@gnrhead, you're a joke! I watched about the first 3 minutes of your first vid. That's all it took. Right when when you claimed that the sedevacantist arguments hold no weight and that they were illogical sealed it up for me. Ha ha hahahaa!!! Well really though. It was your constantly needing to read your pc screen even to make those claims in your opening. MEAT HEAD!!! Lol
Well, the Catholic Church has gone to Hell since Vatican II. Our Lady of Fatima warned about apostasy in the Church in high places. Walk into most Catholic parish churches today and you'll find a church with a Protestant-friendly Mass, altar girls, happy clappy rubrics, communion in hand, judical style vestments, a misplaced tabernacle and generally horrible and spartan church architecture. The Catholic Church has gone to hell. Let's be honest. Vatican II destroyed the Catholic Church.
@StSimonMartyr I think the Sedevacantist radicals that post refute themselves with their own posts. Instead of actually providing proof for arguments, Protestant sedes make false assumptions and toss out pejorative attacks. I suggest you study the Catholic faith before railing against it.
Catholicism is the Mass and the Sacraments. Masons destroyed the Mass in 1962, the required Sacramental Form was destroyed in 1944. Sorry, it's over. The Church is in a state of auto-demolition as Paul VI stated in 1968. Of course it looks legitimate, but that's how Lucifer wants it. If you want the ability to stand when the punishment comes, UNDERSTAND THE THIRD SECRET OF FATIMA.
The stunning evidence is on FATIMAMOVEMENT d o t c o m
Rome has until Aug. 17, 2011 when it will be destroyed
We can only hope that God in his mercy that the Mass of Paul VI is valid. However, in Pius V papal bull Quo Primum - it was very clear the Mass was never to be changed as to not incur the wrath of almighty God and the holy apostles Peter and Paul. The promise of our Lord the gates of Hell shall not prevail meant there will be valid mass communities and faithful worshiping God in sacrifice with validly ordained priests. I do not believe our Lord guaranteed against anti-popes. As a lay Roman Cath
WHY DON'T PEOPLE UNDERSTAND THAT YOU HAVE TO TALK IN THE MODE OF THE TIMES-IT DOESN'T MEAN YOU ARE EMBRACING THE ZEITGEIST! IF BENEDICT XVI WOULD SAY DOWN WITH LIBERALISM, DOWN WITH ISLAM, DOWN WITH PROTESTANTISM, THE VATICAN AND WITH IT ALL OF THE CHURCH COULD CLOSE IT'S GATES FOREVER! DOESN'T EVERYBODY SEE THAT?! Jeeese!
@hgjtugjtu That may be true, but did not Christ say "I have not come to bring peace but the sword, to set father against son...".
It would be a great display of Faith and courage to stand against evil. It is the pope's duty to do so, and that all Christians will follow. It is time he uses his shepherds staff to drive back the wolves. I would rather a Church with 1,000,000 orthodox Catholics than with 1,000,000,000 heretical apostates. If the truth brings martyrdom than I graciously accept.
What "traditionalists" or "sedevacantists" do not understand is that the Mass of Pope Paul VI was a more accurate return to the mass of the early church. Furthermore, the apostolic authority given to priests and bishops to consecrate the host cannot be removed. therefore it logically and theologically follows that the "New Mass" is valid. Just because priests now face the congregation and the form of the liturgy changed that was not theologically different, does not render the mass invalid.
@Pilatocus28 The ICEL translation of the Novus Ordo is blatantly erroneous, and the Tridentine Mass is exponentially more pious in its form then that of the NO. In regards to validity, my naivety says that the NO is still valid. I would need more research and convincing argument in order to sway my opinion otherwise.
VATICAN II WAS NOT HERETICAL! IF YOU ACCEPT THE DOCTRINE OF PAPAL INFALLIBILITY FIRMLY ESTABLISHED AT VATICAN I, THEN YOU HAVE TO ACCEPT VATICAN II TO REMAIN TRULY CATHOLIC. PLUS, THE "NOVUS ORDO" IS PEJORATIVE TERM USED TO DESCRIBE THE NEW MASS, WHICH IS A MISNOMER. THE NEW MASS IS CALLED THE MASS OF PAUL VI.
@Pilatocus28 The council, which is actually just a continuation of Vatican I did not issue any canonical decrees or definitions. That said, various 'pastoral' teachings of the council are blasphemous and heretical to the core. The best summary of the council is that it took one thousand pages to say what could be said in one.
O YOU THAT SO EAGERLY CONDEM MY CHURCH, WILL SAY TO YOU CHRIST AT THE OUR OF JUDMENT: WHAT HAVE YOU DONE TO BE PERFECT, SHOW ME WHAT YOU HAVE DONE FOR MY CHURCH. Did you instead pass your whole time to critisize her. Fool! Don't you know that he who critisize is loosing time to work? Satan the accusator, good of nothing. CATHOLIC CHURCH IS IN VATICAN AND ALL WHO SAYS OTHERWISE ARE HERESY PROPAGANDER, worth of Luther
O YOU THAT SO EAGERLY CONDEM MY CHURCH, WILL SAY TO YOU CHRIST AT THE OUR OF JUDMENT: WHAT HAVE YOU DONE TO BE PERFECT, SHOW ME WHAT YOU HAVE DONE FOR MY CHURCH. Did you instead pass your whole time to critisize her. Fool! Don't you know that he who critisize is loosing time to work? Satan the accusator, good of nothing. CATHOLIC CHURCH IS IN VATICAN AND ALL WHO SAYS OTHERWISE ARE HERESY PROPAGANDER, worth of Luther
You should actually read my quote before you try to refute my position. I was accused of saying this by someone else - so I will give you the same reply I gave them 8months ago, which you seem to be quoting from:
" I would like you to quote from my comments where I said "those who die in the state of grace go directly to heaven" - I never said that."
I don't have time to deal with those that worship the Dimond Brothers. I have done numerous videos and even written a complete article detailing the cowardice of Peter Dimond and his dishonesty. I have also provided a reference for the work on Jerome. Don't accuse someone of lying if you have no idea what you're talking about.
Ok people does nobody know who our lady of La Salette is? She told us that Rome will lose the faith. And besides that the Popes all the way from Vatican 2 have changed the Church so much that it is not longer the same church as the Church Jesus founded. Take a look for your self on how the new vatican 2 popes are taking worship with other religions.
Actually sedevacantism is not the position of the orthodox church. The orthodox deny the Primacy of Peter, but the the sedevacantists do not deny the primacy of Peter, they deny the man on the chair of Peter is not a Catholic.
JP II and your friend benedict openly worshiped in a jewish synagogue, recieved voodo blessings, JpII had a statue of Budda on the ALTER!!! and the list goes on, if this isn't participation, you tell me what would be...
Because the Pope never PARTICIPATED in the false worship of these individuals. This is tantamount to saying that any Pope of the past that committed sins therefore lost his office of the Papacy. Not even a monkey would fall for that one.
@gnrhead A true pope should never waste any time to go study or even be near a voo doo ceremonie even if you say he "never participated in the false worship of these individuals" The fact of the matter is that you need to realize that a True pope should never ditch a day of being the head of the Catholic church to watch this. During this day he could have been doing many beneficial duties such as spreading Catholism and saving souls... NOT being near or watching false worship.
@gnrhead you should be gone from the scene of apologetics because you obviously can not discerne truth in fulness from conepts... v.2 is a false council! You make these videos it seems to glorify your yourself with your ignorant points of view in your so called scholarly format hahahha! and reading your computer screen trying to seem and look intelligant hahaha. what are you a free Mason??? Woe to your herecy!!!
@gnrhead you should be gone from the scene of apologetics because you obviously can not discerne truth in fulness from conepts... v.2 is a false council! You make these videos it seems to glorify your yourself with your ignorant points of view in your so called scholarly format hahahha! and reading your computer screen trying to seem and look intelligant hahaha. what are you a free Mason??? Woe to your heretical tongue !!!
@gnrhead you should be gone from the scene of apologetics because you obviously can not discerne truth in fulness from conepts... v.2 is a false council! You make these videos it seems to glorify your yourself with your ignorant points of view in your so called scholarly format hahahha! and reading your computer screen trying to seem and look intelligant hahaha. what are you a free Mason??? Woe to your heretical tongue !!! BROTHERS AND SISTERS DO NOT BE DECIEVED BY THIS HERETIC! GOD BLESS YOU
@gnrhead Instead of posting videos from the safety and comfort of your bedroom, why not challenge the Brothers of Most Holy Family Monastery to a debate. Allow it to be recorded, and posted so that you can prove everyone just how "logical" and "well researched" you really are on this subject? If you want to talk-the-talk, then I challenge you to walk-the-walk and debate the brothers and allow it to be recorded and posted. If you have done your research, you have nothing to fear.
If you do not know his enemies, then it is you who clearly needs to research this more. You are anti-Catholic, anti-Truth, therefore no amount of testimonies to his sanctity will suffice for you. You are just arguing for the sake of it. You should spend more time learning, and less accusing and trying to refute that which you have no knowledge of.
no, he got it from ONE book that is anti-Catholic. if he can't provide a source, he needs to be quiet. if you wish to defend his claim, YOU need to spend time getting the source for him...IF there is one. no Catholic is stupid enough to say the popes don't sin, we just ask for a source of this alleged weakness. when you have the source email it to me, i will not be continuing this...whatever you want to call it.
Your question is so ridiculous it does not even deserve a response, but I will say that It should be obvious that I didn't live with this Saint, what age do you think I am?
