Louis was a more skilled fighter just for the fact of being born later and knowledge of boxing was getting better. Also They both fought when boxers were tough as hell not like today. It's hard to really gauge how good johnson was. He was huge and all they did was throw white men at him retired old farts and everything. I like Jack Johnson no disrespect but There could have been an even better Black or any minority that we'll never know about because they wouldn't let the belt go to another.
jack johson was physically stronger he had better defence, better stamina(obviously past his prime he fought around 25 rounds against prime willard)he was more smart, louis was a harder puncher,more aggressive i think that it is a 50/50 in the first match johson would outbox louis, but in the rematch i think that louis would find the way to catch and stop him
Louis by late round KO. Johnson never faced on offensive force like Louis. Johnson had a great defense but could be hit. Even Jeffries moving in slow motion was able to connect occasionally. Louis was fast with Ko power in either fist. Johnson would not have been able
to hit and hold like was able to at the turn of the century. Johnson's game was too one dimensional for a complete boxer puncher like Louis.
Pound for pound and in heavyweight rankings I'd say Joe Louis is better than Johnson. That being said, if they had fought it would have made for a great fight, the classic boxer puncher. Would Louis offense been able to penetrate Johnson's defense?
I believe JJ would have figured JL out used his reach & movement(the old footage doesn't show how good his movement was)& just been too clever & crafty. The era the fight took place in would bring in different factors too as JJ would have been an even better boxer in JL's era. A fight between them would just have made thier championship reighn even stronger, & a series of fights could have been one of if not the best ever!!!
Jack Johnson's true claim to greatness was his exploits as the coloured heavyweight champion where he beat all the best boxers of his era, in all his fights on film he gives the impression of having so much more to offer but fast KO's where unheard of in those days & money was made selling the fight films to movie theatres people wouldn't pay to see a 1 round fight. The quality of the film doesn't show the subtlties of JJ's movement & fails to show how good he really was.
louis was head and shoulders above Johnson. putting aside his struggle to overcome social stigma he wasn't that great of a boxer, 3 of his title fights were against middleweights he outweighed by 25-30 pounds and had a signifigant height and reach over, It would be like Larry Holmes fighting Hagler and Duran.There were constant stories of him making agreements to prolong or even throw fights, For all the hub bub surrounding him about race he never offered another black man a title shot.
@SuperGetitgotitgood I think Joe could have beaten Johnson but not in an easy fight. Louis had trouble with "movers" and Jack could move very well around the ring. Johnson never offered a title shot at black fighters because there was no money in such a fight at the time. Don't get me wrong, I think Joe is better than Jack but not by much.
I read that Johnson wanted a shot at Dempsey saying "that style is my bread & butter" or something like that, meaning that he liked guys chasing him.
@speddyg I think it would be hard for Louis. Louis's trainer said that Johnson would win, and Johnson did tell everybody about Louis's weakness and picked Shmeling to win in the first fight.
@louth00 There's no telling how could Max Baer could have been had he taken his boxing seriously. He had a powerful right which a rode all the way to the title. He never really took the time to learn the details of the game which resulted in his short reign. Had a great sense of humor. Was really casted as the bad guy in the movie
@louth00 It's possible but hard to tell. Only a few films of him exist and his record does not exactly read like a who's who of boxing. Some big names but nobody in their prime. Jeffries was 6 years removed from his best,
Ketchell was maybe 160 lbs, Sam Langford was about the 160lbs as well. Sam Mcvey was till a novice. Tommy Burns the shortest heavyweight champion ever, Fitzsimons was almost 50.
jack johnson isen't even a top 10 heavyweight he never fought anyone he never did anything just because he stood up against the white man and was the first black heavyweight champion doesen't mean he's a beast....the guy was a great person for black people but the man diden't do shit? i can name atleast 15 better heavyweights better than this man
Jack Johnson only had like 6 or 7 title defenses. Sorry but Joe Louis crushed for over 12 years straight. I feel for Jack Johnson considering the time and all but he enjoyed partying and not looking to fight every month like Joe Louis did...and Joe did it with dignity and grace.
the best boxer ever is Geroge foreman.. he had Reach Power and he was tall..
Quote Cus amato even said.. ( IF I Trainded Foreman i would make him a beast and Animal.. dont get me wrong hes already a killer.. but with hes power and Reach and hes Tall Body.. i would make him go undeafted.. if i only had him as a boxer.. )
@BunBRIP I don't need to waste my time on somebody as stupid as you. You think that George Foreman is the greatest boxer ever? How? He didn't beat enough greats to be considered that, he didn't accomplish enough to be considered that, he lost to too many lesser fighters to be considered that, etc.
And just because D'amato said something doesn't make it 100% fact. He's not a demi-god.
And also, you just started insulting me because I disagreed with you. LOL.
@BunBRIP Name one great fighter Tyson beat? Larry Holmes, one of the greatest heavyweights of all time. Michael Spinks, one of the greatest light-heavyweights of all time. Trevor Berbick, heavyweight champion of the world. Pinklon Thomas, one of the greatest 80's heavyweights. Frank Bruno, one of Britain's greatest fighters.
