hmmm... most of you guys who are commenting negatively on ECT are citing or giving examples or ECTs done a few decades ago... you do realize it isn't done the same way at all anymore, do you?! And that most of the time the side effects from the ECT are short lasting? And that in many instances psychotherapy (antidepressants and others) have more side effects than ECT?
I finished my treatment of 12 ECT's today. It saved my life. I am a British (living in Canada) 42 year old mother of two small girls who was suicidal. I have had NO adverse side effects from these procedures apart from a little SHORT TERM memory loss and confusion. Please do not comment negtively unless you have been through this treatment and it didnt work for you. Millions are helped by having it. It is NOT barbaric. Far from it.
Unless you've had ect dont speak on its effectiveness,i assure you theres many more success stories then stories of people dieing or suffering permenant memory loss.DO YOU REALLY THINK COUNTIRES LIKE THE U.S,CANADA AND THE U.K would let something that you people say is so harmfull continue, no they wouldn't and if your argument is that its a billion dollar industry then please dont even comment back.
the doctors who do or advocate this practice that are fucking criminals, should be judged and sentenced to death. Or even worse, sentenced to the slow and pathethic endlife they inflict the people they shock.
if anyone wants real studies, patient stories of years of memory loss, deaths from ECT, you can message me, I have a vested interest in exposing the lies, misinformation, including knowing they now "shock" the mentally retarded and dementia patients who have no way of informed consent, do you see? I thought Michelle bachman was crazy at her vaccination beliefs, although I hate her personally I happen to understand even the people who you think are on your side, often lie as well.
@dfowler351976 I'd be more than happy to help you with your stories if you want. I just had two, only two, but I would rather die than have another one. I have been left vulnerable, my memory barely last a minute, I feel like my soul has been taken from me. Miracle? Maybe for some. I'm leaning more towards lawsuit.
ECT IS brain damaging, now doctors more freely admit it. The studies show it even recent ones. the ECT of yesteryear the kind that Ernest Hemingway famously killed himself, saying "what these shock doctors don't know is what shock does to writers...etc." famous quote google it...I was one of the desperate naive Americans who bought into the authority of the pysche industry basically LYING to me saying no chance of memory loss, or not permanent, a year plus of networking with survivors,
@dfowler351976 it's shocking the brain ok? my father an electrical engineer was duped because the ECT docs don't tell the volts current, joules, or raw energy, it's enough to light a strong light bulb, the scientologists may sound crazy, but they also happen to be right. One thing I've learned is not to blindly trust doctors, or people in authoritarian positions, they frequently LIE, this is not B.S. doctors lie, human beings are corrupt as hell...ECT is being "phased out"
A lot of people think this is not helpful but in all honesty it is prob just as helpful as taking a ton of medications. The best treatment for depression to me is cognitive behavioral therapy( most of the time there is an underlying problem causing this feeling of depression).
@shadowJ133 it's "closed head injury" brian damage, shown time again in scores of studies...it's actually more damaging to the brain than in the ECT that was used orignially to slaughter pigs, google it, if you want...shock is as simple as 450 volts of 9 ampiers of current shot inot your brain...I work with survivors, done the reading. doctors lie, and now even top hospitals are trying to stop it's use, the industry gets huge profits, it's brain damage, I have 40 studies,
@dfowler351976 sorry I have collected 40 studies. in the past 1950's ECT was considered torture, and was used to torture from the Catholic church, to Nazi Germany, no truth is more "conspiracy sounding" than fiction often....ECT doctors make at least a hundred or more per shock, it's highly lucraative, there is no informed consent...a 12 year old could intuitively realize shocking a brain has to be destructive. Put it bluntly, imagine energy mugh higher than a light bulb
@poopoopanties nope see my comment below, even big hosptials are now not recommending it. brain damage is worse than in the past, I have studeied up and run groups with ECT survivors, doctors can be such liars...the only difference is modified shock does not break bones, and cause physical pain. but many still feel horrible head aches, and lose years of memory, I can't prove this to you in one comment but it's naive people like you that don't bother to see past the spin.
This is a life-saving procedure....made more humane today for those who suffer from depression and other mental illnesses...I have a history of MI and addiction in my family, and so far other drugs have worked for me. I would only hope that if I reached bottom, my family would use ECT to save my life.
@vgoth100 bullshit, even Mcleans ECT doctor admitted finally to me the voltage and current is higher than in the past, he skirted the issue, but admitted also to paitens losing 10 years of memory, I've done my homework. Sackeim study 07 proves it brain damages 100% of patients, keep in mind Harold Sackeim is one huge ECT proponent with money ties to the ECT lobby
it is WORSE on the brain as current (does the damage) is 3X higher. you probably are an ECT doc yourself@!
@dfowler351976 woah, i am not a doc, far from it. I am a lowly English lit major who happens to have some relatives who have had ECT in the 50s-60s, and they are now dead. I also have relatives who have such severe depression that they are agreeing to ECT. I also have my mother and father who believe in protection over the real fact that they were both lied to and verbally/physically abused in childhood. Merry xmas.
@ thegammerhippo sorry didn't mean to post so many replies to u - I didn't think they were posting so I kept hitting the button again lol! It's late for me - going to sleep - good night - sweet dreams to you all!
hey I agree w/ u thegammerhippo that was a ignorant remark about just have a beer etc. & cheer up - right! I know depression - I'm severely BiPolar so is my Mom she tried to kill herself many times when I was growing up. I also was molested at an early age but am over that now thankfully. I have been on so many meds - they just didn't work for me - I kept having manic episodes where I was dillusional & had to be hospitalized several times. It was very hard on my 3 children. Much better now!
if you look through my comments I actually didn't say I support ECT. I was just saying that weed (THC) can make matters worse and that not all depression is caused cos people can't "cheer the fuck up". I don't know much about ECT hence why I looked this video up to start with. I will also look up what you recommend as I believe you should know all the facts before judging.
@Kadadj Number 1 :- i never once said people choose depression did i ? no ! ok so thats your first point wrong ! Number 2 :- you call me a retard well take a look at your comment "trough" did you mean "through" ? and "you Loose the ability to feel good shit" did you mean "lose the ability" ? see when you call somebody a retard make sure you can fucking spell first not to mention that "you lose the ability to feel good shit" does not even make fucking sense ! are you a retard ? i think soooooooo
I would gladly sacrifice my memory to not suffer from depression and anxiety, though they are both just moderate, so I hope talk therapy and lifestyle changes is going to get me out of it.
well let me clarify. I was molested at a young age and smoking the marijuana as a teen is what lead me to severe anxiety disorder and deepened my pre existing genetic pre-disposition to depression thanks to my mum and dad both having it. you should really shut the fuck up about things you have no idea about. Depression is a chemical imbalance not just a whiney person who thinks not having that new slim ps3 means their life is "the worst".
@thegamerhippo Search for a video in youtube on DIANA LOPER and watch it , see if what i am saying about ECT is stupid ! tell Diana loper she is stupid ! clearly you need some educating on this subject yourself ! as for your past i am very sorry to hear that , my mother went through a similar ordeal so i can understand how this can scar a person for life but my mother went to a phyciatrist and spoke to them without the need for medication or "therapy" , this treatment is not necesary !
well let me clarify. I was molested at a young age and smoking the marijuana as a teen is what lead me to severe anxiety disorder and deepened my pre existing pre-disposition to depression thanks to my mum and dad both having it. you should really shut the fuck up about things you have no idea about. Depression is a chemical imbalance not just a whiney person who thinks not having that new slim ps3 means their life is "the worst".
@thegamerhippo hey I agree w/ u that was a ignorant remark about just have a beer etc. & cheer up - right! I know depression - I'm severely BiPolar so is my Mom she tried to kill herself many times when I was growing up. I also was molested at an early age but am over that now thankfully. I have been on so many meds - they just didn't work for me - I kept having manic episodes where I was dillusional & had to be hospitalized several times. It was very hard on my 3 children.
@thegamerhippo hey I agree w/ u that was a ignorant remark about just have a beer etc. & cheer up - right! I know depression - I'm severely BiPolar so is my Mom she tried to kill herself many times when I was growing up. I also was molested at an early age but am over that now thankfully. I have been on so many meds - they just didn't work for me - I kept having manic episodes where I was dillusional & had to be hospitalized several times. It was very hard on my 3 children.
@thegamerhippo hey I agree w/ u that was a ignorant remark about just have a beer etc. & cheer up - right! I know depression - I'm severely BiPolar so is my Mom she tried to kill herself many times when I was growing up. I also was molested at an early age but am over that now thankfully. I have been on so many meds - they just didn't work for me - I kept having manic episodes where I was dillusional & had to be hospitalized several times. It was very hard on my 3 children. My family & friends
@sriwai1 I think weed is an excellent medication for anxiety & depression. I've used it since I was 15 yrs old, I'm 40 now. After I was diagnosed BiPolar & tried many meds for years, was in & out of the hospital, I now have had 15+ ECT treatments & no longer need meds (or their side effects)! But clinical depression isn't something you personally can understand if you haven't experienced it. It is an illness that requires treatment. A hormone imbalance can cause depression. Educate yourself plz!
@annaban333 clinical depression i can understand , but your telling me that the answer to that is to shoot electricity through your brain ? to actually cause your body to convulse and enter a form of seizure ? even doctors and top medical brains have been on youtube and admit they dont know why this would help with depression , so your going to let somebody shoot electricity through your brain when they dont even know the true effects ? i think wwwtotalitaerde is 100% correct
@sriwai1 ECT has worked wonders fr me. Meds failed to keep me from mania I am severely BiPolar so is my Mom. She tried to killl herself many times as I was growing up & mental illness was even less understood back then. It's a miracle she's alive today - she has even survived breast cancer! My family & friends are so pleased with the results of ECT for me it's been wonderful!
@annaban333 dont you worry about the long term effect to your brain ? i mean from what i have seen on youtube even a lot of doctors say that they dont know what the long term effects are
@sriwai1 Yes & No - I worry more about being insane than I do brain damage. I watched the Laura videos last night & I'm sorry that happened to her - that was years ago & I think there are laws to protect "us" (the mentally ill) now that would prevent stuff like that from happening today (I sure hope - cause that was awful).
@annaban333 I'm 34 and have had 'clinical' depression since I was diagnosed at 13. I have been also diagnosed with severe anxiety disorder and severe OCD. I have been on many meds and therapists and psychiatrists. it runs in my family and my uncle killed himself and had schizophrenia. Frankly, meds (even with the awful side effects I've experienced such as complete killing of libido and 30 KG weight gain) are the only reason I haven't done the same. they arent bad for everyone.
@annaban333 I'm just saying that after 10 years of heavy weed use, I suffered m worst anxirty attacks through smoking and can no longer touch it and my response about weed was to someone who said that depression should be treated by "having a beer, smoking and joint and cheering the fuck up.". No treatment is 100% good or bad for anyone is my only point.
