Torsten Reil: Using biology to make better animation

[crudhousefull]

Add the five senses. Give it needs to survive or abilities will diminish and you have a primitive functional AI of a person. I hope other people start thinking this way and we'll have a virtual person in 50 years

[crudhousefull]

This is so far from trivia it's not even funnyl. The is the end objective of all programming. I remember thinking about whether this would be done 15 years ago programming in turbo pascal. Honestly I thought that it would have progressed much more than it has these few years. Why do all the work yourself when you can have the computer do it for you!?

[RIMESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS]

Why haven't they taken this tech and put it in an actual robot?

[Shadowstray]

@RIMESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS

The problem with robots is that sensing the environment is the hard part. The famous Asimo can't do anything unless it's given a full 3D map of everything it's going to encounter. Besides, you don't want to actually drop a robot that costs more than you'd make in the next 20-30 years :)

[Cssaarr]

@RIMESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS man i was absolutly stunned asking my self exactly the same !

[UnluckyGambler]

i wouldnt be surprised if someone made a game called beat your wife.

[towdow3]

this is what NEXT GEN SHOULD BE in gaming. can u imagine 2k11 or fifa/ pes with this tech?

[lygophile]

and then we'll do the same for other psychological aspects, until we come up with self-conscious minds. we put them in a artificial world, where we allow them to more-or-less exist on their own, and develop of their own accord in a natural fashion, and see how they creature societies etc on their own.

and we will call ourselves God.

[007Thiago]

@lygophile programmers are gods !

[DontTouchMyTea]

It's a really interesting thing this man shows us, I just wish he'd sell it better. Especially the drinking while talking is annoying. And afterwards, he sounds like he's gonna burp at any moment.

Can't he just talk for 20 minutes, and drink as much as he likes afterwards?

[lbarounis]

Amazing.

[OverusedChewToy]

Neural networks have been around for ages. Good to see them getting used properly..took long enough!

[KeepThaT]

Sweden's proud! :D

[MrCollisam]

um, he's German

[BoozyBeggar]

I had the idea of human sim for video games for about 7 years.

[CamNM1991]

This is the software that GTA 4 utilizes =)

NaturalMotion

[BoozyBeggar]

Serious? GTA4 uses this? Shit, I gotta get f'sho, now.

[rankalot]

The trouble with this technology is that the application is video games will be difficult at best......how would we control the character if the simulation has has a adapting personality?

[WarriorPega]

By setting limits to his evolution. Plus, it's not AI. He can't do anything you don't want him to.

[rankalot]

This is the birth of "terminator technology".......I want you to think logically about this, even as a mathmatical equation.... We must limit how far we can go with this. I feel this way because this video is fucking amazing!!!!!! The technology is "theoretically linked" to time travel......Well a variation, but it is still this "real tech"

[matthewgutz]

omg kool

[ickbar11]

As far as games go most developers realistically are going to figure out another method of animating realistically without doing it the computationally expensive way that lags bigtime.

An analogy would be ray tracing where it yields the most accurate lighting model but is solely used in pre-rendered animation.

[SchumannSC]

i have been thinking this for so long lol

[phazt]

wow this is brilliant

[menkaur]

nice.... it will make postal 4 far more exiting ....

[Sondre7]

This technology is such an important step towards the future. If we can really perfect simulation of human motion that can have an improving effect on everything from safety equipment to interactive MMORPGs. Just awesome.

[morelshaman]

Amazing technology!

Funny how the audience reacts to a two-legged animation (no other limbs or head) as though it is a biped (human or otherwise) as long as the biped seems to move "humanly".

Really showcases the power of using the evolutionary method in programming.

Baby-steps towards the Matrix...

[herbg3]

How does this differ from some of the newer physics systems available from non-mainstream animation studios?

[intrepgun]

this mixes in the wonder and creativity of advertisement.

[randomgurn]

Given any physics engine, this method enables you to breed an "actor" which behaves (locally) optimally under the rules of that physics system. This isn't about the physics (as DistinctiveBlend pointed out), it's about the AI.

[orhanc1]

Agreed. If any branch of science, the most important would be biology. The physics would be for the slippery ice or other environments.

[atypicalguy]

They should teach two of those figures to fight each other. Bet you'd get some cool martial arts coriography with that.

[EddyBergman]

Yeah, that's a very cool idea. I'd love to see that. :)

[kjmorley]

Lol, would look just like the fight scene in "Team America".

[thatguy4m711]

@atypicalguy then there will be human right ppl who will come and stop that too

[Darsises]

If it isn't this software, it is something very very similar.

[Darsises]

This software is built into modern animation programs. Generally it is only used to give a basic foundation for an animation. The animator then tweaks it until it looks more fluid and realistic.

[celshader]

This reminds me of the ragdoll technology that is in doom 3. But that was more for death animation rather than other actions.

[harryogre]

very cool stuff

[Inzan3]

Now if you combine that with the head tracking technology you can make some great games! Can you imagine a boxing game?

[Tanru2000]

20 minute talks - I wish uni lectures were this long. 40-50 minutes and you start to drift.

[greycloud24]

The implications of this could be amazing. If this technology scales with computers, it may be possible for us to learn from reactions by these simulations. Theoretically these simulations could undergo several stages of evolution rather rapidly and "evolve" better reflexes than us. We may be learn better ways to react to our environment that increase our chance to survive accidents. Anyhow i think this may be a strong part of the singularity.

[b4skin]

greycloud24: that's the kind of reaction I had (seeing a connection between a babies attempts at walking behavior possibly being reflected in the initial stages of testing this programming. More to your point, thinking it might be used in sports tech. to improve the actual physics of movement given specific variables.