Want to me name more? And also, calling me a faggot repeatedly doesn't make your point come across better. It makes you look like a wannabee ghetto thug.
@BunBRIP Michael Spinks wasn't a pussy, he was one of the greatest light heavyweights of all time and beat Holmes twice at heavyweight and only lost once, to Mike Tyson.
And no, Tyson wasn't a bitch when old George wanted to fight him. He was trying to make a fight with Holyfield but went to prison for four years, and when he was released Foreman had retired.
Also, you sound like a 9 year old little kid trying to sound tough or cool by calling me a faggot in every sentence. It's pathetic.
@IronMikeVideos fagget.. wtf Foreman callet tyson out wen tyson still was.. On Kewin ronneys..Place.. also fagget... Michel spinks beat a old holmes how many times do i need 2 say that fagget.. Geroge callet tyson .. tyson was a scared bitch...
Micheal spinks beat a old Holmes just like tyson.. spinks was a good light wight but in the hewy division he was a Fag like u dad
@BunBRIP see what i mean?... go to school you fucking retard... faggot? im pretty sure you're the only faggot here considering you're the one that says it enough times... stupid fuck!
@RangersFCx217x faggot ass Motherfucker.. go fuck u slutty ass hoe mom.. who spread her legs befroe she meet u dad u fagget.. u fagget go watch gay porn i no u like it bich ass nigger
@CoffeeBeatsTea I think it's called Unforgivable Blackness. Johnson is pretty much my pick for all time heavy, maybe Tyson--would be Foreman had he gotten in shape. Louis had great hands and was a great finisher; other than that, I think Johnson had him in movement, an edge on size and reach, just as much if not more power. Also, Joe had a bit if a glass jaw. Look at Johson's muscle tone compared to fighters of his era: he looks like he's on steroids--cause he had no shortage of testosterone.
@Odhinn222 Johnson more power than Louis? Johnson was never considered a power puncher. He had a decent right uppercut but that's really about all. Louis had one punch KO power in either hand. Check out the records, apart from Johnson's KO of the 150lb Ketchell, Johnson usually won the good defense and would wear his opponents down. Louis destroyed people.
Its funny how many people want to make comparisons of which fighter would beat who but whats not being realised is that there was always racism and hatred towards blacks but about thirty years between Joe Louis and Jack Johnson in asport thats ever evolving.The movement training every thing evolved boxer also went more rounds in Jack Johnsons day about six more than in Louis s day.
considerin the lack of training knowledge and food knowledge they had those days , you can call that body of jack johnson a freak of nature . but i heard freddy roach say that in his opinion louis is the greatest of them all , i stick with that as he knows more then all of us
His trainer, Jack Blackburn, probably told him this to keep him level- headed and make sure his head didn't get too big. Telling someone they can't do something serves as motivation. I'm willing to bet Blackburn knew Joe could beat Jack Johnson. Other than Ali himself, Louis was the greatest heavyweight ever, with Rocky in at a close third. I MAY BE WRONG, BUT I DOUBT IT!!!
@09bnunez no holyfield, foreman or lennox? foreman beats at least 8 of your ten...holyfield beats more than half not 2 mention he is actually capable of beating everyone on ur list cuz no one had more heart and determination than evander and lennox whips nine of these guys easily and i would pick lennox 2 beat ali. obviously my opinion is no more right or wrong than yours but holyfield and lennox did beat tyson...jus sayin! althgh i myself do have tyson in the top ten.
I take Johnson 9 out of 10 times. He was a much smarter fighter and handled pressure with ease. At his best he was nearly unbeatable. It is ironic that Jack Johnson was always considered a menace to society, but it was Joe Louis in his old age that was the drug addict and failure.
@mrmee1229 I am related to Joe Louis via marriage. I likely know far more than you. Stop making excuses for the failures of people. Jack Johnson had the entire white world (and some of the Negroes) wanting him dead. He did not become a heroin addict because of it.
@abdullahthebutcher jeez here we go ... ya ali is my uncle,,, and johnson didnt care u fool he made a mockery of all who hated him he wanted to make white america hate him... louis did a lot for his country patriotically but the govt didnt care still wanted all his money ,, not every1 is the same thats how he chose to deal with it .. why dont u watch the documentary this clip came from
@carmodifire louis was capable of being any body not saying he would beat johnson but louis was amazing fighter .it would be thebest fight johnson ever had
Johnson never fought a fighter who threw combinations like Joe Louis --- Joe would definitely kayo Johnson. Also, many people think that because Johnson was a big strong guy, he must have been a big puncher. His record disproves that -- many 20 round fights, low kayo percentage. Lucky for Joe that he wasn't a contender when Jack was champ, or Johnson would have refused to fight him, just as he ducked Langford, Jeannette, McVea, the other outstanding black fighters of that time.
