@fuckspicx ae you on crack? Cortez brought disease, raped innocents, killed and shot a lot of them, and destroyed the biggest city on water in the world, why the fuck do you support that? god, i hope your kidding
There's nothing wrong with being Iberian and Mesoamerican, Iberians also have a proud history. Yes, they have been known to murder ethnic groups in the past (Jews, Romas, Granadians (Muslims), and Mesoamericans) it's worth learning who you are, even if you don't like what you find out. And having traveled through Mexico, I can tell you that a lot of Mexicans have pale skin, red hair, blue eyes, and other European traits so, they aren't 100% Native American, as much as you might like them to be.
@I1HateTheInternet wtf? mexicans dont have any of those traits!!!! you seriously have some problems, mexicans have brown or black hair, some are pale, but mostly tan, and have brown or light brown eyes. gets your facts right! im sorry, your mistaking them for french people so before you blabber out things, make sure they are correct
It is. I was forced to do two or three reports on ancient African civilizations, - and not Carthaginians, Phoenicians, or even Egyptians mind you - because apparently they weren't African enough? So yeah, in inner city schools they do cater to African Americans. By the way, your comment about Mexicans being *only* Mesoamerican sounds like something straight from the mouths of Aztlan...or some conflicted feelings about your European history.
If you are from Mexico, though, I think it's important for you to learn about Aztec, Mayan, and Iberian history, as it is your ancestoral history, as well as world history. It's a shame and I do feel bad for you. However, I made my comments in relation to what is taught here in the United States. We have our roots ultimately in Greek and Roman culture yet I it seems that our ancestors are downplayed. That's my issue here, I don't feel that Mesoamerican history isn't worth learning.
Truely? We have this shit shoved down our throats in the States because everything - even history - has to be politically correct by catering to people of African and Native American decent. In all of my schooling I didn't hear a single thing about the Sumerians, Hittites, Greeks, Romans, Macedonians, Persians, Minoans, or the Phoenicians, the true pioneers of modern day society. My point is that in this country, history is being rewritten and it angers me.
Plus all the crappy little PBS/History Channel specials on them that basically reitterate the exact same thing over and over, because there isn't much to talk about when it comes to Native Americans (most of them didn't even have a written language). So yeah.
It's funny how people spam the poor comment button for every comment I make, just because I disagree that, in a historical context, that ancient Native American people do not deserve the sort of attention that some of the more advanced ancient cultures deserve. Just goes to show you that people have beeen force fed what is considered politically correct, and anything outside of that is "pathetic", or insensitive, or appalling. Grow up people.
I wrote the previous comments out of irritation, not bigotry. I have no issues with the present day descendants of Aztecs, Mayans, Northern Native Americans, or Incans. My issue is with the medias attempt to portray these people as a hyper advanced, peacepipe-smoking people who were minding their own business until the evil white men came with their evil black powder and killed them. I also feel that air-time would be better suited to civilizations who have actually influenced our present.
I mean at least half of the 8.84 million people that live in Mexico City alone care right? Their ancestors matter to them like yours do to you.
And while you might not find the engineering feats the Aztecs impressive (which I believe is your real point) you must admit, the back story we have of their civilization is at least entertaining, hence were watching a T.V. show.
As far as the bigotry comment, I dont know maybe it was heavy handed, but you sound a wee bit...well...
I wonder what the world would be like if Spain did not conquer the Aztecs. What if the Aztecs defeated spain? Would we still speak spanish? I always like playing the what if game in history. Dont you?
hmm... I didn't post this, so I suspect this is the work of my friend who unwittingly forgot to log out of my account before posting. So, sorry about that. I'd put in my opinion, but this argument is such an unbelievable waste of time I won't even bother.
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Aztecs shouldn't be mentioned in the same breath as the Greek, Roman, Byzantine, or Han Empires, let alone share a History Channel special with them. I'm tired of the politically correctness that teaching or presenting history has to display. Let's just come out and say it. The Greeks had a steam engine by the time these people learned how to build with stone. The Spaniards thought the natives were demons due to the fact that they had barely developed the notion of clothing. They were pathetic.
Dude are you joking? Native American cultures had to basically invent every technology they used. Do you know how hard that is? The Romans had some technology handed to them (although they still invented a lot), the Byzantines as well, and by the time the Spaniards had arrived they had technology from thousands of years and from many different cultures. To say that mesoamerican cultures are any less brilliant than the Greeks, Romans, or countless other societies is ridiculous.
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That's laughable at best.
There were plenty of other tribes to steal/copy technology from. The problem is that none of them made certain key advances.
To say that Old World cultures had an advantage over New World cultures is ludicrous, considering that Old World cultures started with nothing, as well.
Many isolated civilizations, such as the Harrappans, the Hans, and the Japanese, made considerable technological advances without outside help or motivation.
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While I commend American civilization for their work in astrology, time keeping, and architecture, none of those things managed to influence overall human history. And none of those things managed to save them from annihilation by Europeans.
Let me emphasize this point. NONE of the American cultures developed any advanced metallurgic techniques. When the Spaniards arrived, Old World cultures had been procuring advanced techniques in metalworking for over 4000 years.
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Basically, Old World cultures were using gunpowder. They were also making social progress, and were thinking of some of the ideas that are the framework for our government today.
New World cultures were still Neolithic, were using stone tools and weapons, and barely had the technology to make seafaring vessels. They were cavemen.
There's no excuse for that, it's pathetic. I'm tired of hearing the politically correct version of history, these people should be little less than a footnote.
1hatetheinternet you got it wrong, the aztecs were not cavemen they were the most sanitary empire they were so wealthy thier weapons were made of obsidian they cut and carved precious stones crystals and jeweles into shapes a laser today cant macth they had the best grasp of the universe precisely predicting universal movements 1000s of yrs ahead they were the best mathematicians today most scientest highly acnolegde thier intelligence of the stars and cosmos thier measurments of space and time
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Yes I acknowledged their advanced measurements of space and time. But again, many Neolithic cultures had advanced timekeeping measurements. In Neolithic cultures the precise keeping of time seems to be a tremendous issue and a common theme, as there are entire sites dedicated to time keeping for farmers/religious rites, such Stonehedge, or the site recently discovered at Goseck, or many of the American Pyramids, etc. I doubt Americans were the only ancient culture with this knowledge/precision.
