I can see the 'hero is defeated' part of the timeline, but I don't know if it necessarily has to link to OoT. Basically, it's when Ganon retrieves the triforce.
Lets just say the Hero of Time failing was predestined, and the Triforce wish at the end of ALttP change the the past and allowed the Hero of Time to win, thus creating a split and thus the rest of the timeline. If we do that it makes sense.
Basically, After OoT successful ending, Link is no longer there to have a descendent/reincarnation that can battle Ganondorf for Hyrule, and a wish was made to the gods to prevent Ganondorf from getting the triforce (again), and thus the flood happened.
In LttP, Link most likely still lived, or at least long enough for a reincarnation to happen so there was no need for the wish/flood to happen. That's probably the most significant difference between the two 'Adult Timelines' as you put it.
@RedDragonForce2 I think in the LttP, having it placed in the Defeated Time-spilt was great. I think Link lived but was heavily injured.(Always holding a Hate for Gannondorf) Seeing as Zelda was a Sage. (We think but we have heavy proof that she is a sage but that still needs to be answered.) Link and Zelda couldn't have a Child. The only un-married girl Link knew who wasn't a Sage was that Girl in Lon Lon Ranch. Link and her had a Child, Link trained that Child and thats when Lttp happened.
Theoretically, the time changing events in OoT are well defined as any time when you are first able to reach the final area, and heading there with 100 percent completion to your hearts content. Because you're traveling back and forth through time more than once, you could say that before defeating Ganon and being sent back is within one timeline that splits because of that moment in time.
Not specifically any 'Game Over', but just not completing the game itself (Ganon is stopped, or whatever).
@randomweido well no that would imply that the picori sword is the master sword. but that impossible because the picori sword becomes the four sword. but the master sword apears in OOT and the the four sword appears later. Therefore the sword are not the same.
@Kenziex123 Actually the Picori blade is Proved by many Theroists (I spelt that wrong...)The Picori Blade is the re-made Master Sword. Now what they don't see is that in the Minish Cap game it says that the Minish made the Sacred Blade or Picori, Now this is about to get Confusing. So @link1117 and Kenziex123 listen. Many Theroist put the Minish Cap first before Skyward sword because in Skyward sword it talks about a War, what if the Picori Blade is the Skyward sword? I will tell you more soon.
@BeyBlade1999 The Picori Blade turned out to be the Four Sword in the end, during the events of Minish Cap the Master Sword was simply untouched. The Skyward Sword cannot be the Master Sword and the Picori Blade at the same time. Plus the Minish Cap was proven to take place many many years after Skyward Sword. All theories individual timelines at this point are terminated, you can't correct Nintendo.
@Kenziex123 its not that he dies. it is a mistranslation. really its just that he was absent, when ganondorf gained power, all of hyrule was in trouble, but because link pulled the master sword, he changed the future and helped sace the world. however, that world without a hero still exists, and and that is the hero is absent timeline
@geauxlegendofzelda Yeah, that was actually the explanation that made the most sense. However it is actually proved wrong by the Hyrule Historia. Google search: Glitterberri Hyrule Historia. Then check out page 92. It states that the timeline is based on the event of Link being defeated/failing on top of Ganon's Tower.
@Kenziex123 actually, yea. i just had someone else comment the same thing to me on a different timeline video... so i cant argue there. but maybe there was still a link in that timeline, who didnt pull out the master sword. so it would still be a timeline split since one link does, but the other gets defeated since he doesnt have the master sword to kill ganon. just throwin it out there
@geauxlegendofzelda Yeah, I think that was me who told you in the other video actually. =P. But who knows, there could always be translation errors. It's not Nintendo released yet.
The "Hero is defeated" split maybe actually translated to "The Hero doesn't emerge".
The "Era without a Hero" could be a reference to the time when Link has been sent back at the end of OOT and was unable to stop Ganon prior to Wind Waker and the Great Flood.
@Robomagnetin i think its the world that link left behind wen he pulled the master sword, because wen he goes 7 years into the future, he changes the course of time, but the world where he vanished still exists
well the era without hero should have split at majors mask cuz link never goes back to hyrule and as it said the hero left there land and so on and so forth. i cant explain links to the past and i agree with you for the most part
if there were a "Master document"it wouldve work until Tp came out which started the split timeline theories. Another thought why do you guys think only 1 link existed in a timeline there couldve been more than one in a timeline but oh no that wouldnt make sense because of Hyrule,etc. get this guys Hyrule isnt the same in every game there could have been a set of children named the same from the same parent.
@eclipsehedgechidna And many things link to oot because link goes to the past to change the future so there are actually more than 3 possible outcomes
link changes things in the past for that future remember. the song of storms the desert, what happens at the end of oot is he is sent righhhhtt back, hence why he can tell zelda what gannon is going to do before doing it. so doesnt that mean that future has no changes. in mm link fights gannon as a child and wins. but whos to say he couldnt loose. he's just a child. Plus in acount he hasnt changed anything in that past this time so no events could possably stop a link to the past link from
people wanted a timeline, and well they got it. if you don't get it, tough, you guys have ben preaching for one finally got one and now you complain... seriously it is just a game series, if you guys are going to complain about something like this you guys need to seriously grow up
ss said a hero would always appear he reappeared for alttp after being killed in oot even if zelda sent linkl back in time he would reappear when ganon escapes to stop ganon
I think the whole idea of a timeline is a waste of time, though I do partially believe in the split timeline theory, minus the whole "hero is defeated" nonsense, and after that it feels like what's in the title. The LEGEND of Zelda. A legend just retold over time changing a few parts here and there like a real legend. But I'm still more of a split timeline believer.
I agree the reason behind the third split is...less than graceful, but that doesn't detract from the sense it does make. The split where Link is defeated in his fight against Ganon in OoT explains how he had the whole Triforce to begin with in ALttP. He already had the Triforce of Power. He defeated Link, meaning he could take the Triforce of Courage. All that was left to do was to take the Triforce of Wisdom from Zelda.
It explains more than it leaves open, so I'm not complaining too much.
I agree that 'the Hero is defeated' is somewhat of a quick and rather cheap cop out, but I have to say, Link is required to go back to his childhood at least once (lens of truth quest) which leaves the future hanging. Assuming that travel through time via the Master Sword splits up space and time, we can allow that the Hero of Time began his 'future' quest, then disappeared to obtain the lens of truth. When he returned to the 'future' he returned to another branch of that future.
When Zelda sent Link back she returned him to the time before he pulled the master sword out, while keeping his memories and experience. Therefore, the gate to the sacred realm was never opened, so Ganondorf couldnt have taken the triforce. So the hero was never defeated nor could be defeated since the triforce was never touched. And on the adult side, link had already sealed Ganon
I always lightly considered the possibility of the "hero being defeated", or at least, never returning to Hyrule, but I always figured it would have been during the events of Majora's Mask, as that Link, armed with the Ocarina of Time and the rest of his life ahead of him (assuming he survived) seems to disappear altogether after that point.
I disregarded that, though, as the rule of thumb is that THE HERO IS NEVER DEFEATED...
A timeline without explanation raises more questions than answers.
Well think about it for a sec, Ganondorf defeated link and was able to obtain the full triforce. They didn't base "the hero is defeated" part from Ocarina of Time, they based it from the fact that Ganon has the full triforce in Link to the Past.
Mate I don't know if making a straight-up reaction video to the timeline was the best idea.
You've clearly thought alot about the timeline in the past and I think you should've looked into trying to find a way to make this one work instead of just denying it and saying it was a cop out.
In my work with Zelda's progression since 2009, I've also used a 3-way split. However, I also did not care for Nintendo's treatment of that layout. In my version, one path is MM leading to TP followed by the Oracle Games, since the Twinrova Sisters are still alive to revive the original Ganon. Because all those games share the theme of time and seasons, I, in a rather uncreative mood, called this child line the "Time Timeline." :P (cont. next comment)
(cont.) With the second line, the "Traditional Line" that deals with the future where Ganon is sealed, Link to the Past happens with Link's Awakening. Unless being released from the sword leads to LttP or he's revived for 4SA, the latter game must happen in a non-associated split running parallel with LttP.
Before I go further, I'll say I've given up the hope that every game can be directly connected to one another. This is why I don't have a problem with that B1/B2 split.