@dempsey00 Hi there, it would be a tough fight between Louis and Johnson. I would favor Louis slightly based on his power and hand speed. Johnson did beat the fighters you mentioned prior to being champion, but it was a different time back than. None of those fighters including Langford would beat Johnson while champion. Dempsey avoided the #1 contender from 1920 to 1924 as it was the sign of the times. Johnson is a top 5 all-time fighter
@dorsi68 --- Good to hear from you; it's been a long time. Joe would handle Johnson with little trouble, IMO. Johnson would be on the defensive the entire time, trying to clinch and tie Louis up, maybe land an occasional uppercut. But Joe's combinations would put an end to the matter. I agree, Johnson at his best would probably beat Langford et al, but he was notorious for high living and minimal training. Don't you think that Langford and Jeannette at least deserved a chance?
@dorsi68 -- And true, Johnson beat these guys earlier, but in several cases, it was very early in the opponent's career. Langford, for example, weighed only 156 when he fought Johnson. I think it would have been a more competitive fight if Sam was at 180.
Also, I know that as a historian of the sport, you are well aware that Dempsey did NOT avoid Wills and, in fact, signed to fight Wills twice. It just wasn't in the cards due to prevailing racial animosity.
@dempsey00 Hi there, I know Dempsey did not avoid Wills and he would have beaten and most likley KO'd Wills, but it was the sign of the times. Johnson beat Langford very easily the first time and I rank Langford as the greatest p4p fighter ever. But no one wanted to see two black fighters fight. If there was $50,000+ for Johnson, you do not think he would have fought Langford ??? Johnson still beats Langford regardless. Langford was inarguably the #1 contender during Johnson's reign
@dempsey00 but the size different would have made it difficult for Langford to beat Johnson. You must know Greb gave Dempsey some very good sparring matches and at times it was stated he beat and hurt Dempsey. Greb was the greatest middleweight ever, but if he fought Dempsey in a 15 round fight, he would lose based on the size difference. The same applies to Johnson and Langford plus Langford's style would not be as effective with Johnson as it was with the other top contenders you men
@dempsey00 you mentioned. How do you think a 1923 fight between Dempsey and Greb would go and a 1923 fight with Dempsey and Wills go ??? How about Tunney vs Dempsey in 1924 ??? I would say with Greb, it goes 11 rounds, with Wills 8 to 12 rounds with Dempsey winning both. In 1924, I would say Dempsey by maybe 2 points in a decision in a tough fight.
@dorsi68 -- I've read accounts of the sparring sessions between Dempsey & Greb. I can see Greb making Jack look bad for a few rounds but then the Mauler's body punching would slow him down. Dempsey by KO in 6, IMO. I believe that Greb was quoted as not wanting to fight these big, strong guys any more after his last fight with Tunney -- who was bigger and stronger or hit harder than Dempsey?
@dempsey00 Hi there, Arcel is one of the best trainers of all-time, but if he did say Wills was a journeyman, he is way off base as Wills is a better fighter than anyone Dempsey fought with the exception of Tunney. I read that Wills did not wnat to fight Tunney, but even if he did, its unlikley Tunney would have fought Wills. Greb beat Gibbons before Demnpsey beat him, so I can not see Dempsey KOing Greb in 6 rounds. He might KO Greb around the 12th or iy could be a 15 round decision.
@dempsey00 Greb also said that Tunney would beat Denpsey both times and in the second fight, he told Dempsey he would not spar with him as he did not wnat to steal his money as he said Tunney would win easily (which he did). Greb fought all the best fighters of his era from middelwight to heavyweight except for Langford and Wills. It would have been interesting why these fights never occured as Greb never drew the colour line. In 1920 onward, Greb beats Langford and might decision Wills.
@dorsi68 -- Regarding Wills, Ray Arcel described him as 'a journeyman' and Harry was over the hill in '23 anyway. That's why his manager refused to let him fight Gibbons or Tunney. Wills was big and not particularly fast, the type of opponent Dempsey feasted on. I'd say Dempsey by KO within 3-4 rounds, even if they fought in 1918 or '19. And I think Tunney won those fights with his reflexes; I agree with your prediction had they fought earlier when Dempsey was younger and quicker.
Shut the fucking hell up. Blacks are more dominant in boxing because they are poorer than whites, don't get the education they need, have nothing and thus turn to boxing. They put in more effort because It's the only thing they have.
Whites get education and don't turn to boxing because they don't need to. Are you forgetting Marciano? Gene Tunney? Yes I guess so. I've seen black boxers being bullied by white boxers. The boxer is good not because of skin pigmenation, racist fools!
@TheDommeran we're not talking about skin color IDIOT, we're talking about blood heritage, NATIONALITY, and YES it's a fact that NEGROES are better and STRONGER THAN WHITE FOLK
@washingyou Really? Explain why the heavyweight division has been dominated for almost a decade and is still dominated by eastern Europeans? It really does has to much to do with who is hungry at the time. The Irish, Jews, blacks, latinos have all had their periods of time where they dominated boxing.