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Besides, I would acknowledge the Greeks for their astronomy over the Aztecs. They even discovered the Chandler Wobble 3000+ years before modern society did, along with finding the circumference of the Earth and the distance to the sun. Of course, their part in astrological history is downplayed by the Aztec/Mayan/Incan role in it because the History Channel et al have to find some way to compliment it, right? Don't want to offend Native Americans in our telling of history, I guess?
the warriors dress wasn't show or to put people in fear. It was strong skinns of Ocelotl that a blade couldn't pentrate it. and 100,000 warrior didn't take on the spaniards and its 10,000 tlaxcala back up.
I enjoyed the program all 5 parts. I learned a lot about the Aztecs concerning their architecture and building techniques they were quite innovative and truly master builders.
Actually it makes sense when speaking from a Ecological aspect. The places were the Ecology was favorable for High Civilization to be "stimulated" were parts such as: Fertile cresent, Indush Kush, Meso-American region, etc. All of which led to Grain, Corn, Rice, being cultuivated which would lead to a more complex civilization to arise. Of course for the Old World (Beast of burden) was an added bonus, not only fro agriculture but millitarily aswell. Even biological warfare(smallpox) from the cow
wow.I am spaniard,i mean.a white european spaniard and Hernan Cortes looks like an indian,hahahaha.you are so silly yankees,don´t know we are white.hahahah.
you mean hes half spanish half indian idiot he cant be mexican, mexicans are the indians stupid am french and aztec myself i look more white but still have the aztec blood but i have green eyes
Maybe when they saw it was a ship, or it was explained to them by translaters they created a name. Anthropology and archeology has old evidence but they need to visciously interpolate and read between the lines to come up with a story like this one. I hope I could help, sorry if i;m tellingu stuff u already know. These engineering empires series are sweet.
For aztecs not to know how to describe a boat tho, they had never seen one before. An enourmous elaborate vessel that appeared as a mountain. Scouts didn't come back to the ruler and say there are ships with men and horses. They saw mountain-like shapes. That's what they described. They used canoes and platforms with sticks that they probably had 50 names for including slang.
They were closer in proximity to ancient civilizations as well where they might have learned about different theories. But then religion and catholic church censorship was a huge factor in its hindering of development.
But these are people that still believed in gods and had never seen horses before. Logical reasoning at a tribal level was basic and simple. The sun will not rise unless blood is offered. Rain too. In Europe they believed that infection was evil spirits, fever was a result of being hot blooded. That was in the 16th century!
Not true. As a Mexica(Aztec) myself, I can tell you we did not believe in gods. The sun, rain, wind are all manifestations of our one single god, Ometeotl, who is basically our universe, our creator. Sacrificing so the sun can rise is the stupidest thing i have ever heard. We knew the earth revolved around the sun for thousands of years and we never sacrificed millions of people.
You'll see a number of my posts throughout this documentary, but if there were no Aztec gods, why all the decoration and figures of "gods"? What was the actual purpose of the temples to Tlaloc and Huitzilopochtli on top of the Great Pyramid in the center of Tenochtitlan?
These "gods" are manifestations of nature. The god of rain, sun, war are not gods in human form like the ones in christianity. They are natural and real events that we drew pictures to give meaning. Think of it this way, when it rains we would dance, not to honor the rain because you think its a god, but to thank it for its energy and in return we give some of our energy to it and we drew a symbol for it.
I happen to watch the History Channel all the time, but I'd not gotten a chance to see this episode before. I have read much on the Aztec Mexica Empire, so I'm interested to see you're alternative opinion, though I must admit skepticism at the moment. I'll PM you when I get the chance.
Think about it, ancient Mexica had the biggest population in the world of its time, they knew when seasons, eclipses, and alignments of planets and stars will happen. They mastered the art of agriculture and architecture. Do you think they were stupid enough to believe the sun needed blood ?? It's common sense here. Because there historians have PHds that makes them 100% accurate ?? all they do is make guesses, they never lived it.
With Computers, Airplanes, Electricity, Phones and Cable TV, People STILL believe a Man walked on water and died, only to rise from the grave. OF COURSE the Aztecs were that superstitious. The Brilliant Egyptians thought there was an After Life, the Greeks and Romans believed in Curses. Why build a pyramid when you KNOW the sun will rise? No one ever said religions were logical.
This is right, razon real was a justify for invaders, their pope and their king,did say this, destroy all sites swith human sacrifice, but there wern`t,
Spaniards think then that, because they were teached that.
So sacrifices, were only punish.
Discovery try to justify a mith and lie, but it is not right
And the temples are more symbolic than making them for a god. The temples were built to acknowledge not only our past but it was a place for study and connecting ourselves with nature.
Through the uses of the most powerful mind expanders in the world: mushrooms, peyote, LSA, DMT, ect. No civilization in the world has such powerful mind expanders as Mesoamerica (the most powerful mind expanders in the Old World was cannabis, and this was mainly in the Eastern countries like Persia, India, and China.......and ergoth in Europe.
That's a very steep over-generalization. Because most psychedelics are not neuro-toxic. If by drugs you mean such life and substances then even coffee is closer to that than the psychedelics.
Thats all are just weasel words of drug addicted people and goofy drug professors. First they argument of how healthy and mind expanding drugs are and a few years later you see them all without teeth, standing on the train station and searching food in the garbage, or they need psychiatrists to treat their „expanded mind". This is always the same, i watched this dozends of times in my environment. Drugs are for idiots and losers, at least they make people to it.
Revisionist much? The Aztecs did not exist for thousands of years. Further, many of the Mesoamerican civilizations had blood sacrifices. They painted it on their walls, they glorified it in Statues. You can see with your own eyes the stones which the used to place the hearts. We even have some of the skulls that were placed on great racks.
Human sacrifice was widespread in ancient Rome and Greece, and the reason why Europe adopts Christianity is because it is based on the sacrifice of their God's son: Jesus.
