Star Wars & The Dam Busters - Homage or Stealing: Rotten Tomatoes Show

[1Hetty]

"Post-modern borrowing" is so much nicer than "stealing"...

[daniyellowjello]

You know what. You can root every show back to three Shakespeare plays...everyones stealing

[vikingdrizzit]

@daniyellowjello what about snow white and other grimns fairy tails rip offs, those arent based on shakespere, besides, shakespere himself took some of his ideas from other things as well, he simly knew not to steal entire stories

[thecomicbookfan25]

It's neither, just a coincidence. Lucas doesn't steal, family guy does. Do a homage or stealing on family guy stealing the simpsons.

[mindarinas]

Although zombies aka as fans will defend to the death, yes it's a rip off

[TheJazzyBReal]

Rotten Tomatoes' videos are always funny as hell.

[gethsoftware]

why dont they make one from the bible. that is abvius stealing form other myths. lol.

[Kurty451]

@gethsoftware thats happened countless amounts of times already,look at Terminator & even The Matrix.. John Conor J.C. Jesus Christ. There's an anomoly surrounding JC's father & birth. or look at neo, he found his powers in death after he "rose again". even Trinity's name is referencial to the holy trinity. It doesn't stop there for either movie or other movies.

[kieranwilson32]

Lucas actually pieced together many of the scenes using old footage from movies like that to give the ILM people an idea of how it should look

[kieranwilson32]

Lucas actually pieced together many of the scenes using old footage from movies like that to give the ILM people an idea of how it should look

[eleutheromaniac]

it is stealing, but look at it this way: Lucas took a brilliant scene from a movie no one ever watches any more and made it into a classic scene everyone will remember probably for decades.

and it really shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone who has seen the new trilogy: Lucas had 16 years to come up with original material and all he could muster was Jar Jar Binks.

[Lido84]

Is this video Homage or Stealing the extra DVDs from the star wars box set released 11 years ago? Lucas has an entire 20 minute interview explaining that he used scenes from an old war movie to choreograph this entire attack sequence. I was impressed with your Lion King video but this is just rehashing old interviews.

[TheHeadbanger93]

homage

[techraan]

Well since The Dam Busters was not based on an actual World War 2 mission, and was total fiction, I guess my answer would be.... Who frakkin' cares?

[aniki91344]

Homage or Stealing? Light saber battle scenes to a ton of random samurai dueling scenes.

[rosiekunable]

Star Wars is a collage of a bunch of movies, you can't expect George Lucas to make something original.

[atarimon]

Homage. Totally. The entire world, religion, and style of Star Wars is a collage of different things from everywhere. Saying that it 'ripped off' anything is a bit harsh, but it took many influences from many places and combined them with alot of imagination and made a great series...well, the original 3, anyway...

[capntugg]

Definitely homage in this case. Lucas often paid tribute to other hollywood classics and icons. For example, in the diner scene in The Clone Wars, I immediately recognized Wallace Beery in the character of the cook who talks to Obiwan.

[madd800]

stealing!!!"

[n68188]

There are only so many ways to attack a heavily defended target using high performance flying machines. It isn't so much the movie makers copying each other as it is the movie makers making movies about the same thing. People don't complain so much about this with sports movies, but thats because people are more familiar with the inner workings of football and baseball games than they are with that of airstrikes in enemy airspace.

[CyberMurph1090]

Yeah, this is hardly new. Lucas has credited the Dam Busters since Star Wars came out. The whole dang movie is inspired by "The Hidden Fortress", which he makes no secret of either.

[KingOfUm]

@CyberMurph1090 I love The Hidden Fortress, but honestly I don't see many similarities between the two, I just don't get it.

[timothytia]

all the star wars films are homages

[IDaCashman]

Whatever. Star Wars ripped off Dam Busters, Star Trek, Dracula, Frankenstein, Seven Samurai, Metropolis, Wizard of Oz, Flash Gordon, War of the Worlds, The Hidden Fortress, The Searchers, The Phantom Creeps, Lord of the Rings, King Arthur, many classic Westerns, many classic B-Movies, fairy tales, 2001, and so much more!