The cannonisation process probed deeply into his life and took statements from his friends and enemies, and those who lived with him. Even his mortal enemies testified to his eminently saintly life, and high moral standard.
I don't even read the Angelus magazine. I would like you to quote from my comments where I said "those who die in the state of grace go directly to heaven" - I never said that. Whatsmore, your opinion does not matter to me since it is obvious that you reject the entire Catholic Faith. You are a heretic.
You are clearly a fool. You should know better that to believe everthing you read - especially on the internet. He was not an alcholic. That is a lie. Listen to the people who lived with him and knew him, not some protestant/modernist detractors.
Benedict XVI is a modenist - of course the saints die as saints! This is Catholic Dogma. If you die in a state of mortal sin you go straight to Hell. Do you reject this dogma also?
Why do you make up lies against the Saints? You are obviously not Catholic. Pius the Xth was the last Pope to be made a Saint. He opposed every error in the Church his whole life. He certainly was not a drug user, nor an alcholic. Why you lie about this is beyond comprehension.
damn all you mudshark nigger loving jew loving protestant loving mason loving devils, you will all celebrate your Vatican 2 Mass in hell you filty pigs
One thing I think is worth mentioning about the mass is that in the early church the Greek mass was very different than the Latin mass. They both held to different tradition while being in full communion. Both were valid.
Good Video series. I have exchanged blows with the MHFM in the past. Their hostility and irrationality match and exceed the more intense protestants on YouTube. It's quite sad. Some of their work refuting Protestantism is the best I have seen. But when they turn their attention towards the church it turns into conspiracy theories and smear tactics. Their arguments even mirror the protestant's sometimes. Sad.
How misleading can the devil be? Vatican II william teaches you from refuting any religion, where have you been??? Your religion teaches in case you weren't aware accepts all the faiths and that you shouldn't question this. Your not following your Vatican II religion your a heretic within your own faith.... How long have you been Catholic? If you were Catholic for any length of time you would know something evil has been going on with out reading anything. Stop saying your Catholic please
I'm young so I did not see pre-VII but as a Catholic I can tell that you are inaccurate. To be clear, faithful Catholics believe there is only one Church Christ founded. And there is only one Faith. VII did not teach us to accept all faiths. We are to love all people, despite what faith they hold. There is a huge difference. Please do not spread heresy and claim it to be Catholic teaching JamesFrancis.
quangjd......Maybe you need to study the documents of Vatican II and read the writings of the anti-Popes since 1959..... or you could just watch the Dimond Brothers vids on the topic and they give most all the relevant quotes from Vatican II that show that what JamesFrancis1000 said IS accurate.
I go to an Episcopalian/Anglican church but I find this discussion interesting. I didn't know it wasn't simply aesthetics, but the belief that the sacraments were invalid. C.S. Lewis believed religion was the "good infection", an energetic understanding of grace as theosis, a change in a person towards holiness, with sacraments one possible means. However, I don't think most Catholics hold that view? It almost sounds like something binary, you either get grace, or you don't... correct?
Quite untrue. For example, a person attending Mass that does not partake of the Supper can and does still receive graces by merely praying and hoping to one day partake of the Sacrifice of the Mass.
no grace is recieved at the novus ordo, it is a heretical and Godless travisty. To defend it and the V2 heresy not only shows your lack of understanding about the catholic faith but your lack of faith.
you do make a good, comment, i well give you that. do the sinful Jews in Moses day, invalidate Judaism, etc.. you are right in that case. but, what are we to make of one of the Popes letting snake worshipers worship in the Vatican?
we know what to make of it, its right in front of our faces, what we must do now is decide on how to correct the problem. The thought that scares me the most is that, when you look at the fact that this has been going on for 40+ years, that will their be any clergy left, to truly administer to the faith. we must pray the rosary and ask for guidance, it is the holy spirit that guides us. We must let it.
look at what vatican II has done. this heretical council created a new religion that is not catholic. to practice it is heretical. the novus ordo is heretical. the host is not concecrated at the novus ordo, what you are doing is worshiping a piece of bread. there is no salvation outside the church. there is only one God, one Church, one Faith. I am sorry if it is not pc but thats how it is. either you believe or you dont.
You have not attempted to answer my question re the Vatican II changes - See Below, posted 5 days ago. I hoped that someone would at least acknowledge my question. I don't set myself up as a sedvacanticist deliberately - I am willing to give the church every chance to prove the novus ordo mass & Vatican II changes correct. I am not here to argue matters that are beyond my understanding, as I am not a theologian.
I simply don't understand why the mass needed to be changed at all.
jim, the reason they had to change from the True Mass to the Novus Ordo service was to appease protestants. The True Mass is loaded with references to Catholic Dogmas. The new mass eliminated most of that and watered down the rest with ambiguous language in order that it would be acceptable to both Catholics and Protestants. Just do a search of Lutheran or Anglican services. The are nearly identical to the Novus Ordo counterfiet mass.
You stated that sedevacantists believe the gates of hell have prevailed. Incorrect. The Church defines the gates of hell as the death dealing tongues of heretics. Sedevacantists believe the Church has not been overcome by them, but many people have embraced heresy and as a result have cut themselves off from the Mystical body of Christ.
How can you offer proper apologetics if you misrepresent the issues???
If you presented the issues as they are, you would see sedevacantists are right.
I stand by my words. When I said that the Sedes believed such, it was my INTERPRETATION of their pathetic views on Theology and Church doctrine. Their theology is a joke. I have, as you can see through my videos dealing with this subject, misrepresented NO ONE. I always present my opponent's case FIRST then proceed to refute it to the best of my ability. GOD BLESS
That the Church will never be overcome. That Jesus is not a liar and that we can trust in his Church. It is the reason I am a Catholic and not part of a Protestantised offshoot called Sedevacantism.
A cursory reading of the verse tells us the GATES OF HELL will never overcome the Church. The Church that Christ established with a visible head shall last till the end of time. The Greek term for HADES or HELL here, whichever rendering you use shows us that it's pretty much in the context of ANYTHING that is in opposition to GOOD. None of that will, as the Greek word says "BE PREVAILING" over the Church that Christ has given us. GOD BLESS you
I agree. Additionally, the Second Council of Constantinople in A.D. 533 under Pope Vigilius defined "the gates of hell will not prevail against it (by these we understand the death-dealing tongues of heretics);"
Further, Pope Paul IV in Cum Ex Apostolatus Officio declares "if ever at any time it shall appear that any Bishop...or even the Roman Pontiff, prior to his promotion or his elevation as Cardinal or Roman Pontiff, has deviated from the Catholic Faith or fallen into some heresy:
(i) the promotion or elevation, even if it shall have been uncontested and by the unanimous assent of all the Cardinals, shall be null, void and worthless;..."
As well Pope Paul IV states "(vi) those thus promoted or elevated shall be deprived automatically, and without need for any further declaration, of all dignity, position, honour, title, authority, office and power."
Now it would certainly appear that John XXIII all the way up to Benedict XVI have fallen into or encouraged heresy.
This (among other reasons) is why the sedevacantist position is the right one, the Church has shown us over time by the Holy Ghost how to know an anti-pope
thanks for doing these videos. i wasn't even aware that Sedevacantism really existed until just like a week ago. i mean, i had heard rumors of people denouncing Vatican II but man, these people are out there!
LOL, I find it funny you are scared of the truth. Thanks showing me how tough you are by coming on my site and saying you've blocked me. I cried for days. LOL.
..."the mere fact that you do not hail your own Popes is because it will just confirm that SSPX is a schismatic and heretic CULT."
This is true...To go against a pope and at the same time recognize him as the Vicar of Christ, would mean you've fallen into schism.
That is why the Sedevacantist position is the only logical position to follow. Obviously the last 5 popes have committed public heresy along with the entire hierarchy.
It's not a dogmatic claim. But the laymen have the right to follow the true Faith. If/When a true pope is elected, then he will judge the history of the last 45 years accordingly. Until then most sedevacantists have true sacraments with the proper matter form and intention for their spiritual nourishment.
Hey, you fall into the typical mistake of the regular Novus Ordo catholic, who believes that he must only submit and obey to Dogmatic and Infallible proclamations and definitions of the Church, but unfortunately you are wrong.
I am not a "Novus Ordo Catholic" That's a ridiculous title. And to believe that one must only submit to Dogmatic teachings is also ridiculous. I follow the teaching of the Catholic Church as instituted by Christ. Nowhere in Church History did anyone come up with the theological novums that Sedes have conjured up. It's disgusting
It certainly seems that way by the way you talk (that you must only follow dogmatic and infallible declarations)
Sedevacantism merely explains what happened with the last 5 popes, basing themselves in the Tradition and same teaching of the Church, they are not inventing anything, you are.
Vatican I and Pius IX laid down these general principles by establishing all the following as the types of teaching that a Catholic must believe and adhere to:
You're right. Funny that among all the teachings of the Church..NONE Of them give private individuals the right to depose a Pope from Office based on their fallible opinions on the Pope being a formal heretic. It's ridiculous
And who are YOU to claim that GOD has deposed any POPE? In the past Councils convened to make such matters clear to the faithful. What council are you in charge of sir, that has made such a decision? Who are you and all the Sedevacantists? You are simply people INTERPRETING things to your own liking, in a LOUSY fashion as well. The majority of Sedes cannot read Latin, Greek or any of the Biblical or Church languages for that matter!
You are making no sense at all with this silly claim. The Papal Bull i told you about dates back as far as 1559. It IS clear and has been explained by many Saints and countless theologians, but you mindlessly say: "In the past Councils convened to make such matters clear to the faithful. What council are you in charge of sir, that has made such a decision?"