[Drynae]

AI is probably the only thing that stands in a way for making a perfect game. Not sure if there could ever be a perfect game, but we're sure heading in that direction.

AI in games has always been a problem. Ragdoll is good, but for corpses.. and this isn't ragdoll. It's trying to 'survive' a fall. Unlike Crysis, which you can throw a human in the air and just dies, completely lifeless. I'd like to see some better AI in physics and in all their senses.

[randomgurn]

I disagree that AI is the /only/ thing standing in the way. Personally, I find that controllers aren't intuitive or flexible enough. If you have a character with 100s of degrees of freedom, and a controller with just a handful, therein lies a big problem.

And then there is the problem of realistic haptic feedback...

[Drynae]

Can't argue with that. Haven't thought of the controlers. I'm pretty sure they are finding new ways to deal with that.

Total freedom would be controling a game with the mind. Using our own brainwaves as input.

[12354blahbla]

wait WTF... this talk is 5 years old.

[OMGLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL]

I've already done this.

[randomgurn]

Great! Where's the video of you presenting it at TED?

[chikotube]

this AI has so much implications, not just for CGI. Just throw those algorithms in a walking machine, for example.

[smayhew]

ummm...just for laughs...bottle opening closing...drinking water...swallowing water and talking...

this guy is really irritating.

im just not sure how novel this software is. granted, it is a different approach but adding physics to game characters has been around for a long time now, just hasn't been practical due to processing and storage needs. just check out havok and Karma physics SDK in the unreal engine...anyway...i think his simulations look terrible. ragdoll physics are beter.

[DistinctiveBlend]

You (and others) missed the point Scott, it's all about the AI, not the physics..

All current ragdolls (that I know of) are 'dumb', the last 10 mins of this video shows 'smart' ragdolls which are far superior.

[smayhew]

Alright, for NPCs in a sandbox game such as GTA4 it might be pretty cool - I'll give you that...as long as the processing isn't too demanding and it is practical to implement. Still, I think it has a way to go (this lecture is 5 years old? probably it has advanced since then?)for the ragdolling to look not just believable, but cool. Coolness is created by exaggeration, not imitation, it's the difference between handkeyed animation and mocap. The difference between Pixar and the uncanny valley.

[smayhew]

...and, maybe...I was just put off by the messenger, not the message.

[b4skin]

Blade Runner here we come!

[semiliteratedgod]

dunno how they simulate the human evolution lol

the guy is like "here's this shit" and "there it walks like a human"

I suspect some deception here...

[DistinctiveBlend]

"I suspect some deception here..."

Nope, you should read about genetic programming, very easy to use in C++, Java...whatever language you like.

[semiliteratedgod]

I see your point (and I'm familiar with GA's)

Nevertheless there are many many obstacles when you're trying to do something like this, ... and man, many people are trying:)

[semiliteratedgod]

for instance, its movement won't be human-like just because it's a GA (even if it's C++, or Java lol), or did they run it on HUMAN SIZE Genom (DNA)? lmao

Trust me, there were lots of hard work ("almost animation") and it's very primitive, can't adopt because of that

so deception is appropriate.....

[DistinctiveBlend]

semiliteratedgod,

Just thought you were calling the GA process into question, understandably this example is extremely primitive when compared to a real human.

[randomgurn]

Of course its movement isn't human-like because it's a GA; its movement is human-like because they designed a fitness function which rewards human-like movements (in exactly the same way as any characteristic only persists if the fitness function rewards it).

[randomgurn]

Incidentally, analyzing the human genome wouldn't help - after all, newborn babies can't walk (albeit partly because their legs are too weak) - it is something that you learn to do through trial and error.

The human genome determines that the child has two legs etc; it's up to the child to work out the best way to use them!

[smayhew]

that and many of their bones are neither fused together or even connected...in their arms, legs, skull...its not simply that their legs are too weak, but rather, they are physically unable to do so.

[b4skin]

Should've known...techno dancers are really just uncoordinated lifeless shells trying to regain their balance!

[lordtalon69]

I dunno why but that gave me a surprisingly large belly laugh. heh.

[danno1111]

I think it's funny that a little block with legs falling over make everyone burst out in laughter... I laughed too.

[ozjthomas]

Awesome. Saw some samples of this from GTA 4 and have to agree it looks much better than old computer AI. Still needs a long way to go to look human, but it can be a useful tool.

[JesusEinstein]

dog shit

[IChoseTheRedPill]

very cool

[lougeeiam]

wow that was stupid. People have been doing this since the first 3D games with human characters. This is honestly nothing new at all.

[infinit888]

"People have been doing this since the first 3D games with human characters. This is honestly nothing new at all."

You're an idiot. These simulations don't need human characters that's the hole point! They use artificial neural networks (aka AI) to simulate things better, faster, easier and what is best spontaneously to generate interactive gameplay. You're able to observe behaviors which were not programmed/simulated for.

[randomgurn]

My understanding of this is that they are using GAs to breed ANNs, and then taking the best solution as a "black box" which is then the same for all time. The learning process is simply too computationally expensive (he says 4hrs in the video) to run online.

Thus, the simulated character isn't "intelligent", but the ANN used to control it was created using AI.

(That's my interpretation of it, anyway)

[Shezmu]

As someone who is interested in the game industry, I must say that this has made my week. O_O

[Funkypotat0]

I can't wait until they have this technology in all games.

[Grishenko11]

Wow, I never thought I would stoop so low...