I'm not always in combat, but when I am, and my rifle fails to feed or eject, I drop trousers right there on the spot and blast away the grit with a hardy fart straight into the action through the ejection port, or magazine well until it's cleared. Stay tactical my friends!
If you're shooting the gun clean then no. But dirty, it would only make more sense that you need a hotter round to force the actuation of the gun to prevent failures to feed.
the reason the m14 was replaced by the m16 had nothing to do with anything this video entails, one of the main factors was weight of both the ammo and rifle and control-ability on full auto both of witch the m16 does better than the m14, but there is a reason our special forces still use the m14, its deadly accurate arguably more reliable and carries around 2,800 foot pounds of bullet energy compared to the m16 chambered in 556. 1,200 foot pounds of force, far more energy at a range
What they don't illustrate here is that he could have easily urinated into the receiver and down the bore to clear the mud out and continued to rock and roll.
What I fail to understand is why there are people who use such foul language and disgust at this video. The last time I checked, we have freedom of speech and this video is an expression of free speech whether you like it or not. Why don't you people clean up your act so family oriented and Christian people can enjoy this video and reading about it.
I love how they're using 110's. Throw some 175 grains in that. Better yet, throw some hot 180's in that bitch. That bolt'll come back. I promise. 110 is a light load. It's like buying those low recoil shotgun rounds and shooting them through a semi-auto then wondering why they don't have enough power to force the bolt back.
Huh!? The internet told me that the open action M1A-M14 Never FTF or FTE! EVARRRR! Never Evarrrr! It is too Amurrrican! "Drop it in the mud, in the sand, in the snow, in Oatmeal, the plastic ball pit at Burger King & it still SHOOOOOTS!"..... Or not. Actually no.. It won't. Hmmmm I wonder? What rifle has a way to keep foreign debris out of the action? Hmmm? It couldn't be the AR. NO! NOT THE AR! That rifle is inoperable if you so much as sneeze on it!
@esh325 I'm being sarcastic. He could not have done much more to cause the action to fail. The Garand/M14 action is very reliable, but it cannot withstand EVERYTHING. How can most any set of moving/sliding metal parts operate properly caked in mud?
@ronpaul2008rocks In army testing early on, they noted the Garand was not a good performer in mud conditions, and the Springfield 1903 did better. It doesn't mean the Garand is a bad rifle though. While no gun is infallible, there are guns that do better in harsher conditions then others.
oh well i heard it was to expensive but still should have been rebuilt to tkae fal magzines with pstol grip and use of plastic comosites instead the wood
reason for replacement was expsense it was milled not stamped and a little outdated compared to fnfal. the us army should have apllied pistol grip and cut down the butt down and replaced it with a metal rib butt or with the dam plastics of the m16 we would have had afree world rifle furthermore any rifle owuld malfunction with this kind of test
this test is bullshit. cram mud into the chamber of any weapon and force the bolt into battery and pull the trigger. even the vaunted Kalashnikov would choke and/or explode.
@pcheeto The Kalashnikov at least has a safety that doubles as a dust cover, closing up the exposed area, the M14 doesn't. It has a bit of a gap in the receiver that is always exposed. Plus, when the m14's bolt holds open, it's a large area that foreign matter could potentially get into. He didn't purposely try to make it fail, the M14's action just isn't as sealed as well against the elements as other designs.
1 more thing y the fuck would anyone spray wd40 on a rifle before putting it in the dirt that makes dirt stick better. if he treated any weapon like that it would have failed to function. im sick of the lies and trickery by corporations and govt. this guy is a spin doctor he should be a politician. anyone see the mcdonalds commercial it tells you that you are smart for eating their poison? or the cell phone ads were they tell u,u are a loser if u dont buy their product. it make me sick
o that video was brought to you by dpms... no wonder why they were badmouthing the m1a. i would eat all that mud before i let it get in my action. i would have shoved that mud up my dickhole before i let it get in the action. no real gun owner or soldier for that matter would ever shove mud in the action like that
wow that guy would have jammed up an AK with that piss poor crawling job he done....i counted atleast 4 times when he dragged the action of the weapon through the mud.
IF you noticed, he didn't keep his action out of the mud multiple times, you were taught to keep your barrel and action out of the mud. IF in the case of dropping your gun in the mud, you were suppose to drop the mag and cycle the action a few times before reinserting your mag and firing the rifle. Oh well. My Mini and my M1A have always functioned fine, but you just got to operate them properly.
wrong bullet weight, fat bastard rolling around in the mud? this doesn't prove shit. and california is a super faggy, burnt-out, bankrupt mexi-state full of hair dressers, hippies, coked-out superwhores, and rich liberal bozos that is hell bent on violating law abiding citizens constitutional rights. fack california and this vid- i'll stick with my AK47 anyways.
@thegreatseal1991 Nope. 110 TAP run at a higher pressure than regular ball ammo. Had he run regular pressure 110gr loads rather than a fast burning high pressure 110gr TAP self defense load you might have an argument. Remember that the M14 is one of the easier to cycle gas rifles compared to the AR-10 or CETME/G3 which all handle 110gr. TAP just fine.
The rifle jammed because mud got inside through the top hatch which was a well documented problem with the older M1 Garand during WWII.
@brainplay This is a true statement. Even in official military testing they documented the M1 Garand having trouble a lot of trouble in mud and sand. People just don't want to accept the truth.
The M1A operating system evolved from the M1 Garand was once hailed as "the greatest battle implement ever devised". They are one fine weapon. That fat man needs to work on his low crawl technique. It is a rifle not an oar (: P)
@98379SA Actually it was the greatest weapon of it's era. It's now obsolete much like the M14 series. Remember that at the time it was fighting against bolt action rifles and carbines which were standard for almost all countries at the time. By today's standards, it's gas system, bolt, and charging mechanism are poor in comparison to most other gas driven rifles.
@brainplay True it was declared obsolete by 1965. Interesting how every time power and accuracy become important the US military blow the dust off the M14 and it is recalled to service. The M14 serves as the basis for the Mk 14 EBR-RI and also the M39 EMR. Makes one wonder what "obsolete" really means.
@98379SA The only reason its still around is because of its caliber. The army doesn't have any other immediate replacements. I'm sure if they had money for AR10's they would be using that instead as exactly the same as the M16 in function and would be easier to train soldiers on.
@esh325 Maybe, but they field the SR-25 in 7.62x51 (Knight's Armament) which IS based on the AR-10. These are the same people who spend $40,000 a pop on Javelin missiles and requested 1.03 trillion dollars for 2012, 707.5 billion just to the DOD.
@98379SA The SR-25, M110, and SCAR-H are mission specific rifles while the M39 is a generic stop gap. Where as an M110 was only rated to Scout/Sniper platoons, the M39 could be had for pennies and had no mission restrictions allowing for makeshift Designated Marksman teams. SEI whose rifles never tested under harsh conditions could match these other platforms but cost just as much and could never be created in the same volume. The M39 systems are being phased out by the M110.
@98379SA Considering that we already have a few thousand of these things in inventories collecting dust, it's a lot easier to try and put lipstick on a pig rather than go through a whole procurement process and trickle in a new platform. While both the AR-10, FAL, and SCAR-H all trump the M14 hands down, we don't have any in our inventories. It's was cost effective then but finally going away as the EBR and M14 is being phased out happily.
@98379SA It failed. Accept it. Even the M1 Garand had reliability problems with sand and mud in offcial army testing. Not saying the M1 Garand and M1A are bad rifles, they are great rifles, but they have their flaws like any rifle.
My concern is with the "test". If ones life depends on the rifle then it might be prudent to NOT drag it through the mud. If one did that with a weapon in the field it would demonstrate poor judgement. Also, it should be tested side by side with other weapons so as not to imply superiority. The M14 was plagued with breakage and was thought to but unwieldy in jungle combat. That said, the M14 serves as the basis for the Mk 14 enhanced battle rifle and the M39 Enhance Marksman rifle.
My concern is with the "test". If ones life depends on the rifle then it might be prudent to NOT drag it through the mud. If one did that with a weapon in the field it would demonstrate poor judgement. Also, it should be tested side by side with other weapons so as not to imply superiority. The M14 was plagued with breakage and was thought to but unwieldy in jungle combat. That said, the M14 serves as the basis for the Mk 14 enhanced battle rifle and the M39 Enhance Marksman rifle.
With that clay/mud they might as well have put superglue in it. I'm sure next they plan the J-B Weld test. This only proves that one can make a gas operated firearm malfunction with the right kind of "goo".