ECT saved my life... I have to have it done once a month since I no longer take antidepressants and I often relapse (That's the only downside) Of course I wish I didn't have to go this far, but the short term memory loss is a small price to pay for me being dead from suicide or a hallucination. But it is a personal decision that is NOT forced on ANYBODY anymore.
@sriwai1 you are so many kinds of stupid I don't even know how to make you see it. Me smoking weed is what lead me to depression, so much for your handy life tips.
@thegamerhippo so because you cannot handle a little weed because you are a depression case that makes me stupid ? no it just means you are mentally weak ! like most of the people i hear talking about depression , some people have got genuine problems in the world to make them depressed and i dont mean " i smoked too much dope and it made me depressed boo hoo hoo " i am talking like people living in some of the poorest countries in the world who starve to death ! thats depression you prick
@ectdf1975 Thats 78 times the electric chair. All these people whining about death penalty against murderers, but torturing innocent people in a very similar way again and again is fine for them.
@wwwtotalitaerde No one is tortured. I receive ECT once a month & it has helped me so much! I'm put to sleep & do not feel anything - I have not had any negative side effects & I have had over 15 treatments so far. It is really a very good therapy.
@annaban333 Whats the reason for you to get ECT? Probably depression?
Find an appropriate treatment. There are numerous reports of inacceptable effects. ECT was and still is being used to deliberately destoy dissidents brains. If your brain is damaged, you of course will no longer be able to complain about the government or an illness.
Many people who had been subjected to ECT are against it. This makes it an inacceptable treatment.
@wwwtotalitaerde clinical depression i can understand , but your telling me that the answer to that is to shoot electricity through your brain ? to actually cause your body to convulse and enter a form of seizure ? even doctors and top medical brains have been on youtube and admit they dont know why this would help with depression , so your going to let somebody shoot electricity through your brain when they dont even know the true effects ? i think wwwtotalitaerde is 100% correct
@wwwtotalitaerde yeah i suspect you have a point there ! as i have read up on this a lot just so i know more about it and it seems that highly thought of doctors from around the world seem to be VERY against this whereas the "doctors" who seem to be pro ECT are actually the ones who practice it themselves ! from what i have read it seems that most doctors are suggesting that there are much better and safer ways to treat people other than ECT , not just with medication but with psycotherapy .
@sriwai1@sriwai1 So you watched some videos on youtube and that's where you formed your strong objection to ECT treatment? Believe me from what you have said it seems like you have no clue. Nearly ALL psychiatrists support the use of ECT treatment for severe depression (when the patient fails to respond to antidepressant medicationbs). It is a PROVEN treatment which helps thousands of people each year. The only main side effect is short term memory loss. How do I know this? I'm a med student.
@sriwai1 People with depressions often have a reason caused by the circumstances they are living in.This should be changed
Even if one believes in neural disfunction as cause (I don´t,except in very rare cases) ECT is not acceptable.The mechanism behind ECT is the destruction of nerve cells.This is not done selectively in the target area,but in a large area. Acceptable may be non destructive electrical stimulation using electrodes or the techniques described on my channel and homepage.
richmanporman1 obversely you haven't suffered from depression in its true form chronic clinical depression is totally dibillitating and saying get over it or they are choices 'Period' just shows the lack of understanding you and millions of others have about mental illness, just because you can't see that someone has a illness you don't think its there and treat them like they are choosing to be sick. Come and walk a day in my shoes and maybe just maybe you will have some form of compassion.
Suicide and depression ARE choices. Period. Only the selfish and severely egotistical take their own lives-having little regard for anyone else but ONE'S own self. This is the opitome of falling victim to one's own ego. Electro-shock is worthless. The only hope is to stop turning into yourself, and get ouside yourself. There are so many reasons to focus on something else, besides yourself and your "feelings." I have personal experience with depression, and got myself out of it. Be strong.
@richmanpoman1 you are a fucking idiot. there's a big difference between existential depression/situational depression and clinical depression. Clinical depression is a physical disease. It is physiological brain malfunctioning. Telling a clinically depressed person to get over it is like telling someone with a broken arm to just fix it. Being a sufferer of clinical depression, I get offended when I see others transpose their fleeting experience of "depression" onto people who actually know it.
@richmanpoman1 depression is a serious mental illness, it´s a chemical imbalance in the brain, it´s not a phsychological problem..it´s not a common feeling of emotional sadness either, even though it causes a very deep feeling of sadness, it doesn´t matter how strong you are or try to be, it´s a very overpowering condition, most people (myself uncluded) require medication, in order to control the awful symptoms caused by the illness.
My father endured the ECT treatments. He is 65 yrs old with a history of depression but had been treated with a low dose of Paxil for over ten years. About 1 1/2yrs ago his depression came back out of nowhere and was severe. When he woke up from his treatments he would have a bad headache for several hours then feel a little better but it didn't last. He had a lot of short term memory loss but he's fine now. Finally found the right meds and acknowledged that God was trying to get his attention.
My gf just start ECT on Friday 15th of July. I'm very mixed about it I heard so many story's good and bad. I not seen her in 34days now she been so unwell.
I had 9 ect's it is really a permanent cognition and memory destoryer, for some much worse than others. ECT is a closed head injury, you can read all the studies back and forth commentary yourself if you are considering it. But 2/3d's of doctors in a "watershed' moment admitted it always causes permanent or near permanent brain damage. Like most I did this out of desperation, as last resort, now I'm totally a vegatable most of the time, my whole life memories shot. I am not joking nor would
dude, i can go and give you ECT for free. come to my house, and i will shove your head in my 240V wall socket. there, all better, no more neurons, no more memory...:) what a joke...... and they say there are stronger amplitudes of ECT devices on the market than 240V? wow. just ....wow.
Please, for my own research, if anyone has references to BOTH the pros, and the cons of this treatment, please send them via my email ocka@gmx.com. thank you.
i need something like this to get rid of my depression i am in rough shape been bad for years. my polycystic ovarian syndrome met/diabtes/thyroid issues don't help me none add to my depression specially the two metabolic issues. it would be nice to have a treatment or so like this so i can eventually get my gastric bypass surgery I so need as well,i lose weight on my own but be nice to get rid of the other issues . the pcos causes some bipolar like mood swings. wish i had this to help me.
@laserofjustice Cognitive therapy helps you coping with depression, but not recovering from it. It is a useful addition, but does not replace biological treatments such antidepressant medication or ect
@mysonywalkman1978 Some studies have shown that CBT is as powerful (if not more so) than antidepressant medication. Naturally, medication is sometimes used in parallel as a rapid fix.
My concern is that the scientology front group- The "Citizens Commision on Human Rights" is danerously spreading fear of all psychology and psychiatry yet offers nothing but quack pseudo science in return.
its extremely well used, 100,000 people a year in the u.s. in fact I researched all about it, and I have horrific memory and functionality, personality loss now after only 9 ect's. I have volunteereed with survivors of ECT, all say the same story, of unending permanent cogntiive problems, amnesia like symptoms, and disability.
@dfowler351976 I wont dispute your figure, but would like to know where you got it. ECT is a last ditch treatment for chronic and acute depression that has failed to be treated any other way. To put it into context, acute depression, left untreated is frequently fatal due to suicide.
Whatever the rights and wrongs of ECT, the fact that the $cientology cult front group the CCHR jump on the band waggon kills and credibility. They need to stick to auditing out body thetans!
CCHR is routed in Scientology, which gives it no credibility...which is sad, because a lot, not all, of what they say is actually true regarding ECT, and psyche meds. It is a horrible world when you have the supposed "real science" based guys spinning figures, or just ignoring the many terrible ECT patient outcomes, including bad outcomes from the psyche meds as well, and the people fighting back are routed in cult ideology! Somewhere in there lies the truth.
I literally will read the many really good studies showing so many poor outcomes of ECT, and the people who swear on the bible saying it saved their lives, all report serious memory deficits. I have read many patient accounts and talked with many former ECT patients, all report devastating memory loss, and personality, and other functioning loss. Obviously I know first hand this kind of loss. I can barely tie my shoes now. I was much more functional prior to ECT.
last point. I believe ECT is a blunt, closed head injury type of device, that causes euphoria due to the brain damage. There are well documented brain changes, including really damaging the blood brain barrier, massive heating to the brain, and all kinds of secretion of dangerous neurotoxins. There are doctors who have studied this for life. Just wikipedia ECT, and read the section on brain damaging controversy. then do your own research on pubmed, most studies greatly softball things.
@dfowler351976 You are free to believe what you want, as are the people who undergo ECT when all else has failed and suicide is the only other option. It is controversial and, like all physical treatments has side effects and is not to be taken lightly. Thankfully modern medicine and cutting edge talking therapies like CBT are alternatives.
Sadly, the alternative offered by quack therapies such as "dianetics" are entirely medically unsupervised, dangerous and over priced.
thanks, but i've also talked with many ECT "survivors." They all complain of the same thing. Severe long term memory loss, where memories are either non-existent, some for 5, 10 even whole lifetimes, and others are so "smoothed over" it is like a faded, faded memory. During and just after my ECT, I felt torturous physical sensations in my head. This was obviously due to some kind of organic damage from really high voltage electiricity, and the convulsions.
Laser, last point. when you ask former ECT patients, I have concluded, that the memory damage ranges in each person. For a person with the least memory, and also insight damage, it's kind of amazing how ECT damages one's ability to even have good insight, to even access how bad they are. Kitty Dukakis has all kinds of severe memory loss, as she admits to all kinds of lost experiences, even very recent ones. I cannot explain the torture i feel, not knowing what I'm forgetting.
@dfowler351976 I am not denying that there is memory loss in some patients, similarly, depression itself causes memory loss. It's, without doubt, a serious treatment to undergo. To someone who has tried everything else and is suicidal- it's an option that's better than suicide or continuing to suffer deep depression.
The video made it clear, it causes memory loss and if you payed attention towards the end, it said that there is no scientific evidence to explain supposed improvements or the opposite. He said himself that doctors cannot even explain what it does to the brain. That to be is saying that it's bullshit and doesn't work.
I had my third ECT treatment today and I already feel somewhat better. Honestly, many of you are a bunch of sissies who have no right to criticize ECT unless you have had it and also had/have a severe mental illness like myself. I have Schizoaffective Disorder, Bipolar type, which is a nasty combination of mild Schizophrenia and severe Bipolar Disorder. My life was a living hell until I started ECT--you have no idea! And to tell you the truth, the worst part of the procedure is the Robinul inje
I'm trying to study this Monarch mind control program.... is it people going under Electroconvulsive therapy which is electroshock? and does it change your personality and make you the way people want you to do or the way you want your own self to be? and this is no spam I just want answers for real!!!
