Bert Jansch - Nottamun Town

[mouldybear]

A fine version of this wonderful traditional song that comes from a recording by Jean Ritchie. Superb song.

[wideernie]

"Ten thousand were drowned that never were born". That line plus the guitar make my hairs stand up on end.

[Danolboy]

RIP

[waddayouknow]

Brilliant Mr Jansch. Nottamum Town is yours.

[sunriseRISE]

SEEMS boOb'S dylan '' just ripped this off note for note'......... then called it 'MASTERS OF War'....also now seems.. Boobs McZinamini'S first 3 lps are all ENGLISH FOLK//===(cept for where hes ripping off WOODY Guthre'... ha ====BRINGing IT HOME INDEED'.. Stealing wee ZIN-A-MiNi....and he had the GAUL to SAY l the ROLLING STONES. are . A COVERS BAND ha aT least THEY SAID WE THEY DID.....

[paisleybabee]

Is that Brian Jones whispering into his ear?It looks like him

[sslomo]

What a fantastic artist this man is! Thank you for posting this song!

[JazzmanJibilla]

Great pictures, great tune..nicely done..love seeing the old pictures.

[freedomlistener]

TRUE SOUL!! Lots of music nowadays doesn't have it. It doesn't necessarily have anything to do with what genre it is, in my opinion.

[acidpsychedelia69]

Sort of reminds me of Bob Dylan's "Masters of War". I like it.

[killjoy96]

Yeah, it's just terrible how these old traditional folk songs rip off the melodies of modern musicians, ain't it?

[lynettekomidar]

@killjoy96 What!!!

[killjoy96]

@lynettekomidar

From memory that was a reply to someone who claimed this was a rip-off of Dylan's Masters of War, a great song based on this traditional melody.

[AnomicDeadDisciple]

@killjoy96 Someone said that? That's nonsense, opinion or not. They're to excellent and uniquely different songs.

Bert Jansch doesn't need to rip off anyone...when he sings a song it is his song and no one elses

I'd wonder why one would waste their time commenting on a beautiful song except to echo admiration...

What's funny, actually, is that there's a cd called "Songs that Inspired Dylan" and if you would believe it, this song right here is track number one. Ho hum 

[joaped]

@AnomicDeadDisciple Y

[Sshelly34213]

@killjoy96 Actually it was the other way around Dylan ripped the song off. He actually did rip it off and Jean Ritchie sued him claimed the song had been in her family for generations.

[killjoy96]

@Sshelly34213

You're seriously telling me that traditional melodies don't actually jump into a time machine to rip off later musicians? No shit.



[Sshelly34213]

@killjoy96 Lol, apparently other people on this board are rather surprised by this

[clarkewi]

@Sshelly34213 There is no "rip off" in folk music, it is public domain by definition. Note the word "folk" - it comes from "The people" not one person. Copyrights are applicable in pop music and there is a time limit. You can cover a Robert Johnson sone or a Scott Joplin song without licensing. And if you do your own version of a folk song by changing a lyric or chords or whatever then you can claim authorship should you "publish" it. You don't even have to give credit as per "fair use" laws.

[Sshelly34213]

@clarkewi Excuse me but it's public domain because it's traditional!! No one is allowed to say that they are the sole writers if the song is traditional. Even if it were legal, that doesn't make it morally right.

[clarkewi]

@Sshelly34213 May not be morally right, but its common practice. Check Wikipedia story of the Kingston Trio who launched the "folk boom" in America in the late 1950's paving the way for Dylan, Peter Paul and Mary and others. Wikipedia states that " criticism that the group had been getting from more traditional folk performers for money-making copyrights that the Kingston group had secured for their arrangements of public domain songs.[1]" This set the precedent that continues to this day.

[Sshelly34213]

@clarkewi Bob Dylan did not originally gave anyone credit for this song, so he did technically "rip it off," he was actually sued over it. Unfortunately it's a pretty common story.

