Guru3D DirectX 11 Order Independent Transparency

[tutaberi100]

Fuck this directx shit.. Games don't become better until new consoles come out.

[TheSteelStallion]

@tutaberi100 You realise how much ribbing you're going to get from that comment?

[Nikitabomb]

Alright I seriously want to know the song for this video. If anybody knows the answers please respond. I looked through all the comment I found nothing.

[falconidaes]

DX11 is bullshit from M$. Do you really want to see games ONLY on M$ Windows?? Do you really want to pay for every M$ Win with new doubtful DX effects??

OpenGL can handle ALL Operating Systems and have the same or grater POWER, SPEED and EFFECTS.

GAME MAKERS wake UP, they are many OSs faster then XP or W7, and yours games will be running faster on every FREE LINUX.

[haxxxor123]

@falconidaes Sure you can do most things in OGL however a OGL equal to DX11 is yet to be released when it come to shading and tesselation and other things, Unfortually due to this the developers pick DX11 because its simple and its a working standard, Hence they dont have to use a standard that isnt providing the needed quality, YET that is. Im expecting alot from the next OGL release.

[jackalsocoke]

@falconidaes Unfortunately, the recent DX updates have gone without answer from OGL, OGL is *years* behind now. OGL and it's controlling Kronos group have decided to turn for the time being (last 5 years) towards CAD demands not game engine shader requests. They have no reason to implement things like advance tessellation any longer, and focus mainly on precision and calls that automate calculating things about 3d Structures visually. Using OGL for gaming is dying, been for sometime.

[jackalsocoke]

@jackalsocoke For right now its true one could still use OGL 2.# - 3.1 or DX9 and technically still achieve an AAA title (current generation) because no-ones using DX10, 10.1 or 11 b/c none of the consoles can handle it. But once the industry and most people cross over that generational hardware divide DX11 (and even 12 which is currently under-raps but in production) will be used and OGL will officially be incapable of providing the same experience any longer.

[xxslayer66xx]

@falconidaes Yeaaa.... except that the operating system really only has about a 2% impact on gaming performance if you dont have shitty hardware that cant even handle the operating system. And openGL has done some cool things but still you cant honestly say it has as much potential as dx11.

[SystelCyrus]

@falconidaes No thanks, DX11 is rad as hell.

[stefmixo]

Why do I feel like they tried to recreate the assembly room of the StarCraft II trailer ?

[overclockeador]

NVIDIA FTW!!! but I only have a 8800GTX... but still.... NVIDIA FTW!!

[mda40000]

@overclockeador yeah GTX 480 FTW! i got mine and im glad i dont have shit drivers like ATI users.

[Grimmcorpse]

@mda40000 Ahahaha, look at all this fanboying :) nVidia got some shitty drivers aswell, both companies got great products, and some users experience driver-problems. Although the gtx 480 got stomped by 5970.. Don't bitch about that it's a dual cored gpu.. it costs just as much as the gtx 480 anyways :)

[mda40000]

@Grimmcorpse lol actually, the future is DX11. thats what fermi's ment for and it does a damn good job and even beats the 5970 in some of those DX11 games. Nvidia doesnt take one step back like ATI, but thinks ahead for what others will want in the future. ATI's support is shit. Nvidia has a problem, they come out with a driver for it in a couple days, not weeks. They invented the GPU. they are smarter, richer, and bigger than ATI/AMD ever is since the start.

[Grimmcorpse]

@mda40000 Yeah, the future is DX11 and ATi got there first (; And the only reason they beat the ati cards is because the games have been "optimized for nVidia", which again is a result of smart marketing, not the best choice imo. And who's up from when making a dual-core gpu? ATi :) And they invented the gpu? You got to be kidding me. Please support ridiculous statements with sources plx. Hint: ATi was founded in 1985, nvidia in 93'. Dunno if you know maths, but should be simple :)

[mda40000]

@Grimmcorpse lol ok let me say this. Nvidia is the inventor of the GPU that mattered. the first DirectX GPU. so what if ATI had a integrated gpu chip in the commodore (which is embedded so it still doesnt count). and even when they made the first stand alone gpu, it was too early before windows 95 came out for the gpu to matter. when that time came, NV1 was the first to simulate a working 3D model.

