I watched your video three times your very first statement is "the word can nut be left at it is" scott accent included With you not being from this country Its going to be hard for you to understand the true depth of the problems here. You all that come up with this hair brain crap You dont put any real effort or research or apply real logic If anything your going to blur the lines of definitions creating more things to argue about. Hence I am trying substantiate my claim that your stupid here
@YafatFuqa I was referring to the way we treat the word. I'm going to say this one last time. I agree with every point you've made so far. Where anything I've said to you conflicts with what I said in the video, these comments overrule the video. With that in mind does the "hair brain crap" you mention include anything other than what we've already discussed?
@Orygyn Sure there lots of assnine things you said in that vid like talk about a two party system of government when if you really had a clue there only two party by name Its all the same party even if you add a third party it will be some corporate sell out We are being looted by the rich and elite and there plans for us are death we are no longer useful to them The racism terrorism politics its just a shell game to keep you busy till they can slip the noose around all our necks
Now to strengthen my second point I say with words unlike a gunshot Offence can never be given, only taken. In other words, before you can offend me, I have to allow you to do so. if I can choose to be offended, surely that proves the opposite choice (not being offended) is also a choice? it's hard to overrule that emotional reaction - when someone tries to insult you, it's hard not to be offended. What seems automatic we can with recognition and effort master self control. Its so simple right?
@YafatFuqa I agree with the points you made. I'm not sure why you're calling me wrong because everything you've said is backed up in the video or at least should've been.
@Orygyn Well son you need to watch that video again yourself. Over and over you state that the word has power And this is just the beginning to my problem with your video nowhere in that vid did you come close to saying this! If you had I doubt I would have wrote you. For crying outloud WTF "Variablast and the All-Powerful N-Word" is this not the tittle of your video? Should have been covered and was are two different things. If you're discounting this logic I have more to back this point
@YafatFuqa Ah OK I see what the problem is. When you say "The key action here is that someone gives power to the word nigger the word it self has no power", I agree 100%. It was just my choice of words. Any reference I make to the word "having power" should be taken to mean "the current ability of the word to offend, because of current sensitivities". What I've said here should overrule anything in the video that contradicts it as this is what I really believe.
@Orygyn Again your dancing around wanting to be nicey nice. WHATS WRONG WITH OFFENDING PEOPLE THAT ACT LIKE ASSHOLES? I try daily to get through to these people who have not been slaves have not ever really experienced racism. These big whiny babies cry about name calling I believe there leaders have been orchestrating a conflict with whites that they think will put them at the top and they will enslave us whites for revenge or attempt a genocide and all this is just a distraction to rob us
Well how can I really make this clear when there are so many issues that are involved in this. So let make the first a little more clear People nowadays seem to be such pussies and take no responsibility for there own actions The key action here is that someone gives power to the word nigger the word it self has no power Its just a word like any other. you seem to cross this like being shot by a gun and there is no control over the injury The injury here is self inflicted am I correct???
Hey sunshine I am here to ruin your day cause your wrong. Its really really quite simple. I could sit here and call you a nigger all day long is going to bother you(It shouldn't) if you did it would be your "CHOICE" Calling a nigger a nigger is no different niggers would be choosing to give me the the power to ruin there day by getting upset when I write nigger or say nigger OR THINK NIGGER OH LORD CALL THE THOUGHT POLICE! Unless you think niggers are inferior to other races you fucking racist!
When you respond I don't want you to hold back for fear of offending me I won't be offended:)...Are you in favor of redefining the word?...If so, it's worth a try...Its very hard for me to be logical on this issue because it's so close to home, I live in the deep south and I have been called a nigger on several ocassions...Even you just casually saying the word nigger in the video sort of stings...I think that's a clear indication that the word has too much power
@SandySweet575 I don't think redefining it is absolutely necessary to achieving the effect of destigmatising the word which is what I'd like to see happen to it but I'm not against it as it would clearly get the job done. I see the obstacles to the idea as problems to be solved in the process of implementing the idea, not reasons to just discard it outright. In that sense I guess I am in favour of it.
"And that you can endorse some definitions and not others?"
I think "endorse" is an inaccurate way to view this stuff. I don't "endorse" anarchism meaning lack of archons instead of chaos. It has both meanings, and one is more accurate, whereas the other is more a reaction to the word than anything else. Nigger has no such aspect. It came up from racism, and that's what's integral to the definition. Nigger does not mean human, except as a reaction; the same way that anarchism means chaos.
@variablast And the most common definition of nigger. Unlike anarchy, you can't claim that nigger has different roots than what is commonly thought. The attempts of "We're all from Africa" are ridiculous to the extreme. Sure, we're all niggers from Africa... in the same way that everyone has faith, including atheists, in the sun rising each morning.
when u tell someone that he is idiot for example..u can*t associate with somthing....because there are alot of people in the world that think in others way that u think...u call them idiot ...in your opinion...an if they get upset..they get upset because of theyr own conception of
idiot...ok...now...when u tell somone that he is racist..he won*t get mad because of the word...he will become mad on you because of the meaning:)meaning give to words sence(sry bad eng)
What a ridiculous cause to put any effort into. With all the problems in the world, why choose to waste any time or effort into this? It doesn't make any sense. Sure, the word has caused a lot of pain for people and has a lot of history behind it, but in this day and age, its not really something we need to kick around anymore.