Today, nobody recognizes these "inspirations." But that's the people's fault. The way I see it, it's every single epic story ever told put into one, and that's Badass!

[henryprost]

@IDaCashman wow man thats a good comment

[starwarstopmotion]

@IDaCashman the lord of the rings movies were made after the originals.also most of these were made before but were common elements in movies.

[IDaCashman]

@starwarstopmotion K, first off by "Lord of the Rings" I mean the books, of course. Written between the 30's and 50's sounds earlier than Star Wars, huh?

It's true that these stories were done before, and a lot of these examples (Dracula, Frankenstein, Wizard of Oz, War of the Worlds) just flat out admit it. Look up "The seven stories that rule the world."

[starwarstopmotion]

@IDaCashman duh thats why i said movies.you were saying things mostly for movies.and it didnt exactly copy star trek.there is a much bigger story in it.both were produced either during(star trek)and after(star wars)the space race when everybody was interested in space.but star wars is more popular because it had more characters,cooler aliens,weirder places(people from star trek come from earth except the aliens)and better fighting.i still respect star trek though.

[IDaCashman]

@starwarstopmotion Is Arthur a movie? Also, I'm talking about small details, not entire stories. Star Wars is a better fantasy film but Star Trek is much more intellectual; and that's why Star Wars was more popular. There are at least a few things taken from Star Trek, for instance Warp Speed, if that wasn't already done.

[starwarstopmotion]

@IDaCashman light speed the speed of light its real:/

[IDaCashman]

@starwarstopmotion Simple terms: Spaceship goes into speed of light shining strings appear and we go weeee!

I mean that the ship goes into warp speed, not the actual speed itself. Do you need everything explained to you? ._.

[starwarstopmotion]

@IDaCashman i understand that i study star wars,lol.but both were made to demonstrate going at the speed of light.

[IDaCashman]

@starwarstopmotion True.

[starwarstopmotion]

@IDaCashman haha.sorry if i came off a little mean.i do agree that they got scenes and elements from other movies and it did only make it better:D

[IDaCashman]

@starwarstopmotion You didn't sound that mean, really.

[starwarstopmotion]

@IDaCashman haha okay im gonna subscribe to you cas ur cool:Pi dont usually subscribe people

[IDaCashman]

@starwarstopmotion YEEEEEAAAH.

[thecomicbookfan25]

@IDaCashman some of the movies you put there even came out after star wars.

[IDaCashman]

@thecomicbookfan25 Lord of the Rings as in the books; and Star Trek as in the original TV Series from the 60's. Wizard of Oz as in the books too; but Dracula and Frankenstein as in the movies from the 30's.

[timenyart]

@IDaCashman I'm pretty sure its safe to say it was a homage, as Dam busters was based after a real historic event, and the fact that half the people who worked on star wars were british

[Zerudah]

I trust it's an homage, because Lucas does give credit where it's due all the time. Plus, Dam Busters isn't the only pop culture reference in Star Wars.

[aBerlin1945]

Stealing

[kevinamuir]

If you make reference to it, it's an homage.

[titanayrum]

Homage



[moviebakerperson]

star wars was a homage to a bunch of films. this one is a little closer. i think it's homage mainly because IT DOESN'T TAKE PLACE IN SPACE

[MotherEarth2010]

Homage

[TOHOFIEND54]

homage

[vracan]

definitely hommage!

EVERYONE gets inspiration from SOMEWHERE else!!!

Applies to movies,music,art etc etc...

[Fishdogpigsquirrel]

It would have been better if they said nigger in Star Wars.

[StupidFuckingTrolls]

@Fishdogpigsquirrel you know what would better? if someone said cracker

[Fishdogpigsquirrel]

@StupidFuckingTrolls Hey now! Thats bringing back to the old, painful days of owning land and people!Totally offended.

