Winner and third very good horses. The rest of the field have clocked up a post Epsom total of 42 runs and just TWO wins: Buzzword in the German Derby and Hot Prospect in a handicap at Haydock.
@comeonshayman Are you for real? You dont have the best horses in the world right now bud. Australasia has the two best horses in the world today. The wonderful blackcaviar imo the best sprinter of all time. And one of the most naturally talented middle distance horses of all time the mighty So You Think.
@SoulSurvivor79 I suppose you still stand by So You Think one of the most natural talented eh?? over rated mate workforce will destroy SYT easily very easily
@fowlergod09 wow, you sound like the biggest dick head ever, even with a pace maker settin it up for WF he couldnt beat our champ, maybe work force is over rated?
I certainly don't think anyone was going to beat Workforce on this day. Because he was even more impressive in winning this race as he was in winning the Arc De Triomphe, IMO. But I do have to wonder if Aidan O'Brien really picked the best horse that he could've sent to Epsom in Jan Vermeer? I've often wondered if Cape Blanco or even possibly Joshua Tree wouldn't have fared much better in this race than Jan Vermeer ended up faring?
@BigPetrov You are missing out on the best spectacle in racing - National Hunt. On dirt Americans have a huge advantage but Ravens Pass did win the BC classic a few years ago on AW. On turf we have the best horses. Our horses go over there because theres so much money on offer at a time when theres no good flat races in Europe. but the Arc is chosen over any USA race. Why are your courses all 0 shaped? Mike Smith won a maiden & lester piggot the best ever! Frankel is best in world at the mo!
@BigPetrov You cant say America has the best races because that is utter bullsh*t. We have the most watched horse race in the world THE GRAND NATIONAL! hundreds of millions of people watch it worldwide. England also has the best 3year old race The Derby. We also have the ORIGINAL triple crown, 2000 Guineas, Derby, St Leger. Can your races be traced back to 1776? Shergar was so famous he was stolen and held for ransom. Red Rum and Arkle are household names for being so great.
@BigPetrov and @comeonshaymen can we all just calm down. Nobody can tell me that Mike Smith didn't give Zenyatta the worst ride of the year in last years BC. Why do your jockeys have to have horses so far off the pace? You don't see Ryan Moore or Kieran Fallon doing that! In recent years the Irish have been the best breeders (although it pains me to say it being English). Galileo, Rock Of Gibraltar, Azamour, Saddlers Wells, etc. But Dansilli and Dubawi bred over here. Oh, and STS was Irish bred.
LOL these arguments are hilarious from both sides. This is an Epsom Derby vid and we're talking about The Battle of Midway and how American horses only can run on drugs? I'm lol'ing. All countries that produce racehorses have great ones. Hell, Invasor came from Argentina of all places. Cigar was great, Nashwan was great, each racing country has their greats. No point in arguing. Sheesh.
@BigPetrov Sure some of our horses are foreign bred as are some of every nations but that doesn't matter when it comes to training. What the f**k are American tactics these days - my arse could plan a race better. Zenyatta's rides and Animal Kingdom last time out. Look at the class of Paul Hanagan, Ryan Moore and Tony McCoy - the best NH jockey ever. When it comes down to the people i'd rather have a European anytime. Oh, about 80% of all thoroughbreds can be traced back to Eclispe - (UK bred)
@CharlesOlney23 Zenyatta didn't lose because of a bad ride, she lost because she's an overrated piece of shit that beat no one, including 3rd rate Gio Ponti, and then lost to a slightly better horse in Blame (who's no Tiznow or Ghostzapper). Smith is one of the best and just won a race in the UK, but his mount was way overblown. Yes, AK should have been taken up earlier in the race and he'd stil be on for the TC, though the run was huge. Johnny V. won on a UK horse yesterday at G2 in Belmont.
@CharlesOlney23 Of course you'd go with a European, you're from the UK, but really the best Jockeys have come form the US - Chris McCarron, Eddie Arcaro, Bill Shoemaker, Gary Stevens, Velasquez, Albarado, Ron Turcotte (Canada but raced in US), G. Gomez etc...Eclipse was vital, but the US took over in breeding the best, and they host the most exciting and spectacular races in the world - that's why the Euros keep coming over.
@CharlesOlney23 I forgot to mention one of the greatest jockeys of this century in my last comment - Mike Smith (almost 5000 wins), who has been victorious in major races in the US, Canada and the UK (Irish 2,000 Guineas).
@BigPetrov I'd just like to point out that technically, all Thoroughbred racehorses were originally English. The breed being created in England, so any other argument can technically be null and void, as the American 'great's' owe their lineage to England, and even farther back to the Arab countries with their Arabian horses, as do all Thoroughbred horses. Quit whining and just enjoy the race god.
@xxburnyoudown I came on here to watch the great grandson of Mr. Prospector win a race, and then I see these monkeys below putting down US races and horses - so naturally I responded. Yes, England created the Thoroughbred breed back in the 18th Century, but the Americans took over in impressive fashion. The horse is in the blood of Americans - he brought them to the new world and helped them colonize.
@CharlesOlney23 Actually, it's the English garbage trainers who have to deal with crappy milk horses on a daily basis, except those worth watching, who were either bred in the US, like Dancing Brave and Giant's Causeway, or have US/Canadian sires or grandsires, like Nijinsky, Sea Bird and Sea the Stars. Every other horse racing there is not even worth a piece of shit. Who was Workforce's grandsire? Kingmambo, sired by Mr. Prospector - AMERICAN BRED.
The Australian media has to stop focusing so much on American racing and start showing the English classics. How good was this? So much better than watching the Kentucky Derby where all the horses looked the same because they were covered head to toe in dirt.
People, people, people... Is there really any need for all this?? We come here to watch a great racehorse win the Derby.. Not read a full blown argument and insults (although it is all rather funny! ;) ) The Americans can't help it if they are full of their own crap and can't admit they're wrong so they have to bring in something else e.g the war and winter olympics.. which has nothing to do with racing! I'm surprised that cernuous can actually FIT in America seeing as his head is so big!
Workforce going on to win the Arc De Triomphe and Rewilding going on to win the Great Voltigeur and the Sheema Classic really make's those two look like the real class horses in this race, IMO.
@GBeret83 i totally agree, jan vermeer went off hot favourite, but has hardly been heard off since. strongly fancy khalid abdullah to take the honours again this year with henry cecil's world domination.
@000aXeL000, World Domination also made a big believer out of me in his maiden win over 1m 3f at Newbury. Looked a class act in that race. Although it was a maiden field. Anxious to see him in a stakes race against better company prior to the Epsom Derby. But there's no doubt he'll stay the 12f trip at Epsom.
Workhorse , beautiful, is he an irish horse? wish he would race in U.S. If he came to N. America, his value and fame would go up, and the people would love it.
@Pillian Wow you made your point without a snobby word. My point is ,a country doesn't have to be Ireland to get that one horse, maybe one in 50 years,that is the best horse in the world, call It a fluke,whatever. But acknowledge that horse for what it is.Secretariat was born in Kentucky (U.S.) but he had a Canadian connection, Canadians had a great affection for him.Maybe we think differently about horses in N. America. where does (my horse is better than yours) comes from?
It seems to me that you're just on here to annoy people actually pal. Not sure what your point is anymore. My main point is that European but more specifically, Irish horses are seen around the world as being the cream of the cream of thoroughbreds. That's simply a fact. Not sure why you have to resort to calling me a snob and offend everybody else on here. Smacks of an inferiority complex. I
So tell me babygotback, what is secretariats lineage? Is he from an Irish grandsore??? Nasrullah? Pretty sure he is. Besides give me nijinsky or galileo any day. The only people in the world who think that American race horses are the best in the world are Americans! What a fucking surprise.
@babygotback519 I think you love your horses in America we have been obsessed with racing in England for hundreds of years and the Royal family, especially her majesty the Queen! There was a great finish the the Oaks at Epsom a great filly called Snow Fairy won but he comes from way off the pace but he finds a lot of traffic but just gets through at the end. racing in Dubai is oil money but the Sheiks have a philanthropic approach to breeding and racing and they have helped racing a lot.
Workforce's triumph in this little romp does not disguise the lamentable state of Britains horse racing bloodstock. If it were here these deplorable "gasless" hacks would be pulling carriages around Central Park...... probably with great difficulty.
@cernuous Idiots aren't allowed on youtube,so get back where you belong.Either on the Biyou with Forrest Gump or playing with the moose you hillbilly.Uneducated dimwit's with no knowledge whatsoever of the world of horse racing.GREAT Britain has 7 of the top 14 rated horses on the planet and 2 of the top 3.Thank God steroids aren't ruining our breed.
@guitarlegend32 , "Evidently "Idiots" do run rampant on YouTube....you're here. We have something called the Breeders Cup, a very important two day international event contested by only the very best of horseracings bloodstock. Britains perennial lack of success is only rivaled by your history of World Cup competition, which is to say....deplorable. British horseracing bloodstock no matter how you attempt to frame it is incapable of competing internationally. 4 of the top 5 actively raced
champions are American bred. Warped statistics thankfully don't count, only success in competition. Which is something you folk's clearly do not have....at least not here.
@cernuous ...and Irish breeding industries go hand in hand and have produced 12 of the last 15 worldwide champions.Not bad for an industry that' washed up and relying on the junkies that the U.S produces.When you digest this post Forrest,come back with a reply that's at least spelt correctly and worthy of the good ole' U.S of A. YEEEE HAH!
@guitarlegend32 , Judging by the content and the extent of your reply, obviously you're an out of control British "nut", unwilling to accept that your horseracing industry offers little competitive challenge on the international stage. In spite of your historical outburst, British horseracing bloodstock in the United States is largely viewed as a depleted almost spent force incapable of offering the remotest rivalry at championship levels. We attract the very best of world competition
contending for the highest purses..... British horses are seldom triumphant. Now I know it's difficult for you to accept or quantify this, which is the reason I alluded to Englands ineptitude in World Cup soccer competition. But the statistical data relative to British horseracing success here is the equal to the level of embarrassment suffered by you folk's in international soccer. Britain simply offers little to no competition. Now I await your child like response.
@cernuous Is that the best you can do?Please inform me the statistical data on U.S runners in G.B.Like I said we have had 12 horses in the last 15 years which are considered the BEST.You offer no argument whatsoever to my other points which I suppose is as predictable as your one dimentional racing.'The very best of International competition'?.Such as who?We won this years BCT this year as ever with a horse who litteraly wouldn't be allowed to compete in a British group 1.If you have no....
@guitarlegend32 Still one sporting sphere Great Britain and Ireland dominate the world: thoroughbred racing. It will be no surprise once again in 2011 to see a dozen of the top 20 rated flat horses coming from the home nations. Sea The Stars, Harbinger and now Frankel, horses NO American over the period could get within 10 lengths of. He has one point, though, about prize money - our lower grade racing is criminally underfunded considering the betting turnover it generates.
@thespacialone Totally agree on the state of the levy via the bookies,it's a disgrace.My point to Forrest Gump is correct regards Sea The Stars.The problem here is that there is too much prize money for our top races but nowhere near enough filtering down to the lower grades.The yanks are over patrioric and take for granted for some reason that their breed is somehow superior to European horses.The reliance on steroids brings the sport into disrepute and 'infects' a natural breed.There is one..