What are you talking about? Romans (atleast) hated the the very notion of human sacrifice, they mocked the Carthaginians for it who sacrificed children for the gods. Human sacrifice only occured at a time when nothing else seemed to appease the gods, I mean they would try everything before it. Besides, Romans killed Christians becuase not only did they believe they were idle infedels but becuase they belived they were cannibals, "eating the body of Christ", besides the usual propoganda...
Actually early Romans did practice human sacrifice, though later on as the empire grew they viewed it as barbaric. Either way the Romans did many other brutal acts that can easily take the place of human sacrifice, such as the killing of a victim in gladiatorial combat (in fact this can be a form of sacrifice as well).
That wasnt religiius in the elast, that was pure entertainment. The act of sacrificing humans to the gods was seen as stupid to the Romans becuase to them the gods wanted worship and service, not human sacrifice. The only real sacrifices were Christian MArtyrs, but even these were not dedicated to the Gods, and since Christians were refused the title of Roman for much of Roman history the fact that Christians "gave them selves up to God" is irrelavent.
It wasn't pure entertainment early on in the Roman Empire, it was also done for religious reasons too. But yeah, the Romans weren't into human sacrifice as much as other cultures but the fact still remains that human sacrifices have existed in all major regions and cultures at certain points in time, though some less than others. Human sacrifice was actually quite common in ancient Judea for example, and many people consider Israel part of the western diaspora.
The last romans were cristians, no practice sacrifices, not all gladiatorial combat was in the same condition, that only happens when money was important, many combats, was a gladius against a totally protected man
The christian romans did a lot of other horrible shit....for one they slaughtered any non-christians and really any religious group not affiliated with the Roman church....this was in large numbers as well as there were many other sects and religious practices by many other peoples at this time.
I said this before... the bible never supported any of this if you read it. These people did what they wanted but used the name of Christ as a cover for what they do. Just because they call themselves christian doesn't mean they are. Aztec religious beliefs did support this, there's the difference.
You know that's bullshit, your just picking and choosing what you think is christianity.Sure we can all do that. Ignore the parts about executions for adulterers, disobedient children, homosexuals, and non-believer but only embrace the few good non-violent verses. Picking and choosing doesn't really change the nature in that very violent religious book. Heck most of the old testament is how the hebrews slaughtered in genocide the "inferior Cannites".Hmm I wonder where the violence came from,lol.
Ignoring? No I am not ignoring. God never commanded christians to go out and kill them. He commanded the Israellites because they refused to obey God after He had already warned them. After Jesus came and died and rose again the old covenant was fulfilled, no longer needing to do those things and also God lived among the Israellites and the punishments for the sins were dealt with as such. Just study before you talk on a subject you know little about.
I know quite a bit about that subject, dear. And I've heard that argument be used hundreds of times before. It's just one interpretation. I guarantee you that we can find millions of christians that believe the old testament is equally as valid after christ as it it was before christ. Oh and your jesus never said he came to abolish the law....he clearly states that.....but rather to fulfill it. And the new testament has a lot of fucked up shit too.
Silver, what I said is how it states in the bible. Its like saying the sky is blue sort of interpretation... only one way to see it and that's how its explained in the bible black and white. I didn't say it wasn't valid I said it was fulfilled. Read what I said again.
So what's your point then? If it's fulfilled then that doesn't mean any of the old testament and other violent sayings are invalid.
And of course there are many different ways to interpret the bible. Whose to say your way of interpretation is the only way? You can interpret it in any way you want and justify anything in the bible....from peaceful non-violence to your fellow man and to the genocide of millions of your fellow man.
Oh and let's say for arguments sake that your way or ways similar to what you are suggesting are the only one way. That still doesn't take away from the fact that the bible has been and continues to be used to justify oppression and genocide.Whether these verses are taken out of context or not the fact remains that they can be used to justify anything.
If a religious book preached nothing but non-violence and love then it can't be taken any other way.The bible does not preach only these things.
The bible explains things like I said black and white there's only one way to interpret it if you read it in the context of the entire bible and not make up something by reading one little section and think oooo so it means this that and this. The bible is very clear on alot of things but the thing is people never read it in context. The bible preaches only love but love can also mean justice. The Canaanites weren't a lesser people but an immoral and evil one according to God. I'll finish
Each and everytime before God told the Israellites anything, He had warned the people of their wickeness and gave time for them to turn around. For example, the battle of Jericho, Rahab changed and put her faith in God and so she was spared. Not only that, we learn she was an ancestor of Christ. The bible preaches not only love and peace but of war and justice I am not going to lie about that. But in our case, we have the right to defend. Hell for example could be said its unfair but.. sec lol
God's standards are much higher than ours. To enter heaven on our own, we'd have to be perfect, thus none of us would enter and go to hell. But since Christ came, we simply have to repent and believe in Him and our debt is paid. If God lived among us as He did with the ancient Israellites then we might all witness the same sort of commands He gave them. They had to be purified to the extreme because of it. Also because we live in this world we don't understand why He does such things.
But then you'd have to remember, its not over at death. When people ask me about those events, I don't ignore them but because we don't live in those times or we weren't commanded to do it I do have to mention it, they'd find out about it sooner or later. God punishes people back then like He does today with the same amount of severity, sin is no joke to Him. The bible is not justifying anything but showing the fact that God is serious about evil. God tries to help but man refuse basically.
Even your idea that the bible can only be taken into account in its entirety, the fact remains that there are many ways to interpret it in its entirety. Your way or the way you were taught is not the only way obviously, that's why there are hundreds of sects claiming to be the truth. And taking it in its entirety means those violent genocidal laws and commands (justice?) are to be taken as seriously.
The Canaanites were an evil people? Oh yah the Spanish thought the same thing about the Aztecs. Oh please that's just patriarchal ethnic bullshit.....yah the Nazis said the same thing about the Jews. I mean it is no wonder European christians treated the places they colonized as subject or slave peoples......in their eyes they (western christians) are like the chosen people of god; destroying the evil and immoral. All this only further proves my point.