I can't believe the Ali people are here. Your boy wasn't that good. Get the fuck out of here with that "would have never caught" bullshit. Jack Johnson might kill Ali, and Joe Louis is way too good with the left hook, right uppercut, counter jab combo. Seriously? Ali? wtf did Ali ever do to make some one think he could handle Jack fucking Johnson bombs. Ali would look stupid trying to rope-a-dope Jack. He's got no attack for Joe, Joe ain't slow and he ain't weak, and that combo would work
Ha! Johnson is the greatest fighter ever. He was the negro champion from 1903-1908 and fought the likes of lanford, mckvey,willis,jeanette, walcott at least 4 times a piece and won. All of those fighters and many more he fought would have been world champions.along with fighting all white fighters all over the world. From 1903-1915 he was champion. 12 years enough said.
nice to c people are focusing on the boxing and not the pointless ness off coloure i love boxing a iam a fighter but i think there is no such thing as a iorn jaw but in stead a well trained anthaleat how is conditioned fighter how can well from a haymaker but you might have over looked that a lot of fights go to l8ter rounds after tking so many punches wouldent that make most fighters have a iorn jaw
lois was 10x the puncher of massively overrated jack..get real..jack hit willard a zillian times with no kd and smaller dempsey killed willard..lois would ko him rite away
jack johnson is one of my favourite boxers because he had balls and courage .he was the baddest motherfucker in that time like ali and tyson later. he had fought against the racist society he was his own man and he didnt care what white people would say but i have to admit that joe louis was the greatest ever he had speed,tremendous punch,skills and a big heart he was the most complete heavyweight ever in my opinion
@arr443 Guess I have to disagree, Johnson looks like he was far superior athletically over Louis and was just as fast with his hands. Johnson was also bigger than Louis. Both Johnson and Jim Jeffries were far superior size wise for heavyweights in the early 1900s.
WOW!In My Eye's?Joe Louis without a doubt....Louis had a better record and he fought black fighters...Johnson refused to fight black fighters the man was a bonafide bitch if u ask me.....Louis 27 title defences 12 years has Johnson done that?
@JesseThe16 Johnson held the negro heavyweight title from 1903 to 1908. Where he fought all the tough black fighters that the white fighters were affraid to fight. Louis had 25 defenses. Johnson fought far more black fighters.
Yep and no one ever wants to bring this up but Joe Louis really didn't have a cast-iron jaw. Whenever he faced an opponent who could take what he dished out, he ended up losing more often than not (Braddock being the exception but he did knock JL on his ass for the 2nd time in his pro career after Schmelling did it first). So the chin factor would really be the deciding factor and Johnson had a legendary chin and I think that would edge out Louis in the end.
Joe Louis was the first black heavy weight boxing champion to fight black contenders also. Jack Johnson refused to fight black boxers once he became champion.
jack Johnson was the baddest dude to ever hold the HW crown. As hated as he was and high as the stakes and consequences were he lived the life he wanted and apologized to nobody
hey look nigga, I am black, and joe louis said in hid AUTObiography that he had alot of native,blood in him, but that black folks are always trying to be indian, or whatever they were not, so he didnt advertise it, you can look at him and see that.
dude i just watched this 3 1/2 hour movie 2 days ago ey i have a hard time findin his fights but in the doc he looked real good one of the few truly technical slick guys from that far back
Also i disagre that Louis would beat Ali. Flat footed Louis would never catch ALI all night and if he did Ali took a great punch. Ali had the right style to beat louis. Ali would beat Johnson aswell but this could be close as they both had similarities. I agree Johnson would defeat Louis. Johnson was one of the most intelligent boxers of all time like Ali.
UGLY444 I disagree that Ali didn't have great stamina compared to Johnson. It's true in Johnson's time they faught 40 rounds but they faught at a much slower pace, were flat footed, hardly threw combinations, lot's of clinches compared to Ali's time. Ali in his prime could dance for 15 rounds this requires a lot of stamina. I'm sure if ALI faught in Johnson's time he could box 40 rounds it' s all state of mind.
Johnson would destroy Louis !! Johnson was like Ali,not so fast but hits much harder and he had much much much more stamina !! he could fight for 30or 40 rounds at a high level and hits very hard..thats why i think,he would beat louis. I dont think ali could beat lousi,cause Ali couldn't hold his speed for 15 rounds and louis would catch him and hurt him and win the later rounds.but louis wouldnt be able to catch Johnson beacause of johnsons superior stamina,clevernes and movement.
Louis is a underrated fighter. Louis belongs in the top 4 pound for pound boxers of all time. Louis had more skill, power, accuracy and precision. He would have beaten Johnson.
Joe Louis wasn`t allowed to be himself. Case point, Louis LOVED watermelon, however his handlers,advisors did not want ANY pictures showing him eating watermelon, for fear it woud re-enforce a negative sterotype of blacks and watermelon !
I would put Jack Johnson ahead of Joe Louis. Louis would have came forward and Johnson would have tied him up, caught his punches on the gloves, moved around and frustrated him. If Louis got a few of his trademark hooks through who knows but I think Jack Johnson would have been too clever
Jack Johnson at the time he beat T.Burns vs Joe Louis when he beat Schmeling....holy crap, that would have been a fight, some how I still see it like a points win for Jack, but if Louis gets in one of those right hand bombs who knows. What do you guys think?