@guitarlegend32 A lot of graft, not enough cash. Betfair getting £5m avrg matched on premiership games now, but no real cash injection into the game. That's fine, they don't need it. But if you got 100 "low grade" races a week, each generating them, say, £15k, that's £75m profit over a year. As they, and the fixed odds layers, make more money from the lower grace stuff than the topflight races, they should stump up, with more generous/frequent sponsorships. Circa £2k prize money is a joke
@guitarlegend32 You're right about the drug thing. Like most American sports it's become institutionalised. Although our game is not entirely straight I don't think it's an issue for us. Imo really takes the edge off of it, brings into questions trainers, can't appreciate a good training performance if you think roids could be really what's behind it. Plus it seems a bit samey over there. All the tracks the same, and the dirt too much favours hold up performers. Best regards, TSO
@thespacialone ..idiot on the BCC 2010 site who thought Harbinger,when I refered to him as the top horse this year,as the actual name of handicapping in this country,the equivelent of their Beyer Speed Ratings!! Their ignorance is an embarrasment.
@thespacialone Don't know who you are but you sure think your're special. It's strange but English horses don't win in America. The difference between England and America is ,when America sees a champion no difference what country,they see a champion. tTo England it can't be a champion unless its English. Ask the Queen how many horses in her stable are from Secretariat, the Queen bypasses the president and goes to Kentucky to the breeding farms. I guess those American horses win over there.
@thespacialone Guess where all American Thoroughbreds originate from if trace them back a couple of generations?
Yes the lower grade races are seriously underfunded. I would like to see Bookmakers and Betting exchanges putting in more money for theses races out of there millions and millions of profit each year, A couple of hundred grand would not even dent their profits etc. Millions spent on advertising at Race courses could also be included, say about 3% or there abouts.
@MrNativeDancer I saw some bod from Betfair saying they were going to invest £3m over 3 years into specifically lower-grade UK racing on RUK about a week back - maybe the youtube walls have ears :) That's certainly a start. Yeah, I'm sure much more could be done, it certainly is in North America. Snooker seems to be benefited from more professional marketing and administration, maybe racing needs to follow suit.
@cernuous ....actual argument on the points I have raised(which for a yank is embarrasing),then please shut up.'The highest purses'?STS won more prize money in 9 races than Zenyatta did in her first 19 you moron.In the U.S there are 5 decent races per year,the massively overrated Triple Crown and a couple BC races that you assume foreign horses need to compete in to call themselves great.To be considered the best you have to race the best so get off your fat asses and travel over here.YEEEE HA!
@guitarlegend32, I think your abysmally poor record of success here in the United States speaks volumes for the present state of British racing bloodstock. Performance is the only quantifiable evidence; or as in your case Britains lack thereof; is the proof and and not your absurd references to Hyperion or anything else. Horseracing is largely subjective, which is the only point of counter argument you may have when explaining away Britains ineptitude in champion events contested here.
How sad, how terribly sad that the free falling Britain of to-day with it's undeniably rich history and traditions are held captive by primitives such as you. My goodness, no wonder you serve as the anvil for world mockery. I have formally dismissed you as a bizarre form of ill bred, British myopic crank, you will receive no further reply.
@cernuous You will be reading this reply though,so on behalf of all sane thinking GREAT Britains,go fuck yorself you obnoxious pile of paranoid shit.You haven't created a single argument against my FACTS.What the hell has a FOOTBALL(soccer,just sums you up Forrest)match or a Winter Olympics got to do with the Epsom Derby?The U.S is the most loathed nation on this planet and I can't wait for the Chinese to cash in the $1.2 trillion you owe them,therfore you will vanish.U.S-source of ALL evil.
@guitarlegend32, For example your dreadful performance in World Cup soccer competition is quantifiable. The results of Great Britains ineptitude in this years Winter Olympic Games at Vancouver is of equal proof of your countries diminished international competitive skills. 1 single medal versus 37 for us; while nations of the third world such as Slovakia, Belarus and Slovenia clearly trounced you. Such is not the stuff of champions. This level of incompetency pervades your entire country...
and has long effected your horseracing bloodstock. British bred racehorses are a standing joke here in the United States. Your juvenile references to "fat asses" and "Forrest Gump" only serves to illustrate the extent of Britains sad modern day implosion. Success in competition is the real test of a nation ....not namecalling.
@cernuous British bred racehorses are not a standing joke in the U.S., shame on you! If they have a champion,great, A finely trained champion at his peak is a glorious animal to behold, I don't care which country he's from. It's all about the horse. Swap insults if you want but I would love to see their champion run!
@cernuous Nations of the third world? Lol. Could you be any more blatantly provocative? The irony of the wind up obviously escapes you. Your country wouldn't exist if wasn't for the people you have such contempt for. Also all of your bloodstock descend from Eclpise, an English bred horse btw so your point really loses merit there don't you think? As for the mighty Nation of the United States? You're a bunch of refugees who couldn't hack life in these parts. Know your place.
@corny165 Damn this Eclipse DNA must be getting spread pretty thin.Pretty damn old too. With the contempt you have for the U.S. I wish we had let Hitler have every God Damn one of you, we'll know better next time .
@babygotback519 Ha. I'm not English btw. The Russians stopped Hitler get it right. I know that doesn't sit well with the capitalist ideology that pervades American culture but its true. The US' role in the war, like that of the English if we're honest, is completely overstated. The total War on the eastern front decided the conflict. Anyway, i don't have contempt for Americans just your completely UNJUSTIFIED smugness.
@cornybutt, Sure the Russians were so well represented in the battles of Midway, Leyte Gulf, Okinawa and Iwo Jima, they "saved" our "smug" U.S asses. But I digress, I might very well have overstated the impact of our war efforts effectiveness...... This is a video of a horserace you bimbo not a lesson in WWII historical mythology according to you. God, who are these bozo's.
@cernuous No one said the Russians saved the US. I said the Russians stopped Hitler. At the 'battle' of Midway the Japs lost 3,000 men. The Axis lost 800,000 men attacking Stalingrad. Nothing mythological in simple numbers. I didn't bring up the war either, i responded to a comment above. Anyway you are hardly in a position to lecture me on the fact that this is a horse racing video when you've brought up, without provocation, the Winter Olympics and the World Cup.... Touch on. Fuck face.
@cornybutt, Don't be absurd the battle of Midway was the greatest Air Craft Carrier Battle in history. It pitted the finest U.S plane carrying warships against those of Japan. We decimated the Japanese carrier fleet to the extent that they would only use their navy in defensive operations for the balance of the war. Why would you compare a naval battle with the attack on Stalingrad? We practically stood alone in the Pacific theater finally choosing to end the entire affair by a show of....
@cornybutt, Thank you for alluding to the Winter Olympics; this was clearly another superb demonstration of the United States athletic prowess. Incidently had the Liberation of Europe not gone according to plan, you can rest assured we would have liquidated Germany in much the same fashion as we decimated Japan.
@cernuous You're refugees pal. The history of your country is the history of people that left my country and the other the countries of Europe. A super race of refugees perhaps? LOLOL. Sure you're still being colonised by the dirty Mexicans ffs!
Anyway, thats enough. You're funny but you need to work on the wind ups. You're about as subtle as a sledgehammer.
@cornybutt, O'h go away, you're a time waster, one who's filled to the brim with racial epithets and silly stereotypical nonsense. Should "F- --k face" or "dirty Mexicans" be the sum total of your child like gibberish, I think you've clearly exposed yourself as an ignorant uneducated slob. Get lost you creep. God, who are these bozo's.
@AlexJones158 i wouldn't take it to heart mate. He's just some nameless fucker with time on his hands and who enjoys a wind up. The internet was made for cunts like him!
I actually think its funny someone would go out of their way to create multiple accounts and confess to having a wank over a bombing! Loneliness is a terrible thing. ha ha.
@cernuous Why the hell are you saying we did bad in the World Cup (Its called football not soccer), when you went out in the same round as us you HILLBILLY DICKHEAD
In America you dope youre horses They arnt fast without drugs
In Europe the top class horses run on turf so they have to extra durable, not like your stupid Yankee nags who run on dirt
I'm a massive racing fan but i dont give a shit about Kenfucky Derby, cos its shit
U are a typical deluded American. Nashwan wud destroy Secratariat
@comeonshaymen Who's Nashwan, you piece of shit Englishman? Your mediocre, dreary, depressing, garbage country has produced nothing to compare with the best from America. Great US horses like Secretariat, Spectacular Bid, Dr. Fager, Affirmed, Ghostzapper would destroy your donkeys. The only horses worth watching in the UK were bred where? In the US or Canada you sausage eating monkey: Nijinsky and Dancing Brave, or owed their talent to US sires, like Sea Bird. Burn in hell you filthy fuck.
@comeonshaymen You "dont give a shit about Kentucky Derby"? Well I don't give a shit about the Arc that has some filthy, muslim, raghead country as its sponser - and then the frogs fucking eat their horses when they're done with them!! At least big US races don't suck up to dirty arabs, or call their horses Dubai Gold (LOL!!!) The US has produced big winners on dirt AND grass, greats like Sec and Barbaro who won on both. Any Euro horse worth his salt was bred in the US, or has US sires. UK fuck!
Oh, and there has only ever been 1 horse called Dubai Gold, and he has only ran twice in point to points (doubt that u know what that means stupid hillbilly)
Zarkava is better than Zenyatta
Carlton House is better than Animal Kingdom
On dirt your nags would destroy us i admit
On turf we have the best horses ever
Our horses can JUMP too! I know strange concept. Not like your stupid retarded donkeys
@comeonshaymen Yes, I know your horses can JUMP, and break their necks too in the process! - then sent to a French butcher shop (LO!!). Did you read my last comment - I don't give a crap about Zenyatta, the overhyped overrated mare. Tiznow, Ghostzapper, Curlin, Smarty Jones, Barbaro, Alysheba: these are the US greats of the last two decades. Our best like Secretariat and Barbaro won on both dirt AND grass. Only "Dubai Gold"? - what about Dubai Celebration and Dubai Queen? Stinking arab suckups.
@BigPetrov Watch the 2010 Grand National. Best race ever. And your horses, there names make no sense. Mine That Bird. FTW???? Our best horses on the flat were Mill Reef, Nijinsky, Nashwan, Sea The Stars, Shergar and Harbinger. Over jumps, Red Rum, Arkle, Golden Miller, Hattons Grace, L'Escargot, Best Mate, Kauto Star, Denman, Exotic Dancer and Flyingbolt.
@comeonshaymen I said I was going to ignore your comments since my last post, but I'll make an exception. I came to this video because I read some good things about Workforce and wanted to see him run. The first thing I notice is people on here blasting American horses, trainers and races. Now, the most sensible thing to do would have been to continue watching the race and move on, but my emotions got the better of me and I got caught up in a useless argument. cont.