Silver, I told you why things happened like that back then. God was literally living with them, so things seemed far harsher than it is. God told them Himself of what they did, He warned them, gave them time to change, the Canaanites were not ignorant of God but chose to go another way. Those were the only time God told Israellites to do such because He had also promised the land to them not anyone else and the nations weren't about to live peacefully with them.
Just shows how unforgiving, bloodthirsty, and fucked up your god is. Just like he flooded the entire world right.....he couldn't just tell the people they were wicked....heck if god was all-powerful he doesn't even have to have suffering. Obviously Yahweh is some made up deity by some hallucinating patriarchs to cement their cultural power.
The Canaanites were as innocent as the Palestinians. But many judeo-christians don't seem to realize that for obvious racist and religious reasons.
There's only one way, for example the bible says not to make a doctrine on one verse. When God says in John 3:16 that anyone who believes in Jesus will be granted eternal life and not perish He meant anyone. When God does something, His reason is without flaw or evil intent. When we do something its not. If God doesn't sanction something then you can't blame christianity for what people do in the name of Christ. They do that for themselves
The bible is not fond of racism also because of the fact there are no races. God only created the human race. I never asked you to agree with what I am saying, I am asking you to study thoroughly before you go making accusations if you want to discuss this further lets do so on an IM cuz this doesn't give much room for me to elaborate on the subject. But I'll finish with this, what God does will may not understand but we have to understand He knows what's best.
Please, any layman can see the racism of the bible quite easily. The Hebrews attitude towards the Canaanites and other peoples were not racist? What were they then? All-loving? Please....if you deny racism in that encounter your basically saying that the victims of the racist genocide weren't human. It's no different if a bunch of conquering racial supremacists came to your home state and start killing and kicking you off your land. What would you say then if you were the victim?
I am very well read on the subject, thank you. I came from a staunchly christian family and studied scriptures throughout my childhood. Like I said it all comes back to your own interpretation vs other interpretations. There isn't much to elaborate on.....it's all just selective theology.
pianted at walls not means sacrifice, interpretation is other, similar to Sacred heart image of the cristians, maybe problem, was the interpretation , the stone is a mith, created by monks, that stones are invention
How can they not have a word for a boat.......THEY LIVE ON A FLOATING CITY THAT USED BOATS AS TRANSPORTATION! Therefore they would have a word for boat.....the only thing they need to add to their word boat is "big", since European boats were probably far larger than the boats that the Aztec used.
This documentary is very interesting and informative, but there are a lot of contradictions here and there (another example would be the life span of the Aztecs).
¡Qué Moctezuma tan Pinchi pusieron en este documental!
imacristobal 2 months ago
guess who invented " hockey or basketball "????
99cacahuate 8 months ago
its funny how whites kill 95% of the Native Americans and then talk about how much American they are more than the so called Mexicans....
99cacahuate 1 year ago
@99cacahuate ha FAG
lilmofo92 8 months ago
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LONG LIVE THE LEGACY OF CORTEZ
fuckspicx 1 year ago
@fuckspicx ae you on crack? Cortez brought disease, raped innocents, killed and shot a lot of them, and destroyed the biggest city on water in the world, why the fuck do you support that? god, i hope your kidding
aztecsun12 1 year ago
thank u
atanneriscool 1 year ago
thank u. helped me out.all u people suck me tin tin
atanneriscool 1 year ago
People why do u come here to argue....just enjoy the video
8jimador 1 year ago 9
spanish l/h/s
rekomaged1 1 year ago
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I1HateTheInternet 1 year ago
There's nothing wrong with being Iberian and Mesoamerican, Iberians also have a proud history. Yes, they have been known to murder ethnic groups in the past (Jews, Romas, Granadians (Muslims), and Mesoamericans) it's worth learning who you are, even if you don't like what you find out. And having traveled through Mexico, I can tell you that a lot of Mexicans have pale skin, red hair, blue eyes, and other European traits so, they aren't 100% Native American, as much as you might like them to be.
I1HateTheInternet 1 year ago
@I1HateTheInternet wtf? mexicans dont have any of those traits!!!! you seriously have some problems, mexicans have brown or black hair, some are pale, but mostly tan, and have brown or light brown eyes. gets your facts right! im sorry, your mistaking them for french people so before you blabber out things, make sure they are correct
aztecsun12 1 year ago
It is. I was forced to do two or three reports on ancient African civilizations, - and not Carthaginians, Phoenicians, or even Egyptians mind you - because apparently they weren't African enough? So yeah, in inner city schools they do cater to African Americans. By the way, your comment about Mexicans being *only* Mesoamerican sounds like something straight from the mouths of Aztlan...or some conflicted feelings about your European history.
I1HateTheInternet 1 year ago
If you are from Mexico, though, I think it's important for you to learn about Aztec, Mayan, and Iberian history, as it is your ancestoral history, as well as world history. It's a shame and I do feel bad for you. However, I made my comments in relation to what is taught here in the United States. We have our roots ultimately in Greek and Roman culture yet I it seems that our ancestors are downplayed. That's my issue here, I don't feel that Mesoamerican history isn't worth learning.
I1HateTheInternet 1 year ago
Truely? We have this shit shoved down our throats in the States because everything - even history - has to be politically correct by catering to people of African and Native American decent. In all of my schooling I didn't hear a single thing about the Sumerians, Hittites, Greeks, Romans, Macedonians, Persians, Minoans, or the Phoenicians, the true pioneers of modern day society. My point is that in this country, history is being rewritten and it angers me.
I1HateTheInternet 1 year ago
Plus all the crappy little PBS/History Channel specials on them that basically reitterate the exact same thing over and over, because there isn't much to talk about when it comes to Native Americans (most of them didn't even have a written language). So yeah.
I1HateTheInternet 1 year ago
That's all I heard about in history class growing up in both Florida and California. World history went like this for me:
-There were some guys called Greeks and Romans, but they were bad.
Then there was 18 chapters dedicated to Mesoamerican life, culminating in the bad men from Spain spoiling the fun.
-And then present day race issues.
That was my world history textbook. Don't get the attention they deserve huh?