If i'm not mistaken, at the end of this video clip,one of the sponsors was DPMS. I may be reading too much into this but this might explain the anti-M-1A bias, as DPMS makes rifles in the AR platform
At the Navy Fleet Matches at Dam Neck, I had my M-1A throw an extractor while shooting at the 500 yd stage. Thankfully, the armourers from Crane, Indiana replaced the extractor and ejector in time for me to finish the stage. Thankfully, this type of malfunction is extremely rare. I don't know everything about the M-1 family of service rifles and don't pretend to so I ask experienced armourers whenever I can and check the technical pubs to get an answer.
@Garandstander It's not as rare as you think. Non-USGI parts are usually the culprit but the extractor on the M14 series is a weak link as it has a history of doing this before Norinco was invented. A beefier spring would help.
The Israelis had trouble with the FNFAL during the six day war due to sandy conditions. I own a DSA FAL, an M1-A and an AR-10. All of these designs have one area in which they are better in than the other designs. These rifles are not AK's and you simply can't abuse these rifles and expect them to work. Like the Marines have always said, know your weapon, maintain it and know what will cause stoppages and how to prevent them.
@oldannyboy37 Yes, but I think an AK would do better in this test. The AK has a safety that doubles as a dust cover that seals the action from debris, where the M14 has a gap in the receiver that junk can get into. If the bolt action is held to the rear on the M14, it allows even more foreign matter into the gun.
@esh325 You are right, that and AKs have much looser tolerances. It takes a bit more to gunk them up but at the point where your getting that much crap in the receiver pretty much any gun is going to jam.
Actually the M16 came about because the mil. was looking for something with lighter ammo (can carry more) and less recoil (easier to control on full auto). They look at other cals. but the M16 got chosen thru the "good ol' boy" system. It's taken over 40 years and the AR platform is still not as reliable as the M1, M1A and .30 Carbine were from day 1.
@HunterHornet Couldn't use the Norinco because if it failed people would say it's because it's Chinese. The Smith enterprise looks pretty nice. I like my Springfield M1A though, never failed me yet.
i use mobil1 synthetic grease in my m1a (not oil) and you would be hard pressed to throw a wrench in her gears.the 10 round mag is not the problem,the girly ammo could be suspect in a rifle that is still green and not properly greased.then again im just a truck driver,what do i know.
1) they are using the wrong grain of ammo so this is bullshit.. 2) I believe that compared to the m16/m4 the m1a is the superior weapon, it's more reliable and has greater stopping power. Its not without faults though, its considerably heavier than then m16, which don't get me wrong is a great weapon, in the right conditions and with a soft tipped bullet it would put down almost anyone one shot. Really its pick your poison, reliability/ stopping power, or mobility and more user friendly
I bet that mud got into the selector switch cutout in the stock and gummed up the hammer...try it again with an M1 Garand or an m14 without the cutout and you will see that it works.
As far as saying that this is the reason the m16 replaced the m14 I think you might be a bit off. If you were to try this test with an m16 you would get the same result or worse.
Maybe I should post a video of what happens with a black rifle in this situation. Or maybe not. I'd rather not waste my time trying to make a point. Both guns are great, I just prefer to kill when I hit a target. Not piss off.
that all depends on how volatile the round is. If it is too explosive it will not make it to the vitals and your target will be left with a hideous bloody superficial wound. you must have penetration and expansion. light tap rounds are varmint bullets... for groundhogs and wild dogs.
I own (2) Alan Baker M1A Rifles.....you're gay...you're a loser....You shouldn't even have ANYTHING to do with these guns....."lame" is just what I'd start to call you.
Out of all the bullet weights to use, why did they use 110 grains for a reliability test? As stated by someone else Hornady does make good ammo, but I think these bullets might be a bit too light. A bullet in the 150-168 grain range would have been more appropriate.
i have shot thousands of rounds thru mine and it has never jammed, but the ar 15 does jam badly that's why i got rid of mine and got a sig 556. m1a will always be my favorite and the only reason it was replaced by military is because of it's weight and it was uncontrollable on full auto.
@peterpetree really, my Direct impingment AR-15 hasnt jammed on me once. I clean it once a day and thats that, once its clean, it functions like a dream.
@TheRaptor06 actually you can get it dirty. all that crap about it jamming every few seconds. total lies. that DID happen back in nam in the first 3 months it was introduced before it had been revised but it doesnt happen too often now Soldiers in afghanistan just clean it when they can and it turns out fine. I have 2 friends in the army and one in the marine core and none of them have any complaints about its reliability. Im going to colledge right now but ive used it extensively in training
Notice at the beginning he has "California Law" magazine. I mean, Jesus Fucking Christ California has become the Nazi gun state. No "Assault" weapons (the good guns). 10 round magazines. And on Feb 1st 2011 (NOW) you can ONLY buy ammo from gun stores (not online) and you MUST: Fill out a form. Name. Address. WHO you're buying it for (yourself or others) and WHY you are buying it. And you must give your photo ID along with A THUMB PRINT! Our forefathers warned us about this shit! WAKE UP!
@nanoer87 Yeah, thank god for that. They nearly got away with it. I'm wondering what else is coming next? All they need is another shootout or some mentally ill person shooting at a helicopter and soon it will be like Australia where you can only own a BB-gun or a single-shot bolt action .22 rifle.
wow, that is terrible. Here in good old Texas, I go to academy or walmart, give them my ID and $32 dollars and they give me my box of 100 .45 acps. Screw california, place is going downhill anyways.
mmh i have a serious question to you. and it's not offensive (sry for my english i'm from switzerland :D):
what's the deal with a lot of americans and all this gun stuff?? yeah i admit i am also fascinated by weapons. for example the k31 or a weapon like that. but i don't understand what is the problem if you can't by yourself an assault rifle?? why the hell you need G36C or an MG36 at home??
@Matthias1990Swiss The founding fathers of America knew that the only way to be protected from tyranny was to have the arms to fend it off. I think any responsible citizen should be able to purchase any gun (in any country), because when you ban fully auto guns, then next come "high-capacity", and "high-powered", and the ammo get more difficult to purchase until eventually you just can't buy anything period. Besides, we've never been invaded have we? ;)
sry the last one i didn't understand what you mean with high-capacity. i know the translation but not in this context. btw you say to be protected from tiranny. if you have an assault rifle at home and your governement is a tyranny you can't do anything against it because the governement has an army ;) and comon. self protection or protect your home with lets say an mg42 :D that's too much firepower to just protect yourself ;)
@Matthias1990Swiss Well the anti-gun hippies call anything that holds more than a couple of bullets "high-capacity", it's ridiculous but in places like California there are limits to the amount of ammo each gun can hold (like 10). And yes, I get what your saying and your right about machine guns not being necessary which I agree with, but my opinion is that if you can afford it you should be able to buy it and use it legally. They did okay in 1776 against the government :) Hope that made sense
@Matthias1990Swiss Yeah I guess I shouldn't have assumed you'd know your American history hahaha, 1776 was the American Revolution, when the people living in the colonies rebelled against the British, good times! haha well good day to you!
Why does someone need a SUV to drive just them self to work? Why do we need HD tvs? Why do we need anything more than what folks had in the 1800s (besides modern medicine)? BC we want to. My 100rd mags are fun, and I want them. Its like sex, I don't "need" to have it for any reason other than to have kids. But damn it its fun, and I want to.
that's a point. but you have to admit stuff like tv and so on don't hurt someone other. for example if you are angry and drunk and you want to take revenge for something. i think a 100rg mag gun is more dangerous in this situation than a hd tv :D i think it's really a matter of opinions. the issue with guns is that the risk of negative things beeing to happen is bigger :D
and lets say the massacre at columbine. if it would be just legal to have knifes or let's say half automatic weapons you have to admit that the possibility killing much persons in a short time would decrease.
i could talk about that topic hours long xd^^ :D i'm out now cya ;)
@Matthias1990Swiss Yes but they could have killed more than they did (at Columbine) by ramming a suv into the cafeteria. Or using a 2 inch razors to steal a 747, and pack a van full of homemade explosives. If someone wants to kill someone they will find a way to do it. Japan has school massacres with knives and swords. And all these things (cars, guns, fertilizer, and knives) have something in common. The VAST majority of their users are good people, who break no laws with them.