Actually the one that makes no sense here is YOU. You are claiming that certain Popes are heretics based on the fallible opinions of fallible men. Get real
Hah, among all the teachings of the Church eh? then what about this:In Cum ex Apostolatus Officio (1559), Paul IV decreed that no declaration was necessary for a heretical pope to lose his office; it would occur automatically. (See para. 6: eo ipso, absque aliqua desuper facienda declaratione.)
Nearly all theologians who treated the question after Cum ex Apostolatus (including St. Robert Bellarmine) taught that a heretical pope would lose his authority without any declaration.
still don't get it? You're no one to be deposing a Holy Father. Where is your authority? Are you another loon like David Hobson that claims he has OFFICIAL authority? If not, then you must have SOME viable reason as to be making such outrageous claims.
I do know what ipso facto means. That is our problem here. You are not understanding. YOU as well as any SEDE are NO ONE to declare that a Pope is a heretic and therefore no longer in office. Do you not understand? YOU ARE NO ONE. Your private little opinions don't matter at all. Your judgments on what is heresy and what is not is ludicrous. Until a Council deals on such matters then I'll continue to believe as I believe and ignore private opinions
Now you are sounding like a real imbecile, and a blind fool. The authority of the Church cannot give evil, because the Church is indefectible; but the V2 teachings and changes overthrow the teaching and tradition of the Church.
By only following points 1 and 2, you become a heretic or even a schismatic, because you "choose" not to follow the remaining 3 principles.
The principle and teaching that a Pope who becomes a heretic has always been held by the Church; even if it is not a dogma, you MUST believe and follow that teaching.
St. Francis de Sales, Doctor of the Church:
"Now when he [the Pope] is explicitly a heretic, he falls ipso facto from
I am sorry Sunsigil. You, as well as anyone else that puts themselves above the Church are really NO ONE to be making such private judgments. The fact is that no Dogmatic statement claims what you are saying. It's all fine and dandy what the Theologians say. Theological speculations do not make dogma. I am sorry that you are not aware of Theological factors
I wish. I have too many projects and debates on my slate. I've pushed the debut date for it to March 09. Some of the arguments are so bad that I didn't want to touch upon them but I have. I think it's actually an awful piece of work. There is much more educational Sedevacantist material out there. This book is shaping up to NOT be of that nature.
MHM1 "monastery" and their Feeneyite quasi-heretical opinions cannot be taken as normative or representative of "normal" sedevacantism, which is a theological opinion of practice, and pertains to canon law and the fact that a public heretic cannot hold office in the Roman Catholic Church. I am not sede, but sedevacantists are doctrinally Roman Catholics and do not WANT to separate from the Holy See and the Pope, they have problems with individual ones only.
This example is considered an extraordinary circumstance, not a norm. Poor comparison. Not to mention he was an acolyte, which as you know is part of a clergy. He was not a woman, like the Novus Ordo practices today in administering the "Eucharist"
Just a thought, but has anyone thought about this: the Vatican II council started on the year 1962. Now if you sum up those 4 numbers, you get the number 18.
SunSigil, if you knew anything about numerology or the like you would know that the number 18 is really 9. So the numbers '666' have nothing to do with the number 9.
Not only that, why should only the year 1962 be taken into consideration to determine its number? From where do get your thinking? You make no sense when it comes to numbers.
Sure thing, message my Youtube account we can set up the details, whether you're knowledgeable on computers or not, it's VERY simple. The debate topic is about the FORM of the Eucharist right?
It can mainly be found in the Catechism, which was considered and STILL is considered official by the Church. Anyhow, do you plan to get this debate done or not? I got no response. What's more, you usually take about 5-6 days to reply at times.
Not the phone, let's debate on the net. We will debate the Council of Trent on the form of the Eucharist. Since you seemingly think I'm wrong, I'll take you to task. Message me here, we can do a live recorded debate. I have requirements---no profanity and no being rude. Let's get this thing going.
I use the OFFICIAL Catechism of the Council of Trent, which never gets oudated due to the Council deliberations. The only formula needed is THIS IS MY BODY and THIS IS MY BLOOD. Simple as that..got an issue with that? Then argue and fight with the Council of Trent--your argument isn't against me, it's against the Catholic Church. As far as your imprimatur goes? You need to learn why imprimaturs are given out.
I just TOLD YOU, the OFFICIAL COT Council of TRENT, this is the OFFICIAL Catechism, the Catechism from 1923 is outdated and was never put into use by a SAINT of any sort. Get real! Talking about Latin? Let's talk about the formulation in GREEK! Which I deal with in this video series and the JOKE that the MHFM are. No wonder they have lost people once I made them look like fools--they're a joke with no grasp of theology at all.
Personally your opinion is useless when it goes against the Church of Christ. You should get in touch with the OFFICIAL Catechism of Trent so you can see that the ONLY FORMULA NEEDED TO EFFECTUATE the sacrament is THIS IS MY BODY and THIS IS MY BLOOD. Get in touch with a priest and learn your doctrine and allign yourself with Catholicism not with a branched off form of Protestantism
Ahhh yes, read the Catechism? Considering I have the original COTCT right here to my RIGHT side in the LATIN and English as well as GREEK sides where it references Scripture. But I need to read the Catechism eh? You need to get educated in the faith and stop believing what Protestant offshoots are shoving down your throat. GOD BLESS
An accusation of being Protestant?... From a novus ordo defender...OK, sure. May I also suggest reading some encyclicals from true Popes such as St. Pius X, Pacendi, which had already infallibly declared many of the false teachings of the Vatican II religion as heretical.
How about you RE-READ, I never accused you of being PROTESTANT. And Novus Ordo? I guess you should re-read. I have read all those encyclicals, get real and get educated. Instead of reading hilarious propaganda, actually learn the Biblical and Church languages---then come back and try to put up a fight, your punches at the air are funny.
Even the earliest of Fathers in the era of the General Councils declared that controverting a General Council was a CRIME (the very word used by St. Athanasius the Great).
Denying the authority of the Second Vatican Council is to reject the indefectibility of the Catholic church. Therefore, denying the dogmas which were taught by the First Vatican Council, is perfect grounds for a censure of heresy. That is really all that is needed to refute sedevacantism as a viable alternative.
The rotten fruits of Vatican 2 are there for all to see. Empty churches, homosexual priests, lack of vocations, Protestant masses, Hideous architecture (LA cathedral), ecumenism= everybody is saved, but the traditionals, women priests in the oven, and the worst is the doubt in the real presence. I go to the SSPX, which is not sedevacantis. Viva Cristo Rey!
First off, at 2:40, there is your first wrong. No, they do not say the Church is wrong. No, they do not say that the Gates of Hell have prevailed. And then what you continue to say is wrong. The pictures of the immoral priests are not to show the Novous Ordo fake, but to show the fruits of the Novous Ordo. Jesus says things are shown by their fruits, so the MHFM are showing the fruits of the Novous Ordo.
You're very incorrect, until you have actually spoken to the Dimond Bros please do not attempt to say what they actually mean. The images that are shown are to show the FRUITS and to show that the Novus Ordo is false. It's plain old stupidity. Their tactics are a joke.
GNR, I really liked your videos before, but I have to say right now I agree with the MHFM. And what you have said to creathavok is part of why. Jesus said to be humble. He even went as far as to say how you treat the lowest person you know of, the people that are lost, is how you treat him. Well, if that is true, based on how you treat the people that disagree with you, I would hate to see what Jesus had to say. Your a good person, but be nice. (more, in next cmmt)
I am sorry that you agree with a few low life hateful individuals that aren't even "brothers" of anything, but rather liars. I will pray for you and I am saddened that the infection of sedevacantism is spreading.
And since you are a self professed coward--I will no longer accept your comments here. Wanna get some respect? Stop hiding in the shadows with your radical views that people laugh at. Come forth and try and refute me. Give it your best shot. Although I am sure you'll shield yourself with the best defense "Uhh uhhhh heretic! I don't have to...heretic!"
Then get a life and stop making an idiot of yourself. Copy and paste must be fun. I've refuted every single ridiculous comment you've made already. If that's the best you can do---which it IS--I feel sorry for the sedes even more. Get the guts to refute my series, if you can't---then shun yourself in the corner like the coward and ignorant person you are. Study Theology--please
You're an idiot..I suggest you actually get an education before coming here and trying to pervert the Catholic faith...do me a favor. Instead of posting about 10 pages worth of garbage that EVERY SEDEVACANTIST ALWAYS posts--and that I've refuted about 5,000 times over...try refuting my series. No doubt you will come back repeating what EVERY sede says---yet none have the guts or ability to refute my series. GOOD LUCK
Abuses include "communion" in the hand? Girls in miniskirts, people laughing and shaking hands! We Catholics have been guarnteed our Mass of the ages. there is now way you will be able to defend Benidicts words (jews are "saved" without Jesus) you are too young to even know what has been lost. Pray the Rosary (not the Mercy chaplet) and ask Our Lady to help you.You need it.
I am too young to know what has been lost? Then refute my video if I am so ignorant. I suggest you get a formal education in theology. Learn the BIBLICAL languages, and don't come to this page touting your self righteous knowledge or I'll tear it apart--along with your ego. Refute my videos---give it your best shot. If you can't, then go hide in the corner with the rest of the Sedevacantists.