I1HateTheInternet 1 year ago
And fighting my arguements with insults and the poor comment button is irrelevant. The point is no one has any relevant counterpoints.
I1HateTheInternet 2 years ago
I just corrected you and put your own insult back at you.. SO I guess that indicates your own comment is irrelevant, according to your own words.
pnfkwfl 2 years ago
Difference is I gave points to verify my position, you just said I'm pathetic, basing it on nothing. But nice try!
I1HateTheInternet 2 years ago
It's funny how people spam the poor comment button for every comment I make, just because I disagree that, in a historical context, that ancient Native American people do not deserve the sort of attention that some of the more advanced ancient cultures deserve. Just goes to show you that people have beeen force fed what is considered politically correct, and anything outside of that is "pathetic", or insensitive, or appalling. Grow up people.
I1HateTheInternet 2 years ago
@I1HateTheInternet
Deserve? What does that even mean? lol. Its history and played a huge role in the upbringing of an entire civilization.
Where exactly does people becoming angered by your personal bigotry expressed online collide with bring up politically correct behavior again?
Deserveclassic
diedahero 2 years ago
I wrote the previous comments out of irritation, not bigotry. I have no issues with the present day descendants of Aztecs, Mayans, Northern Native Americans, or Incans. My issue is with the medias attempt to portray these people as a hyper advanced, peacepipe-smoking people who were minding their own business until the evil white men came with their evil black powder and killed them. I also feel that air-time would be better suited to civilizations who have actually influenced our present.
I1HateTheInternet 2 years ago
Comment removed
diedahero 2 years ago
I mean at least half of the 8.84 million people that live in Mexico City alone care right? Their ancestors matter to them like yours do to you.
And while you might not find the engineering feats the Aztecs impressive (which I believe is your real point) you must admit, the back story we have of their civilization is at least entertaining, hence were watching a T.V. show.
As far as the bigotry comment, I dont know maybe it was heavy handed, but you sound a wee bit...well...
diedahero 2 years ago
I wonder what the world would be like if Spain did not conquer the Aztecs. What if the Aztecs defeated spain? Would we still speak spanish? I always like playing the what if game in history. Dont you?
FnHilarious101 2 years ago
hmm... I didn't post this, so I suspect this is the work of my friend who unwittingly forgot to log out of my account before posting. So, sorry about that. I'd put in my opinion, but this argument is such an unbelievable waste of time I won't even bother.
iroxalldatime 2 years ago 2
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Aztecs shouldn't be mentioned in the same breath as the Greek, Roman, Byzantine, or Han Empires, let alone share a History Channel special with them. I'm tired of the politically correctness that teaching or presenting history has to display. Let's just come out and say it. The Greeks had a steam engine by the time these people learned how to build with stone. The Spaniards thought the natives were demons due to the fact that they had barely developed the notion of clothing. They were pathetic.
I1HateTheInternet 2 years ago
Dude are you joking? Native American cultures had to basically invent every technology they used. Do you know how hard that is? The Romans had some technology handed to them (although they still invented a lot), the Byzantines as well, and by the time the Spaniards had arrived they had technology from thousands of years and from many different cultures. To say that mesoamerican cultures are any less brilliant than the Greeks, Romans, or countless other societies is ridiculous.
iroxalldatime 2 years ago 30
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That's laughable at best.
There were plenty of other tribes to steal/copy technology from. The problem is that none of them made certain key advances.
To say that Old World cultures had an advantage over New World cultures is ludicrous, considering that Old World cultures started with nothing, as well.
Many isolated civilizations, such as the Harrappans, the Hans, and the Japanese, made considerable technological advances without outside help or motivation.
I1HateTheInternet 2 years ago
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While I commend American civilization for their work in astrology, time keeping, and architecture, none of those things managed to influence overall human history. And none of those things managed to save them from annihilation by Europeans.
Let me emphasize this point. NONE of the American cultures developed any advanced metallurgic techniques. When the Spaniards arrived, Old World cultures had been procuring advanced techniques in metalworking for over 4000 years.
I1HateTheInternet 2 years ago
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Basically, Old World cultures were using gunpowder. They were also making social progress, and were thinking of some of the ideas that are the framework for our government today.
New World cultures were still Neolithic, were using stone tools and weapons, and barely had the technology to make seafaring vessels. They were cavemen.
There's no excuse for that, it's pathetic. I'm tired of hearing the politically correct version of history, these people should be little less than a footnote.
I1HateTheInternet 2 years ago
1hatetheinternet you got it wrong, the aztecs were not cavemen they were the most sanitary empire they were so wealthy thier weapons were made of obsidian they cut and carved precious stones crystals and jeweles into shapes a laser today cant macth they had the best grasp of the universe precisely predicting universal movements 1000s of yrs ahead they were the best mathematicians today most scientest highly acnolegde thier intelligence of the stars and cosmos thier measurments of space and time
OrlandoWa 2 years ago 3
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Yes I acknowledged their advanced measurements of space and time. But again, many Neolithic cultures had advanced timekeeping measurements. In Neolithic cultures the precise keeping of time seems to be a tremendous issue and a common theme, as there are entire sites dedicated to time keeping for farmers/religious rites, such Stonehedge, or the site recently discovered at Goseck, or many of the American Pyramids, etc. I doubt Americans were the only ancient culture with this knowledge/precision.
I1HateTheInternet 2 years ago
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Besides, I would acknowledge the Greeks for their astronomy over the Aztecs. They even discovered the Chandler Wobble 3000+ years before modern society did, along with finding the circumference of the Earth and the distance to the sun. Of course, their part in astrological history is downplayed by the Aztec/Mayan/Incan role in it because the History Channel et al have to find some way to compliment it, right? Don't want to offend Native Americans in our telling of history, I guess?
I1HateTheInternet 2 years ago
@iroxalldatime The most amazing part is that they didn't even have the wheel.
TheMostEvilDarkLord 6 months ago
@TheMostEvilDarkLord, they did have the wheel.
TheMasterSlasher 5 months ago
@TheMasterSlasher no they didnt have the wheel.