@Matthias1990Swiss -- Lol you aren't from switzerland. And if you are, you are probably 12 years old. And if you're not, then you're a fuckin' retard man. I've read all of your posts, what was that bit about an HDTV? Shut the fuck up and get outta here.
@Matthias1990Swiss did you happen to re-read any of your comments? Don't come at me bashing that you are just engaging in a normal conversation when clearly I have a much higher level of reading skill than you.
the description- "Maybe there is a reason the M14 was replaced by the M16." It is certainly not this reason. the m-16 would jam in far less worsed conditions. The
m-14/m1a is certainly more reliable than the m-16. Im pretty sure any auto rifle would jam with the amount of mud he put in this rifle. He dragged that gun through mud! he DRRAGGED it!
@a2redneck Doubt it. The M-16 series comes with a dust cover that seals off the bolt. With the dust cover closed, nothing gets in there. The dust cover on the M-14 opens downwards into the breach area. Any loose mud on top of that trapdoor would be thrown inside of the rifle, on top of the rounds and bolt itself. There are also large open areas on the right side near the fire select and the charging handle.
The M14 was replaced because it was crap and forced on us by politicians.
@brainplay i still think the m-14 is more reliable than the m-16. Soldiers in iraq and afghanistan are dusting off old m-14 because the m-16 jams up and under powered, but whatever. You just cant say the m-14 is crap. It based off the m-1 garand "the greatest battle implement ever devised"- General George S. Patton. Also, the m-14 is still in service today as a sniper rifle (m-21 m-25) The m-14 shoots a man stopping 7.62x51mm. besides your not fighting with the dust cover on.
@a2redneck No soldiers in Iraq are dusting off M-14's to shoehorn them into a Designated Marksman program not because they are uber reliable. It's in the inventory and a LOT easier to get than an M110. Parts, optics, etc on the other hand are not. Nor is the M-14's performance been that great as those that do get these pinnacles of overratedness often leave them in the trucks.
@brainplay Wooow, you know the dust cover doesn't do squat right? You get some sand or something in the star chamber on an AR and you're through, won't go into battery.
@FWalshingham You do realize you have no clue what you're talking about? Not only does that little door form a darn good seal over the bolt but the star chamber when properly lubed (rather than run dry) slops crap out of it when the bolt locks into place? Debris related jams don't occur in the star chamber, they happen on the rail.
@brainplay I don't know what AR's you're using, but you certainly aren't using them in sandy conditions. The dust cover hardly does a thing, hence the SOP of laying them right side up when you do have to lay them down. Maybe if it had a gasket or something on it, but as it is I have never had too much luck with the dust cover. As for the star chamber, the bolt can't lock into place if there is crap in there, especially if crappy CLP (GI CLP) is attracting sand and grit.
No trained soldier would let the action of his weapon be deep in the mud like that, this test is unrealistic. I doubt even an AK would function after this.
well when you drag the fuckin rifle action down through the mud, what do you think is gonna happen? ar would not have fared any better, and I honestly think that amount of gunk would jam an ak. this test proved nothing except that we have changed our methods for low crawling under barbed wire.
@dhena81 A new M4 would jam under far less conditions. The M4 is a modern marvel of a machined weapon, but it absolutely will jam from any form of getting dirty. Not to mention dragging through muddy water.
Interesting video, will this is just one M1A jam where AR-15/M-16 jammed up more than the M1A and M-14. Me I like both rifles if any one thinks I'm against AR-15, M-16 style firearms. Will now though the new piston M-16 AR-15 and M4 style firearms make them
I don't see why people are complaining about the ammo. As long as it uses the same umph as the military ammo to cycle the op rod, then it's no problem. Commercial .308 is actually known to have higher pressures then military .308. The biggest issue I saw here was that there is a fair sized opening for mud to get through where the selector switch is. It should have been covered up as the the military one is.
I was in the US Army for eight years and a Ranger. Trained with the M14, M16, and many others. All will malfunction but proper training would allow you to fight through the problem. After seeing a little action in Granada with the M16, I would choose the M14 over the M16. Currenlty I am a law enforcement ofier and weapons instructor. I am also my dpartments AR armorer. If you are going t test a weapon, get a qualified person to do the testing, not this guy.
@rommell0195 Do I here sour grapes? I agree the guy was amatuerish, but the fact is when mud was applied this m14 failed. I too like the m14, but it has an awful lot of open action are for my tastes.
You get enough gunk in anything, yeah even an AK, and you'll shut her down. I didn't expect the white lab coat guy to take the plunge along with the rifle, cool! :-)
@NoiseMostBeautiful The problem is that the myth of the M14 is that it is supposed to be impervious to letting that much mud into it with so little effort. He only dragged it in the mud for 1 minute. You could do the same with an M16 or AK-47 with their dust covers closed and not get any mud into them.
This wasn't supposed to be a comparison between weapon systems. Merely killing the sacred cow of M14 invincibility.
The M14 is designed to fire 147 grain mil spec ammo. They were using 110 grain Hornady TAP ammo which would not generate enough port pressure to operate the rifle. If they actually used mil spec ammo and greased the rifle like it is supposed to be instead of spraying oil on the stock I bet it would have worked.
@disturbedone5009 The TAP ammo fires at a higher pressure than the milspec stuff. I pushes a 110gr bullet out at 3100fps vs. a 147gr round at 2600. Even with a heavier round the fps is still much lower that if it was using the higher pressure powder used in the TAP rounds. On top of that the gas port is self regulating and adjust to pressure changes need to fire the lighter tracer rounds and heavier AP rounds.
@disturbedone5009 The TAP ammo fires at a higher pressure than the milspec stuff. I pushes a 110gr bullet out at 3100fps vs. a 147gr round at 2600. Even with a heavier round the fps is still much lower that if it was using the higher pressure powder used in the TAP rounds. On top of that the gas port is self regulating and adjust to pressure changes need to fire the lighter tracer rounds and heavier AP rounds.
Also, oil sprayed on the exterior is an old trick to keep out mud and grime.
Higher muzzle velocity with a lighter bullet does not mean it will have the same port pressure. I have read that 110 grain .308 TAP might not always cycle in a M1a or M14 variant rifle unless it is properly greased or very clean.
If they wanted this to be a good test then why not use what the rifle was designed for?
@disturbedone5009 You're right, it doesn't always mean the port pressure will be the same. It also doesn't mean it will be less. But the funny part here is that the Springfield Armory webpage has 110gr TAP as an approved cartridge. So far only one person on THR mentioned that he thought the TAP was too light. Since then the myth has been perpetuated. 110gr TAP is hot stuff and more than enough to cycle the gun. 147gr ball wouldn't have helped fix the jamming here in any way shape or form..
@disturbedone5009 Ah I ran down the myth. Originally Springfield put out a list of ammo types to avoid damaging the rifle. 110gr TAP was mentioned but no reason was EVER given. Then the guessing and speculation started.
This gun jammed because when fired, the receiver cover plate move inside of the rifle to open. By doing so it splatters mud into it's own guts. Second, because it has large openings near the op rod and at the selector for mud, water, and grime to enter.
This test would only be of much use if they did exactly the same thing, at the same time, in the same way, with an M16. As a standalone test, it's not very useful.
Why the hell are they using the lightest weight ammo they can find? If you're gonna test a "military rifle" under military conditions try using military ammo. Minimum of 147gr. Lower weight rds might produce higher speeds for the bullet, but it lacks the power to reliably cycle the operating rod, which is fine for a range queen or a gun behind the bedroom door, but if you're gonna muck up the system, use heavy hard hitting rds that will manhandle that op rod back and sling the crap off of it.
@davidpkm Higher pressure isn't dependent on bullet weight alone. TAP ammo uses a faster burning commercial powder than military ball powder which brings the pressure up to 61,000psi which is the same for 168gr ball. This is more than enough to cycle the action just fine.
The rifle failed because like many M14's (not civilian M1a), it has many areas for mud and grime to enter. Mud piled up at the charging handle, fire selector switch, and top cover which folds into the rifle during cycling.
@brainplay The increased case pressure for the Tap ammo is exerted on the bullet propelling it forward with more velocity than a heavier weight round. Speed isn't the issue, the force propelling it backwards is. The difference in force between bullets can be felt by the shooter. Heavier bullets kick noticeably harder because it is harder to push a heavier projectile forward than a light one. The result is more rearward force, equal and opposite reaction stuff.