At about 2:45 you claim that SV's say "the true church no longer exists". You obviously have NOT studied the sedevacantist position or you would know that that is NOT what we say. The true church does and will always exist but the modernists have separated themselves from it through their heresies. And, because heretics are no longer members of the church, they can therefore not be the heads of it. Simple as that.
vatican2 you seriously have a LOT of time on your hands. Creating bogus accounts(the account was created today!) and then posting things in defense of yourself. Come on..seriously. If you refuse to attempt to refute my video series, then get lost.
Yes, I'm a masonic insider. Is it any wonder why I have erased your comments. I noted to you that I was out of town, therefore it's hard keeping up with you posting 10-20 comments with profanity each day. You're sick in the head. You're a kid who refused to attempt to refute me and instead posts profanity all day long since you have NO life. I don't have time, I am out of town ACTUALLY DEFENDING CATHOLICISM. Not sitting behind my computer posting profane things. Get a life kid
Jana, I am out of town at the moment. I apologize completely for not responding yet, I have had two debates in places well away from my hometown. Vatican2 has resorted to posting profanity all over my page, so I have erased many of his comments. Do not worry, upon my return home I will respond to you. GOD BLESS!
get a life kid, you spend nearly all day typing garbage out. I don't have the time to deal with your stupidity. Until you decide to REFUTE my series on the Novus Ordo, get another line of work
The Dimond Brothers also claim that the Orthodox are manifest heretics. I guess their arguments are AIR TIGHT eh? You're a pompous fool. It's a shame that 99.9% of Catholic apologists don't waste their energy on dealing with Sedevacantism--cause if they did, it would make you guys look a lot more foolish. Once more, instead of claiming I'm stupid, as you've been doing--how's about you try and refute my stuff first?
I have called and I have emailed the MHFM. But what I see from you and the other user posting here is pure stupidity and cowardice. You keep throwing your baseless arguments around repetitively. I have refuted all those arguments. I am done with you. Until you have the GUTS to actually refute my videos then bother posting. Til then..bye bye
Too bad the best you can do is repeat yourself over and over and over. You're a typical coward. If you have any guts or self-respect then ATTEMPT to refute my series. Give it your best shot. Til then, you're simply another fool repeating yourself over and over about how WRONG I am, without PROVING I am wrong
You're quite the ignorant person v2refuter. Not only have I SEEN and OWN their WHOLE DVD series, but I am working on a FULL refutation of their ENORMOUS book. It should be done by October. You are quite the fool. I will send you a free copy when I'm done tearing the MHFM apart once again
Ahh..my series is "lousy". Care to refute it? You infer that I am immature? I am not the one going around preaching conspiracy theories and claiming others are damned to hell since they don't believe as you. Unlike you--I believe YOU still have access to salvation. If you wish to debate Cantate Domino we can do so. If you think my series is lousy, then REFUTE it. That is what I have done to the Dimond Bros. series on the N.Ordo, do the same to mine..POINT BY POINT. Bring it on
No they won't, they haven't even bothered responding to this or the Siri theory that I dismantled. They simply reject responding to my comments. So great
Furthermore, everything you have posted is ALSO taken out of context. Seems to me like you also don't understand Cantate Domino or the Catholic Church's teaching on Invincible Ignorance or the CONTEXT on that document. How about you actually attempt to refute my SERIES instead of posting things that I've already dealt with many times over. If you can't, then get lost.
You would be wise to actually WATCH my series instead of posting what I dub the ILLOGICAL FALLACY quotes. I could care less what your quotes say or what these people say. These aren't INFALLIBLE DOGMATIC statements. As much as you like them, you fall into the category of the people I refute. Next time LISTEN to something before punching at the air. Battling a position you obviously don't even understand. Better luck next time.
Such a nice comment. All the Popes were heretics from the 11th century on? I guess that would make the Orthodox heretics true, since the two temporarily re-united in the 15th century. Before making ridiculous claims, be careful that you might slip and have your foot land in your mouth
I work for the Catholic Legate--a Catholic apologetics organization--I really feel sorry for you and people like you that believe that everything is a conspiracy theory. Get a life kid.
Long live the Traditional Latin Mass the and pope Benedict the XVI
AbptvQueensny 3 weeks ago
@gnrhead, you're a joke! I watched about the first 3 minutes of your first vid. That's all it took. Right when when you claimed that the sedevacantist arguments hold no weight and that they were illogical sealed it up for me. Ha ha hahahaa!!! Well really though. It was your constantly needing to read your pc screen even to make those claims in your opening. MEAT HEAD!!! Lol
oojudg3oo 3 months ago
Well, the Catholic Church has gone to Hell since Vatican II. Our Lady of Fatima warned about apostasy in the Church in high places. Walk into most Catholic parish churches today and you'll find a church with a Protestant-friendly Mass, altar girls, happy clappy rubrics, communion in hand, judical style vestments, a misplaced tabernacle and generally horrible and spartan church architecture. The Catholic Church has gone to hell. Let's be honest. Vatican II destroyed the Catholic Church.
MyBetty111 8 months ago
Novus Ordo or New Order, is part of the Judeo Masonic NEW WORLD ORDER..
How one cannot reconcile the 2, I do not know.
Vatican 2is apostacy, as is the NEW Mass.
Occultist Luther said Change the Mass, Change the Faith and thats exactly what occurred.
StSimonMartyr 8 months ago
@StSimonMartyr I think the Sedevacantist radicals that post refute themselves with their own posts. Instead of actually providing proof for arguments, Protestant sedes make false assumptions and toss out pejorative attacks. I suggest you study the Catholic faith before railing against it.
gnrhead 8 months ago
You accept Nostra Aetate...that Jews and NOT Practicing Catholics are Now God's Chosen People
This defies 1900 years of Church teaching and Christ's teaching.
The Canon of the Mass was also changed, Christ's own words were altered. It is invalid and illicit.
StSimonMartyr 8 months ago
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Catholicism is the Mass and the Sacraments. Masons destroyed the Mass in 1962, the required Sacramental Form was destroyed in 1944. Sorry, it's over. The Church is in a state of auto-demolition as Paul VI stated in 1968. Of course it looks legitimate, but that's how Lucifer wants it. If you want the ability to stand when the punishment comes, UNDERSTAND THE THIRD SECRET OF FATIMA.
The stunning evidence is on FATIMAMOVEMENT d o t c o m
Rome has until Aug. 17, 2011 when it will be destroyed
fatimamovement 9 months ago
We can only hope that God in his mercy that the Mass of Paul VI is valid. However, in Pius V papal bull Quo Primum - it was very clear the Mass was never to be changed as to not incur the wrath of almighty God and the holy apostles Peter and Paul. The promise of our Lord the gates of Hell shall not prevail meant there will be valid mass communities and faithful worshiping God in sacrifice with validly ordained priests. I do not believe our Lord guaranteed against anti-popes. As a lay Roman Cath
jpjacksify 11 months ago
WHY DON'T PEOPLE UNDERSTAND THAT YOU HAVE TO TALK IN THE MODE OF THE TIMES-IT DOESN'T MEAN YOU ARE EMBRACING THE ZEITGEIST! IF BENEDICT XVI WOULD SAY DOWN WITH LIBERALISM, DOWN WITH ISLAM, DOWN WITH PROTESTANTISM, THE VATICAN AND WITH IT ALL OF THE CHURCH COULD CLOSE IT'S GATES FOREVER! DOESN'T EVERYBODY SEE THAT?! Jeeese!
hgjtugjtu 1 year ago
@hgjtugjtu That may be true, but did not Christ say "I have not come to bring peace but the sword, to set father against son...".
It would be a great display of Faith and courage to stand against evil. It is the pope's duty to do so, and that all Christians will follow. It is time he uses his shepherds staff to drive back the wolves. I would rather a Church with 1,000,000 orthodox Catholics than with 1,000,000,000 heretical apostates. If the truth brings martyrdom than I graciously accept.
catholicpeter 1 year ago
What "traditionalists" or "sedevacantists" do not understand is that the Mass of Pope Paul VI was a more accurate return to the mass of the early church. Furthermore, the apostolic authority given to priests and bishops to consecrate the host cannot be removed. therefore it logically and theologically follows that the "New Mass" is valid. Just because priests now face the congregation and the form of the liturgy changed that was not theologically different, does not render the mass invalid.
Pilatocus28 1 year ago
@Pilatocus28 The ICEL translation of the Novus Ordo is blatantly erroneous, and the Tridentine Mass is exponentially more pious in its form then that of the NO. In regards to validity, my naivety says that the NO is still valid. I would need more research and convincing argument in order to sway my opinion otherwise.
catholicpeter 1 year ago
VATICAN II WAS NOT HERETICAL! IF YOU ACCEPT THE DOCTRINE OF PAPAL INFALLIBILITY FIRMLY ESTABLISHED AT VATICAN I, THEN YOU HAVE TO ACCEPT VATICAN II TO REMAIN TRULY CATHOLIC. PLUS, THE "NOVUS ORDO" IS PEJORATIVE TERM USED TO DESCRIBE THE NEW MASS, WHICH IS A MISNOMER. THE NEW MASS IS CALLED THE MASS OF PAUL VI.