FlintKnappinFool 1 month ago
Correction, YOU are pathetic.
pnfkwfl 2 years ago
Someones a little touchy about their ancestor's failures, no?
I1HateTheInternet 2 years ago
brutal world
thepharaoh16 2 years ago
Montezuma fucked up, the comet that he saw served as a warning so if he was smart, he would prepare.
TitanSubZero15 2 years ago
the warriors dress wasn't show or to put people in fear. It was strong skinns of Ocelotl that a blade couldn't pentrate it. and 100,000 warrior didn't take on the spaniards and its 10,000 tlaxcala back up.
piercedheart1492 2 years ago
What the fuck do Israelites have to do with Aztecs?
TheLastMexicatl 2 years ago
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I enjoyed the program all 5 parts. I learned a lot about the Aztecs concerning their architecture and building techniques they were quite innovative and truly master builders.
whitewitchwares 2 years ago
Damn Spanish, why destroy such a great civilization.
war war war...
znopert 3 years ago 2
Yea but then again without them lol things would be far different today
1989dman 3 years ago
i didnt no social could be so interesting!
halogirl333 3 years ago
Did anyone ever notice that the Native American's in what is now the USA, didn't built shit compared to the South American natives..
Kind of like the Southern Euro's over the Northern Euros..
Weird.
Eagle971 3 years ago
yeah yeah
forgotmypassword3 3 years ago
Actually it makes sense when speaking from a Ecological aspect. The places were the Ecology was favorable for High Civilization to be "stimulated" were parts such as: Fertile cresent, Indush Kush, Meso-American region, etc. All of which led to Grain, Corn, Rice, being cultuivated which would lead to a more complex civilization to arise. Of course for the Old World (Beast of burden) was an added bonus, not only fro agriculture but millitarily aswell. Even biological warfare(smallpox) from the cow
amdturion123 3 years ago
Blergh, why do they fail to mention all the signs and omens which caused Moctezuma (II) to act like he did?
UserNameForYeeTube 3 years ago
No wonder Age of Empire 3 Warcheif have Aztec soldier wearing animal costume.
zenniz1992 3 years ago
Yes, but pure blooded european spanairds are white as they get.Caucasion
Darothone 3 years ago
wow.I am spaniard,i mean.a white european spaniard and Hernan Cortes looks like an indian,hahahaha.you are so silly yankees,don´t know we are white.hahahah.
ximocastello2000 4 years ago
you mean hes half spanish half indian idiot he cant be mexican, mexicans are the indians stupid am french and aztec myself i look more white but still have the aztec blood but i have green eyes
likpit 4 years ago
60% of mexicans are mixed indian and spanish.
oscaradrianvazquez 4 years ago 4
Yeah and 30% are pure Indians while only 10% are pure Spanish.
silverbackman 3 years ago 8
there is a huge mistake, the guy who plays CORTES is not spanish is mexican-half indian.
ramoscux 4 years ago 3
Maybe when they saw it was a ship, or it was explained to them by translaters they created a name. Anthropology and archeology has old evidence but they need to visciously interpolate and read between the lines to come up with a story like this one. I hope I could help, sorry if i;m tellingu stuff u already know. These engineering empires series are sweet.
AdrianK403 4 years ago
For aztecs not to know how to describe a boat tho, they had never seen one before. An enourmous elaborate vessel that appeared as a mountain. Scouts didn't come back to the ruler and say there are ships with men and horses. They saw mountain-like shapes. That's what they described. They used canoes and platforms with sticks that they probably had 50 names for including slang.
AdrianK403 4 years ago
They were closer in proximity to ancient civilizations as well where they might have learned about different theories. But then religion and catholic church censorship was a huge factor in its hindering of development.
AdrianK403 4 years ago
But these are people that still believed in gods and had never seen horses before. Logical reasoning at a tribal level was basic and simple. The sun will not rise unless blood is offered. Rain too. In Europe they believed that infection was evil spirits, fever was a result of being hot blooded. That was in the 16th century!
AdrianK403 4 years ago 2
Not true. As a Mexica(Aztec) myself, I can tell you we did not believe in gods. The sun, rain, wind are all manifestations of our one single god, Ometeotl, who is basically our universe, our creator. Sacrificing so the sun can rise is the stupidest thing i have ever heard. We knew the earth revolved around the sun for thousands of years and we never sacrificed millions of people.
CannibalPutrefaction 4 years ago 3
You'll see a number of my posts throughout this documentary, but if there were no Aztec gods, why all the decoration and figures of "gods"? What was the actual purpose of the temples to Tlaloc and Huitzilopochtli on top of the Great Pyramid in the center of Tenochtitlan?
illerac84 4 years ago
These "gods" are manifestations of nature. The god of rain, sun, war are not gods in human form like the ones in christianity. They are natural and real events that we drew pictures to give meaning. Think of it this way, when it rains we would dance, not to honor the rain because you think its a god, but to thank it for its energy and in return we give some of our energy to it and we drew a symbol for it.
CannibalPutrefaction 4 years ago
And the sun needing blood to rise?
I happen to watch the History Channel all the time, but I'd not gotten a chance to see this episode before. I have read much on the Aztec Mexica Empire, so I'm interested to see you're alternative opinion, though I must admit skepticism at the moment. I'll PM you when I get the chance.
illerac84 4 years ago
Think about it, ancient Mexica had the biggest population in the world of its time, they knew when seasons, eclipses, and alignments of planets and stars will happen. They mastered the art of agriculture and architecture. Do you think they were stupid enough to believe the sun needed blood ?? It's common sense here. Because there historians have PHds that makes them 100% accurate ?? all they do is make guesses, they never lived it.
CannibalPutrefaction 4 years ago
With Computers, Airplanes, Electricity, Phones and Cable TV, People STILL believe a Man walked on water and died, only to rise from the grave. OF COURSE the Aztecs were that superstitious. The Brilliant Egyptians thought there was an After Life, the Greeks and Romans believed in Curses. Why build a pyramid when you KNOW the sun will rise? No one ever said religions were logical.
kev3d 4 years ago 4
This is right, razon real was a justify for invaders, their pope and their king,did say this, destroy all sites swith human sacrifice, but there wern`t,
Spaniards think then that, because they were teached that.
