@ghanimajade aww always thought he said "unconquerable" Now I have to go back and listen again. Either way, I really miss Durkin's awesome, dramatic calls. He has such a way with capturing and channeling emotion. I'm so sad that he stopped calling the Breeder's Cup and now the Triple Crown.
Brilliant horse; when he won the Dubai World Cup he proved how deep he could dig. For the record, I backed Halling in the Breeders Cup Classic - tailed off by around 57 lengths :P
The 1995 BC Classic and the 1996 Dubai World Cup were just 2 of the races right in the middle of that 16 race win streak that Cigar accomplished to tie Citation's record. Which stood at the time. Zenyatta has since eclipsed both. But no one can ever say the Paulson's weren't sporting, and took the easy path with Cigar for his 16 straight win's. He raced in the biggest G1 races of the day, against all the best horses of his era!!
Truly, is was almost like a cruel joke that Cigar, arguably one of America's greatest horses ever, ended up being sterile, and never got to pass those champion's genes along. Coolmore-Ireland bought Cigar's breeding rights. Under agreement with Alan Paulson that Cigar would stand stud at Coolmore's American facility. Just over the past 8 or 9 years, look at the great horses that Galileo and Montjeu have sired for Coolmore-Ireland. Just imagine if they would've had Cigar prior to those two? Scary
I can't believe he is rated only at 18th given his wins overseas. There's no much he could have achieved in his career than he did. I don't see how it's possible that any horse from now could be ranked ahead of Spectacular Bid. I wonder Zenyatta will rank if she wins her last race?
One day I was at Saratoga and Durkin comes on the loud speaker, "Special anouncement, there is a massive power outage across New York State, but more importantly the 10th race at Saratoga is off the turf."
Whatever you think of Cigar, he is the fourth horse ever to go undefeated in the much more difficult handicap division while running a full schedule. The other three are Man O'War-1920, Tom Fool- 1953 and Spectacular Bid- 1980. That is pretty good company to be in.
My favorite Durkin line in the race occurs near the one minute mark: "Cigar wants to go to the lead, but Jerry Bailey says 'NO!... Not yet!", just the way he said it was nothing short of epic
People here also seem to forget towards the end of his streak he visited another continent. 5000mile journey is not something horse's do often and still win.
The most impressive thing about his time being 1:59 50 is the fact that the first half mile was run in more than 48 seconds. He really had to pick up in the final 3/4 miles.
who ever says Cigar was a fluke is an idiot who wouldn't no excellence if it came up and bit you in the nose . sheesh he was darn fast, undefeated with perfect seasons and the ability to go head to head with another horse and look like he is giving all he's got but still find more for the win . he is amazing and one of the most courageous and best racehorses ever . Cigar forever !
I've looked at the past comments on this board. Some go out of their way to knock Cigar as some tomato can of a racehorse. They scream who did he beat,and all the normal stuff. This is very similiar to what people said about Seattle Slew in his 3 yr old year. "Just a good horse in a bad lot",funny this mindset shows up constantly. Just remember this, A GREAT HORSE will make very good horses look average. Thats why it appears he ran against nobody. Thats why he won 16 straight races people! WOW!
i couldnt have agreed with you more. I think Cigar gets alot of flak because Holy Bull got injured in the only race they ever met up with each other. So they are probably unconciously bitter.
BE109 well stated! If Cigar was a fluke how did he go undefeated? People need to think before they write. Cigar was one of the greatest! Showed up everytime after he figured out how to race! You need to go to Kentucky Horse Park & see this champ in the flesh. He has a commanding presence about him. I got to feed him some mints & pet him. I have the picture in my office. I just wish he could have sired some foals. What a shame!
I had the pleasure to "meet" Cigar at the Hall of Champions at the Kentucky Horse Park and let me tell you--he's the biggest racehorse I have ever seen.
Cigar is what made me love horse racing so much, with all of a passion. Everytime I see this horse run I get chills down my spine and everything feels so good to see this horse! My all time favourite.!
He wasn't ready as a 2yo and went unraced. Early in 3 yo campaign wasn't seen as anything more than a high level allowance/listed stakes horse.. They kept going back and forth on whether he would be a dirt or turf racer. They switched trainers to Bill Mott and he got him to run on the dirt and he began to bloom late in his 4 year old campaign.
By far the most wonderful race I've ever seen in person, great horse, great jockey, great race. Probably the happiest day I've ever spent at Belmont :-) Will never forget it. Thanks for the memories Cigar and Jerry Bailey!
Cigar may not have been the equal of Slew, Secretariat or the Bid but unlike them he never lost a race for almost two years at a multitude of tracks and that makes him truly special.
I'm not a Denman fan. I cringe when I hear "and away they go" or when he describes a :46 half in a mile and a quarter race as "sensible". Maybe with polytrack at Santa Anita that'll change.
You can visit Cigar at the Kentucky Horse Park in Lexington. I was there this week; what an amazing horse. When they brought him into the pavillion, he just had this look of a champion. If you can describe a horse as looking arrogant, that was him.
Totally agree. We also need NBC back doing the Breeders' Cup. I can't abide Trevor Denman; he's good, but much too monotone. I prefer Tom Durkin and his delivery much more.
Any doubters about this horse's ability must not have been at Belmont that day. I had the pleasure of seeing the BC live that year, and in just a puddle of water all around the race track, Cigar toyed with the field and won easily to complete a perfect season. He and Inside Information put together the two most impressive BC wins that year. Cigar may not be in the top ten in racing history, but he has to be considered as one of the greats. Just a wonderful horse to have seen run.