I prefer Jack johnson. Jack johnson had a better boxing brain and didn't give a shit about anyone. Even jack blackburn Louis' manager who fought as a lightweight in johnson's era said Jack would beat Louis everyday of the week and twice on sunday and he disliked Johnson.
"When Joe Louis asked Lena Horne, with whom he was then having a relationship, to keep score for him at a Hollywood golf benefit, the singer refused -- she was entertaining troops that day. Joe hit her with a left hook. Then he started to choke her. In his 1978 autobiography, written with Edna and Art Rust Jr., Louis said that the only thing that saved Lena's life was an aunt in the next room who threatened to call the police."
That is some fucked up repugnant shit how white people portrayed Jack Johnson. I'm white but, my family isn't from here. 2nd gen polish on my dads side and 3rd or 4th gen irish on my mothers. Racism will never die. I'm completely convinced of that. Jack Johnson didn't give a shit and good for him he rubbed white's faces in his GLORY! Fuckin racist pigs.
Joe Louis was an uneducated Uncle Tom. Read about the lack of respect he gave Jack Johnson because the white man told him to. Joe Louis died a heroin addict. Jack Johnson died the way he lived -- fast!
Very true. Joe Louis wasn't an Uncle Tom. He was simply a man who did what he had to get where he needed to go. Jack Johnson in the early 1900s made Black Fighters look like devils in racist America. Louis couldn't flaunt, and he had good management earlier on*, not so much later on, and they told him and he knew that to get respect for his people, he would have to work the system and be a great fighter.
Bert Sugar said it best in a couple interviews where he said basically, different immigrants and people of non-anglo ethnicity had to prove themselves to white America, and many times that is through boxing.
In Berts's words, first it was the Irish in the late 1800s, than Blacks, than Jews, and the last 20-30 years different Spanish ethnic groups, from Mexicans to Puerto Ricans, to Panamanians like Duran. It's odd how boxing has a huge effect on society.
nah Joe Louis wasn't an Uncle Tom...he did what he had to do in the ring...Louis was a shy guy...he would have never gloated in or out of the ring anyway...Johnson was the opposite of Louis.
WHy do people always say that Ali has Parkinsons because of Boxing??? How many fights did Michael J. Fox have?
And look at Alis career.... He didnt get hit nearly as much as others-Frazier, Chuvalo, Bonavena, Quarry. None of these guys have, or had, Parkinsons. Point is, peopel say Ali got it from Boxing because he is a household name with a disease. I think he would have gotten it anyways.
Very true. Taking repeated shots to the head cant really help anything. Im just saying that if boxing was THE cause for parkinsons, plenty more boxers would have it before Ali. Ali was actually hit alot less than the average fighter, even less than most great fighters, so I dont think boxing is the number one reason as to why he has the disease.
It's difficult to believe that Ali's ring career didn't contribute in some way to his present condition. He took some serious poundings towards the end of his career, especially with the rope-a-dope tactics he liked to use. The Foreman, Frazier, Shavers and Norton fights were particularly bad, but also Wepner, Spinks, Lyle, Holmes etc.
was there any other great black fighters we missed out on from the same era? who were held back from title fights coz of the need for a great white hope?
Man... obviously, nobody can ever know for sure. But I'm forced to believe that the top fighters in some ways get better over time. I suspect that Joe Louis was objectively better than Jack Johnson, at least a little bit.
I'm glad I don't have to like one to the exclusion of the other. These are both two of my favourite champs of any weight division of all time. But I have to admit, despite how much I love Joe Louis, Jack Johnson is something of a sentimental favourite of mine.
well said. however i account for the fact that any given fighter would adapt to a later era having the advantage of evolved training and technique..
Joe was great, but you can clearly see that Jack J had the speed, conditioning, athleticism, quickness, reflexes and just overall cunning and ring mastery that would have translated well in any era, including this one...
Ali= The Greatest (the guy pretty much changed sports forever)!! Joe Louis= Best Heavyweight (conventional style: jab, right-hand, left- hook)! JL was the people's champ! Rocky Marciano= Hardest hittting and toughest to beat (I mean that literally too)!! Jack Johnson= A Boxing God!!! (inside the ring of course).. JJ had a flawless defense with "cat-like" reflexes.. Inside the ring the guy was way ahead of his time man, comparing him to JL doesn't make sense to me...
Louis was a more skilled fighter just for the fact of being born later and knowledge of boxing was getting better. Also They both fought when boxers were tough as hell not like today. It's hard to really gauge how good johnson was. He was huge and all they did was throw white men at him retired old farts and everything. I like Jack Johnson no disrespect but There could have been an even better Black or any minority that we'll never know about because they wouldn't let the belt go to another.
