I wouldn't say it doesn't 'matter'. Nothing 'matters'. What matters is up to us to create (or not create). If somebody is highly liberated by the idea of free-will, and uses it positively to further improve the quality of his/her life, well, let free-will matter to them. If somebody is believes the 'illusion' of free-will is a great coping mechanism for when they feel they haven't achieved a certain goal, I say let em!
Whether it matters or not isn't an issue. I think understanding the idea is.
Neil DeGrasse Tyson once spoke about argument from ignorance. He said that if you don't understand something, you are not in the place to jump to any conclusion, instead, you should try and learn about it, to understand it. Once you stop questioning things and start jumping to conclusions, that is when you stop being a scientist. I'm not trying to argue the existence of god, for I am an Agnostic, I'm just trying to reiterate the lack of knowledge we have about such things.
You can't say that a metaphysical realm absolutely does not exist. As you said in a previous video, you then possess the burden of proof. You can not prove that a metaphysical realm does not exist, for it is outside of our element as human beings. I'm not saying that there is a definite explanation as to the nature of this metaphysical realm, but you do have to take into account the possibility of one.
why not consider both freewill and determinism irrelevant? determinism relies upon the principle of causality, yet it's quite possible to refute causality. David Hume demonstrated that, although one event always precedes another, this does not prove that the first event necessarily causes the second. rather, a succession of events creates an expectation that the second event would happen after the first. yet this expectation is merely a belief or habit, not absolute proof.
well, you have explained yourself very articulately. well, you have explained yourself very articulately. You make perfect sense, except when it really gets down to it, you believing that we are all here because a bunch of chemicals randomly came together and created everything.
Well, now that you have countless Christians praying for you, and God's Word never comes back void, you will encounter something you can't explain. At that point you will have to decide. Let us know.
If fatalism is true, and if déjà vu is the sensation of resonance that I've watched this video infinite times in the past, then I'm appalled that the universe loops in such a way that I'd be back here watching this asshole once again for the eternalth time (my neologism). If free will doesn't exist, I think this guy left out the fact that we may be able to evolve to the point where we'll be able to "feel determinism." Then, the illusion wouldn't be able to maintain itself.
This is a video about his belief system. He believes that life is what you make it. therefore he believes in free will even though he can not prove it. Causal effect events happen. Beyond that is subjective conjecture/ belief. The ghost in the machine.
I believe that we do have free will, but I can see your general point. Perhaps we only have free will in terms of our immediate choices, but the long- term future is predetermined. I hope that we do control our destiny to some extent, but noone really knows.
I'm trying to understand "We have complete control over our lives 'now'". What do you mean by this? The laws of the universe have complete control over your life now. Right?
...you never defined free will. What does free mean? What does will mean? What does free will mean? (answer: everyone has a personal definition...see the "free will stew" in the post below mine!). Call free will something that actually means something...like "conscious choice" maybe.
I feel much the same way about trying to figure out the origin of the universe. It's one of those dauntingly difficult tasks that is possibly entirely impossible to nail down completely, so I don't see a point in arguing about it. I'll quote Terry Goodkind in saying that "every fool will argue about the number of stars in the sky because they don't have to fear ever being proven wrong" This is probably not verbatim and I'm not certain it's his own original quote. But I think it fits.
Determinism is a very convincing argument though I remember reading that it is contradicted by quantum physics. The butterfly effect is a good way of explaining determinism.
well this situation IS completely reasoned with simple logic.
our "free will" depends on our ability to make choices. the fact that we can not change the choices that we are going to make, being preset on what our minds and situations present us to choose.
but we ARE our minds (sorry spiritual people, chances are your conscience is based on your brain which will probably end up dead) this means that these preset choices we make are based on our choices? so (as you said) it doesn't matter.
How can we hold people responsible for anything, if they couldn't have possibly done anything else? Easy, because if that applies universally, then we couldn't have possibly *not* held them responsible (assuming in that case we did). ;)
Al- I actually convinced my boyfriend that we have no free will in a debate- and he's extremely intelligent. I'm taking that side temporarily until I find contrary evidence. I, like you, am not really bothered either way due to the illusion of choice, but I'd be interested to tell you my reasoning and see if you see any flaws in it- you seem to be good at catching them (then again, so is he...)
It doesn't matter really how intelligent you are. You need only study a grandmaster game of chess to see how easy it is for an intelligent person to be fooled by complex logic. Only one thread of logic need be interpreted wrong and the result will be an incorrect solution.
How can you justly punish someone for improper ethical behaviour if they did not possess free will? This argument is at the heart of legal/ethical debates on punishment.
If I kill someone because it was oredetermined and I had no ability to choose not kill them, then how can you claim that I should be responsible for my actions???
We already have exceptions for people's crimes that they commit even if free will exists: insanity, youth, etc. There is no absolute yes/no easy answer for this.
What I say in my video is that even if determinism is true, we can't predict the future and our lives behave as though we have free will anyway. Whether or not it actually exists is effectively irrelevant.
Further, just because we think free will is very important to have is not evidence that it actually exists.
It may not be important to you in the sense that you go on making decision whether or not they are illusions or "real" choices.
But, "moral responsibility" is a very important topic when it comes to death sentence....especially if you are the one on death row. In this case, there is a big difference between the illusion of free will and "real" free will. It is not ethical to assign moral responsibility to someone who cannot "choose" their destiny.
If we punish someone in a deterministic universe, then that punishment itself is a "cause", with the possible effects being deterrent against committing the crime again, and rehabilitation of the criminal. These are exactly the same reasons we punish criminals now, even if free will exists. So it is moral to punish someone in deterministic universe, since that punishment acts as a deterministic cause making that person (and others) act differently, and less likely to be a criminal again.
No one is arguing that it isn't moral to punish some one in a determinisitc universe. It is pointless to have ethical morals in a deterministic universe because all actions are deterministic and there is only the 'illusion' of choice. In fact, the punishment system itsekf is governed by determinism so it also cannot choose the laws freely!
It may not be important to you in the sense that you go on making decision whether or not they are illusions or "real" choices.
But, "moral responsibility" is a very important topic when it comes to death sentence....especially if you are the one on death row. In this case, there is a big difference between the illusion of free will and "real" free will. It is not ethical to assign moral responsibility to someone who cannot "choose" their destiny.
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you are a lifeless person. if you believe in science, then is science a religion, or better yet you say that your an atheist. that you don't Believe in higher powers or whatever. but in the context that you start with contradicts your whole argument bud.
Well dear mikeleifskramstad, then let me borrow your argument:
If you believe in love, then love is a religion. If you believe in justice, then justice is a religion. If you believe smoking to be unhealthy, smoking is a religion etc.
i know wierd huh? but think about it in a deeper level. let go of evry belief that you have. let go of reality. let go of everything. now think about it again, but you have to really think about it. i'm not saying to think atheiest, because you don't know wat religion is, so you cant be an atheist, if you let that go. but your mind in perspective that you just don't know. use skepticism.
It doesn't. That wasn't my direct intent, though "free will" is commonly espoused by Christianity.
I don't think it is possible to disprove God, as he's a concept that is fully malleable and not subject to logical refutation. There will always be some excuse why evidence against gods don't apply. See Carl Sagan's "dragon in m garage" argument.
However, what Christians claim God does---such as curing diseases, preventing accidents, bringing goodluck, making marriages last longer, answering prayers, etc.---can be and have been disproved by statistics.
A deist god, even though whose existence is in theory not disprovable, is a useless one anyway.
With how fast Earths magnetic field has been decreasing in power over the last 100 years of which we have been keeping track of it the earth cannot possibly be 4.5 billion years old when simple math is applied. They say earth can only be some 10's of thousands of years old. So earth couldnt have existed before the alotted time and that in turn proves evolution wrong.. Our carbon dating is so unreliable that we cannot comprehend what amount of time sumthing has been sitting somewhere lost in time
whitelght9: Radiocarbon dating is only used for dating objects up to a few tens of thousands of years, so perhaps you are thinking of a different dating method?