@sidewalkcafe2007 I have been in racing 35 years and there is zero doubt that when Cigar was right he was an all time top 12 horse....he ran a sub 2 min mile and 1/4 at least twice maybe 3 times....he was a real push button horse who could make 2 and 3 runs within a race.....anyone who thinks Cigar would not be very competitive vs slew, affirmed, spectacular bid etc really needs to go back to racing 101
I get a kick out of the online debate. Cigar was and is my favorite race horse & one of my top 5 favorite athletes human or equine but as far as his competition goes i've got 2 words; Alphabet Soup
Alright CF70, i am not in the business of tarnishing anyones video experience, i actually hold you in very high esteem, and any comments said, were not meant to offend you, or anyones experience of horse racing on these channels. my apologies all.
I very much appreciate your honesty and humble spirit regarding your previous comments. I am honored that you think of me with such respect, I respect you as well. I am also pleased that we can move forward in a positive manner; many people would not have been so understanding of my concerns, for that I thank you.
Exellent dialogue by the way. its not called dissing anybody, he is what he is, a horse that did,nt beat anybody, and referencing holy bull into the cigar discussion is weak. Holy bull is what he is,and we will never know what his true ability was because he didnt finish in the donn,listen holy bull isnt the horse thats ranked 18th, so he should take flak for his short commings and if this is a way of honoring cigar i am glad to be the one doing it. thank you and have a wonderful day.
On that note, I'm going to be monitoring further comments on this video; this debating is beginning to tarnish this fine race of Cigar. Let's just celebrate the horse and keep our criticisms to ourselves, shall we?
gotta disagree with you. You keep sayin he didnt beat anyone. Dont fault the horse for the competition around him, he did what he had to do. Like I said to you b4, if Dr.Fager didnt have Buckpasser and Damascus in his era, would u question his greatness too? Its not like Cigar did it at just one track, he shipped. and in the process won some of the biggest races in the country, majority of his wins in that streak were grade 1s. and its not the streak that impresses its the races he won.
You make fair points about Cigar, and I appreciate them. He could only beat who was in the running at the time. A lot of his competition was not the best, but as you said, he shipped well and proved himself on many tracks and in many G1's; that and his amazing consistency make him a very fine horse in my books. I'd like this debate to end here, please, so this video experience can focus solely on Cigar's accomplishment in this race, as it happened.
I met Cigar at KHP too! We were walking through the Hall of Champions barn to sit and watch the show and I glanced to the right and saw Cigar's face looking at me through the gate of his stall! It was very exciting. I also had the pleasure of meeting John Henry a few months before he died. I fed them both apples through gates of their doors. :o)
Tom durkin always overexagerates like he was calling great history, he knows cigar didnt posess the speed of a swaps or brilliance of a holy bull. swaps a great horse who set [9 WORLD,TRACK, AND AMERICAN RECORDS] NUFF SAID. but anyways what did cigar set the record for how to beat up on weak allowance horses.
I dont think all of the horses he beat in his Grade 1 wins were weak allowance horses. And he won 16 STRAIGHT races. Cigar isnt the greatest racehorse ever, but he is comparable. Holy Bull isnt that great, compared to others like Secretariat, Ruffian, Seattle Slew, or Man O War. Holy Bull was just a GOOD racehorse, not a GREAT one. If you want to diss Cigar, dont do it on the video that is honoring him.
Holy bull is kingpin of a 28 year span. he love to run, while other horses had anxiety about bieng on the track, no horse could touch him since the great spectacular bid, he would have probably been good as his great uncle dr fager. so what cigar showed up 16 races in a row his record is still a winded one cigar was moderatey talented horse with great consistency ,and i will say it again.
Cigar beat many of the same horses that Holy Bull did. Holy Bull only won one race over 9 furlongs and he had to give everything he had to win that day (Travers over Concern). Cigar toyed with Concern, Devil His Due,etc. Let's look at the top 5 Beyer speed figures of each horse.
Holy Bull-122,119,117,116,115
Cigar-121,118,117,117,117. If Cigar is a mediocre talent than so is Bull. The Bull ran over a 110 Beyer 8 times. Cigar ran over a 110 Beyer in each of his last 17 starts!
Wow great win cigar beating up on another sad bunch - weakest BC classic in history. Cigar was the most overrated horse of are time, end of story. Holy Bull rules!
Thank you. I strive on making all of these videos a place where people can state their opinion in a respectful, fair way. I've seen so many other channels get out of hand that it takes away from the experience of enjoying the ponies.
Please keep the name [secretariat] out of your mouth when we discuss cigar they shoudnt even be mentioned in the same breath. Ok lets forget about shitty competitors if 1/5 is equal to one lenght secretariat times of 1:45 2/5 track rec,1:59 2/5 stks and track, 1:33 stks and trck rec,2:24 wrld and trck rec 31 lenghts secretariat showed his dominance over all generations. cigar ran slow times.
You know what i got something to say,holy bull,holy bull, holy bull. I am so sorry i have a few more things to say remeber these names. skip away,dare and go,alphabet soup, and quit saying he got hung up five wide at woodbine, he had every chance to win, same against a 3 year old skip away but still lost, and dont say he got caught up in a speed duel at del mar either.
Well if you base your race horse greatness on winning 16 in a row then that is a shallow and one dimentional way to measure race horses. Believe me lets put it like this his first two years of non winning in small races has to account for his overall rating he achieved a rare feat, but that does,nt put him where they ranked him on the greatest 100 of all time.
I am sick of people saying cigar was this great horse, if you go back to his races, who did he beat can any one name them. tin can competition bill mott and the paulsons did one of the best managing jobs of all time whenever he ran against stiff competition he wasnt good enough, skip away,alphabet soup,and the mug job by mandella in pac classic, he stopped like the coward he was.