[Grimmcorpse]

@mda40000 GPU=Graphics processing unit. No matter if it can handle 3D or not. the NV1 was MARKETED as the first gpu,the first graphics chip with a dedicated processor. But since nvidia invented the "gpu" term,they could say that they invented it. Just like ATi is bragging about their invention of the vpu, the video-processing unit. (Which would, in fact, incorporate gpu's, since they are vpu's :) But then again, IBM was one of the first to create a 2d/3d card, which means both are marketing bs.

[mda40000]

@gaming0wiz many say since nvidia held off their 400 series for 6 months helped them rewrite the architecture for Fermi then before. this is not true and still even when it DID come out 6 months later, it still beat ATI at its own game, Tessellation. ATI has been putting tessellators in since the HD 2000 series, and for the first try for Nvidia for their Tessellation engine to beat a veteran in the field. that an accomplishment itself.

[gaming0wiz]

@mda40000 Now you just ruined a perfectly commonsensical argument by being a fanboy...

[mda40000]

@gaming0wiz yeah im fuckin porud to be a fanboy. you get so much more out of a Nvidia card than with an ATI. YES PHYSX,CUDA, and driver support are included.

[Korilaz31337]

@mda40000 Whoah! lets calm down now, you pay more for the 480 than the 5870 and you only get a 5% increase in performance at most, and it costs more to keep a 480 up and running, the fans are louder, and the card generates more heat... plus when it comes to bonuses... Eyefinity 6 with CF cards you get more more frames than with 3d vision surround... and so far 3d is just a market gimmick right now, not to mention Eyefinity 6 is way cooler....

[mda40000]

@Korilaz31337 but your refering to DX10/9 as everyone else thinks about where this card is marketed as a DX11 card. Nvidia could have stayed with their last architecture and made those API's faster like ATI did. but instead they built an entirely new architecture that focuses around DX11 while being backwards compatible with DX9/10. Getting an Nvidia card is worth it in the long run when ATI users are slowing down in Crysis 2 under tessellation while Nvidia users will be stable running.

[DrBeardo]

@mda40000 @mda40000 What? they didn't make a DX11/OGL4 only card, they are just adding newer instruction sets to the existing instruction sets for all previous versions of DX and OGL.

Nvidia after getting cut off at the knees by Intel and AMD had to find a new market somewhere so they modified their chip design to do better at GPGPU so they could sell more chips to the server market. GPUs are no longer graphics chips but Stream Processors useful for many different workloads.

[mda40000]

@DrBeardo What i meant by "for DX11/OGL4" is that they built the architecture for fermi geared towards DirectX 11 rather than improving anything on how the architecture handles DX10/9 better. ATI did the opposite. they focused on making the 5000 series faster for current DirectX10/9 titles like crysis,3dmark vantage, etc. and you can see that when you compare them to 1.5 to 2x faster in DX10/9, but 2x slower than fermi with DX11

[DrBeardo]

@mda40000 What? That sound more like shitty drivers then the chip not being able to handle previous iterations of graphics spec properly. Especially since bits of the stack from DX6 are still used for games using DX11.

Nothing is removed from the spec, only added. Its usually added in large blocks with major windows version updates. Though the same features can be implemented on any OS in OpenGL as long as the hardware can do it.

[mda40000]

@DrBeardo no shit. but why is this hard to understand for you guys? Nvidia spent more time on developing its new architecture for DX11 rather than taking anything from its older ones and improving it. Yes it also goes hand in hand with drivers, but the polymorph engine is nothing like and superior (at the moment) to what ATI has. AMD/ATI users comment about Nvidia drivers being shitty for not having one minor feature, while Nvidia users complain about ATI's not being entirely complete.