I think this should be a freedom of speech issue, not a moral issue. Those who want to use the word for its derogatory meaning still will. And black people will still get offended. The one thing that will definitely take it away is if it fades into obscurity, if no one uses it for any reason.
i live in scotland too, and i hear the term "sand-nigger" a lot in reference to arabs. i have a friend who is of pakistani origin and he doesnt mind being called a "sand-nigger", as long as he knows the person saying it isnt racist.
if nigger is said by people who arent being racist, and racists use other words than nigger in order to be racist, the word nigger will surely lose its potency.
At 3:09 I really can't follow this any further.Nigger of course stems from nigre, meaning black.Ice T reflects its use correctly as much as anything - he corrects you 'bout whatchew doin' nigga.But the fact that 40% of Americans live in poverty, and now nigga has come to mean not only blacks but also to indicate those who can expect an ersatz emancipation be offerred them in an otherwise Democratic society I feel is a good arguement in favour of its use.To a degree.As for censoring M.Twain, wtf?
...socially acceptable, just just wacking off in public isnt acceptable, and why should it be? because its a word? then shall we set out to destigmatizate all offensive words?
...i think an objective way to gauge this is to see how the attempted destigmitisation of other words has effected the use and meaning of these words, if it has ever worked and HOW it worked.
certain words do just go away like 'cowabunga'. but that would be too much to hope for with this word.
i dont think its a question of censorship though and more a question of appropriate human etiquette. the word nigger isnt a forbidden word, people are already free to use it and do, its just not...
@detr1mentalist That's a very good idea. I'd need time to look into it but it's worth a shot. It's not forbidden but there are places where ANY usage of the word is censored. Variablast can't get a Facebook page because of his name and couldn't sell his items on eBay even if dpr and PR had let him. And there's the Huck Finn example. I'm fine with them being frowned upon, but not censored.
@Orygyn i just thought about this now. maybe we should take the chompsky approach with 'wanna fight terrorism? stop being a terrorist', and be all like 'if you wanna stop the stigma of the word nigger, stop using the word.'
discontinued use of the word might lower its.. 'importance', sure it might be remembered in 20 years, but itll be like: boy: 'dad, what does nigger mean?' dad: 'why son, its an old fashoned word that was used decades/centuries ago, but noone uses or cares about it anymore'
@Orygyn well it seems the best way to cause an idea to lose its power or impact is to ignore it, like a troll. and if the word 'nigger' was a person, itd be a troll.
sorry about all the posts, but im not 100% on my own opinion on this topic and am as eager to see the other perspective as you seem to be
@detr1mentalist Exactly. I'm just thinking that if people are still using it, and especially given that we have the internet so there'll be a mention of it somewhere, it's going to keep cropping up until they ignore it. Another option, insensitive as it may be, is that the would-be victims need to perceive the word for what it is (just a word) and not let it get to them.
@Orygyn i can still understand why they'd censore it though, these are supposed to be family friendly sites, and as i said, the word is unethical, just as much as creating the username 'dogfuckermcgee72'
@detr1mentalist I make an exception for censorship when it's hate speech and that's the argument used against this particular word but I address that when I addressed HC's argument.
when i think about this it reminds me of the word 'fag/faggot' and how that/those words have been undergoing an attempted destigmatization by the gay community for afew decades now. in part it has worked, and within the gay community it has been changed to an affectionate 'quip', i suppose the word nigger has done that too within black communities, so within the minority communities it can undergo destigmatization, yet it seems the meaning of these words stay the same outside the community...
@detr1mentalist I'd argue that that's not down to the failure of the idea but the failure to convey what they've done to the word to the larger public. It could well be the case that you're with gay friends and in the back of your mind you're thinking "don't say fag" whereas they've long since become cool with it.
@Orygyn "nigger- a man of light brown to black skin color who adheres to the stereotypes thrust upon them (drunk and or tribal)" is what I was referring to.
'Sort by time' sucks. Use 'Sort by thread (beta)'. Big difference.
You don't need to change the word. Thats not going to accomplish anything. You need to make people stop using it. They will just find an other word to replace it. A word being change doesn't change people ignorant views.
@MrLawliet1992 Given how the word is perceived I'd say that you have to tread with caution. Taking that approach tends to lead to the words being despised and ultimately censored.
@Orygyn I Think its pointless to change a words meaning if people still feel the hatred behind the word. Changing words does nothing. People will find ways to be racist. Your barking up the wrong tree.
@Orygyn Then your a very selfish person to think its a big issue to sort out censorship. Don't worry about the more seriously underlying problem. Your totally wrong.
@Orygyn The reason behind you doing so is to stop it being censored. after that, do you expect to actually try to make a difference and sort racism. Rather then one of many words that are used to portray it.
