Re: Defending Materialism (about consciousness)

defending panexperientialist materialism.

response to: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LX3UT2YH0AU

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[EverettsVLOG]

you argue that we dont know what matter 'consists' of, yet you go on to say that matter is not a 'substance'.

another possible contradiction is that you say that we can understand the energetic processes of things, yet how can this be? I could similarly equivocate (as you do w.r.t. substance) that we used to think of hte *process* of billard balls but now we think of the *process* of a wavefunction evolving, so clearly our notions of processes change.

[0ThouArtThat0]

I suppose my point was that matter does not consist of anything, or in other words it is not a substance. In light of the quantum revolution, it seems misleading to talk about matter as being 'made' of anything. It is energy in a constant process of becoming, certainly with features we can distinguish as various particles, but they always exist in motion and vanish when not in relationship with one another.

[EverettsVLOG]

right, but usually they are in relationship with one another. you realize there are other interpretations of the quantum mechanical formalism, its odd that you are treating your interpretation so axiomatically.

[0ThouArtThat0]

Are you familiar with David Bohm's interpretation? It saves the possibility of determinism even while granting consciousness a central role in the unfolding of reality.

watch?v=SvyD2o7w24g&feature=re­lated

[EverettsVLOG]

the bohm interpretation does not give consciousness a central role int he unfolding of reality - at least not the modern bohm interpretation i'm thinking of. however is admits to non locality. The point is that if you make an argument based upon a particular interpretation of quantum mechanics you have built -in an unevidenced dogma into your philosophy.

[0ThouArtThat0]

have you watched the interview of Bohm I linked above? I'd be curious to know you're reaction to his interpretation. As far as 'admitting' non-locality, if we take Bell's experimental findings seriously, non-local effects have been proven, no? The only remaining question concerns what the nature of matter/energy/space-time are such that non-locality is possible.

[0ThouArtThat0]

re: the central role of consciousness/perception in Bohm's thought: watch?v=Mst3fOl5vH0&feature=re­lated

[MrMentalflossed]

@EverettsVLOG matter is the illusion of substance through interactions of fields of energy, a solid is only slowly vibrational stable , and on up the scale as well as further down the scale,..a 2 dimential patern displayed creats the 3d space then by adding the 4th dimention of time that space is then able to react to itself, the energy fields created by the holographic object then repel other hologhraphics with fields of there own thus creating the illusion of solid matter.

[ndrwplussine]

i do not support these amateur videos. No offence, but this type of video belongs to your small talk and debates in philosophy 101, not here.

[Brodaddy1000]

All matter is merely energy condensed into a slow vibration. Some say everything is matter. I say everything is vibration.

[TheAntiFascist2010]

everything is matter, however, materialism in the form of greed and consumption are not healthy to the human physique on any level. Even the word lust. Just because religions use these words doesn't mean that lust and greed for material things somehow becomes good after you stop believing in god. Also if something is a process it is still happening in your brain and your brain is matter. All brain energy exists in the physical as frequency waves. It is all matter.

[KrfNYC2]

I wasn't paying attention...I'll come back.

[seanotube85]

If you can measure energy, doesn't this suggest that it exists physically? How can something that does NOT physically exist within our physical reality affect something that DOES physically exist within our physical reality?

[lllooollnnnlloooll]

What is matter? the answer to your question is endless, the more you research the more you will find. Just my opinion, great video.

[Kasu1917]

Matter is a philosophical category denoting the external world which is given to man by his senses, and which is copied, photographed, and reflected by our sensations, while existing independently of them. Matter is all that exists independently of consciousness. Whether it be atoms, electrons, quarks, loops of energy, or 11 dimensional membranes, it is still the world which exists outside of our sensations. Matter in motion = Energy = Reality.

[TypicalEnglish]

@EverettsVLOG ah dude i knew the first comment i'd see would be quantum mechanics :p

i believe quantum mechanics should be renamed = Things humans don't fully understand or can comprehend so just say it is chance

[carnivourlocust]

@infonomics he would accept what he experiences to be the truth and to be the only reality there is ... do you imply he has emotions or is he also withouth them? if he'd be without emotions than he has no energy and doesn't exist ... for emotions are the main part of the energy that lives or soul :) !