[DrBeardo]

@mda40000 OK, so be specific, what exactly is either one missing at this point in the game D3D or OGL/GLSL spec specific? Because historically ATI's D3D drivers have been more complete while Nvidia's have had better OGL support and has typically been the one to introduce niche nonstandard tech first, like 3d view, cuda, sli etc.

Drivers are the biggest part of this, no matter how fast the GPU may be on paper, if the drivers are shit then the card simply wont work optimally. I'm not taking sides

[mda40000]

@DrBeardo Nvidia CHOOSES to lead a path of pioneering with their graphics products. they do a good job of it however, by implementing it, but using it to get either the most performance (SLI) or create awesome visuals (PhysX) without a massive drop in performance. now the only game that really drops with PhysX on is Batman AA and thats if you have a card thats less than a 9800 GTX+

[DrBeardo]

@mda40000 Besides TWIMTBP is the same thing as Intel's ICC compiler, its meant to intentionally cripple the game by disabling certain optimizations and instructionsets when non Nv hardware is detected.

ICC does the same to AMD, VIA and Xcore86 CPUs, the code you compile on it flies as it will make use of all the various SSE instruction sets on Intel CPUs, but when you run that code on a non Intel CPU that has the same instruction sets the code refuses to use them even though they...

[DrBeardo]

@mda40000 ... are functionally identical due to cross licensing agreements with AMD over the x64 instruction sets. Its the whole reason that AMD sued Intel this last time around, it's not innovation, it's anti-competitive.

In other words it's a con, it's not an innovation to cripple your competition by either bribing a company to gimp out their code or to convince a bunch of devs that GCC is a worse compiler since it's Open Source and doesn't support the latest SSE the day it hits the silicon.

[mda40000]

@DrBeardo ATI doesnt do a whole lot of empowering new technology, gets the most out of it over time. Nvidia has a bigger community and it gives them an edge as with AMD/ATI, they have to decide whether or not they want to pay to promote their technology on a game to lose too much money where as Nvidia can plan on promoting any big game release with their "the way its meant to be played" logo.

[DrBeardo]

@mda40000 The reason for that is Nvidia no longer has any other market to move into, they have no chipset business, they have no chance of getting an x86 license out og Intel without a massive legal battle, they have their GPUs and they have Tegra and that's it. They are hoping like hell that the next Game Boy doesn't go the way of the Virtual Boy since there aren't any other big ARM based devices using Tegra.

Nvidia has a bigger market share of gamers but DAAMIT is into everything they aren't.

[DrBeardo]

@mda40000 Personally though I want Nvidia to take the court case and merge with VIA, this would allow Nv to make CPUs and chipsets as well as attack Intel by disallowing SLi on Intel chipsets, This of course if they can scale the Nano up to 4+ cores at 3+ Ghz, there is no reason it can't with some tweaking though.

The last thing anyone wants is for Intel to buy out Nv, unless you'd like to see the return of 1993 pricing on your parts... Yay, $3000 USD for a single GTX680...

[mda40000]

@DrBeardo See, personally i like Nvidia chipsets. not one has given me any slack and im not saying intel chipsets do, but Nvidia just makes it so much easier to configure the bios and their Northbridge's are better quality and can shit i can push my memory so far on them. but yeah. the reason i think intel threw nvidia out of their sights with motherboard licensing was to get ready for Larabee. now obviously that failed, but is still waiting for a day to become real. Nvidia just pioneers...

[DrBeardo]

@mda40000 Nvidia's non IGP chipsets are OK, my 680i LT is still going strong with an E4300@3.8Ghz but I've had 2 different makes of 6150IGP boards go as well as a 520a fail with blown SATA controllers, none where OCd.

Nobody pioneers, all the "new" tech SLi, Eyefinity, Physx, 3D etc. are all either bought from another company or are old tech that was done over a decade ago and sort of worked, but either was a solution without a problem, was too unweildy or just simply had no mass market appeal.

[mda40000]

@DrBeardo well lets just say this (and i proudly use a 790i FTW Digital PWM so i like their chipsets), they may not pioneering, but they greatly add on to what the original speification was and even get alot more attention out of it. 3dfx came up with a little idea about SLI, but Nvidia bought them out once the RIVA TNT started taking note and put the SLI idea into production. Ageia PhysX - bought out because Nvidia noticed it wasn't noticed much. Eyefinity is less of a change than 3d surround.