How many horses can you name that one 16 in a row. A handful maybe. No matter of competition 16 in a row is amazing. Cigar is a true great racehorse. If you go by competition Secretariat would not be a great racehorse. When there is no argument that he is the greatest of all time. Enough said
Okay, I can't be silent anymore seeing your comment "If you go by competition, Secretariat would not be a great racehorse." That is an absolutely FALSE statement! Secretariat faced EXCELLENT horses in his career, the most impressive example being his triumph over 6 OLDER champion horses in the '73 Marlboro, and FINE horses in his other races. Please research Big Red's career thoroughly before you make such an insane comment. My goodness.
Let me clear up what I was meaning by that. Earlier on this forum someone made that comment Secretariats competition was not that great. I misworded it when I wrote this. I personally believe Secretariat ran against some great competition. Sorry if I offended anyone with that comment. I believe Big Red is the greatest that every lived and I am in no way comparing the two horses because there is no comperison. Again sorry about the comment.
think b4 u talk. in the pacific classic Cigar chased Siphon thru a half in 45 4/5, 6 furlongs in 1:09 and a mile in 1:33 and still managed to take the lead b4 being overtaken by Dare and Go, Skip Away barely held on to win by a head, a few more jumps and Cigar had him and he was cutting into Alphabet Soup's lead. When he lost, he went down fighting, he didnt quit. He was game. And that what makes a champion, so to call Cigar a coward u obviously dont know what u talkin about
not a great horse?you have to be kidding lol,he was one of the best ever,and beat all comers.the breeders cup , the dubai,what are we talking about chopped liver competition.get a clue
Cigar was not really a great horse. Don't get me wrong. He was a very good horse. But when you put his 16-race win streak in the proper perspective really look at the type of competition he was facing, it's just not as impressive.
So your saying L'Carriere, Concern, Unaccounted For, Soul of the Matter, and Best Pal to name a few weren't impressive competition? At times he was running against mediocre competition but even so, to run this race in 1:59 3/5 is impressive by anyones standards. And going by the competition standard we'd have to say that Secretariat was not really a great horse either.
Mintano, I strongly disagree with your statement "And going by the competition standard we'd have to say that Secretariat was not really a great horse either." I'm hoping you were making a sarcastic point there, otherwise, please research Secretariat's career thoroughly. To imply that he faced mediocre competition is flat-out false. No offense.
He's lucky HOLY BULL was forced into early retirement. Guarantee you Cigar would not have been one of all time greats because HOLY BULL who have taken his place.
Now is the time for all of us horse lovers to step up! Thousands of horses are being slaughtered right now in the US for human consumption.Even Racehorses and pregnant mares are killed. USDA studies show over 92% of horses slaughtered are healthy and 3 out of 10 contain unhealthy chemicals.
One of the great things about having Belmont being my home track is I love the dimensions of big Sandy. There was a time when the mile and a quarter races were one turn races. The chute for the mile and an eighth was used but now it's part of the training track. Wish they'd go back to using that chute for 10 furlong races.
wow that almost drove me to teers ive never seen the whole race before but the call at the wire gives me bumps every time! and by the way ihendrix516 it was jockey elliot that smarty didnt win, he made his move waaaaaay too early in the belmont.
Elliot didn't move waaaaaaay to early, jocks do not hold their hands still and look over their shoulder coming into the stretch. I don't hate Bailey, but I agree wholeheartedly with jhendrix516. It wasn't just Bailey, Solis on Rock Hard Ten did the same damn thing. I beleive they didn't want to see a journeyman jock do something they have never done. k7m4 you need to study more on your raceriding analysis.
I forgot to add that jocks who are moving their horse are scrubbing on the horses neck(called handriding),they use the stick when they want all the horse has. Just a little helpful advice, or just watch the Belmont video over until you see what actually occurred.
he did too, the most common move is at the quarter pole right? he moved way before that, he got a three length lead when he could of saved his energy for the stretch. he didnt have any momentum left because he had already used it to take the lead. and im not the only one that thinks that.
Well I really don't care many think that way,that doesn't change the fact he never shook the reins until he hit the top of the stretch, just before that he was looking over his shoulder to keep an eye on anyone trying to get 1st run. That is pure proof he didn't move to early. You can learn alot by watching a jocks body language. Now there is no doubt smarty was amped up, that is the reason he got caught, not Elliot moving to early.
Sometimes horses who are backing up make it look like the leader is making a move, I believe that is what you were looking at. Elliot's lack of movement with his hands and his looking behind show all the signs of a jock waiting as long as he can before setting the horse down for the stretch drive.
i didnt say he had set smarty down for the stretch drive too early, what i said was that he made him go to the lead to early. a horse can go to the lead and not be ready for the stretch drive. and besides where is elliot now? i mean i know hes still jockying at the bigger tracks but not as good or as big of a rider than say laparoux, bejarono, desourmoux, or gomez.
Was devastated when the connections decided not to bring him to Australia for the Cox Plate. Would have been great to see him race Octagonal, Saintly and co on turf at WFA.
I've accidentally removed a comment by someone who was at this race and spoke of being "glad to be there to see it." When youtube prevents you from commenting too many times in succession, it cancels the reply link and puts 'remove' in it's place momentarily. Whoever posted that, please feel free to re-enter it. My apologies. Take care.
You're most welcome, karakota. Cigar was a legend indeed. The final time in this race was 1:59.58 actually, but still an amazing performance nonetheless. Take care.