THIS FUCKING TREATMENT CAUSES HEART DAMAGE AND BRAIN DAMAGE SO BEWARE DO NOT HAVE THIS DONE TO YOU!!!!!! YOU WILL BE IN WORSE SHAPE IF YOU HAVE THIS BARBARIC SHIT DONE TO YOU!!!!!! WARNING!!!!!
Wauv. I've never seen how one looked like under ECT therapy.
As a bipolar I was once sumitted to have ECT against my will. - (While I was going from depression to mania more than once in a day. Transcript from my medical journal.) Though they had me sign an authorization for ECT under extreme presseure.
The only good thing about those 6 horible weeks is that most of it I still don't remember.
i was in wilston house brisbane qld australia,my mate and I were sitting down having a smoke and a nurse walked over the walkway and he made a whistle because he could see under her skirt ,I had no inclination to look up her skirt or any sexual innuendo I was just in the wrong place at the wrong time
I just love how highschool graduates go batshit crazy over a procedure that they don't have any idea other than: "fuck, they give your brain electricity man" . Yea it's a very bad, very very bad procedure with no benefits so just don't get the therapy and continue with your depression until you kill yourself one day.
Kitty and Mike Dukakis spoke to us two days ago inter alia about this, it's wonderful that they have been able to fight through this and stick together. They also recently celebrated their 47th anniversary. Pray for her as she goes over to Washington in three weeks to give her testification in favor of ECT treatment.
@UncagedCardinal Actually, many would say it's because we have become more advanced in diagnosing such disorders. But it is commonly overdiagnosed such as in teenagers or children.
I just finished my 4th session and I'm going again on Wednesday. So far, I haven't experienced any ill effects and my memory has actually improved. I'm even starting to remember things I didn't even know were still in my head. I guess results vary from person to person. Whether or not this treatment is right for you depends on the severity of your depression. It should only be used after all other options have been exhausted.
My 87 year old mum became consumed by worries some months ago and simply could no longer function let alone discuss anything with anyone. After a series of ECT (I must confess I was worried) treatments she is a different person; all those anxieties have gone, she interacts well, laughs again (hasn't done that for some time) and hasn't lost any memory at all. I'm shocked (sic).
My 87 year old mum became consumed by worries some months ago and simply could no longer function let alone discuss anything with anyone. After a series of ECT (I must confess I was worried) treatments she is a different person; all those anxieties have gone, she interacts well, laughs again (hasn't done that for some time) and hasn't lost any memory at all. I'm shocked (sic).
My 87 year old mum became consumed by worries some months ago and simply could no longer function let alone discuss anything with anyone. After a series of ECT (I must confess I was worried) treatments she is a different person; all those anxieties have gone, she interacts well, laughs again (hasn't done that for some time) and hasn't lost any memory at all. I'm shocked (sic).
@shocks007. My 87 year old mum became consumed by worries some months ago and simply could no longer function let alone discuss anything with anyone. After a series of ECT (I must confess I was worried) treatments she is a different person; all those anxieties have gone, she interacts well, laughs again (hasn't done that for some time) and hasn't lost any memory at all. I'm shocked (sic).
I've been getting ECT now for over a year. It started at 3 times a week for one month, and now I get it 2 times a month. It may sound like a scary thing, but it helped me. My medications alone did not help, but the ECT has saved my life.
My dad his fourth ECT this morning! We've seen improvments but he is far from being cured. I'll be glad to show him which cabinet that the drinking glasses are in five times a day if that means he can lie in the floor and color coloring books with my four year old daughter again. Does anyone know typically how many shocks before significant results are seen?
@Jennifereramsey From my experience, most people show a significant improvement (if there is going to be one) after 6 or 7 treatments. As for the fear of memory loss, most of the time it is the short-term memory that if effected and a lot of the time it is not very substantial. Obviously this is a generalization from what I have seen over the past 3 years. I hope your dad continues improving.
@Jennifereramsey From my experience, most people show a significant improvement (if there is going to be one) after 6 or 7 treatments. As for the fear of memory loss, most of the time it is the short-term memory that if effected and a lot of the time it is not very substantial. Obviously this is a generalization from what I have seen over the past 3 years. I hope your dad continues improving.
I dont understand why this is considered ok! The doctors dont even fully understand what they are doing to people! If you are seriously depressed get therapy and work through your problems, not screw over your brain. Its pathetic that this is still an accepted practice where there are so many other tools to help you out there. I know, I was seriously depressed for 5 years.
@BreLeezy This is not by any means a first line of treatment for depression and is reserved for extreme cases. It is a frightening concept but is the most effective treatment available today for severe depression refractory to medications. Doctors do know what they are doing, but outcomes are sometimes unpredictable as is everything in medicine. After intense therapy and 24 different meds in various combos over 8 years, I was desperate. At that point, ECT saved my life.
People who angrily denounce ECT have clearly never experienced severe depression before. A slight headache and a little bit of memory loss is a very small price to pay for the mere possibility of getting some relief from it.
@ral1334 Yeah, this is exactly the same argument as why desperate terminal patients go under ridiculous treatments as homeopathy, curanderism or whatever. An 800 mA electricity current shot can't bring your wife/husband, your money, your disrupted house back to a marvelous state. And probably, considering the insignificant rate of improvement from this treatment (similar to a placebo effect), this bit of memory loss and cognitive deficit might be the final pusher to commit suicide.
@maelstromx1 Well, I happen to have undergone the treatment. I'll admit that the relief it provided was only temporary, but I don't think I'm any worse off for having had it done. In truth, I'm neither an advocate nor an opponent of ECT. It just doesn't seem that extreme to me given the abhorrent mental state that leads up to it. I do think that it should continue to remain an option for people, at least until something better comes along.
@maelstromx1 And also, regarding your comment about an electric current not bringing one's spouse, money, or home back; you are arguing under the false assumption that depression is a natural reaction to life events. But often it is not. It is quite possible for someone not prone to depression to recover from such losses, while a person who is prone to depression may kill himself/herself over what may appear to be a mere trifle to an outside observer, hence the term "mental illness."
@ral1334 May be it's a false assumption but the biochemical hypothesis is far from proven too. I do not advocate an spiritual healing point of view, what to my eyes seems to be relevant is what Society expects for people, particularly the mentally ill, that it's what is troublesome. Consider this: in developed countries, the number of people mentally ill is increasing each year. Modern society expects to us to adapt under conditions that millenia ago (or even decades only) were inexistent.
The more "treatments" you have the harder it is for your brain to recover.
Who is going to take care of you when you forget important pieces of your life and your brain no longer functions well enough to take care of yourself? Are you going to be happy being an in and out mental patient or live in an institution?
Ernest Hemingway shot himself after having ECT. He realized it ruined his brain.
@CambridgeHeights when the mechanism of why a treatment works is unknown (admiting hipotetically that it does work), then the words "informed consent" become meaningless. Informed of what? If the information is that they simply don't know, then taking action according to this falsely informed consent is irresponsible.
@maelstromx1 There are lots of procedures and medications that people take in which the mechanism of action is unknown, yet the safety and efficacy are proven beyond a doubt.
Informed consent involves informing the patient of the risks and benefits of the procedure/medication. Mechanism of action is irrelevant.
@CambridgeHeights Absolutely the same could be said about homeopathy. You'll say "no, homeopathy efficacy is not proven" which i will concede. But how is it proven that given psychiatric procedure is efficient and beneficial? How do they test it? Over time? Then... time is the explanation! Here "time" plays the role of Null Hypothesis, now they have to prove that an alternative explanation (the one which idiotic doctors are prone to give) is more explanatory than the mentioned Null Hypothesis
@maelstromx1 The evidence is abundantly clear that homeopathy does NOT work. The evidence that ECT works is overwhelming. I don't know what your point is.
@CambridgeHeights what evidence? You don't see any "general medicine survivor movement", in contrast, supporting psych survivors movements, associations, etc. are everywhere, in every country.
@CambridgeHeights Did you want data? There i go: Lisanby SH, Maddox JH, Prudic J, Devanand DP, Sackeim HA (June 2000). "The effects of electroconvulsive therapy on memory of autobiographical and public events". Arch. Gen. Psychiatry 57 (6): 581–90. doi:10.1001/archpsyc.57.6.581. PMID 10839336.
Benbow, SM (2004) "Adverse effects of ECT". In AIF Scott (ed.) The ECT Handbook, second edition. London: The Royal College of Psychiatrists, pp. 170–174.
@maelstromx1 Ya, ECT has adverse effects. What's your point? As long as the patients are informed of the possibility of those adverse effects, it's ethical. Every drug and procedure has adverse effects, some more severe than others.
@CambridgeHeights i do not have problem with that. For example, i do not advocate Homeopathy, but everyone is free to take it and i'm no one to forbid the decision made by who gives it a try; my ethical concern is then inform that person that homeopathy is a scam, once informed, that person can do what he wants, it's his decision. The problem remains then in those people claiming Homeopathy is science. As for psychiatric methods, the issue, to me, is exactly the same.
@maelstromx1 We agree on homeopathy. The difference is that ECT has been shown to work. We may not know the mechanism of how ECT works, just like we don't know the mechanism of action of many drugs, but there is an abundance of peer-reviewed scientific evidence to support that it works. Homeopathy does not have a shred of reliable evidence to support its efficacy.
And more: Feliu M, et al. (June 2008). "Neuropsychological effects and attitudes in patients following electroconvulsive therapy.". Neuropsychiatric Disease and Treament 4 (3): 613–17. PMID 18830401. PMC 2526376.
Coleman EA, Sackeim HA, et al. (March 1996). "Subjective Memory Complaints Prior to and Following Electroconvulsive Therapy.". Biological Psychiatry. 39 (5): 346–56. doi:10.1016/0006-3223(95)00185-9. PMID 18830401
Sackeim HA, Prudic J, Fuller R, Keilp J, Lavori PW, Olfson M (January 2007). "The cognitive effects of electroconvulsive therapy in community settings". Neuropsychopharmacology 32 (1): 244–54. doi:10.1038/sj.npp.1301180. PMID 1693671.
Breggin Peter (2007). "ECT Damages the Brain: Disturbing News for Patients and Shock Doctors Alike.". Ethical Human Psychology and Psychiatry. 9 (2): 83–86. doi:10.1891/152315007782021196.
I work with children and adult with epilepsy who have seizures on a regular basis. That is what ECT is. Many years ago a man discovered that patients in mental hospitals with epilepsy never had depression. Exploring this lead to shock therapy with in recent years has become much more humane. My mother is 81 and has had over 30 treatments over the past 2 years. Before that she was like a walking vegtable for 8 years. She wanted to die everyday, heard voices, had to be watched 24 hrs a day.
@VeronicaFeline no the intention is not to wipe your memory, that is an unwanted side effect. the small short current of electricity shocks your brain and induces a seizure in the person. this resets the electrical signals of the brain, and lets the brain reprogram itself. well, it happens something along those lines. it is not completely understood WHY it works, but evidence has proven it does. it is used to improve the condition of patients who have depression, bipolar, schizophrenia.