(cont 2) The third line is the same one Nintendo formed, the "Flood Line." the first 4-Swords can happen before this, but not 4SA.
I did take your theory of LoZ and LoZ II being in a new Hyrule above the ruins of the first, so in order to reach those games old Hyrule must be destroyed somehow. The flood explains the first possibility, but the other two lines must experience a tragedy yet to be shared.
Games like Oracle of Seasons can happen after this as well, given it's a new generation.
Just want to say one more thing (I'm saving some of the intricacies): If you chart the timeline I just stated, it forms a shield with a sword going straight down it. A horizontal line from OoT, 3 vertical lines going down and meeting centerwise during Hyrule's expiration. The line going down from there completes the sword. Neat, huh? You can also think of the lines going up as Ganon's trident. ;)
And when the NES games doesn't happen in some permutations, the 3 lines can keep going down.
Just because there isn't *yet* a game showing what happens if the Link of, say, Skyward Sword is defeated, doesn't mean that that won't be the premise of a future Zelda title.
i'm kinda thinking that there is no split timeline but don't get made at me cuz i havnen't thought it all out yet exept one thing while link went to terminia gonnon could have broken the seal so while he was destroying hyrule link is off on another adventure in terminia and hyrule was then flooded i mean it would kinda make since
Should we still take into account the fact that in the future, the windmill was already set off, despite Link not actually doing it in the past yet? It's a paradox, but something about that could explain something.
@SHADE45 It's known as the predestination paradox, a causal or causality loop, or a closed timelike curve. It's a classic plot device of many science fiction stories featuring time travel.
@BrentDubroc In other words, when Link plays the Song of Storms in the past so he can access the Bottom of the Well, he is causing the event that allows him to learn the song in the future. When Link first arrives in the future, he has already played the song in the past, regardless of whether he had traveled back in time yet or not.
In the Link to the Past timeline, Link was "defeated" and thus died and will, by Skyward Sword rules be reincarnated later. In the Wind Waker timeline, Link was literally removed from space/time to go back and instead live his childhood out in the center timeline- he did not die, and thus he will never be reincarnated. Thus it makes sense that the King of Red Lions says that the Hero of Wind is not related to the previous hero in any way, a quality now unique to him alone. I think, anyway..
In Windwaker, it speaks of the Hero of Time. Link must have went back in time and went on with his Majora's Mask adventure, and wasn't there to defeat Ganon for the second time, because it speaks of Ganon returning and wreaking havock.
Also, this is assuming it's real, and you don't get a 'gameover' in real life. Also, it's there because that's where the other split is. It seems like you're just trying to prove this wrong so it fits your timeline.
You know that each Link is a different person, and there can be a huge amount of years between each game, so Ganon could have died in between OoT and ALttP.
@Bitsybud >Nintendo's timeline doesn't fit my preconceived notions of it. My fanfic must be better than Nintendo's canon, because I obviously know more about the Legend of Zelda than the company that created it!
Do you realize how selfish and delusional that sounds?
the thurd spllit does make sence in ALttp ganon has controll of the entire triforce and the only way for that is for hi t defeat link and zelda after the ri force split
Ive never made a timeline observation with much detail, where basically Skyward Sword is first, then Ocarina of Time, then the split with Majora's Mask and Wind Waker, cause I havent played any of the Zelda games that werent 3D. It seems that the "Hero is defeated" timeline split is kinda cool in its own way, but it doesnt fit. Sounds about right.
I dont think the third split is a "what if" scenario but a split from an earlier game that created this alternate oot. I hate to think they could just pull a "what if like did this" for every game because theorizing would be imposible. Skyward sword has a bunch of splits and the TOT was around way be4 that so we know theres some other splits somewhere.
if you play oot it shows 3 timeline link learned the song some way we don't see in game then teaches to the guy,what if link in goes to the future and teaches that song to him & goes back in time there
Or like the whole impa thing is ss at the end of the game zelda games her a bracelet then if you ply the gme again you notice she has it therefore zelda gave it to her on timeline seperate from impa's first meating with link
@fdsfgs123 I never said it does i said in ss there evidence that the ss takes place aross three timelines the proof is when you meet the old woman in begining of the game she has zelda's braclet but acrooding to the plot zelda didn't gice it to her until after demise is defeated therefpre some where off screen zelda gave it her before demise was beaten then timetraveling link changed that
@TCD252009 >ss takes place across three timelines because of Zelda's bracelet
Zelda's bracelet is evidence for the game taking place in one timeline, not three. Entertaining the idea that Skyward Sword takes place across multiple timelines when all the ingame evidence suggests otherwise is just silly.
It's a bunch of shit that never existed before. If almost thirty years of Zelda didn't make it clear enough for you people, then this should. They never thought this stuff through. No wonder why it makes so little sense that they needed to make three timelines.
@SkellionPowalskiz >No wonder why it makes so little sense that they needed to make three timelines.
What are you talking about? It makes perfect sense from a thematic standpoint, and if you bring parallel universes into the picture it also makes sense from a literary standpoint.
@fdsfgs123 Ever hear that DC Comics is basically resetting the entire universe?
That's pretty much a good old slice of proof that different universes is just a really stupid, overly complicated way of creating different stories in the same series.
It's only because people need to be force-fed convoluted crap to make themselves feel more intelligent than others that this shit happened in the first place. It could have been simple, but no, someone wanted it their way.
You see it as stupid and over-complicated. I see it as a simple solution and a good alternative to a retcon. Neither outlook is more correct than the other, as in the end it all boils down to personal views and opinions.
@SuperSkyler21 Uh, no. It's explicitly stated that the Master Sword is what allows the time travel. Link just sleeps for seven years, that is not time travel.
The book explicitly states that Ganondorf kills Link in the final battle.
There is no way that he can ever return to his Original timeline as he has changed it already. Therefore a third one has to be created by Zelda returning him to a "new" childhood. In his original timeline Link has therefore been "defeated" by Ganondorf without even fighting against him...He is simply vanishing from his Timeline by his own choice during the events of OOT.
@NaM3le5sThe19 well you also have to admit, some people are also to stupid to realise its a game, and if oot is going to have the adult/child split, why not have one connecting the older games??? i mean after all alttp had the sealing war at the very begining of the freaking game, but is he going off about that and how it makes total sence??? nope
@khozyla >Therefore a third one has to be created by Zelda returning him to a "new" childhood.
Not true, if u check the ending of OOT again, she says she returns him back to his ORIGINAL TIME. "The hero is defeated" timeline MUST mean that if BOTH heroes fail their missions. However, the one in the future already failed, meaning that if the current Link fails to survive going into the future, "The hero is defeated", the realm will stay shut.
@khozyla What? A *second* timeline (Child Era) is created when Zelda sends him back. In OoT, Link's original timeline is what becomes the Adult Era. Link does not leave his original timeline behind until after he has dealt with Ganon.
@SuRit13377 As I have stated earlier I believe that the second timeline during OoT is actually created earlier. At the time when the master sword is being pulled for the first time. Link will continue OoT in this second one (Adult), defeating Ganon, being sent back, etc... But there is no Link in the timeline in which he had originally pulled the sword, therefore leaving it undefended against Ganondorf gaining Power (exactly as he vanishes from the Adult Era when Zelda sends him back, aswell).
@khozyla I've heard a few people say similar things, but the thing is, the sages have to have been awakened. That would mean Link would have to have gone through all the temples. I say that because the sages were the ones who sealed Ganon away when Link died, and also because the towns were then named after them in Zelda 2. Also, I could be wrong, but I believe some more thorough translations have actually clarified that Hyrule Historia states Ganon killed Link in battle.
@khozyla No thats not right. You are right about it spliting when link is sent back by zelda, but thats the only split that happens in the entire game. Everything up till that point is the original timeline, theres no split when link pulls the master sword.
Here's my quick idea on the whole "defeat" dilemma. The first part of OOT (Child dungeons) takes place in the left Timeline (LttP, etc.).This is Links original Past. During OOT Link realizes, that he needs to pull the master sword and change past events in order to achieve his goals (i.e. aquiring the mirror of truth). This can be seen as a defeat, as he is not able to achieve his goals as he originally intended.
you make it seem like it should be done your way just because you believe your way is correct.. i found no issue with the hero dying time split in out cuz OOT is basically the game that split everything up PLUS we ALL knew nintendo didn't have a timeline but so many people kept bitching about having one well what do you want nintendo to do ..they obviously going to make a timeline out the ass
Part 2, and the Sages sealed him immediately after his entrance. But seeing as the SR has no time and is more a mid point between dimensions, then it would have no effect on the Ganon currently running around. What if the Sacred Realm maintains the 3 constants, [Master Sword, Triforce, and Ganon] in every split, explaining why they remain constant regardless of the timeline?
