FPTP voting system has been put up for a vote to change it 30 times in Canada in different areas and rejected 30 times . Democracy you have to love it .
@hanksnow82 Is it any surprise that the very system that allows the majority to win would be voted down? It is systemically self referring. But is it FAIR AND REPRESENTATIVE?
30 times across how many generations? How many times has a GOOD electoral system been proposed and with proper education accompanying it's proposal? 30 times sounds large unless you figure in that Canada is a massive country and has existed for many generations. Two dimensions that make your argument weak.
@enlightenedone676 FPTP has won out over proportional representation in 30 votes in Canada since 1995 . In its lost vote in Ontario in 2007 it was defeated by a huge margin pretty much killing the movement . Our system created the greatest country in the world but now you don't like it .
@hanksnow82 Greatest country in the world by what standard? Your personal opinion? Sorry to say but Canada comes in 4th overall based on a UN study. We come in 30th in healthcare behind Morocco. South Korea has a higher educational rating than us. Income inequality is increasing here faster than the US. I can see you've bought into the propaganda. It was nice talking to you.
@enlightenedone676 Have you ever been to Morocco ? I have and unless you're a multi millionaire it's a shit hole . Here's a little heads up the UN is the most corupt organization in the history ofthe world . You need to get out of your moms basement and go see the worls . Later .
@hanksnow82 Morocco is a shit hole and yet somehow we fall behind it in healthcare according to the WHO. Doesn't sound good to me. Isn't falling behind a shit hole in health care a bad thing? Next you're going to tell me the WHO is corrupt too? Maybe you should read your answers before you post. Your logic is a failure and it sickens me.
I agree. There's always time for communication. You'll KNOW when you need to take action. Don't get desperate. Setting up an Occupation that has been going for as long as it has now, is evidence that we can get things done. Be patient.
@enlightenedone676 You say our voting system sucks but you don't say why or what system you would change it to . Voter apathy tends to be greatest with the under acheivers and in some ways thats good .
@hanksnow82 Sorry, I'm limited to 500 characters. We have a first past the post voting system. What I would change it to would be a list based system where you rank candidates based on preference, with the option of choosing 'none of the above' and a mixed member system so we can vote to support both a local candidate and party separate from each other. I'd like to see the sources you based your 'under achiever' claim on, including a definition of 'under achiever.
Why would you occupy Bay Street when the rest of the world considers Canadian Banks the gold standard in this crisis . Canadian banks didnt bundle worthless securities . You're going to have to change your reason for protesting , again .
@hanksnow82 Global economy includes Canada. We have derivatives trading. We have a faster disappearing middle class than the US. We have the exact same multinational corporations that the US has. We have multiple instances of human rights violations here. There's a GLOBAL energy crisis. The hospitals and schools are way too underfunded. Our voting system sucks. Most of our politicians suck. Our population is apathetic. Need more reasons?
@enlightenedone676 Really ? What derivative products are traded on the TSE ? All successful countries have home based multinational companies . Being a successful multinational business serving the global market does not make you the evil empire . I work for a multi national company based in Canada that i'm quite proud of .The hospitals and schools are a provincial concern and i'm betting you didn't even bother to vote in the last provincial election let alone work for a political party .
@hanksnow82 Wow. Never heard of OTC derivatives markets eh? I should have been more specific about multinationals: ie. MONSANTO. Since you brought it up, what company do you work for? I fail to see why it matters if an issue is provincial, municipal or national concern. And yes I did vote, but there is no way for you to verify your accusation so it is ultimately hollow.
@enlightenedone676 What OTC derivatives are sold from the TSE ? I work for multi national BRP which is a great corporation like most companies . You're grouping provincial responsibilities with federal and even international matters and you can't realistically lump them all together . FPTP isa great system of voting and it has served this country well for almost 150 years . The left wants to get rid of it because it's the only way they could introduce some of their wacked out ideas
@hanksnow82 They're called OVER THE COUNTER for a reason. I'm not lumping. I'm saying that they are all problems. International matters? Occupy is a global movement. Explain to me how First Past the Post is a good voting system. I don't speak for the 'left'. I'm talking about having sense. Having a system where every vote counts, and you don't have to vote some idiot in locally so that you get proper representation provincially makes sense.