@comeonshaymen Unfortunately, my etiquette and my manners worsened with every post. It's safe to say that the US and UK have produced the finest TB's in history, and Canada too just for Nijinsky (possibly the greatest turf horse of all time) and his sire Northern Dancer (one of the finest dirt racers and sires ever). Our best of recent times were Secretariat (who won dirt and grass), Spectacular Bid, Dr. Fager, Affirmed, Tiznow, Smarty Jones, Curlin, Cigar and Ghostzapper.
@BigPetrov Well said. Europe and Ameica both have good horses. Sorry for the conflict between us. :) I guess racing is racing, Flat or NH, Dirt of turf, and we should enjoy it all.
@comeonshaymen I'm sorry too for the arguments that were getting really crazy towards the end! Two big races coming up - Epsom Derby tomorrow and Belmont next week. Well done to St. Nicholas Abbey for winning the Coronation Cup today.
@BigPetrov I have seen some of the horses you mention. For me, Dr Fager is the best one I have ever seen. I also saw Troy, Nijinsky, Il Tempo, Kingston Town, Secretariat, Tulloch and So You Think at the races. For me, Dr Fager is the greatest champion I have ever seen. You could see it in the crowd also. They knew they were witnessing something special. I would like to have seen Zenyatta. She is a special animal also.
@comeonshaymen Being originally Russian I should be more appreciative of European racing, and I actually am starting to become familiar with some of the greats from the UK and Europe (the reason I came on here)...and then things headed downhill a bit! I'm not too keen on the Grand National because of the fatalities that have occurred at that race (two this year), but do enjoy some of the smaller races with the smaller jumps.
@comeonshaymen How the hell is Carlton House better than Animal Kingdom? He's made what - 90,000 pounds so far in his career. He has talent, yes, largely due to his great grandsire being one of the best sires of all time (US bred Mr. Prospector), but he's not better than AK - who won on dirt despite being bred as a turf horse. Let them race on grass and we'll see who's better. I heard your Queen was trading horses with that dirty sheikh who used to condone child slaves for camel racing. Bravo!!
@BigPetrov I really dont have a clue what youre on about, you stupid retarded yank. Bravo. WTF?
At the moment, we have the best horses in the world. Frankel. St Nicholas Abbey. Carlton House. Overdose is European. On dirt too, Gitano Hernando was a turf horse in England before moving to RSA.
As for breeding, Animal Kingdom was out of an German mare, which is in Europe, but i doubt that stupid Americans would know that.
Carlton House hasnt won that much prize money because hes only ran 3 times
@comeonshaymen I know AK is out of a German mare, you stupid, fish-and-chip-eating, greasy refuse, but he was bred in the US. Was Sea Bird bred in America because he had a US sire, you stupid monkey? BRAVO TO YOUR QUEEN FOR TRADING HORSES WITH A FILTHY MUSLIM ARAB SHEIKH, WHO CONDONED CHILD SLAVES FOR CAMEL RACING. Ah, NOW your pea brain understood my previous comment. Your shitty country sucks up to dirty ragheads and your horses are subpar at best. I'm done with you, UK crap.
@BigPetrov Ah, a typical American shithead. YOU DONT REALISE THAT AMERICA IS THE MOST HATED COUNTRY IN THE WORLD. NO1 LIKES U, you shitty hillbllies. An Englishman (BTW We dont refer to ourselves as UK, u shithead. we r ENGLAND, SCOTLAND, WALES AND N.IRELAND) would admit that America have good horses, which i have.
U have good horses.
But our horses are better.
As for breeding, u sed that Carlton House was good beacus of his US grandsire
@cernuous ...breaking Dubai Millenium(rated 3lbs superior to your best,Cigar).When was the last time a 3yo in America even deserved to be in the same race as STS,Workforce or Zarkhava?Not one U.S 3yo in the last ten years has been rated within 6lbs of STS.There wouldn't even be racing of the thoroughbred in America at all but for G.B where every single animal was decended from in the late 1600's.Mustang racing with Billy the Kid is as close as you would be without us and there's more history..
@cernuous ...of ALL U.S horses.The reliance on us in the past regards breeding shows that going back only 5 generations there is British/European blood on both sides of the pedigree in EVERY U.S horse,Nearco being the best example,who's sire Pharos being a decendant of the magnificent St.Simon.Who's your greatest influence in breeding?Northern Dancer was CANADIAN and his sire Neartic was by Nearco from a British mare,Lady Angela by another of the great British stallions Hyperion.The British....
@cernuous 'The very best of horseracing bloodstock'?Such as who?The Breeders Cup is a steroid ridden bunch of cheats who in the words of John W.Amerman,the head of the U.S Jockey Club,has stated 'will take 50 years for the drug culture to be removed from OUR bloodlines'.Thank God OUR breeders are turning their backs and not 'infecting' the totaly natural state of British and European breeding.The Dubai WC has received no attention from our TOP horses since the best ever,track record.....
@cernuous ...in Newmarket alone than the whole of the U.S.The dirt garbage you race on has such little variety,more like Nascar with legs runnung around in circles.Greyhound racing at it's best - sprint from the stalls and the winner tires the least.I suppose your one of the dimwits who thinks the ninth best rated horse in the world in Zenyatta is the greatest horse who ever lived.You've had about 3 decent mares in your entire history,when we have 3 a season.Most of your shit summer grade 1's...
@cernuous ...need to be handicaps because the entire season revolves around the BC which is basically an afterthought for our very best horses.STS wouldn't lower himself to run in that shite.Where are the other International horses?Is it really that attractive?When are you pathetic cowards going to even enter a horse in the greatest historical race of all time - The REAL Derby.Faggots.All of your awards come from historical horses from OUR past,Eclipse,look him up,he's in the blood of over 90%..
I believe it wasnt the real workforce in the King George, it certainly wasnt the horse who won the Derby anyway. But did Cape Blanco not run his race either? Hard to say. I do think harbinger loved Ascot though and he might not have won that far on a different track. It was a huge performance nonetheless but i have to agree with you, that to rate that performance as better than Dancing Braves Arc is nonsense. But raitings are like opinions....
@cmcgarth1O I love ratings as an argument but would never use them from a beting point of view.On the question of the King George,I just don't beleive ANY of the defeated horses ran to anywhere near their best.Cape Blanco was running over a trip that I honestly don't think he gets and winning distances are excentuated when one horse is staying on and another weakening.The time was a track record but on a newly laid track.Youmzain?Clearly past his best.It is amazing the horses who adore Ascot...
Plenty to loo forward to for next season already. Workforce, Frankel, RVW, Twice Over, Canford Cliffs, Cape Blanco, So You Think.... makes for some classic racing. Apologies to amy ommitted, and any that have run their 6-10 races and retired ;)
Lingfield Derby Trial win or not? LOL. Given the show that Workforce put on this day, and an Arc De Triomphe win on top of that. I'll bet Prince Khalid Abdullah has to feel pretty silly looking back on this race now and seeing the pink cap on Bullet Train and the green cap on Workforce. LOL.
@SIDESLAM Could not agree more with you there. That is one Derby I will never forget. Anyone who says this was a poor Derby does not know what they are talking about. Workforce that was such a brave performance there! It didn't just look good he broke the track record aswell in the process!
I think he can, sure he had a shocker in the King george but thats racing, and had he won the King George he would not be the price he is for the Arc, lets hope for a run and a great run at that.
@GBeret83 Partly true, as said before the bit slipped through Workforces mouth in the Dante he could not get a breather in so was running on empty lungs.ask any one who knows about bits,trainers jockeys etc. So a viable reason for Dante defeat. That is not an excuse but genuine reason. You try running with out breathing see how far you can go! But anyway thats racing and these things happen. Cape Blanco and Workforce are two of the best horses I have ever seen.Both champions in there own rite!
@postcardterry, I think if you'll take a look at when I posted that comment. At the time, Workforce's only big win had been in the Epsom Derby. Cape Blanco had won the Dante, the Irish Derby, had outrun Workforce in the King George, and had single handed destroyed the form of the Juddmonte International Stakes by running Rip Van Winkle and Twice Over completely off of their feet in the Irish Champion Stakes. I'm pretty certain I made that comment pre-Arc De Triomphe.
@GBeret83 The Irish Champion form is suspect to say the least, any horse in front that day had a huge advantage. The fact that Sea lord was right next to Twice Over and Rip Van Winkle tells you it was a false race.
Workforce is a good horse but he won a weak Derby and a weak Arc, Harbinger would have destroyed him again if he had run in the Arc
@cmcgarth1O Why are you so confident Harbinger would have won the Arc?Soft ground would have been a disadvantage and ground is the most vital ingredient to any horse.Doesn't it at least make Workforce versatile and I really wouldn't be surprised if he won a top 1m 2f race next season.
@cmcgarth1O Ground is totally and utterly vital to any horse,very few go on everything.Would Dancing Brave won as he did in his Arc victory on softish going?No,because he wouldn't even have run,nor Sea the Stars.Stoute has always loved Workforce and had complete faith he would act on the going even having won the Derby on firm.Harbinger's one off brilliant King George victory to me doesn't deserve a 142 rating by Timeform.Seriously,better than the Brave and Sea The Stars who did it repeatedly?
@guitarlegend32 I know what your saying and i agree that a horses ultimate rating should not be judged on one performance but on its career as a whole. That said, Harbinger was a a typical stoute improver(cliched as it may be) but he was clearly an improved horse and he didnt get the chance to show if he could do it again. I see no reason why he wouldnt have continued to perform with such power and I think he would have won the Arc, just like I think Manduro would have.
@cmcgarth1O I adore Stoute improvers,which is why I am so looking forward to Workforce next year.He is the most imposing animal you could wish to see and was clearly protected by not running in the Breeders Cup Turf.All the same,there is no argument against your opinion of Harbinger,alas what else do we see other than performances on the track?I just have real difficulty rating him that highly when his opponents ran below their best in the specifiic contest.D Brave,Sea Bird etc were evaluated..
@cmcgarth1O ...Swain ran his best races there as did Doyen,who was virtually useless elsewhere and to reiterate to be given 142 when not producing anywhere near that previously and alas not given the chance elsewhere is as you say nonsence.
@cmcgarth1O ...on their performances when it was obvious that what they performed to was exact form.I.E no excuses.In essence,Timeform are saying that Harbinger would have beaten Dancing Brave in the 1986 Arc.Utter rubbish.Regards.
@guitarlegend32 Your just some lairy 15 year old whos first ever winner was Workforce so your determined to convince everyone hes great, take it from a man whos been watching racing for over 40 years, he isnt
@MANUTD4LIFE171 Your i.q isn't your age you dork.Convince EVERYONE asshole?It's only you who needs converting.WHO'S MR.BROOKS Dip shit.You know so much?Tell me all about him.Funny isn't it how you NEVER reply to what is written in front of you.SEA BIRD.Couldn't reply.Harbinger winning by 11 lengths running under 2.28,couldn't reply.Secretariat?Couldn't reply.Shergar beat nothing of any quality whatsoever.If he was that great why didn't he win a VERY,VERY poor Leger.You hold Stoute in such....