@MrLawliet1992 OK, assuming the word's power is brought down to levels where it won't make free speech advocates hypocrites, that's fine with me. It won't be for variablast. Along side this we can ALSO deal with racism. Before, during and after. There's no reason why anyone can't address both issues.
@Orygyn They are not different issues. The word is used to be racist towards someone. You need to stop people thinking this way. You cant take away their words and expect them to stop. You blind to the truth.
excellent video man. i agree with many points. i however have my own reasons for not niggering the word. i think he is dedicated and sincere, and i wish him well. you've got a great point regarding Huck Finn. its a serious affront to literature.
let me know if anyone comes up with an argument/angle you haven't considered before.
I am in the middle of writing a modern art themed book called Silicates. It's about 400 pages of the word nigger, front to back. Got a few people interested. Should be a pain to proof read, yeah.
Theres too much to talk about in a small text box. If I find time maybe I will make a video addressing how I feel on the issue. Great video by the way.
the way to get people to listen is to have someone with trunks of subs make a catchy music video about it. that's the only way to get people to listen to anything these days. if only onision was still one of us lol.
language is a fickle bitch (sic!) and censoring it has always been the wrong thing to do, because not a word, but the attributed meaning, context and the intentionality of the communication act is important. Which is why i really love that you said "dont get angry at the word nigger, get angry at racism!". Because that's a perfect paraphrasing of that. I think variablast is doing a good thing that hopefully raises awareness and a deeper understanding of language culture and its pitfalls.
You bring up Tom Sawyer and Huckleberry Fin and that censoring the N-Word out of there is bad. I agree. The story takes part in a certain time and the attitude towards black people is criticized in it - it's not the main theme of the story but one of the themes. But what is achieved if instead you change the meaning of the word? It's censoring too, because now all the people call black people "human", which sounds rather nice and isn't at all what they mean in the story.
@commanderkruge OK, I'm not entirely sure where the idea that the original meaning would completely die comes from, although it may well have been among the many variablast videos I haven't seen or missed. I disagree that that would be the case for reasons ooj (SkidRowRadio) cited below, "it's impossible", especially today in the internet age. The definition would simply be listed in the dictionary as archaic.
@Orygyn Oh, ok, so the "old" meaning wouldn't die? In which case it will still be used by racists in the old way - it's their mindset. And nothing is gained. And now you need to ask which "nigger" someone means if it's not immediately clear through the context. Meh.
Come to think of it - that's pretty much where we are now anyways: "Nigger" has become slang for "Dude, Pal, Bloke" some time ago, and - unlike VB's silly mission, is used that way by ppl it directly affects.
@commanderkruge Yes, the friendly use of "Nigger" has been going on for quite a while now, started by the BLACK community - just as is normal in such cases. And this use is slowly spreading - to white hiphoppers, for example. It has already come so far that, given the right circumstances, black and white people sometimes call each other "My Nigga/er" meaning "My man!". This has been going on for quite a while and will continue or not, depending how the living language English will change.
@commanderkruge Fact is - IF such changes come along, they usually come from within a subculture that in some way "has got something to do" with the word that's changing meaning. Why does VB want to start a second, artificial change in the word, instead of simply promoting the natural change that already is under way?
Because it's about him wanting to be special and recognized, that's why.
@commanderkruge Sorry it took so long to reply, it's been a busy few days for me. That's a question you'd have to ask VB. What i would say is jumping to that conclusion is pretty premature until you at least get some comment from him about it.
@Orygyn I don't "propose" it, I observe it - it's going on right now. It has been going on for decades. It's safe to assume that it's already moving at the speed that society feels comfortable to accept it. I find it kind of funny how VB seems to ignore this and wants his own new definition instead, and tomorrow please. By choosing that path instead of promoting the natural change in some way the only thing he achieves in the long run is to estrange a lot of ppl and put himself in the spotlight.
@commanderkruge With only a tiny change he could make almost the exact same videos, promoting the already accepted "dude" - meaning for "nigger" for wider use. That way he would, so to say, join forces with the positive change that already IS going on. But then he wouldn't be special any more and THAT is his actual main agenda. He needs to stick out, he needs others to see his "wisdom" and follow his way. :)
@commanderkruge I think I need to be more clear. There's a difference between the dictionary definition and people's perceptions of the word. The perceptions need to change. Assuming we go with VB's idea, the aim is first to desensitise people to the word by presenting it to them then to present the new definition. In cases where it will still be used in racial contexts the idea would be to laugh at the idea that getting called a human is an insult.
niggering nigger. that's the only two words you need to see how silly it all is.
the collection of letters that make up the word aint the problem and even in the utterly impossible scenario that the word could be completely robbed of its historical implications and racist connotations, it still wouldnt do squat to help in the fight against ignorance and racism.
it is also important that it retains its henious connotations so that it may serve as a reminder and a signifier of things we dun wrong.
@SkidRowRadio words being taken out of Huck Finn etc are a different matter. we do have issues with censorship and literally ignorance and such, that does not mean we should campaign to 'save the word nigger'
the word dont need saving, it needs to die. most black people would tell you this. i dont pretend to be an authority on it.