"Uncomprable, invincible, unbeatable, CIGAR!" I love it!
ghanimajade 3 months ago
@ghanimajade aww always thought he said "unconquerable" Now I have to go back and listen again. Either way, I really miss Durkin's awesome, dramatic calls. He has such a way with capturing and channeling emotion. I'm so sad that he stopped calling the Breeder's Cup and now the Triple Crown.
rldean1975 2 months ago
Brilliant horse; when he won the Dubai World Cup he proved how deep he could dig. For the record, I backed Halling in the Breeders Cup Classic - tailed off by around 57 lengths :P
Laytonia1977 3 months ago
The 1995 BC Classic and the 1996 Dubai World Cup were just 2 of the races right in the middle of that 16 race win streak that Cigar accomplished to tie Citation's record. Which stood at the time. Zenyatta has since eclipsed both. But no one can ever say the Paulson's weren't sporting, and took the easy path with Cigar for his 16 straight win's. He raced in the biggest G1 races of the day, against all the best horses of his era!!
GBeret83 4 months ago
Truly, is was almost like a cruel joke that Cigar, arguably one of America's greatest horses ever, ended up being sterile, and never got to pass those champion's genes along. Coolmore-Ireland bought Cigar's breeding rights. Under agreement with Alan Paulson that Cigar would stand stud at Coolmore's American facility. Just over the past 8 or 9 years, look at the great horses that Galileo and Montjeu have sired for Coolmore-Ireland. Just imagine if they would've had Cigar prior to those two? Scary
GBeret83 4 months ago
Also As much as I do admire Cigar, Holy Bull would have had something to say that year. Don't Know whether Cigar would have gotten past The Bull.
TicinoParadise 4 months ago
now that's a racehorse
faudreechris 6 months ago
the winner's too good here
dunsta69 11 months ago
Someone tried to say Zenyatta was the best horse they've seen since Spectacular Bid. Then I showed them this video xD.
queenluciaa 1 year ago
He is now 20 and still looks fabulous. You can see him at the Kentucky Horse Park.
Saffron49 1 year ago
Great call...miss that horse
xjungfreud 1 year ago
"THE INCOMPARABLE, INVINCIBLE, UNBEATABLE CIGAR"
bnegs521 1 year ago
I can't believe he is rated only at 18th given his wins overseas. There's no much he could have achieved in his career than he did. I don't see how it's possible that any horse from now could be ranked ahead of Spectacular Bid. I wonder Zenyatta will rank if she wins her last race?
bgardiner2000 1 year ago
wow that's truly amazing!
barbaro267 1 year ago
I love to watch the jockeys get into it "but not the whip part"...He was riding the hell outta Cigar
205seeme 1 year ago
Gotta love that call. ;)
ruffianrulz 1 year ago
Still the best race call EVER!
AccentAigu05 1 year ago
One day I was at Saratoga and Durkin comes on the loud speaker, "Special anouncement, there is a massive power outage across New York State, but more importantly the 10th race at Saratoga is off the turf."
ddido4604 1 year ago
cf1970...thanks for posting...just beginning to "get into" Cigar. WOW!!! What a horse!!!
bbmtge 1 year ago
Whatever you think of Cigar, he is the fourth horse ever to go undefeated in the much more difficult handicap division while running a full schedule. The other three are Man O'War-1920, Tom Fool- 1953 and Spectacular Bid- 1980. That is pretty good company to be in.
jkmooreelle 2 years ago
My favorite Durkin line in the race occurs near the one minute mark: "Cigar wants to go to the lead, but Jerry Bailey says 'NO!... Not yet!", just the way he said it was nothing short of epic
terjer01 2 years ago
I concur.....Brilliant!!!!!
jasonm921 1 year ago
People here also seem to forget towards the end of his streak he visited another continent. 5000mile journey is not something horse's do often and still win.
COAchilles 2 years ago
I love this horse. Saw him run. He reminds me a lot of the Aussie horse Kingston Town, another champ.
SugarTomAppleRoger 2 years ago
The camerqa work is great. NBC should still do the BC.
Arps103 2 years ago
i love cigar first of all he is one of my favorites
cigar was not undeafeted he wasnt even a good horse till the streak began
but his heart was amazing
Earthamaster 2 years ago
The most impressive thing about his time being 1:59 50 is the fact that the first half mile was run in more than 48 seconds. He really had to pick up in the final 3/4 miles.
lengua92 2 years ago
by the way that was a great end call . suits CIgar perfectly
corneliagirl101 2 years ago
@corneliagirl101 yes it does.
sonjaxfactor 2 years ago
who ever says Cigar was a fluke is an idiot who wouldn't no excellence if it came up and bit you in the nose . sheesh he was darn fast, undefeated with perfect seasons and the ability to go head to head with another horse and look like he is giving all he's got but still find more for the win . he is amazing and one of the most courageous and best racehorses ever . Cigar forever !
corneliagirl101 2 years ago
Great call, great race.
God I love how smoothly Cigar moved in toward the rail off the turn.
tafari127 2 years ago
In his book Jerry Bailey says Cigar is great, that's good enough for me. Read Jerry's book.
tjprzewo 2 years ago
Cigar was a special rachorse. God only knows what he could've accomplished had he gotten to the dirt early in his career.
Skoshi33 3 years ago
alot less if holy bull didnt get hurt
porkrollboy 2 years ago
Mammamia...GRANDE CIGAR !
dorsten69Italy 3 years ago
Perhaps one of the greatest calls to date, besides Secretariat's Belmont. What a race.
DerangedAlibi 3 years ago
I agree, plus the Arazi call is awesome
bg147 2 years ago
Three wide sweep to the lead approaching the final turn. I think he did that in every race.