I'm in complete bewilderment as to this asshole's perception of times.He thinks there are many horses who would destroy a track record by 5 SECONDS.That like Usain Bolt running 100m in 8.5 seconds!!!!!!!!!!! What a uneducated,knowledgeless idiot.When Secretariat won the Belmont by 31 lengths,he beat the previous U.S best by only 1.2 seconds,yet this single race is one of the top three displays by a racehorse in the history of thoroughbred racing.This idiot think's it's possible for a horse to...
@Claudio1Cannigia i will be astounded and il hold my hands up, i spend hours daily studying the form of races trying to find winners, and ive spent ours on end trying to get my head round this Derby, there realy is no form that can suggest it is any better than mediocre, personaly i dont feel Workforce would have been in the first 3 of last years Derby, if you back him for the Arc then i wish you luck, but i honestly wouldnt back him at 200/1 for the Arc, i doubt he will ever win another G1
Workforce may have ran a fabulous Epsom Derby and set a new Epsom track record on this day. But he was made to look like a boy racing a man in the King George. Actually, Workforce, Cape Blanco, Youmzain, and Confront all looked like boys racing a man in Harbinger. Plus, he also made Daryakana look like a girl racing a man. JMO.
@GBeret83 Yes, indeed. I watched the King George several times. I cant come up with any logical answer as to how most of the field ran like they did. Obviously Youmzain keeps his best from for the Ark. Maybe Harbinger was something really special. He did make them look like boys. Shame he has been retired though. Who knows what he would of went on to achieve?
Workforce won a poor Derby. He beat a pacemaker by 6 lenghts. He will struggle to win a Group One again this season. Been with Sir Michael maby next season. Maby.
the derby form looked suspect when he beat the track record,????? i agree he is no way near shergar but still should of easily had enough to beet harbinger who has never even raced in a group1 so work that out.
thats ridiculous the derby form always looked suspect michael stoute is a highly talented and respected trainer, harbinger would have beaten anything hes improving all the time
todays race was the biggest scam in sporting history, micheal stoute has clearly done nothing with workforce since the derby , and soley concentrated on harbinger, he would not of even been close to workforce on his derby form, i honestly believe stoute has been tipped off by the bookies or harry herbert, i mean workforce should of improved on the derby win not gone backwards, as much as i love horse racing im afraid it is so corrupt., trainers should only be allowed to enter one horse per race.
@robbo1089 You are clueless he beat some 100/1 pacemaker who has since finished near enough last in his 2 recent starts in the Derby, Workforce is no were near good enough to beat Harbinger, the dante form is there in the book he finished near enough the same distance behind cape blanco in the dante as he did in the King George, Im afraid Workforce is more of a Kris Kin than a Shergar
@MANUTD4LIFE171 How would you compare how Harbinger was last year when he was the age Workforce is now? Watch Harbingers races last year. When he was Workforces age.
In the Dante the bit slipped through Workforces mouth, so he would not of been able to breath properly. The Derby took a lot out of Workforce it was a hard race for him. Infact it has taken a lot out of all the horses bar a few that ran in the race, hence no winners have came from the race.
@MrNativeDancer No winners have come from the race except buzz word because they were all rubbish, He has had 7 weeks rest more rest than any of the others who raced in the King George, Shergar won the Derby, Irish Derby and King George all in the space of 7 weeks by a combined distance of 22 lenghs was he tired, Workforce is a poor Derby winner and everyone knows it, that realy is all there is to it
@MANUTD4LIFE171 I wonder if you will be saying this next year when he returns as a proper 4 year old. hahaha I think people can right Workforce off at their own peral so to speak. The form of a lot of the Derby horses going into the Derby was quite solid, its just on that day on that ground it took a hell of a lot out of the horses. I rode the track years ago and know what the track is like.
Shergar was in a league of his own though wasnt he? Incredible performance that was.
@MANUTD4LIFE171 They have now, Hot Prospect won on Saturday, pretty decent race aswell. he was well beaten in this Derby so now at last the Derby form has been franked. I think quite a few of the Derby horses are starting to come back to form. So write them off at your own peril. I watched the Derby it was good race and a fantastic performance from Workforce End of Story Hot Prospect now backs that up as others will do aswell. Buzz word thats two winners now.
@MrNativeDancer Hot prospect won a very average handicap race, fair enough he won nicely, but it was against a bunch of handicap standard race horses, i hardly see how his win off a very low mark for a derby horse has in anyway enhanced the form of Workforces win, if he had won a group race then perhaps, but handicap racing, its only one step up from the all weather pal, Workforce is a shocking Derby winner, and i find it embarasing to the prestige of the race that a horse as poor as that won
@MrNativeDancer no racing pundit worth his salt takes notice of times, At First Sight ran an outstanding time quicker than Sea The Stars and New Approach, so he must be better than both if your theory works, Shergar was like 10 seconds slower as it was very soft but he would destroy Workforce with ease and Sir Micheal Stoute would tell you the same, Workforce was a mediocre winner and his Ascot run were he ran to form the same distance behind Cape Blanco as in the Dante proves this
@MrNativeDancer So Ryan Moores word is Gospel, ofcourse hes going to hail his first Derby winner, even if its just out of sentiment, the horse has just won you the Derby, thats the pinnacle for any jockey, hes not then going to say he doesnt think hes that good, name me a jockey who hasnt hailed his Derby winner, your argument is complete trype, that was his day and he ran well, i actually selected Workforce in my Tote ten to follow contest at the start of the season so dont think i dislike him
@MANUTD4LIFE171 You say my argument is trpe? Rip Van Winkle just won the Judmonte International. Rewilding just won the Great Voltageure. Like I said the Derby took a lot out of the horses they just need time. So far I have been proved right 4 times also we had a German Derby winner from the race aswell. And you where saying along with the rest of the sheep it was a poor Derby? Judmonte, a 40k Handicap, German Derby , and a Great Voltageure. Just proves how good that Derby really was AGAIN!
on a lighter note i had £25 on workforce @ 7-1 in the arc :)
tmc1881 5 months ago
Comment removed
worldrugbyhighlights 6 months ago
Winner and third very good horses. The rest of the field have clocked up a post Epsom total of 42 runs and just TWO wins: Buzzword in the German Derby and Hot Prospect in a handicap at Haydock.
Not what you'd call a vintage field, then.
tigerboy1966 6 months ago
unbelievable speed :)
Kayanite1 6 months ago
@fowlergod09 Easy very easy my friend! Workforce aye what happened?
SoulSurvivor79 6 months ago
@fowlergod09 I sure do, we will find out wont we. Hey bud where did plantuer finish the other day again?
SoulSurvivor79 7 months ago
fowlergod09 Just like you said plantuer would ? Workforce is a great horse. But you will see the real syt in his next start!
SoulSurvivor79 7 months ago
@comeonshayman Are you for real? You dont have the best horses in the world right now bud. Australasia has the two best horses in the world today. The wonderful blackcaviar imo the best sprinter of all time. And one of the most naturally talented middle distance horses of all time the mighty So You Think.
SoulSurvivor79 7 months ago
@SoulSurvivor79 I suppose you still stand by So You Think one of the most natural talented eh?? over rated mate workforce will destroy SYT easily
fowlergod09 7 months ago
@SoulSurvivor79 I suppose you still stand by So You Think one of the most natural talented eh?? over rated mate workforce will destroy SYT easily very easily
fowlergod09 7 months ago
@fowlergod09 wow, you sound like the biggest dick head ever, even with a pace maker settin it up for WF he couldnt beat our champ, maybe work force is over rated?
mozaus707 6 months ago
I certainly don't think anyone was going to beat Workforce on this day. Because he was even more impressive in winning this race as he was in winning the Arc De Triomphe, IMO. But I do have to wonder if Aidan O'Brien really picked the best horse that he could've sent to Epsom in Jan Vermeer? I've often wondered if Cape Blanco or even possibly Joshua Tree wouldn't have fared much better in this race than Jan Vermeer ended up faring?
GBeret83 7 months ago
@BigPetrov You are missing out on the best spectacle in racing - National Hunt. On dirt Americans have a huge advantage but Ravens Pass did win the BC classic a few years ago on AW. On turf we have the best horses. Our horses go over there because theres so much money on offer at a time when theres no good flat races in Europe. but the Arc is chosen over any USA race. Why are your courses all 0 shaped? Mike Smith won a maiden & lester piggot the best ever! Frankel is best in world at the mo!
CharlesOlney23 8 months ago 2
@BigPetrov You cant say America has the best races because that is utter bullsh*t. We have the most watched horse race in the world THE GRAND NATIONAL! hundreds of millions of people watch it worldwide. England also has the best 3year old race The Derby. We also have the ORIGINAL triple crown, 2000 Guineas, Derby, St Leger. Can your races be traced back to 1776? Shergar was so famous he was stolen and held for ransom. Red Rum and Arkle are household names for being so great.
CharlesOlney23 8 months ago
@BigPetrov and @comeonshaymen can we all just calm down. Nobody can tell me that Mike Smith didn't give Zenyatta the worst ride of the year in last years BC. Why do your jockeys have to have horses so far off the pace? You don't see Ryan Moore or Kieran Fallon doing that! In recent years the Irish have been the best breeders (although it pains me to say it being English). Galileo, Rock Of Gibraltar, Azamour, Saddlers Wells, etc. But Dansilli and Dubawi bred over here. Oh, and STS was Irish bred.
CharlesOlney23 8 months ago
LOL these arguments are hilarious from both sides. This is an Epsom Derby vid and we're talking about The Battle of Midway and how American horses only can run on drugs? I'm lol'ing. All countries that produce racehorses have great ones. Hell, Invasor came from Argentina of all places. Cigar was great, Nashwan was great, each racing country has their greats. No point in arguing. Sheesh.
1by1illknockuout 8 months ago
@BigPetrov Sure some of our horses are foreign bred as are some of every nations but that doesn't matter when it comes to training. What the f**k are American tactics these days - my arse could plan a race better. Zenyatta's rides and Animal Kingdom last time out. Look at the class of Paul Hanagan, Ryan Moore and Tony McCoy - the best NH jockey ever. When it comes down to the people i'd rather have a European anytime. Oh, about 80% of all thoroughbreds can be traced back to Eclispe - (UK bred)
CharlesOlney23 8 months ago
@CharlesOlney23 Zenyatta didn't lose because of a bad ride, she lost because she's an overrated piece of shit that beat no one, including 3rd rate Gio Ponti, and then lost to a slightly better horse in Blame (who's no Tiznow or Ghostzapper). Smith is one of the best and just won a race in the UK, but his mount was way overblown. Yes, AK should have been taken up earlier in the race and he'd stil be on for the TC, though the run was huge. Johnny V. won on a UK horse yesterday at G2 in Belmont.
BigPetrov 8 months ago
@CharlesOlney23 Of course you'd go with a European, you're from the UK, but really the best Jockeys have come form the US - Chris McCarron, Eddie Arcaro, Bill Shoemaker, Gary Stevens, Velasquez, Albarado, Ron Turcotte (Canada but raced in US), G. Gomez etc...Eclipse was vital, but the US took over in breeding the best, and they host the most exciting and spectacular races in the world - that's why the Euros keep coming over.