@enlightenedone676 I trade regularly on the TSE again i know of no OTC derivatives that are are sold from the TSE only the NYSE . Please tell me what OTCs are being offered in Toronto or Canada for that matter and who is selling them in this country ? This is arguably one of the best countrues in the world and we got here with FPTP . The left just wants to do away with FPTP so that ideas that would never be supported by the majority of voters could be given credence
@hanksnow82 OTCs are not traded on thr TSE. Those would be Exchange Traded derivatives. OTCs are not subject to the same oversight or regulations that OTCs are: watch?v=Mcc-GkjkOvE
You've failed to answer why you think FPTP voting is a good system beyond 'it helps the conservatives win". Voting shouldn't be about political strategy and games. It should be a fair representation and expression of the voting population. If you can't understand why that's important, I can't help you.
@enlightenedone676 You have no idea what derivatives are let a lone bundeled derivatives you need to get yourself up to speed on how the TSE works you have the two markets confused . Your assertion that FPTP helps conservatives win flies in the face of the facts since Liberals have governed more then any other party in the history of the country . What you want is the ideas of the minority imposed on the majority .
@hanksnow82 You say I'm confused and yet you provide no evidence that what I say is false.
You're the one that asserted that "The left just wants to do away with FPTP so that ideas that would never be supported by the majority of voters could be given credence" without any polling evidence to suggest that. I asked you to tell me how FPTP is a more fair system than the one I proposed. Instead you throw out some liberal conspiracy red herring. Your debating skills fail.
@enlightenedone676 What you have proposed has been voted down in 30 seperate elections in Canada over the last decade . My debating skills deal in facts yours deal in fantasy .
FPTP voting system has been put up for a vote to change it 30 times in Canada in different areas and rejected 30 times . Democracy you have to love it .
hanksnow82 3 months ago
@hanksnow82 Is it any surprise that the very system that allows the majority to win would be voted down? It is systemically self referring. But is it FAIR AND REPRESENTATIVE?
30 times across how many generations? How many times has a GOOD electoral system been proposed and with proper education accompanying it's proposal? 30 times sounds large unless you figure in that Canada is a massive country and has existed for many generations. Two dimensions that make your argument weak.
enlightenedone676 3 months ago
@enlightenedone676 FPTP has won out over proportional representation in 30 votes in Canada since 1995 . In its lost vote in Ontario in 2007 it was defeated by a huge margin pretty much killing the movement . Our system created the greatest country in the world but now you don't like it .
hanksnow82 3 months ago
@hanksnow82 Greatest country in the world by what standard? Your personal opinion? Sorry to say but Canada comes in 4th overall based on a UN study. We come in 30th in healthcare behind Morocco. South Korea has a higher educational rating than us. Income inequality is increasing here faster than the US. I can see you've bought into the propaganda. It was nice talking to you.
enlightenedone676 3 months ago
@enlightenedone676 Have you ever been to Morocco ? I have and unless you're a multi millionaire it's a shit hole . Here's a little heads up the UN is the most corupt organization in the history ofthe world . You need to get out of your moms basement and go see the worls . Later .
hanksnow82 3 months ago
@hanksnow82 Morocco is a shit hole and yet somehow we fall behind it in healthcare according to the WHO. Doesn't sound good to me. Isn't falling behind a shit hole in health care a bad thing? Next you're going to tell me the WHO is corrupt too? Maybe you should read your answers before you post. Your logic is a failure and it sickens me.
enlightenedone676 3 months ago
I agree. There's always time for communication. You'll KNOW when you need to take action. Don't get desperate. Setting up an Occupation that has been going for as long as it has now, is evidence that we can get things done. Be patient.
enlightenedone676 3 months ago
@enlightenedone676 You say our voting system sucks but you don't say why or what system you would change it to . Voter apathy tends to be greatest with the under acheivers and in some ways thats good .
hanksnow82 3 months ago
@hanksnow82 Sorry, I'm limited to 500 characters. We have a first past the post voting system. What I would change it to would be a list based system where you rank candidates based on preference, with the option of choosing 'none of the above' and a mixed member system so we can vote to support both a local candidate and party separate from each other. I'd like to see the sources you based your 'under achiever' claim on, including a definition of 'under achiever.