Hey Lan, it's great to have you back :). With regards to the timeline, the third timeline could potentially not be from a scenario where the Hero of Time gets killed. Remember when Link FIRST pulls out the Master Sword and Ganondorf pops up announcing that Link led him to the Sacred Realm. And yet after the 7 year jump, we see him within Hyrule with his blinged out doom fortress. Now, that tells me that the split starts @ the point where Ganondorf remains IN the Sacred Realm
just because you dont agree with the 3rd split doesnt mean nintendo didnt have a master document. you can disagree and bitch and moan all you want, but its canon and official. maybe give nintedo credit for trying to peice together such a bitch of timeline together while trying to make everything logical. this isnt just for Lancun. this is for everyone that is haveing a bitch fit because the timeline is different than the one they made in their own head
@przybylofosho But that IS the whole problem. They were the ones that decided to start retro fitting their own game sin their series, which they didn't have to, and consequently made things far more complicated than they ever should have been. If they honestly couldn't think of a timeline that made 100% perfect sense that involved EVERY game in the series, they should have jsut left things as is. This just seems so lazy in the fact that they want to make it official just for them releasing it.
@hungryhungrymetroid They didn't start "retro fitting" the games. The games have been connected from the beginning. People just like to deny that because they're idiots.
And just because you dislike how it works doesn't mean it doesn't make sense.
@hungryhungrymetroid go to glitterberris translation of the hyrule historia and tell me they didnt try to peice this together as best they could. this is story telling. they wrote the story so they can do whatever they want with it. the reason they made it offical is because people kept asking nintendo about it and making so many videos trying to explain it. since they revealed the timeline, people have been bitchin about it.
I think the hero is defeated era came about when link was sealed in the sacred realm. Even though he defeated Ganon he went back to his original time but maybe that timeline where hyrule became a wasteland still existed. Thus he is defeated because he technically still didn't save hyrule from destruction. If you think about it, Ganon is only sealed in that specific point of the timeline so his past self should still exist. Idk if I'm making any sense. This whole thing is complicated. Maybe with
@xShadowOfTheNite Your theory would hold water had the Hyrule Historia not, when describing the beginning of the Downfall timeline, had an image of Adult Link fighting Ganondorf, with the caption "Link versus Ganondorf."
Plus, for the Sages to seal Ganondorf, they would need to have been awakened first (Otherwise there would have been no point at all to Adult Temples in OoT), and the final Sage is awakened right before the final confrontation with Ganon.
I think the reason their is a hero is defeated timeline is in OOT is because it is the first time in the timeline that Demise(Ganondolf) get one of the triforce giving him a higher chance of defeating link.
I have to explaine my third line explanation at the end when ganondorf change into ganon he defeated link he change him to dark link zelda got the master sword hiding in the lost wood then defeated ganon with the sages ganon sends dark link to the past to stop zelda but somehow he ended up in the water temple and that when the timeline split
Finally (sorry for all the separate comments), how does there being something you don't like in the timeline "prove" that they just made it up for the book?
Even if the decision were objectively nonsensical, what does that have to do with how long ago they made the decision in the first place.
If I were to write a series and put them all together in a nonsensical order, does that mean I couldn't have made up that nonsensical order as I wrote the series?
The third tree, or "hero defeated" tree is just games that need to remain unplaced, as they can fit in many parts of the timeline ... I have no issue with this, official timeline fixed ... officially!
@millerm753 And how is that any better? There being three timelines, one where Ganon is victorious, is thematically fitting for the Legend of Zelda series.
@fdsfgs123 It is a perfect fit with the themes and mythology of the world. The longer I look at it, the more I'm convinced that Nintendo didn't make this up on the spot.
@fdsfgs123 Yes, that would be nice, and if they made such a timeline, great ... but I would hardly call them throwing the game they can't find a place for "making a timeline" ... that's more like recycling >.>
I believe that Nintendo should have called up Lan and ocarinahero10 and Nintendo should have flown them out to japan and Nintendo should have asked them how the *BOOP* they should make the timeline in a way that makes sense because i don't think Nintendo understands what they did in their own games
@tejanos2 Except that this completely works except for tiny details that Lancun himself doesn't even care about. Also, ocarinahero's old timeline was full of mistakes that he refused to believe were wrong, like Ganon and Ganondorf not being separate characters.
The reason a new hero appears in the Downfall Timeline but not in the Adult Timeline is simple. Many of the heroes were reincarnations of the previous one. The "Spirit of the Hero" as stated by Demise.
In the Downfall Timeline, Link dies, so he can obviously be reincarnated. In the Adult Timeline, Link leaves the timeline completely, ceasing to exist. You can't be reincarnated if you don't exist.
Your explanation for how the third timeline could work makes no sense. If Link never left the Temple of Light, the Sages wouldn't have been around to seal Ganon, Ganondorf would have never gotten the Triforce of Courage, and the Master Sword would have been stuck in the Sacred Realm.
Besides, how is your explanation any better. You've just made up a different what if scenario than the one Nintendo did. How is yours somehow better than theirs?
To me, the hero is defeated part is either a clever or stupid twist, but I think if they worded it "Hero never awakes" like you said, it would make more sense. What bothers me a little more is how Majoras Mask and Wind Waker are not in the same timeline when Wind Waker clearly references that link went back in time to go after a long lost friend (aka the events of Majoras Mask). Shouldn't those two be in the same strand?
@pokemega32 Incorrect, first off at the beginning of the game, there is reference that the hero of time was a young boy... not a man. Second, the king of red lions states after you get the master sword that the hero of time left to go find a friend (aka Majoras Mask). How do they know that if Wind Waker is on the adult hero timeline and Majoras Mask happens on the child side of the timeline. It makes no valid sense.
@n4tennis23 The Hero of Time was 16 as an "adult", and besides, he was never even called the Hero of Time in the child timeline. The KoRL never says anything about going to find a friend. Even in the english version he just said he left for another land, while the Japanese version explicitly says he traveled through time.
And Ganondorf wasn't defeated by Link in the Child Timeline, so how could Wind Waker possibly fit in that timeline?
Also to the commenters, the Hyrule Historia specifically states that Link dying at the hands of Ganon is what causes the timeline that leads to LttP and onwards, therefore the events leading up to it is not caused by Link leaving one timeline due to Master Sword time travel shenanigans.
One more thing, having three timelines is a perfect fit thematically for the Legend of Zelda series, considering how relevant the Triforce is in the mythology of the games.
Describing the Downfall timeline as a "What-If scenario" just shows that you have no clue how parallel universes and alternate worlds work. How about instead of saying that Nintendo's timeline is bunk, you actually read up about this concept that has been used across many different franchises and forms of entertainment?
I believe that the third was not caused by the hero's defeat, but by his absence.You see, on OoT's ending,when young Link meets young Zelda again,she had yet to flee with Impah.On the original timeline,they had already left, meaning that this is not the original timeline.So, OoT Link awake in timeline A,defeats Ganon on timeline B, and comes back to timeline C, where none/few of the events of OoT had taken place.
hmmmm...... maybe the "hero is defeated" part might be that link lost and spawned back and said: oh if i go on like this for ever i will not win, so he quits and ganon becomes ruler of hyrule (almost said tamriel right there), this is no joke this is my actual thought, or the more logical is that he realizes that ganon is strong and quits.and then it moves on to link to the past. im not a zelda fan that much but this might be right.
ALSO I think that it is funny that When Link was invoved in the capture of Ganon the seal doesnt hold eve. But when he isnt invoved like in the area before Link to the past the seal actually holds and he needs to create agnhm to help him.
wate a minet in the end of skyward sword Demis says the his hate shal be reincarnate with an edles scycal but y come he (he meaning ganonDORF) (when i make my timeline i'll explane wy im capitalising the dorf) dies in windwaker and twilight prinssces
I am pretty much all with you there, sir. I think that unless we know "when" the Hero of Time is defeated, it doesn't make sense at all, but if it means that the Hero loses to Ganon(dorf) after opening the doorway to the Sacred Realm (which, correct me if I'm wrong, then becomes the Dark Realm), then doesn't everything that happens after the Hero "losing" mean that anything after that takes place in the Sacred Realm, and 'Link to the Past' can't happen because there's 2 seperate realms in it?