@littlepeter5 If there's something which "improves" this sort of such different conditions (depression, bipolar, schizofrenia, etc), then this demonstrates it doesn't improve anything. What this clearly suggests is placebo effect taking place.
@littlepeter5 If there's something which "improves" this sort of such different conditions (depression, bipolar, schizofrenia, etc), then this demonstrates it doesn't improve anything. What this clearly suggests is placebo effect taking place.
@jtaylorl You're right... my wife shouldn't have ECT, she should go ahead and commit suicide, just like she's thought about every day for years, and was hospitalized for last year.
You people reading this should know 2 words some of these sadistic con artists use to implicate people. "conspiracy" and "paranoid" These words were developed in the 1950's to label people incompetent and dangerous and railroad them into mental hospitals where ANYTHNG can be done to them. NOBODY KNOWS if "POISONED VEINS" (WHAT A NAME FOR SOMEBODY CALLING ANOTHER PERSON "PARANOID" ABOUT ELECTROCONVULSIVE THERAPY) has even BEEN in australia and if so what he has seen, or done.
The psychiatric industry makes BILLIONS each year on "diagnosing" and pilling gullible people, TELLING them what their problems are! DO YOU KNOW WHAT YOUR PROBLEM IS, MR/MS DEPRESSED PERSON? YOUR PROBLEM IS, YOURE DEPRESSED! So now what you gonna do? Pay thousands and thousands and THOUSANDS of dollars to counsellors and the drug companies? Youre DEPRESSED, DEAL WITH IT! Maybe you were abused, scared, alone. So you let some assholes MEDICATE YOU and railroad you into a SHOCKBOX??
BAN ECT NOW! None of you, even the shock docs themselves, knows what goes on in individual situations. The ect machine is a very effective instrument of torture and coersion. So while your STUPID family is paying for your "treatment" even though they sense something is wrong, youre being abused, raped tortured coerced drugged injected pilled and STUPID people outside are being told whatever they need to hear to perpetuate it. You can even be drugged for a visit so you look "disturbed"
@MassDeportation I volunteered in an ECt Suite for a number of years and I saw many ECT treatments being done. The Dr's didn't torture the patients!! I have first-hand experience of witnessing ECT treatments being done. No torture or coercion was seen. I also spoke to the patients before and after each ECT treatment and saw them both before ECT was started and after all treatments were finished. ECT saved their lives, that's what they said over and over again. It kept these people from suicide.
@MassDeportation Why should people believe your comment? I have no reason to lie or even bother commenting on this page because quite frankly, you sound paranoid as it is which makes your comments hard to believe. I can also only speak from my point of view and what I have seen in Australian hospitals. The U.S. may be a whole other story, and I'm sure there are some doctors who are not practicing ethically, but overall doctors are trying to help people, not make them worse.
@poisonedxveins People can believe my comment because a few of the decieved drugged fools see people being put in a prison type environment with little contact with the outside world, controlled by the jailers themselves. People see a psychiatric INDUSTRY that makes BILLIONS off of pills and shock therapy (putting electricity thru DRUGGED vuneralbe peoples BRAINS) You have no reason to lie LOL! MONEY? You have no reason to comment on this page? Then why are you commenting on this page? LIAR!
@poisonedxveins Probably the cause of this improvement is not the ECT itself, but the fact that it settles the person in a position in which he "is doing something": he no longer remains passive. When you take pills, the most probable is that you do nothing to improve your life, you simply expect that the pill do all the work. But when you go under a real new experience, then you're pressured to change, be it an ECT procedure or bangee jumping.
@maelstromx1 Actually they have done a number of studies where patients think they're undergoing real ECT but are actually just being put to sleep for a few minutes etc. to see if ECT actually works or if the improvements were a byproduct of the extra care these individuals were receiving due to getting ECT done. Those patients who really had ECT improved, those who didn't, did not. ECT has a 70-90% success rate for depression, hence why it is still available. It's drastic, but sometimes needed.
@poisonedxveins That is only a little part of testing a Null Hypothesis and it still demonstrates why Psychology and its big brother, Psychiatry, are no real sciences. To actually pass a placebo effect test comparison, the control group had to go under some kind of procedure which actually had some noticeable effects. For example, to test a new drug for depression, you don't administrate a sugar pill to the control group, you give some pill that it's known for gaving some effects ...(continued)
...some effects, but at the same time this effects are known to be irrelevant for the illness in question (p.e. a headache). If you give a sugar pill to the control group, they'll rapidly percieve that it has no effect on them, decreasing or nulifying the potential placebo effect.But if you administrate a pill which produces a headache or a change in behaviour irrelevant to the depression, the control group will realize that, in some way, the pill is working, increasing the pl.effect
For a ECT case, the situation you describe in which the control group is under, is analogical to the case of the sugar pill. The problem then, remains in the fact that is doubtly ethical to administrate TO PEOPLE some kind of placebo which can produce some undesirable effects, which restricts absolutely the range of the studies to some very particular cases, making more branches of the Psychology, and Psychiatry, as a whole, unscientific
Mmh interesting assumption with no way out. If the success rate is so high (70-90% being higher than drugs, actually) why not abandon all drug treatment at first hand? Because ECT is more risky? Because produces brain damage? Because is cheaper than administrate drugs for your whole life? Oh, now i know. If it's the first and second reason, wow, this means actually ECT is not as safe and efficient; if it's the third... Psychiatry is dubious enterprise... Anyways, it gives ECT a bad role.
In Sweden they first poison people, with no psychiatric problems that have been lured into contacting psychiatry, with overdoses of neuroleptica and then ECT them in order to cause memory loss so that they will not be able to defend them selves in court against false accusations about having psychiatric problems. One reason is that psychiatry can't get enough patients otherwise, and the other is that the psychiatric staff are Nazis that want to exterminate certain groups of people.
hmmm... most of you guys who are commenting negatively on ECT are citing or giving examples or ECTs done a few decades ago... you do realize it isn't done the same way at all anymore, do you?! And that most of the time the side effects from the ECT are short lasting? And that in many instances psychotherapy (antidepressants and others) have more side effects than ECT?
dazybaby 4 days ago
I finished my treatment of 12 ECT's today. It saved my life. I am a British (living in Canada) 42 year old mother of two small girls who was suicidal. I have had NO adverse side effects from these procedures apart from a little SHORT TERM memory loss and confusion. Please do not comment negtively unless you have been through this treatment and it didnt work for you. Millions are helped by having it. It is NOT barbaric. Far from it.
1107deedee 1 week ago
Unless you've had ect dont speak on its effectiveness,i assure you theres many more success stories then stories of people dieing or suffering permenant memory loss.DO YOU REALLY THINK COUNTIRES LIKE THE U.S,CANADA AND THE U.K would let something that you people say is so harmfull continue, no they wouldn't and if your argument is that its a billion dollar industry then please dont even comment back.
logeezie876 3 weeks ago
the doctors who do or advocate this practice that are fucking criminals, should be judged and sentenced to death. Or even worse, sentenced to the slow and pathethic endlife they inflict the people they shock.
mrtomtomparis75 3 weeks ago in playlist electroshock
There is $3 billion in ECT/Sledgehammer therapy.
XavierAtriedes 4 weeks ago
Remember a life of pain or feel better. Seems like an easy choice to me.
bedtimesleepytime 1 month ago 4
if anyone wants real studies, patient stories of years of memory loss, deaths from ECT, you can message me, I have a vested interest in exposing the lies, misinformation, including knowing they now "shock" the mentally retarded and dementia patients who have no way of informed consent, do you see? I thought Michelle bachman was crazy at her vaccination beliefs, although I hate her personally I happen to understand even the people who you think are on your side, often lie as well.
dfowler351976 1 month ago
@dfowler351976 I'd be more than happy to help you with your stories if you want. I just had two, only two, but I would rather die than have another one. I have been left vulnerable, my memory barely last a minute, I feel like my soul has been taken from me. Miracle? Maybe for some. I'm leaning more towards lawsuit.
aspen47 17 hours ago
ECT IS brain damaging, now doctors more freely admit it. The studies show it even recent ones. the ECT of yesteryear the kind that Ernest Hemingway famously killed himself, saying "what these shock doctors don't know is what shock does to writers...etc." famous quote google it...I was one of the desperate naive Americans who bought into the authority of the pysche industry basically LYING to me saying no chance of memory loss, or not permanent, a year plus of networking with survivors,
dfowler351976 1 month ago
@dfowler351976 it's shocking the brain ok? my father an electrical engineer was duped because the ECT docs don't tell the volts current, joules, or raw energy, it's enough to light a strong light bulb, the scientologists may sound crazy, but they also happen to be right. One thing I've learned is not to blindly trust doctors, or people in authoritarian positions, they frequently LIE, this is not B.S. doctors lie, human beings are corrupt as hell...ECT is being "phased out"
dfowler351976 1 month ago
A lot of people think this is not helpful but in all honesty it is prob just as helpful as taking a ton of medications. The best treatment for depression to me is cognitive behavioral therapy( most of the time there is an underlying problem causing this feeling of depression).
shadowJ133 1 month ago
@shadowJ133 it's "closed head injury" brian damage, shown time again in scores of studies...it's actually more damaging to the brain than in the ECT that was used orignially to slaughter pigs, google it, if you want...shock is as simple as 450 volts of 9 ampiers of current shot inot your brain...I work with survivors, done the reading. doctors lie, and now even top hospitals are trying to stop it's use, the industry gets huge profits, it's brain damage, I have 40 studies,
dfowler351976 1 month ago
@dfowler351976 sorry I have collected 40 studies. in the past 1950's ECT was considered torture, and was used to torture from the Catholic church, to Nazi Germany, no truth is more "conspiracy sounding" than fiction often....ECT doctors make at least a hundred or more per shock, it's highly lucraative, there is no informed consent...a 12 year old could intuitively realize shocking a brain has to be destructive. Put it bluntly, imagine energy mugh higher than a light bulb
dfowler351976 1 month ago
White ladies need to stop working in corporate paper offices and eating macaroni for dinner.