Pilatocus28 1 year ago
@Pilatocus28 The council, which is actually just a continuation of Vatican I did not issue any canonical decrees or definitions. That said, various 'pastoral' teachings of the council are blasphemous and heretical to the core. The best summary of the council is that it took one thousand pages to say what could be said in one.
catholicpeter 1 year ago
great videos man
danthrplgst 1 year ago
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O YOU THAT SO EAGERLY CONDEM MY CHURCH, WILL SAY TO YOU CHRIST AT THE OUR OF JUDMENT: WHAT HAVE YOU DONE TO BE PERFECT, SHOW ME WHAT YOU HAVE DONE FOR MY CHURCH. Did you instead pass your whole time to critisize her. Fool! Don't you know that he who critisize is loosing time to work? Satan the accusator, good of nothing. CATHOLIC CHURCH IS IN VATICAN AND ALL WHO SAYS OTHERWISE ARE HERESY PROPAGANDER, worth of Luther
TheSpiritualShow 1 year ago
O YOU THAT SO EAGERLY CONDEM MY CHURCH, WILL SAY TO YOU CHRIST AT THE OUR OF JUDMENT: WHAT HAVE YOU DONE TO BE PERFECT, SHOW ME WHAT YOU HAVE DONE FOR MY CHURCH. Did you instead pass your whole time to critisize her. Fool! Don't you know that he who critisize is loosing time to work? Satan the accusator, good of nothing. CATHOLIC CHURCH IS IN VATICAN AND ALL WHO SAYS OTHERWISE ARE HERESY PROPAGANDER, worth of Luther
TheSpiritualShow 1 year ago
excellent!
thorough, clear, direct to the core.
georgethinksalot 1 year ago
@MegaLogic101
You should actually read my quote before you try to refute my position. I was accused of saying this by someone else - so I will give you the same reply I gave them 8months ago, which you seem to be quoting from:
" I would like you to quote from my comments where I said "those who die in the state of grace go directly to heaven" - I never said that."
If you think I did, provide the entire comment.
iotaunam1 1 year ago
I don't have time to deal with those that worship the Dimond Brothers. I have done numerous videos and even written a complete article detailing the cowardice of Peter Dimond and his dishonesty. I have also provided a reference for the work on Jerome. Don't accuse someone of lying if you have no idea what you're talking about.
gnrhead 1 year ago
Ok people does nobody know who our lady of La Salette is? She told us that Rome will lose the faith. And besides that the Popes all the way from Vatican 2 have changed the Church so much that it is not longer the same church as the Church Jesus founded. Take a look for your self on how the new vatican 2 popes are taking worship with other religions.
Daleman1992 2 years ago
Sedevacantism is much older than Vatican II, in fact Sedevacantism is definitely as old as 1204 AD and probably linked to 1054 AD.
From the moment Cardinal Humbert dropped the Papal Bull in the Hagia Sophia, the chair of Peter has been vacant.
Sedevacantism is nothing new - it is the position of the Orthodox Church.
DopoNotte 2 years ago
Actually sedevacantism is not the position of the orthodox church. The orthodox deny the Primacy of Peter, but the the sedevacantists do not deny the primacy of Peter, they deny the man on the chair of Peter is not a Catholic.
teely518402 2 years ago
JP II and your friend benedict openly worshiped in a jewish synagogue, recieved voodo blessings, JpII had a statue of Budda on the ALTER!!! and the list goes on, if this isn't participation, you tell me what would be...
nsolcis 2 years ago
how is a pope who participates in Voodoo ceremonies a true pope? that makes no sense at all, not even a child would fall for that one...
nsolcis 2 years ago
Because the Pope never PARTICIPATED in the false worship of these individuals. This is tantamount to saying that any Pope of the past that committed sins therefore lost his office of the Papacy. Not even a monkey would fall for that one.
gnrhead 2 years ago
@gnrhead A true pope should never waste any time to go study or even be near a voo doo ceremonie even if you say he "never participated in the false worship of these individuals" The fact of the matter is that you need to realize that a True pope should never ditch a day of being the head of the Catholic church to watch this. During this day he could have been doing many beneficial duties such as spreading Catholism and saving souls... NOT being near or watching false worship.
dalemandc 1 year ago
@gnrhead you should be gone from the scene of apologetics because you obviously can not discerne truth in fulness from conepts... v.2 is a false council! You make these videos it seems to glorify your yourself with your ignorant points of view in your so called scholarly format hahahha! and reading your computer screen trying to seem and look intelligant hahaha. what are you a free Mason??? Woe to your herecy!!!
8dodger7 1 year ago
@gnrhead you should be gone from the scene of apologetics because you obviously can not discerne truth in fulness from conepts... v.2 is a false council! You make these videos it seems to glorify your yourself with your ignorant points of view in your so called scholarly format hahahha! and reading your computer screen trying to seem and look intelligant hahaha. what are you a free Mason??? Woe to your heretical tongue !!!
8dodger7 1 year ago
@gnrhead you should be gone from the scene of apologetics because you obviously can not discerne truth in fulness from conepts... v.2 is a false council! You make these videos it seems to glorify your yourself with your ignorant points of view in your so called scholarly format hahahha! and reading your computer screen trying to seem and look intelligant hahaha. what are you a free Mason??? Woe to your heretical tongue !!! BROTHERS AND SISTERS DO NOT BE DECIEVED BY THIS HERETIC! GOD BLESS YOU
8dodger7 1 year ago
@gnrhead Instead of posting videos from the safety and comfort of your bedroom, why not challenge the Brothers of Most Holy Family Monastery to a debate. Allow it to be recorded, and posted so that you can prove everyone just how "logical" and "well researched" you really are on this subject? If you want to talk-the-talk, then I challenge you to walk-the-walk and debate the brothers and allow it to be recorded and posted. If you have done your research, you have nothing to fear.
alexphantom17 7 months ago
@beatleswine -
If you do not know his enemies, then it is you who clearly needs to research this more. You are anti-Catholic, anti-Truth, therefore no amount of testimonies to his sanctity will suffice for you. You are just arguing for the sake of it. You should spend more time learning, and less accusing and trying to refute that which you have no knowledge of.
iotaunam1 2 years ago
no, he got it from ONE book that is anti-Catholic. if he can't provide a source, he needs to be quiet. if you wish to defend his claim, YOU need to spend time getting the source for him...IF there is one. no Catholic is stupid enough to say the popes don't sin, we just ask for a source of this alleged weakness. when you have the source email it to me, i will not be continuing this...whatever you want to call it.
latinmasslover 2 years ago
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latinmasslover 2 years ago
perhaps you could provide us with first-hand knowledge of him?
latinmasslover 2 years ago
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latinmasslover 2 years ago
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latinmasslover 2 years ago
@beatleswine -
Your question is so ridiculous it does not even deserve a response, but I will say that It should be obvious that I didn't live with this Saint, what age do you think I am?
The cannonisation process probed deeply into his life and took statements from his friends and enemies, and those who lived with him. Even his mortal enemies testified to his eminently saintly life, and high moral standard.
iotaunam1 2 years ago
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latinmasslover 2 years ago
Peace of Christ!
Will you please provide a source for your accusations against Pope St. Pius X?
latinmasslover 2 years ago
Your not even Catholic.
I don't even read the Angelus magazine. I would like you to quote from my comments where I said "those who die in the state of grace go directly to heaven" - I never said that. Whatsmore, your opinion does not matter to me since it is obvious that you reject the entire Catholic Faith. You are a heretic.
iotaunam1 2 years ago
You are clearly a fool. You should know better that to believe everthing you read - especially on the internet. He was not an alcholic. That is a lie. Listen to the people who lived with him and knew him, not some protestant/modernist detractors.
Benedict XVI is a modenist - of course the saints die as saints! This is Catholic Dogma. If you die in a state of mortal sin you go straight to Hell. Do you reject this dogma also?
iotaunam1 2 years ago
Why do you make up lies against the Saints? You are obviously not Catholic. Pius the Xth was the last Pope to be made a Saint. He opposed every error in the Church his whole life. He certainly was not a drug user, nor an alcholic. Why you lie about this is beyond comprehension.
iotaunam1 2 years ago
damn all you mudshark nigger loving jew loving protestant loving mason loving devils, you will all celebrate your Vatican 2 Mass in hell you filty pigs
youallschallack 2 years ago
One thing I think is worth mentioning about the mass is that in the early church the Greek mass was very different than the Latin mass. They both held to different tradition while being in full communion. Both were valid.
JDZwiers19 2 years ago
Good Video series. I have exchanged blows with the MHFM in the past. Their hostility and irrationality match and exceed the more intense protestants on YouTube. It's quite sad. Some of their work refuting Protestantism is the best I have seen. But when they turn their attention towards the church it turns into conspiracy theories and smear tactics. Their arguments even mirror the protestant's sometimes. Sad.
JDZwiers19 2 years ago
How misleading can the devil be? Vatican II william teaches you from refuting any religion, where have you been??? Your religion teaches in case you weren't aware accepts all the faiths and that you shouldn't question this. Your not following your Vatican II religion your a heretic within your own faith.... How long have you been Catholic? If you were Catholic for any length of time you would know something evil has been going on with out reading anything. Stop saying your Catholic please
JamesFrancis1000 2 years ago 3
I'm young so I did not see pre-VII but as a Catholic I can tell that you are inaccurate. To be clear, faithful Catholics believe there is only one Church Christ founded. And there is only one Faith. VII did not teach us to accept all faiths. We are to love all people, despite what faith they hold. There is a huge difference. Please do not spread heresy and claim it to be Catholic teaching JamesFrancis.
quangjd 2 years ago
quangjd......Maybe you need to study the documents of Vatican II and read the writings of the anti-Popes since 1959..... or you could just watch the Dimond Brothers vids on the topic and they give most all the relevant quotes from Vatican II that show that what JamesFrancis1000 said IS accurate.
wjweigand 2 years ago
God bless you!! I have one problem with you. You like SF? I am a rams fan.LOL
EucharistismyGod 2 years ago
Great, very interesting and useful series. God bless you!
anila1970 2 years ago
At least here we now have a list of those "wannabe Catholics" (sedevacantists and other anti-Vatican 2 "Catholics").