BigPetrov 8 months ago
@CharlesOlney23 I forgot to mention one of the greatest jockeys of this century in my last comment - Mike Smith (almost 5000 wins), who has been victorious in major races in the US, Canada and the UK (Irish 2,000 Guineas).
BigPetrov 8 months ago
@BigPetrov I'd just like to point out that technically, all Thoroughbred racehorses were originally English. The breed being created in England, so any other argument can technically be null and void, as the American 'great's' owe their lineage to England, and even farther back to the Arab countries with their Arabian horses, as do all Thoroughbred horses. Quit whining and just enjoy the race god.
xxburnyoudown 8 months ago
@xxburnyoudown I came on here to watch the great grandson of Mr. Prospector win a race, and then I see these monkeys below putting down US races and horses - so naturally I responded. Yes, England created the Thoroughbred breed back in the 18th Century, but the Americans took over in impressive fashion. The horse is in the blood of Americans - he brought them to the new world and helped them colonize.
BigPetrov 8 months ago
The Arguments below make me LOL LMFAO LOL WTF
MrNativeDancer 8 months ago
American's can't train for shit but then again they don't have good horses to train.
CharlesOlney23 8 months ago
@CharlesOlney23 Actually, it's the English garbage trainers who have to deal with crappy milk horses on a daily basis, except those worth watching, who were either bred in the US, like Dancing Brave and Giant's Causeway, or have US/Canadian sires or grandsires, like Nijinsky, Sea Bird and Sea the Stars. Every other horse racing there is not even worth a piece of shit. Who was Workforce's grandsire? Kingmambo, sired by Mr. Prospector - AMERICAN BRED.
BigPetrov 8 months ago
Or Nijinsky
comeonshaymen 8 months ago
The Australian media has to stop focusing so much on American racing and start showing the English classics. How good was this? So much better than watching the Kentucky Derby where all the horses looked the same because they were covered head to toe in dirt.
Constance861973 9 months ago
People, people, people... Is there really any need for all this?? We come here to watch a great racehorse win the Derby.. Not read a full blown argument and insults (although it is all rather funny! ;) ) The Americans can't help it if they are full of their own crap and can't admit they're wrong so they have to bring in something else e.g the war and winter olympics.. which has nothing to do with racing! I'm surprised that cernuous can actually FIT in America seeing as his head is so big!
Emilybacon91 9 months ago 6
Workforce going on to win the Arc De Triomphe and Rewilding going on to win the Great Voltigeur and the Sheema Classic really make's those two look like the real class horses in this race, IMO.
GBeret83 9 months ago
@GBeret83 i totally agree, jan vermeer went off hot favourite, but has hardly been heard off since. strongly fancy khalid abdullah to take the honours again this year with henry cecil's world domination.
000aXeL000 9 months ago
@000aXeL000, World Domination also made a big believer out of me in his maiden win over 1m 3f at Newbury. Looked a class act in that race. Although it was a maiden field. Anxious to see him in a stakes race against better company prior to the Epsom Derby. But there's no doubt he'll stay the 12f trip at Epsom.
GBeret83 9 months ago
Workhorse , beautiful, is he an irish horse? wish he would race in U.S. If he came to N. America, his value and fame would go up, and the people would love it.
babygotback519 1 year ago
To behold regardless of where it is from. I'm just saying that more of the greatest horses are European.
Pillian 1 year ago
@Pillian Wow you made your point without a snobby word. My point is ,a country doesn't have to be Ireland to get that one horse, maybe one in 50 years,that is the best horse in the world, call It a fluke,whatever. But acknowledge that horse for what it is.Secretariat was born in Kentucky (U.S.) but he had a Canadian connection, Canadians had a great affection for him.Maybe we think differently about horses in N. America. where does (my horse is better than yours) comes from?
babygotback519 1 year ago
I would agree with some of what you say, that a magnificent horse is a spectacle
Pillian 1 year ago
It seems to me that you're just on here to annoy people actually pal. Not sure what your point is anymore. My main point is that European but more specifically, Irish horses are seen around the world as being the cream of the cream of thoroughbreds. That's simply a fact. Not sure why you have to resort to calling me a snob and offend everybody else on here. Smacks of an inferiority complex. I
Pillian 1 year ago
Comment removed
babygotback519 1 year ago
So tell me babygotback, what is secretariats lineage? Is he from an Irish grandsore??? Nasrullah? Pretty sure he is. Besides give me nijinsky or galileo any day. The only people in the world who think that American race horses are the best in the world are Americans! What a fucking surprise.
Pillian 1 year ago
Comment removed
babygotback519 1 year ago
Comment removed
babygotback519 1 year ago
There are bigger prizes in Europe and Dubai than America
jnmklo9 1 year ago
@jnmklo9 How do you know? In America we appreciate a horse. It"s not just about the money. LMAO in DUBAI it's just to get horses to show up..
babygotback519 1 year ago
@babygotback519 I think you love your horses in America we have been obsessed with racing in England for hundreds of years and the Royal family, especially her majesty the Queen! There was a great finish the the Oaks at Epsom a great filly called Snow Fairy won but he comes from way off the pace but he finds a lot of traffic but just gets through at the end. racing in Dubai is oil money but the Sheiks have a philanthropic approach to breeding and racing and they have helped racing a lot.
jnmklo9 1 year ago
Comment removed
babygotback519 1 year ago
totally agree with guitar legend here, and unless this yank has any evidence to back up his statements then he can forget it.
irish horses are the best in the world and by some distance. followed by the english, then probably the french and then maybe the americans.
Pillian 1 year ago
Comment removed
babygotback519 1 year ago
Workforce's triumph in this little romp does not disguise the lamentable state of Britains horse racing bloodstock. If it were here these deplorable "gasless" hacks would be pulling carriages around Central Park...... probably with great difficulty.
cernuous 1 year ago
@cernuous Idiots aren't allowed on youtube,so get back where you belong.Either on the Biyou with Forrest Gump or playing with the moose you hillbilly.Uneducated dimwit's with no knowledge whatsoever of the world of horse racing.GREAT Britain has 7 of the top 14 rated horses on the planet and 2 of the top 3.Thank God steroids aren't ruining our breed.
guitarlegend32 1 year ago
@guitarlegend32 , "Evidently "Idiots" do run rampant on YouTube....you're here. We have something called the Breeders Cup, a very important two day international event contested by only the very best of horseracings bloodstock. Britains perennial lack of success is only rivaled by your history of World Cup competition, which is to say....deplorable. British horseracing bloodstock no matter how you attempt to frame it is incapable of competing internationally. 4 of the top 5 actively raced
cernuous 1 year ago
champions are American bred. Warped statistics thankfully don't count, only success in competition. Which is something you folk's clearly do not have....at least not here.
cernuous 1 year ago
@cernuous ...and Irish breeding industries go hand in hand and have produced 12 of the last 15 worldwide champions.Not bad for an industry that' washed up and relying on the junkies that the U.S produces.When you digest this post Forrest,come back with a reply that's at least spelt correctly and worthy of the good ole' U.S of A. YEEEE HAH!
guitarlegend32 1 year ago
@guitarlegend32 , Judging by the content and the extent of your reply, obviously you're an out of control British "nut", unwilling to accept that your horseracing industry offers little competitive challenge on the international stage. In spite of your historical outburst, British horseracing bloodstock in the United States is largely viewed as a depleted almost spent force incapable of offering the remotest rivalry at championship levels. We attract the very best of world competition
cernuous 1 year ago
contending for the highest purses..... British horses are seldom triumphant. Now I know it's difficult for you to accept or quantify this, which is the reason I alluded to Englands ineptitude in World Cup soccer competition. But the statistical data relative to British horseracing success here is the equal to the level of embarrassment suffered by you folk's in international soccer. Britain simply offers little to no competition. Now I await your child like response.
cernuous 1 year ago
@cernuous Is that the best you can do?Please inform me the statistical data on U.S runners in G.B.Like I said we have had 12 horses in the last 15 years which are considered the BEST.You offer no argument whatsoever to my other points which I suppose is as predictable as your one dimentional racing.'The very best of International competition'?.Such as who?We won this years BCT this year as ever with a horse who litteraly wouldn't be allowed to compete in a British group 1.If you have no....
guitarlegend32 1 year ago
@guitarlegend32 Still one sporting sphere Great Britain and Ireland dominate the world: thoroughbred racing. It will be no surprise once again in 2011 to see a dozen of the top 20 rated flat horses coming from the home nations. Sea The Stars, Harbinger and now Frankel, horses NO American over the period could get within 10 lengths of. He has one point, though, about prize money - our lower grade racing is criminally underfunded considering the betting turnover it generates.
thespacialone 1 year ago
@thespacialone Totally agree on the state of the levy via the bookies,it's a disgrace.My point to Forrest Gump is correct regards Sea The Stars.The problem here is that there is too much prize money for our top races but nowhere near enough filtering down to the lower grades.The yanks are over patrioric and take for granted for some reason that their breed is somehow superior to European horses.The reliance on steroids brings the sport into disrepute and 'infects' a natural breed.There is one..
guitarlegend32 1 year ago
@guitarlegend32 A lot of graft, not enough cash. Betfair getting £5m avrg matched on premiership games now, but no real cash injection into the game. That's fine, they don't need it. But if you got 100 "low grade" races a week, each generating them, say, £15k, that's £75m profit over a year. As they, and the fixed odds layers, make more money from the lower grace stuff than the topflight races, they should stump up, with more generous/frequent sponsorships. Circa £2k prize money is a joke
thespacialone 1 year ago
Comment removed
babygotback519 1 year ago
@guitarlegend32 You're right about the drug thing. Like most American sports it's become institutionalised. Although our game is not entirely straight I don't think it's an issue for us. Imo really takes the edge off of it, brings into questions trainers, can't appreciate a good training performance if you think roids could be really what's behind it. Plus it seems a bit samey over there. All the tracks the same, and the dirt too much favours hold up performers. Best regards, TSO
thespacialone 1 year ago
Comment removed
babygotback519 1 year ago
@thespacialone ..idiot on the BCC 2010 site who thought Harbinger,when I refered to him as the top horse this year,as the actual name of handicapping in this country,the equivelent of their Beyer Speed Ratings!! Their ignorance is an embarrasment.
guitarlegend32 1 year ago
@thespacialone Don't know who you are but you sure think your're special. It's strange but English horses don't win in America. The difference between England and America is ,when America sees a champion no difference what country,they see a champion. tTo England it can't be a champion unless its English. Ask the Queen how many horses in her stable are from Secretariat, the Queen bypasses the president and goes to Kentucky to the breeding farms. I guess those American horses win over there.
babygotback519 1 year ago
@babygotback519 Congratz (I think). Not many people understand my name, based on Real Madrid manager Jose Mourinho, aka the Special One.
Your Zenyatta was pretty good, I'll give you that. And you could have a real contender, for the first time in a long time, in Uncle Mo.
thespacialone 1 year ago
@thespacialone Guess where all American Thoroughbreds originate from if trace them back a couple of generations?
Yes the lower grade races are seriously underfunded. I would like to see Bookmakers and Betting exchanges putting in more money for theses races out of there millions and millions of profit each year, A couple of hundred grand would not even dent their profits etc. Millions spent on advertising at Race courses could also be included, say about 3% or there abouts.