Lancun: The adult era. The sensical era. The era without a hero, or is it? Why is it without a hero?
RDF2: Hey Lan, I have a theory: Link went back before having a kid born with his bloodline, or at least never hooked up with any of the girls (Romani, Zelda, Ruto) in the Adult era. This left no bloodline to exist until the reincarnation in Wind Waker. So yeah, without a hero meant that the Goddesses of Hyrule were still in the making of a new incarnation, but took too long to stop Ganondorf.
in majora's mask there is an ending where if you do not make the "dead-line" as it be to defeat the villain than the moon crashes into the land and everything is destroyed and link is "dead" what is to happen then... the hero is defeated or is he not?
This time-line does work, but only if you read 'hero defeated' as 'the past that wasn't changed by the time traveling hero' or 'the unchanged future'. So in OoT you start in the past as a kid and then go to the unchanged future, there you travel back to the past and do things that change the future, then he travels back into the changed future. Using this to split up the time in a changed future and unchanged future would make the whole timeline valid. Change 'defeated' into 'left' and it works.
@Panicnl So what I was really trying to say is that it actually isn't a what-if situation but a legit split, only the one who made it got lazy and put 'hero defeated' in it instead of explaining the situation. If it said 'Hero left' it would be right, but the designer got lazy or confused and put defeated there creating a false 'what-if situation.
The Timeline was always very....sketchy. It's mostly the fact that there is no official translation yet. I think the third timeline could of actually occurred the first time you go back in time in OoT, as explained by user 'YourHeroes' video.
In fairness, let me explain the possible functional differences between "The Hero is Defeated" and "The Hero of Wind & A New World". With Link defeated, Ganondorf would still be around to have significant influence on things whereas the Wind Waker timeline leaves us with a long stretch of time where there is no Ganondorf.
More importantly, it can only be assumed that each Link has to die at some point, eventually being replaced as the Link from Skyward Sword is replaced by the Minish Cap Link; The Link in "A Link to the Past" showing up in the "The Hero is Defeated" timeline would be no different. The only time we've officially seen Link's disappearance become an issue was in the Wind Waker timeline.
That said, it still seems kind of hokey; just putting them all after FSA would be better.
@shayaan2354 Nintendo probably saw his timeline and copied it but they didn't want to look like they just copied off of Lancun so they added the extra split to cover their asses.
Hero is defeated: the possibility of a NEW zelda game to link OoT? I HOPE
t3hNEWhypro50 14 hours ago
And of course, when muddling with time, all bets are off.
TheFallenBeard 1 week ago
I can see the 'hero is defeated' part of the timeline, but I don't know if it necessarily has to link to OoT. Basically, it's when Ganon retrieves the triforce.
TheFallenBeard 1 week ago
I'm just glad they didn't include the CD-I games in the timeline.
MGSMOBSCENE 1 week ago
Lets just say the Hero of Time failing was predestined, and the Triforce wish at the end of ALttP change the the past and allowed the Hero of Time to win, thus creating a split and thus the rest of the timeline. If we do that it makes sense.
VeganAmazing 2 weeks ago
Basically, After OoT successful ending, Link is no longer there to have a descendent/reincarnation that can battle Ganondorf for Hyrule, and a wish was made to the gods to prevent Ganondorf from getting the triforce (again), and thus the flood happened.
In LttP, Link most likely still lived, or at least long enough for a reincarnation to happen so there was no need for the wish/flood to happen. That's probably the most significant difference between the two 'Adult Timelines' as you put it.
RedDragonForce2 2 weeks ago 2
@RedDragonForce2 I think in the LttP, having it placed in the Defeated Time-spilt was great. I think Link lived but was heavily injured.(Always holding a Hate for Gannondorf) Seeing as Zelda was a Sage. (We think but we have heavy proof that she is a sage but that still needs to be answered.) Link and Zelda couldn't have a Child. The only un-married girl Link knew who wasn't a Sage was that Girl in Lon Lon Ranch. Link and her had a Child, Link trained that Child and thats when Lttp happened.
BeyBlade1999 1 week ago
Theoretically, the time changing events in OoT are well defined as any time when you are first able to reach the final area, and heading there with 100 percent completion to your hearts content. Because you're traveling back and forth through time more than once, you could say that before defeating Ganon and being sent back is within one timeline that splits because of that moment in time.
Not specifically any 'Game Over', but just not completing the game itself (Ganon is stopped, or whatever).
RedDragonForce2 2 weeks ago
It's ridiculous how similar Lanc's was to this O_o
Emperorerror 2 weeks ago
do you still have the same reaction to this?
dmerkaGU10 2 weeks ago
Minish cap second because if the played it in the intro it said the picora sword came from a land in the sky\ skyward sword land in sky
\
randomweido 3 weeks ago
@randomweido well no that would imply that the picori sword is the master sword. but that impossible because the picori sword becomes the four sword. but the master sword apears in OOT and the the four sword appears later. Therefore the sword are not the same.
link1117 1 week ago
@randomweido Picori Blade has no relation to the Master Sword, it is a different sword all together.
Kenziex123 1 week ago
@Kenziex123 Actually the Picori blade is Proved by many Theroists (I spelt that wrong...)The Picori Blade is the re-made Master Sword. Now what they don't see is that in the Minish Cap game it says that the Minish made the Sacred Blade or Picori, Now this is about to get Confusing. So @link1117 and Kenziex123 listen. Many Theroist put the Minish Cap first before Skyward sword because in Skyward sword it talks about a War, what if the Picori Blade is the Skyward sword? I will tell you more soon.
BeyBlade1999 1 week ago
@BeyBlade1999 The Picori Blade turned out to be the Four Sword in the end, during the events of Minish Cap the Master Sword was simply untouched. The Skyward Sword cannot be the Master Sword and the Picori Blade at the same time. Plus the Minish Cap was proven to take place many many years after Skyward Sword. All theories individual timelines at this point are terminated, you can't correct Nintendo.
Kenziex123 1 week ago
u made a lot of really bad points. i dont think u really understand wat they were going for with this timeline
geauxlegendofzelda 3 weeks ago
i love this timeline! its makes sense, and it leaves room for plenty more games... isnt that wat we all want anyway?
geauxlegendofzelda 3 weeks ago 9
@geauxlegendofzelda I wouldn't say it makes sense... yet. But yea, I am glad that it's actually one big legend now.
Kenziex123 1 week ago
@Kenziex123 what doesnt make sense about it?
geauxlegendofzelda 1 week ago
@geauxlegendofzelda the 3rd timeline primarily. How can a destined Hero die? This confuses me.
Kenziex123 1 week ago
@Kenziex123 its not that he dies. it is a mistranslation. really its just that he was absent, when ganondorf gained power, all of hyrule was in trouble, but because link pulled the master sword, he changed the future and helped sace the world. however, that world without a hero still exists, and and that is the hero is absent timeline
geauxlegendofzelda 1 week ago
@geauxlegendofzelda Yeah, that was actually the explanation that made the most sense. However it is actually proved wrong by the Hyrule Historia. Google search: Glitterberri Hyrule Historia. Then check out page 92. It states that the timeline is based on the event of Link being defeated/failing on top of Ganon's Tower.
Kenziex123 1 week ago
@Kenziex123 actually, yea. i just had someone else comment the same thing to me on a different timeline video... so i cant argue there. but maybe there was still a link in that timeline, who didnt pull out the master sword. so it would still be a timeline split since one link does, but the other gets defeated since he doesnt have the master sword to kill ganon. just throwin it out there
geauxlegendofzelda 6 days ago
@geauxlegendofzelda Yeah, I think that was me who told you in the other video actually. =P. But who knows, there could always be translation errors. It's not Nintendo released yet.
Kenziex123 6 days ago
@Kenziex123 oh wow.... hahahaha maybe that was u on the other video :) wat are the odds of that? lol
geauxlegendofzelda 6 days ago
@geauxlegendofzelda In english at least.
Kenziex123 6 days ago
Nintendo probably has something up their sleeve. I can imagine a future game involving time travel that could explain this.