Any difference between the M1A and M14 is irrelevant, they didn't shoot an M14 so there was no fire selector switch. The same areas that allow particulates to enter allow them to leave, very tight tolerance weapons will generally give you more reliability issues than ones with looser tolerances. Many manufacturers now recommend a "break in period" for precisely this reason. The rotating bolt turns to the left when fired, away from the moving parts and would normally sling crud everywhere.
@davidpkm Umm, you do realize that the M-14 is a GAS OPERATED rifle and recoil has nothing to do with it's cycling? The gas pressure inside the barrel determines if the bolt cycles or not. Gas pressure in the barrel is greater than the recoil which is why most modern rifles are gas impingement or piston driven.
That big chunk of metal up front isn't a bayonet mount, it's a gas block where the piston and op-rod are attached.
@brainplay Umm I don't ever recall saying it was recoil operated. I said it takes more force to push a heavier bullet out of the barrel. That makes the pressure in the barrel higher. Both rounds having 61,000psi in the chamber means nothing after they've made it 16 inches down the barrel to the gas block. Really? All this time I thought I'd been cleaning my bayonet piston.
@davidpkm It takes more force to push out a heavier bullet at the same speed as the lighter bullet. This is correct. But 168gr Ball ammo is being pushed out at around 2600-2700fps while this lighter bullets is being pushed out at 3000-3100fps. The force needed to push the lighter rounds at these extremely high speeds matches the pressure for the heavier rounds moving at much slower from the muzzle.
@brainplay Max chamber pressure for any mil spec load should not exceed 50,000 psi regardless of bullet weight, as it's beyond the max pressure of the 7.62x51mm. I would advise against firing commercial .308 Winchester out of an M1A if you have one, it is not the same as 7.62x51mm. It operates at different pressures and at different overall cartridge lengths.
@davidpkm 50,000 CUP (Copper Units of Pressure, aka crush pressure), 62,000 SAAMI (actual psi). They are two different pressure measurements with CUP being old school and now obsolete but still listed in manuals for archival purposes. They did away with CUP in the 70's after they were able to measure the pressure direct rather than having to use a copper crusher guns which weren't the most accurate measures at the time.
@brainplay It's more like 50,000 cup is about 58,000psi, and everything I've seen has been in psi not cup. I've seen 62,000 psi written as 52,000 cup which might lead to some confusion. Feel free to look in TM 43-0001-27, it's psi. The pressures of commercial .308 Win rounds exceed the max for 7.62x51mm, if the TM is correct, it does so by 12,000psi. The headspace, OAL, and case wall thickness are also different. You won't catch me shooting commercial .308 Win. much less hot loaded 110 grain.
I still love the M1A...
Gamerguy94 3 days ago
I'm not always in combat, but when I am, and my rifle fails to feed or eject, I drop trousers right there on the spot and blast away the grit with a hardy fart straight into the action through the ejection port, or magazine well until it's cleared. Stay tactical my friends!
slt223 6 days ago
@slt223 Do you prefer dos equis as well?
turdferguson9725 7 hours ago
If you're shooting the gun clean then no. But dirty, it would only make more sense that you need a hotter round to force the actuation of the gun to prevent failures to feed.
TheRed137 1 week ago
@TheRed137 Hornady tap 110 GR is hotter then regular .308. It's 3165 FPS at the muzzle.
esh325 1 week ago
the reason the m14 was replaced by the m16 had nothing to do with anything this video entails, one of the main factors was weight of both the ammo and rifle and control-ability on full auto both of witch the m16 does better than the m14, but there is a reason our special forces still use the m14, its deadly accurate arguably more reliable and carries around 2,800 foot pounds of bullet energy compared to the m16 chambered in 556. 1,200 foot pounds of force, far more energy at a range
AfterlifeFireman 2 weeks ago
What they don't illustrate here is that he could have easily urinated into the receiver and down the bore to clear the mud out and continued to rock and roll.
nov284 2 weeks ago
@nov284 LOL :D
whodare 1 week ago
What I fail to understand is why there are people who use such foul language and disgust at this video. The last time I checked, we have freedom of speech and this video is an expression of free speech whether you like it or not. Why don't you people clean up your act so family oriented and Christian people can enjoy this video and reading about it.
Sparky37944 3 weeks ago
if he didn't carry the gun like a complete doucher he wouldn't have had that problem. fuck that fat ass
stanbydiverdmt 3 weeks ago
Here's an idea ,your next to the the water ,wash it out!
hayhog22 1 month ago
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I love how they're using 110's. Throw some 175 grains in that. Better yet, throw some hot 180's in that bitch. That bolt'll come back. I promise. 110 is a light load. It's like buying those low recoil shotgun rounds and shooting them through a semi-auto then wondering why they don't have enough power to force the bolt back.
TheRed137 1 month ago
Comment removed
TheRed137 1 month ago
these guys are idiots. who the hell uses 110s to kill people?
c1elite436 1 month ago
@c1elite436 Why's it matter if they used 110's? It's hotter then regular .308.
esh325 3 weeks ago
@esh325 Standard .308 is like 168 grains.
TheRed137 2 weeks ago
@TheRed137 It makes no difference for cycling.
esh325 1 week ago
Huh!? The internet told me that the open action M1A-M14 Never FTF or FTE! EVARRRR! Never Evarrrr! It is too Amurrrican! "Drop it in the mud, in the sand, in the snow, in Oatmeal, the plastic ball pit at Burger King & it still SHOOOOOTS!"..... Or not. Actually no.. It won't. Hmmmm I wonder? What rifle has a way to keep foreign debris out of the action? Hmmm? It couldn't be the AR. NO! NOT THE AR! That rifle is inoperable if you so much as sneeze on it!
Friedstuffsable 1 month ago
How come he doesn't open the action so more mud and water can get in?
ronpaul2008rocks 1 month ago
@ronpaul2008rocks Why? It already choked really bad without having the action open.
esh325 1 month ago
@esh325 I'm being sarcastic. He could not have done much more to cause the action to fail. The Garand/M14 action is very reliable, but it cannot withstand EVERYTHING. How can most any set of moving/sliding metal parts operate properly caked in mud?
ronpaul2008rocks 1 month ago
@ronpaul2008rocks In army testing early on, they noted the Garand was not a good performer in mud conditions, and the Springfield 1903 did better. It doesn't mean the Garand is a bad rifle though. While no gun is infallible, there are guns that do better in harsher conditions then others.
esh325 1 month ago
@ronpaul2008rocks An AR15 might have perhaps did better in this test. The moving parts of an AR15 can be sealed by the dust cover.
esh325 1 month ago
m14 is the best battle rifle ever fuck you people .308 ftw , fuck .223
coty734 2 months ago
oh well i heard it was to expensive but still should have been rebuilt to tkae fal magzines with pstol grip and use of plastic comosites instead the wood
kullas924 2 months ago
reason for replacement was expsense it was milled not stamped and a little outdated compared to fnfal. the us army should have apllied pistol grip and cut down the butt down and replaced it with a metal rib butt or with the dam plastics of the m16 we would have had afree world rifle furthermore any rifle owuld malfunction with this kind of test
kullas924 2 months ago
@kullas924 The AR15 was milled too. The FAL was milled too. They had straight stock versions of the M14.
esh325 2 months ago
this test is bullshit. cram mud into the chamber of any weapon and force the bolt into battery and pull the trigger. even the vaunted Kalashnikov would choke and/or explode.
pcheeto 2 months ago
@pcheeto The Kalashnikov at least has a safety that doubles as a dust cover, closing up the exposed area, the M14 doesn't. It has a bit of a gap in the receiver that is always exposed. Plus, when the m14's bolt holds open, it's a large area that foreign matter could potentially get into. He didn't purposely try to make it fail, the M14's action just isn't as sealed as well against the elements as other designs.
esh325 2 months ago
I'll take the M1A any day over the AR-15, but with that said I guess it's all preference.