Popsfresh 1 month ago
The creepy music doesn't help. ECT is an effective therapy that's been distorted by media!
poopoopanties 1 month ago 2
@poopoopanties nope see my comment below, even big hosptials are now not recommending it. brain damage is worse than in the past, I have studeied up and run groups with ECT survivors, doctors can be such liars...the only difference is modified shock does not break bones, and cause physical pain. but many still feel horrible head aches, and lose years of memory, I can't prove this to you in one comment but it's naive people like you that don't bother to see past the spin.
dfowler351976 1 month ago
This is a life-saving procedure....made more humane today for those who suffer from depression and other mental illnesses...I have a history of MI and addiction in my family, and so far other drugs have worked for me. I would only hope that if I reached bottom, my family would use ECT to save my life.
vgoth100 2 months ago
@vgoth100 bullshit, even Mcleans ECT doctor admitted finally to me the voltage and current is higher than in the past, he skirted the issue, but admitted also to paitens losing 10 years of memory, I've done my homework. Sackeim study 07 proves it brain damages 100% of patients, keep in mind Harold Sackeim is one huge ECT proponent with money ties to the ECT lobby
it is WORSE on the brain as current (does the damage) is 3X higher. you probably are an ECT doc yourself@!
dfowler351976 1 month ago
@dfowler351976 woah, i am not a doc, far from it. I am a lowly English lit major who happens to have some relatives who have had ECT in the 50s-60s, and they are now dead. I also have relatives who have such severe depression that they are agreeing to ECT. I also have my mother and father who believe in protection over the real fact that they were both lied to and verbally/physically abused in childhood. Merry xmas.
vgoth100 1 month ago
Saved my life!
Kcwellons 2 months ago
Disgusting, sickening n inhumane.
Enyatea72 3 months ago
i'm scared
TheCulturedMonk 3 months ago
@ thegammerhippo sorry didn't mean to post so many replies to u - I didn't think they were posting so I kept hitting the button again lol! It's late for me - going to sleep - good night - sweet dreams to you all!
annaban333 4 months ago
hey I agree w/ u thegammerhippo that was a ignorant remark about just have a beer etc. & cheer up - right! I know depression - I'm severely BiPolar so is my Mom she tried to kill herself many times when I was growing up. I also was molested at an early age but am over that now thankfully. I have been on so many meds - they just didn't work for me - I kept having manic episodes where I was dillusional & had to be hospitalized several times. It was very hard on my 3 children. Much better now!
annaban333 4 months ago
if you look through my comments I actually didn't say I support ECT. I was just saying that weed (THC) can make matters worse and that not all depression is caused cos people can't "cheer the fuck up". I don't know much about ECT hence why I looked this video up to start with. I will also look up what you recommend as I believe you should know all the facts before judging.
thegamerhippo 4 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@Kadadj Number 1 :- i never once said people choose depression did i ? no ! ok so thats your first point wrong ! Number 2 :- you call me a retard well take a look at your comment "trough" did you mean "through" ? and "you Loose the ability to feel good shit" did you mean "lose the ability" ? see when you call somebody a retard make sure you can fucking spell first not to mention that "you lose the ability to feel good shit" does not even make fucking sense ! are you a retard ? i think soooooooo
sriwai1 4 months ago
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sriwai1 4 months ago
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sriwai1 4 months ago
I would gladly sacrifice my memory to not suffer from depression and anxiety, though they are both just moderate, so I hope talk therapy and lifestyle changes is going to get me out of it.
Kadadj 4 months ago
well let me clarify. I was molested at a young age and smoking the marijuana as a teen is what lead me to severe anxiety disorder and deepened my pre existing genetic pre-disposition to depression thanks to my mum and dad both having it. you should really shut the fuck up about things you have no idea about. Depression is a chemical imbalance not just a whiney person who thinks not having that new slim ps3 means their life is "the worst".
thegamerhippo 4 months ago
@thegamerhippo Search for a video in youtube on DIANA LOPER and watch it , see if what i am saying about ECT is stupid ! tell Diana loper she is stupid ! clearly you need some educating on this subject yourself ! as for your past i am very sorry to hear that , my mother went through a similar ordeal so i can understand how this can scar a person for life but my mother went to a phyciatrist and spoke to them without the need for medication or "therapy" , this treatment is not necesary !
sriwai1 4 months ago
well let me clarify. I was molested at a young age and smoking the marijuana as a teen is what lead me to severe anxiety disorder and deepened my pre existing pre-disposition to depression thanks to my mum and dad both having it. you should really shut the fuck up about things you have no idea about. Depression is a chemical imbalance not just a whiney person who thinks not having that new slim ps3 means their life is "the worst".
thegamerhippo 4 months ago
@thegamerhippo hey I agree w/ u that was a ignorant remark about just have a beer etc. & cheer up - right! I know depression - I'm severely BiPolar so is my Mom she tried to kill herself many times when I was growing up. I also was molested at an early age but am over that now thankfully. I have been on so many meds - they just didn't work for me - I kept having manic episodes where I was dillusional & had to be hospitalized several times. It was very hard on my 3 children.
annaban333 4 months ago
@thegamerhippo hey I agree w/ u that was a ignorant remark about just have a beer etc. & cheer up - right! I know depression - I'm severely BiPolar so is my Mom she tried to kill herself many times when I was growing up. I also was molested at an early age but am over that now thankfully. I have been on so many meds - they just didn't work for me - I kept having manic episodes where I was dillusional & had to be hospitalized several times. It was very hard on my 3 children.
annaban333 4 months ago
@thegamerhippo hey I agree w/ u that was a ignorant remark about just have a beer etc. & cheer up - right! I know depression - I'm severely BiPolar so is my Mom she tried to kill herself many times when I was growing up. I also was molested at an early age but am over that now thankfully. I have been on so many meds - they just didn't work for me - I kept having manic episodes where I was dillusional & had to be hospitalized several times. It was very hard on my 3 children. My family & friends
annaban333 4 months ago
@sriwai1 I think weed is an excellent medication for anxiety & depression. I've used it since I was 15 yrs old, I'm 40 now. After I was diagnosed BiPolar & tried many meds for years, was in & out of the hospital, I now have had 15+ ECT treatments & no longer need meds (or their side effects)! But clinical depression isn't something you personally can understand if you haven't experienced it. It is an illness that requires treatment. A hormone imbalance can cause depression. Educate yourself plz!
annaban333 4 months ago
@annaban333 clinical depression i can understand , but your telling me that the answer to that is to shoot electricity through your brain ? to actually cause your body to convulse and enter a form of seizure ? even doctors and top medical brains have been on youtube and admit they dont know why this would help with depression , so your going to let somebody shoot electricity through your brain when they dont even know the true effects ? i think wwwtotalitaerde is 100% correct
sriwai1 4 months ago
@sriwai1 ECT has worked wonders fr me. Meds failed to keep me from mania I am severely BiPolar so is my Mom. She tried to killl herself many times as I was growing up & mental illness was even less understood back then. It's a miracle she's alive today - she has even survived breast cancer! My family & friends are so pleased with the results of ECT for me it's been wonderful!
annaban333 4 months ago
@annaban333 dont you worry about the long term effect to your brain ? i mean from what i have seen on youtube even a lot of doctors say that they dont know what the long term effects are
sriwai1 4 months ago
@sriwai1 Yes & No - I worry more about being insane than I do brain damage. I watched the Laura videos last night & I'm sorry that happened to her - that was years ago & I think there are laws to protect "us" (the mentally ill) now that would prevent stuff like that from happening today (I sure hope - cause that was awful).
annaban333 4 months ago
@annaban333 I'm 34 and have had 'clinical' depression since I was diagnosed at 13. I have been also diagnosed with severe anxiety disorder and severe OCD. I have been on many meds and therapists and psychiatrists. it runs in my family and my uncle killed himself and had schizophrenia. Frankly, meds (even with the awful side effects I've experienced such as complete killing of libido and 30 KG weight gain) are the only reason I haven't done the same. they arent bad for everyone.
thegamerhippo 4 months ago
@annaban333 I'm just saying that after 10 years of heavy weed use, I suffered m worst anxirty attacks through smoking and can no longer touch it and my response about weed was to someone who said that depression should be treated by "having a beer, smoking and joint and cheering the fuck up.". No treatment is 100% good or bad for anyone is my only point.
thegamerhippo 4 months ago
ECT saved my life... I have to have it done once a month since I no longer take antidepressants and I often relapse (That's the only downside) Of course I wish I didn't have to go this far, but the short term memory loss is a small price to pay for me being dead from suicide or a hallucination. But it is a personal decision that is NOT forced on ANYBODY anymore.
koochy79 4 months ago
"Decide for yourself" Yeah ummmmm....... NO!!
ChUcKySaWeSoMe 4 months ago
@sriwai1 you are so many kinds of stupid I don't even know how to make you see it. Me smoking weed is what lead me to depression, so much for your handy life tips.
thegamerhippo 4 months ago
@thegamerhippo so because you cannot handle a little weed because you are a depression case that makes me stupid ? no it just means you are mentally weak ! like most of the people i hear talking about depression , some people have got genuine problems in the world to make them depressed and i dont mean " i smoked too much dope and it made me depressed boo hoo hoo " i am talking like people living in some of the poorest countries in the world who starve to death ! thats depression you prick
sriwai1 4 months ago
whine went you have that motherfuckers
psettimi 4 months ago
Depression DOES NOT EQUAL hell, Borderline Personality Disorder = HELL
psettimi 4 months ago
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TheMuttlovin 4 months ago
Breaking news in Australia on ECT DEATHS
theage.com.au/victoria/state-urged-to-act-on-shocking-death-rates-in-mental-care-20110904-1jsh1.html
theage.com.au/victoria/200-psych-patients-died-suddenly-20110630-1gt2o.html#ixzz1Qm5tYYoV
electricshocktherapy.info
patbrodnik 4 months ago
@ectdf1975 Thats 78 times the electric chair. All these people whining about death penalty against murderers, but torturing innocent people in a very similar way again and again is fine for them.
wwwtotalitaerde 4 months ago
@wwwtotalitaerde No one is tortured. I receive ECT once a month & it has helped me so much! I'm put to sleep & do not feel anything - I have not had any negative side effects & I have had over 15 treatments so far. It is really a very good therapy.
annaban333 4 months ago
@annaban333 Whats the reason for you to get ECT? Probably depression?
Find an appropriate treatment. There are numerous reports of inacceptable effects. ECT was and still is being used to deliberately destoy dissidents brains. If your brain is damaged, you of course will no longer be able to complain about the government or an illness.
Many people who had been subjected to ECT are against it. This makes it an inacceptable treatment.
wwwtotalitaerde 4 months ago
@wwwtotalitaerde clinical depression i can understand , but your telling me that the answer to that is to shoot electricity through your brain ? to actually cause your body to convulse and enter a form of seizure ? even doctors and top medical brains have been on youtube and admit they dont know why this would help with depression , so your going to let somebody shoot electricity through your brain when they dont even know the true effects ? i think wwwtotalitaerde is 100% correct
sriwai1 4 months ago
@sriwai1 I suspect that some of the pro comments are being put here by shrinks and their snitchers to influence the public.
wwwtotalitaerde 3 months ago
@wwwtotalitaerde yeah i suspect you have a point there ! as i have read up on this a lot just so i know more about it and it seems that highly thought of doctors from around the world seem to be VERY against this whereas the "doctors" who seem to be pro ECT are actually the ones who practice it themselves ! from what i have read it seems that most doctors are suggesting that there are much better and safer ways to treat people other than ECT , not just with medication but with psycotherapy .
sriwai1 3 months ago
@sriwai1 @sriwai1 So you watched some videos on youtube and that's where you formed your strong objection to ECT treatment? Believe me from what you have said it seems like you have no clue. Nearly ALL psychiatrists support the use of ECT treatment for severe depression (when the patient fails to respond to antidepressant medicationbs). It is a PROVEN treatment which helps thousands of people each year. The only main side effect is short term memory loss. How do I know this? I'm a med student.