enlightenedone676 3 months ago
sound is turned WAY too low
rareyrare 4 months ago
I agree, they will do anything to shut these protests down this is canada not the U.S.A
1988scottcarey 4 months ago
Why would you occupy Bay Street when the rest of the world considers Canadian Banks the gold standard in this crisis . Canadian banks didnt bundle worthless securities . You're going to have to change your reason for protesting , again .
hanksnow82 4 months ago
@hanksnow82 Global economy includes Canada. We have derivatives trading. We have a faster disappearing middle class than the US. We have the exact same multinational corporations that the US has. We have multiple instances of human rights violations here. There's a GLOBAL energy crisis. The hospitals and schools are way too underfunded. Our voting system sucks. Most of our politicians suck. Our population is apathetic. Need more reasons?
enlightenedone676 3 months ago
@enlightenedone676 Really ? What derivative products are traded on the TSE ? All successful countries have home based multinational companies . Being a successful multinational business serving the global market does not make you the evil empire . I work for a multi national company based in Canada that i'm quite proud of .The hospitals and schools are a provincial concern and i'm betting you didn't even bother to vote in the last provincial election let alone work for a political party .
hanksnow82 3 months ago
@hanksnow82 Wow. Never heard of OTC derivatives markets eh? I should have been more specific about multinationals: ie. MONSANTO. Since you brought it up, what company do you work for? I fail to see why it matters if an issue is provincial, municipal or national concern. And yes I did vote, but there is no way for you to verify your accusation so it is ultimately hollow.
enlightenedone676 3 months ago
@enlightenedone676 What OTC derivatives are sold from the TSE ? I work for multi national BRP which is a great corporation like most companies . You're grouping provincial responsibilities with federal and even international matters and you can't realistically lump them all together . FPTP isa great system of voting and it has served this country well for almost 150 years . The left wants to get rid of it because it's the only way they could introduce some of their wacked out ideas
hanksnow82 3 months ago
@hanksnow82 They're called OVER THE COUNTER for a reason. I'm not lumping. I'm saying that they are all problems. International matters? Occupy is a global movement. Explain to me how First Past the Post is a good voting system. I don't speak for the 'left'. I'm talking about having sense. Having a system where every vote counts, and you don't have to vote some idiot in locally so that you get proper representation provincially makes sense.
enlightenedone676 3 months ago
@enlightenedone676 I trade regularly on the TSE again i know of no OTC derivatives that are are sold from the TSE only the NYSE . Please tell me what OTCs are being offered in Toronto or Canada for that matter and who is selling them in this country ? This is arguably one of the best countrues in the world and we got here with FPTP . The left just wants to do away with FPTP so that ideas that would never be supported by the majority of voters could be given credence
hanksnow82 3 months ago
@hanksnow82 OTCs are not traded on thr TSE. Those would be Exchange Traded derivatives. OTCs are not subject to the same oversight or regulations that OTCs are: watch?v=Mcc-GkjkOvE
You've failed to answer why you think FPTP voting is a good system beyond 'it helps the conservatives win". Voting shouldn't be about political strategy and games. It should be a fair representation and expression of the voting population. If you can't understand why that's important, I can't help you.
enlightenedone676 3 months ago
@enlightenedone676 You have no idea what derivatives are let a lone bundeled derivatives you need to get yourself up to speed on how the TSE works you have the two markets confused . Your assertion that FPTP helps conservatives win flies in the face of the facts since Liberals have governed more then any other party in the history of the country . What you want is the ideas of the minority imposed on the majority .
hanksnow82 3 months ago
@hanksnow82 You say I'm confused and yet you provide no evidence that what I say is false.
You're the one that asserted that "The left just wants to do away with FPTP so that ideas that would never be supported by the majority of voters could be given credence" without any polling evidence to suggest that. I asked you to tell me how FPTP is a more fair system than the one I proposed. Instead you throw out some liberal conspiracy red herring. Your debating skills fail.
enlightenedone676 3 months ago
@enlightenedone676 What you have proposed has been voted down in 30 seperate elections in Canada over the last decade . My debating skills deal in facts yours deal in fantasy .
hanksnow82 3 months ago
tin foil hat is tight lack of air giving you paranoid thought
bugmyass 4 months ago
Any way the volume can be improved? lt's pretty hard to hear.
Go Toronto!
TraceyMush 4 months ago