Your "magnetic field" argument is mainly proposed by creationist Thomas Barnes. There are many problems with it, chiefly that it ignores the nondipole component of the earth's field and also the evidence for the dynamo theory.
I assume you are a Young Earth Creationist, who believes the world to be only a few thousand years old?
So I asked you a question about how to create life and you cited me a book on how we believe it is done not by how we know. You Cannot build life from scratch, you nor any man on this planet can even create the simplest of life forms or even begin to wonder how it is done and yet we believe that comets carrying germs and lightning all collided into the earth to create life. Thats sad that you believe this and its sad that you cannot owe up to a creator because of your arrogance in intelligence..
whitelght9: The book I cited covers how complex organisms like life can be created from simpler forms. Abiogensis would be a different topic.
I think we can begin to wonder: science has uncovered genetics, molecular biology, neurology and several other areas of study how life works. But because it doesn't offer a complete picture, that doesn't mean life has an intelligent creator automatically. And I don't know where you are getting the lightning/comets thing.
Well I was just stating what many different evolutionists believe. They believe that Comets are what hit the earth and gave us water and that they carried with them the ingredients of life which was sparked by lightning and the sun to start metabolizing. That seems to be evolutionists solution to every problem that has been presented to them in our solar system as to how it was created. An asteroid or a comet hits sumthing and does sumthing to make things change.. Its rediculous...
You believe with your rhetoric and your knowledge that you can persuade believers into becoming non-believers. You do this why? Is there any reason behind these videos? I dont understand that if you are a non-believer, why are you wasting your time posting videos on here explaining why you dont believe instead of out doing sumthing with your life and living it up? That is the atheist life and dream is it not? Live life to the fullest. Why must you try to explain what noone can explain?
I see a lot of people making unreasonable decisions based on superstition, and I have a lot of ideas that other people may not have thought of. I find it personally fulfilling to teach others or present new ideas.
And I would live a life of complete hedonism, but I don't think I'd enjoy it much. :)
Arrogance? Really? So basically, if we were back in 400 BC, and because I can't explain completely why it rains, that I'm being arrogant in not automatically claiming that it must be God who grabs handfuls of water and tosses it about..
Also, concerning that mankind has never created life, wrong again. While I could bore you with the manmade self-replication macromolecules created, I'l give you this instead.
You are a very bright human being and you have been gifted. The smarter people in this world have seem to all figured out that god does not exist,So they think. You are smart yes, so answer me this. Why in fact can we humans not even begin to understand how to build a human body let alone a living cell that metabolates from scratch? To believe that we are merely the production and overcoming of odds that are ubsurd and evolving into what we are is just way to hard for me to believe. God Bless
whitelght9 - Dawkin's book "Climbing Mount Improbable" details the process by which complex life comes about.
It does not matter if a theory is hard for you to believe or not, it matters what evidence supports it. Further, this still does not relieve you of the obligation to present evidence to support your claims. Your beliefs do not win by default if mine do not measure up.
i actually saw this thing on the science channel about how every decision we could've ever made is portrayed in alternate dimensions. what do you make of that?
I think, as it relates to social interactions it makes a huge difference. Also how we deal with criminality and that is something that arises out of the social interactions as well.
To me, it is important that people have a more realistic concept of human decision-making for our every day social interactions.
I think the orthodoxy in any religion is characterized by what you stated, but I have reason to believe the text in the Holy Bible says something quite different (John 5-6, Romans 9, etc..) and teaches the kind of self-realization and deep philosophical inquiry that you attribute to atheists. Of course Buddhism, and especially early Buddhists like Siddhartha Gautama (Buddha) were a lot more introspective and analytical of themselves and their own perception also.
i mean serious research, not just a check on google.
which are : international banking cartels, illuminati,Free masonry,the crusaders,the comitee of 300,the magestic 12,why is the pope part of the comitee of 300. and why is he WAY more richer then the federal banking theifs. wich have more money that you could ever spend in 100 life spawn. please search on real complicated stuff, if you like complicated things. but leave simple things alone.
oh and don't be foolled the bible god does exist. it is just subtile. does it refers at any part of the bible as a supernatural god?
yes and no. it just suppose. its up to the reader to take the info he/she judge good for its/hers convictions.
the thing bible says about god.like:
he knows all,(nsa,cia,kgb),if you do bad things he will know it,(big brother), everything is subtile so that people don't question authority. even bible says that.
free will is the much important thing. SIMPLY because if you can't make any choice then its called slavery. and thats what were going for if you people keep thinking that free will dosn't exist. its as foolish as to think that this world is the matrix. even if it were. so what. you got only on life. don't you have dreams? free will allows you to either realize them or forget them. forget them also mean changing dreams. wich can be influenced by a bunch of factors.
why do you think you swear on the bible on the court?
and at the point we are in the world right now. well laws applicate only to those you can't buyout cautions. cautions should be illigal. why do you think the court system favors criminals? that damn SIMPLE. the govt establishment is rotted,coorupted to the bones.liberty,free will.that is bullshit.
free will, freedom,liberty,resistance,you are free to refuse to be force into a way.
if you're pulling this crap just because your thinking its made up from the bible. well should you know that bible is crap.
and the way it work is MUCH MORE SIMPLE.
here it is. religions prophets listen to a group of people beliefs.
then those prophets make claims, write bibles and ultimatly take manipulate the people belief system wich make them hold on each another. they distort it in a way to take control over population.who do you think the pope is really.
It would be much more helpful if you could explain why you think free will exists or why you disagree with the points made in my video. Send me an email if it won't fit in the comments section.
I wasn't aware you made legitimate points, having watched the video. Maybe if you did, I'd try to formulate an argument against yours, but how can I when none exists?
MyLegendarySelf: My main point is that there is no effective difference between having free will and a deterministic system that is so complex as to be completely unpredictable. So this question of if free will exists is not nearly as important as it is usually credited as.
So your argument is that we just think we're choosing things but we're actually being randomly manipulated and chemically brainwashed into thinking we're making decisions? Please tell me I misunderstood you.
MyLegendarySelf: Say I choose vanilla over chocolate as a preferred flavor. If free will exists, I chose it of my own free will. If determinism is true, every mental action I took leading up to choosing vanilla still felt like my own choice. I say that free will is not an important question, because either way our experience and consciousness is the exact same.
Your preferred flavor is not chosen. That is not free will. You can't control which flavor you choose.
Free will is choosing either cone regardless of your preference, or any other factor--it's simply the ability to, to put it simply, make a conscious act of the will..
I chose to put two periods at the end of the sentence above this one. I removed it once, and then I put it back. I am in control of my will, and I chose every word I used here.
I'm not sure if "revolutionary" would be the right word, it's one of the oldest philosophical questions out there.
And I didn't mean the concept did not have an impact. The point in my video is that there is no difference between free will being real or an illusion.
I agree the ability to feel "free" is real. I used to feel it myself. It's a powerful adaptation we acquired through evolution. but the understanding we are not free is an even more powerful adaptation, or skill.you can't say there is no difference between illusion of free will and to truly have "free will." it might feel similar but it's different. Ok, you agree it had an impact, thats kinda what I meant revolutionary.
leephysics: How is a perfect illusion of free will and actual free will it different? I think there is no difference, which is why proving that "free will" (however you define it) exists has been so impossible.
"How is a perfect illusion of free will and actual free will it different?" there is no difference. I agree. but, we don't have a perfect illusion. I can break the spell by simply telling you you don't have it.