[inovatvstdios]

@DrBeardo SLi is not an innovation to anyone who knows anything about electronic buses. Eyefinity, Physx? Seriously, since the theory of relativity and move to transistors there hasnt been a single piece of innovation in electronics. everything you're marveling at is an obvious iteration. ALSO, Overclockers are bigger dumb fucks than early adopters, they contribute the most to slow progress

[inovatvstdios]

@mda40000 you seriously dont know what you're talking about

[mda40000]

@inovatvstdios and you ARE? i smell trollfag and how do overclockers slow progress? they show what can be with current hardware.

[inovatvstdios]

@mda40000 i see you are very slow

[inovatvstdios]

@mda40000 also white people say troll, black people say hater? truly remarkable how deluded this generation is

[mda40000]

@inovatvstdios truly remarkable how troll you really are. seriously your living in it. maybe you should start making it better hm?

[inovatvstdios]

@mda40000 I feel sorry for your brain. like a ferrari in the garage, while you play forza. clearly conversing with dumb fuck s like you is making me slow as well.

also, if i was a troll you'd be so trolled.

[mda40000]

@inovatvstdios i am weeping... but i love your funny metaphors.

[Pinnger]

GOOD BEAT!!! ;] ;] ;]

[Disinf3ctant]

Does anyone know the name of the song?

[THX1948]

The 5770 is a sweet card !

[FrankDodd]

Perhaps I need to get my eyes tested because after looking at it I suspect you can do that with DirectX 9.

[santiontanon]

@FrankDodd well, you can do anything eve without DX. The point is how many things does DX handle for you. The new thing here, is that in DX 10 and earlier, when there were transparent objects, you as a programmer, had to sort them so that the furthest one was drawn first. This was a problem, since sorting uses a lot of CPU. Now, DX handles this for you (hopefully in hardware), so, this is much faster and easier to do.

[jviper2004]

There was a video that explained this better (some dude doing a presentation using this demo), but that video for some reason has been removed. Yes it's true you could do the same thing in DirectX 6 and sort all your objects from back to front, but I think what this does it sort per pixel, so you don't end up with the painter's algorithm issue.

[4K4K1K0]

Revival of the consumer cards that do the sorting for you? Awesome!

[archyinf]

@santiontanon well, basically this was not possible before in real time. It uses a fragment based depth sorting technique with, in this example, up to 64 layers. Most cpu based techniques only sort objects or perhaps triangles which is not enough to display all possibilities correctly.

Doing something like this on the cpu would basically mean software rastarization and shading.

[RaTcHeT302]

What i think is kind of stupid was when i heard that you have to buy a new card for DX11

[IzakHunt]

Superb track but what is it?

[maxumbur]

nice track

[rrxdeadman]

Why DirectX 11? Most games don't use version 10.

[tutaberi100]

Because dx 11 has tessellation.. that should make next gen games much better looking.

[LastSando]

DirectX 11 have more power for games,you can play fotorealistic games with DX11... I am witing for DX 13 ^^

[rrxdeadman]

Why DirectX 11? They don't use 10 in most of the games now.

[anshumansinghr]

Looks so boring. And the robot runs in a funny manner.

[alxd25]

Name of the track plz :D

[shaun928]

According to Track ID on the Sony Ericsson w995a

the track is:

Flash

Johan Gielen

Revelations [Disk 1]

and very nice video :)

[shaun928]

i may be wrong :/

[Orgazmuz]

its not the track of the video

[drealgrin]

can directx11 do that with my girlfriend's panties too?

[FunnyMcBunny]

Nah man... Buy her some white panties and just "accidentally" squirt some water on them. ;)'

Trust me, it works. :)

[LauxRO]

that would be awesome. uhauhauhauha

[erjohnson227]

@drealgrin lol, i second that.

[WillP999]

This has existed for ages.