@SkidRowRadio Nigger isn't dying. Nigga sealed it's fate. It's here, and it now has one extra definition. Niggering is new activity that isn't for everyone. Some people pretend to jerk off, some people nigger shit.
nigga was a massive and gradual movement that gathered steam thru 3 decades of social upheaval and struggle, 3 decades of milions of people redefining a word (with a letter and intonation changed, very important point), not a one man crusaide of some white dude off the internet who got stuck with the name after he failed to convince a single black person to take it.
@SkidRowRadio I can't move on. I'm a fundamentalist Discordian Niggeritarian. Saying nigger is part of my religion, you god damn bigot. You god damn motherfucking religiously intolerant nazi jew pig.
@SkidRowRadio OK so it seems we agree as far as "something needs to be done". I forgot about the "reminder of racism" argument which has come up a few times so I'll put it in the description.
How dare them take a hateful, hurtful, and over all fucked uop word out of a kids book.
How dare them...
-_-
NTtheLion 2 weeks ago
over here now, orygyn. Massive losses online, someone with the password deleted the variablast channel and niggeritarian has been false flagged down.
but i'm still here. hope you're well. Merry Xmas to you and all that jazz.
WorthlessLoser8 2 months ago
@WorthlessLoser8 That's about 3000 videos. Even if someone disagreed with you profoundly that's going ridiculously too far.
Orygyn 2 months ago
I watched your video three times your very first statement is "the word can nut be left at it is" scott accent included With you not being from this country Its going to be hard for you to understand the true depth of the problems here. You all that come up with this hair brain crap You dont put any real effort or research or apply real logic If anything your going to blur the lines of definitions creating more things to argue about. Hence I am trying substantiate my claim that your stupid here
YafatFuqa 8 months ago
@YafatFuqa I was referring to the way we treat the word. I'm going to say this one last time. I agree with every point you've made so far. Where anything I've said to you conflicts with what I said in the video, these comments overrule the video. With that in mind does the "hair brain crap" you mention include anything other than what we've already discussed?
Orygyn 8 months ago
@Orygyn Sure there lots of assnine things you said in that vid like talk about a two party system of government when if you really had a clue there only two party by name Its all the same party even if you add a third party it will be some corporate sell out We are being looted by the rich and elite and there plans for us are death we are no longer useful to them The racism terrorism politics its just a shell game to keep you busy till they can slip the noose around all our necks
YafatFuqa 8 months ago
Now to strengthen my second point I say with words unlike a gunshot Offence can never be given, only taken. In other words, before you can offend me, I have to allow you to do so. if I can choose to be offended, surely that proves the opposite choice (not being offended) is also a choice? it's hard to overrule that emotional reaction - when someone tries to insult you, it's hard not to be offended. What seems automatic we can with recognition and effort master self control. Its so simple right?
YafatFuqa 8 months ago
@YafatFuqa I agree with the points you made. I'm not sure why you're calling me wrong because everything you've said is backed up in the video or at least should've been.
Orygyn 8 months ago
@Orygyn Well son you need to watch that video again yourself. Over and over you state that the word has power And this is just the beginning to my problem with your video nowhere in that vid did you come close to saying this! If you had I doubt I would have wrote you. For crying outloud WTF "Variablast and the All-Powerful N-Word" is this not the tittle of your video? Should have been covered and was are two different things. If you're discounting this logic I have more to back this point
YafatFuqa 8 months ago
@YafatFuqa Ah OK I see what the problem is. When you say "The key action here is that someone gives power to the word nigger the word it self has no power", I agree 100%. It was just my choice of words. Any reference I make to the word "having power" should be taken to mean "the current ability of the word to offend, because of current sensitivities". What I've said here should overrule anything in the video that contradicts it as this is what I really believe.
Orygyn 8 months ago
@Orygyn Again your dancing around wanting to be nicey nice. WHATS WRONG WITH OFFENDING PEOPLE THAT ACT LIKE ASSHOLES? I try daily to get through to these people who have not been slaves have not ever really experienced racism. These big whiny babies cry about name calling I believe there leaders have been orchestrating a conflict with whites that they think will put them at the top and they will enslave us whites for revenge or attempt a genocide and all this is just a distraction to rob us
YafatFuqa 8 months ago
Well how can I really make this clear when there are so many issues that are involved in this. So let make the first a little more clear People nowadays seem to be such pussies and take no responsibility for there own actions The key action here is that someone gives power to the word nigger the word it self has no power Its just a word like any other. you seem to cross this like being shot by a gun and there is no control over the injury The injury here is self inflicted am I correct???
YafatFuqa 8 months ago
Hey sunshine I am here to ruin your day cause your wrong. Its really really quite simple. I could sit here and call you a nigger all day long is going to bother you(It shouldn't) if you did it would be your "CHOICE" Calling a nigger a nigger is no different niggers would be choosing to give me the the power to ruin there day by getting upset when I write nigger or say nigger OR THINK NIGGER OH LORD CALL THE THOUGHT POLICE! Unless you think niggers are inferior to other races you fucking racist!