BluePedal 3 years ago
I've looked at the past comments on this board. Some go out of their way to knock Cigar as some tomato can of a racehorse. They scream who did he beat,and all the normal stuff. This is very similiar to what people said about Seattle Slew in his 3 yr old year. "Just a good horse in a bad lot",funny this mindset shows up constantly. Just remember this, A GREAT HORSE will make very good horses look average. Thats why it appears he ran against nobody. Thats why he won 16 straight races people! WOW!
BE109 3 years ago
i couldnt have agreed with you more. I think Cigar gets alot of flak because Holy Bull got injured in the only race they ever met up with each other. So they are probably unconciously bitter.
JSanity01 3 years ago
Be109 , could not have been better said." A great horse will make very good horses look average." Every time !!
jlowsown 3 years ago
BE109 well stated! If Cigar was a fluke how did he go undefeated? People need to think before they write. Cigar was one of the greatest! Showed up everytime after he figured out how to race! You need to go to Kentucky Horse Park & see this champ in the flesh. He has a commanding presence about him. I got to feed him some mints & pet him. I have the picture in my office. I just wish he could have sired some foals. What a shame!
pleasantcolony 2 years ago
what a call !! gave me the chills
cruzer0322 3 years ago
I had the pleasure to "meet" Cigar at the Hall of Champions at the Kentucky Horse Park and let me tell you--he's the biggest racehorse I have ever seen.
fhry6a 3 years ago
Cigar is what made me love horse racing so much, with all of a passion. Everytime I see this horse run I get chills down my spine and everything feels so good to see this horse! My all time favourite.!
marylu44 3 years ago
the camera work looks kind of cinematic. I like it.
SeaMonkey6543 3 years ago
he's such a good horse and i love him so much he was my dads fvorit horse and i love fhim so much!
barbaroluver1996 3 years ago
What a horse!
sargeanthulka 3 years ago
Cigar=Greatest NY bred
beastmanR 3 years ago
No disrespect intended, but he was born in Maryland.
DerangedAlibi 3 years ago
Cigar was bred in Maryland
JSanity01 3 years ago
why didnt cigar run in the kentucky derby
castlestar99 3 years ago
He wasn't ready as a 2yo and went unraced. Early in 3 yo campaign wasn't seen as anything more than a high level allowance/listed stakes horse.. They kept going back and forth on whether he would be a dirt or turf racer. They switched trainers to Bill Mott and he got him to run on the dirt and he began to bloom late in his 4 year old campaign.
joshb729 3 years ago
if you were there when cigar won there was a rainbow over belmont when he won!
damm416 3 years ago
By far the most wonderful race I've ever seen in person, great horse, great jockey, great race. Probably the happiest day I've ever spent at Belmont :-) Will never forget it. Thanks for the memories Cigar and Jerry Bailey!
sicilianbella35 3 years ago 2
Even in New Zealand Cigar was well known. A champion.
joesweetk 3 years ago 2
Cigar may not have been the equal of Slew, Secretariat or the Bid but unlike them he never lost a race for almost two years at a multitude of tracks and that makes him truly special.
I'm not a Denman fan. I cringe when I hear "and away they go" or when he describes a :46 half in a mile and a quarter race as "sensible". Maybe with polytrack at Santa Anita that'll change.
ebbets1965 3 years ago
You can visit Cigar at the Kentucky Horse Park in Lexington. I was there this week; what an amazing horse. When they brought him into the pavillion, he just had this look of a champion. If you can describe a horse as looking arrogant, that was him.
garetharogers 3 years ago
"The unconqurable, invinsible, unbeatable Cigar". This was my favorite racehorse.
vesco32 3 years ago
i love the camera work in this race so much. Its more exciting when they show different views like this. =]
seggymon 3 years ago 4
Totally agree. We also need NBC back doing the Breeders' Cup. I can't abide Trevor Denman; he's good, but much too monotone. I prefer Tom Durkin and his delivery much more.
Have a good week!
cf1970 3 years ago
cigar went all over the COUNTRY and the WORLD to prove how brilliant he was..cigar was a WORLD CHAMPION..a true legend
ruffchamp1 3 years ago
Any doubters about this horse's ability must not have been at Belmont that day. I had the pleasure of seeing the BC live that year, and in just a puddle of water all around the race track, Cigar toyed with the field and won easily to complete a perfect season. He and Inside Information put together the two most impressive BC wins that year. Cigar may not be in the top ten in racing history, but he has to be considered as one of the greats. Just a wonderful horse to have seen run.
sidewalkcafe2007 3 years ago 3
@sidewalkcafe2007 I have been in racing 35 years and there is zero doubt that when Cigar was right he was an all time top 12 horse....he ran a sub 2 min mile and 1/4 at least twice maybe 3 times....he was a real push button horse who could make 2 and 3 runs within a race.....anyone who thinks Cigar would not be very competitive vs slew, affirmed, spectacular bid etc really needs to go back to racing 101
renduke 2 weeks ago
Amazing horse and jockey. A horse that new exactly what he had to do. SPIRIT and that horse had loads of it!!!
hollowedhead 3 years ago
I get a kick out of the online debate. Cigar was and is my favorite race horse & one of my top 5 favorite athletes human or equine but as far as his competition goes i've got 2 words; Alphabet Soup
3 more:Dare & Go
bcstpete 3 years ago
Alright CF70, i am not in the business of tarnishing anyones video experience, i actually hold you in very high esteem, and any comments said, were not meant to offend you, or anyones experience of horse racing on these channels. my apologies all.
drfager01 3 years ago
I very much appreciate your honesty and humble spirit regarding your previous comments. I am honored that you think of me with such respect, I respect you as well. I am also pleased that we can move forward in a positive manner; many people would not have been so understanding of my concerns, for that I thank you.