[metaitachi]

Meh theyre not overly similar. Like near the end you compared 2 explosions... okay...?

But yeah Lucas did draw a lot of inspiration from other movies so i dont doubt that he had this in mind when creating those shots. Is it stealing? I'm not sure, but it resulted in one of the best films ever.

[anotherOneMore7]

It's no secret they were heavily imitating this type of footage. That was the idea... to find a way to translate space combat into something the audience could relate to.

[goldenevdo]

homage

[roockowacko]

well , its probably just a homage , along with the flyinf text in the begining of each film , flash gordon started that :/

[ddods14]

um no, there are shots very similar to those in almost all plane flying movies.

[Daandude1]

Homage, because the whole starwars series is full of little nods to these old adventure movies. Like the slide in cuts seen in many 50's movies and father son relationships.

[Krissdafish]

@Daandude1

I couldt agree.

[HarUman1234]

Lucas actually admits it's a homage

[zeijedatnietnetookal]

@HarUman1234 Saying it's an homage is exactly not admitting to stealing. An homage reuires disclosure of sources, or reference if you will. No reference? Stealing.

[ogukuo72]

Yep. Stealing. 

[merrimac291]

Empire is what I think of when I think of Star Wars.

[MaxRebo120]

Homage

[e105beta]

It should be known that the original Star Wars was just one giant tribute to other great movies.

The Hidden Fortress, anyone?

[awings718]

is that really how you pronounce homage?

[tubebellator]

lucas is nothing but a film nerd that patches things together

[blindandwatching]

Lucas took so many ideas from so many movies to make episode 4. Though I like how he strung them together into a coherent movie. So I say Homage, just don't do it again Lucas or I'll decapitate you with my lightsaber.

[dragde123ify]

@blindandwatching lol good joke of the lightsaber :D

[nerfballs2000]

Good artists copy, great artists steal.

[lawofmatthew]

Homage of course! Lucas said it years ago

[bob0s062]

Lucas said way back when Star Wars came out that he got his ideas from WWII dog fighting footage. Homage.

[Cacmypants]

The whole of (the original) star wars is a homage to stuff that came before it

[bsnxenogear]

More Homage than stealing.

[HawaiiKnut]

I won't use the word "stealing", but inspiration. Lucas have stated that good chunks of his films are inspired by other films.

[Ferosaur]

it just seems to me like the natural way to film scenes like that

[JackBelialAntihero]

I don`t like star wars much but I think it's just influence, I mean every artist have one, there's no such a thing as "a self made artist"

[mmarsh1972]

Neither homage nor Stealing

Lucas has stated that the Space combat scenes were inspired from WWII Air combat footage, so I don't think its stealing from Dam Busters as both films used the same source material.

[TieLandProductions]

Using the same camera angles and shots is not stealing. Countless movies share the same kinds of shots, angles, and camera tricks, none of which is really considered stealing. Yeah, the dialogue's also ripped off, but it's just battle chatter. It's not what made Star Wars the movie it is; had the dialogue been different, it wouldn't have made that much of a difference. Now, if Star Wars became famous for a line/ plot that came straight from Dambusters, then we'd have a problem.

[wewantpot010]

Didn't Lucas steal the idea of star wars from flash gordon

[manmanguy]

wow, may be stealing

[juffan]

Star Wars has so many stolen scenes

[dftbapeep]

omg this is so stupid star wars is nothing like this the black and white movie is like all movies in that time

[MrSmoke2Toke]

@dftbapeep are you fucked?? read what you said and think about it

[dftbapeep]

@MrSmoke2Toke go fuck yourself i stand by it

[thedarksaviour755]

HOMAGE! :D

[mckfrr]

Okay listen people every single movie of all time ever made has borrowed or stole an idea from other movies or books or whatever, it is impossible to make a movie without having some or little similarity to something else. As long as it's not a total whole movie copycat.