NIAfan2: I think free will doesn't matter because even if it doesn't exist, we still have a perfect illusion of it that works just as well as if we did have free will.
you have a very good point with the whoel "does it really matter" but i don't entirely agree with that thinkign this to be true or not will have no effect, simply because in that whoel determenistic system knowledge of soemthing also acts as part of the system, i can say from personal experience that beleiving that a person can't have freewill made my life alot more calm and less streesfull, and it's fun to debate and think about, whenever you actually find people that care XD
afskater182: From WL: "So now you might be tempted to just ignore the question, ignore the mystery of free will. Say 'Oh, well, it's just an historical anecdote. It's sophomoric. It's a question with no answer. Just forget about it.'"
I suppose the 80% I copy doesn't include the completely opposite conclusion and argument I am making? Also, "Waking Life" wasn't the first to propose these arguments and analogies either.
You copied more that one part also. I'm not saying you can't say something similar, but you shouldn't say something word for word, and act as such that its your own words.
I've posted links to transcripts of both this video and that scene from Waking Life in this video's description.
Afskater182, you claim that I "copied 80%" and some of it "word for word". Point out where exactly I do this. If you can find even more than a handful of phrases, I'll cede to your point.
He does do that, why I say that if he didn't? have you even seem waking life? if you have then you should be a able to hear that was copied word for word.
afskater182: For a second time, I'm telling you I have the scripts of my video and the script of the "free will" scene from Waking Life posted in the video description. Point out where I copy it, "word for word".
yes i've seen it and he even said to you some 6 times that he has the two scripts maybe you shoul wagtch it yourself and read the scripts intead of being a dumbass
I believe the point of the video was to illustrate that whether you believe your actions are merely reactions of cause and effect, or plucked from infinate possibilities a la free will, your descision of "Should i wear the green shirt or the red shirt today" won't change.
Determinism does not necessarily infer a lack of morality. I personally believe that the universe is science and thoughts are causal reactions... but I am a secular humanist, believing ethical actions are *essential* to life.
Dont open your mind so much your brains fall out. External and internal forces influence our decisions but it's up to each individual to act or not to act. It is through free will and determination that you will pass or fail at whatever activity you have chosen to endeavor. Have you ever wondered why only the young college age types question free will? Probably the same ones who would never claim responsability for misdeeds as a teenager.
I remember like it was yesterday the moment I realized that is was possible that I had nothing to with my past present and future. It was very enlightning until I realized I still had to get up and go to work because the bills still needed to be paid and I was responsable for paying them. Choices, get up or not get up. lol
the only reason the bible mentions free will is to keep christians in line, as long as they think they have a choice, as long as they think their fate for eternity is in their hands, they will continue to eat up the christian bullshit, and will continue to try to love god. especially when you add in the fact that they could die tomorrow. it's a trap, simple as that, a trap.
its funny, these videos. people are so damn obsessed with figuring out "why". why we're here, why we're so intelligent, why we're aware, if we're a divine species, etc.. it's kind of humorous. why can't people just live? i guess that's just too much to ask.
Great presentation, however the question of free will matters very much. Comprehending that human free will does not exist helps to destroy moral anger, hate, pride, etc. Such an insight has practical consequences and is therefore an important non-free step in the advancement of the human species. Higher levels of consciousness are important. Perhaps your materialistic worldview has blinded you to this?
These kind of platitudes show a pithy misunderstanding of how philosophers of science try to address issues, and a sturdy willingness to reach greedily for the Kool-Aid ("spirituality").
Which of the three platitudes do you deny after reviewing evidence from the past 200,000 years?
Anyway, here's a nice little quote to ponder:
"This awareness of the lack of free will keeps me from taking myself and my fellow men too seriously as acting and deciding individuals, and from losing my temper. Albert Einstein
Have you ever really thought about consciousness? Consciousness is not physical, nor can it be 'proved' scientifically, yet we know it exists. If you were to die tomorrow how would science 'prove' you existed? And I don't mean your body, but you - your personality? We can't see consciousness and we can't touch it. How do we even know for sure it dies when the body does? If science has no method for proving its existence, how can it prove it ceasing to exist? I believe this is the realm of God.
Ripleytee: Consciousness IS physical, we know it is physically rooted in the brain, though details are lacking. But amputating a limb or having a heart transplant doesn't change personality, so we can know that personality doesn't reside there. But we know that brain injury, alcohol & drugs all physically affect our brains and also affect our conscious awareness of the world (often distorting it).
Just because we lack many details does not mean consciousness is entirely shrouded in mystery.
False dichotomy - it's not "you" OR "your body". "You" is the pronoun we give to perceived intentional agents (this is why we refer to "corpses" as such, because there're no agents), and there's absolutely NO REASON to assert offhand, without evidence (indeed, the very idea of evidence can't be even conceived in such a circumstance), that such an intentional agent can survive the death of the physical body "it" inhabits and go "somewhere else" as opposed to just being annihilated.
IMO, If the 'idea', that free will does not exist, effects peoples actions, (maybe they become depressed when they hear that free will does not exist; in the same way that they could become depressed if they are being told, that they are worthless, ugly, stupid, [insert 1000 other things], etc.) then the 'idea' of free will, does matter, because the idea itself, can effect peoples actions.
Maybe human beings are physical manifestations that result in free will.
I mean the events that lead to our ultimate decision could not result in any decision if we didn't exist. So maybe the free will is just our presence in the universe.
We choose things and cause events to occur that would never happen normally had we had not been here.
Freewill may not be a a "decision" we make but a situation our presence creates.
Maybe life is a reflection of free will of matter? dunno
Free will matters cuz it's existence and nature is an interesting question. And the last sentence of the vid: "Life is still pretty much what you make it" is an affirmation (and I believe a correct one) of what out perceptions tell us: Free will exists. QM phenomena cut the deterministic chain so free will is possible. How this works-just how free will comes to be, is an exciting frontier of human knowledge.
No, spirituality is not the copout, materialism is. You have no accountability because all your actions are determined. Free will exists, because you must *act* *as if* it exists. If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, then it's a duck. Duh.
Braveheart6642: This is exactly why I say free will doesn't matter. This concept or abstraction of free will definitely exists, in the sense that we make choices and decisions all the time. But determinism (which physics and biology at least seem to point to) would say that matter will play out in a way that we have no say over. Either way, free will still walks and quacks like a duck, even if it really isn't a duck.
not really, that saying is pretty misleading. If another animal similar to a duck existed (like a goose) with a similar quack and a similar walking pattern you could still mistake for a duck.
Just because something look, acts and sounds like you think it would doesn't mean that's actually the answer.
I could make a robot that walks, quacks and looks like a duck, doesn't make it a duck.
Great video! You are one of my favorite youtube atheists and quite possibly the most influential to my understanding of the universe. Thanks for these!
What it does say is that Heaven exists. There is more than one. Paradise is different from Heaven. There will be a Resurrection where people will be reunited with their bodies. It does not, however, promise an eternity of bliss and idleness. Thanks for being fair. The quality of your videos are well above average. You have a good voice for presenting as well.
Even if the Bible doesn't promise an afterlife of heavenly bliss, this afterlife concept is pretty popular and strongly associated with Christianity.
The religion is more than the contents of the Bible (ask a Catholic).
Don't be rude to a guy that you recognize is fair and even-tempered when it comes to such a heated topic. Calling his ignorance "profound" is mean-spirited.
Any mistaken beliefs my fellow believers may have is of no consequence. It merely reflects how ill-informed most people are on the subject. My particular Faith doesn't rely exclusively on the teachings of the Bible as well. I did not intend my comment to be "mean spirited", but I was not about to call him "stupid" either, as he abviously is not. He chose to speak on a topic sounding as if he were claiming authority in it. As one who knows better I was merely calling him on it. My apologies.
poor, i agree that free will isn't as important but the argument you are using can be applied to anythgn "you don't care and you are just gonna live ur life as if determinism isn't true" eventhough you cannot disprove it.
god/allah my ass. they say read the bible, but the bible doesn't explain anything. i'm watching this vidoe because i have free will and god/allah/jesus does't have that type of power to control me.....your a nice kid. nice video
Without free will you can't hold people morally accountable for their actions.