Take care.
cf1970 3 years ago
Exellent dialogue by the way. its not called dissing anybody, he is what he is, a horse that did,nt beat anybody, and referencing holy bull into the cigar discussion is weak. Holy bull is what he is,and we will never know what his true ability was because he didnt finish in the donn,listen holy bull isnt the horse thats ranked 18th, so he should take flak for his short commings and if this is a way of honoring cigar i am glad to be the one doing it. thank you and have a wonderful day.
drfager01 3 years ago
On that note, I'm going to be monitoring further comments on this video; this debating is beginning to tarnish this fine race of Cigar. Let's just celebrate the horse and keep our criticisms to ourselves, shall we?
Take care.
cf1970 3 years ago
gotta disagree with you. You keep sayin he didnt beat anyone. Dont fault the horse for the competition around him, he did what he had to do. Like I said to you b4, if Dr.Fager didnt have Buckpasser and Damascus in his era, would u question his greatness too? Its not like Cigar did it at just one track, he shipped. and in the process won some of the biggest races in the country, majority of his wins in that streak were grade 1s. and its not the streak that impresses its the races he won.
JSanity01 3 years ago
You make fair points about Cigar, and I appreciate them. He could only beat who was in the running at the time. A lot of his competition was not the best, but as you said, he shipped well and proved himself on many tracks and in many G1's; that and his amazing consistency make him a very fine horse in my books. I'd like this debate to end here, please, so this video experience can focus solely on Cigar's accomplishment in this race, as it happened.
Take care.
cf1970 3 years ago
Thank you, and keep those videos coming, I really enjoy watching them.
JSanity01 3 years ago
I saw CIGAR at hollywood he did'nt look that impressive.
drfager01 4 years ago
I just saw Cigar at the Kentucky Horse Park. I felt like I was meeting a rock star.
PhoohPhah 4 years ago 3
I met Cigar at KHP too! We were walking through the Hall of Champions barn to sit and watch the show and I glanced to the right and saw Cigar's face looking at me through the gate of his stall! It was very exciting. I also had the pleasure of meeting John Henry a few months before he died. I fed them both apples through gates of their doors. :o)
kmnmiamisax 4 years ago
That is awesome. I asked the girl cleaning Cigar's stall if I could pet, as no one else was around, but she was like "no way." I was worth a shot.
PhoohPhah 4 years ago
I saw Cigar and John Henry at the Horse Park, too in 2001! It was really awesome.
tegi53 4 years ago
thank you, very smart horseman.
drfager01 4 years ago
well said drfagar01
xxjoo 4 years ago
Tom durkin always overexagerates like he was calling great history, he knows cigar didnt posess the speed of a swaps or brilliance of a holy bull. swaps a great horse who set [9 WORLD,TRACK, AND AMERICAN RECORDS] NUFF SAID. but anyways what did cigar set the record for how to beat up on weak allowance horses.
drfager01 4 years ago
I dont think all of the horses he beat in his Grade 1 wins were weak allowance horses. And he won 16 STRAIGHT races. Cigar isnt the greatest racehorse ever, but he is comparable. Holy Bull isnt that great, compared to others like Secretariat, Ruffian, Seattle Slew, or Man O War. Holy Bull was just a GOOD racehorse, not a GREAT one. If you want to diss Cigar, dont do it on the video that is honoring him.
Ruffian4Ever 3 years ago 2
Holy bull is kingpin of a 28 year span. he love to run, while other horses had anxiety about bieng on the track, no horse could touch him since the great spectacular bid, he would have probably been good as his great uncle dr fager. so what cigar showed up 16 races in a row his record is still a winded one cigar was moderatey talented horse with great consistency ,and i will say it again.
drfager01 4 years ago
Cigar beat many of the same horses that Holy Bull did. Holy Bull only won one race over 9 furlongs and he had to give everything he had to win that day (Travers over Concern). Cigar toyed with Concern, Devil His Due,etc. Let's look at the top 5 Beyer speed figures of each horse.
Holy Bull-122,119,117,116,115
Cigar-121,118,117,117,117. If Cigar is a mediocre talent than so is Bull. The Bull ran over a 110 Beyer 8 times. Cigar ran over a 110 Beyer in each of his last 17 starts!
jhordanian 3 years ago
Wow great win cigar beating up on another sad bunch - weakest BC classic in history. Cigar was the most overrated horse of are time, end of story. Holy Bull rules!
xxjoo 4 years ago
Awesome call...btw, why arnt races filmed like this anymore? its much more dramatic this way.
Thanks for the video!
Pippin76 4 years ago
Sure was! I agree, the camera angles are a lot of fun and add drama. Not sure why they've abandoned it. It would be nice to have that style return.
You're welcome.
cf1970 4 years ago
NBC filmed their Breeder's Cup races this way....look up the 1989 Classic to see great camera work.
jasonm921 4 years ago
Promise no profanity, just passionate.
mastiffs36 4 years ago
Terrific. Thanks.
cf1970 4 years ago
exellent forum.
mastiffs36 4 years ago
Thank you. I strive on making all of these videos a place where people can state their opinion in a respectful, fair way. I've seen so many other channels get out of hand that it takes away from the experience of enjoying the ponies.
Take care.
cf1970 4 years ago
cigar was best in his generation only.You just cannot say he is the best ever.
