Sifu Wang Kiu - Mok Yan Chong (Dummy) 1-30 by www.wangkiu.nl

[silvanobonafe]

Bekijk deze video's ww w. vingtsunkungfu. info

[DutchMessiah1]

Cool! This is my sigung!

[eternalspring247]

Nice. Want to see what I have learned in the Wang Kiu lineage? Watch my videos.

[samtayt]

As a student from the late eighties of the past century I confirm that Sigung Wang Kiu always teached thoroughly and was a person of great integrity regarding the Wing Chun system. He also was not afraid do de-myth some stories brought up later and well familliair with what others changed or teached.

[bobdragonpole]

relax and nice...

[MemphisFlash]

There have been many types of 'wooden-dummys' for thousands of years,...Shao-lin Temple probably has the most accurate historical account of 'training-dummies'. The traditional wing-chun Mook Yan Joong form has 108-steps,...later there was added 8 more steps by some schools. All of the techniques are good and useable. Mu-chong fa si gu lao nien nien le'! Jie ge' lu shi fa si hen hao yeh'! duo xie, Si-Fu Mark

[hgearangler]

wangkiu,

when was the dummy idea created? By YipMan or which master?

[pissdchris]

point taken..I reckon wing chun is practical art not all about being flash...like plastic schools.. take the sul nim tao, no spinning hook kicks in that, but it gives you balance to support your strike ect...I respect your form I was just reading peoples quotes and got to me thinking chears and thanx

[pissdchris]

apparantly there where differant levils of the dummy the main differance is steping in with the side advance and the triangle side advance but there wher also diferant forms

I've found that by ending each section with dobble fock sau ya can mirror each section includeing the dobble palms as the third strike is differant the weaveing palm strike low...fell free to find my dummy form on my chanel...sorry to sound like a know it all..

[wangkiu]

Hello Pissdchris,

Feel free to sound as if you know it all :) as you say, because I don't really understand your explanation anyway...

To our honest opinion there were no different levels of the dummy, they were created later when Yip Man died just to be more unique or special. The dummy is just a set of movements so you can make your stance and foreward pressure more perfect.

[YuenYun]

Hm, from what I know, traditionally there were 100 movements, although when I do a set of "10" I can't count them...

I believe Yip Man also added sets after the 100, but I haven't seen them myself. Either way, the wooden dummy is a tool for practicing stance and movements. You can also study where you are free from the line of attack if you pay attention to the position of the dummy, and that's helped me a lot.

The dummy is not bound to the sets. Just by touching it, it can teach you a lot.

[wangkiu]

Then what should we all traditional? Yip Man teached Sifu Wang Kiu only 108 at the first time in the 50's. Maybe Yip Man added 8 more movements himself before sifu Wang Kiu became to teach. I doubt it, but I wasn't there.

Further you are right about the goal of the dummy. It's not bound to the sets, but just like the other forms, there's at least one order that should be the same everytime so you won't change the system in a while. It's like an alphabet of movements just to remember them.

[TazDSV]

@YuenYun there are 108 movements

[YuenYun]

@TazDSV ah yes, my mistake. I said 100 because I was taught the dummy in sets of ten, so doing "100" on the dummy would be the last set. Thanks for the correction

[devilzmantis]

that's my sifu's original teacher, Kenneth Chung. He teaches the dummy just like that... nice stuff!

[ledgohan]

i'm gonna have to heavily disagree with that statement. By the way, you better run that by Ken and see what he think of it haha.

[devilzmantis]

oops, i thought that was leung sheung maybe it's because it had his name along with others on the description. my bad. But this video isn't the crappy hard fast demos I see on the web.

[ledgohan]

i understand. though, leung sheung doesn't have any footage and wang kiu looks nothing like him. not to mention that ken's dummy (and presumably LS's) is very different to this one as far as application. Though the sequence is the same.

[wangkiu]

Quite intersting that you know (without seeing) that the application of Sifu Wang Kiu and Sifu Leung Sheung is very different.

If the sequence IS the same, application should be the same too. In Wing Chun you can interpret movements differently off course, but when following the principles the applications cannot be so different if the sequence is the same.