YafatFuqa 8 months ago
When you respond I don't want you to hold back for fear of offending me I won't be offended:)...Are you in favor of redefining the word?...If so, it's worth a try...Its very hard for me to be logical on this issue because it's so close to home, I live in the deep south and I have been called a nigger on several ocassions...Even you just casually saying the word nigger in the video sort of stings...I think that's a clear indication that the word has too much power
SandySweet575 8 months ago
@SandySweet575 I don't think redefining it is absolutely necessary to achieving the effect of destigmatising the word which is what I'd like to see happen to it but I'm not against it as it would clearly get the job done. I see the obstacles to the idea as problems to be solved in the process of implementing the idea, not reasons to just discard it outright. In that sense I guess I am in favour of it.
Orygyn 8 months ago
@Orygyn Yes I would agree
SandySweet575 8 months ago
@variablast you've seen my video :-)
gothatfunk 1 year ago
"That's right, we've switched from words coming from what people actually mean, to words being political figures that we endorse. Bravo."
The "bravo" part. I think it's awful to treat words like politicians. Words, to a certain extent, are just words.
"You don't think that words matter?"
Obviously.
watch?v=B-mj0krEuCQ
SomethingSea1 1 year ago
"And that you can endorse some definitions and not others?"
I think "endorse" is an inaccurate way to view this stuff.
I don't "endorse" anarchism meaning lack of archons
instead of chaos. It has both meanings, and one is more
accurate, whereas the other is more a reaction to the word
than anything else. Nigger has no such aspect. It came
up from racism, and that's what's integral to the definition.
Nigger does not mean human, except as a reaction; the
same way that anarchism means chaos
SomethingSea1 1 year ago
"And that you can endorse some definitions and not others?"
I think "endorse" is an inaccurate way to view this stuff. I don't "endorse" anarchism meaning lack of archons instead of chaos. It has both meanings, and one is more accurate, whereas the other is more a reaction to the word than anything else. Nigger has no such aspect. It came up from racism, and that's what's integral to the definition. Nigger does not mean human, except as a reaction; the same way that anarchism means chaos.
SomethingSea1 1 year ago
@variablast ugh. I guess I should put [/sarcasm] when I'm being sarcastic with you.
SomethingSea1 1 year ago
@variablast That's right, we've switched from words coming from what people actually mean, to words being political figures that we endorse. Bravo.
SomethingSea1 1 year ago
"Is it the definition you endorse?"
Do I endorse that Hitler was an evil mofo? No, I don't. That's just how it is.
"It is not ridiculous to point out that we are all from Africa."
Ironically enough, I agree with you. Maybe I'm bipolar :P
SomethingSea1 1 year ago
@variablast And the most common definition of nigger. Unlike anarchy, you can't claim that nigger has different roots than what is commonly thought. The attempts of "We're all from Africa" are ridiculous to the extreme. Sure, we're all niggers from Africa... in the same way that everyone has faith, including atheists, in the sun rising each morning.
SomethingSea1 1 year ago
you were trulely methodical well done man
FLCLever 1 year ago
@FLCLever Thanks 8<{D-
Orygyn 1 year ago
well...i will take one case...
when u tell someone that he is idiot for example..u can*t associate with somthing....because there are alot of people in the world that think in others way that u think...u call them idiot ...in your opinion...an if they get upset..they get upset because of theyr own conception of
idiot...ok...now...when u tell somone that he is racist..he won*t get mad because of the word...he will become mad on you because of the meaning:)meaning give to words sence(sry bad eng)
MrOneStepToHell 1 year ago
@MrOneStepToHell Very good point.
Orygyn 1 year ago
@variablast Are you talking about changing the word or the whole of Niggeritarianism.
Orygyn 1 year ago
@variablast If you have more to say, feel free. I've not got too much on my plate at all.
Orygyn 1 year ago
Comment removed
Mjhavok 1 year ago
@cammyjee No I don't have any objections to it.
Orygyn 1 year ago
@cammyjee LOL.
Orygyn 1 year ago
What a ridiculous cause to put any effort into. With all the problems in the world, why choose to waste any time or effort into this? It doesn't make any sense. Sure, the word has caused a lot of pain for people and has a lot of history behind it, but in this day and age, its not really something we need to kick around anymore.
sean1256 1 year ago
@sean1256 Meh I say address all issues however unimportant.
Orygyn 1 year ago
I think this should be a freedom of speech issue, not a moral issue. Those who want to use the word for its derogatory meaning still will. And black people will still get offended. The one thing that will definitely take it away is if it fades into obscurity, if no one uses it for any reason.
SeriousPsyche 1 year ago
@SeriousPsyche Possibly yeh.
Orygyn 1 year ago
0:00
pause at the U in "hi guys"
orygyns sex face.
volound 1 year ago
@volound LOL.
