Christian Consumers Kill the Church

[westbororapist]

This sounds a lot more like a power point presentation from a large corporation. I hope people realize that Mark Driscoll is in this for himself. That's why he wants to make everybody his clone and follow his every command. It's quite disturbing

[redrocklove]

Amen!

[MrBanditrider]

Just curious, in reference to getting married, why do you require couples to "declare all your sexual sin and history?" I have some issues with this. If my Lord and Savior can forgive me of my sexual sin and make me new again, why do I have to tell you/church about my past sin? That should be between me and God...and my furture spouse if need be, not the pastor and church. I dont remember Jesus telling the woman at the well to tell her "sexual history." I believe he said, go sin no more.

[firecom11]

@MrBanditrider : yes it's between you and God but testimony is also shedding light to darkness that the old is dead and the new has risen. this is called accountability not just to God but to your wife, pastor and church. it's best to be accountable. its God's family.

[spiritfired]

Huh? So the consumers take money from the disciples to feed themselves?

[ta2dpastor]

@ SavedCenturion... No... I'd say the point was that if your church has money and people you had better count the cost if you don't do it right. I think he was pointing out that God is at work but it can all be lost if the community of believers does not engage in the walk and work of the church. Just a thought, after all there is no formula or equation which says a certain church size is more or less holy or better than another

[jayarelinkous]

I attend a church in the south, and I have been impacted hugely by Mark and Mars Hill! You guys are affecting the body of Christ as a whole in huge ways and I am thankful for what God is doing through you. Thank you, thank you, thank you! You guys are changing the game in a way that has never been done but so needed!! Keep up the great work guys, the rest of the body of Christ is behind you!!!

[pksmb1120]

@jayarelinkous Same here. I live in East Texas and stumbled across some of his stuff here on YouTube. We got preachers down here that aren't afraid to step on toes either. And from what I understand, his area is one of the most unchurched areas in the country. He presents the Gospel in such a way that people understand. Some people may not like his "in-your-face" approach, but sometimes it's best to just say it like it is rather than try to water it down.

[SavedCenturion88]

So the point is that if your church has money, numbers, etc. then what you are doing is right. Yeah, makes sense because I remember the huge churches and money that the Apostles were part of...oh, and the Ana Baptists...yeah, they raked in the cash and numbers...theology based on human success...

[NomadHeart22]

@SavedCenturion88 This video bothered me in the same way. It just didn't seem right, for the exact reasons that you said.

[MrCharrrles]

@rafaforgd I think he's talking about confessing to God

[Jerkwad152]

@rafaforgd

You're confusing Mark with the likes of Pat Robertson. That's like comparing an apple to a durian.

[theomathetes21]

@Jerkwad152 That's the awesomest analogy I've seen all month. lol.

[rafaforgd]

Jesus said: "You know that the rulers of the Gentiles lord it over them, and those who are great exercise authority over them. Yet it shall not be so among you; but whoever desires to become great among you, let him be your servant. And whoever desires to be first among you, let him be your slave— just as the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give His life a ransom for many."

[MrMrRobS]

@Xeonxtreme The reason he forbids some to marry is because they are too spiritually immature, and their marriage would be a train wreck that will damage them and their spouce horrifically. If a guy is sleeping around, or has a history of violence towards women, or is chronically lazy, they seriously need to work on their Christ-like-ness before they can even consider marriage. I hope that clarifies the issue!

[Xeonxtreme]

@MrMrRobS

"The reason he forbids some to marry is because they are too spiritually immature,"

Well at least you admit that he does forbid it, on what ever merits he believed is valid in his eyes.

This is the wonderful thing about marriage, it was not created by man, that being the case, man doesn't get to re-invent it, or redefine it or place his qualification upon it.

Spiritually immature what does that mean? What about those that are spiritually dead? They shouldn't marry at all then.

[shamgar001]

@Xeonxtreme He can't actually forbid someone from marrying at all, but he has every right to forbid them from being married in his church.

[MrMrRobS]

@Xeonxtreme Hey, what those verses speak of is people who are making up oppressive rules that aren't in the Bible, telling people to abstain from meats, for instance, even though Christians are no longer under the law. In the same vein these guys were telling people 'you are a second-class citzien if you marry', and therefore that marriage as an institution is bad. Mark D doesn't teach this: he teaches that marriage is a right, good, and wonderful gift from God.

[godrox]

It frustrates me so much how most churches not only give in to consumerism, but they actually feed it, thinking that church is about having lots of programs, activities and busyness. Few of them will say that or admit to it, but their actions and evaluation process (or lack thereof) say differently.

[Xeonxtreme]

@2:48 1 Timothy 4:1-3

"1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;

2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

3 Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth."

FORBIDDING TO MARRY, this is wrong, drifting has already begun.

[VeryResurrection]

@Xeonxtreme

I think the verse refers to completely forbidding marriage, the way Roman Catholic church forbids their priests to marry, for example. And we all know what kind of ugly fruit that produced.

[OneAvidity]

Right on... amen.