MrGreeneggsnham 1 month ago
PS, beautiful explanation, I couldn't have said it better myself. They shoulda' used you as the guy that explains free-will in Waking Life.
futureslugger 4 months ago
I wouldn't say it doesn't 'matter'. Nothing 'matters'. What matters is up to us to create (or not create). If somebody is highly liberated by the idea of free-will, and uses it positively to further improve the quality of his/her life, well, let free-will matter to them. If somebody is believes the 'illusion' of free-will is a great coping mechanism for when they feel they haven't achieved a certain goal, I say let em!
Whether it matters or not isn't an issue. I think understanding the idea is.
futureslugger 4 months ago
Neil DeGrasse Tyson once spoke about argument from ignorance. He said that if you don't understand something, you are not in the place to jump to any conclusion, instead, you should try and learn about it, to understand it. Once you stop questioning things and start jumping to conclusions, that is when you stop being a scientist. I'm not trying to argue the existence of god, for I am an Agnostic, I'm just trying to reiterate the lack of knowledge we have about such things.
StarchaserXXI 8 months ago
You can't say that a metaphysical realm absolutely does not exist. As you said in a previous video, you then possess the burden of proof. You can not prove that a metaphysical realm does not exist, for it is outside of our element as human beings. I'm not saying that there is a definite explanation as to the nature of this metaphysical realm, but you do have to take into account the possibility of one.
StarchaserXXI 8 months ago
get new glasses, those are pretty out of date
bangzilla 9 months ago
why not consider both freewill and determinism irrelevant? determinism relies upon the principle of causality, yet it's quite possible to refute causality. David Hume demonstrated that, although one event always precedes another, this does not prove that the first event necessarily causes the second. rather, a succession of events creates an expectation that the second event would happen after the first. yet this expectation is merely a belief or habit, not absolute proof.
Creak86 9 months ago
I don't think our bodies have their own souls. No. I think our souls have their own body.
randomstuff7942 9 months ago
Silopsism is always redundant.
ciaochowbella 11 months ago
well, you have explained yourself very articulately. well, you have explained yourself very articulately. You make perfect sense, except when it really gets down to it, you believing that we are all here because a bunch of chemicals randomly came together and created everything.
Well, now that you have countless Christians praying for you, and God's Word never comes back void, you will encounter something you can't explain. At that point you will have to decide. Let us know.
DUMBarranger56 1 year ago
If fatalism is true, and if déjà vu is the sensation of resonance that I've watched this video infinite times in the past, then I'm appalled that the universe loops in such a way that I'd be back here watching this asshole once again for the eternalth time (my neologism). If free will doesn't exist, I think this guy left out the fact that we may be able to evolve to the point where we'll be able to "feel determinism." Then, the illusion wouldn't be able to maintain itself.
lestrangemadame 1 year ago
This is a video about his belief system. He believes that life is what you make it. therefore he believes in free will even though he can not prove it. Causal effect events happen. Beyond that is subjective conjecture/ belief. The ghost in the machine.
Twicebakedtaters 1 year ago
I believe that we do have free will, but I can see your general point. Perhaps we only have free will in terms of our immediate choices, but the long- term future is predetermined. I hope that we do control our destiny to some extent, but noone really knows.
gsco82 1 year ago
Oh gee....sounds like you waste alot of intelligence thinking.talking circles around yourself...such a shame...it is possible to think too much.
jevequart 1 year ago
I agree totally you have said everything I've thought. They throw a silly tantrum.
Esoparagon 1 year ago
Control freak.
riverlioness 1 year ago
If you think those terrorists are all predetermined by their Allah since they day they're born to bomb the USA, then you have serious mental issues!
Predetermination = Psychological Mentality and Sickness.
XionXXXX 1 year ago
According to Biblical scripture,the only one with free will is God.
CBALLEN 1 year ago
I like to believe that I have free will. The laws of physic make me believe that I have free will. I guess.
tubetib 1 year ago
I'm trying to understand "We have complete control over our lives 'now'". What do you mean by this? The laws of the universe have complete control over your life now. Right?
blackvest2 1 year ago
Wow. *Thumb uped, favourited, and subscribed*
This is the best examination of free will I've ever heard.
dannyboyfour 1 year ago
to god this sounds like a dog barking
AhYaOk 1 year ago
@AhYaOk To Shiva that sounded like a dog shitting.
kyledavidbyron 1 year ago
@rhetoricalmonkey
Just because Atheists believe a teaching similar (or the same) as a religion is Not Irony
If something is a good idea... USE IT
Thou shalt not kill: (ok, good idea)
Thou shalt not steal: (Another good idea)
Thou shalt not use poetry, art, or music to get into girls' pants! Use into their heads: (Another good idea!)
I use good ideas, Regardless of the source, and I reject bad ideas, Regardless of the source!
This is something called Common Sense
BlankPicketSign 1 year ago 2
FINALLY someone who actually has good way to Shut the Free Will non-sense down!
I shall use this argument for Great Justice!
BlankPicketSign 1 year ago
great video!! one of the first ppl i meet that gets this.
gromgromeson 2 years ago
...you never defined free will. What does free mean? What does will mean? What does free will mean? (answer: everyone has a personal definition...see the "free will stew" in the post below mine!). Call free will something that actually means something...like "conscious choice" maybe.
Explorer766 2 years ago
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Explorer766 2 years ago
Freewill argument can never be proven either way. We dont have Gods input
If proof showed God made decisions then God haters would reject the proof
If proof showed man made decisions (man is physical god) then God lovers would reject the proof
Ex: Evolution is proven false repeatedly but it is still believed by many
All we know is that at every instance there appears a choice to be made between good and bad (evil) and we appear to make the selection
We have a imited perspective
allspeechiswelcome 2 years ago
@allspeechiswelcome
Subtle Troll is Subtle
But still detected
BlankPicketSign 1 year ago
laughable
atheists use to condemn and ridicule Calvinists, until they found out their materialistic beliefs prevent free will from existing
Now a fool (atheist) is claiming that it doesn't matter if you really have free will or not
It doesn't matter that a murderer is just as innocent as someone with a mental disorder?
It doesn't matter that you can't control any of your actions and no one is to blame for any actions?
Psychologists say the belief that there is no free will is harmful
itsnobody 2 years ago
I feel much the same way about trying to figure out the origin of the universe. It's one of those dauntingly difficult tasks that is possibly entirely impossible to nail down completely, so I don't see a point in arguing about it. I'll quote Terry Goodkind in saying that "every fool will argue about the number of stars in the sky because they don't have to fear ever being proven wrong" This is probably not verbatim and I'm not certain it's his own original quote. But I think it fits.
canibalgofer 2 years ago
Schrodinger's cat mention ftw!
canibalgofer 2 years ago
Determinism is a very convincing argument though I remember reading that it is contradicted by quantum physics. The butterfly effect is a good way of explaining determinism.
VoiceDissent 2 years ago
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username009z 2 years ago
well this situation IS completely reasoned with simple logic.
our "free will" depends on our ability to make choices. the fact that we can not change the choices that we are going to make, being preset on what our minds and situations present us to choose.
but we ARE our minds (sorry spiritual people, chances are your conscience is based on your brain which will probably end up dead) this means that these preset choices we make are based on our choices? so (as you said) it doesn't matter.
mrmojoman2 2 years ago
Your soul is chemicals and electricity in sections of your brain.