[lexlinkroy]

Homage

[spartankiller650]

fuck dam busters. star wars is way more awesome

[UncommonAction]

The Dam Busters what? Oh, yeah that movie that wasn't Star Wars

[Joshtika18]

I know I have a bias here as a star wars fan, but I have to say, a lot of this is just common military procedure and air-to-ground tactics, so I see how it could definately be a coincidence or unintentional...of course I could be wrong.

[TheFallen8v]

Not a fan of star wars (there good movies but Im not a fan) but I say honage cuz GL said he was inspired by alot of movies when he was making star wars

[DragonLordKris]

Homage, both are only similar because both movies were trying to recreate or based off of world war air combat.

[TheAtticus19]

It's an homage. In fact, Lucas made a lot of homages to old movies in the original Star Wars trilogy. Just watch James Rolfe's reviews of the Star Wars movies.

[SuperWally93]

Well here's the thing, George Lucas was inspired many stories when making Star Wars. Western, Mythology and yes, other films. So to me this is no surprise.

[DNAngel2009]

In the making of the movie documentary, Lucas said that they looked at old war films to see how to portray an energetic fight. The scene where Han Solo and Luke Skywalker are shooting down enemy fighters together is directly influenced by this one war film, i don't know its name.

[DanielLaux429]

It's homage. Star Wars always homaged older movies, including this one & even Flash Gordon.

[weofparadigm]

I say homage. There's not enough similarities to incite outright theft.

[TheAstronymus]

@weofparadigm Right! Star Wars has lasers.

Just kidding. ;)

[SlashManEXE]

Obciously a homage. This is only one sequence of the film. If they both had similar plots throughout, then that might be suspicious. It has definately been inspired, but some of the things are just too distant to be considered 'stealing.' I mean, you might see these similarities in nearly every WWII dogfight video.

[msingersfo]

Homage... and Stealing - Lucas supplied his team with WWII dogfight footage. Certainly some a lot of "The Dam Busters" was influential on Lucas the writer and Lucas the visual leech.

[grenadianmed]

Wow.....Lucas pulled a Tarantino.

[TheMajorMicroMedia2]

who gives a shit this happned decades ago fuck it

[goofystarwars]

you a bitch

[SexCyberGuideCom]

thanks

[FailJunkies]

Fail Videos!! @ My Channel!!

[FailJunkies]

Fail Videos!! @ My Channel!!

[hanrahanorama]

who is george lucas?

[NeraFX]

He copied the entire scene. That's called stealing. Just because Lucas was "inspired by the classics" and borrowed" from them - what does that even mean? It's okay because the movies are old as hell and no one watches them anymore, apparently that's what that means. What are you people on about? Of course it's stealing.

Either way an homage isn't much different. It's often an excuse for unoriginality - not that Lucas wasn't original, but perhaps he needed a little help with his filming...

[lorezapocalypse]

@NeraFX Originality is over rated.

That scene was entertaining next to nobody stuck in an old black and white movie. Taking it out and recontextualizing it made it better. That's what a majority of sampling does, from Hip-hop to post modern literature. It takes something good, and alters it to make it better.

[NeraFX]

@lorezapocalypse: Personally, I enjoyed The Dam Busters, and the original scene was just as entertaining as the re-done one (maybe more). Michael Anderson is a very good director. As is Lucas - I mean he's a visionary - but even with that said, stealing is still stealing. That's an objective statement.

[lorezapocalypse]

"objective statement"

I'm not one to claim that reasonable standards for the arts cannot be established but I would stay away from the word objective.

The question is, of course, at what point does an appropriated work recontextualized become sufficiently divergent from its source material as to constitute an original artistic vision. I don't think hard lines can be draw with this, and in an era of sample based music and aggregated news sources such distinctions seems counter productive.

[NeraFX]

Your argument is irrelevant, here. I would agree with you for sure if we were talking about something else. What's original in film anymore? It's all been done. How many fighter pilot scenes are there in the history of film?

But we aren't talking about that, we're talking about this one scene. Lucas copied it shot for shot! What's there to argue? It isn't like he DID take inspiration, or an idea, or a shot or two from the original, he took the whole thing. He just flat out copied it. Y'know?