999liverpool999 2 months ago
@sriwai1 People with depressions often have a reason caused by the circumstances they are living in.This should be changed
Even if one believes in neural disfunction as cause (I don´t,except in very rare cases) ECT is not acceptable.The mechanism behind ECT is the destruction of nerve cells.This is not done selectively in the target area,but in a large area. Acceptable may be non destructive electrical stimulation using electrodes or the techniques described on my channel and homepage.
wwwtotalitaerde 1 month ago
Psychiatric drugs have caused more harm to me than good. I'm sick of these so-called "doctors" pushing this kind of shit on people.
cbohar84 4 months ago
lol i just want to c someone get shocked, you guys are talking seioursly and using all 500 letters, chill out jesus -_-
chrismanlol00 5 months ago
richmanporman1 obversely you haven't suffered from depression in its true form chronic clinical depression is totally dibillitating and saying get over it or they are choices 'Period' just shows the lack of understanding you and millions of others have about mental illness, just because you can't see that someone has a illness you don't think its there and treat them like they are choosing to be sick. Come and walk a day in my shoes and maybe just maybe you will have some form of compassion.
ThePdoc1 5 months ago
Suicide and depression ARE choices. Period. Only the selfish and severely egotistical take their own lives-having little regard for anyone else but ONE'S own self. This is the opitome of falling victim to one's own ego. Electro-shock is worthless. The only hope is to stop turning into yourself, and get ouside yourself. There are so many reasons to focus on something else, besides yourself and your "feelings." I have personal experience with depression, and got myself out of it. Be strong.
richmanpoman1 5 months ago
@richmanpoman1 you are a fucking idiot. there's a big difference between existential depression/situational depression and clinical depression. Clinical depression is a physical disease. It is physiological brain malfunctioning. Telling a clinically depressed person to get over it is like telling someone with a broken arm to just fix it. Being a sufferer of clinical depression, I get offended when I see others transpose their fleeting experience of "depression" onto people who actually know it.
TheFoundation123 5 months ago
@richmanpoman1 depression is a serious mental illness, it´s a chemical imbalance in the brain, it´s not a phsychological problem..it´s not a common feeling of emotional sadness either, even though it causes a very deep feeling of sadness, it doesn´t matter how strong you are or try to be, it´s a very overpowering condition, most people (myself uncluded) require medication, in order to control the awful symptoms caused by the illness.
extradutyfelt1 5 months ago
My father endured the ECT treatments. He is 65 yrs old with a history of depression but had been treated with a low dose of Paxil for over ten years. About 1 1/2yrs ago his depression came back out of nowhere and was severe. When he woke up from his treatments he would have a bad headache for several hours then feel a little better but it didn't last. He had a lot of short term memory loss but he's fine now. Finally found the right meds and acknowledged that God was trying to get his attention.
Jennifereramsey 5 months ago
My gf just start ECT on Friday 15th of July. I'm very mixed about it I heard so many story's good and bad. I not seen her in 34days now she been so unwell.
JohnG1988 6 months ago
I had 9 ect's it is really a permanent cognition and memory destoryer, for some much worse than others. ECT is a closed head injury, you can read all the studies back and forth commentary yourself if you are considering it. But 2/3d's of doctors in a "watershed' moment admitted it always causes permanent or near permanent brain damage. Like most I did this out of desperation, as last resort, now I'm totally a vegatable most of the time, my whole life memories shot. I am not joking nor would
dfowler351976 6 months ago
It does work for some people. I am one of them. I get a treatment and EVERYONE can tell it has helped me. My friends, my family, even other patients.
AVelvetRevolution 6 months ago
dude, i can go and give you ECT for free. come to my house, and i will shove your head in my 240V wall socket. there, all better, no more neurons, no more memory...:) what a joke...... and they say there are stronger amplitudes of ECT devices on the market than 240V? wow. just ....wow.
Please, for my own research, if anyone has references to BOTH the pros, and the cons of this treatment, please send them via my email ocka@gmx.com. thank you.
Barnett791 7 months ago
i need something like this to get rid of my depression i am in rough shape been bad for years. my polycystic ovarian syndrome met/diabtes/thyroid issues don't help me none add to my depression specially the two metabolic issues. it would be nice to have a treatment or so like this so i can eventually get my gastric bypass surgery I so need as well,i lose weight on my own but be nice to get rid of the other issues . the pcos causes some bipolar like mood swings. wish i had this to help me.
gadgetfreak197444 7 months ago
ECT is very rarely used, fortunately, there are many alternatives such as cognitive therapy and modern anti-depressants for severe cases.
By creating fear and stigma like this video is to condem many people to morbid avoidance of getting help.
Depression needs professional, qualified advice and support.
laserofjustice 7 months ago
@laserofjustice Cognitive therapy helps you coping with depression, but not recovering from it. It is a useful addition, but does not replace biological treatments such antidepressant medication or ect
mysonywalkman1978 7 months ago
@mysonywalkman1978 Some studies have shown that CBT is as powerful (if not more so) than antidepressant medication. Naturally, medication is sometimes used in parallel as a rapid fix.
My concern is that the scientology front group- The "Citizens Commision on Human Rights" is danerously spreading fear of all psychology and psychiatry yet offers nothing but quack pseudo science in return.
laserofjustice 7 months ago
its extremely well used, 100,000 people a year in the u.s. in fact I researched all about it, and I have horrific memory and functionality, personality loss now after only 9 ect's. I have volunteereed with survivors of ECT, all say the same story, of unending permanent cogntiive problems, amnesia like symptoms, and disability.
dfowler351976 6 months ago
@dfowler351976 I wont dispute your figure, but would like to know where you got it. ECT is a last ditch treatment for chronic and acute depression that has failed to be treated any other way. To put it into context, acute depression, left untreated is frequently fatal due to suicide.
Whatever the rights and wrongs of ECT, the fact that the $cientology cult front group the CCHR jump on the band waggon kills and credibility. They need to stick to auditing out body thetans!
laserofjustice 6 months ago
CCHR is routed in Scientology, which gives it no credibility...which is sad, because a lot, not all, of what they say is actually true regarding ECT, and psyche meds. It is a horrible world when you have the supposed "real science" based guys spinning figures, or just ignoring the many terrible ECT patient outcomes, including bad outcomes from the psyche meds as well, and the people fighting back are routed in cult ideology! Somewhere in there lies the truth.
dfowler351976 6 months ago
I literally will read the many really good studies showing so many poor outcomes of ECT, and the people who swear on the bible saying it saved their lives, all report serious memory deficits. I have read many patient accounts and talked with many former ECT patients, all report devastating memory loss, and personality, and other functioning loss. Obviously I know first hand this kind of loss. I can barely tie my shoes now. I was much more functional prior to ECT.
dfowler351976 6 months ago
last point. I believe ECT is a blunt, closed head injury type of device, that causes euphoria due to the brain damage. There are well documented brain changes, including really damaging the blood brain barrier, massive heating to the brain, and all kinds of secretion of dangerous neurotoxins. There are doctors who have studied this for life. Just wikipedia ECT, and read the section on brain damaging controversy. then do your own research on pubmed, most studies greatly softball things.
dfowler351976 6 months ago
@dfowler351976 You are free to believe what you want, as are the people who undergo ECT when all else has failed and suicide is the only other option. It is controversial and, like all physical treatments has side effects and is not to be taken lightly. Thankfully modern medicine and cutting edge talking therapies like CBT are alternatives.
Sadly, the alternative offered by quack therapies such as "dianetics" are entirely medically unsupervised, dangerous and over priced.
laserofjustice 6 months ago
thanks, but i've also talked with many ECT "survivors." They all complain of the same thing. Severe long term memory loss, where memories are either non-existent, some for 5, 10 even whole lifetimes, and others are so "smoothed over" it is like a faded, faded memory. During and just after my ECT, I felt torturous physical sensations in my head. This was obviously due to some kind of organic damage from really high voltage electiricity, and the convulsions.
dfowler351976 6 months ago
Laser, last point. when you ask former ECT patients, I have concluded, that the memory damage ranges in each person. For a person with the least memory, and also insight damage, it's kind of amazing how ECT damages one's ability to even have good insight, to even access how bad they are. Kitty Dukakis has all kinds of severe memory loss, as she admits to all kinds of lost experiences, even very recent ones. I cannot explain the torture i feel, not knowing what I'm forgetting.
dfowler351976 6 months ago
@dfowler351976 I am not denying that there is memory loss in some patients, similarly, depression itself causes memory loss. It's, without doubt, a serious treatment to undergo. To someone who has tried everything else and is suicidal- it's an option that's better than suicide or continuing to suffer deep depression.
laserofjustice 5 months ago
fear is a powerful thing
leeeleveneleven 7 months ago
The video made it clear, it causes memory loss and if you payed attention towards the end, it said that there is no scientific evidence to explain supposed improvements or the opposite. He said himself that doctors cannot even explain what it does to the brain. That to be is saying that it's bullshit and doesn't work.
RezaLemmyng 8 months ago
Many, many years ago my aunt underwent ECT for depression. It didn't help her and she lost some of her memory permanently.
mamby101 8 months ago
I had my third ECT treatment today and I already feel somewhat better. Honestly, many of you are a bunch of sissies who have no right to criticize ECT unless you have had it and also had/have a severe mental illness like myself. I have Schizoaffective Disorder, Bipolar type, which is a nasty combination of mild Schizophrenia and severe Bipolar Disorder. My life was a living hell until I started ECT--you have no idea! And to tell you the truth, the worst part of the procedure is the Robinul inje
NewTrierFreak 9 months ago 13
I'm trying to study this Monarch mind control program.... is it people going under Electroconvulsive therapy which is electroshock? and does it change your personality and make you the way people want you to do or the way you want your own self to be? and this is no spam I just want answers for real!!!
EJLUKE115 9 months ago
SMOKE WEED!!! DONT DO ECT
xYoungDeezYx 10 months ago
does somebody knows where i can watch this online??
gabiluchis703 10 months ago
THIS FUCKING TREATMENT CAUSES HEART DAMAGE AND BRAIN DAMAGE SO BEWARE DO NOT HAVE THIS DONE TO YOU!!!!!! YOU WILL BE IN WORSE SHAPE IF YOU HAVE THIS BARBARIC SHIT DONE TO YOU!!!!!! WARNING!!!!!