Kenziex123 3 weeks ago
The "Hero is defeated" split maybe actually translated to "The Hero doesn't emerge".
The "Era without a Hero" could be a reference to the time when Link has been sent back at the end of OOT and was unable to stop Ganon prior to Wind Waker and the Great Flood.
Robomagnetin 3 weeks ago
@Robomagnetin i think its the world that link left behind wen he pulled the master sword, because wen he goes 7 years into the future, he changes the course of time, but the world where he vanished still exists
geauxlegendofzelda 3 weeks ago
well the era without hero should have split at majors mask cuz link never goes back to hyrule and as it said the hero left there land and so on and so forth. i cant explain links to the past and i agree with you for the most part
xephers3 3 weeks ago
Your placement of the games was also stupendously accurate. So well done.
agreatflood2121 1 month ago
At least we were correct about the "Split in Time" for the Zelda Timeline
agreatflood2121 1 month ago
It is nice to finally know what you think about the "official" timeline.
I agree its wack
agreatflood2121 1 month ago
if there were a "Master document"it wouldve work until Tp came out which started the split timeline theories. Another thought why do you guys think only 1 link existed in a timeline there couldve been more than one in a timeline but oh no that wouldnt make sense because of Hyrule,etc. get this guys Hyrule isnt the same in every game there could have been a set of children named the same from the same parent.
eclipsehedgechidna 1 month ago
@eclipsehedgechidna And many things link to oot because link goes to the past to change the future so there are actually more than 3 possible outcomes
eclipsehedgechidna 1 month ago
The PLAYER gets a game over screen if you die against Ganon, but in the context of the world Link is defeated if you die and Hyrule is doomed.
bubba106 1 month ago
link changes things in the past for that future remember. the song of storms the desert, what happens at the end of oot is he is sent righhhhtt back, hence why he can tell zelda what gannon is going to do before doing it. so doesnt that mean that future has no changes. in mm link fights gannon as a child and wins. but whos to say he couldnt loose. he's just a child. Plus in acount he hasnt changed anything in that past this time so no events could possably stop a link to the past link from
MrTrexo2 1 month ago
people wanted a timeline, and well they got it. if you don't get it, tough, you guys have ben preaching for one finally got one and now you complain... seriously it is just a game series, if you guys are going to complain about something like this you guys need to seriously grow up
neji100 1 month ago
ss said a hero would always appear he reappeared for alttp after being killed in oot even if zelda sent linkl back in time he would reappear when ganon escapes to stop ganon
dragonjedi101 1 month ago
I think the whole idea of a timeline is a waste of time, though I do partially believe in the split timeline theory, minus the whole "hero is defeated" nonsense, and after that it feels like what's in the title. The LEGEND of Zelda. A legend just retold over time changing a few parts here and there like a real legend. But I'm still more of a split timeline believer.
AeroFirstPlayer 1 month ago
I agree the reason behind the third split is...less than graceful, but that doesn't detract from the sense it does make. The split where Link is defeated in his fight against Ganon in OoT explains how he had the whole Triforce to begin with in ALttP. He already had the Triforce of Power. He defeated Link, meaning he could take the Triforce of Courage. All that was left to do was to take the Triforce of Wisdom from Zelda.
It explains more than it leaves open, so I'm not complaining too much.
MagmarFire 1 month ago in playlist Updated Legend of Zelda Timeline Theory
I agree that 'the Hero is defeated' is somewhat of a quick and rather cheap cop out, but I have to say, Link is required to go back to his childhood at least once (lens of truth quest) which leaves the future hanging. Assuming that travel through time via the Master Sword splits up space and time, we can allow that the Hero of Time began his 'future' quest, then disappeared to obtain the lens of truth. When he returned to the 'future' he returned to another branch of that future.
Palltube 1 month ago
When Zelda sent Link back she returned him to the time before he pulled the master sword out, while keeping his memories and experience. Therefore, the gate to the sacred realm was never opened, so Ganondorf couldnt have taken the triforce. So the hero was never defeated nor could be defeated since the triforce was never touched. And on the adult side, link had already sealed Ganon
xXMurph4n4torXx 1 month ago
I always lightly considered the possibility of the "hero being defeated", or at least, never returning to Hyrule, but I always figured it would have been during the events of Majora's Mask, as that Link, armed with the Ocarina of Time and the rest of his life ahead of him (assuming he survived) seems to disappear altogether after that point.
I disregarded that, though, as the rule of thumb is that THE HERO IS NEVER DEFEATED...
A timeline without explanation raises more questions than answers.
Nesseight 1 month ago in playlist Updated Legend of Zelda Timeline Theory
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Well think about it for a sec, Ganondorf defeated link and was able to obtain the full triforce. They didn't base "the hero is defeated" part from Ocarina of Time, they based it from the fact that Ganon has the full triforce in Link to the Past.
Wiseman108 1 month ago
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Wiseman108 1 month ago
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Wiseman108 1 month ago
Mate I don't know if making a straight-up reaction video to the timeline was the best idea.
You've clearly thought alot about the timeline in the past and I think you should've looked into trying to find a way to make this one work instead of just denying it and saying it was a cop out.
AZAMENAZA 1 month ago
youtube.com/watch?v=umS4flaa-20
I think this perfectly explains how there can be a third timeline branch.
AZAMENAZA 1 month ago
demise curse is suppose to always bring back all 3c but yet in ww timeline link never appeared to stop ganon again contradictions to itself
dragonjedi101 1 month ago
In my work with Zelda's progression since 2009, I've also used a 3-way split. However, I also did not care for Nintendo's treatment of that layout. In my version, one path is MM leading to TP followed by the Oracle Games, since the Twinrova Sisters are still alive to revive the original Ganon. Because all those games share the theme of time and seasons, I, in a rather uncreative mood, called this child line the "Time Timeline." :P (cont. next comment)
SonofMrPeanut 1 month ago
(cont.) With the second line, the "Traditional Line" that deals with the future where Ganon is sealed, Link to the Past happens with Link's Awakening. Unless being released from the sword leads to LttP or he's revived for 4SA, the latter game must happen in a non-associated split running parallel with LttP.
Before I go further, I'll say I've given up the hope that every game can be directly connected to one another. This is why I don't have a problem with that B1/B2 split.
(cont 2)
SonofMrPeanut 1 month ago
(cont 2) The third line is the same one Nintendo formed, the "Flood Line." the first 4-Swords can happen before this, but not 4SA.
I did take your theory of LoZ and LoZ II being in a new Hyrule above the ruins of the first, so in order to reach those games old Hyrule must be destroyed somehow. The flood explains the first possibility, but the other two lines must experience a tragedy yet to be shared.
Games like Oracle of Seasons can happen after this as well, given it's a new generation.
SonofMrPeanut 1 month ago
Just want to say one more thing (I'm saving some of the intricacies): If you chart the timeline I just stated, it forms a shield with a sword going straight down it. A horizontal line from OoT, 3 vertical lines going down and meeting centerwise during Hyrule's expiration. The line going down from there completes the sword. Neat, huh? You can also think of the lines going up as Ganon's trident. ;)
And when the NES games doesn't happen in some permutations, the 3 lines can keep going down.
SonofMrPeanut 1 month ago
I think they should change, hero defeated, to Link never pulling the Master sword, that would make sense right?
TheChatroom123 1 month ago
Just because there isn't *yet* a game showing what happens if the Link of, say, Skyward Sword is defeated, doesn't mean that that won't be the premise of a future Zelda title.
OxfordGamelanSociety 1 month ago
i'm kinda thinking that there is no split timeline but don't get made at me cuz i havnen't thought it all out yet exept one thing while link went to terminia gonnon could have broken the seal so while he was destroying hyrule link is off on another adventure in terminia and hyrule was then flooded i mean it would kinda make since
gigasteel 1 month ago
Should we still take into account the fact that in the future, the windmill was already set off, despite Link not actually doing it in the past yet? It's a paradox, but something about that could explain something.
SHADE45 1 month ago
@SHADE45 It's known as the predestination paradox, a causal or causality loop, or a closed timelike curve. It's a classic plot device of many science fiction stories featuring time travel.
BrentDubroc 1 month ago
@BrentDubroc In other words, when Link plays the Song of Storms in the past so he can access the Bottom of the Well, he is causing the event that allows him to learn the song in the future. When Link first arrives in the future, he has already played the song in the past, regardless of whether he had traveled back in time yet or not.