BlackCappa 2 years ago
I go to an Episcopalian/Anglican church but I find this discussion interesting. I didn't know it wasn't simply aesthetics, but the belief that the sacraments were invalid. C.S. Lewis believed religion was the "good infection", an energetic understanding of grace as theosis, a change in a person towards holiness, with sacraments one possible means. However, I don't think most Catholics hold that view? It almost sounds like something binary, you either get grace, or you don't... correct?
Magnulus76 2 years ago
Quite untrue. For example, a person attending Mass that does not partake of the Supper can and does still receive graces by merely praying and hoping to one day partake of the Sacrifice of the Mass.
GOD BLESS
gnrhead 2 years ago 3
OK... so intentions are important.
God bless you too and may you have a happy Easter.
Magnulus76 2 years ago
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no grace is recieved at the novus ordo, it is a heretical and Godless travisty. To defend it and the V2 heresy not only shows your lack of understanding about the catholic faith but your lack of faith.
exiledfenian 2 years ago 8
you do make a good, comment, i well give you that. do the sinful Jews in Moses day, invalidate Judaism, etc.. you are right in that case. but, what are we to make of one of the Popes letting snake worshipers worship in the Vatican?
medievalman86 2 years ago 3
we know what to make of it, its right in front of our faces, what we must do now is decide on how to correct the problem. The thought that scares me the most is that, when you look at the fact that this has been going on for 40+ years, that will their be any clergy left, to truly administer to the faith. we must pray the rosary and ask for guidance, it is the holy spirit that guides us. We must let it.
exiledfenian 2 years ago 5
Great video. Thank you brother.
elcamaras 3 years ago
look at what vatican II has done. this heretical council created a new religion that is not catholic. to practice it is heretical. the novus ordo is heretical. the host is not concecrated at the novus ordo, what you are doing is worshiping a piece of bread. there is no salvation outside the church. there is only one God, one Church, one Faith. I am sorry if it is not pc but thats how it is. either you believe or you dont.
exiledfenian 3 years ago 11
Hey gnrhead, just answer me this: do you believe that there is salvation outside the Church?
And this: what do you think about ecumenism?
Nekrohol 3 years ago 6
gnrhead,
You have not attempted to answer my question re the Vatican II changes - See Below, posted 5 days ago. I hoped that someone would at least acknowledge my question. I don't set myself up as a sedvacanticist deliberately - I am willing to give the church every chance to prove the novus ordo mass & Vatican II changes correct. I am not here to argue matters that are beyond my understanding, as I am not a theologian.
I simply don't understand why the mass needed to be changed at all.
jim50505 3 years ago
jim, the reason they had to change from the True Mass to the Novus Ordo service was to appease protestants. The True Mass is loaded with references to Catholic Dogmas. The new mass eliminated most of that and watered down the rest with ambiguous language in order that it would be acceptable to both Catholics and Protestants. Just do a search of Lutheran or Anglican services. The are nearly identical to the Novus Ordo counterfiet mass.
wjweigand 3 years ago 6
You stated that sedevacantists believe the gates of hell have prevailed. Incorrect. The Church defines the gates of hell as the death dealing tongues of heretics. Sedevacantists believe the Church has not been overcome by them, but many people have embraced heresy and as a result have cut themselves off from the Mystical body of Christ.
How can you offer proper apologetics if you misrepresent the issues???
If you presented the issues as they are, you would see sedevacantists are right.
davecyco 3 years ago 4
I stand by my words. When I said that the Sedes believed such, it was my INTERPRETATION of their pathetic views on Theology and Church doctrine. Their theology is a joke. I have, as you can see through my videos dealing with this subject, misrepresented NO ONE. I always present my opponent's case FIRST then proceed to refute it to the best of my ability. GOD BLESS
gnrhead 3 years ago
Sir, what is a Catholic to understand by the second part of Matthew 16:18 "...and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it."?
davecyco 3 years ago
That the Church will never be overcome. That Jesus is not a liar and that we can trust in his Church. It is the reason I am a Catholic and not part of a Protestantised offshoot called Sedevacantism.
gnrhead 3 years ago
Not be overcome by what?
davecyco 3 years ago
A cursory reading of the verse tells us the GATES OF HELL will never overcome the Church. The Church that Christ established with a visible head shall last till the end of time. The Greek term for HADES or HELL here, whichever rendering you use shows us that it's pretty much in the context of ANYTHING that is in opposition to GOOD. None of that will, as the Greek word says "BE PREVAILING" over the Church that Christ has given us. GOD BLESS you
gnrhead 3 years ago
I agree. Additionally, the Second Council of Constantinople in A.D. 533 under Pope Vigilius defined "the gates of hell will not prevail against it (by these we understand the death-dealing tongues of heretics);"
davecyco 3 years ago
Further, Pope Paul IV in Cum Ex Apostolatus Officio declares "if ever at any time it shall appear that any Bishop...or even the Roman Pontiff, prior to his promotion or his elevation as Cardinal or Roman Pontiff, has deviated from the Catholic Faith or fallen into some heresy:
(i) the promotion or elevation, even if it shall have been uncontested and by the unanimous assent of all the Cardinals, shall be null, void and worthless;..."
davecyco 3 years ago
As well Pope Paul IV states "(vi) those thus promoted or elevated shall be deprived automatically, and without need for any further declaration, of all dignity, position, honour, title, authority, office and power."
Now it would certainly appear that John XXIII all the way up to Benedict XVI have fallen into or encouraged heresy.
This (among other reasons) is why the sedevacantist position is the right one, the Church has shown us over time by the Holy Ghost how to know an anti-pope
davecyco 3 years ago
Can you give me any good reason why the vatican II reforms should have ever taken place? In particular the changes to the mass.
jim50505 3 years ago
thanks for doing these videos. i wasn't even aware that Sedevacantism really existed until just like a week ago. i mean, i had heard rumors of people denouncing Vatican II but man, these people are out there!
alvarezga 3 years ago
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Armibus 3 years ago
LOL, I find it funny you are scared of the truth. Thanks showing me how tough you are by coming on my site and saying you've blocked me. I cried for days. LOL.
ddmiller4 3 years ago
Just wrote something the other day. Didn't show up on your not-so-informative site.
ddmiller4 3 years ago
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Armibus 3 years ago
..."the mere fact that you do not hail your own Popes is because it will just confirm that SSPX is a schismatic and heretic CULT."
This is true...To go against a pope and at the same time recognize him as the Vicar of Christ, would mean you've fallen into schism.
That is why the Sedevacantist position is the only logical position to follow. Obviously the last 5 popes have committed public heresy along with the entire hierarchy.
Thanks for pointing that out Armibus.
ddmiller4 3 years ago
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Armibus 3 years ago
And you as well as any Sedevacantist are NO ONE to claim, through your OWN private judgment, that the Pope IS a manifest heretic.
gnrhead 3 years ago
It's not a dogmatic claim. But the laymen have the right to follow the true Faith. If/When a true pope is elected, then he will judge the history of the last 45 years accordingly. Until then most sedevacantists have true sacraments with the proper matter form and intention for their spiritual nourishment.
ddmiller4 3 years ago
Hey, you fall into the typical mistake of the regular Novus Ordo catholic, who believes that he must only submit and obey to Dogmatic and Infallible proclamations and definitions of the Church, but unfortunately you are wrong.
SunSigil 3 years ago
I am not a "Novus Ordo Catholic" That's a ridiculous title. And to believe that one must only submit to Dogmatic teachings is also ridiculous. I follow the teaching of the Catholic Church as instituted by Christ. Nowhere in Church History did anyone come up with the theological novums that Sedes have conjured up. It's disgusting
gnrhead 3 years ago
Then what are you?
It certainly seems that way by the way you talk (that you must only follow dogmatic and infallible declarations)
Sedevacantism merely explains what happened with the last 5 popes, basing themselves in the Tradition and same teaching of the Church, they are not inventing anything, you are.
SunSigil 3 years ago
Novus Ordo was the new rite that was instituted a while back. It's not a NEW order anymore buddy. Buy a theological manual. I suggest amazon
gnrhead 3 years ago
Vatican I and Pius IX laid down these general principles by establishing all the following as the types of teaching that a Catholic must believe and adhere to:
SunSigil 3 years ago
1.Solemn pronouncements of the extraordinary Magisterium.
2.Teachings of the universal ordinary Magisterium.
3.Teachings of the universal ordinary Magisterium held by the universal and common consent of theologians to belong to the faith.
4.Doctrinal decisions of the Vatican congregations.
5.Theological truths and conclusions so certain that opposition to them merits some theological censure short of heresy.
So you see, you MUST follow and accept ALL of the above, not just dogmas.
SunSigil 3 years ago
You're right. Funny that among all the teachings of the Church..NONE Of them give private individuals the right to depose a Pope from Office based on their fallible opinions on the Pope being a formal heretic. It's ridiculous
gnrhead 3 years ago
Again, you fail to realize that the Pope is deposed by DIVINE LAW, God Himself deposes him, and there is no need for a general council or trial
SunSigil 3 years ago
And who are YOU to claim that GOD has deposed any POPE? In the past Councils convened to make such matters clear to the faithful. What council are you in charge of sir, that has made such a decision? Who are you and all the Sedevacantists? You are simply people INTERPRETING things to your own liking, in a LOUSY fashion as well. The majority of Sedes cannot read Latin, Greek or any of the Biblical or Church languages for that matter!
gnrhead 3 years ago
You are making no sense at all with this silly claim. The Papal Bull i told you about dates back as far as 1559. It IS clear and has been explained by many Saints and countless theologians, but you mindlessly say: "In the past Councils convened to make such matters clear to the faithful. What council are you in charge of sir, that has made such a decision?"