There is only 2 greatest horse ever lived until today and that is Man o war and secretariat
FORESTDONS 4 years ago
Please keep the name [secretariat] out of your mouth when we discuss cigar they shoudnt even be mentioned in the same breath. Ok lets forget about shitty competitors if 1/5 is equal to one lenght secretariat times of 1:45 2/5 track rec,1:59 2/5 stks and track, 1:33 stks and trck rec,2:24 wrld and trck rec 31 lenghts secretariat showed his dominance over all generations. cigar ran slow times.
mastiffs36 4 years ago
I agree with a lot of what you're saying in this statement, but please, no profanity here.
Thanks for the comments, and for your co-operation with my request.
cf1970 4 years ago
You know what i got something to say,holy bull,holy bull, holy bull. I am so sorry i have a few more things to say remeber these names. skip away,dare and go,alphabet soup, and quit saying he got hung up five wide at woodbine, he had every chance to win, same against a 3 year old skip away but still lost, and dont say he got caught up in a speed duel at del mar either.
mastiffs36 4 years ago
Well if you base your race horse greatness on winning 16 in a row then that is a shallow and one dimentional way to measure race horses. Believe me lets put it like this his first two years of non winning in small races has to account for his overall rating he achieved a rare feat, but that does,nt put him where they ranked him on the greatest 100 of all time.
mastiffs36 4 years ago
I am sick of people saying cigar was this great horse, if you go back to his races, who did he beat can any one name them. tin can competition bill mott and the paulsons did one of the best managing jobs of all time whenever he ran against stiff competition he wasnt good enough, skip away,alphabet soup,and the mug job by mandella in pac classic, he stopped like the coward he was.
mastiffs36 4 years ago
16 in a row baby
dckundr 4 years ago
How many horses can you name that one 16 in a row. A handful maybe. No matter of competition 16 in a row is amazing. Cigar is a true great racehorse. If you go by competition Secretariat would not be a great racehorse. When there is no argument that he is the greatest of all time. Enough said
Rodney81818 4 years ago
Okay, I can't be silent anymore seeing your comment "If you go by competition, Secretariat would not be a great racehorse." That is an absolutely FALSE statement! Secretariat faced EXCELLENT horses in his career, the most impressive example being his triumph over 6 OLDER champion horses in the '73 Marlboro, and FINE horses in his other races. Please research Big Red's career thoroughly before you make such an insane comment. My goodness.
Peace.
cf1970 4 years ago
Let me clear up what I was meaning by that. Earlier on this forum someone made that comment Secretariats competition was not that great. I misworded it when I wrote this. I personally believe Secretariat ran against some great competition. Sorry if I offended anyone with that comment. I believe Big Red is the greatest that every lived and I am in no way comparing the two horses because there is no comperison. Again sorry about the comment.
Rodney81818 4 years ago
No problem. I just want people to know that Secretariat's competition was top rate.
Thanks for the clarification.
cf1970 4 years ago
think b4 u talk. in the pacific classic Cigar chased Siphon thru a half in 45 4/5, 6 furlongs in 1:09 and a mile in 1:33 and still managed to take the lead b4 being overtaken by Dare and Go, Skip Away barely held on to win by a head, a few more jumps and Cigar had him and he was cutting into Alphabet Soup's lead. When he lost, he went down fighting, he didnt quit. He was game. And that what makes a champion, so to call Cigar a coward u obviously dont know what u talkin about
JSanity01 3 years ago
not a great horse?you have to be kidding lol,he was one of the best ever,and beat all comers.the breeders cup , the dubai,what are we talking about chopped liver competition.get a clue
pdg63 4 years ago
cigar 16 in a row, he went to dubai in the middle east to prove what a brilliant champion he was...a world champion
ruffchamp1 4 years ago 2
Cigar... a true legend.
bubcasto 4 years ago 2
Cigar was awesome. One of the few great racehorses.
Rodney81818 4 years ago
Cigar was not really a great horse. Don't get me wrong. He was a very good horse. But when you put his 16-race win streak in the proper perspective really look at the type of competition he was facing, it's just not as impressive.
taylordeloss 4 years ago
So your saying L'Carriere, Concern, Unaccounted For, Soul of the Matter, and Best Pal to name a few weren't impressive competition? At times he was running against mediocre competition but even so, to run this race in 1:59 3/5 is impressive by anyones standards. And going by the competition standard we'd have to say that Secretariat was not really a great horse either.
Mintano 4 years ago
Mintano, I strongly disagree with your statement "And going by the competition standard we'd have to say that Secretariat was not really a great horse either." I'm hoping you were making a sarcastic point there, otherwise, please research Secretariat's career thoroughly. To imply that he faced mediocre competition is flat-out false. No offense.
Peace.
cf1970 4 years ago
It was meant sarcastically lol. I've seen what Secretariat was up against.
Mintano 4 years ago
Thank you so much, everyone, for your kind support, comments and input. I'm very happy that you've enjoyed the video! God bless.
cf1970 4 years ago
Thank you for posting Cigar's footage. Tom Durkin is fabulous, and for Cigar, well...he is legend
CraftyTequila 4 years ago 2
Thank you so much for posting this! I've looked everywhere for it.
1Jayhawk1 4 years ago
cigar..16 in succession as cigar assumes the crown of immortality! cigar is an unstoppable dynamo
ruffchamp1 4 years ago
He's lucky HOLY BULL was forced into early retirement. Guarantee you Cigar would not have been one of all time greats because HOLY BULL who have taken his place.
toongoon88 4 years ago
Cigar was just an incredible racehorse, one of the all time greats!