So sacrifices, were only punish.
Discovery try to justify a mith and lie, but it is not right
atlantepetl 3 years ago
And the temples are more symbolic than making them for a god. The temples were built to acknowledge not only our past but it was a place for study and connecting ourselves with nature.
CannibalPutrefaction 4 years ago
Through the uses of the most powerful mind expanders in the world: mushrooms, peyote, LSA, DMT, ect. No civilization in the world has such powerful mind expanders as Mesoamerica (the most powerful mind expanders in the Old World was cannabis, and this was mainly in the Eastern countries like Persia, India, and China.......and ergoth in Europe.
silverbackman 4 years ago
Fuck the "mind expanders". Drugs turn your brain into a heap of shit.
SimpliciusTeutsch 3 years ago
That's a very steep over-generalization. Because most psychedelics are not neuro-toxic. If by drugs you mean such life and substances then even coffee is closer to that than the psychedelics.
silverbackman 3 years ago
Thats all are just weasel words of drug addicted people and goofy drug professors. First they argument of how healthy and mind expanding drugs are and a few years later you see them all without teeth, standing on the train station and searching food in the garbage, or they need psychiatrists to treat their „expanded mind". This is always the same, i watched this dozends of times in my environment. Drugs are for idiots and losers, at least they make people to it.
SimpliciusTeutsch 3 years ago
Drugs are only useful in moderation, abuse makes them betray the user...
shiningIvory 3 years ago
I'm sure they are. So we should ban coffee right? I guess 90% of North Americans are idiots because they consume the drug known as caffeine.
Haha keep spouting your nonsense.
silverbackman 3 years ago
of course, but not all that %, a few lest is right
atlantepetl 3 years ago
Revisionist much? The Aztecs did not exist for thousands of years. Further, many of the Mesoamerican civilizations had blood sacrifices. They painted it on their walls, they glorified it in Statues. You can see with your own eyes the stones which the used to place the hearts. We even have some of the skulls that were placed on great racks.
kev3d 4 years ago
Human sacrifice was widespread in ancient Rome and Greece, and the reason why Europe adopts Christianity is because it is based on the sacrifice of their God's son: Jesus.
silverbackman 4 years ago
What are you talking about? Romans (atleast) hated the the very notion of human sacrifice, they mocked the Carthaginians for it who sacrificed children for the gods. Human sacrifice only occured at a time when nothing else seemed to appease the gods, I mean they would try everything before it. Besides, Romans killed Christians becuase not only did they believe they were idle infedels but becuase they belived they were cannibals, "eating the body of Christ", besides the usual propoganda...
shiningIvory 3 years ago
Actually early Romans did practice human sacrifice, though later on as the empire grew they viewed it as barbaric. Either way the Romans did many other brutal acts that can easily take the place of human sacrifice, such as the killing of a victim in gladiatorial combat (in fact this can be a form of sacrifice as well).
silverbackman 3 years ago
That wasnt religiius in the elast, that was pure entertainment. The act of sacrificing humans to the gods was seen as stupid to the Romans becuase to them the gods wanted worship and service, not human sacrifice. The only real sacrifices were Christian MArtyrs, but even these were not dedicated to the Gods, and since Christians were refused the title of Roman for much of Roman history the fact that Christians "gave them selves up to God" is irrelavent.
shiningIvory 3 years ago
It wasn't pure entertainment early on in the Roman Empire, it was also done for religious reasons too. But yeah, the Romans weren't into human sacrifice as much as other cultures but the fact still remains that human sacrifices have existed in all major regions and cultures at certain points in time, though some less than others. Human sacrifice was actually quite common in ancient Judea for example, and many people consider Israel part of the western diaspora.
silverbackman 3 years ago
The last romans were cristians, no practice sacrifices, not all gladiatorial combat was in the same condition, that only happens when money was important, many combats, was a gladius against a totally protected man
atlantepetl 3 years ago
The christian romans did a lot of other horrible shit....for one they slaughtered any non-christians and really any religious group not affiliated with the Roman church....this was in large numbers as well as there were many other sects and religious practices by many other peoples at this time.
silverbackman 3 years ago
i agree, my reference is about the moment in the last years of the Roma, and the comparation sith mexican world before the spain invation
atlantepetl 3 years ago
I said this before... the bible never supported any of this if you read it. These people did what they wanted but used the name of Christ as a cover for what they do. Just because they call themselves christian doesn't mean they are. Aztec religious beliefs did support this, there's the difference.
1989dman 3 years ago
You know that's bullshit, your just picking and choosing what you think is christianity.Sure we can all do that. Ignore the parts about executions for adulterers, disobedient children, homosexuals, and non-believer but only embrace the few good non-violent verses. Picking and choosing doesn't really change the nature in that very violent religious book. Heck most of the old testament is how the hebrews slaughtered in genocide the "inferior Cannites".Hmm I wonder where the violence came from,lol.
silverbackman 3 years ago
Ignoring? No I am not ignoring. God never commanded christians to go out and kill them. He commanded the Israellites because they refused to obey God after He had already warned them. After Jesus came and died and rose again the old covenant was fulfilled, no longer needing to do those things and also God lived among the Israellites and the punishments for the sins were dealt with as such. Just study before you talk on a subject you know little about.
1989dman 3 years ago
I know quite a bit about that subject, dear. And I've heard that argument be used hundreds of times before. It's just one interpretation. I guarantee you that we can find millions of christians that believe the old testament is equally as valid after christ as it it was before christ. Oh and your jesus never said he came to abolish the law....he clearly states that.....but rather to fulfill it. And the new testament has a lot of fucked up shit too.
silverbackman 3 years ago
Silver, what I said is how it states in the bible. Its like saying the sky is blue sort of interpretation... only one way to see it and that's how its explained in the bible black and white. I didn't say it wasn't valid I said it was fulfilled. Read what I said again.
1989dman 3 years ago
So what's your point then? If it's fulfilled then that doesn't mean any of the old testament and other violent sayings are invalid.