Orygyn 1 year ago
i live in scotland too, and i hear the term "sand-nigger" a lot in reference to arabs. i have a friend who is of pakistani origin and he doesnt mind being called a "sand-nigger", as long as he knows the person saying it isnt racist.
if nigger is said by people who arent being racist, and racists use other words than nigger in order to be racist, the word nigger will surely lose its potency.
good video. i admire your sincerity and logic.
volound 1 year ago
@volound Thanks, agreed.
Orygyn 1 year ago
At 3:09 I really can't follow this any further.Nigger of course stems from nigre, meaning black.Ice T reflects its use correctly as much as anything - he corrects you 'bout whatchew doin' nigga.But the fact that 40% of Americans live in poverty, and now nigga has come to mean not only blacks but also to indicate those who can expect an ersatz emancipation be offerred them in an otherwise Democratic society I feel is a good arguement in favour of its use.To a degree.As for censoring M.Twain, wtf?
Lieu3C4 1 year ago
@Lieu3C4 Yeh sorry I had a lot to say.
Orygyn 1 year ago
...socially acceptable, just just wacking off in public isnt acceptable, and why should it be? because its a word? then shall we set out to destigmatizate all offensive words?
detr1mentalist 1 year ago
Comment removed
detr1mentalist 1 year ago
...i think an objective way to gauge this is to see how the attempted destigmitisation of other words has effected the use and meaning of these words, if it has ever worked and HOW it worked.
certain words do just go away like 'cowabunga'. but that would be too much to hope for with this word.
i dont think its a question of censorship though and more a question of appropriate human etiquette. the word nigger isnt a forbidden word, people are already free to use it and do, its just not...
detr1mentalist 1 year ago
@detr1mentalist That's a very good idea. I'd need time to look into it but it's worth a shot. It's not forbidden but there are places where ANY usage of the word is censored. Variablast can't get a Facebook page because of his name and couldn't sell his items on eBay even if dpr and PR had let him. And there's the Huck Finn example. I'm fine with them being frowned upon, but not censored.
Orygyn 1 year ago
@Orygyn i just thought about this now. maybe we should take the chompsky approach with 'wanna fight terrorism? stop being a terrorist', and be all like 'if you wanna stop the stigma of the word nigger, stop using the word.'
discontinued use of the word might lower its.. 'importance', sure it might be remembered in 20 years, but itll be like: boy: 'dad, what does nigger mean?' dad: 'why son, its an old fashoned word that was used decades/centuries ago, but noone uses or cares about it anymore'
detr1mentalist 1 year ago
@detr1mentalist Possibly.
Orygyn 1 year ago
@Orygyn well it seems the best way to cause an idea to lose its power or impact is to ignore it, like a troll. and if the word 'nigger' was a person, itd be a troll.
sorry about all the posts, but im not 100% on my own opinion on this topic and am as eager to see the other perspective as you seem to be
detr1mentalist 1 year ago
@detr1mentalist Exactly. I'm just thinking that if people are still using it, and especially given that we have the internet so there'll be a mention of it somewhere, it's going to keep cropping up until they ignore it. Another option, insensitive as it may be, is that the would-be victims need to perceive the word for what it is (just a word) and not let it get to them.
Orygyn 1 year ago
@Orygyn i can still understand why they'd censore it though, these are supposed to be family friendly sites, and as i said, the word is unethical, just as much as creating the username 'dogfuckermcgee72'
detr1mentalist 1 year ago
@detr1mentalist I make an exception for censorship when it's hate speech and that's the argument used against this particular word but I address that when I addressed HC's argument.
Orygyn 1 year ago
when i think about this it reminds me of the word 'fag/faggot' and how that/those words have been undergoing an attempted destigmatization by the gay community for afew decades now. in part it has worked, and within the gay community it has been changed to an affectionate 'quip', i suppose the word nigger has done that too within black communities, so within the minority communities it can undergo destigmatization, yet it seems the meaning of these words stay the same outside the community...
detr1mentalist 1 year ago
@detr1mentalist I'd argue that that's not down to the failure of the idea but the failure to convey what they've done to the word to the larger public. It could well be the case that you're with gay friends and in the back of your mind you're thinking "don't say fag" whereas they've long since become cool with it.
Orygyn 1 year ago
nigger- a man of light brown to black skin color who adheres to the stereotypes thrust upon them (drunk and or tribal)
sobored671 1 year ago
@sobored671 LOL.
Orygyn 1 year ago
@Orygyn That's the definition of nigger.
SomethingSea1 1 year ago
@SomethingSea1 I've left tons of comments on this video. Which one are you referring to?
Orygyn 1 year ago
@Orygyn "nigger- a man of light brown to black skin color who adheres to the stereotypes thrust upon them (drunk and or tribal)" is what I was referring to.
'Sort by time' sucks. Use 'Sort by thread (beta)'. Big difference.
SomethingSea1 1 year ago
@SomethingSea1 Ah ok thanks.
Orygyn 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@Orygyn That's the definition of nigger.
SomethingSea1 1 year ago
You don't need to change the word. Thats not going to accomplish anything. You need to make people stop using it. They will just find an other word to replace it. A word being change doesn't change people ignorant views.