[63judesboy]

@clarkewi You're right in principle - but Robert Johnson's material is copyright with the proceeds going to his estate. I understand that he has a son who benefits from this.

[FOARP]

@63judesboy - Copyright in creative works is 70 years from death of the author, Robert Johnson died in 1938, so his compositions has been in the public domain since 2008 and anyone can use them freely. Copyright in recordings of performances in the United States is complex, but cannot be more than 95 years, so use of Robert Johnson's recorded performances is probably not free at the moment.

[63judesboy]

@FOARP Thanks for the clarification :)

[Marseille5]

Exactly. Very similar songs.

[beethovenbix]

THIS SONG ACTUALLY INFLUENCED DYLAN TO WRITE MASTERS OF WAR ! This Song was around before Dylan even wrote it !!!!

[FolkieOne]

You've not quite managed to pick up on the sarcasm of the first reply. It's OK,... step away from the CAPSLOCK.

[beethovenbix]

"It's All About the Music at the end of the day. If people wanna' be sarcastic that

ain't my problem. Regardless of who

borrowed from who -doesn't matter.

As long as the 'borrower' acknowledges

the debt."

[pewpie99]

superb.

[pewpie99]

hammelsburgh - yes - this music was used by Dylan for masters of war.

[mcwarty]

i think this quite possibly the best jansch song iv ever heard............splendid

[Toyboy789]

awesomely simple and timeless . . . pared back to all that counts in great musicianship! Thanks for the posting!

[hammelsburgh]

Masters of War isnt it

[wobblytodger]

recorded on a kitchen bench in swiss cottage on a real to real with a primitive guitar with Anne Briggs in attendance, but hell his edge and angst says it all.

[eebeelive]

SWEET! A grey mare like me would know!!!

e

[eebeelive]

SWEET!

[SirMikeyD]

Holy hell! I haven't heard that in ~20 years and it's even better than I remembered. Not one note could've been improved upon ... ol' BJ right nailed that one!

Also ... I thought Carthy looked normal (at least for him back then)!

[JimCodPie]

It's funny how Martin Carthy looks like a complete hippie on the floor and Davey Graham looks like a smart business man

oh and lovely song btw

[jurijmlotman]

brilliant singer, bert jansch. strange kind of british folk soulfulness.

[jsilence418]

A DAMN good singer too !!

[1fretter]

Great first album. Recorded by Bill Leader if I remember rightly.

[cjwaywell]

Bert is the only God.

[C0YS18]

..with Dylan and Nick Drake!? ;-)! no Ive only just found about Bert and I can say Im quite inpressed!!....maybe I should of bought his album instead of Manu Chao! oh well I'll buy it tomorrow

[dpg25]

Theres nothing wrong with Manu Chao! Check out his old Mano Negra stuff or Clandestino.

[C0YS18]

Nothing wrong with manu chao at all!! Love the guy!!! But I would of saved £4 if I bought this album instead and I really like Jansch...maybe even more then Manu Chao, I do also like his old stuff

[garethhulin]

how can manu who ever ????and bert jansch even be mentioned in the same breath?

[C0YS18]

Obv. english. In the rest of the world Manu Chao is one of the biggest names around, very politicaly aware and actually takes much influence from Folk. Albight it being the feel and more tradition "street" music as he discribes it (He dosent mean hip hop or that fake R&B shit when he mentions this but the classical folk or trad folk) esecialy form nigeria!? cant be sure.