MrNativeDancer 11 months ago
@MrNativeDancer I saw some bod from Betfair saying they were going to invest £3m over 3 years into specifically lower-grade UK racing on RUK about a week back - maybe the youtube walls have ears :) That's certainly a start. Yeah, I'm sure much more could be done, it certainly is in North America. Snooker seems to be benefited from more professional marketing and administration, maybe racing needs to follow suit.
thespacialone 11 months ago
@cernuous ....actual argument on the points I have raised(which for a yank is embarrasing),then please shut up.'The highest purses'?STS won more prize money in 9 races than Zenyatta did in her first 19 you moron.In the U.S there are 5 decent races per year,the massively overrated Triple Crown and a couple BC races that you assume foreign horses need to compete in to call themselves great.To be considered the best you have to race the best so get off your fat asses and travel over here.YEEEE HA!
guitarlegend32 1 year ago
@guitarlegend32, I think your abysmally poor record of success here in the United States speaks volumes for the present state of British racing bloodstock. Performance is the only quantifiable evidence; or as in your case Britains lack thereof; is the proof and and not your absurd references to Hyperion or anything else. Horseracing is largely subjective, which is the only point of counter argument you may have when explaining away Britains ineptitude in champion events contested here.
cernuous 1 year ago
How sad, how terribly sad that the free falling Britain of to-day with it's undeniably rich history and traditions are held captive by primitives such as you. My goodness, no wonder you serve as the anvil for world mockery. I have formally dismissed you as a bizarre form of ill bred, British myopic crank, you will receive no further reply.
cernuous 1 year ago
@cernuous You will be reading this reply though,so on behalf of all sane thinking GREAT Britains,go fuck yorself you obnoxious pile of paranoid shit.You haven't created a single argument against my FACTS.What the hell has a FOOTBALL(soccer,just sums you up Forrest)match or a Winter Olympics got to do with the Epsom Derby?The U.S is the most loathed nation on this planet and I can't wait for the Chinese to cash in the $1.2 trillion you owe them,therfore you will vanish.U.S-source of ALL evil.
guitarlegend32 1 year ago 4
@guitarlegend32, For example your dreadful performance in World Cup soccer competition is quantifiable. The results of Great Britains ineptitude in this years Winter Olympic Games at Vancouver is of equal proof of your countries diminished international competitive skills. 1 single medal versus 37 for us; while nations of the third world such as Slovakia, Belarus and Slovenia clearly trounced you. Such is not the stuff of champions. This level of incompetency pervades your entire country...
cernuous 1 year ago
and has long effected your horseracing bloodstock. British bred racehorses are a standing joke here in the United States. Your juvenile references to "fat asses" and "Forrest Gump" only serves to illustrate the extent of Britains sad modern day implosion. Success in competition is the real test of a nation ....not namecalling.
cernuous 1 year ago
@cernuous British bred racehorses are not a standing joke in the U.S., shame on you! If they have a champion,great, A finely trained champion at his peak is a glorious animal to behold, I don't care which country he's from. It's all about the horse. Swap insults if you want but I would love to see their champion run!
babygotback519 1 year ago
@cernuous Nations of the third world? Lol. Could you be any more blatantly provocative? The irony of the wind up obviously escapes you. Your country wouldn't exist if wasn't for the people you have such contempt for. Also all of your bloodstock descend from Eclpise, an English bred horse btw so your point really loses merit there don't you think? As for the mighty Nation of the United States? You're a bunch of refugees who couldn't hack life in these parts. Know your place.
corny165 1 year ago
@corny165 Damn this Eclipse DNA must be getting spread pretty thin.Pretty damn old too. With the contempt you have for the U.S. I wish we had let Hitler have every God Damn one of you, we'll know better next time .
babygotback519 1 year ago
@babygotback519 Ha. I'm not English btw. The Russians stopped Hitler get it right. I know that doesn't sit well with the capitalist ideology that pervades American culture but its true. The US' role in the war, like that of the English if we're honest, is completely overstated. The total War on the eastern front decided the conflict. Anyway, i don't have contempt for Americans just your completely UNJUSTIFIED smugness.
corny165 1 year ago
@corny165 Damn how old are you? My grandfather wasn't alive then. Know your place, more like can you REMEMBER your place. Hang in there old timer!
banner1835 11 months ago
@cornybutt, Sure the Russians were so well represented in the battles of Midway, Leyte Gulf, Okinawa and Iwo Jima, they "saved" our "smug" U.S asses. But I digress, I might very well have overstated the impact of our war efforts effectiveness...... This is a video of a horserace you bimbo not a lesson in WWII historical mythology according to you. God, who are these bozo's.
cernuous 10 months ago
@cernuous No one said the Russians saved the US. I said the Russians stopped Hitler. At the 'battle' of Midway the Japs lost 3,000 men. The Axis lost 800,000 men attacking Stalingrad. Nothing mythological in simple numbers. I didn't bring up the war either, i responded to a comment above. Anyway you are hardly in a position to lecture me on the fact that this is a horse racing video when you've brought up, without provocation, the Winter Olympics and the World Cup.... Touch on. Fuck face.
corny165 10 months ago
@cornybutt, Don't be absurd the battle of Midway was the greatest Air Craft Carrier Battle in history. It pitted the finest U.S plane carrying warships against those of Japan. We decimated the Japanese carrier fleet to the extent that they would only use their navy in defensive operations for the balance of the war. Why would you compare a naval battle with the attack on Stalingrad? We practically stood alone in the Pacific theater finally choosing to end the entire affair by a show of....
cernuous 10 months ago
overwhelming might.
cernuous 10 months ago
@cornybutt, Thank you for alluding to the Winter Olympics; this was clearly another superb demonstration of the United States athletic prowess. Incidently had the Liberation of Europe not gone according to plan, you can rest assured we would have liquidated Germany in much the same fashion as we decimated Japan.
cernuous 10 months ago
@cernuous You're refugees pal. The history of your country is the history of people that left my country and the other the countries of Europe. A super race of refugees perhaps? LOLOL. Sure you're still being colonised by the dirty Mexicans ffs!
Anyway, thats enough. You're funny but you need to work on the wind ups. You're about as subtle as a sledgehammer.
corny165 10 months ago
@cornybutt, O'h go away, you're a time waster, one who's filled to the brim with racial epithets and silly stereotypical nonsense. Should "F- --k face" or "dirty Mexicans" be the sum total of your child like gibberish, I think you've clearly exposed yourself as an ignorant uneducated slob. Get lost you creep. God, who are these bozo's.
cernuous 10 months ago
@cernuous Don't let it get to you. You go to the trouble of changing my name to 'cornybutt' every time and you call me childish!
corny165 10 months ago
@corny165 did you know that cernuous spams a lot of British channels,
where he "boasts" about how he masturbates to 7/7 bombing footage,
as he hates "limeys" so much. He's on numerous God Save the Queen,
and he also has username "americaownsengland" and jumpmaster263.
He is one sick yank bastard!
AlexJones158 9 months ago
@AlexJones158 i wouldn't take it to heart mate. He's just some nameless fucker with time on his hands and who enjoys a wind up. The internet was made for cunts like him!
I actually think its funny someone would go out of their way to create multiple accounts and confess to having a wank over a bombing! Loneliness is a terrible thing. ha ha.
corny165 9 months ago
@cernuous Why do yo troll so many English channels, bragging
about how you "masterbate" to 7/7 bombing channels,
you sick yank cunt! Well, i wank off to 9/11 collapse footage
and jizz my home made 9/11 fireman doll, what do you think
of that you filthy yank cunt, stinking hillbilly FUCKASS?
AlexJones158 9 months ago
@cernuous so you FINALLY admit, that you're a yank troll fuckwit,
with no other purpose in life than to be a TOTAL CUNT!
You wanking muthafucking yank shiteater!
jumpsplaaat 9 months ago
@cernuous Why the hell are you saying we did bad in the World Cup (Its called football not soccer), when you went out in the same round as us you HILLBILLY DICKHEAD
In America you dope youre horses They arnt fast without drugs
In Europe the top class horses run on turf so they have to extra durable, not like your stupid Yankee nags who run on dirt
I'm a massive racing fan but i dont give a shit about Kenfucky Derby, cos its shit
U are a typical deluded American. Nashwan wud destroy Secratariat
comeonshaymen 8 months ago
@comeonshaymen Who's Nashwan, you piece of shit Englishman? Your mediocre, dreary, depressing, garbage country has produced nothing to compare with the best from America. Great US horses like Secretariat, Spectacular Bid, Dr. Fager, Affirmed, Ghostzapper would destroy your donkeys. The only horses worth watching in the UK were bred where? In the US or Canada you sausage eating monkey: Nijinsky and Dancing Brave, or owed their talent to US sires, like Sea Bird. Burn in hell you filthy fuck.
BigPetrov 8 months ago
@BigPetrov Is American the nationatility for someone from the US?
Or is it Obese?
Or Burger Eating Interfering Monkey??
comeonshaymen 8 months ago
@comeonshaymen You "dont give a shit about Kentucky Derby"? Well I don't give a shit about the Arc that has some filthy, muslim, raghead country as its sponser - and then the frogs fucking eat their horses when they're done with them!! At least big US races don't suck up to dirty arabs, or call their horses Dubai Gold (LOL!!!) The US has produced big winners on dirt AND grass, greats like Sec and Barbaro who won on both. Any Euro horse worth his salt was bred in the US, or has US sires. UK fuck!
BigPetrov 8 months ago 2
@BigPetrov STS, all Irish bred
Nijinsky, Canadian bred.
Oh, and there has only ever been 1 horse called Dubai Gold, and he has only ran twice in point to points (doubt that u know what that means stupid hillbilly)
Zarkava is better than Zenyatta
Carlton House is better than Animal Kingdom
On dirt your nags would destroy us i admit
On turf we have the best horses ever
Our horses can JUMP too! I know strange concept. Not like your stupid retarded donkeys
Long live the great British horses
comeonshaymen 8 months ago
@comeonshaymen Yes, I know your horses can JUMP, and break their necks too in the process! - then sent to a French butcher shop (LO!!). Did you read my last comment - I don't give a crap about Zenyatta, the overhyped overrated mare. Tiznow, Ghostzapper, Curlin, Smarty Jones, Barbaro, Alysheba: these are the US greats of the last two decades. Our best like Secretariat and Barbaro won on both dirt AND grass. Only "Dubai Gold"? - what about Dubai Celebration and Dubai Queen? Stinking arab suckups.
BigPetrov 8 months ago
@BigPetrov Watch the 2010 Grand National. Best race ever. And your horses, there names make no sense. Mine That Bird. FTW???? Our best horses on the flat were Mill Reef, Nijinsky, Nashwan, Sea The Stars, Shergar and Harbinger. Over jumps, Red Rum, Arkle, Golden Miller, Hattons Grace, L'Escargot, Best Mate, Kauto Star, Denman, Exotic Dancer and Flyingbolt.