BroBadger 2 months ago
Is there any 10 round G.I. mags?
mdouglas1990 3 months ago
1 more thing y the fuck would anyone spray wd40 on a rifle before putting it in the dirt that makes dirt stick better. if he treated any weapon like that it would have failed to function. im sick of the lies and trickery by corporations and govt. this guy is a spin doctor he should be a politician. anyone see the mcdonalds commercial it tells you that you are smart for eating their poison? or the cell phone ads were they tell u,u are a loser if u dont buy their product. it make me sick
sicsempertyrannis187 3 months ago
o that video was brought to you by dpms... no wonder why they were badmouthing the m1a. i would eat all that mud before i let it get in my action. i would have shoved that mud up my dickhole before i let it get in the action. no real gun owner or soldier for that matter would ever shove mud in the action like that
sicsempertyrannis187 4 months ago
wow that guy would have jammed up an AK with that piss poor crawling job he done....i counted atleast 4 times when he dragged the action of the weapon through the mud.
soonersfan081 4 months ago
@soonersfan081 I've seen dirtier ak's work like they were clean.
mdouglas1990 3 months ago
I've seen dirtier ak's work like they were clean.
mdouglas1990 3 months ago
IF you noticed, he didn't keep his action out of the mud multiple times, you were taught to keep your barrel and action out of the mud. IF in the case of dropping your gun in the mud, you were suppose to drop the mag and cycle the action a few times before reinserting your mag and firing the rifle. Oh well. My Mini and my M1A have always functioned fine, but you just got to operate them properly.
Cougsfan34 4 months ago
Take care of your killing machine and God will take care of you while sorting M14 carnage
gbmcy 4 months ago
why the hell would he oil the outside of the gun? and I have never seen an m14 jam before he used the lightest 308's I have ever heard of
BALJIT147 4 months ago
wrong bullet weight, fat bastard rolling around in the mud? this doesn't prove shit. and california is a super faggy, burnt-out, bankrupt mexi-state full of hair dressers, hippies, coked-out superwhores, and rich liberal bozos that is hell bent on violating law abiding citizens constitutional rights. fack california and this vid- i'll stick with my AK47 anyways.
RAVENBOYbc 5 months ago
try that test with an ar15, and see what happens!
trevinor3 5 months ago
these losers are full of crap! m1a is a solid piece of gear!
trevinor3 5 months ago
110 grains bullets ARE the problem. Springfield Armory requires ammo between 140 and 170 grains, using 110's are asking for an issue.
thegreatseal1991 5 months ago
@thegreatseal1991 Nope. 110 TAP run at a higher pressure than regular ball ammo. Had he run regular pressure 110gr loads rather than a fast burning high pressure 110gr TAP self defense load you might have an argument. Remember that the M14 is one of the easier to cycle gas rifles compared to the AR-10 or CETME/G3 which all handle 110gr. TAP just fine.
The rifle jammed because mud got inside through the top hatch which was a well documented problem with the older M1 Garand during WWII.
brainplay 4 months ago in playlist brainplay's Favorited Videos
@brainplay This is a true statement. Even in official military testing they documented the M1 Garand having trouble a lot of trouble in mud and sand. People just don't want to accept the truth.
esh325 4 months ago
The M1A operating system evolved from the M1 Garand was once hailed as "the greatest battle implement ever devised". They are one fine weapon. That fat man needs to work on his low crawl technique. It is a rifle not an oar (: P)
98379SA 5 months ago
@98379SA Actually it was the greatest weapon of it's era. It's now obsolete much like the M14 series. Remember that at the time it was fighting against bolt action rifles and carbines which were standard for almost all countries at the time. By today's standards, it's gas system, bolt, and charging mechanism are poor in comparison to most other gas driven rifles.
brainplay 4 months ago in playlist brainplay's Favorited Videos
@brainplay True it was declared obsolete by 1965. Interesting how every time power and accuracy become important the US military blow the dust off the M14 and it is recalled to service. The M14 serves as the basis for the Mk 14 EBR-RI and also the M39 EMR. Makes one wonder what "obsolete" really means.
98379SA 4 months ago
@98379SA The only reason its still around is because of its caliber. The army doesn't have any other immediate replacements. I'm sure if they had money for AR10's they would be using that instead as exactly the same as the M16 in function and would be easier to train soldiers on.
esh325 4 months ago
@esh325 Maybe, but they field the SR-25 in 7.62x51 (Knight's Armament) which IS based on the AR-10. These are the same people who spend $40,000 a pop on Javelin missiles and requested 1.03 trillion dollars for 2012, 707.5 billion just to the DOD.
98379SA 4 months ago
@98379SA In the military procurement system, I believe small arms get the least attention.
esh325 4 months ago
@esh325 That is probably true
98379SA 4 months ago
@98379SA The SR-25, M110, and SCAR-H are mission specific rifles while the M39 is a generic stop gap. Where as an M110 was only rated to Scout/Sniper platoons, the M39 could be had for pennies and had no mission restrictions allowing for makeshift Designated Marksman teams. SEI whose rifles never tested under harsh conditions could match these other platforms but cost just as much and could never be created in the same volume. The M39 systems are being phased out by the M110.
brainplay 4 months ago
@98379SA Considering that we already have a few thousand of these things in inventories collecting dust, it's a lot easier to try and put lipstick on a pig rather than go through a whole procurement process and trickle in a new platform. While both the AR-10, FAL, and SCAR-H all trump the M14 hands down, we don't have any in our inventories. It's was cost effective then but finally going away as the EBR and M14 is being phased out happily.
brainplay 4 months ago
@98379SA It failed. Accept it. Even the M1 Garand had reliability problems with sand and mud in offcial army testing. Not saying the M1 Garand and M1A are bad rifles, they are great rifles, but they have their flaws like any rifle.
esh325 4 months ago
My concern is with the "test". If ones life depends on the rifle then it might be prudent to NOT drag it through the mud. If one did that with a weapon in the field it would demonstrate poor judgement. Also, it should be tested side by side with other weapons so as not to imply superiority. The M14 was plagued with breakage and was thought to but unwieldy in jungle combat. That said, the M14 serves as the basis for the Mk 14 enhanced battle rifle and the M39 Enhance Marksman rifle.
98379SA 4 months ago
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My concern is with the "test". If ones life depends on the rifle then it might be prudent to NOT drag it through the mud. If one did that with a weapon in the field it would demonstrate poor judgement. Also, it should be tested side by side with other weapons so as not to imply superiority. The M14 was plagued with breakage and was thought to but unwieldy in jungle combat. That said, the M14 serves as the basis for the Mk 14 enhanced battle rifle and the M39 Enhance Marksman rifle.
98379SA 4 months ago
This guy is to out of shape for this shit
Don007206 5 months ago
Brainplay, thank you for your input
Garandstander 5 months ago
With that clay/mud they might as well have put superglue in it. I'm sure next they plan the J-B Weld test. This only proves that one can make a gas operated firearm malfunction with the right kind of "goo".
98379SA 5 months ago
If i'm not mistaken, at the end of this video clip,one of the sponsors was DPMS. I may be reading too much into this but this might explain the anti-M-1A bias, as DPMS makes rifles in the AR platform
Garandstander 5 months ago
At the Navy Fleet Matches at Dam Neck, I had my M-1A throw an extractor while shooting at the 500 yd stage. Thankfully, the armourers from Crane, Indiana replaced the extractor and ejector in time for me to finish the stage. Thankfully, this type of malfunction is extremely rare. I don't know everything about the M-1 family of service rifles and don't pretend to so I ask experienced armourers whenever I can and check the technical pubs to get an answer.
Garandstander 5 months ago
@Garandstander It's not as rare as you think. Non-USGI parts are usually the culprit but the extractor on the M14 series is a weak link as it has a history of doing this before Norinco was invented. A beefier spring would help.
brainplay 5 months ago
The Israelis had trouble with the FNFAL during the six day war due to sandy conditions. I own a DSA FAL, an M1-A and an AR-10. All of these designs have one area in which they are better in than the other designs. These rifles are not AK's and you simply can't abuse these rifles and expect them to work. Like the Marines have always said, know your weapon, maintain it and know what will cause stoppages and how to prevent them.
Garandstander 5 months ago
good video. still wont stop me from purchasing my own M1A, its a great firearm...out of the mud, of course.
aiolos2411 7 months ago
These test never really have impressed me, you can make any firearm jam....it doesn't really prove anything.
If you get enough crap in the receiver of any fire arm and it will jam up, AK included.
Some handle muck better than others, but that's an entirely different conversation.
oldannyboy37 7 months ago
@oldannyboy37 Yes, but I think an AK would do better in this test. The AK has a safety that doubles as a dust cover that seals the action from debris, where the M14 has a gap in the receiver that junk can get into. If the bolt action is held to the rear on the M14, it allows even more foreign matter into the gun.
esh325 5 months ago
@esh325 You are right, that and AKs have much looser tolerances. It takes a bit more to gunk them up but at the point where your getting that much crap in the receiver pretty much any gun is going to jam.
oldannyboy37 5 months ago
...Did he really have to drag himself through the mud too?