[ledgohan]

Also, who's to say everyone is correct in their execution of principles, or that they even understand said principles? One reason there are so many different deviations and no good practitioners is precisely because of the AMOUNT of interpretation from people who may not necessarily be qualified or capable of understanding. (sorry about so many comments, youtube limits the number of characters)

[wangkiu]

True, the principles can be explained differently.

But still, I doubt you can "see" the application of the movements in this video. At least we can't, we were thaught later. You can interpreter, like you say yourself, how you think the application will be. But untill you see the explanation or the movements, it's only a guess.

Though I do agree you can see some...

A PAK SAU in the dummy is a PAK SAU in application. But still minor differences can occur in explanation.

[ledgohan]

there is only so much to be said online, unfortunately this is not a good place for discussions bc we cannot feel another's hands for clarification. My original intention was simply to say that this is done quite differently from Leung Sheung's method and that this can be said from experience, just like the ability to "see" is gained from experience. LS's wing chun is very detail oriented and direct, using the 5 points, elbows and knees for power generation and stress position and sensitivity.

[8PalmWorks]

Absolutely the real thing. Sharp, clear and precise. Grandmaster of the year 2007 and the renowned pillar of the original Wing Chun.

Plse, post some more.

[Yakshinian]

Is there any way I might be able to see the rest of the video, please? With respect.

[wangkiu]

You can only view the rest of the video at the school of our foundation in the Netherlands. Only small parts will be released on behalf of Sifu.

You are always welcome to visit us sometimes and see the rest.

More video's will come soon.

[donchichi24]

Wang Kiu is the Wing Chun man! I like his seminars!

[DiamonDi1]

Finally...Wing Chun how it should be done (and is being taught by the Wang Kiu Foundation)..... More please.

[chisaucat]

How can he claim this is Ip Man's wooden Dummy ICheck the Ip Man 8mm movie !!!

[wangkiu]

Hello Chisaucat.

First of all, Sifu Wang Kiu doesn't claim anything. He's showing here the Mok Yan Chong as how he was taught by Yip Man. The 8mm is a set of short clips next to each other and can not be seen as a complete form. Even Leung Ting and Yip Chun have shown us different orders in the last years in books and video's.

The only thing Sifu alway told us is that he never changed 1 bit in his Wing Chun, otherwise the next generations will never know what Yip Man taught in the '50....

[mofotox]

I absolutely agree with Wong Kiu about keeping the art true. If everyone did all the forms differently, the variations would multiply EXPONENTIALLY. After a few generations, the art would be degraded to an unrecognizable and pathetic level! As for Ip Chun, he does not know squat! He only started crash course when he needed to teach for a living. Leung Thug only 'trained' with Ip Man for nine months. Even if that was true, he didn't learn much! Everything else from them is embellishments!

[wangkiu]

Yes mofotox, you are right.

Wang Kiu told us that even if he did not always agree with Yip Man (for example about the last kicks in the Dummy Works, which are not mirrored), he never changed a bit. Who is he to change something? Maybe there's an explanation about that end of the dummy that he didn't see, when he should change it, people would never find out.

Further he believes all changes made by others has never improved the Wing Chun system itself, so there's no need for change.

[prchdaword]

I see Chisau cat's point though...Look at Tsui Sheun Ting's dummy as well...its different from this video and he was an early student as well. Look at Wong Shong Leung's dummy and it is also different.

[wangkiu]

Hello Prchdaword,

But again, what's shown here is how Sifu was taught by Yip Man.

According to Yip Man (what was told by Sifu) the dummy has exact mirrored movements. It's a fact that Wong Shun Leung made (maybe good for him!) changes in the Wing Chun movements and Tsui Sheun Ting actually was teached later then the first generation. Both their dummy works are (again) different and both are not mirrored at all..

Right? Wrong? Good changes?

Not for me to decide, just want the original version.

[mofotox]

The dummy is set too high for him!

[wangkiu]

Hello Mofotox, you are right, this dummy is a little bit too high for Sifu Wang Kiu. Later in the video he explains this also.

[deadalicious]

wang kiu is the best

[stephanotisflori]

Excellent!! This must be one of the best wooden dummy forms I have ever seen. I wish you all the very best with the Wang Kiu Foundation. [Umaru Idi-Catteau, Amsterdam]