And why did u watch if u hate European racing????
comeonshaymen 8 months ago
@comeonshaymen I said I was going to ignore your comments since my last post, but I'll make an exception. I came to this video because I read some good things about Workforce and wanted to see him run. The first thing I notice is people on here blasting American horses, trainers and races. Now, the most sensible thing to do would have been to continue watching the race and move on, but my emotions got the better of me and I got caught up in a useless argument. cont.
BigPetrov 7 months ago
@comeonshaymen Unfortunately, my etiquette and my manners worsened with every post. It's safe to say that the US and UK have produced the finest TB's in history, and Canada too just for Nijinsky (possibly the greatest turf horse of all time) and his sire Northern Dancer (one of the finest dirt racers and sires ever). Our best of recent times were Secretariat (who won dirt and grass), Spectacular Bid, Dr. Fager, Affirmed, Tiznow, Smarty Jones, Curlin, Cigar and Ghostzapper.
BigPetrov 7 months ago
@BigPetrov Well said. Europe and Ameica both have good horses. Sorry for the conflict between us. :) I guess racing is racing, Flat or NH, Dirt of turf, and we should enjoy it all.
comeonshaymen 7 months ago
@comeonshaymen I'm sorry too for the arguments that were getting really crazy towards the end! Two big races coming up - Epsom Derby tomorrow and Belmont next week. Well done to St. Nicholas Abbey for winning the Coronation Cup today.
BigPetrov 7 months ago
@BigPetrov I have seen some of the horses you mention. For me, Dr Fager is the best one I have ever seen. I also saw Troy, Nijinsky, Il Tempo, Kingston Town, Secretariat, Tulloch and So You Think at the races. For me, Dr Fager is the greatest champion I have ever seen. You could see it in the crowd also. They knew they were witnessing something special. I would like to have seen Zenyatta. She is a special animal also.
SugarTomAppleRoger 4 months ago
@comeonshaymen Being originally Russian I should be more appreciative of European racing, and I actually am starting to become familiar with some of the greats from the UK and Europe (the reason I came on here)...and then things headed downhill a bit! I'm not too keen on the Grand National because of the fatalities that have occurred at that race (two this year), but do enjoy some of the smaller races with the smaller jumps.
BigPetrov 7 months ago
@comeonshaymen How the hell is Carlton House better than Animal Kingdom? He's made what - 90,000 pounds so far in his career. He has talent, yes, largely due to his great grandsire being one of the best sires of all time (US bred Mr. Prospector), but he's not better than AK - who won on dirt despite being bred as a turf horse. Let them race on grass and we'll see who's better. I heard your Queen was trading horses with that dirty sheikh who used to condone child slaves for camel racing. Bravo!!
BigPetrov 8 months ago
@BigPetrov I really dont have a clue what youre on about, you stupid retarded yank. Bravo. WTF?
At the moment, we have the best horses in the world. Frankel. St Nicholas Abbey. Carlton House. Overdose is European. On dirt too, Gitano Hernando was a turf horse in England before moving to RSA.
As for breeding, Animal Kingdom was out of an German mare, which is in Europe, but i doubt that stupid Americans would know that.
Carlton House hasnt won that much prize money because hes only ran 3 times
comeonshaymen 8 months ago
@comeonshaymen I know AK is out of a German mare, you stupid, fish-and-chip-eating, greasy refuse, but he was bred in the US. Was Sea Bird bred in America because he had a US sire, you stupid monkey? BRAVO TO YOUR QUEEN FOR TRADING HORSES WITH A FILTHY MUSLIM ARAB SHEIKH, WHO CONDONED CHILD SLAVES FOR CAMEL RACING. Ah, NOW your pea brain understood my previous comment. Your shitty country sucks up to dirty ragheads and your horses are subpar at best. I'm done with you, UK crap.
BigPetrov 8 months ago
@BigPetrov Ah, a typical American shithead. YOU DONT REALISE THAT AMERICA IS THE MOST HATED COUNTRY IN THE WORLD. NO1 LIKES U, you shitty hillbllies. An Englishman (BTW We dont refer to ourselves as UK, u shithead. we r ENGLAND, SCOTLAND, WALES AND N.IRELAND) would admit that America have good horses, which i have.
U have good horses.
But our horses are better.
As for breeding, u sed that Carlton House was good beacus of his US grandsire
Animal Kingdom is good cos of his European dam
comeonshaymen 8 months ago
@corny165 Haha, "know your place." Love it!
thespacialone 1 year ago
@corny165 yep that cernuous is one braindead hillbilly fuckwit,
let's hope the rest of his body follows suit! haha
AlexJones158 9 months ago
champions are American bred.
cernuous 1 year ago
@cernuous ...breaking Dubai Millenium(rated 3lbs superior to your best,Cigar).When was the last time a 3yo in America even deserved to be in the same race as STS,Workforce or Zarkhava?Not one U.S 3yo in the last ten years has been rated within 6lbs of STS.There wouldn't even be racing of the thoroughbred in America at all but for G.B where every single animal was decended from in the late 1600's.Mustang racing with Billy the Kid is as close as you would be without us and there's more history..
guitarlegend32 1 year ago
@cernuous ...of ALL U.S horses.The reliance on us in the past regards breeding shows that going back only 5 generations there is British/European blood on both sides of the pedigree in EVERY U.S horse,Nearco being the best example,who's sire Pharos being a decendant of the magnificent St.Simon.Who's your greatest influence in breeding?Northern Dancer was CANADIAN and his sire Neartic was by Nearco from a British mare,Lady Angela by another of the great British stallions Hyperion.The British....
guitarlegend32 1 year ago
@cernuous 'The very best of horseracing bloodstock'?Such as who?The Breeders Cup is a steroid ridden bunch of cheats who in the words of John W.Amerman,the head of the U.S Jockey Club,has stated 'will take 50 years for the drug culture to be removed from OUR bloodlines'.Thank God OUR breeders are turning their backs and not 'infecting' the totaly natural state of British and European breeding.The Dubai WC has received no attention from our TOP horses since the best ever,track record.....
guitarlegend32 1 year ago
@cernuous ...in Newmarket alone than the whole of the U.S.The dirt garbage you race on has such little variety,more like Nascar with legs runnung around in circles.Greyhound racing at it's best - sprint from the stalls and the winner tires the least.I suppose your one of the dimwits who thinks the ninth best rated horse in the world in Zenyatta is the greatest horse who ever lived.You've had about 3 decent mares in your entire history,when we have 3 a season.Most of your shit summer grade 1's...
guitarlegend32 1 year ago
@cernuous hey odious, You're STILL on here drooling over
English cock I see! Well, as well suited to sucking cock as you are,
I wish you would find a more suitable platform for doing it,
Some people are here to ACTUALLY watch the race,
so take your anti-British filth elsewhere you degenerate
yank bastard!
AlexJones158 9 months ago
@cernuous ...need to be handicaps because the entire season revolves around the BC which is basically an afterthought for our very best horses.STS wouldn't lower himself to run in that shite.Where are the other International horses?Is it really that attractive?When are you pathetic cowards going to even enter a horse in the greatest historical race of all time - The REAL Derby.Faggots.All of your awards come from historical horses from OUR past,Eclipse,look him up,he's in the blood of over 90%..
guitarlegend32 1 year ago
I believe it wasnt the real workforce in the King George, it certainly wasnt the horse who won the Derby anyway. But did Cape Blanco not run his race either? Hard to say. I do think harbinger loved Ascot though and he might not have won that far on a different track. It was a huge performance nonetheless but i have to agree with you, that to rate that performance as better than Dancing Braves Arc is nonsense. But raitings are like opinions....
cmcgarth1O 1 year ago
@cmcgarth1O I love ratings as an argument but would never use them from a beting point of view.On the question of the King George,I just don't beleive ANY of the defeated horses ran to anywhere near their best.Cape Blanco was running over a trip that I honestly don't think he gets and winning distances are excentuated when one horse is staying on and another weakening.The time was a track record but on a newly laid track.Youmzain?Clearly past his best.It is amazing the horses who adore Ascot...
guitarlegend32 1 year ago
Plenty to loo forward to for next season already. Workforce, Frankel, RVW, Twice Over, Canford Cliffs, Cape Blanco, So You Think.... makes for some classic racing. Apologies to amy ommitted, and any that have run their 6-10 races and retired ;)
bgardiner2000 1 year ago
Ryan is some jockey too
jnmklo9 1 year ago
I'm with ya Nucleo
Pic6King 1 year ago
I am still taking AL KHALI in the Breeders cup Turf. Workforce is a beautiful horse. HE deserves his respect
Nucleo85Torino 1 year ago
Comment removed
tomellams87 1 year ago
Lingfield Derby Trial win or not? LOL. Given the show that Workforce put on this day, and an Arc De Triomphe win on top of that. I'll bet Prince Khalid Abdullah has to feel pretty silly looking back on this race now and seeing the pink cap on Bullet Train and the green cap on Workforce. LOL.
GBeret83 1 year ago
What a Trainer Sir M-Stoute is and what a ride from Ryan Moore, ''THANKS'' to all the camp for a very special day.
1 word - AWESOME.
SIDESLAM 1 year ago
@SIDESLAM Could not agree more with you there. That is one Derby I will never forget. Anyone who says this was a poor Derby does not know what they are talking about. Workforce that was such a brave performance there! It didn't just look good he broke the track record aswell in the process!
MrNativeDancer 1 year ago
If they run him can he win the Arc ???
I think he can, sure he had a shocker in the King george but thats racing, and had he won the King George he would not be the price he is for the Arc, lets hope for a run and a great run at that.
SIDESLAM 1 year ago
Comment removed
GBeret83 1 year ago
@GBeret83 Didn't quite out run him today though.
guitarlegend32 1 year ago
@GBeret83 Partly true, as said before the bit slipped through Workforces mouth in the Dante he could not get a breather in so was running on empty lungs.ask any one who knows about bits,trainers jockeys etc. So a viable reason for Dante defeat. That is not an excuse but genuine reason. You try running with out breathing see how far you can go! But anyway thats racing and these things happen. Cape Blanco and Workforce are two of the best horses I have ever seen.Both champions in there own rite!
MrNativeDancer 1 year ago
@GBeret83 Cape Blanco has impressed you more than Workforce??Are you on drugs or just a fairweather friend?
postcardterry 1 year ago
@postcardterry, I think if you'll take a look at when I posted that comment. At the time, Workforce's only big win had been in the Epsom Derby. Cape Blanco had won the Dante, the Irish Derby, had outrun Workforce in the King George, and had single handed destroyed the form of the Juddmonte International Stakes by running Rip Van Winkle and Twice Over completely off of their feet in the Irish Champion Stakes. I'm pretty certain I made that comment pre-Arc De Triomphe.
GBeret83 1 year ago
@GBeret83 The Irish Champion form is suspect to say the least, any horse in front that day had a huge advantage. The fact that Sea lord was right next to Twice Over and Rip Van Winkle tells you it was a false race.