WigglesThePirate 2 years ago 7
@WigglesThePirate That's just boring :(
TheJuliusJT 1 year ago
@WigglesThePirate derp
ThisTroper1 4 months ago
How can we hold people responsible for anything, if they couldn't have possibly done anything else? Easy, because if that applies universally, then we couldn't have possibly *not* held them responsible (assuming in that case we did). ;)
Skepdisc 2 years ago
That is insane logic.
dartplayer170 2 years ago
Opinion noted
Skepdisc 2 years ago
Al- I actually convinced my boyfriend that we have no free will in a debate- and he's extremely intelligent. I'm taking that side temporarily until I find contrary evidence. I, like you, am not really bothered either way due to the illusion of choice, but I'd be interested to tell you my reasoning and see if you see any flaws in it- you seem to be good at catching them (then again, so is he...)
graaar 2 years ago
It doesn't matter really how intelligent you are. You need only study a grandmaster game of chess to see how easy it is for an intelligent person to be fooled by complex logic. Only one thread of logic need be interpreted wrong and the result will be an incorrect solution.
dartplayer170 2 years ago
Free Will very important!
How can you justly punish someone for improper ethical behaviour if they did not possess free will? This argument is at the heart of legal/ethical debates on punishment.
If I kill someone because it was oredetermined and I had no ability to choose not kill them, then how can you claim that I should be responsible for my actions???
dartplayer170 2 years ago
We already have exceptions for people's crimes that they commit even if free will exists: insanity, youth, etc. There is no absolute yes/no easy answer for this.
What I say in my video is that even if determinism is true, we can't predict the future and our lives behave as though we have free will anyway. Whether or not it actually exists is effectively irrelevant.
Further, just because we think free will is very important to have is not evidence that it actually exists.
Albert10110 2 years ago 5
It may not be important to you in the sense that you go on making decision whether or not they are illusions or "real" choices.
But, "moral responsibility" is a very important topic when it comes to death sentence....especially if you are the one on death row. In this case, there is a big difference between the illusion of free will and "real" free will. It is not ethical to assign moral responsibility to someone who cannot "choose" their destiny.
dartplayer170 2 years ago
If we punish someone in a deterministic universe, then that punishment itself is a "cause", with the possible effects being deterrent against committing the crime again, and rehabilitation of the criminal. These are exactly the same reasons we punish criminals now, even if free will exists. So it is moral to punish someone in deterministic universe, since that punishment acts as a deterministic cause making that person (and others) act differently, and less likely to be a criminal again.
deamon138 2 years ago
No one is arguing that it isn't moral to punish some one in a determinisitc universe. It is pointless to have ethical morals in a deterministic universe because all actions are deterministic and there is only the 'illusion' of choice. In fact, the punishment system itsekf is governed by determinism so it also cannot choose the laws freely!
dartplayer170 2 years ago
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dartplayer170 2 years ago
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dartplayer170 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
It may not be important to you in the sense that you go on making decision whether or not they are illusions or "real" choices.
But, "moral responsibility" is a very important topic when it comes to death sentence....especially if you are the one on death row. In this case, there is a big difference between the illusion of free will and "real" free will. It is not ethical to assign moral responsibility to someone who cannot "choose" their destiny.
dartplayer170 2 years ago
Actually, my mouse was hooked up to a geiger counter which was placed next to a beeker containing a radioactive isotope.
The mouse selected a video based on the timing of when an atom decided to decay based on the laws of physics. That is how I got to this video.
Was it predetermined?????
dartplayer170 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
you are a lifeless person. if you believe in science, then is science a religion, or better yet you say that your an atheist. that you don't Believe in higher powers or whatever. but in the context that you start with contradicts your whole argument bud.
mikeleifskramstad 2 years ago
mikeleifskramstad: I disagree that science is a religion, and I go into this question directly with my video, "Is Atheism a Relgion?"
Albert10110 2 years ago
Well dear mikeleifskramstad, then let me borrow your argument:
If you believe in love, then love is a religion. If you believe in justice, then justice is a religion. If you believe smoking to be unhealthy, smoking is a religion etc.
ToyoKadiyaMikayla 2 years ago
i know wierd huh? but think about it in a deeper level. let go of evry belief that you have. let go of reality. let go of everything. now think about it again, but you have to really think about it. i'm not saying to think atheiest, because you don't know wat religion is, so you cant be an atheist, if you let that go. but your mind in perspective that you just don't know. use skepticism.
mikeleifskramstad 2 years ago
If you say that free will is inexistent, how does that disprove God/ a god?
nieuwsma2 2 years ago
It doesn't. That wasn't my direct intent, though "free will" is commonly espoused by Christianity.
I don't think it is possible to disprove God, as he's a concept that is fully malleable and not subject to logical refutation. There will always be some excuse why evidence against gods don't apply. See Carl Sagan's "dragon in m garage" argument.
Albert10110 2 years ago 5
However, what Christians claim God does---such as curing diseases, preventing accidents, bringing goodluck, making marriages last longer, answering prayers, etc.---can be and have been disproved by statistics.
A deist god, even though whose existence is in theory not disprovable, is a useless one anyway.
qqqquito 2 years ago
@Albert10110 I think Agnosticism is the right choice since you can never prove that god is nonexistent, as you can never prove god is existent.
anyways, I really like the way you see the world, it's pretty simple, physics dominate everything.
mau571 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@Albert10110 "I don't think it is possible to disprove God, as he's a concept that is fully malleable and not subject to logical refutation."
This is the smartest thing I have ever heard an atheist say. Much props to you.
shezie125 10 months ago
With how fast Earths magnetic field has been decreasing in power over the last 100 years of which we have been keeping track of it the earth cannot possibly be 4.5 billion years old when simple math is applied. They say earth can only be some 10's of thousands of years old. So earth couldnt have existed before the alotted time and that in turn proves evolution wrong.. Our carbon dating is so unreliable that we cannot comprehend what amount of time sumthing has been sitting somewhere lost in time
whitelght9 2 years ago
whitelght9: Radiocarbon dating is only used for dating objects up to a few tens of thousands of years, so perhaps you are thinking of a different dating method?
Your "magnetic field" argument is mainly proposed by creationist Thomas Barnes. There are many problems with it, chiefly that it ignores the nondipole component of the earth's field and also the evidence for the dynamo theory.
I assume you are a Young Earth Creationist, who believes the world to be only a few thousand years old?
Albert10110 2 years ago
So I asked you a question about how to create life and you cited me a book on how we believe it is done not by how we know. You Cannot build life from scratch, you nor any man on this planet can even create the simplest of life forms or even begin to wonder how it is done and yet we believe that comets carrying germs and lightning all collided into the earth to create life. Thats sad that you believe this and its sad that you cannot owe up to a creator because of your arrogance in intelligence..
whitelght9 2 years ago
whitelght9: The book I cited covers how complex organisms like life can be created from simpler forms. Abiogensis would be a different topic.
I think we can begin to wonder: science has uncovered genetics, molecular biology, neurology and several other areas of study how life works. But because it doesn't offer a complete picture, that doesn't mean life has an intelligent creator automatically. And I don't know where you are getting the lightning/comets thing.
Also, please stop the insults.
Albert10110 2 years ago
Well I was just stating what many different evolutionists believe. They believe that Comets are what hit the earth and gave us water and that they carried with them the ingredients of life which was sparked by lightning and the sun to start metabolizing. That seems to be evolutionists solution to every problem that has been presented to them in our solar system as to how it was created. An asteroid or a comet hits sumthing and does sumthing to make things change.. Its rediculous...
whitelght9 2 years ago
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whitelght9 2 years ago
You believe with your rhetoric and your knowledge that you can persuade believers into becoming non-believers. You do this why? Is there any reason behind these videos? I dont understand that if you are a non-believer, why are you wasting your time posting videos on here explaining why you dont believe instead of out doing sumthing with your life and living it up? That is the atheist life and dream is it not? Live life to the fullest. Why must you try to explain what noone can explain?
whitelght9 2 years ago
I see a lot of people making unreasonable decisions based on superstition, and I have a lot of ideas that other people may not have thought of. I find it personally fulfilling to teach others or present new ideas.