BrentDubroc 1 month ago
In the Link to the Past timeline, Link was "defeated" and thus died and will, by Skyward Sword rules be reincarnated later. In the Wind Waker timeline, Link was literally removed from space/time to go back and instead live his childhood out in the center timeline- he did not die, and thus he will never be reincarnated. Thus it makes sense that the King of Red Lions says that the Hero of Wind is not related to the previous hero in any way, a quality now unique to him alone. I think, anyway..
Satsuma0 1 month ago in playlist More videos from Lancun
In Windwaker, it speaks of the Hero of Time. Link must have went back in time and went on with his Majora's Mask adventure, and wasn't there to defeat Ganon for the second time, because it speaks of Ganon returning and wreaking havock.
EpicKuriboh 1 month ago
Also, this is assuming it's real, and you don't get a 'gameover' in real life. Also, it's there because that's where the other split is. It seems like you're just trying to prove this wrong so it fits your timeline.
KROMExRainbow 1 month ago
You know that each Link is a different person, and there can be a huge amount of years between each game, so Ganon could have died in between OoT and ALttP.
KROMExRainbow 1 month ago
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@Bitsybud >Nintendo's timeline doesn't fit my preconceived notions of it. My fanfic must be better than Nintendo's canon, because I obviously know more about the Legend of Zelda than the company that created it!
Do you realize how selfish and delusional that sounds?
HerpaDerpa85 1 month ago
the thurd spllit does make sence in ALttp ganon has controll of the entire triforce and the only way for that is for hi t defeat link and zelda after the ri force split
ShadowMasterLuigi 1 month ago
4:04 is what I thought "The Hero is defeated" actually meant, and they just worded it that way to make it sound more dramatic/less complicated.
theDarkKnightofChaos 1 month ago in playlist Uploaded videos
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HerpaDerpa85 1 month ago
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HerpaDerpa85 1 month ago
Ive never made a timeline observation with much detail, where basically Skyward Sword is first, then Ocarina of Time, then the split with Majora's Mask and Wind Waker, cause I havent played any of the Zelda games that werent 3D. It seems that the "Hero is defeated" timeline split is kinda cool in its own way, but it doesnt fit. Sounds about right.
1KingZant 1 month ago
ganon eventually died on the hero is defeated split because alttp is probably after his natural death.
nelsonator687 1 month ago
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I don't like this one. Your timeline is the timeline I'll always go by.
dylanstakely 1 month ago
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dylanstakely 1 month ago
I dont think the third split is a "what if" scenario but a split from an earlier game that created this alternate oot. I hate to think they could just pull a "what if like did this" for every game because theorizing would be imposible. Skyward sword has a bunch of splits and the TOT was around way be4 that so we know theres some other splits somewhere.
soniti80 1 month ago
Maybe there's no hero at Wind Waker because he drowned in the flood. :P
professorgadd 1 month ago
if you play oot it shows 3 timeline link learned the song some way we don't see in game then teaches to the guy,what if link in goes to the future and teaches that song to him & goes back in time there
Or like the whole impa thing is ss at the end of the game zelda games her a bracelet then if you ply the gme again you notice she has it therefore zelda gave it to her on timeline seperate from impa's first meating with link
TCD252009 1 month ago
@TCD252009 Cool fanfic bro, but from the evidence presented time travel via the Gate of Time and Master Sword aging/deaging doesn't cause any splits.
fdsfgs123 1 month ago
@fdsfgs123 I never said it does i said in ss there evidence that the ss takes place aross three timelines the proof is when you meet the old woman in begining of the game she has zelda's braclet but acrooding to the plot zelda didn't gice it to her until after demise is defeated therefpre some where off screen zelda gave it her before demise was beaten then timetraveling link changed that
TCD252009 1 month ago
@TCD252009 >ss takes place across three timelines because of Zelda's bracelet
Zelda's bracelet is evidence for the game taking place in one timeline, not three. Entertaining the idea that Skyward Sword takes place across multiple timelines when all the ingame evidence suggests otherwise is just silly.
fdsfgs123 1 month ago
It's a bunch of shit that never existed before. If almost thirty years of Zelda didn't make it clear enough for you people, then this should. They never thought this stuff through. No wonder why it makes so little sense that they needed to make three timelines.
But whatever, you fanboys will just eat it up.
SkellionPowalskiz 1 month ago in playlist Updated Legend of Zelda Timeline Theory
@SkellionPowalskiz >No wonder why it makes so little sense that they needed to make three timelines.
What are you talking about? It makes perfect sense from a thematic standpoint, and if you bring parallel universes into the picture it also makes sense from a literary standpoint.
fdsfgs123 1 month ago
@fdsfgs123 Ever hear that DC Comics is basically resetting the entire universe?
That's pretty much a good old slice of proof that different universes is just a really stupid, overly complicated way of creating different stories in the same series.
It's only because people need to be force-fed convoluted crap to make themselves feel more intelligent than others that this shit happened in the first place. It could have been simple, but no, someone wanted it their way.
SkellionPowalskiz 1 month ago
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fdsfgs123 1 month ago
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fdsfgs123 1 month ago
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@SkellionPowalskiz >just a really stupid, overly complicated way
You see it as stupid and over-complicated. I see it as a simple solution and a good alternative to a retcon. Neither outlook is more correct than the other, as in the end it all boils down to personal views and opinions.
fdsfgs123 1 month ago
@fdsfgs123 Can someone explain to me why this comment is marked as spam, when it doesn't even look like a spam comment?
BrentDubroc 1 month ago
Where is my video reply?
ebilly99 1 month ago
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SuperSkyler21 1 month ago
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SuperSkyler21 1 month ago
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@khozyla Above said image and caption, we have this text:
The defeat of Link, the Hero of Time
The thief Ganondorf steals the Triforce of Power and kidnaps Zelda.
Link, the Hero of Time, challenges him for the fate of Hyrule, but loses.
We can infer from this that Adult Link and Ganondorf did do battle in the Downfall timeline.
fdsfgs123 1 month ago
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fdsfgs123 1 month ago
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SuperSkyler21 1 month ago
@SuperSkyler21 Uh, no. It's explicitly stated that the Master Sword is what allows the time travel. Link just sleeps for seven years, that is not time travel.
The book explicitly states that Ganondorf kills Link in the final battle.
pokemega32 1 month ago
In Link to the Past GBA, you find the Four Swords temple. You can't explain that.
JPlusWTF 1 month ago
There is no way that he can ever return to his Original timeline as he has changed it already. Therefore a third one has to be created by Zelda returning him to a "new" childhood. In his original timeline Link has therefore been "defeated" by Ganondorf without even fighting against him...He is simply vanishing from his Timeline by his own choice during the events of OOT.
khozyla 1 month ago 15
@khozyla finally someone who's got it
NaM3le5sThe19 1 month ago
@NaM3le5sThe19 well you also have to admit, some people are also to stupid to realise its a game, and if oot is going to have the adult/child split, why not have one connecting the older games??? i mean after all alttp had the sealing war at the very begining of the freaking game, but is he going off about that and how it makes total sence??? nope
neji100 1 month ago
@khozyla >Therefore a third one has to be created by Zelda returning him to a "new" childhood.
Not true, if u check the ending of OOT again, she says she returns him back to his ORIGINAL TIME. "The hero is defeated" timeline MUST mean that if BOTH heroes fail their missions. However, the one in the future already failed, meaning that if the current Link fails to survive going into the future, "The hero is defeated", the realm will stay shut.
TonnyGhantous 1 month ago
@khozyla What? A *second* timeline (Child Era) is created when Zelda sends him back. In OoT, Link's original timeline is what becomes the Adult Era. Link does not leave his original timeline behind until after he has dealt with Ganon.
SuRit13377 1 month ago
@SuRit13377 As I have stated earlier I believe that the second timeline during OoT is actually created earlier. At the time when the master sword is being pulled for the first time. Link will continue OoT in this second one (Adult), defeating Ganon, being sent back, etc... But there is no Link in the timeline in which he had originally pulled the sword, therefore leaving it undefended against Ganondorf gaining Power (exactly as he vanishes from the Adult Era when Zelda sends him back, aswell).
khozyla 1 month ago
@khozyla I've heard a few people say similar things, but the thing is, the sages have to have been awakened. That would mean Link would have to have gone through all the temples. I say that because the sages were the ones who sealed Ganon away when Link died, and also because the towns were then named after them in Zelda 2. Also, I could be wrong, but I believe some more thorough translations have actually clarified that Hyrule Historia states Ganon killed Link in battle.