Workforce is a good horse but he won a weak Derby and a weak Arc, Harbinger would have destroyed him again if he had run in the Arc
cmcgarth1O 1 year ago
@cmcgarth1O Why are you so confident Harbinger would have won the Arc?Soft ground would have been a disadvantage and ground is the most vital ingredient to any horse.Doesn't it at least make Workforce versatile and I really wouldn't be surprised if he won a top 1m 2f race next season.
guitarlegend32 1 year ago
@guitarlegend32 On his King George performance, it would have took more than soft ground to stop him in the Arc.
cmcgarth1O 1 year ago
@cmcgarth1O Ground is totally and utterly vital to any horse,very few go on everything.Would Dancing Brave won as he did in his Arc victory on softish going?No,because he wouldn't even have run,nor Sea the Stars.Stoute has always loved Workforce and had complete faith he would act on the going even having won the Derby on firm.Harbinger's one off brilliant King George victory to me doesn't deserve a 142 rating by Timeform.Seriously,better than the Brave and Sea The Stars who did it repeatedly?
guitarlegend32 1 year ago
@guitarlegend32 I know what your saying and i agree that a horses ultimate rating should not be judged on one performance but on its career as a whole. That said, Harbinger was a a typical stoute improver(cliched as it may be) but he was clearly an improved horse and he didnt get the chance to show if he could do it again. I see no reason why he wouldnt have continued to perform with such power and I think he would have won the Arc, just like I think Manduro would have.
cmcgarth1O 1 year ago
@cmcgarth1O I adore Stoute improvers,which is why I am so looking forward to Workforce next year.He is the most imposing animal you could wish to see and was clearly protected by not running in the Breeders Cup Turf.All the same,there is no argument against your opinion of Harbinger,alas what else do we see other than performances on the track?I just have real difficulty rating him that highly when his opponents ran below their best in the specifiic contest.D Brave,Sea Bird etc were evaluated..
guitarlegend32 1 year ago
@cmcgarth1O ...Swain ran his best races there as did Doyen,who was virtually useless elsewhere and to reiterate to be given 142 when not producing anywhere near that previously and alas not given the chance elsewhere is as you say nonsence.
guitarlegend32 1 year ago
@cmcgarth1O ...on their performances when it was obvious that what they performed to was exact form.I.E no excuses.In essence,Timeform are saying that Harbinger would have beaten Dancing Brave in the 1986 Arc.Utter rubbish.Regards.
guitarlegend32 1 year ago
he is no cape blanco though i backed workforce n the derby as his was the beaten by the best 3yr old who didnt go to the derby
jlpkwh 1 year ago
i love living down the road from the derby downs :)
MrsAmyDiCaprio 1 year ago
...to lower a track record by 5 SECONDS!!!!!! That's like Secretariat winning by 60 lengths!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! What a total clown.HAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!
guitarlegend32 1 year ago
@guitarlegend32 Your just some lairy 15 year old whos first ever winner was Workforce so your determined to convince everyone hes great, take it from a man whos been watching racing for over 40 years, he isnt
MANUTD4LIFE171 1 year ago
@MANUTD4LIFE171 Your i.q isn't your age you dork.Convince EVERYONE asshole?It's only you who needs converting.WHO'S MR.BROOKS Dip shit.You know so much?Tell me all about him.Funny isn't it how you NEVER reply to what is written in front of you.SEA BIRD.Couldn't reply.Harbinger winning by 11 lengths running under 2.28,couldn't reply.Secretariat?Couldn't reply.Shergar beat nothing of any quality whatsoever.If he was that great why didn't he win a VERY,VERY poor Leger.You hold Stoute in such....
guitarlegend32 1 year ago
@MANUTD4LIFE171 When aswell you idiot,did I say WF was'great'? NEVER.Just thats he's better than what was seen at Ascot.
guitarlegend32 1 year ago
I'm in complete bewilderment as to this asshole's perception of times.He thinks there are many horses who would destroy a track record by 5 SECONDS.That like Usain Bolt running 100m in 8.5 seconds!!!!!!!!!!! What a uneducated,knowledgeless idiot.When Secretariat won the Belmont by 31 lengths,he beat the previous U.S best by only 1.2 seconds,yet this single race is one of the top three displays by a racehorse in the history of thoroughbred racing.This idiot think's it's possible for a horse to...
guitarlegend32 1 year ago
Did any one notice At First Site got badly bumped at the start? He nearly got knocked sideways there if you look closely.
MrNativeDancer 1 year ago
Comment removed
MrNativeDancer 1 year ago
i wonder what r u going 2 say when this horse wins l'arc....?
Claudio1Cannigia 1 year ago
@Claudio1Cannigia Is he entered? I think WOW! would be their answer haha
MrNativeDancer 1 year ago
@Claudio1Cannigia I suggest you save your money as Workforce will not be winning the Arc, no chance
MANUTD4LIFE171 1 year ago
@MANUTD4LIFE171 well mate we will see.....but tell me what will u say if he wins xDDD...
Claudio1Cannigia 1 year ago
@Claudio1Cannigia i will be astounded and il hold my hands up, i spend hours daily studying the form of races trying to find winners, and ive spent ours on end trying to get my head round this Derby, there realy is no form that can suggest it is any better than mediocre, personaly i dont feel Workforce would have been in the first 3 of last years Derby, if you back him for the Arc then i wish you luck, but i honestly wouldnt back him at 200/1 for the Arc, i doubt he will ever win another G1
MANUTD4LIFE171 1 year ago
Workforce may have ran a fabulous Epsom Derby and set a new Epsom track record on this day. But he was made to look like a boy racing a man in the King George. Actually, Workforce, Cape Blanco, Youmzain, and Confront all looked like boys racing a man in Harbinger. Plus, he also made Daryakana look like a girl racing a man. JMO.
GBeret83 1 year ago
@GBeret83 Yes, indeed. I watched the King George several times. I cant come up with any logical answer as to how most of the field ran like they did. Obviously Youmzain keeps his best from for the Ark. Maybe Harbinger was something really special. He did make them look like boys. Shame he has been retired though. Who knows what he would of went on to achieve?
MrNativeDancer 1 year ago
Workforce won a poor Derby. He beat a pacemaker by 6 lenghts. He will struggle to win a Group One again this season. Been with Sir Michael maby next season. Maby.
hutcyh 1 year ago
the derby form looked suspect when he beat the track record,????? i agree he is no way near shergar but still should of easily had enough to beet harbinger who has never even raced in a group1 so work that out.
robbo1089 1 year ago
thats ridiculous the derby form always looked suspect michael stoute is a highly talented and respected trainer, harbinger would have beaten anything hes improving all the time
littlebay75 1 year ago
todays race was the biggest scam in sporting history, micheal stoute has clearly done nothing with workforce since the derby , and soley concentrated on harbinger, he would not of even been close to workforce on his derby form, i honestly believe stoute has been tipped off by the bookies or harry herbert, i mean workforce should of improved on the derby win not gone backwards, as much as i love horse racing im afraid it is so corrupt., trainers should only be allowed to enter one horse per race.
robbo1089 1 year ago
@robbo1089 You are clueless he beat some 100/1 pacemaker who has since finished near enough last in his 2 recent starts in the Derby, Workforce is no were near good enough to beat Harbinger, the dante form is there in the book he finished near enough the same distance behind cape blanco in the dante as he did in the King George, Im afraid Workforce is more of a Kris Kin than a Shergar
MANUTD4LIFE171 1 year ago
@MANUTD4LIFE171 How would you compare how Harbinger was last year when he was the age Workforce is now? Watch Harbingers races last year. When he was Workforces age.
In the Dante the bit slipped through Workforces mouth, so he would not of been able to breath properly. The Derby took a lot out of Workforce it was a hard race for him. Infact it has taken a lot out of all the horses bar a few that ran in the race, hence no winners have came from the race.
MrNativeDancer 1 year ago
@MrNativeDancer No winners have come from the race except buzz word because they were all rubbish, He has had 7 weeks rest more rest than any of the others who raced in the King George, Shergar won the Derby, Irish Derby and King George all in the space of 7 weeks by a combined distance of 22 lenghs was he tired, Workforce is a poor Derby winner and everyone knows it, that realy is all there is to it
MANUTD4LIFE171 1 year ago
@MANUTD4LIFE171 I wonder if you will be saying this next year when he returns as a proper 4 year old. hahaha I think people can right Workforce off at their own peral so to speak. The form of a lot of the Derby horses going into the Derby was quite solid, its just on that day on that ground it took a hell of a lot out of the horses. I rode the track years ago and know what the track is like.
Shergar was in a league of his own though wasnt he? Incredible performance that was.
MrNativeDancer 1 year ago
@MANUTD4LIFE171 They have now, Hot Prospect won on Saturday, pretty decent race aswell. he was well beaten in this Derby so now at last the Derby form has been franked. I think quite a few of the Derby horses are starting to come back to form. So write them off at your own peril. I watched the Derby it was good race and a fantastic performance from Workforce End of Story Hot Prospect now backs that up as others will do aswell. Buzz word thats two winners now.
MrNativeDancer 1 year ago
@MrNativeDancer Hot prospect won a very average handicap race, fair enough he won nicely, but it was against a bunch of handicap standard race horses, i hardly see how his win off a very low mark for a derby horse has in anyway enhanced the form of Workforces win, if he had won a group race then perhaps, but handicap racing, its only one step up from the all weather pal, Workforce is a shocking Derby winner, and i find it embarasing to the prestige of the race that a horse as poor as that won
MANUTD4LIFE171 1 year ago
@MANUTD4LIFE171 OK THEN in what way does a horse have to win the Derby to be impresive in your eyes then Mr Manutd4life
Does a track record not count for anything then?
I dont see that record being broken any time soon?
To me a course record is impresive, it doesnt matter what he beat, the time proves it WAS impresive, even Ryan Moor the jockey thought it was aswell.
I will say no more on this matter, watch the race again. What horse would of beaten him on that day? That was his day! End Of!!!!
MrNativeDancer 1 year ago
@MrNativeDancer no racing pundit worth his salt takes notice of times, At First Sight ran an outstanding time quicker than Sea The Stars and New Approach, so he must be better than both if your theory works, Shergar was like 10 seconds slower as it was very soft but he would destroy Workforce with ease and Sir Micheal Stoute would tell you the same, Workforce was a mediocre winner and his Ascot run were he ran to form the same distance behind Cape Blanco as in the Dante proves this
MANUTD4LIFE171 1 year ago
@MrNativeDancer So Ryan Moores word is Gospel, ofcourse hes going to hail his first Derby winner, even if its just out of sentiment, the horse has just won you the Derby, thats the pinnacle for any jockey, hes not then going to say he doesnt think hes that good, name me a jockey who hasnt hailed his Derby winner, your argument is complete trype, that was his day and he ran well, i actually selected Workforce in my Tote ten to follow contest at the start of the season so dont think i dislike him
MANUTD4LIFE171 1 year ago
@MANUTD4LIFE171 You say my argument is trpe? Rip Van Winkle just won the Judmonte International. Rewilding just won the Great Voltageure. Like I said the Derby took a lot out of the horses they just need time. So far I have been proved right 4 times also we had a German Derby winner from the race aswell. And you where saying along with the rest of the sheep it was a poor Derby? Judmonte, a 40k Handicap, German Derby , and a Great Voltageure. Just proves how good that Derby really was AGAIN!
MrNativeDancer 1 year ago