And I would live a life of complete hedonism, but I don't think I'd enjoy it much. :)
Albert10110 2 years ago
Arrogance? Really? So basically, if we were back in 400 BC, and because I can't explain completely why it rains, that I'm being arrogant in not automatically claiming that it must be God who grabs handfuls of water and tosses it about..
Also, concerning that mankind has never created life, wrong again. While I could bore you with the manmade self-replication macromolecules created, I'l give you this instead.
melancholyid 2 years ago
You can do whatever you want.
You just cant, not want, what you want.
There is no free will.
westlv 2 years ago
I forget who is the source, but I like the quote, "You are free to do whatever you want. You just don't have any control over what you want." :)
Albert10110 2 years ago
if the soul exist, then having a brain transplan doesnt really matter
Nades129 2 years ago
in case ur interested:
it sounds like you believe that christians believe that if they do good works, they will get into heaven and if they dont, they wont.
i understand why you have been left thinking that...
BUT, the bible teaches that the only way to heaven to confession of jesus christ as lord, and confession of ur sins to him.
question:
since you dont believe in souls, why do you think that abby and brittany hensel are so different?
thebestwillow 2 years ago
to clarify my question...:
what do you think is and has been the cause of the differences between abby and brittany hensel?
thebestwillow 2 years ago
thebestwillow: In short, because they have separate brains.
Albert10110 2 years ago
ok.
thebestwillow 2 years ago
You are a very bright human being and you have been gifted. The smarter people in this world have seem to all figured out that god does not exist,So they think. You are smart yes, so answer me this. Why in fact can we humans not even begin to understand how to build a human body let alone a living cell that metabolates from scratch? To believe that we are merely the production and overcoming of odds that are ubsurd and evolving into what we are is just way to hard for me to believe. God Bless
whitelght9 2 years ago
whitelght9 - Dawkin's book "Climbing Mount Improbable" details the process by which complex life comes about.
It does not matter if a theory is hard for you to believe or not, it matters what evidence supports it. Further, this still does not relieve you of the obligation to present evidence to support your claims. Your beliefs do not win by default if mine do not measure up.
Albert10110 2 years ago
i actually saw this thing on the science channel about how every decision we could've ever made is portrayed in alternate dimensions. what do you make of that?
StarchaserXXI 2 years ago
wonderfully done.
gatorclaw 2 years ago
bien explicado
prgalois 2 years ago
And for that reason I am a Buddhist-Christian-Atheist-Agnostic-Gnostic.
A student of reality.
Rybot9000 3 years ago
I do think beliefs like this make a difference.
I think, as it relates to social interactions it makes a huge difference. Also how we deal with criminality and that is something that arises out of the social interactions as well.
To me, it is important that people have a more realistic concept of human decision-making for our every day social interactions.
Rybot9000 3 years ago
Thank you. You give atheism a good name. Keep up the good work!
GrantMorey 3 years ago
This relates to the is-ought problem, in that 'free will''s the ought, while 'is' is reality.
redmapleleaf 3 years ago
start reading my post from the bottom to the top. lol make more sense this way.
monsterrun 3 years ago
science was use by religions as the principle way to divide and conquer.
divide the religious beliver, simple minded people who don't like complicated shit.
and science peeps who are intriguated as constantly asking questions.pushing things deeper. you will never stop realizing things.
to actually realize that everything is reallated one to another. so why making it more complicated when it can be that simple.
but anyway.what i was saying is religions used this as a tool to divide peeps.
monsterrun 3 years ago
I think the orthodoxy in any religion is characterized by what you stated, but I have reason to believe the text in the Holy Bible says something quite different (John 5-6, Romans 9, etc..) and teaches the kind of self-realization and deep philosophical inquiry that you attribute to atheists. Of course Buddhism, and especially early Buddhists like Siddhartha Gautama (Buddha) were a lot more introspective and analytical of themselves and their own perception also.
Rybot9000 3 years ago
go make some research on those groups.
i mean serious research, not just a check on google.
which are : international banking cartels, illuminati,Free masonry,the crusaders,the comitee of 300,the magestic 12,why is the pope part of the comitee of 300. and why is he WAY more richer then the federal banking theifs. wich have more money that you could ever spend in 100 life spawn. please search on real complicated stuff, if you like complicated things. but leave simple things alone.
monsterrun 3 years ago
oh and don't be foolled the bible god does exist. it is just subtile. does it refers at any part of the bible as a supernatural god?
yes and no. it just suppose. its up to the reader to take the info he/she judge good for its/hers convictions.
the thing bible says about god.like:
he knows all,(nsa,cia,kgb),if you do bad things he will know it,(big brother), everything is subtile so that people don't question authority. even bible says that.
you can't defy gods. why not? just wondering.
monsterrun 3 years ago
free will is the much important thing. SIMPLY because if you can't make any choice then its called slavery. and thats what were going for if you people keep thinking that free will dosn't exist. its as foolish as to think that this world is the matrix. even if it were. so what. you got only on life. don't you have dreams? free will allows you to either realize them or forget them. forget them also mean changing dreams. wich can be influenced by a bunch of factors.
mainly life experiance.
monsterrun 3 years ago
holy bible = laws book.
why do you think you swear on the bible on the court?
and at the point we are in the world right now. well laws applicate only to those you can't buyout cautions. cautions should be illigal. why do you think the court system favors criminals? that damn SIMPLE. the govt establishment is rotted,coorupted to the bones.liberty,free will.that is bullshit.
free will, freedom,liberty,resistance,you are free to refuse to be force into a way.
only sheeps can't see the door.
monsterrun 3 years ago
"Hath not the potter power over the clay to make one vessel unto honour and another unto dishonour?" (Rom 9:21)
"...I am nothing but dust and ashes," (Gen 18:27)
"Though seeing, they do not see" (Matt 13:11)
"Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the sinful nature with its passions and desires." (Gal 5:24)
"I will open my mouth in parables, I will utter hidden things" (Psalm 78:2)
It seems to me that crucifying one's sinful nature (Gal 5:20) prepares the mind ...
Rybot9000 3 years ago
as the parable of the sower (Matt 13:1-32) for understanding truly what the whole point of the text is.
Free-Will is never given credence in the Bible so far as I am aware and repeatedly refers to the opposite. For example:
"...no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father" (John 6:65)
It often reads to me like a refutation of Gods, and a case for Reality. Supplanting "Reality" with "God" and spinning some fancy poetry around it.
Rybot9000 3 years ago
and about religions...
if you're pulling this crap just because your thinking its made up from the bible. well should you know that bible is crap.
and the way it work is MUCH MORE SIMPLE.
here it is. religions prophets listen to a group of people beliefs.
then those prophets make claims, write bibles and ultimatly take manipulate the people belief system wich make them hold on each another. they distort it in a way to take control over population.who do you think the pope is really.
monsterrun 3 years ago
you're complicating things way too much.
you just need to belive that things can be easy and dosn't need full fuck up scientific explication.
don't you realise that most of the answer we are looking for are much more simple then they often look like.
always trying to make things more complicated can actually lure you into doubt.
and you should know doubt is the balance.
it can pull you to the right side or just push you down the dark side. just don't think too much. its dengerous.
monsterrun 3 years ago
humans have to do choices every 30 seconds.(average) guess the probabilitys!
when you make a choice. w/e is the choice. you condamn the other choice to have never existed.
there's multiple realms that build the universe. there's what we call reality wich is shattered in over 500 billions dimensions.
we have dream realm. where you fell what you whant to fell. everything is good,no pain.
nightmares: same as dream except you are forced into a scenario and fear,hate,terror dominate the grounds.
monsterrun 3 years ago
Don't believe in God? Okay.
Don't believe in free will? All respect before you, before I even know you, gone. lol
MyLegendarySelf 3 years ago
It would be much more helpful if you could explain why you think free will exists or why you disagree with the points made in my video. Send me an email if it won't fit in the comments section.