BE109 4 years ago
Now is the time for all of us horse lovers to step up! Thousands of horses are being slaughtered right now in the US for human consumption.Even Racehorses and pregnant mares are killed. USDA studies show over 92% of horses slaughtered are healthy and 3 out of 10 contain unhealthy chemicals.
mercuryepiphany"DOT"com/horses/when_is_a_problem_not_a_proble.html
equineadvocates"DOT"com/hs/inside2.html
hsus"DOT"org/horses_equines/
timwoolleyracing"DOT"com/
wvarab 4 years ago
"andrewmalveaux (2 months ago) The INCOMPARABLE, INVINCIBLE, UNBEATABLE, CI-GAR! I still get chills too."
Whew!! Tell me about it!!! I actually got teary eyed, 'cause for once the call matched the horse running as well!
Brilliant horse! I wonder if we might have had a triple crown winner with this guy (?)
toobe2 4 years ago
Cigar was just awesome! OMG!
passion4horseracing 4 years ago
I have Cigar's Breyer! wow! :)
rooroogirl 4 years ago
i just got the barbaro model!!!!! IM SO EXCITED!!!
passion4horseracing 4 years ago
One of the great things about having Belmont being my home track is I love the dimensions of big Sandy. There was a time when the mile and a quarter races were one turn races. The chute for the mile and an eighth was used but now it's part of the training track. Wish they'd go back to using that chute for 10 furlong races.
bigbird914 4 years ago
that horse can run!
TrailRiderUSA 4 years ago
wow that almost drove me to teers ive never seen the whole race before but the call at the wire gives me bumps every time! and by the way ihendrix516 it was jockey elliot that smarty didnt win, he made his move waaaaaay too early in the belmont.
k7m4 4 years ago
Elliot didn't move waaaaaaay to early, jocks do not hold their hands still and look over their shoulder coming into the stretch. I don't hate Bailey, but I agree wholeheartedly with jhendrix516. It wasn't just Bailey, Solis on Rock Hard Ten did the same damn thing. I beleive they didn't want to see a journeyman jock do something they have never done. k7m4 you need to study more on your raceriding analysis.
BE109 4 years ago
I forgot to add that jocks who are moving their horse are scrubbing on the horses neck(called handriding),they use the stick when they want all the horse has. Just a little helpful advice, or just watch the Belmont video over until you see what actually occurred.
BE109 4 years ago
he did too, the most common move is at the quarter pole right? he moved way before that, he got a three length lead when he could of saved his energy for the stretch. he didnt have any momentum left because he had already used it to take the lead. and im not the only one that thinks that.
k7m4 4 years ago
Well I really don't care many think that way,that doesn't change the fact he never shook the reins until he hit the top of the stretch, just before that he was looking over his shoulder to keep an eye on anyone trying to get 1st run. That is pure proof he didn't move to early. You can learn alot by watching a jocks body language. Now there is no doubt smarty was amped up, that is the reason he got caught, not Elliot moving to early.
BE109 4 years ago
Sometimes horses who are backing up make it look like the leader is making a move, I believe that is what you were looking at. Elliot's lack of movement with his hands and his looking behind show all the signs of a jock waiting as long as he can before setting the horse down for the stretch drive.
BE109 4 years ago
i didnt say he had set smarty down for the stretch drive too early, what i said was that he made him go to the lead to early. a horse can go to the lead and not be ready for the stretch drive. and besides where is elliot now? i mean i know hes still jockying at the bigger tracks but not as good or as big of a rider than say laparoux, bejarono, desourmoux, or gomez.
k7m4 4 years ago
Hate Jerry Bailey cause he intentionally pushed the pace to wear Smarty down in the Belmont with a horse who couldnt win. Love Cigar though.
jhendrix516 4 years ago
The INCOMPARABLE, INVINCIBLE, UNBEATABLE, CI-GAR! I still get chills too.
andrewmalveaux 4 years ago
I had $200,000 on the big guy in this race..
whoppertopper 4 years ago
I still get excited when I hear tom durkins call at the wire. 12 years sure goes fast
bcstpete 4 years ago
a cornation of a true champion that day.
JSanity01 4 years ago
Cigar and Jerry(Jockey), is one of the best horse.
wildwilly2k7 5 years ago
Was devastated when the connections decided not to bring him to Australia for the Cox Plate. Would have been great to see him race Octagonal, Saintly and co on turf at WFA.
bgardiner2000 5 years ago
Two horse racing greats: Animal and man; Cigar and Jerry Bailey. It just doesn't get much better. Thank you for posting this video.
OnTheMoneyMooney 5 years ago
Thanks. Glad you liked it. Yep, Cigar & Bailey were amazing. Take care.
cf1970 5 years ago
I've accidentally removed a comment by someone who was at this race and spoke of being "glad to be there to see it." When youtube prevents you from commenting too many times in succession, it cancels the reply link and puts 'remove' in it's place momentarily. Whoever posted that, please feel free to re-enter it. My apologies. Take care.
cf1970 5 years ago
great stuff, have any alysheba vs ferdinand rivalry?
bettydaw1970 5 years ago
Poor Ferdinand. Makes my heart hurt to think about him
slug863 5 years ago
cigar won 16 in a row.the greatest horse ive ever seen, absolutely brilliant to see him in person.
ruffchamp1 5 years ago
Ruffchamp1, I wish! What fun that would have been to have seen him in person. He was sensational. Take care.
cf1970 5 years ago
1:58:58 without competing either, truly a legend.
Thank you
karakota 5 years ago
You're most welcome, karakota. Cigar was a legend indeed. The final time in this race was 1:59.58 actually, but still an amazing performance nonetheless. Take care.
cf1970 5 years ago
cf1970, you are truly a racing fan's hero!
Thank you again.
JohnFPorcaro 5 years ago
Thanks John. You're too kind. Glad you enjoyed the video. God bless.
cf1970 5 years ago