@slapapiggy What part of "All Government employees should realize that the process of collective barganing as usually understood cannot be transplanted into the public service" don't you understand. If there is ANY distortion, it is yours. Also, the complete document is readidly available on the internet as commented before in previous post to the same comment. Google it.
@zymurg2007 If you were to take the time to read the WHOLE letter, you would see he is addressing STRIKES by public employees, not their ability to bargain. Again, it's easy to distort by taking quotes out of context.
@slapapiggy You will always read into what YOU like, but FDR clearly did NOT think collective barganing belonged in the public sector and CLEARLY said so. I DID read the whole document, and FDR SAID collective barganing cannot be transplanted into the public service and that means exactly what it says! Regardless hoe you would LIKE to read it, it is correct, collective bargaining in public service is inconsistance with government/employer and taxpayer relationship. End of story.
@philip0460 This issue is about the Public sector, not 'companies' which are private sector. In this issue the unions conceded the excessive pay they were receiving from the taxpayers that were granted them far in excess of the private sector unions or non-union.
@philip0460 For one thing only. power, control and influence of the leaders, and the required dues from the membership, nothing more. As in Wisconsin, in most public union employees have NO CHOICE. They MUST join the union or get another job. Dues automaticaly deducted from your pay. Until now. Thank you Gov Walker.
@philip0460 : I can complain and ask to make more but thats what keeps jobs here too. America has become too spoiled. Everyone thinks they are entitled to boats and big house and a nice car. We are all a part of the problem. We all need to simplify. Not to say corporations are innocent. I work in the Hollywood industry and they pay their VP's and Managers ridiculous amounts of money...
@philip0460 :... I know many public workers who complain yet if the doors were open to competition hundreds of thousands of folk would love their jobs. I hear them brag how they take long lunches and shop on the clock whereas in a private company your butt would be tossed out and have no union to defend you. I have a buddy who makes $35 an hour and full benefits and accumulated vacation and works a non hazardous job. What a joke !!! If there was competition he probably make $ 15.
To ever make Collective Bargaining a "Right" would mean that someone has to sit on the other side of the table and 'bargain' as a requirement by law, whether they wanted to or not, whether they agreed or disagreed. That would no longer be 'bargaining' it would be agreement or concession by mandate. The true right in a democracy is your freedom of speech. There is no requirement that anyone must respond or even debate, much less bargain with anyone, and, in a democracy there never will be.
Today's News "DES MOINES, Iowa (AP) - The Iowa House has approved a bill that overhauls the state's collective bargaining law and reduces workers' negotiating "rights" ". Iowa, Ohio, NJ, are next, more to follow.
Congratulations Wisconsin and Governor Scott Walker and the State Assembly in their vote 18-1 to restrict collective bargaining today (3/9/11). Extraordinary progress for the tax payer and America! Unions do NOT speak for Wisconsin, or America!
"No American should be forced to join a union and pay dues to get a job in this country," Sen. Jim DeMint, R-S.C., said in a statement today when the bill for National Right To Work was introduced in congress 3/9/2011.
Congratulations to Congressional GOP today for introducing a National Right to Work Bill which will make it national for EVERY State in the US public employees the ability to NOT join a public union and to not be forced to pay dues to unions. Taxpayers (which of course pay government employees that are required to pay union dues, much of which unions use for political contributions of which 93% go to Democrats). Efforts underway nationally in support of this bill ! Well done GOP!
Regardless of whether or not FDR backed collective bargaining for public unions or not, what's good for the goose, etc, etc. Truth is, collective bargaining is the voice of the working person. Take that away and you have a quick decent back to the days where the unregulated work place saw, low wages, dangerous working conditions, discrimination, termination without cause, nepotism, etc, etc.
@louise12345 Do you realize that all Federal employees and most states do NOT have collective bargaining? And, they have the best wages and working conditions in the country over private sector. You are confusing public and private sectors. Collective bargaining has NO business in public sector, you can't negeotiate with your employer, the tax payers.
@zymurg2007 - Yes of course I realize that. I was speaking about those that do already have cb rights. I am not confusing anything at all. Whether your employer is the tax payer or a multinational corporation, it makes no difference. Workers deserve representation and collective bargaining works. Many unions have already taken more than generous pay cuts as a part of bargaining. So it's not just a one way street, there is give too.
@louise12345 (1) "Whether your employer is the tax payer or multinational corporation (private sector) makes no difference at all". Illustrates your naivete' . There is a HUGE difference. (2) "Yes of course I realize that" ..."Take that away and you have a quick decent back to the days..."., Federal employees NEVER had those days! Its PUBLIC EMPLOYEE UNIONS" You totally miss the point and are unable to understand your own comments. It doesn't matter because you will never get it!