[C0YS18]

and also yuo may find takes a lot form ye reggae and even has worked with maney reggae artists and has dedicated many songs to them. Including Mr Marley. Wheather you prefer tosh or not is another question

[garethhulin]

thanks friend- you explained my point for me..Bert Jansch isnt a reggae derived artist is he? or a world music artist is he?

so why make the most disparate comparison ...i think your just jealous of us Brits....thats ok . you can keep Manu . he is awful,soulless,derivitaive and typically style less...i bet he's german or something hahaha

[C0YS18]

oi Manu grandad was put to death by francos regiem. They escaped and he was born in france. Manu is famed for having one of the most destincet styles around, but he does change it a lot. At first he was vey punk and then slowly turned more "world music". When he left Mano Negra he made a entirely accustic album (almost) of which Caldestino was the main hit. A song about the unfairness and lonelyness of ileagle imigrents. his second album is a more chilled out album

[C0YS18]

Anyway The problem with the UK and the US as well is they are stubbern to what is happing around the world. For me manu chao iw in there with the top top artists (In my top 10)

[garethhulin]

the problem with the uk is that you dont live here but wish you did ... :) ...trust me, there aint no problem here....bert jansch is a foundation artist whop inspired the likes of marr,paige ...you name it ....that was my point but you obvously are not aware of this...and instead mae comparisions to someoen who i am well aware of for your info' but sadly ifind nothing in his music that would make me want to go and buy a manu c.d over a lou reed for instance...i.e. he is shit!!!

[C0YS18]

I do live in the uk. Im english...I live in yprk and have lived in the UK most my life 14.5 of my 16 years. I was born in the UK.

Im aware Janch inspired great artists and is a great artist however I could probably get you into manu chao tell me what you like and I will find something. Manu chao has been in the bussinuss for 20 years+ and he has had so many stilles at this time, from Reggae to hip-hop.

[C0YS18]

You have only confermed my greatest fears that music is now pritty much dead. The stubberness in england today is rediculas.Manu chao for me remains one of the only artists who truly knows what music means today and remains one of the only artists who has a soul and truely belives what hes saying.Many people think that one day he will be shot for his contraversy...Thank god hes not pop. in the US otherwise hed be gone by now

[garethhulin]

i know heres an idea..... lets have a dumb argument online about music ,say ypou spouting shit at a dj,musician and 25 year old record collection owning fuly grown man...... but lets not though hey , i dont want to fuel your already paranoid teenage hormonal delusions based on such scant assumptions,go back to your angst ridden grief hole.

[dasilvaec]

I mostly agree with you man, music today is pretty pathetic. However you have to keep in mind that it isn't too necessary for a musician to believe in what they are singing, look at Bob Dylan for instance, and alot of true folk musicians (Bob is not one of these) for that matter. Folk music is all about passing down a story through song, you don't have to believe in it necessarily. Also you need to grow your music collection before you can brag about it, i myself have hundreds of albums.

[q28s1]

I wouldn't call it pathetic.. Music in general is about expression and if you think about it all these people in this era were looking for something deeper so there music will be deeper. All people really seem to want these days are simple answers, quick easy feel goods. I think it shows through the music.

There is still deep music out there, just not much.

[Sshelly34213]

@q28s1 Again, as I said to another poster the sales only represent 1% of the population. You are right when you say people want simple answers to tough questions. Surveys show that people think we need to cut spending for the national deficit, but when asked what to cut they overwhelmingly said nothing...

There's a bit of denial going on right now and that's what pop culture reflects. We have turned inward and away from the world as a population.

[nerdyharry]

@q28s1 it's getting deeper again in a bit.

[Tianshou88]

popular culture is pathetic, therefore the music that is widely publicized is pathetic. look back, a lot of incredibly talented and influential musicians barely ever made it into the public eye. traditional delta blues artists are a good example. also someone like jackson c frank. there are people around the world who are brilliant writing incredible music but are never recognized cause miley cyrus is shaking her tits at everyone. its pretty sad. so i guess in a way i agree with you =/

[Sshelly34213]

@Tianshou88 I don't think I agree with that because pop music comes from folk and blues...folk was really the pop music of its day.