[lorezapocalypse]

Couldn't the direct appropriation of a scene from a WWII movie be a clear indication that we are supposed to view the space opera as an allegory for the state of geopolitics at the time the film was produced?

I'm sure I don't need to point out Regan's use of Star War's jargon to frame the debate over the cold war, from the evil empire to actual real life space lasers.

[NeraFX]

Are you mocking me? I'm not trying to be an ass, but seriously, are you? Really, I don't even know what you're talking about anymore. I fail to see how any of that relates to this video. Reagan's ridiculous "Star Wars" twaddle is totally disociative to... to ANY of this. Are you truly serious?

[lorezapocalypse]

Yes, I am mocking you.

I don't think I could make my position more clear. Given how every medium in the past couple decades has been revitalized by collage techniques, everything from music, to the visual arts, to literature, to even the news, traditional concepts of intellectual ownership are out dated.

[NeraFX]

Well, then, clearly neither of us are able to make our positions clear. Agree to disagree, how about that?

[lorezapocalypse]

@NeraFX Sure.

[peacechildforever]

- who fucking cares, dude -

[sharkinfested]

Lol, people are taking this video seriously.

Virtually every war movie and TV show has similar scenes, ie. Memphis Belle, Top Gun, Band of Brothers, Independence Day, Baa Baa Black Sheep, Battlestar Galactica - just to name a few.

[PiefaceclownPrdctns]

How else was Lucas supposed to make a scene about fighter pilots? Was he somehow supposed to defy the laws of the universe and create new ways to film a person sitting in a tiny cockpit? And was he supposed to create his own military dialogue? It's not stealing, it's common sense

[BlueTunisia]

This is stupid.

[erichathy222]

what is star wars and whos this luke skywalker?

[June28July]

Some mediocre franchise about laser swords and... I don't know, teddy bears versus giant metallic chickens or something...

[erichathy222]

lol giant metallic chickens im crying for real that was funny thanks

[June28July]

Really? Ha ha, you're welcome.

[chukurulugai]

it's clever re-making of a movie old enough to not get sued for it.

[tredwest]

It's stealing until you get caught, then it becomes an 'homage'.

[rocky0240]

STEALING!!!!!! an homage pay tribue by making a refrence, but when you take the whole damn sence!!!!

[melak6]

i think you meant" Scene"

[sairak5]

Fuck STAR WARS!

[metaleggman18]

Lucas borrowed a ton of stuff from older movies and just did something to spice it all up a bit. Take Indiana Jones for example. He didn't make the character up; the character had been around long before.

[stickshaka]

The Dam Busters movie didn't create it anyway. It's recreating an event from WW2 & Lucas uses it as a point of reference for his own scene that also involved multiple piloted craft attacking a large stationary object.

[gwapedo]

who cares???? really....

[TWELLS117]

Definitely homage.

Star wars has always been that,lucas has always been inspired by the classics.

[mrbender14]

That's not stealing

Lucas was inspired by alot of shit and combined alot of ideas and made them into one film

[Jay304BEe]

you kno stealing means star wars are the ones who stole, right. so ya fuck all u star wars fans for thinking the dam busters stole

[LordPenguin7485]

total thievery but then again...I hate the star wars series and wish it would die so I'm obviously biased.

[Clone1260whoOWNS]

LAWL

[WeskJago]

homage. of course most would say stealing. most people are ignorant and would rather put blame on something than accept it as 'homage'

[NoNickNoKick]

Pillage

[JackCkiller]

Stealing

[ishotbuckwheat]

stealing

[IgliMarku]

STEALAGE!!!

[rafidiisme]

both....but more coincenidental...more than just those two movies have made dog fights like that....

[icemanlonewolf]

It's not coincidental when the effects team for star wars says they used dam busters as an early animated storyboard that Lucas cut for them.

[OfficialAlbert]

lol

[godzhor]

ITS COINCIDENTAL.