@zymurg2007 - JFK signed executive order 10988 granting Federal employees (limited) collective bargaining RIGHTS! The descent backwards I was referring to is back to the days of the Corporate oligarchy of the likes of Carnegie, Rockefeller, etc. When the powerless worker was no more than a mere serf. Rights like bargaining are essential to maintain civility in the workplace.
@louise12345 yes, but fortunately President Jimmy Carter in 1979 signed Executive Order 12171 prohibiting many federal organizations from collective bargaining, which has been amended 12 times to include most remaining federal organizations from collective bargaining for national security.
@joeeltree Do a search for "FDR and Collective Bargaining" by Patrick McILheran who said in his published work "FDR’s backing for collective bargaining was “only for the private sector. Roosevelt openly opposed bargaining rights for government unions.”
Why didn't they read the whole letter? It would give FDR's true feelings on the matter.
Taking excerpts out of context is only useful to distort the truth. He was only against federal employees striking.
slapapiggy 3 months ago
@slapapiggy What part of "All Government employees should realize that the process of collective barganing as usually understood cannot be transplanted into the public service" don't you understand. If there is ANY distortion, it is yours. Also, the complete document is readidly available on the internet as commented before in previous post to the same comment. Google it.
zymurg2007 3 months ago
@zymurg2007 If you were to take the time to read the WHOLE letter, you would see he is addressing STRIKES by public employees, not their ability to bargain. Again, it's easy to distort by taking quotes out of context.
slapapiggy 1 month ago
@slapapiggy You will always read into what YOU like, but FDR clearly did NOT think collective barganing belonged in the public sector and CLEARLY said so. I DID read the whole document, and FDR SAID collective barganing cannot be transplanted into the public service and that means exactly what it says! Regardless hoe you would LIKE to read it, it is correct, collective bargaining in public service is inconsistance with government/employer and taxpayer relationship. End of story.
zymurg2007 1 month ago
Then you know what? Maybe companies should pay their workers MORE then they wouldn't have to organize. Duh!
philip0460 11 months ago
@philip0460 This issue is about the Public sector, not 'companies' which are private sector. In this issue the unions conceded the excessive pay they were receiving from the taxpayers that were granted them far in excess of the private sector unions or non-union.
zymurg2007 11 months ago
@zymurg2007
But why do people unionize? for their health? LOL
philip0460 11 months ago
@philip0460 For one thing only. power, control and influence of the leaders, and the required dues from the membership, nothing more. As in Wisconsin, in most public union employees have NO CHOICE. They MUST join the union or get another job. Dues automaticaly deducted from your pay. Until now. Thank you Gov Walker.
zymurg2007 11 months ago
@philip0460 The average unionized automaker worker makes $170,000 per year in salary and benefits.
Are you saying that ALL similarly skilled non-union workers should make $170,000 per year?
How may companies can survive that wage rate?
AdamGales 11 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@philip0460 The average unionized automaker worker makes $170,000 per year in salary and benefits.
Are you saying that ALL similarly skilled non-union workers should make $170,000 per year?
How may companies can survive that wage rate?
AdamGales 11 months ago
@philip0460 : I can complain and ask to make more but thats what keeps jobs here too. America has become too spoiled. Everyone thinks they are entitled to boats and big house and a nice car. We are all a part of the problem. We all need to simplify. Not to say corporations are innocent. I work in the Hollywood industry and they pay their VP's and Managers ridiculous amounts of money...
megatron6644 11 months ago
@philip0460 :... I know many public workers who complain yet if the doors were open to competition hundreds of thousands of folk would love their jobs. I hear them brag how they take long lunches and shop on the clock whereas in a private company your butt would be tossed out and have no union to defend you. I have a buddy who makes $35 an hour and full benefits and accumulated vacation and works a non hazardous job. What a joke !!! If there was competition he probably make $ 15.
megatron6644 11 months ago
@philip0460 :...They work for us remember. We can choose what car we buy based on best deal, why can't we choose the rates and employees govt hires?
megatron6644 11 months ago
To ever make Collective Bargaining a "Right" would mean that someone has to sit on the other side of the table and 'bargain' as a requirement by law, whether they wanted to or not, whether they agreed or disagreed. That would no longer be 'bargaining' it would be agreement or concession by mandate. The true right in a democracy is your freedom of speech. There is no requirement that anyone must respond or even debate, much less bargain with anyone, and, in a democracy there never will be.
zymurg2007 11 months ago
Today's News "DES MOINES, Iowa (AP) - The Iowa House has approved a bill that overhauls the state's collective bargaining law and reduces workers' negotiating "rights" ". Iowa, Ohio, NJ, are next, more to follow.
zymurg2007 11 months ago
A GREAT victory today for America and the GOP. Thank you Wisconsin and Gov. Scott Walker!
zymurg2007 1 year ago
Congratulations Wisconsin and Governor Scott Walker and the State Assembly in their vote 18-1 to restrict collective bargaining today (3/9/11). Extraordinary progress for the tax payer and America! Unions do NOT speak for Wisconsin, or America!
zymurg2007 1 year ago
"No American should be forced to join a union and pay dues to get a job in this country," Sen. Jim DeMint, R-S.C., said in a statement today when the bill for National Right To Work was introduced in congress 3/9/2011.