Are you ok man? you make no sense.
SunSigil 3 years ago
Actually the one that makes no sense here is YOU. You are claiming that certain Popes are heretics based on the fallible opinions of fallible men. Get real
gnrhead 3 years ago
No. We simply compare their teachings with the Tradition and ever-same teaching of the Catholic Church, and it contradicts it.
SunSigil 3 years ago
Hah, among all the teachings of the Church eh? then what about this:In Cum ex Apostolatus Officio (1559), Paul IV decreed that no declaration was necessary for a heretical pope to lose his office; it would occur automatically. (See para. 6: eo ipso, absque aliqua desuper facienda declaratione.)
Nearly all theologians who treated the question after Cum ex Apostolatus (including St. Robert Bellarmine) taught that a heretical pope would lose his authority without any declaration.
SunSigil 3 years ago
still don't get it? You're no one to be deposing a Holy Father. Where is your authority? Are you another loon like David Hobson that claims he has OFFICIAL authority? If not, then you must have SOME viable reason as to be making such outrageous claims.
gnrhead 3 years ago
LOL, do YOU still "don't get it"? A pope who becomes a heretic loses his office ipso facto WITHOUT ANY declaration, do you know what ipso facto means?
I don't depose him, God does, because by falling into Manifest heresy, he's out.
You confuse Heresy with any other sin, but heresy isn't like any other sin; it goes against the Faith, and that is intolerable.
SunSigil 3 years ago
I do know what ipso facto means. That is our problem here. You are not understanding. YOU as well as any SEDE are NO ONE to declare that a Pope is a heretic and therefore no longer in office. Do you not understand? YOU ARE NO ONE. Your private little opinions don't matter at all. Your judgments on what is heresy and what is not is ludicrous. Until a Council deals on such matters then I'll continue to believe as I believe and ignore private opinions
gnrhead 3 years ago
Now you are sounding like a real imbecile, and a blind fool. The authority of the Church cannot give evil, because the Church is indefectible; but the V2 teachings and changes overthrow the teaching and tradition of the Church.
SunSigil 3 years ago
By only following points 1 and 2, you become a heretic or even a schismatic, because you "choose" not to follow the remaining 3 principles.
The principle and teaching that a Pope who becomes a heretic has always been held by the Church; even if it is not a dogma, you MUST believe and follow that teaching.
St. Francis de Sales, Doctor of the Church:
"Now when he [the Pope] is explicitly a heretic, he falls ipso facto from
his dignity and out of the Church..."
SunSigil 3 years ago
I am sorry Sunsigil. You, as well as anyone else that puts themselves above the Church are really NO ONE to be making such private judgments. The fact is that no Dogmatic statement claims what you are saying. It's all fine and dandy what the Theologians say. Theological speculations do not make dogma. I am sorry that you are not aware of Theological factors
gnrhead 3 years ago
I wish. I have too many projects and debates on my slate. I've pushed the debut date for it to March 09. Some of the arguments are so bad that I didn't want to touch upon them but I have. I think it's actually an awful piece of work. There is much more educational Sedevacantist material out there. This book is shaping up to NOT be of that nature.
gnrhead 3 years ago
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Armibus 3 years ago
MHM1 "monastery" and their Feeneyite quasi-heretical opinions cannot be taken as normative or representative of "normal" sedevacantism, which is a theological opinion of practice, and pertains to canon law and the fact that a public heretic cannot hold office in the Roman Catholic Church. I am not sede, but sedevacantists are doctrinally Roman Catholics and do not WANT to separate from the Holy See and the Pope, they have problems with individual ones only.
IustitiaPax 3 years ago
Wonderful! It's about time someone took sedevacantism on.
Side note, apparently SaintfromPadua is one too O__O
knghtcmdr 3 years ago
We need a new Swift to do justice to this lunacy.
Jgrant3919 3 years ago
This example is considered an extraordinary circumstance, not a norm. Poor comparison. Not to mention he was an acolyte, which as you know is part of a clergy. He was not a woman, like the Novus Ordo practices today in administering the "Eucharist"
ddmiller4 3 years ago
Sedevacantism has happened throughout the history of Catholicism.
ddmiller4 3 years ago 2
Just a thought, but has anyone thought about this: the Vatican II council started on the year 1962. Now if you sum up those 4 numbers, you get the number 18.
Now, 6+6+6=18!
Coincidence? I think not!
SunSigil 3 years ago
SunSigil, if you knew anything about numerology or the like you would know that the number 18 is really 9. So the numbers '666' have nothing to do with the number 9.
Not only that, why should only the year 1962 be taken into consideration to determine its number? From where do get your thinking? You make no sense when it comes to numbers.
1Hope4All 3 years ago
it was just a joke that happens to end in 666.
SunSigil 3 years ago
Comment removed
Armibus 3 years ago
lol, i was just making a joke, but you're such a square that you think i believ in "numerology". haha!
SunSigil 3 years ago
Comment removed
Armibus 3 years ago
hey, take a hike moron. No one cares what you say.
SunSigil 3 years ago
What video series is it we're supposed to watch first? Is it "The amazing Heresies Of Paul VI"?
162ALAN162 3 years ago
Oops no. I've found it now: "Why The New Mass And New Rite Of Ordination Are Invalid", I just noticed that also has five parts.
162ALAN162 3 years ago
Sure thing, message my Youtube account we can set up the details, whether you're knowledgeable on computers or not, it's VERY simple. The debate topic is about the FORM of the Eucharist right?
gnrhead 3 years ago
It can mainly be found in the Catechism, which was considered and STILL is considered official by the Church. Anyhow, do you plan to get this debate done or not? I got no response. What's more, you usually take about 5-6 days to reply at times.
gnrhead 3 years ago
This truly IS the essential issue ! ... where Peter is there is the Church !
bigchickenfu 3 years ago
Except in a time when the See is Vacant.
ddmiller4 3 years ago
Not the phone, let's debate on the net. We will debate the Council of Trent on the form of the Eucharist. Since you seemingly think I'm wrong, I'll take you to task. Message me here, we can do a live recorded debate. I have requirements---no profanity and no being rude. Let's get this thing going.
gnrhead 3 years ago
I use the OFFICIAL Catechism of the Council of Trent, which never gets oudated due to the Council deliberations. The only formula needed is THIS IS MY BODY and THIS IS MY BLOOD. Simple as that..got an issue with that? Then argue and fight with the Council of Trent--your argument isn't against me, it's against the Catholic Church. As far as your imprimatur goes? You need to learn why imprimaturs are given out.
gnrhead 3 years ago
I just TOLD YOU, the OFFICIAL COT Council of TRENT, this is the OFFICIAL Catechism, the Catechism from 1923 is outdated and was never put into use by a SAINT of any sort. Get real! Talking about Latin? Let's talk about the formulation in GREEK! Which I deal with in this video series and the JOKE that the MHFM are. No wonder they have lost people once I made them look like fools--they're a joke with no grasp of theology at all.
gnrhead 3 years ago
Personally your opinion is useless when it goes against the Church of Christ. You should get in touch with the OFFICIAL Catechism of Trent so you can see that the ONLY FORMULA NEEDED TO EFFECTUATE the sacrament is THIS IS MY BODY and THIS IS MY BLOOD. Get in touch with a priest and learn your doctrine and allign yourself with Catholicism not with a branched off form of Protestantism
gnrhead 3 years ago
RCCatholic is correct... grnhead you need to read what the Roman Catechism says.
wjweigand 3 years ago
Ahhh yes, read the Catechism? Considering I have the original COTCT right here to my RIGHT side in the LATIN and English as well as GREEK sides where it references Scripture. But I need to read the Catechism eh? You need to get educated in the faith and stop believing what Protestant offshoots are shoving down your throat. GOD BLESS
gnrhead 3 years ago
An accusation of being Protestant?... From a novus ordo defender...OK, sure. May I also suggest reading some encyclicals from true Popes such as St. Pius X, Pacendi, which had already infallibly declared many of the false teachings of the Vatican II religion as heretical.
wjweigand 3 years ago
How about you RE-READ, I never accused you of being PROTESTANT. And Novus Ordo? I guess you should re-read. I have read all those encyclicals, get real and get educated. Instead of reading hilarious propaganda, actually learn the Biblical and Church languages---then come back and try to put up a fight, your punches at the air are funny.
gnrhead 3 years ago
Even the earliest of Fathers in the era of the General Councils declared that controverting a General Council was a CRIME (the very word used by St. Athanasius the Great).
Denying the authority of the Second Vatican Council is to reject the indefectibility of the Catholic church. Therefore, denying the dogmas which were taught by the First Vatican Council, is perfect grounds for a censure of heresy. That is really all that is needed to refute sedevacantism as a viable alternative.
rguerrah 3 years ago
The rotten fruits of Vatican 2 are there for all to see. Empty churches, homosexual priests, lack of vocations, Protestant masses, Hideous architecture (LA cathedral), ecumenism= everybody is saved, but the traditionals, women priests in the oven, and the worst is the doubt in the real presence. I go to the SSPX, which is not sedevacantis. Viva Cristo Rey!
xipe02 3 years ago 4
Come on, let's get reasonable here, ther eis NO BULL or statement that even HINTS that Vatican II and the laity are excommunicated. This is a joke!
gnrhead 3 years ago
First off, at 2:40, there is your first wrong. No, they do not say the Church is wrong. No, they do not say that the Gates of Hell have prevailed. And then what you continue to say is wrong. The pictures of the immoral priests are not to show the Novous Ordo fake, but to show the fruits of the Novous Ordo. Jesus says things are shown by their fruits, so the MHFM are showing the fruits of the Novous Ordo.