Albert10110 3 years ago
I wasn't aware you made legitimate points, having watched the video. Maybe if you did, I'd try to formulate an argument against yours, but how can I when none exists?
MyLegendarySelf 3 years ago
MyLegendarySelf: My main point is that there is no effective difference between having free will and a deterministic system that is so complex as to be completely unpredictable. So this question of if free will exists is not nearly as important as it is usually credited as.
Albert10110 3 years ago
Maybe that seems reasonable to you? I don't know.
So your argument is that we just think we're choosing things but we're actually being randomly manipulated and chemically brainwashed into thinking we're making decisions? Please tell me I misunderstood you.
MyLegendarySelf 3 years ago
MyLegendarySelf: Say I choose vanilla over chocolate as a preferred flavor. If free will exists, I chose it of my own free will. If determinism is true, every mental action I took leading up to choosing vanilla still felt like my own choice. I say that free will is not an important question, because either way our experience and consciousness is the exact same.
Albert10110 3 years ago
Oh, I see. You are confused to what free will is.
Your preferred flavor is not chosen. That is not free will. You can't control which flavor you choose.
Free will is choosing either cone regardless of your preference, or any other factor--it's simply the ability to, to put it simply, make a conscious act of the will..
I chose to put two periods at the end of the sentence above this one. I removed it once, and then I put it back. I am in control of my will, and I chose every word I used here.
MyLegendarySelf 3 years ago
free will does matter. in fact it's a revolutionary idea.
leephysics 3 years ago
did you watch the video?
AshNekoBoy 3 years ago
yes, several times.
leephysics 3 years ago
I'm not sure if "revolutionary" would be the right word, it's one of the oldest philosophical questions out there.
And I didn't mean the concept did not have an impact. The point in my video is that there is no difference between free will being real or an illusion.
Albert10110 3 years ago
I agree the ability to feel "free" is real. I used to feel it myself. It's a powerful adaptation we acquired through evolution. but the understanding we are not free is an even more powerful adaptation, or skill.you can't say there is no difference between illusion of free will and to truly have "free will." it might feel similar but it's different. Ok, you agree it had an impact, thats kinda what I meant revolutionary.
leephysics 3 years ago
leephysics: How is a perfect illusion of free will and actual free will it different? I think there is no difference, which is why proving that "free will" (however you define it) exists has been so impossible.
Albert10110 3 years ago
"How is a perfect illusion of free will and actual free will it different?" there is no difference. I agree. but, we don't have a perfect illusion. I can break the spell by simply telling you you don't have it.
leephysics 3 years ago
knowing we don't have free will does change our behavior! this is obvious.
leephysics 3 years ago
somebody needs to watch fight club
melvann 3 years ago
ok so correct me if im wrong but ur argument
that free will doesn't matter is because the
alternative is random probabilities which you
think aren't concrete but in fact make up our day to day lives in the form of choice and emotion ....... thats it
NIAfan2 3 years ago
NIAfan2: I think free will doesn't matter because even if it doesn't exist, we still have a perfect illusion of it that works just as well as if we did have free will.
Albert10110 3 years ago
you're exactly right. i would very much appreciate your views and all comments on my video response (God's Flaw) once approved.
Dom0ne 3 years ago
you have a very good point with the whoel "does it really matter" but i don't entirely agree with that thinkign this to be true or not will have no effect, simply because in that whoel determenistic system knowledge of soemthing also acts as part of the system, i can say from personal experience that beleiving that a person can't have freewill made my life alot more calm and less streesfull, and it's fun to debate and think about, whenever you actually find people that care XD
awwurdead 3 years ago
you just copied 80% of this from "waking life" the movie exactly.
Then the other parts from other people.
I think its funny when people try to sound smart by copying other people. Think for yourself.
afskater182 3 years ago
afskater182: From WL: "So now you might be tempted to just ignore the question, ignore the mystery of free will. Say 'Oh, well, it's just an historical anecdote. It's sophomoric. It's a question with no answer. Just forget about it.'"
I suppose the 80% I copy doesn't include the completely opposite conclusion and argument I am making? Also, "Waking Life" wasn't the first to propose these arguments and analogies either.
Albert10110 3 years ago
You copied more that one part also. I'm not saying you can't say something similar, but you shouldn't say something word for word, and act as such that its your own words.
afskater182 3 years ago
I've posted links to transcripts of both this video and that scene from Waking Life in this video's description.
Afskater182, you claim that I "copied 80%" and some of it "word for word". Point out where exactly I do this. If you can find even more than a handful of phrases, I'll cede to your point.
Albert10110 3 years ago
there are almsot no new philosophical ideas that are original, and there are alot of good points that he brings up that the movie does not include
awwurdead 3 years ago
yeah of course there is not.
I'm saying you shouldn't copy something word for word. you have to agree with that.
afskater182 3 years ago
yeah and he doesn't do that... he might share some ideas but what he sais is entrily in his own words
awwurdead 3 years ago
this an absurd debate.
He does do that, why I say that if he didn't? have you even seem waking life? if you have then you should be a able to hear that was copied word for word.
afskater182 3 years ago
afskater182: For a second time, I'm telling you I have the scripts of my video and the script of the "free will" scene from Waking Life posted in the video description. Point out where I copy it, "word for word".
Albert10110 3 years ago
yes i've seen it and he even said to you some 6 times that he has the two scripts maybe you shoul wagtch it yourself and read the scripts intead of being a dumbass
awwurdead 3 years ago
Only it does matter, as no free will means no right and wrong, a conclusion which inevitably affects ones thinking. Good video though.
newsam4neworld 3 years ago
I believe the point of the video was to illustrate that whether you believe your actions are merely reactions of cause and effect, or plucked from infinate possibilities a la free will, your descision of "Should i wear the green shirt or the red shirt today" won't change.
Determinism does not necessarily infer a lack of morality. I personally believe that the universe is science and thoughts are causal reactions... but I am a secular humanist, believing ethical actions are *essential* to life.
Obsidianorb 3 years ago
Is free will endowed or intrinsic to humanity ?
Can one lose ones free will ?
Is there free will in Heaven ?
Is there free will in Hell ?
Does God have free will ?
What prompted God to create ?
free will ?
random chance ?
Lohitaksha 3 years ago
Dont open your mind so much your brains fall out. External and internal forces influence our decisions but it's up to each individual to act or not to act. It is through free will and determination that you will pass or fail at whatever activity you have chosen to endeavor. Have you ever wondered why only the young college age types question free will? Probably the same ones who would never claim responsability for misdeeds as a teenager.
dedes016 3 years ago
I remember like it was yesterday the moment I realized that is was possible that I had nothing to with my past present and future. It was very enlightning until I realized I still had to get up and go to work because the bills still needed to be paid and I was responsable for paying them. Choices, get up or not get up. lol
dedes016 3 years ago
good shit man, just finished the video, haha.
AndrewDewittBaker 3 years ago
the only reason the bible mentions free will is to keep christians in line, as long as they think they have a choice, as long as they think their fate for eternity is in their hands, they will continue to eat up the christian bullshit, and will continue to try to love god. especially when you add in the fact that they could die tomorrow. it's a trap, simple as that, a trap.
AndrewDewittBaker 3 years ago
its funny, these videos. people are so damn obsessed with figuring out "why". why we're here, why we're so intelligent, why we're aware, if we're a divine species, etc.. it's kind of humorous. why can't people just live? i guess that's just too much to ask.