ACslookin 3 days ago
jack johson was physically stronger he had better defence, better stamina(obviously past his prime he fought around 25 rounds against prime willard)he was more smart, louis was a harder puncher,more aggressive i think that it is a 50/50 in the first match johson would outbox louis, but in the rematch i think that louis would find the way to catch and stop him
combatesdeboxeo 2 weeks ago
Louis by late round KO. Johnson never faced on offensive force like Louis. Johnson had a great defense but could be hit. Even Jeffries moving in slow motion was able to connect occasionally. Louis was fast with Ko power in either fist. Johnson would not have been able
to hit and hold like was able to at the turn of the century. Johnson's game was too one dimensional for a complete boxer puncher like Louis.
andrewr62 2 weeks ago
Pound for pound and in heavyweight rankings I'd say Joe Louis is better than Johnson. That being said, if they had fought it would have made for a great fight, the classic boxer puncher. Would Louis offense been able to penetrate Johnson's defense?
MrBumboclart 1 month ago
Johnson over Louis by comfortable 15 rd. decision. Jacks upper body strength would let him smother Joe on the inside. Both in my top three.
1899sharkey 1 month ago
When I look at J.J I see a real man. No color define him, no one order him around
TheFlutevisions 2 months ago
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I believe JJ would have figured JL out used his reach & movement(the old footage doesn't show how good his movement was)& just been too clever & crafty. The era the fight took place in would bring in different factors too as JJ would have been an even better boxer in JL's era. A fight between them would just have made thier championship reighn even stronger, & a series of fights could have been one of if not the best ever!!!
TheStonecoldloner 3 months ago
Jack Johnson's true claim to greatness was his exploits as the coloured heavyweight champion where he beat all the best boxers of his era, in all his fights on film he gives the impression of having so much more to offer but fast KO's where unheard of in those days & money was made selling the fight films to movie theatres people wouldn't pay to see a 1 round fight. The quality of the film doesn't show the subtlties of JJ's movement & fails to show how good he really was.
TheStonecoldloner 3 months ago
louis was head and shoulders above Johnson. putting aside his struggle to overcome social stigma he wasn't that great of a boxer, 3 of his title fights were against middleweights he outweighed by 25-30 pounds and had a signifigant height and reach over, It would be like Larry Holmes fighting Hagler and Duran.There were constant stories of him making agreements to prolong or even throw fights, For all the hub bub surrounding him about race he never offered another black man a title shot.
SuperGetitgotitgood 3 months ago
@SuperGetitgotitgood I think Joe could have beaten Johnson but not in an easy fight. Louis had trouble with "movers" and Jack could move very well around the ring. Johnson never offered a title shot at black fighters because there was no money in such a fight at the time. Don't get me wrong, I think Joe is better than Jack but not by much.
I read that Johnson wanted a shot at Dempsey saying "that style is my bread & butter" or something like that, meaning that he liked guys chasing him.
speddyg 2 months ago
@speddyg I think it would be hard for Louis. Louis's trainer said that Johnson would win, and Johnson did tell everybody about Louis's weakness and picked Shmeling to win in the first fight.
carmodifire 2 months ago
00:07
Holy fuck. Wouldn't want to get hit by that shit. That bag is dead.
goonodeath 3 months ago
Joe Louis would win !
MrJoelouisbarrow 3 months ago
"Yeah Joe, you're not white, but if you do what we say, we'll throw you the choicest scraps from the table." Well done white America.
tnrc75 3 months ago
Louis would kill Johnson. His trainer said Johnson was better very early in Joe's career.
crowley0312 3 months ago
@crowley0312 IDK, Johnson was the one who found Louis's flaw, and I think he's capitalize,cuz Louis has no in ring IQ
carmodifire 3 months ago
Johnson would destroy Louis, even Louis's trainer said so.
carmodifire 3 months ago
@louth00 There's no telling how could Max Baer could have been had he taken his boxing seriously. He had a powerful right which a rode all the way to the title. He never really took the time to learn the details of the game which resulted in his short reign. Had a great sense of humor. Was really casted as the bad guy in the movie
Cinderella Man which was not totally accurate.
andrewr62 3 months ago
@louth00 It's possible but hard to tell. Only a few films of him exist and his record does not exactly read like a who's who of boxing. Some big names but nobody in their prime. Jeffries was 6 years removed from his best,
Ketchell was maybe 160 lbs, Sam Langford was about the 160lbs as well. Sam Mcvey was till a novice. Tommy Burns the shortest heavyweight champion ever, Fitzsimons was almost 50.
andrewr62 3 months ago
jack johnson isen't even a top 10 heavyweight he never fought anyone he never did anything just because he stood up against the white man and was the first black heavyweight champion doesen't mean he's a beast....the guy was a great person for black people but the man diden't do shit? i can name atleast 15 better heavyweights better than this man
malcolmscotty1 4 months ago
Holy shit these comments are racist!
pimpnastyfunk420 4 months ago
Jack Johnson only had like 6 or 7 title defenses. Sorry but Joe Louis crushed for over 12 years straight. I feel for Jack Johnson considering the time and all but he enjoyed partying and not looking to fight every month like Joe Louis did...and Joe did it with dignity and grace.
aitraining 4 months ago
JJ would win, according to Louis's trainer.
carmodifire 4 months ago
no offence to joe but jack wouldve killed him
straightfactsnolies 5 months ago
the best boxer ever is Geroge foreman.. he had Reach Power and he was tall..