HoopTrundler 1 month ago
@khozyla No thats not right. You are right about it spliting when link is sent back by zelda, but thats the only split that happens in the entire game. Everything up till that point is the original timeline, theres no split when link pulls the master sword.
soniti80 1 month ago
Here's my quick idea on the whole "defeat" dilemma. The first part of OOT (Child dungeons) takes place in the left Timeline (LttP, etc.).This is Links original Past. During OOT Link realizes, that he needs to pull the master sword and change past events in order to achieve his goals (i.e. aquiring the mirror of truth). This can be seen as a defeat, as he is not able to achieve his goals as he originally intended.
khozyla 1 month ago
you make it seem like it should be done your way just because you believe your way is correct.. i found no issue with the hero dying time split in out cuz OOT is basically the game that split everything up PLUS we ALL knew nintendo didn't have a timeline but so many people kept bitching about having one well what do you want nintendo to do ..they obviously going to make a timeline out the ass
fullm3tal90 1 month ago
Part 2, and the Sages sealed him immediately after his entrance. But seeing as the SR has no time and is more a mid point between dimensions, then it would have no effect on the Ganon currently running around. What if the Sacred Realm maintains the 3 constants, [Master Sword, Triforce, and Ganon] in every split, explaining why they remain constant regardless of the timeline?
DonEddy75 1 month ago
Hey Lan, it's great to have you back :). With regards to the timeline, the third timeline could potentially not be from a scenario where the Hero of Time gets killed. Remember when Link FIRST pulls out the Master Sword and Ganondorf pops up announcing that Link led him to the Sacred Realm. And yet after the 7 year jump, we see him within Hyrule with his blinged out doom fortress. Now, that tells me that the split starts @ the point where Ganondorf remains IN the Sacred Realm
DonEddy75 1 month ago
Is there spoilers of Skyward Sword on this video? That's all I want to know :P someone answer please >.<
Jakester12621 1 month ago
@Jakester12621 Read the video description :P but yes, there is a spoiler for skyward sword.
Kremite 1 month ago
Its left open to allow more games...if it was closed or air tight then the series would be over.....or is that just me
vmmini91 1 month ago
just because you dont agree with the 3rd split doesnt mean nintendo didnt have a master document. you can disagree and bitch and moan all you want, but its canon and official. maybe give nintedo credit for trying to peice together such a bitch of timeline together while trying to make everything logical. this isnt just for Lancun. this is for everyone that is haveing a bitch fit because the timeline is different than the one they made in their own head
przybylofosho 1 month ago
@przybylofosho But that IS the whole problem. They were the ones that decided to start retro fitting their own game sin their series, which they didn't have to, and consequently made things far more complicated than they ever should have been. If they honestly couldn't think of a timeline that made 100% perfect sense that involved EVERY game in the series, they should have jsut left things as is. This just seems so lazy in the fact that they want to make it official just for them releasing it.
hungryhungrymetroid 1 month ago
@hungryhungrymetroid They didn't start "retro fitting" the games. The games have been connected from the beginning. People just like to deny that because they're idiots.
And just because you dislike how it works doesn't mean it doesn't make sense.
pokemega32 1 month ago
@hungryhungrymetroid go to glitterberris translation of the hyrule historia and tell me they didnt try to peice this together as best they could. this is story telling. they wrote the story so they can do whatever they want with it. the reason they made it offical is because people kept asking nintendo about it and making so many videos trying to explain it. since they revealed the timeline, people have been bitchin about it.
przybylofosho 1 month ago
I think the hero is defeated era came about when link was sealed in the sacred realm. Even though he defeated Ganon he went back to his original time but maybe that timeline where hyrule became a wasteland still existed. Thus he is defeated because he technically still didn't save hyrule from destruction. If you think about it, Ganon is only sealed in that specific point of the timeline so his past self should still exist. Idk if I'm making any sense. This whole thing is complicated. Maybe with
xShadowOfTheNite 1 month ago
@xShadowOfTheNite Your theory would hold water had the Hyrule Historia not, when describing the beginning of the Downfall timeline, had an image of Adult Link fighting Ganondorf, with the caption "Link versus Ganondorf."
Plus, for the Sages to seal Ganondorf, they would need to have been awakened first (Otherwise there would have been no point at all to Adult Temples in OoT), and the final Sage is awakened right before the final confrontation with Ganon.
fdsfgs123 1 month ago
I think the reason their is a hero is defeated timeline is in OOT is because it is the first time in the timeline that Demise(Ganondolf) get one of the triforce giving him a higher chance of defeating link.
x7c8r9 1 month ago
The Hero is killed... Link dies, but has weakened Ganon enough that the sages can finish him off.
Avalon304 1 month ago
I have to explaine my third line explanation at the end when ganondorf change into ganon he defeated link he change him to dark link zelda got the master sword hiding in the lost wood then defeated ganon with the sages ganon sends dark link to the past to stop zelda but somehow he ended up in the water temple and that when the timeline split
TheHenshinguy 1 month ago
Personally, I think i would make a lot more sense if they simply just said that Link is unsuccesful instead of saying he is DEFEATED.
PurplePizzaPokemon 1 month ago
@PurplePizzaPokemon Why? He WAS defeated.
pokemega32 1 month ago
Finally (sorry for all the separate comments), how does there being something you don't like in the timeline "prove" that they just made it up for the book?
Even if the decision were objectively nonsensical, what does that have to do with how long ago they made the decision in the first place.
If I were to write a series and put them all together in a nonsensical order, does that mean I couldn't have made up that nonsensical order as I wrote the series?
pokemega32 1 month ago
The third tree, or "hero defeated" tree is just games that need to remain unplaced, as they can fit in many parts of the timeline ... I have no issue with this, official timeline fixed ... officially!
millerm753 1 month ago
Comment removed
BrentDubroc 1 month ago
@millerm753 And how is that any better? There being three timelines, one where Ganon is victorious, is thematically fitting for the Legend of Zelda series.
fdsfgs123 1 month ago
@fdsfgs123 Ganon defeating Link and obtaining the rest of the Triforce from Link and Zelda is what directs the course of history for one timeline.
Zelda sending Link back in time is what directs the course of history for another timeline.
And finally, Link informing Zelda and the King of Hyrule of Ganondorf's schemes is what directs the course of history for the final timeline.
fdsfgs123 1 month ago
@fdsfgs123 In other words, the events of one timeline are a direct result of the actions of the bearer of the Triforce of Power.
The events of another timeline are a direct result of the actions of the bearer of the Triforce of Wisdom
And finally, the events of the final timeline are a direct result of the actions of the bearer of the Triforce of Courage.
fdsfgs123 1 month ago
@fdsfgs123 It is a perfect fit with the themes and mythology of the world. The longer I look at it, the more I'm convinced that Nintendo didn't make this up on the spot.
fdsfgs123 1 month ago
@fdsfgs123 Yes, that would be nice, and if they made such a timeline, great ... but I would hardly call them throwing the game they can't find a place for "making a timeline" ... that's more like recycling >.>
millerm753 1 month ago
I believe that Nintendo should have called up Lan and ocarinahero10 and Nintendo should have flown them out to japan and Nintendo should have asked them how the *BOOP* they should make the timeline in a way that makes sense because i don't think Nintendo understands what they did in their own games
tejanos2 1 month ago
@tejanos2 Except that this completely works except for tiny details that Lancun himself doesn't even care about. Also, ocarinahero's old timeline was full of mistakes that he refused to believe were wrong, like Ganon and Ganondorf not being separate characters.
pokemega32 1 month ago
The reason a new hero appears in the Downfall Timeline but not in the Adult Timeline is simple. Many of the heroes were reincarnations of the previous one. The "Spirit of the Hero" as stated by Demise.
In the Downfall Timeline, Link dies, so he can obviously be reincarnated. In the Adult Timeline, Link leaves the timeline completely, ceasing to exist. You can't be reincarnated if you don't exist.
pokemega32 1 month ago
Your explanation for how the third timeline could work makes no sense. If Link never left the Temple of Light, the Sages wouldn't have been around to seal Ganon, Ganondorf would have never gotten the Triforce of Courage, and the Master Sword would have been stuck in the Sacred Realm.