MrLawliet1992 1 year ago
@MrLawliet1992 Given how the word is perceived I'd say that you have to tread with caution. Taking that approach tends to lead to the words being despised and ultimately censored.
Orygyn 1 year ago
@Orygyn I Think its pointless to change a words meaning if people still feel the hatred behind the word. Changing words does nothing. People will find ways to be racist. Your barking up the wrong tree.
MrLawliet1992 1 year ago
@MrLawliet1992 Ah hold on. I said this in the video, it's not about racism, it's about censorship. Fighting racism is a whole other issue.
Orygyn 1 year ago
@Orygyn Then your a very selfish person to think its a big issue to sort out censorship. Don't worry about the more seriously underlying problem. Your totally wrong.
MrLawliet1992 1 year ago
@MrLawliet1992 I didn't say anything about not addressing racism, I simply said this particular issue doesn't deal with it.
Orygyn 1 year ago
@Orygyn This particular issue is pointless and ignorant to the true damage the word causing. If al you care is about it not being censored anymore.
MrLawliet1992 1 year ago
@MrLawliet1992 It's addressing the damage.
Orygyn 1 year ago
@Orygyn The reason behind you doing so is to stop it being censored. after that, do you expect to actually try to make a difference and sort racism. Rather then one of many words that are used to portray it.
MrLawliet1992 1 year ago
@MrLawliet1992 OK, assuming the word's power is brought down to levels where it won't make free speech advocates hypocrites, that's fine with me. It won't be for variablast. Along side this we can ALSO deal with racism. Before, during and after. There's no reason why anyone can't address both issues.
Orygyn 1 year ago
@Orygyn They are not different issues. The word is used to be racist towards someone. You need to stop people thinking this way. You cant take away their words and expect them to stop. You blind to the truth.
MrLawliet1992 1 year ago
@MrLawliet1992 They share common elements but they do differ. Beyond that, I agree with the rest of what you said except obviously that last remark.
Orygyn 1 year ago
@Orygyn Your are ignorant, Naive and selfish towards what you believe is right and wrong.
MrLawliet1992 1 year ago
excellent video man. i agree with many points. i however have my own reasons for not niggering the word. i think he is dedicated and sincere, and i wish him well. you've got a great point regarding Huck Finn. its a serious affront to literature.
let me know if anyone comes up with an argument/angle you haven't considered before.
gothatfunk 1 year ago
@gothatfunk There's been 2 that I forgot to address in the video.
1. The definition should remain as a lesson as to what racism can do (or some variation thereof depending on the person arguing).
2. That definition won't ever die completely.
Once I've responded to the comments I'm going to put my answers in the description.
Orygyn 1 year ago
NIGGER
lambrioza 1 year ago
I am in the middle of writing a modern art themed book called Silicates. It's about 400 pages of the word nigger, front to back. Got a few people interested. Should be a pain to proof read, yeah.
ultimateinfinite 1 year ago
Theres too much to talk about in a small text box. If I find time maybe I will make a video addressing how I feel on the issue. Great video by the way.
Sevold 1 year ago
the way to get people to listen is to have someone with trunks of subs make a catchy music video about it. that's the only way to get people to listen to anything these days. if only onision was still one of us lol.
katiegirl5786 1 year ago
SMARTPARTS Double O Seven!
utuberevlimitracing 1 year ago
@utuberevlimitracing Bond wishes he was me 8<{D-
Orygyn 1 year ago
language is a fickle bitch (sic!) and censoring it has always been the wrong thing to do, because not a word, but the attributed meaning, context and the intentionality of the communication act is important. Which is why i really love that you said "dont get angry at the word nigger, get angry at racism!". Because that's a perfect paraphrasing of that. I think variablast is doing a good thing that hopefully raises awareness and a deeper understanding of language culture and its pitfalls.
Lutzifer31337 1 year ago
@Lutzifer31337 Thanks. Yeh, I think, if nothing else, his cause is at least having a noticeable positive effect on how we perceive the word.
Orygyn 1 year ago
NIGGER
take that society
jonathon1018 1 year ago
@jonathon1018 LOL.
Orygyn 1 year ago
You bring up Tom Sawyer and Huckleberry Fin and that censoring the N-Word out of there is bad. I agree. The story takes part in a certain time and the attitude towards black people is criticized in it - it's not the main theme of the story but one of the themes. But what is achieved if instead you change the meaning of the word? It's censoring too, because now all the people call black people "human", which sounds rather nice and isn't at all what they mean in the story.
commanderkruge 1 year ago
@commanderkruge OK, I'm not entirely sure where the idea that the original meaning would completely die comes from, although it may well have been among the many variablast videos I haven't seen or missed. I disagree that that would be the case for reasons ooj (SkidRowRadio) cited below, "it's impossible", especially today in the internet age. The definition would simply be listed in the dictionary as archaic.
Orygyn 1 year ago
@Orygyn Oh, ok, so the "old" meaning wouldn't die? In which case it will still be used by racists in the old way - it's their mindset. And nothing is gained. And now you need to ask which "nigger" someone means if it's not immediately clear through the context. Meh.