AndrewDewittBaker 3 years ago
that would be nice, but we need answers to have a better life quality
ds9roa 3 years ago
Great aspect Quentin Sorry Al
I do agree this whole freewill is just a philosophical abstract idea (in the religious sense)
However I do not believe I make the choices I do because of of a series of binary numbers computing what I will do next
I believe it is much more simple than that
I (we) am a social animal
I do what is best for my social group as a mechanism for survival
Evolution programed me to act 'human' simply for survival
Psychopaths require a different explanation totally
666daedsidog 3 years ago
I have free will
It requires conscious awareness of the number of possibilities
open to one
It can be hard to exercise it but it is possible
JudeHider 3 years ago
Great presentation, however the question of free will matters very much. Comprehending that human free will does not exist helps to destroy moral anger, hate, pride, etc. Such an insight has practical consequences and is therefore an important non-free step in the advancement of the human species. Higher levels of consciousness are important. Perhaps your materialistic worldview has blinded you to this?
zorasterman 3 years ago
"Higher levels of consciousness"
"non-free step"
"advancement of the human species"
These kind of platitudes show a pithy misunderstanding of how philosophers of science try to address issues, and a sturdy willingness to reach greedily for the Kool-Aid ("spirituality").
psymon208 3 years ago
Which of the three platitudes do you deny after reviewing evidence from the past 200,000 years?
Anyway, here's a nice little quote to ponder:
"This awareness of the lack of free will keeps me from taking myself and my fellow men too seriously as acting and deciding individuals, and from losing my temper. Albert Einstein
zorasterman 2 years ago
Have you ever really thought about consciousness? Consciousness is not physical, nor can it be 'proved' scientifically, yet we know it exists. If you were to die tomorrow how would science 'prove' you existed? And I don't mean your body, but you - your personality? We can't see consciousness and we can't touch it. How do we even know for sure it dies when the body does? If science has no method for proving its existence, how can it prove it ceasing to exist? I believe this is the realm of God.
Ripleytee 3 years ago
Ripleytee: Consciousness IS physical, we know it is physically rooted in the brain, though details are lacking. But amputating a limb or having a heart transplant doesn't change personality, so we can know that personality doesn't reside there. But we know that brain injury, alcohol & drugs all physically affect our brains and also affect our conscious awareness of the world (often distorting it).
Just because we lack many details does not mean consciousness is entirely shrouded in mystery.
Albert10110 3 years ago
I disagree, consciousness is NOT physical. Here is the dictionary definition:
-of or pertaining to that which is material: the physical universe; the physical sciences.
-noting or pertaining to the properties of matter and energy other than those peculiar to living matter.
-pertaining to the physical sciences, esp. physics.
Anyway, you didn't answer my question. How can you prove your mind/consciousness exists without witness or record?
Ripleytee 3 years ago
False dichotomy - it's not "you" OR "your body". "You" is the pronoun we give to perceived intentional agents (this is why we refer to "corpses" as such, because there're no agents), and there's absolutely NO REASON to assert offhand, without evidence (indeed, the very idea of evidence can't be even conceived in such a circumstance), that such an intentional agent can survive the death of the physical body "it" inhabits and go "somewhere else" as opposed to just being annihilated.
psymon208 3 years ago
DJLorenzen 3 years ago
test
DJLorenzen 3 years ago
Maybe human beings are physical manifestations that result in free will.
I mean the events that lead to our ultimate decision could not result in any decision if we didn't exist. So maybe the free will is just our presence in the universe.
We choose things and cause events to occur that would never happen normally had we had not been here.
Freewill may not be a a "decision" we make but a situation our presence creates.
Maybe life is a reflection of free will of matter? dunno
trentspencerktm 3 years ago
I agree with every word! Couldn't have put it better myself.
Wishchrono 3 years ago 2
simply brilliant!
satanstoolshed 3 years ago 2
Hey, everyone. Check out my channel. I tricked it out since I posted here last. But I'll still be changing my top vids.
RickeyRamone 3 years ago
...Shoulda been:"Free will matters cuz *its* existence and nature..."
Sorry-grammar...
RickeyRamone 3 years ago
Free will matters cuz it's existence and nature is an interesting question. And the last sentence of the vid: "Life is still pretty much what you make it" is an affirmation (and I believe a correct one) of what out perceptions tell us: Free will exists. QM phenomena cut the deterministic chain so free will is possible. How this works-just how free will comes to be, is an exciting frontier of human knowledge.
RickeyRamone 3 years ago
No, spirituality is not the copout, materialism is. You have no accountability because all your actions are determined. Free will exists, because you must *act* *as if* it exists. If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, then it's a duck. Duh.
Braveheart6642 3 years ago
Braveheart6642: This is exactly why I say free will doesn't matter. This concept or abstraction of free will definitely exists, in the sense that we make choices and decisions all the time. But determinism (which physics and biology at least seem to point to) would say that matter will play out in a way that we have no say over. Either way, free will still walks and quacks like a duck, even if it really isn't a duck.
Albert10110 3 years ago
not really, that saying is pretty misleading. If another animal similar to a duck existed (like a goose) with a similar quack and a similar walking pattern you could still mistake for a duck.
Just because something look, acts and sounds like you think it would doesn't mean that's actually the answer.
I could make a robot that walks, quacks and looks like a duck, doesn't make it a duck.
Teamrocketgg 3 years ago
Great video! You are one of my favorite youtube atheists and quite possibly the most influential to my understanding of the universe. Thanks for these!
Rkelly22 3 years ago
It would seem that the illusion is incomplete.
youmeandsomeknives 3 years ago
image god knowing in advance about the horrors of the world wars and doing nothing to stop it.
doesn't he have free will to stop it?
ukidding 3 years ago
As you say (or mean to say), 'imagine god'.
Imagine whatever you wish.
Rules - peramaters of conduct - benefit/negative-benefit. Make a descision.
Free-will? No. Important? Yes.
youmeandsomeknives 3 years ago
That's pretty much exactly what I have come to think about free will. It's nice to see someone else reach a similar conclusion.
ocarinak 3 years ago
Al.. love your stuff. Google 'hyperdiscordia free will' It's an amusing take on the entire free will argument.
jesterspace 3 years ago
Nowhere in the Bible (at least) does it promise an afterlife of "heavenly bliss". Your ignorance of religion is profound.
steve0281 3 years ago
steve0281: Enlighten me. What does the Bible say about Heaven and life after death?
Albert10110 3 years ago
What it does say is that Heaven exists. There is more than one. Paradise is different from Heaven. There will be a Resurrection where people will be reunited with their bodies. It does not, however, promise an eternity of bliss and idleness. Thanks for being fair. The quality of your videos are well above average. You have a good voice for presenting as well.
steve0281 3 years ago
Even if the Bible doesn't promise an afterlife of heavenly bliss, this afterlife concept is pretty popular and strongly associated with Christianity.
The religion is more than the contents of the Bible (ask a Catholic).
Don't be rude to a guy that you recognize is fair and even-tempered when it comes to such a heated topic. Calling his ignorance "profound" is mean-spirited.
ampenergy 3 years ago
Any mistaken beliefs my fellow believers may have is of no consequence. It merely reflects how ill-informed most people are on the subject. My particular Faith doesn't rely exclusively on the teachings of the Bible as well. I did not intend my comment to be "mean spirited", but I was not about to call him "stupid" either, as he abviously is not. He chose to speak on a topic sounding as if he were claiming authority in it. As one who knows better I was merely calling him on it. My apologies.
steve0281 3 years ago
What was the name of the computer/entity that knows all?
And what did it have to do with anything?
Hexus13th 3 years ago
poor, i agree that free will isn't as important but the argument you are using can be applied to anythgn "you don't care and you are just gonna live ur life as if determinism isn't true" eventhough you cannot disprove it.
Paraz1tul 3 years ago
free will does not exist because we are infuenced by chemical and electrical impulses we have no control over.
monkeyjeebusx420 3 years ago
god/allah my ass. they say read the bible, but the bible doesn't explain anything. i'm watching this vidoe because i have free will and god/allah/jesus does't have that type of power to control me.....your a nice kid. nice video
ancientprotecter 3 years ago