Charles "Rad Geek" Johnson chats it up with MHD about Agorism

[hemligkarlek]

Dude on the left - quit nodding! SO distracting. Other than that - great video.

[withDefiance]

Agorism/market anarchism is the total deniel that capitalism or 'the market' can be just as opressive as a state. Why would it not be? Why are the morals of the market (which currently already rules) better then those of the state? Which is their instrument. The instrument will be in their hands anyway if you remove the state it will just have another name eg. Private army. And those who have no money can get less protection? Weird society you want.

[octothorn]

@withDefiance

What rules? No fraud, no theft no force? Those are the rules. What's the problem?

[withDefiance]

@octothorn It is not that it has rules, it is dominating... and its dominating of the will of the people. That is what opression is. If its the market that makes it profitable to opress the other or to take from the other what is not theirs.

[octothorn]

@withDefiance

Dominating? How?

[withDefiance]

@octothorn Because those companies have no interest but making profit. And are not in the hands of the people but of the owners... and they can make plans that are not in the interest of those people.

[octothorn]

@withDefiance

They make profit by providing a service and making people happy. You want to be happy, don't you?

So if you avoid the businesses that make you unhappy, and use the ones that do, then you are participating in the constructive process.

Don't you buy anything from a company that makes you happy?

[withDefiance]

@withDefiance

Next to that capitalism is based upon growth, endless growth, and there is an end to this planet. So its not sustainable at all. Not in the far future, and for me not now eighter, because there are a lot of beautiful places, people etc, that are being chased from the places where they lived for centuries just and exactly for this profit.

[octothorn]

@withDefiance

What do you mean by "growth" in that context?

[octothorn]

@withDefiance

Because the means for the market is to benefit both the buyer and the seller. The actions are voluntary, so rational individuals only participate when it is to their benefit.

On the other hand, the mechanism of the state is to apply force. Individuals are forced to interact with the state on threat of harm, so rational individuals interact with the state only to opt for the lesser harm.

Interaction with the state always involves minimisation of harm, not benefit.

[Oiaku]

lol neckbeards

[enemyartistkristofeR]

peace. love. anarchy

[withDefiance]

@enemyartistkristofeR

This has (almost) nothing to do with anarchism

[juju5000]

MHD, You should try to interview Roderick T. Long.

[semyaza666]

I agree with Agorism except for it's stand on intellectual property rights. I have a friend who is an artist and she makes a living off her art and characters she creates. Lately, she is finding 'bootleg" products featuring her characters. How can it be just for someone to take her characters (much like a cartoon character) and make money off them without her permission? Is an agorist going to say 'tough luck"? I just don't see agorism as a friend to the artistic community.

[baggytheo]

She can only think of those characters as her own property if they remain within the confines of her own mind. Information is infinitely reproducible, exceedingly more so here in the information age. Property is only that which must be utilized exclusively by one agent, and since duplicating a piece of information does not deprive that information's originator or bearer of their own holding of the information, it can not be viewed as an infringement on property rights.

[baggytheo]

Would a "friend" to the artistic community go around threatening people with violence or theft or imprisonment if they copied pieces of information that one party (artists) intended to benefit by exclusively?

[ufee]

Agorism is a technique. You can't disagree. It's impossible. It's like saying you disagree with football.

All you can do is hope your government can scare enough people into abstaining from agorist techniques.

[enemyartistkristofeR]

my thoughts on the subject, as an artist myself, I have seen my images "around" as well, sometimes for sale, others online or whatever, to me, that is the greatest form of flattery, not to mention that it spreads you work around for others to see. If you care more about making money than expressing your ideas through art, maybe art isn't the proper venue. But if you enjoy the exposure simply on a creative level, then you have to deal with it. Besides, who said it would have sold otherwise?!

[NewVinland]

@semyaza666 No one stole the characters. She willingly submitted her ideas on paper and sold them to other people. It thus became the property of people even at that moment. Everything anybody invents is the product of other influences. No one calls those things thievery. Although I am in disagreement with you, there are some within Agorism/Anarcho-Capitalism who would be in agreement with you. These are things we can discuss peacefully.

[octothorn]

@semyaza666

So your friend is having trouble with bootlegged products featuring her characters? Sounds like the laws prohibiting it don't work so well.

What do you suggest?

[motorhomediaries]

thanks for letting us know -- it's been fixed now.

[DeraJa]

I love what you guys are doing! It is inspiring to see all the libertarian activism around the country.

[D4Shawn]

That was a really great interview!