Idolmakercat 10 months ago
are you fucking serious, damn grow a fucking pair off balls and stop telling yourself your depressed so you cant do shit
prflow 10 months ago
its shocking how can they do that
kirkbypaul12345 10 months ago
Wauv. I've never seen how one looked like under ECT therapy.
As a bipolar I was once sumitted to have ECT against my will. - (While I was going from depression to mania more than once in a day. Transcript from my medical journal.) Though they had me sign an authorization for ECT under extreme presseure.
The only good thing about those 6 horible weeks is that most of it I still don't remember.
And the ECT treatment was in 2009.
caver313 10 months ago
,that afternoon I was strapped downed to a table and given a bit of shock therapy by a couple of nurses.
I'll never forget how they strapped me down and terrorized me ,no doctor ,just sick joy and laughter as they put the volts rthough me.
dirkman 10 months ago
i was in wilston house brisbane qld australia,my mate and I were sitting down having a smoke and a nurse walked over the walkway and he made a whistle because he could see under her skirt ,I had no inclination to look up her skirt or any sexual innuendo I was just in the wrong place at the wrong time
dirkman 10 months ago
I just love how highschool graduates go batshit crazy over a procedure that they don't have any idea other than: "fuck, they give your brain electricity man" . Yea it's a very bad, very very bad procedure with no benefits so just don't get the therapy and continue with your depression until you kill yourself one day.
Vecna999 11 months ago
I think lack of love and sense of security could be the cause for mental illnesses. Not more, not less.
Treat people with love, it's the best medicine.
piotrekk8 11 months ago
Kitty and Mike Dukakis spoke to us two days ago inter alia about this, it's wonderful that they have been able to fight through this and stick together. They also recently celebrated their 47th anniversary. Pray for her as she goes over to Washington in three weeks to give her testification in favor of ECT treatment.
lloydreggie 1 year ago
This video begins with the statement that
"Depression affects some 20 million Americans"
Mmmm. So, what's wrong with a Country that would make so many people become so sad ?
UncagedCardinal 1 year ago
@UncagedCardinal Actually, many would say it's because we have become more advanced in diagnosing such disorders. But it is commonly overdiagnosed such as in teenagers or children.
TheOn3LeftBehind 11 months ago
Comment removed
UncagedCardinal 1 year ago
I just finished my 4th session and I'm going again on Wednesday. So far, I haven't experienced any ill effects and my memory has actually improved. I'm even starting to remember things I didn't even know were still in my head. I guess results vary from person to person. Whether or not this treatment is right for you depends on the severity of your depression. It should only be used after all other options have been exhausted.
SoloWing808 1 year ago 22
@SoloWing808 I think you're right. All I know is my mum was lost within a tortured mind and now she's calm, happy and interactive.
ppod2010 1 year ago
@SoloWing808 It should be mainly done only with consent of the person in question. And it is not the case.
finehomemadewine 7 months ago
@SoloWing808 Were you awake during the therapy?
DarksiderDarmoset 7 months ago
@SoloWing808 My doc has been talking about it but I'm not sure. I'll def be fired if I get this treatment and I need my job even tho I hate it.
argentinawinthrop 3 months ago
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@SoloWing808 My doc has been talking about it but I'm not sure. I'll def be fired if I get this treatment and I need my job even tho I hate it.
argentinawinthrop 3 months ago
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My 87 year old mum became consumed by worries some months ago and simply could no longer function let alone discuss anything with anyone. After a series of ECT (I must confess I was worried) treatments she is a different person; all those anxieties have gone, she interacts well, laughs again (hasn't done that for some time) and hasn't lost any memory at all. I'm shocked (sic).
ppod2010 1 year ago 2
This has been flagged as spam show
My 87 year old mum became consumed by worries some months ago and simply could no longer function let alone discuss anything with anyone. After a series of ECT (I must confess I was worried) treatments she is a different person; all those anxieties have gone, she interacts well, laughs again (hasn't done that for some time) and hasn't lost any memory at all. I'm shocked (sic).
ppod2010 1 year ago
My 87 year old mum became consumed by worries some months ago and simply could no longer function let alone discuss anything with anyone. After a series of ECT (I must confess I was worried) treatments she is a different person; all those anxieties have gone, she interacts well, laughs again (hasn't done that for some time) and hasn't lost any memory at all. I'm shocked (sic).
ppod2010 1 year ago
This is very controversial treatment!
shocks007 1 year ago
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@shocks007. My 87 year old mum became consumed by worries some months ago and simply could no longer function let alone discuss anything with anyone. After a series of ECT (I must confess I was worried) treatments she is a different person; all those anxieties have gone, she interacts well, laughs again (hasn't done that for some time) and hasn't lost any memory at all. I'm shocked (sic).
ppod2010 1 year ago
I wish I could prescribe this treatment for many peope I know........it works wonders!
shadoobee23 1 year ago
I've been getting ECT now for over a year. It started at 3 times a week for one month, and now I get it 2 times a month. It may sound like a scary thing, but it helped me. My medications alone did not help, but the ECT has saved my life.
meadowood07aol 1 year ago 2
My dad his fourth ECT this morning! We've seen improvments but he is far from being cured. I'll be glad to show him which cabinet that the drinking glasses are in five times a day if that means he can lie in the floor and color coloring books with my four year old daughter again. Does anyone know typically how many shocks before significant results are seen?
Jennifereramsey 1 year ago
@Jennifereramsey From my experience, most people show a significant improvement (if there is going to be one) after 6 or 7 treatments. As for the fear of memory loss, most of the time it is the short-term memory that if effected and a lot of the time it is not very substantial. Obviously this is a generalization from what I have seen over the past 3 years. I hope your dad continues improving.
hmdunlop 1 year ago
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@Jennifereramsey From my experience, most people show a significant improvement (if there is going to be one) after 6 or 7 treatments. As for the fear of memory loss, most of the time it is the short-term memory that if effected and a lot of the time it is not very substantial. Obviously this is a generalization from what I have seen over the past 3 years. I hope your dad continues improving.
hmdunlop 1 year ago
I dont understand why this is considered ok! The doctors dont even fully understand what they are doing to people! If you are seriously depressed get therapy and work through your problems, not screw over your brain. Its pathetic that this is still an accepted practice where there are so many other tools to help you out there. I know, I was seriously depressed for 5 years.
BreLeezy 1 year ago 2
@BreLeezy This is not by any means a first line of treatment for depression and is reserved for extreme cases. It is a frightening concept but is the most effective treatment available today for severe depression refractory to medications. Doctors do know what they are doing, but outcomes are sometimes unpredictable as is everything in medicine. After intense therapy and 24 different meds in various combos over 8 years, I was desperate. At that point, ECT saved my life.
CatAtomic100 1 year ago 3
People who angrily denounce ECT have clearly never experienced severe depression before. A slight headache and a little bit of memory loss is a very small price to pay for the mere possibility of getting some relief from it.
ral1334 1 year ago
@ral1334 Yeah, this is exactly the same argument as why desperate terminal patients go under ridiculous treatments as homeopathy, curanderism or whatever. An 800 mA electricity current shot can't bring your wife/husband, your money, your disrupted house back to a marvelous state. And probably, considering the insignificant rate of improvement from this treatment (similar to a placebo effect), this bit of memory loss and cognitive deficit might be the final pusher to commit suicide.
maelstromx1 1 year ago
@maelstromx1 Well, I happen to have undergone the treatment. I'll admit that the relief it provided was only temporary, but I don't think I'm any worse off for having had it done. In truth, I'm neither an advocate nor an opponent of ECT. It just doesn't seem that extreme to me given the abhorrent mental state that leads up to it. I do think that it should continue to remain an option for people, at least until something better comes along.
ral1334 1 year ago 2
@maelstromx1 And also, regarding your comment about an electric current not bringing one's spouse, money, or home back; you are arguing under the false assumption that depression is a natural reaction to life events. But often it is not. It is quite possible for someone not prone to depression to recover from such losses, while a person who is prone to depression may kill himself/herself over what may appear to be a mere trifle to an outside observer, hence the term "mental illness."
ral1334 1 year ago
@ral1334 May be it's a false assumption but the biochemical hypothesis is far from proven too. I do not advocate an spiritual healing point of view, what to my eyes seems to be relevant is what Society expects for people, particularly the mentally ill, that it's what is troublesome. Consider this: in developed countries, the number of people mentally ill is increasing each year. Modern society expects to us to adapt under conditions that millenia ago (or even decades only) were inexistent.
maelstromx1 1 year ago
what the hell is wrong with you suporters of ect? are you crasy!
fiddlestickszz 1 year ago
Memory loss and brain damage. No thanks.
The more "treatments" you have the harder it is for your brain to recover.
Who is going to take care of you when you forget important pieces of your life and your brain no longer functions well enough to take care of yourself? Are you going to be happy being an in and out mental patient or live in an institution?
Ernest Hemingway shot himself after having ECT. He realized it ruined his brain.
ZXN280 1 year ago
How could this be controversial? It's a medical procedures, given with informed consent, that has been proven to work.
CambridgeHeights 1 year ago
@CambridgeHeights when the mechanism of why a treatment works is unknown (admiting hipotetically that it does work), then the words "informed consent" become meaningless. Informed of what? If the information is that they simply don't know, then taking action according to this falsely informed consent is irresponsible.
maelstromx1 1 year ago
@maelstromx1 There are lots of procedures and medications that people take in which the mechanism of action is unknown, yet the safety and efficacy are proven beyond a doubt.
Informed consent involves informing the patient of the risks and benefits of the procedure/medication. Mechanism of action is irrelevant.
CambridgeHeights 1 year ago
@CambridgeHeights Absolutely the same could be said about homeopathy. You'll say "no, homeopathy efficacy is not proven" which i will concede. But how is it proven that given psychiatric procedure is efficient and beneficial? How do they test it? Over time? Then... time is the explanation! Here "time" plays the role of Null Hypothesis, now they have to prove that an alternative explanation (the one which idiotic doctors are prone to give) is more explanatory than the mentioned Null Hypothesis
maelstromx1 1 year ago
@maelstromx1 The evidence is abundantly clear that homeopathy does NOT work. The evidence that ECT works is overwhelming. I don't know what your point is.
CambridgeHeights 1 year ago
@CambridgeHeights what evidence? You don't see any "general medicine survivor movement", in contrast, supporting psych survivors movements, associations, etc. are everywhere, in every country.
maelstromx1 1 year ago
@maelstromx1 The evidence is abundant. Do a Google Scholar search.
CambridgeHeights 1 year ago
@CambridgeHeights Did you want data? There i go: Lisanby SH, Maddox JH, Prudic J, Devanand DP, Sackeim HA (June 2000). "The effects of electroconvulsive therapy on memory of autobiographical and public events". Arch. Gen. Psychiatry 57 (6): 581–90. doi:10.1001/archpsyc.57.6.581. PMID 10839336.