Quote Cus amato even said.. ( IF I Trainded Foreman i would make him a beast and Animal.. dont get me wrong hes already a killer.. but with hes power and Reach and hes Tall Body.. i would make him go undeafted.. if i only had him as a boxer.. )
BunBRIP 5 months ago
@BunBRIP HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.
You're so wrong it's fucking funny!
IronMikeVideos 4 months ago
@IronMikeVideos fagget,, go scuk a dick cus.. amato said it himself.. fagget..
tyson would get Raped u fucking fanboy fagget tyson dick Riding otherfucker..
get of tyson dick fagget..
BunBRIP 4 months ago
@BunBRIP I don't need to waste my time on somebody as stupid as you. You think that George Foreman is the greatest boxer ever? How? He didn't beat enough greats to be considered that, he didn't accomplish enough to be considered that, he lost to too many lesser fighters to be considered that, etc.
And just because D'amato said something doesn't make it 100% fact. He's not a demi-god.
And also, you just started insulting me because I disagreed with you. LOL.
IronMikeVideos 4 months ago
@IronMikeVideos fag nr 1 geroge dinet have the same triner as tyson.. nr 2.. Geroge would rape tyson..
U Fagget.. u god is tyson cus u a fagget.. nr 3 who did tyson Fight?? Geroge fouhgt great guys .. motherfucker..
Ken norton Ali frazier.. and alort more u stupid motherfucker..name 1 tyson has.?? punk ass bitch
BunBRIP 4 months ago
@BunBRIP Name one great fighter Tyson beat? Larry Holmes, one of the greatest heavyweights of all time. Michael Spinks, one of the greatest light-heavyweights of all time. Trevor Berbick, heavyweight champion of the world. Pinklon Thomas, one of the greatest 80's heavyweights. Frank Bruno, one of Britain's greatest fighters.
Want to me name more? And also, calling me a faggot repeatedly doesn't make your point come across better. It makes you look like a wannabee ghetto thug.
IronMikeVideos 4 months ago
@IronMikeVideos fagget say that again larry holmes hahahaha Larry was way over hes age micheal spinks was a fucking pussy,,, u fagget
Tell me this why was tyson a Bitch wen old gergoe wannet 2 fight him...
also frank bronu ahahahahhahahah u soo gay
BunBRIP 4 months ago
@BunBRIP Michael Spinks wasn't a pussy, he was one of the greatest light heavyweights of all time and beat Holmes twice at heavyweight and only lost once, to Mike Tyson.
And no, Tyson wasn't a bitch when old George wanted to fight him. He was trying to make a fight with Holyfield but went to prison for four years, and when he was released Foreman had retired.
Also, you sound like a 9 year old little kid trying to sound tough or cool by calling me a faggot in every sentence. It's pathetic.
IronMikeVideos 4 months ago
@IronMikeVideos fagget.. wtf Foreman callet tyson out wen tyson still was.. On Kewin ronneys..Place.. also fagget... Michel spinks beat a old holmes how many times do i need 2 say that fagget.. Geroge callet tyson .. tyson was a scared bitch...
Micheal spinks beat a old Holmes just like tyson.. spinks was a good light wight but in the hewy division he was a Fag like u dad
BunBRIP 4 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@BunBRIP You know nothing about boxing.
IronMikeVideos 4 months ago
Comment removed
gammastag 4 months ago
@BunBRIP you silly dunce speak English
gammastag 4 months ago
@gammastag suck a dick ten i might .. speek english
BunBRIP 4 months ago
@BunBRIP Wow were you dropped on you're head when you were a baby... you're spelling is fucking horrible
RangersFCx217x 4 months ago
@RangersFCx217x suck a dick fagget.. or go eat a dick
BunBRIP 4 months ago
@BunBRIP see what i mean?... go to school you fucking retard... faggot? im pretty sure you're the only faggot here considering you're the one that says it enough times... stupid fuck!
RangersFCx217x 4 months ago
@RangersFCx217x faggot ass Motherfucker.. go fuck u slutty ass hoe mom.. who spread her legs befroe she meet u dad u fagget.. u fagget go watch gay porn i no u like it bich ass nigger
BunBRIP 4 months ago
@BunBRIP nope try again you're still a dumbass... oh and you're gran was a real slut last night but you're mother ain't to far behind ;)
RangersFCx217x 4 months ago
@RangersFCx217x fagget.. i bet u mom is a slutty hoe like u granny.. who give me a blow yesterday bitch
BunBRIP 4 months ago
@BunBRIP do you realise how fucking retarded you are? Nope because you didn't go to school did you?
RangersFCx217x 4 months ago
@RangersFCx217x u mom is a hoe yes
BunBRIP 4 months ago
Jack Johnson would win in my eyes...