Besides, how is your explanation any better. You've just made up a different what if scenario than the one Nintendo did. How is yours somehow better than theirs?
pokemega32 1 month ago
To me, the hero is defeated part is either a clever or stupid twist, but I think if they worded it "Hero never awakes" like you said, it would make more sense. What bothers me a little more is how Majoras Mask and Wind Waker are not in the same timeline when Wind Waker clearly references that link went back in time to go after a long lost friend (aka the events of Majoras Mask). Shouldn't those two be in the same strand?
n4tennis23 1 month ago
@n4tennis23 Uh, no. The very fact that they tell you he went back in time means they're on separate timelines.
pokemega32 1 month ago
@pokemega32 Incorrect, first off at the beginning of the game, there is reference that the hero of time was a young boy... not a man. Second, the king of red lions states after you get the master sword that the hero of time left to go find a friend (aka Majoras Mask). How do they know that if Wind Waker is on the adult hero timeline and Majoras Mask happens on the child side of the timeline. It makes no valid sense.
n4tennis23 1 month ago
@n4tennis23 The Hero of Time was 16 as an "adult", and besides, he was never even called the Hero of Time in the child timeline. The KoRL never says anything about going to find a friend. Even in the english version he just said he left for another land, while the Japanese version explicitly says he traveled through time.
And Ganondorf wasn't defeated by Link in the Child Timeline, so how could Wind Waker possibly fit in that timeline?
pokemega32 1 month ago
The reason there is not a "hero is defeated" split for every single game is simply because there haven't been any games made that require them yet.
That doesn't mean they don't happen, it just means they don't matter right now.
pokemega32 1 month ago
Also to the commenters, the Hyrule Historia specifically states that Link dying at the hands of Ganon is what causes the timeline that leads to LttP and onwards, therefore the events leading up to it is not caused by Link leaving one timeline due to Master Sword time travel shenanigans.
One more thing, having three timelines is a perfect fit thematically for the Legend of Zelda series, considering how relevant the Triforce is in the mythology of the games.
fdsfgs123 1 month ago
Describing the Downfall timeline as a "What-If scenario" just shows that you have no clue how parallel universes and alternate worlds work. How about instead of saying that Nintendo's timeline is bunk, you actually read up about this concept that has been used across many different franchises and forms of entertainment?
fdsfgs123 1 month ago
I like to think that the "Hero is defeated" scenario leads to Final Fantasy I. There's even a gravestone that says "Here lies Link" :P
19Szabolcs91 1 month ago 7
LOL, you're so pissed, it's hilarious xD!
TheLegendaryFusion 1 month ago
i think that with the skyward sword that they are trying to patch the timeline up so that it does make sense.
saruto715 1 month ago
I believe that the third was not caused by the hero's defeat, but by his absence.You see, on OoT's ending,when young Link meets young Zelda again,she had yet to flee with Impah.On the original timeline,they had already left, meaning that this is not the original timeline.So, OoT Link awake in timeline A,defeats Ganon on timeline B, and comes back to timeline C, where none/few of the events of OoT had taken place.
GigaFullsMash 1 month ago
the hero is defeated is thinking that when zelda sends link to an new timeline so there is no link in the original timeline
mageftw222 1 month ago
hank lan i think the same way :)
goldenlink1001 1 month ago
hmmmm...... maybe the "hero is defeated" part might be that link lost and spawned back and said: oh if i go on like this for ever i will not win, so he quits and ganon becomes ruler of hyrule (almost said tamriel right there), this is no joke this is my actual thought, or the more logical is that he realizes that ganon is strong and quits.and then it moves on to link to the past. im not a zelda fan that much but this might be right.
DarkFireMario100001 1 month ago
3 way split, who'da thunk it
ctt4lfecw 1 month ago
ALSO I think that it is funny that When Link was invoved in the capture of Ganon the seal doesnt hold eve. But when he isnt invoved like in the area before Link to the past the seal actually holds and he needs to create agnhm to help him.
Vandalia1998 1 month ago
wate a minet in the end of skyward sword Demis says the his hate shal be reincarnate with an edles scycal but y come he (he meaning ganonDORF) (when i make my timeline i'll explane wy im capitalising the dorf) dies in windwaker and twilight prinssces
Basekillmenlawz 1 month ago
I am pretty much all with you there, sir. I think that unless we know "when" the Hero of Time is defeated, it doesn't make sense at all, but if it means that the Hero loses to Ganon(dorf) after opening the doorway to the Sacred Realm (which, correct me if I'm wrong, then becomes the Dark Realm), then doesn't everything that happens after the Hero "losing" mean that anything after that takes place in the Sacred Realm, and 'Link to the Past' can't happen because there's 2 seperate realms in it?
forrenz 1 month ago
Personally, I don't think it's that bad, but Jesus christ, that "the hero is defeated" timeline is just stupid
Alfasali 1 month ago
Lancun: The adult era. The sensical era. The era without a hero, or is it? Why is it without a hero?
RDF2: Hey Lan, I have a theory: Link went back before having a kid born with his bloodline, or at least never hooked up with any of the girls (Romani, Zelda, Ruto) in the Adult era. This left no bloodline to exist until the reincarnation in Wind Waker. So yeah, without a hero meant that the Goddesses of Hyrule were still in the making of a new incarnation, but took too long to stop Ganondorf.
RedDragonForce2 1 month ago
in majora's mask there is an ending where if you do not make the "dead-line" as it be to defeat the villain than the moon crashes into the land and everything is destroyed and link is "dead" what is to happen then... the hero is defeated or is he not?
magagod2 1 month ago
This time-line does work, but only if you read 'hero defeated' as 'the past that wasn't changed by the time traveling hero' or 'the unchanged future'. So in OoT you start in the past as a kid and then go to the unchanged future, there you travel back to the past and do things that change the future, then he travels back into the changed future. Using this to split up the time in a changed future and unchanged future would make the whole timeline valid. Change 'defeated' into 'left' and it works.
Panicnl 1 month ago
@Panicnl So what I was really trying to say is that it actually isn't a what-if situation but a legit split, only the one who made it got lazy and put 'hero defeated' in it instead of explaining the situation. If it said 'Hero left' it would be right, but the designer got lazy or confused and put defeated there creating a false 'what-if situation.
Panicnl 1 month ago
Your dual split timeline theory makes more sense than the triple split.
Raicun27 1 month ago
I think the reason OOT is special because if you die in OOT then there was no one to stop Gannon, therefore the Decline era comes up.
During any other game when the hero was "defeated" all that would happen would be Gannon essentially destroying the world.
I think that is their thinking behind it.
JonBall44 1 month ago
@JonBall44 Technically Oot Should not exist
SPzenku44 1 month ago
I don't ever remember dying in OoT and then having link's awakening start up...
Alchemydude667 1 month ago
The Timeline was always very....sketchy. It's mostly the fact that there is no official translation yet. I think the third timeline could of actually occurred the first time you go back in time in OoT, as explained by user 'YourHeroes' video.
DarkDeSTiny45 1 month ago in playlist Updated Legend of Zelda Timeline Theory
As Soon as i heard the "what if" timeline I figured they just wanted fans to stop bitching about the timeline
SPzenku44 1 month ago
In fairness, let me explain the possible functional differences between "The Hero is Defeated" and "The Hero of Wind & A New World". With Link defeated, Ganondorf would still be around to have significant influence on things whereas the Wind Waker timeline leaves us with a long stretch of time where there is no Ganondorf.
SunWukong54 1 month ago
@SunWukong54
More importantly, it can only be assumed that each Link has to die at some point, eventually being replaced as the Link from Skyward Sword is replaced by the Minish Cap Link; The Link in "A Link to the Past" showing up in the "The Hero is Defeated" timeline would be no different. The only time we've officially seen Link's disappearance become an issue was in the Wind Waker timeline.
That said, it still seems kind of hokey; just putting them all after FSA would be better.
SunWukong54 1 month ago
@shayaan2354 Nintendo probably saw his timeline and copied it but they didn't want to look like they just copied off of Lancun so they added the extra split to cover their asses.
skittezraine 1 month ago