Bangbrosiah 7 months ago
Actually the M16 came about because the mil. was looking for something with lighter ammo (can carry more) and less recoil (easier to control on full auto). They look at other cals. but the M16 got chosen thru the "good ol' boy" system. It's taken over 40 years and the AR platform is still not as reliable as the M1, M1A and .30 Carbine were from day 1.
hevitubi 7 months ago
m1as are not USGI mil spec. They do not have chrome lined barrels/chambers and they have less than USGI bolts and receivers.
HunterHornet 8 months ago
@HunterHornet It's hard to get an aunthetic military M14.
esh325 8 months ago
@esh325
the closest thing would be a smith's enterprise build or a Polytech/Norinco. both use chrome lining and exceed mil-spec on receiver strength.
HunterHornet 8 months ago
@HunterHornet Couldn't use the Norinco because if it failed people would say it's because it's Chinese. The Smith enterprise looks pretty nice. I like my Springfield M1A though, never failed me yet.
esh325 8 months ago
i use mobil1 synthetic grease in my m1a (not oil) and you would be hard pressed to throw a wrench in her gears.the 10 round mag is not the problem,the girly ammo could be suspect in a rifle that is still green and not properly greased.then again im just a truck driver,what do i know.
308scoutrfl 8 months ago
1) they are using the wrong grain of ammo so this is bullshit.. 2) I believe that compared to the m16/m4 the m1a is the superior weapon, it's more reliable and has greater stopping power. Its not without faults though, its considerably heavier than then m16, which don't get me wrong is a great weapon, in the right conditions and with a soft tipped bullet it would put down almost anyone one shot. Really its pick your poison, reliability/ stopping power, or mobility and more user friendly
japanesemartialarts2 8 months ago 2
You don't run 110 grain ammo in this gun. It will not cycle reliably!!!!
Its like shooting 40 grain ammo through a m16.
brycom1 9 months ago
@brycom1 Agreed, 110 gr is terrible for a m14.
esh325 8 months ago
only far if the m16 was put through the same test side by side
mrwestist 9 months ago
I bet that mud got into the selector switch cutout in the stock and gummed up the hammer...try it again with an M1 Garand or an m14 without the cutout and you will see that it works.
762deathtotheNWO 9 months ago
As far as saying that this is the reason the m16 replaced the m14 I think you might be a bit off. If you were to try this test with an m16 you would get the same result or worse.
Bassist117 9 months ago
Maybe I should post a video of what happens with a black rifle in this situation. Or maybe not. I'd rather not waste my time trying to make a point. Both guns are great, I just prefer to kill when I hit a target. Not piss off.
TheWaffleWankers 10 months ago
@TheWaffleWankers You obviously have not learned the word Hornady. lol
saari09 9 months ago
@TheWaffleWankers You obviously have not learned the word Hornady. lol You don't get up from a hit with TAP ammunition.
saari09 9 months ago
@saari09
that all depends on how volatile the round is. If it is too explosive it will not make it to the vitals and your target will be left with a hideous bloody superficial wound. you must have penetration and expansion. light tap rounds are varmint bullets... for groundhogs and wild dogs.
HunterHornet 8 months ago
I can't even watch.....
MarvelousSeven 10 months ago
I own (2) Alan Baker M1A Rifles.....you're gay...you're a loser....You shouldn't even have ANYTHING to do with these guns....."lame" is just what I'd start to call you.
Blago6actual 10 months ago
Out of all the bullet weights to use, why did they use 110 grains for a reliability test? As stated by someone else Hornady does make good ammo, but I think these bullets might be a bit too light. A bullet in the 150-168 grain range would have been more appropriate.
lvvein 11 months ago 15
@lvvein that was the first thing that came to my mind as soon as he said it
sicsempertyrannis187 4 months ago
4:03 no shit dumbass
CoinZaphod187 11 months ago
i have shot thousands of rounds thru mine and it has never jammed, but the ar 15 does jam badly that's why i got rid of mine and got a sig 556. m1a will always be my favorite and the only reason it was replaced by military is because of it's weight and it was uncontrollable on full auto.
peterpetree 11 months ago
@peterpetree really, my Direct impingment AR-15 hasnt jammed on me once. I clean it once a day and thats that, once its clean, it functions like a dream.
IKEELYOUNOW 11 months ago
@IKEELYOUNOW Well, try and get it dirty once. You'll see what difference it makes...
TheRaptor06 10 months ago
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IKEELYOUNOW 10 months ago
@TheRaptor06 actually you can get it dirty. all that crap about it jamming every few seconds. total lies. that DID happen back in nam in the first 3 months it was introduced before it had been revised but it doesnt happen too often now Soldiers in afghanistan just clean it when they can and it turns out fine. I have 2 friends in the army and one in the marine core and none of them have any complaints about its reliability. Im going to colledge right now but ive used it extensively in training
IKEELYOUNOW 10 months ago
@IKEELYOUNOW that is not how you spell college, good luck in school
longtrangm1a 9 months ago
@longtrangm1a if you were up past 12 doing homework you would make typos too.
IKEELYOUNOW 9 months ago
@TheRaptor06 they have complaints about having to clean it, but they do clean it. and due to that it doesnt malfunction on them.
IKEELYOUNOW 10 months ago
Notice at the beginning he has "California Law" magazine. I mean, Jesus Fucking Christ California has become the Nazi gun state. No "Assault" weapons (the good guns). 10 round magazines. And on Feb 1st 2011 (NOW) you can ONLY buy ammo from gun stores (not online) and you MUST: Fill out a form. Name. Address. WHO you're buying it for (yourself or others) and WHY you are buying it. And you must give your photo ID along with A THUMB PRINT! Our forefathers warned us about this shit! WAKE UP!
mrjustin5 11 months ago 35
@mrjustin5 Actually, the bullet law was over ruled and we can buy online without any restrictions.
nanoer87 8 months ago
@nanoer87 Yeah, thank god for that. They nearly got away with it. I'm wondering what else is coming next? All they need is another shootout or some mentally ill person shooting at a helicopter and soon it will be like Australia where you can only own a BB-gun or a single-shot bolt action .22 rifle.
mrjustin5 8 months ago
@mrjustin5
wow, that is terrible. Here in good old Texas, I go to academy or walmart, give them my ID and $32 dollars and they give me my box of 100 .45 acps. Screw california, place is going downhill anyways.
Schofie1d 7 months ago
@mrjustin5 Thank the lord I live in good ole South Dakota where I can own assault weapons and high capacity magazines
SonnyJWright 7 months ago
@mrjustin5
mmh i have a serious question to you. and it's not offensive (sry for my english i'm from switzerland :D):
what's the deal with a lot of americans and all this gun stuff?? yeah i admit i am also fascinated by weapons. for example the k31 or a weapon like that. but i don't understand what is the problem if you can't by yourself an assault rifle?? why the hell you need G36C or an MG36 at home??
Matthias1990Swiss 7 months ago
@Matthias1990Swiss The founding fathers of America knew that the only way to be protected from tyranny was to have the arms to fend it off. I think any responsible citizen should be able to purchase any gun (in any country), because when you ban fully auto guns, then next come "high-capacity", and "high-powered", and the ammo get more difficult to purchase until eventually you just can't buy anything period. Besides, we've never been invaded have we? ;)
cjsoccer09 7 months ago
@cjsoccer09
sry the last one i didn't understand what you mean with high-capacity. i know the translation but not in this context. btw you say to be protected from tiranny. if you have an assault rifle at home and your governement is a tyranny you can't do anything against it because the governement has an army ;) and comon. self protection or protect your home with lets say an mg42 :D that's too much firepower to just protect yourself ;)
Matthias1990Swiss 7 months ago
@Matthias1990Swiss Well the anti-gun hippies call anything that holds more than a couple of bullets "high-capacity", it's ridiculous but in places like California there are limits to the amount of ammo each gun can hold (like 10). And yes, I get what your saying and your right about machine guns not being necessary which I agree with, but my opinion is that if you can afford it you should be able to buy it and use it legally. They did okay in 1776 against the government :) Hope that made sense
cjsoccer09 7 months ago
@cjsoccer09
what did they in 1776?? the folk against the governement or what you mean?? yeah i think it's a matter of different opinions ;) hehe :D
Matthias1990Swiss 7 months ago
@Matthias1990Swiss Yeah I guess I shouldn't have assumed you'd know your American history hahaha, 1776 was the American Revolution, when the people living in the colonies rebelled against the British, good times! haha well good day to you!
cjsoccer09 7 months ago
@Matthias1990Swiss
Why does someone need a SUV to drive just them self to work? Why do we need HD tvs? Why do we need anything more than what folks had in the 1800s (besides modern medicine)? BC we want to. My 100rd mags are fun, and I want them. Its like sex, I don't "need" to have it for any reason other than to have kids. But damn it its fun, and I want to.