Well, to the next video!
cet1217 3 years ago 2
You're very incorrect, until you have actually spoken to the Dimond Bros please do not attempt to say what they actually mean. The images that are shown are to show the FRUITS and to show that the Novus Ordo is false. It's plain old stupidity. Their tactics are a joke.
gnrhead 3 years ago
GNR, I really liked your videos before, but I have to say right now I agree with the MHFM. And what you have said to creathavok is part of why. Jesus said to be humble. He even went as far as to say how you treat the lowest person you know of, the people that are lost, is how you treat him. Well, if that is true, based on how you treat the people that disagree with you, I would hate to see what Jesus had to say. Your a good person, but be nice. (more, in next cmmt)
cet1217 3 years ago 2
I am sorry that you agree with a few low life hateful individuals that aren't even "brothers" of anything, but rather liars. I will pray for you and I am saddened that the infection of sedevacantism is spreading.
gnrhead 3 years ago
And since you are a self professed coward--I will no longer accept your comments here. Wanna get some respect? Stop hiding in the shadows with your radical views that people laugh at. Come forth and try and refute me. Give it your best shot. Although I am sure you'll shield yourself with the best defense "Uhh uhhhh heretic! I don't have to...heretic!"
Yes yes...run and hide. Best tactic. Good night.
gnrhead 3 years ago
Then get a life and stop making an idiot of yourself. Copy and paste must be fun. I've refuted every single ridiculous comment you've made already. If that's the best you can do---which it IS--I feel sorry for the sedes even more. Get the guts to refute my series, if you can't---then shun yourself in the corner like the coward and ignorant person you are. Study Theology--please
gnrhead 3 years ago
You're an idiot..I suggest you actually get an education before coming here and trying to pervert the Catholic faith...do me a favor. Instead of posting about 10 pages worth of garbage that EVERY SEDEVACANTIST ALWAYS posts--and that I've refuted about 5,000 times over...try refuting my series. No doubt you will come back repeating what EVERY sede says---yet none have the guts or ability to refute my series. GOOD LUCK
gnrhead 3 years ago
Abuses include "communion" in the hand? Girls in miniskirts, people laughing and shaking hands! We Catholics have been guarnteed our Mass of the ages. there is now way you will be able to defend Benidicts words (jews are "saved" without Jesus) you are too young to even know what has been lost. Pray the Rosary (not the Mercy chaplet) and ask Our Lady to help you.You need it.
SAYYOURROSARY 3 years ago
I am too young to know what has been lost? Then refute my video if I am so ignorant. I suggest you get a formal education in theology. Learn the BIBLICAL languages, and don't come to this page touting your self righteous knowledge or I'll tear it apart--along with your ego. Refute my videos---give it your best shot. If you can't, then go hide in the corner with the rest of the Sedevacantists.
gnrhead 3 years ago
At about 2:45 you claim that SV's say "the true church no longer exists". You obviously have NOT studied the sedevacantist position or you would know that that is NOT what we say. The true church does and will always exist but the modernists have separated themselves from it through their heresies. And, because heretics are no longer members of the church, they can therefore not be the heads of it. Simple as that.
wjweigand 3 years ago
vatican2 you seriously have a LOT of time on your hands. Creating bogus accounts(the account was created today!) and then posting things in defense of yourself. Come on..seriously. If you refuse to attempt to refute my video series, then get lost.
gnrhead 3 years ago
V2, are you tired of making new accounts? Get a life kid..seriously. Stop posting stupidities or I will simply report you. This is getting old.
gnrhead 3 years ago
hahahahhaha
Yes, I'm a masonic insider. Is it any wonder why I have erased your comments. I noted to you that I was out of town, therefore it's hard keeping up with you posting 10-20 comments with profanity each day. You're sick in the head. You're a kid who refused to attempt to refute me and instead posts profanity all day long since you have NO life. I don't have time, I am out of town ACTUALLY DEFENDING CATHOLICISM. Not sitting behind my computer posting profane things. Get a life kid
gnrhead 3 years ago
Jana, I am out of town at the moment. I apologize completely for not responding yet, I have had two debates in places well away from my hometown. Vatican2 has resorted to posting profanity all over my page, so I have erased many of his comments. Do not worry, upon my return home I will respond to you. GOD BLESS!
gnrhead 3 years ago
get a life kid, you spend nearly all day typing garbage out. I don't have the time to deal with your stupidity. Until you decide to REFUTE my series on the Novus Ordo, get another line of work
gnrhead 3 years ago
One other thing, most sedevacantists (mhfm included) recognize the other traditional liturgies, not just the Roman Rite (Byzantine, etc.)
47split 3 years ago
Are you familiar with Pope St. Pies V "De Defectibus" and Pope Paul IV's Cum ex Apostalus Officio?
47split 3 years ago
The Dimond Brothers also claim that the Orthodox are manifest heretics. I guess their arguments are AIR TIGHT eh? You're a pompous fool. It's a shame that 99.9% of Catholic apologists don't waste their energy on dealing with Sedevacantism--cause if they did, it would make you guys look a lot more foolish. Once more, instead of claiming I'm stupid, as you've been doing--how's about you try and refute my stuff first?
gnrhead 3 years ago
I have called and I have emailed the MHFM. But what I see from you and the other user posting here is pure stupidity and cowardice. You keep throwing your baseless arguments around repetitively. I have refuted all those arguments. I am done with you. Until you have the GUTS to actually refute my videos then bother posting. Til then..bye bye
gnrhead 3 years ago
Too bad the best you can do is repeat yourself over and over and over. You're a typical coward. If you have any guts or self-respect then ATTEMPT to refute my series. Give it your best shot. Til then, you're simply another fool repeating yourself over and over about how WRONG I am, without PROVING I am wrong
gnrhead 3 years ago
Ahhh yes, and there are green men working at the local BANK and 911 was ALL a conspiracy coverup.
Wowsers
gnrhead 3 years ago
You're quite the ignorant person v2refuter. Not only have I SEEN and OWN their WHOLE DVD series, but I am working on a FULL refutation of their ENORMOUS book. It should be done by October. You are quite the fool. I will send you a free copy when I'm done tearing the MHFM apart once again
gnrhead 3 years ago
Ahh..my series is "lousy". Care to refute it? You infer that I am immature? I am not the one going around preaching conspiracy theories and claiming others are damned to hell since they don't believe as you. Unlike you--I believe YOU still have access to salvation. If you wish to debate Cantate Domino we can do so. If you think my series is lousy, then REFUTE it. That is what I have done to the Dimond Bros. series on the N.Ordo, do the same to mine..POINT BY POINT. Bring it on
gnrhead 3 years ago
How did this change Catholic teaching? Guess you can't answer that
gnrhead 3 years ago
Sorry, I'm not a conspiracy theory nutcase like you. Even if such WAS the case, how does this refute Vatican 2? Stick to the issues!
gnrhead 3 years ago
No they won't, they haven't even bothered responding to this or the Siri theory that I dismantled. They simply reject responding to my comments. So great
gnrhead 3 years ago
It WAS originally accepted, you are COMPLETELY incorrect. Instead of running your mouth, would you care to debate the issues?
gnrhead 3 years ago
Furthermore, everything you have posted is ALSO taken out of context. Seems to me like you also don't understand Cantate Domino or the Catholic Church's teaching on Invincible Ignorance or the CONTEXT on that document. How about you actually attempt to refute my SERIES instead of posting things that I've already dealt with many times over. If you can't, then get lost.
gnrhead 3 years ago
You would be wise to actually WATCH my series instead of posting what I dub the ILLOGICAL FALLACY quotes. I could care less what your quotes say or what these people say. These aren't INFALLIBLE DOGMATIC statements. As much as you like them, you fall into the category of the people I refute. Next time LISTEN to something before punching at the air. Battling a position you obviously don't even understand. Better luck next time.
gnrhead 3 years ago
Such a nice comment. All the Popes were heretics from the 11th century on? I guess that would make the Orthodox heretics true, since the two temporarily re-united in the 15th century. Before making ridiculous claims, be careful that you might slip and have your foot land in your mouth
gnrhead 3 years ago
On what organization are you into?
What kind of Secret organization?
Let me know so that i may clarufy my mistakes.
coz i think yall are misleading people and making them believe something that is masonically pleasing....
Chriozian 3 years ago
Hahahahaha
I work for the Catholic Legate--a Catholic apologetics organization--I really feel sorry for you and people like you that believe that everything is a conspiracy theory. Get a life kid.
gnrhead 3 years ago
Ok GnrStupidhead Let me Just say that Your Realy FAKE AGAIN!
I Made a point That John Paul 2 Kissed the KORAN and you dont want to Accept it.
And About My say about the ECUMENISM? Does that not make any sense to You?
OH! why would I even ask you! YOUR A FAKE!
Oh I also made a Point when I wrote the "No Gossiping about other gods" in the Bible.
So, do I make myself Clear Or your Just REALY SOME typical STUPID WHITE BOY?!
And Please Get Yourselves Exorcised Blind WHITES!
Chriozian 3 years ago