Come to think of it - that's pretty much where we are now anyways: "Nigger" has become slang for "Dude, Pal, Bloke" some time ago, and - unlike VB's silly mission, is used that way by ppl it directly affects.
commanderkruge 1 year ago
@commanderkruge Yes, the friendly use of "Nigger" has been going on for quite a while now, started by the BLACK community - just as is normal in such cases. And this use is slowly spreading - to white hiphoppers, for example. It has already come so far that, given the right circumstances, black and white people sometimes call each other "My Nigga/er" meaning "My man!". This has been going on for quite a while and will continue or not, depending how the living language English will change.
commanderkruge 1 year ago
@commanderkruge Fact is - IF such changes come along, they usually come from within a subculture that in some way "has got something to do" with the word that's changing meaning. Why does VB want to start a second, artificial change in the word, instead of simply promoting the natural change that already is under way?
Because it's about him wanting to be special and recognized, that's why.
commanderkruge 1 year ago
@commanderkruge Sorry it took so long to reply, it's been a busy few days for me. That's a question you'd have to ask VB. What i would say is jumping to that conclusion is pretty premature until you at least get some comment from him about it.
Orygyn 1 year ago
@commanderkruge The method you propose is perfectly reasonable as well.
Orygyn 1 year ago
@Orygyn I don't "propose" it, I observe it - it's going on right now. It has been going on for decades. It's safe to assume that it's already moving at the speed that society feels comfortable to accept it. I find it kind of funny how VB seems to ignore this and wants his own new definition instead, and tomorrow please. By choosing that path instead of promoting the natural change in some way the only thing he achieves in the long run is to estrange a lot of ppl and put himself in the spotlight.
commanderkruge 1 year ago
@commanderkruge With only a tiny change he could make almost the exact same videos, promoting the already accepted "dude" - meaning for "nigger" for wider use. That way he would, so to say, join forces with the positive change that already IS going on. But then he wouldn't be special any more and THAT is his actual main agenda. He needs to stick out, he needs others to see his "wisdom" and follow his way. :)
commanderkruge 1 year ago
@commanderkruge I think I need to be more clear. There's a difference between the dictionary definition and people's perceptions of the word. The perceptions need to change. Assuming we go with VB's idea, the aim is first to desensitise people to the word by presenting it to them then to present the new definition. In cases where it will still be used in racial contexts the idea would be to laugh at the idea that getting called a human is an insult.
Orygyn 1 year ago
Interesting questions to VB, I'm curious for his answers... *picks up some nuts*
commanderkruge 1 year ago
My problem with variablast is, believe it or not, I'm not convinced he buys it. He comes off as so trollish sometimes.
Tyrtamus 1 year ago
@Tyrtamus He's the most dedicated troll by far that I've ever come across or heard of if that's the case.
Orygyn 1 year ago
niggering nigger. that's the only two words you need to see how silly it all is.
the collection of letters that make up the word aint the problem and even in the utterly impossible scenario that the word could be completely robbed of its historical implications and racist connotations, it still wouldnt do squat to help in the fight against ignorance and racism.
it is also important that it retains its henious connotations so that it may serve as a reminder and a signifier of things we dun wrong.
SkidRowRadio 1 year ago
@SkidRowRadio words being taken out of Huck Finn etc are a different matter. we do have issues with censorship and literally ignorance and such, that does not mean we should campaign to 'save the word nigger'
the word dont need saving, it needs to die. most black people would tell you this. i dont pretend to be an authority on it.
SkidRowRadio 1 year ago
@SkidRowRadio Nigger isn't dying. Nigga sealed it's fate. It's here, and it now has one extra definition. Niggering is new activity that isn't for everyone. Some people pretend to jerk off, some people nigger shit.
FundieFucktard 1 year ago
@FundieFucktard hee hee!
(pretending? who dat den?)
nigga was a massive and gradual movement that gathered steam thru 3 decades of social upheaval and struggle, 3 decades of milions of people redefining a word (with a letter and intonation changed, very important point), not a one man crusaide of some white dude off the internet who got stuck with the name after he failed to convince a single black person to take it.
ps, still love ya Fuck. just move on already!
SkidRowRadio 1 year ago
@SkidRowRadio I can't move on. I'm a fundamentalist Discordian Niggeritarian. Saying nigger is part of my religion, you god damn bigot. You god damn motherfucking religiously intolerant nazi jew pig.
FundieFucktard 1 year ago
@FundieFucktard aww thanks!!! you werent to know but just last week i niggered 'nazijewpig' so that it now means 'fluffy bunny ears cutiepie'
XD
SkidRowRadio 1 year ago
@SkidRowRadio Aw shucks! Great work! I always knew you were one of us. Niggering is fun!
FundieFucktard 1 year ago
@SkidRowRadio OK so it seems we agree as far as "something needs to be done". I forgot about the "reminder of racism" argument which has come up a few times so I'll put it in the description.
Orygyn 1 year ago