And of course there are many different ways to interpret the bible. Whose to say your way of interpretation is the only way? You can interpret it in any way you want and justify anything in the bible....from peaceful non-violence to your fellow man and to the genocide of millions of your fellow man.
silverbackman 3 years ago
Oh and let's say for arguments sake that your way or ways similar to what you are suggesting are the only one way. That still doesn't take away from the fact that the bible has been and continues to be used to justify oppression and genocide.Whether these verses are taken out of context or not the fact remains that they can be used to justify anything.
If a religious book preached nothing but non-violence and love then it can't be taken any other way.The bible does not preach only these things.
silverbackman 3 years ago
The bible explains things like I said black and white there's only one way to interpret it if you read it in the context of the entire bible and not make up something by reading one little section and think oooo so it means this that and this. The bible is very clear on alot of things but the thing is people never read it in context. The bible preaches only love but love can also mean justice. The Canaanites weren't a lesser people but an immoral and evil one according to God. I'll finish
1989dman 3 years ago
Each and everytime before God told the Israellites anything, He had warned the people of their wickeness and gave time for them to turn around. For example, the battle of Jericho, Rahab changed and put her faith in God and so she was spared. Not only that, we learn she was an ancestor of Christ. The bible preaches not only love and peace but of war and justice I am not going to lie about that. But in our case, we have the right to defend. Hell for example could be said its unfair but.. sec lol
1989dman 3 years ago
Please read before you reply this time
1989dman 3 years ago
God's standards are much higher than ours. To enter heaven on our own, we'd have to be perfect, thus none of us would enter and go to hell. But since Christ came, we simply have to repent and believe in Him and our debt is paid. If God lived among us as He did with the ancient Israellites then we might all witness the same sort of commands He gave them. They had to be purified to the extreme because of it. Also because we live in this world we don't understand why He does such things.
1989dman 3 years ago
But then you'd have to remember, its not over at death. When people ask me about those events, I don't ignore them but because we don't live in those times or we weren't commanded to do it I do have to mention it, they'd find out about it sooner or later. God punishes people back then like He does today with the same amount of severity, sin is no joke to Him. The bible is not justifying anything but showing the fact that God is serious about evil. God tries to help but man refuse basically.
1989dman 3 years ago
Even your idea that the bible can only be taken into account in its entirety, the fact remains that there are many ways to interpret it in its entirety. Your way or the way you were taught is not the only way obviously, that's why there are hundreds of sects claiming to be the truth. And taking it in its entirety means those violent genocidal laws and commands (justice?) are to be taken as seriously.
silverbackman 3 years ago
The Canaanites were an evil people? Oh yah the Spanish thought the same thing about the Aztecs. Oh please that's just patriarchal ethnic bullshit.....yah the Nazis said the same thing about the Jews. I mean it is no wonder European christians treated the places they colonized as subject or slave peoples......in their eyes they (western christians) are like the chosen people of god; destroying the evil and immoral. All this only further proves my point.
Yah the bible is very fond of racism. ;)
silverbackman 3 years ago
Silver, I told you why things happened like that back then. God was literally living with them, so things seemed far harsher than it is. God told them Himself of what they did, He warned them, gave them time to change, the Canaanites were not ignorant of God but chose to go another way. Those were the only time God told Israellites to do such because He had also promised the land to them not anyone else and the nations weren't about to live peacefully with them.
1989dman 3 years ago
Just shows how unforgiving, bloodthirsty, and fucked up your god is. Just like he flooded the entire world right.....he couldn't just tell the people they were wicked....heck if god was all-powerful he doesn't even have to have suffering. Obviously Yahweh is some made up deity by some hallucinating patriarchs to cement their cultural power.
The Canaanites were as innocent as the Palestinians. But many judeo-christians don't seem to realize that for obvious racist and religious reasons.
silverbackman 3 years ago
There's only one way, for example the bible says not to make a doctrine on one verse. When God says in John 3:16 that anyone who believes in Jesus will be granted eternal life and not perish He meant anyone. When God does something, His reason is without flaw or evil intent. When we do something its not. If God doesn't sanction something then you can't blame christianity for what people do in the name of Christ. They do that for themselves
1989dman 3 years ago
All your doing is saying your way is the one way. Everyone has their opinion on the so called one way and can easily back their way with scriptures.
silverbackman 3 years ago
The bible is not fond of racism also because of the fact there are no races. God only created the human race. I never asked you to agree with what I am saying, I am asking you to study thoroughly before you go making accusations if you want to discuss this further lets do so on an IM cuz this doesn't give much room for me to elaborate on the subject. But I'll finish with this, what God does will may not understand but we have to understand He knows what's best.
1989dman 3 years ago
Please, any layman can see the racism of the bible quite easily. The Hebrews attitude towards the Canaanites and other peoples were not racist? What were they then? All-loving? Please....if you deny racism in that encounter your basically saying that the victims of the racist genocide weren't human. It's no different if a bunch of conquering racial supremacists came to your home state and start killing and kicking you off your land. What would you say then if you were the victim?
silverbackman 3 years ago
I am very well read on the subject, thank you. I came from a staunchly christian family and studied scriptures throughout my childhood. Like I said it all comes back to your own interpretation vs other interpretations. There isn't much to elaborate on.....it's all just selective theology.
silverbackman 3 years ago
pianted at walls not means sacrifice, interpretation is other, similar to Sacred heart image of the cristians, maybe problem, was the interpretation , the stone is a mith, created by monks, that stones are invention
atlantepetl 3 years ago
How can they not have a word for a boat.......THEY LIVE ON A FLOATING CITY THAT USED BOATS AS TRANSPORTATION! Therefore they would have a word for boat.....the only thing they need to add to their word boat is "big", since European boats were probably far larger than the boats that the Aztec used.
This documentary is very interesting and informative, but there are a lot of contradictions here and there (another example would be the life span of the Aztecs).
silverbackman 4 years ago
Thanks for posting!
mattbernabe 4 years ago
facinating documentry thanks for posting.
skwinkle79 4 years ago
WOW!
Kunvict 4 years ago