Amen!
zymurg2007 1 year ago
Congratulations to Congressional GOP today for introducing a National Right to Work Bill which will make it national for EVERY State in the US public employees the ability to NOT join a public union and to not be forced to pay dues to unions. Taxpayers (which of course pay government employees that are required to pay union dues, much of which unions use for political contributions of which 93% go to Democrats). Efforts underway nationally in support of this bill ! Well done GOP!
zymurg2007 1 year ago
Regardless of whether or not FDR backed collective bargaining for public unions or not, what's good for the goose, etc, etc. Truth is, collective bargaining is the voice of the working person. Take that away and you have a quick decent back to the days where the unregulated work place saw, low wages, dangerous working conditions, discrimination, termination without cause, nepotism, etc, etc.
louise12345 1 year ago
@louise12345 Do you realize that all Federal employees and most states do NOT have collective bargaining? And, they have the best wages and working conditions in the country over private sector. You are confusing public and private sectors. Collective bargaining has NO business in public sector, you can't negeotiate with your employer, the tax payers.
zymurg2007 1 year ago
@zymurg2007 - Yes of course I realize that. I was speaking about those that do already have cb rights. I am not confusing anything at all. Whether your employer is the tax payer or a multinational corporation, it makes no difference. Workers deserve representation and collective bargaining works. Many unions have already taken more than generous pay cuts as a part of bargaining. So it's not just a one way street, there is give too.
louise12345 1 year ago
@louise12345 (1) "Whether your employer is the tax payer or multinational corporation (private sector) makes no difference at all". Illustrates your naivete' . There is a HUGE difference. (2) "Yes of course I realize that" ..."Take that away and you have a quick decent back to the days..."., Federal employees NEVER had those days! Its PUBLIC EMPLOYEE UNIONS" You totally miss the point and are unable to understand your own comments. It doesn't matter because you will never get it!
zymurg2007 1 year ago
@zymurg2007 - JFK signed executive order 10988 granting Federal employees (limited) collective bargaining RIGHTS! The descent backwards I was referring to is back to the days of the Corporate oligarchy of the likes of Carnegie, Rockefeller, etc. When the powerless worker was no more than a mere serf. Rights like bargaining are essential to maintain civility in the workplace.
louise12345 1 year ago
@louise12345 yes, but fortunately President Jimmy Carter in 1979 signed Executive Order 12171 prohibiting many federal organizations from collective bargaining, which has been amended 12 times to include most remaining federal organizations from collective bargaining for national security.
zymurg2007 11 months ago
@louise12345 Collective bargaining has never been and will never be a RIGHT.
It is not provided for in our constitution or our Bill of Rights. It is a privilege that can be taken away, fortunately.
zymurg2007 11 months ago
@louise12345 Also louise, collective bargaining is not and NEVER has been a RIGHT! There is no such thing is "cb rights"
zymurg2007 1 year ago
Even George Meany, Head of the AFL-CIO, declared Dec 4, 1955 in the NY Times "It is impossible to bagain collectively with the Government"
zymurg2007 1 year ago
He was not opposed to collective bargaining, he was opposed to striking
joeeltree 1 year ago
@joeeltree Wrong. FDR was totally opposed to colective barganing for Government Employees.
zymurg2007 1 year ago
@joeeltree Do a search for "FDR and Collective Bargaining" by Patrick McILheran who said in his published work "FDR’s backing for collective bargaining was “only for the private sector. Roosevelt openly opposed bargaining rights for government unions.”
zymurg2007 1 year ago
@joeeltree Search "FDR's Ghost Is Smiling on Wisconsin's Governor" by Patrick McILheran dated Feb 19, 2011.
Published in "Real Clear Politics" and is recommended reading. Previous title was a follow-up article by same author.
zymurg2007 1 year ago
@joeeltree Now THAT is a comment from someone who can't have read the words contained in the video commented upon.
TheTypicalGirl 1 year ago
You should really include a link to the whole letter
joeeltree 1 year ago
@joeeltree I don't include links in YouTube post, but it is readily available. Google it.
zymurg2007 1 year ago