The problem is that pop music has become something that people have become apathetic to. The cd sales of pop musicians today don't even represent 1% of the population. If you were to pander to every person, musicians like this would most definitely be "popular." Also remember that none of those people will be remembered 20 years down the line. Pop is in the moment

[Sshelly34213]

@C0YS18 It's not dead, think of it like a bear in the winter. It's hibernating. People once thought music was dead in the late 80s and then grunge came along and woke us up as a population. Music hibernates until it is needed or until the population is ready again to be a part of the world. The world is a big scary place and most people try to pretend it doesn't exist for the most part. We live in the suburbs to get away from the big, bad, scary city. We have minivans because driving scares us.

[C0YS18]

He has inspired tones of artists and has for many people put world music back on the map. For me Manu Chao is not a morden Janch but a modern Clash, Bob Marley, Lou Reed/VU, David Bowie I feel in terms of Influence (I mean the way the bands Manu Chao and his solo carrer (albight it not being solo) is a lot like VUs structure i.e mxing lots of stilles together, and to a certain extent the clash) hes no Dylan, Cash, Jansch, Dekker but hes what follows on from that your Led Zepp, Bowie,Marley ect

[garethhulin]

just kidding...ok..so you lke him,thats cool.

[C0YS18]

oi lets end this arguement and let it go back on topic, however it must be mentioned that I own a good 60 albums I love many music and probably on a whole we share most music tasts but I think having an Italian side has got me into "world music"..albight it mostly being spain and ethiopia...

[Pomepwns]

Mmm, copypasta. My favourite.

[C0YS18]

featuring the amazing "la Primavera" as well as it being called "proxima statsion:esperanza" "next station hope" Joe Strummer was known to be a massive fan of Manu and Manu described him as an uncle to him. The reggae things that I mentioned are to do with the fact you have favourated tosh. And also your arguement is ultamatly floored becouse I AM FROM THE UK!!!!!!! Also the fact that you say your aware of Manu and then you say you bet hes "german or something"!!

[jsilence418]

Magickal! thank you for the post.

1

[viking1au]

And is that Heather Jansch whispering in Bert's ear just after the pic of Martin & Davey?

[viking1au]

Just looked again. Yes it looks like a pic of Martin Carthy and Davey Graham, just after the pic of Bert reclining. Intentional, or did the person who posted this screw up.??? Love Bert & Martin both. - Both great guitar maestros!

[joaped]

intentionally my friend

[viking1au]

Thought so. Both Bert and Martin are legends in their own lifetime. Martin comes to Australia a lot more than Bert but both have a big following. -- Re Davey Graham: Rumour of several months is that he is coming out of retirement, is working on a new album and that Bert is playing on it with him. Heard anything??????????

[viking1au]

Good photo compilations. -- Somewhere about the middle; is that a pic of Martin Carthy and Davey Graham???????

[99ZARDOZ]

I like Jansch's voice. It is very distinctive - you hear his stuff and you know it's him singing. Beats the crap out of a lot of technically correct but boring and interchangeable singers out there.

This is a piece of musical magic and extremely hard to play, let alone to sing at the same time.

As for compilations, this is on "Legend" a compilation available in the UK which introduced me to the wonder of Jansch.

[Sshelly34213]

@99ZARDOZ It actually kind of reminds me of Donovan's voice, except perhaps a bit raspier and rougher. Either way it is pretty unique.

[amodellife]

more please - fabulous. thanks.

[VelvetRope41]

like i said...your taste in music is superb...i am looking forward to hearing what you have to say about me!!! great song more is right

[Namezszs]

Oh god, One of my favorite songs

turns out to be ruined up by this guy who cant even sing

Dammit

[joaped]

hmmm, why do you even bother? uugg, hate people that comment on something t hey dont know, if youre a "Bob Dylan cants Sing, bububu" then fuck off man

[ETM9000]

Whenever i click on the profiles of people that say negative stuff like that they always have the most rediculous profiles usually with some cartoon character background and a stupid video favorite list of people playing video games or shooting cans.

[avocet1961]

Thanks for posting this. I can never understand why this is never on compilation CDs of Bert's - it's certainly one of his best!