Smith03 7 months ago
@Smith03
that's a point. but you have to admit stuff like tv and so on don't hurt someone other. for example if you are angry and drunk and you want to take revenge for something. i think a 100rg mag gun is more dangerous in this situation than a hd tv :D i think it's really a matter of opinions. the issue with guns is that the risk of negative things beeing to happen is bigger :D
Matthias1990Swiss 7 months ago
@Smith03
and lets say the massacre at columbine. if it would be just legal to have knifes or let's say half automatic weapons you have to admit that the possibility killing much persons in a short time would decrease.
i could talk about that topic hours long xd^^ :D i'm out now cya ;)
Matthias1990Swiss 7 months ago
@Matthias1990Swiss Yes but they could have killed more than they did (at Columbine) by ramming a suv into the cafeteria. Or using a 2 inch razors to steal a 747, and pack a van full of homemade explosives. If someone wants to kill someone they will find a way to do it. Japan has school massacres with knives and swords. And all these things (cars, guns, fertilizer, and knives) have something in common. The VAST majority of their users are good people, who break no laws with them.
Smith03 7 months ago
@Smith03
mmh yeah of course. but what i wanted to say is that with a gun a bad use is easier than a bad use with a knife :D
btw i think in switzerland for a private person it would be very difficult to get legal an machine gun :D in switzerland the gun-law is very strict
Matthias1990Swiss 7 months ago
@Matthias1990Swiss -- Lol you aren't from switzerland. And if you are, you are probably 12 years old. And if you're not, then you're a fuckin' retard man. I've read all of your posts, what was that bit about an HDTV? Shut the fuck up and get outta here.
meshuggahfan 6 months ago
@meshuggahfan
yeah i'm not from switzerland you're right im from the moon xd
can't believe that there has to be people like you who can't have a normal discussion without insulting others.
poor poor-.-
it's a normal discussion and no one did insult anybody. ok may it's your style of discussing just to insult and so on.
maybe you're a person that takes a gun and starts blowing all down that are not your opinion?? c'mon
Matthias1990Swiss 6 months ago
@Matthias1990Swiss did you happen to re-read any of your comments? Don't come at me bashing that you are just engaging in a normal conversation when clearly I have a much higher level of reading skill than you.
meshuggahfan 6 months ago
@meshuggahfan
hey dude it's not my native language ok?? so you want to speak in german or swissgerman ok??
it's not easy arguing in a not native language
Matthias1990Swiss 6 months ago
@mrjustin5 It is a suggestion for for them to take ID and thumb print. I've never actually seen a gun store or sporting goods place bother with it.
gshum3k 7 months ago
@mrjustin5 not true about ammo, only in the bay area. here in san diego you can get ammo online instore, no id or paperwork needed
carcrazylt1 6 months ago
@mrjustin5
complete and utter violation of your constitutional rights
id take that crap to court- federal court
CanadianReich 5 months ago
@CanadianReich
do it before they use one states bad laws to set precedent for other states adoption of similar bad laws
CanadianReich 5 months ago
@mrjustin5 thank you for that
ownedkapoo 4 months ago
the description- "Maybe there is a reason the M14 was replaced by the M16." It is certainly not this reason. the m-16 would jam in far less worsed conditions. The
m-14/m1a is certainly more reliable than the m-16. Im pretty sure any auto rifle would jam with the amount of mud he put in this rifle. He dragged that gun through mud! he DRRAGGED it!
a2redneck 11 months ago
@a2redneck Doubt it. The M-16 series comes with a dust cover that seals off the bolt. With the dust cover closed, nothing gets in there. The dust cover on the M-14 opens downwards into the breach area. Any loose mud on top of that trapdoor would be thrown inside of the rifle, on top of the rounds and bolt itself. There are also large open areas on the right side near the fire select and the charging handle.
The M14 was replaced because it was crap and forced on us by politicians.
brainplay 11 months ago
@brainplay i still think the m-14 is more reliable than the m-16. Soldiers in iraq and afghanistan are dusting off old m-14 because the m-16 jams up and under powered, but whatever. You just cant say the m-14 is crap. It based off the m-1 garand "the greatest battle implement ever devised"- General George S. Patton. Also, the m-14 is still in service today as a sniper rifle (m-21 m-25) The m-14 shoots a man stopping 7.62x51mm. besides your not fighting with the dust cover on.
a2redneck 11 months ago
@a2redneck No soldiers in Iraq are dusting off M-14's to shoehorn them into a Designated Marksman program not because they are uber reliable. It's in the inventory and a LOT easier to get than an M110. Parts, optics, etc on the other hand are not. Nor is the M-14's performance been that great as those that do get these pinnacles of overratedness often leave them in the trucks.
brainplay 11 months ago
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a2redneck 11 months ago
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@brainplay ok fine the m-16 is more reliable than the m-14, but the m-14 is more powerful and more accurate.
a2redneck 11 months ago
@brainplay Wooow, you know the dust cover doesn't do squat right? You get some sand or something in the star chamber on an AR and you're through, won't go into battery.
FWalshingham 11 months ago
@FWalshingham You do realize you have no clue what you're talking about? Not only does that little door form a darn good seal over the bolt but the star chamber when properly lubed (rather than run dry) slops crap out of it when the bolt locks into place? Debris related jams don't occur in the star chamber, they happen on the rail.
brainplay 11 months ago
@brainplay I don't know what AR's you're using, but you certainly aren't using them in sandy conditions. The dust cover hardly does a thing, hence the SOP of laying them right side up when you do have to lay them down. Maybe if it had a gasket or something on it, but as it is I have never had too much luck with the dust cover. As for the star chamber, the bolt can't lock into place if there is crap in there, especially if crappy CLP (GI CLP) is attracting sand and grit.
FWalshingham 11 months ago
No trained soldier would let the action of his weapon be deep in the mud like that, this test is unrealistic. I doubt even an AK would function after this.
GunLovinKid 1 year ago
well when you drag the fuckin rifle action down through the mud, what do you think is gonna happen? ar would not have fared any better, and I honestly think that amount of gunk would jam an ak. this test proved nothing except that we have changed our methods for low crawling under barbed wire.
secretmarksman 1 year ago
A new Colt M4 wouldn't have jammed in these conditions sorry boys and gals get over it the year is 2011.
dhena81 1 year ago
@dhena81 Seriously? You have to be joking. An M4A1 or AR15 would probably explode on the first shot under these conditions.
ChrisHun7er 11 months ago
@dhena81 A new M4 would jam under far less conditions. The M4 is a modern marvel of a machined weapon, but it absolutely will jam from any form of getting dirty. Not to mention dragging through muddy water.
millergun 11 months ago
@dry7bones Last part is reliable.
dry7bones 1 year ago
Interesting video, will this is just one M1A jam where AR-15/M-16 jammed up more than the M1A and M-14. Me I like both rifles if any one thinks I'm against AR-15, M-16 style firearms. Will now though the new piston M-16 AR-15 and M4 style firearms make them
dry7bones 1 year ago
M14s are designed to be run with 150 grain bullets. 110 grain hornady's will not be as reliable in shitty conditions...
PKanadian 1 year ago
Hornady 110 grains are NOT going to cycle that rifle reliably. END OF STORY
brycom1 1 year ago
this is making me cry your recking a great rifle.
viper10011 1 year ago
I don't see why people are complaining about the ammo. As long as it uses the same umph as the military ammo to cycle the op rod, then it's no problem. Commercial .308 is actually known to have higher pressures then military .308. The biggest issue I saw here was that there is a fair sized opening for mud to get through where the selector switch is. It should have been covered up as the the military one is.
esh325 1 year ago
.338 Lapua > .308 Winchester > .223 Remington
Deal with it
MegaMonkeyChunk 1 year ago
@MegaMonkeyChunk
if thats the case than the .408 is the king
bjizzle123 1 year ago
Im speachless...what a turd, to bad the action didnt slip a take off a finger...
avail18 1 year ago
I was in the US Army for eight years and a Ranger. Trained with the M14, M16, and many others. All will malfunction but proper training would allow you to fight through the problem. After seeing a little action in Granada with the M16, I would choose the M14 over the M16. Currenlty I am a law enforcement ofier and weapons instructor. I am also my dpartments AR armorer. If you are going t test a weapon, get a qualified person to do the testing, not this guy.
rommell0195 1 year ago
@rommell0195 Do I here sour grapes? I agree the guy was amatuerish, but the fact is when mud was applied this m14 failed. I too like the m14, but it has an awful lot of open action are for my tastes.
preparehandbook 1 year ago
they should use mil spec 7.62 x 51mm ammunition, not some new match tactical shit, its a military rifle not a damn ar-15
AirsoftVeteran96 1 year ago
The problem is hes shooting 110 gr ammo in a rifle that isnt made for anything less than 147 gr.