Why are they marketing it as DX11 specific?

[MmhGanja]

wow, whats the name of the track? sounds nice

[mankopi]

yo man, the vibe got me kicking!

[jviper2004]

Now I would ASSUME that in DirectX11, order independent transparency is built-in .i.e, the z-buffer actually takes transparentcy into account, meaning you can just render transparent objects with out having to write shader code that requires tons of memory usage and computationally expensive and only supports 16 layers at the most. If it does, that would be specail. But if it's no better than what you can do in DirectX9/10, then it's not special. It's just annoying (Ray tracing FTW!!!).

[ecookman]

this reminds me of something outta mechwar 4

[Bristecom]

I think it's great how Microsoft has taken good old ideas from PowerVR, Matrox, ATI, and NVIDIA and implemented them in DirectX 11 as standard.

[nitr0dnb]

It's tech demo from ATI.

[DJordydj]

Is that Starcraft 2??

[andruis55]

epic fail :DD

[FreePersiaForAll]

And what is supposed to be so significant about this?

[pgcarea51]

Who cares about graphics...

Song name, please!

[Levente20]

fail

[pgcarea51]

success

[Levente20]

why would u look at this video and asking for song lol... fail

[pgcarea51]

Because this demonstration isnt impressive.

They could have chosen water, or something more crysis-like.

But a transformer?

Thats boring.

Although the music is rather cool.

[Levente20]

btw how the fuk is tihs hardware tessaltion working? how the shit is that dense polycount realtime HOW HOW? in max the turbosmooth 2 it lags in viewport

[religionInsanity]

pgcarea51

with your comment it is obviously clear that you have no clue at all why this is special.

[religionInsanity]

Really bad :)

[0Camus0]

You Idiot, this shows how to render multiple alpha surfaces order independent, using dual depth peeling passes, if you can do this on Directx 9 come here and say it's boring, otherwise shut the f.up

[pgcarea51]

Its boring.

And childish, as well.

You have to live with that, son.

[Smauglys]

The same question, whats the music name?

[Deeprunpestcontrol]

Music name please .

[johnbananawarrior]

looks like the song name is more intresting then the video =)

[DonFlavi]

NAME OF THE SONG PLEASE!!!!!!!!!

[DonFlavi]

the name of the song please

[rambow70]

song name!!!!!!!!!!! what is it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[GrandDK]

Sounds like some old school progressive psy. Bitmonx, SBK, etc.

[ru5hn]

hello there :)! we still waiting name of this brutal track !

[aberkae]

that used to be me in the club robotic dancing lol,

nice video

[NBK1980]

Very nice Track :)

[Feder147]

Holy shit amd makes techno better than tiesto XD

[johncolling]

Heresy !!! Dont defile our God Tiesto !! :)

[dave00dance]

the problem is pc games can advance much faster than consle market yet the mian money is in consoles so pc game makers will limit themselves to consoiles games instaed of breaking the trend with crfysis type games

[decyx2]

This is sadly true and that is why DirectX 10 did not have the impact that it should have.

[BCEMCOCATb]

DX10 didn't have impact because it wasn't finished. MS launched it as it was to increase Vista sales.

Read what devs say about it.

[gor1l1a]

Seriously: What is the song/D.J.???!!

[johncolling]

Agreed..what is the sound track ??

[FILROD]

nada de especial sinceramente...

[Xendance]

I suspect that calculating image alpha will be quicker on DX 11 than on previous DX versions. Multiple alpha maps on top of each other (or multiple objects with alpha maps) can strain game engines and gpu's quite a lot.

[TeKKwR]

nice music

[RiptorSLO]

DX11?

More like DX7 :\

[MUNI743]

i love the music :D

[DjiXas]

Soundtrack?

[MUNI743]

cool !@!!!!!!

[magnamod]

Looks great, can't quite determine what's different about it though.

[kovacsandras]

compared to what?

[magnamod]

Shiny white glow?

[BCEMCOCATb]

In previous D3D versions it was merely possible to make correct independent order transparency.