William Lane Craig vs Lewis Wolpert 2/12

Is God a Delusion? Professors William Lane Craig and Lewis Wolpert debate.

Moderated by BBC's John Humphrys

Hosted by the University and Colleges Christian Fellowship (UCCF)

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People & Blogs

Tags:

• William
• Lane
• Craig
• Lewis
• Wolpert
• Is
• God
• Delusion
• Atheism
• Theism
• Richard
• Dawkins
• John
• Humphrys

[khughesdc]

@Lawlessone777 Hand picking the word of God? Are you saying that the word of God is NOT truth? Look, you can't have it both ways. WLC stated that the only objective moralilty is through God. I pointed out to you that the Bible contradicts this. You have danced around the issue for the past 3 posts. You simply can't have it both ways...

[khughesdc]

@Lawlessone777 You just couldn't resist classifying me could you? I believe life's "meaning" is what you make of it. Why do you feel that there needs to be a higher power for life to have meaning? I find that quite sad actually... It must be nice to have no personal responsibility and use God as your crutch.

[Lawlessone777]

@khughesdc Then you're a nihilist, which is fine there's a ton of books on nihilism which are great, I recommend Nietzsche and Kierkegaard, you'd like them. I disagree with nihilism and moral subjectivism on a few grounds, mainly in that human interaction operates under the assumption that people ought to be aware of this pre-existing set of moral codes and standards. Which is why killing a bug is morally neutral, but murdering a human is cruel and evil. Even the language shows objectivity.

[Lawlessone777]

@khughesdc And again I'd like to note that you're using a 500 character limit to try and make sense of a subject that has been discussed at length for thousands of years. You're vastly over simplifying and hand picking biblical scripture, something I find both the evangelical literalist and hostile atheist have in common. I can't unpack the cultural, theological, and philosophical grounds in which that scripture was written in less than 500 characters. For those answers you need to study them.

[khughesdc]

@Lawlessone777 "Millions of books on the subject"? No hyperbole there.... Regardless, lets examine the "Objective" morality of your Christian God. On one hand, the Ten Commandments state that Murder is a sin. Then it states in Leviticus 20:13 "If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abominable deed; they have forfeited their lives." You can't have it both ways and IF you decided to follow Gods word, you would be in prison.

[khughesdc]

@Lawlessone777 No, I think you are the one making the assumption. You are assuming that there is an entity that created the universe. Furthermore, this has NOTHING to do with my point. WLC claims that the only way we can have objective morality is via a God of some sort. I don't believe there is any such thing as objective morality, I believe it is all subjective.

[Lawlessone777]

@utubepunk They don't offer a rebuttal during their opening statement, they do that during their rebuttal period. The entire point of the rebuttal period is to correct strawmen, jump through hurtles, and undo the burden shifting. Atheists have had more than 20 years to craft an appropriate rebuttal, yet what I see repeatedly is the implication that rebuttals exist, without ever actually mentioning what they are. Instead they go on random tangents, filibuster, and ad hom. Kinda like you just did.

[utubepunk]

@Lawlessone777 They prepare with their own opening statements & how they will argue their side of the debate. They're not there to correct WLC's strawmen, jump through his hurdles & undo the burden shifting he does. I'm sure WLC thinks his points being proven incorrect is the only way to make a case, but its not. Besides, how do you argue with someone who thinks its okay that children were massacred by god's command? Is any legit argument gonna resonate with someone like that?

[Lawlessone777]

@khughesdc You assume no religious person has ever studied the things you're talking about, vaguely, through a veil of condescension. Something that may surprise you is that people have been talking about religion for thousands of years, and people who are doctors in theology have actually considered these things long before untrained teenagers on the internet found them. You may also be surprised to find there are millions of books on the subject. You should read some, they're fascinating.

[Lawlessone777]

@khughesdc You've utterly misunderstood the argument. Any cause of the universe, intelligent or unintelligent, must have the characteristics of timelessness and spacelessness. They must also be capable of creating a universe. These are not attributes given in an attempt to prove that it's God; ANY cause of the universe must have those attributes to be capable of causing the universe. If it was effected by space, or time, it couldn't have pre-existed space and time.