Ranger4321 1 year ago
I'm an M1A fan but this was priceless lol. Hey shit happens.
03andrew77 1 year ago
Hes lucky the rifle didnt blow up in his face. The world is infested with morons......
dlmwtvl 1 year ago
You get enough gunk in anything, yeah even an AK, and you'll shut her down. I didn't expect the white lab coat guy to take the plunge along with the rifle, cool! :-)
NoiseMostBeautiful 1 year ago
@NoiseMostBeautiful The problem is that the myth of the M14 is that it is supposed to be impervious to letting that much mud into it with so little effort. He only dragged it in the mud for 1 minute. You could do the same with an M16 or AK-47 with their dust covers closed and not get any mud into them.
This wasn't supposed to be a comparison between weapon systems. Merely killing the sacred cow of M14 invincibility.
brainplay 1 year ago
@brainplay
The M14 is designed to fire 147 grain mil spec ammo. They were using 110 grain Hornady TAP ammo which would not generate enough port pressure to operate the rifle. If they actually used mil spec ammo and greased the rifle like it is supposed to be instead of spraying oil on the stock I bet it would have worked.
disturbedone5009 1 year ago
@disturbedone5009 The TAP ammo fires at a higher pressure than the milspec stuff. I pushes a 110gr bullet out at 3100fps vs. a 147gr round at 2600. Even with a heavier round the fps is still much lower that if it was using the higher pressure powder used in the TAP rounds. On top of that the gas port is self regulating and adjust to pressure changes need to fire the lighter tracer rounds and heavier AP rounds.
brainplay 1 year ago
@disturbedone5009 The TAP ammo fires at a higher pressure than the milspec stuff. I pushes a 110gr bullet out at 3100fps vs. a 147gr round at 2600. Even with a heavier round the fps is still much lower that if it was using the higher pressure powder used in the TAP rounds. On top of that the gas port is self regulating and adjust to pressure changes need to fire the lighter tracer rounds and heavier AP rounds.
Also, oil sprayed on the exterior is an old trick to keep out mud and grime.
brainplay 1 year ago
@brainplay
Higher muzzle velocity with a lighter bullet does not mean it will have the same port pressure. I have read that 110 grain .308 TAP might not always cycle in a M1a or M14 variant rifle unless it is properly greased or very clean.
If they wanted this to be a good test then why not use what the rifle was designed for?
disturbedone5009 1 year ago
@disturbedone5009 You're right, it doesn't always mean the port pressure will be the same. It also doesn't mean it will be less. But the funny part here is that the Springfield Armory webpage has 110gr TAP as an approved cartridge. So far only one person on THR mentioned that he thought the TAP was too light. Since then the myth has been perpetuated. 110gr TAP is hot stuff and more than enough to cycle the gun. 147gr ball wouldn't have helped fix the jamming here in any way shape or form..
brainplay 1 year ago
@disturbedone5009 Ah I ran down the myth. Originally Springfield put out a list of ammo types to avoid damaging the rifle. 110gr TAP was mentioned but no reason was EVER given. Then the guessing and speculation started.
This gun jammed because when fired, the receiver cover plate move inside of the rifle to open. By doing so it splatters mud into it's own guts. Second, because it has large openings near the op rod and at the selector for mud, water, and grime to enter.
brainplay 1 year ago
This test would only be of much use if they did exactly the same thing, at the same time, in the same way, with an M16. As a standalone test, it's not very useful.
pilatunes 1 year ago
Wash it out with half a canteen of water and keep on shooting. Just try that with an m-16
gyrsriddle 1 year ago
@gyrsriddle You can also pee on it Not the most practical solution if you are actually getting shot at but in a pinch...
pilatunes 1 year ago
Why the hell are they using the lightest weight ammo they can find? If you're gonna test a "military rifle" under military conditions try using military ammo. Minimum of 147gr. Lower weight rds might produce higher speeds for the bullet, but it lacks the power to reliably cycle the operating rod, which is fine for a range queen or a gun behind the bedroom door, but if you're gonna muck up the system, use heavy hard hitting rds that will manhandle that op rod back and sling the crap off of it.
davidpkm 1 year ago
@davidpkm Higher pressure isn't dependent on bullet weight alone. TAP ammo uses a faster burning commercial powder than military ball powder which brings the pressure up to 61,000psi which is the same for 168gr ball. This is more than enough to cycle the action just fine.
The rifle failed because like many M14's (not civilian M1a), it has many areas for mud and grime to enter. Mud piled up at the charging handle, fire selector switch, and top cover which folds into the rifle during cycling.
brainplay 1 year ago
@brainplay The increased case pressure for the Tap ammo is exerted on the bullet propelling it forward with more velocity than a heavier weight round. Speed isn't the issue, the force propelling it backwards is. The difference in force between bullets can be felt by the shooter. Heavier bullets kick noticeably harder because it is harder to push a heavier projectile forward than a light one. The result is more rearward force, equal and opposite reaction stuff.
davidpkm 1 year ago
Any difference between the M1A and M14 is irrelevant, they didn't shoot an M14 so there was no fire selector switch. The same areas that allow particulates to enter allow them to leave, very tight tolerance weapons will generally give you more reliability issues than ones with looser tolerances. Many manufacturers now recommend a "break in period" for precisely this reason. The rotating bolt turns to the left when fired, away from the moving parts and would normally sling crud everywhere.
davidpkm 1 year ago
@davidpkm Umm, you do realize that the M-14 is a GAS OPERATED rifle and recoil has nothing to do with it's cycling? The gas pressure inside the barrel determines if the bolt cycles or not. Gas pressure in the barrel is greater than the recoil which is why most modern rifles are gas impingement or piston driven.
That big chunk of metal up front isn't a bayonet mount, it's a gas block where the piston and op-rod are attached.
brainplay 1 year ago
@brainplay Umm I don't ever recall saying it was recoil operated. I said it takes more force to push a heavier bullet out of the barrel. That makes the pressure in the barrel higher. Both rounds having 61,000psi in the chamber means nothing after they've made it 16 inches down the barrel to the gas block. Really? All this time I thought I'd been cleaning my bayonet piston.
davidpkm 1 year ago
@davidpkm It takes more force to push out a heavier bullet at the same speed as the lighter bullet. This is correct. But 168gr Ball ammo is being pushed out at around 2600-2700fps while this lighter bullets is being pushed out at 3000-3100fps. The force needed to push the lighter rounds at these extremely high speeds matches the pressure for the heavier rounds moving at much slower from the muzzle.
brainplay 1 year ago
@brainplay Max chamber pressure for any mil spec load should not exceed 50,000 psi regardless of bullet weight, as it's beyond the max pressure of the 7.62x51mm. I would advise against firing commercial .308 Winchester out of an M1A if you have one, it is not the same as 7.62x51mm. It operates at different pressures and at different overall cartridge lengths.
davidpkm 1 year ago
@davidpkm 50,000 CUP (Copper Units of Pressure, aka crush pressure), 62,000 SAAMI (actual psi). They are two different pressure measurements with CUP being old school and now obsolete but still listed in manuals for archival purposes. They did away with CUP in the 70's after they were able to measure the pressure direct rather than having to use a copper crusher guns which weren't the most accurate measures at the time.
brainplay 1 year ago
@brainplay It's more like 50,000 cup is about 58,000psi, and everything I've seen has been in psi not cup. I've seen 62,000 psi written as 52,000 cup which might lead to some confusion. Feel free to look in TM 43-0001-27, it's psi. The pressures of commercial .308 Win rounds exceed the max for 7.62x51mm, if the TM is correct, it does so by 12,000psi. The headspace, OAL, and case wall thickness are also different. You won't catch me shooting commercial .308 Win. much less hot loaded 110 grain.
davidpkm 1 year ago