Benbow, SM (2004) "Adverse effects of ECT". In AIF Scott (ed.) The ECT Handbook, second edition. London: The Royal College of Psychiatrists, pp. 170–174.
maelstromx1 1 year ago
@maelstromx1 Ya, ECT has adverse effects. What's your point? As long as the patients are informed of the possibility of those adverse effects, it's ethical. Every drug and procedure has adverse effects, some more severe than others.
CambridgeHeights 1 year ago
@CambridgeHeights i do not have problem with that. For example, i do not advocate Homeopathy, but everyone is free to take it and i'm no one to forbid the decision made by who gives it a try; my ethical concern is then inform that person that homeopathy is a scam, once informed, that person can do what he wants, it's his decision. The problem remains then in those people claiming Homeopathy is science. As for psychiatric methods, the issue, to me, is exactly the same.
maelstromx1 1 year ago
@maelstromx1 We agree on homeopathy. The difference is that ECT has been shown to work. We may not know the mechanism of how ECT works, just like we don't know the mechanism of action of many drugs, but there is an abundance of peer-reviewed scientific evidence to support that it works. Homeopathy does not have a shred of reliable evidence to support its efficacy.
CambridgeHeights 1 year ago
More: Squire LR, Slater PC, Miller PL (January 1981). "Retrograde amnesia and bilateral electroconvulsive therapy. Long-term follow-up". Arch. Gen. Psychiatry 38 (1): 89–95. PMID 7458573.
Squire LR, Slater PC (January 1983). "Electroconvulsive therapy and complaints of memory dysfunction: a prospective three-year follow-up study". Br J Psychiatry 142: 1–8. doi:10.1192/bjp.142.1.1. PMID 6831121.
maelstromx1 1 year ago
And more: Feliu M, et al. (June 2008). "Neuropsychological effects and attitudes in patients following electroconvulsive therapy.". Neuropsychiatric Disease and Treament 4 (3): 613–17. PMID 18830401. PMC 2526376.
Coleman EA, Sackeim HA, et al. (March 1996). "Subjective Memory Complaints Prior to and Following Electroconvulsive Therapy.". Biological Psychiatry. 39 (5): 346–56. doi:10.1016/0006-3223(95)00185-9. PMID 18830401
maelstromx1 1 year ago
Sackeim HA, Prudic J, Fuller R, Keilp J, Lavori PW, Olfson M (January 2007). "The cognitive effects of electroconvulsive therapy in community settings". Neuropsychopharmacology 32 (1): 244–54. doi:10.1038/sj.npp.1301180. PMID 1693671.
Breggin Peter (2007). "ECT Damages the Brain: Disturbing News for Patients and Shock Doctors Alike.". Ethical Human Psychology and Psychiatry. 9 (2): 83–86. doi:10.1891/152315007782021196.
maelstromx1 1 year ago
History of Psychiatry is full, FULL of medical explanations totally ambiguous when contasted to Null Hypothesis.
maelstromx1 1 year ago
She has psychotic depression and every pill in the book gave no help. After the ECT we saw our mom for the first time in 8 years.
bluetempelton 1 year ago
I work with children and adult with epilepsy who have seizures on a regular basis. That is what ECT is. Many years ago a man discovered that patients in mental hospitals with epilepsy never had depression. Exploring this lead to shock therapy with in recent years has become much more humane. My mother is 81 and has had over 30 treatments over the past 2 years. Before that she was like a walking vegtable for 8 years. She wanted to die everyday, heard voices, had to be watched 24 hrs a day.
bluetempelton 1 year ago 2
the reason electro shock is used is to wipe your memory right?
please someone explain EXACTLY what people have these procedures for
details.
VeronicaFeline 1 year ago
@VeronicaFeline no the intention is not to wipe your memory, that is an unwanted side effect. the small short current of electricity shocks your brain and induces a seizure in the person. this resets the electrical signals of the brain, and lets the brain reprogram itself. well, it happens something along those lines. it is not completely understood WHY it works, but evidence has proven it does. it is used to improve the condition of patients who have depression, bipolar, schizophrenia.
littlepeter5 1 year ago
@littlepeter5 If there's something which "improves" this sort of such different conditions (depression, bipolar, schizofrenia, etc), then this demonstrates it doesn't improve anything. What this clearly suggests is placebo effect taking place.
maelstromx1 1 year ago
@littlepeter5 If there's something which "improves" this sort of such different conditions (depression, bipolar, schizofrenia, etc), then this demonstrates it doesn't improve anything. What this clearly suggests is placebo effect taking place.
maelstromx1 1 year ago
evil destruction of brain!
it`s a crime!
MrGibbus 1 year ago
BZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
Dflowen 1 year ago
i feel sorry for any idiot that even considers this
jtaylorl 1 year ago
@jtaylorl You're right... my wife shouldn't have ECT, she should go ahead and commit suicide, just like she's thought about every day for years, and was hospitalized for last year.
Your compassion is underwhelming.
NightAire 1 year ago
@ MassDeportation...you sound psychotic and delusional. Wow.
macdisciple 1 year ago 6
@macdisciple define psychotic and delusional. have you ever thought that it is him that is normal, but everyone else is delusional.
shadowindadark 1 year ago
You people reading this should know 2 words some of these sadistic con artists use to implicate people. "conspiracy" and "paranoid" These words were developed in the 1950's to label people incompetent and dangerous and railroad them into mental hospitals where ANYTHNG can be done to them. NOBODY KNOWS if "POISONED VEINS" (WHAT A NAME FOR SOMEBODY CALLING ANOTHER PERSON "PARANOID" ABOUT ELECTROCONVULSIVE THERAPY) has even BEEN in australia and if so what he has seen, or done.
MassDeportation 1 year ago
The psychiatric industry makes BILLIONS each year on "diagnosing" and pilling gullible people, TELLING them what their problems are! DO YOU KNOW WHAT YOUR PROBLEM IS, MR/MS DEPRESSED PERSON? YOUR PROBLEM IS, YOURE DEPRESSED! So now what you gonna do? Pay thousands and thousands and THOUSANDS of dollars to counsellors and the drug companies? Youre DEPRESSED, DEAL WITH IT! Maybe you were abused, scared, alone. So you let some assholes MEDICATE YOU and railroad you into a SHOCKBOX??
MassDeportation 1 year ago
BAN ECT NOW! None of you, even the shock docs themselves, knows what goes on in individual situations. The ect machine is a very effective instrument of torture and coersion. So while your STUPID family is paying for your "treatment" even though they sense something is wrong, youre being abused, raped tortured coerced drugged injected pilled and STUPID people outside are being told whatever they need to hear to perpetuate it. You can even be drugged for a visit so you look "disturbed"
MassDeportation 1 year ago
@MassDeportation I volunteered in an ECt Suite for a number of years and I saw many ECT treatments being done. The Dr's didn't torture the patients!! I have first-hand experience of witnessing ECT treatments being done. No torture or coercion was seen. I also spoke to the patients before and after each ECT treatment and saw them both before ECT was started and after all treatments were finished. ECT saved their lives, that's what they said over and over again. It kept these people from suicide.
poisonedxveins 1 year ago
@poisonedxveins And i should BELIEVE your comment, because?
MassDeportation 1 year ago
@MassDeportation Why should people believe your comment? I have no reason to lie or even bother commenting on this page because quite frankly, you sound paranoid as it is which makes your comments hard to believe. I can also only speak from my point of view and what I have seen in Australian hospitals. The U.S. may be a whole other story, and I'm sure there are some doctors who are not practicing ethically, but overall doctors are trying to help people, not make them worse.
poisonedxveins 1 year ago
@poisonedxveins People can believe my comment because a few of the decieved drugged fools see people being put in a prison type environment with little contact with the outside world, controlled by the jailers themselves. People see a psychiatric INDUSTRY that makes BILLIONS off of pills and shock therapy (putting electricity thru DRUGGED vuneralbe peoples BRAINS) You have no reason to lie LOL! MONEY? You have no reason to comment on this page? Then why are you commenting on this page? LIAR!
MassDeportation 1 year ago
@poisonedxveins Probably the cause of this improvement is not the ECT itself, but the fact that it settles the person in a position in which he "is doing something": he no longer remains passive. When you take pills, the most probable is that you do nothing to improve your life, you simply expect that the pill do all the work. But when you go under a real new experience, then you're pressured to change, be it an ECT procedure or bangee jumping.
maelstromx1 1 year ago
@maelstromx1 Actually they have done a number of studies where patients think they're undergoing real ECT but are actually just being put to sleep for a few minutes etc. to see if ECT actually works or if the improvements were a byproduct of the extra care these individuals were receiving due to getting ECT done. Those patients who really had ECT improved, those who didn't, did not. ECT has a 70-90% success rate for depression, hence why it is still available. It's drastic, but sometimes needed.
poisonedxveins 1 year ago
@poisonedxveins That is only a little part of testing a Null Hypothesis and it still demonstrates why Psychology and its big brother, Psychiatry, are no real sciences. To actually pass a placebo effect test comparison, the control group had to go under some kind of procedure which actually had some noticeable effects. For example, to test a new drug for depression, you don't administrate a sugar pill to the control group, you give some pill that it's known for gaving some effects ...(continued)
maelstromx1 1 year ago
...some effects, but at the same time this effects are known to be irrelevant for the illness in question (p.e. a headache). If you give a sugar pill to the control group, they'll rapidly percieve that it has no effect on them, decreasing or nulifying the potential placebo effect.But if you administrate a pill which produces a headache or a change in behaviour irrelevant to the depression, the control group will realize that, in some way, the pill is working, increasing the pl.effect
maelstromx1 1 year ago
For a ECT case, the situation you describe in which the control group is under, is analogical to the case of the sugar pill. The problem then, remains in the fact that is doubtly ethical to administrate TO PEOPLE some kind of placebo which can produce some undesirable effects, which restricts absolutely the range of the studies to some very particular cases, making more branches of the Psychology, and Psychiatry, as a whole, unscientific
maelstromx1 1 year ago
Mmh interesting assumption with no way out. If the success rate is so high (70-90% being higher than drugs, actually) why not abandon all drug treatment at first hand? Because ECT is more risky? Because produces brain damage? Because is cheaper than administrate drugs for your whole life? Oh, now i know. If it's the first and second reason, wow, this means actually ECT is not as safe and efficient; if it's the third... Psychiatry is dubious enterprise... Anyways, it gives ECT a bad role.
maelstromx1 1 year ago
In Sweden they first poison people, with no psychiatric problems that have been lured into contacting psychiatry, with overdoses of neuroleptica and then ECT them in order to cause memory loss so that they will not be able to defend them selves in court against false accusations about having psychiatric problems. One reason is that psychiatry can't get enough patients otherwise, and the other is that the psychiatric staff are Nazis that want to exterminate certain groups of people.
MOBiL4u 1 year ago 2