IslamGuideCom 5 months ago
@CoffeeBeatsTea I think it's called Unforgivable Blackness. Johnson is pretty much my pick for all time heavy, maybe Tyson--would be Foreman had he gotten in shape. Louis had great hands and was a great finisher; other than that, I think Johnson had him in movement, an edge on size and reach, just as much if not more power. Also, Joe had a bit if a glass jaw. Look at Johson's muscle tone compared to fighters of his era: he looks like he's on steroids--cause he had no shortage of testosterone.
Odhinn222 5 months ago
@Odhinn222 Johnson more power than Louis? Johnson was never considered a power puncher. He had a decent right uppercut but that's really about all. Louis had one punch KO power in either hand. Check out the records, apart from Johnson's KO of the 150lb Ketchell, Johnson usually won the good defense and would wear his opponents down. Louis destroyed people.
andrewr62 4 months ago
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Odhinn222 5 months ago
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Odhinn222 5 months ago
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Odhinn222 5 months ago
Its funny how many people want to make comparisons of which fighter would beat who but whats not being realised is that there was always racism and hatred towards blacks but about thirty years between Joe Louis and Jack Johnson in asport thats ever evolving.The movement training every thing evolved boxer also went more rounds in Jack Johnsons day about six more than in Louis s day.
rodneychris507 5 months ago
I would but my money on Joe Louis but not by KO. Johnson's defense was awesome but his offense in my opinion was effective but not great. Mostly
right uppercuts and hooks off the break. Johnson was not nearly the puncher
Joe Louis was. I believe Joe was quicker. Louis by decision.
andrewr62 6 months ago
what documentary is this from?
CoffeeBeatsTea 7 months ago
@CoffeeBeatsTea it's called Unbelievable Blackness the Rise and Fall of Jack Johnson
frankiegrrl 6 months ago
considerin the lack of training knowledge and food knowledge they had those days , you can call that body of jack johnson a freak of nature . but i heard freddy roach say that in his opinion louis is the greatest of them all , i stick with that as he knows more then all of us
isitcosimblack 8 months ago
4 dislikes the commentators hated jack Johnson because he will forever be more than they will be.
lildertygangsta 9 months ago
@lildertygangsta ok einstein
rileydd08 9 months ago
His trainer, Jack Blackburn, probably told him this to keep him level- headed and make sure his head didn't get too big. Telling someone they can't do something serves as motivation. I'm willing to bet Blackburn knew Joe could beat Jack Johnson. Other than Ali himself, Louis was the greatest heavyweight ever, with Rocky in at a close third. I MAY BE WRONG, BUT I DOUBT IT!!!
WillieG1990 9 months ago
@WillieG1990 Rocky had more power than all of them. Louis had a beautiful soul. Jack was an ignorant.
rileydd08 9 months ago
@rileydd08 stop kidding yourself.
jmgnyg 7 months ago
ali ...louis...rocky.....tyson....liston....dempsey....holmes...sullivan..walcott baer thats my top ten heavyweight champions.of all time
09bnunez 10 months ago
@09bnunez no holyfield, foreman or lennox? foreman beats at least 8 of your ten...holyfield beats more than half not 2 mention he is actually capable of beating everyone on ur list cuz no one had more heart and determination than evander and lennox whips nine of these guys easily and i would pick lennox 2 beat ali. obviously my opinion is no more right or wrong than yours but holyfield and lennox did beat tyson...jus sayin! althgh i myself do have tyson in the top ten.
jmgnyg 7 months ago
This is a stupid match up, obviously Joe louis would destroy Jack Johnson. Anyone who knows boxing and has actually boxed properly would know this.
MultiGreat1 10 months ago
@MultiGreat1 eh...Louis's trainer himself said that Jack Johnson would win.
carmodifire 10 months ago
jack johnson said himself that joe could knock ya brains out
coldsoulschmidtbull 10 months ago
I take Johnson 9 out of 10 times. He was a much smarter fighter and handled pressure with ease. At his best he was nearly unbeatable. It is ironic that Jack Johnson was always considered a menace to society, but it was Joe Louis in his old age that was the drug addict and failure.
abdullahthebutcher 10 months ago
@abdullahthebutcher thats because the fukin irs got on his ass and totally fuct him in the end do0 ur research
mrmee1229 10 months ago
@mrmee1229 I am related to Joe Louis via marriage. I likely know far more than you. Stop making excuses for the failures of people. Jack Johnson had the entire white world (and some of the Negroes) wanting him dead. He did not become a heroin addict because of it.
abdullahthebutcher 10 months ago
@abdullahthebutcher jeez here we go ... ya ali is my uncle,,, and johnson didnt care u fool he made a mockery of all who hated him he wanted to make white america hate him... louis did a lot for his country patriotically but the govt didnt care still wanted all his money ,, not every1 is the same thats how he chose to deal with it .. why dont u watch the documentary this clip came from
mrmee1229 10 months ago
joe louis's trainer knew both, and said that johnson would win any day on the week.
carmodifire 11 months ago
@carmodifire louis was capable of being any body not saying he would beat johnson but louis was amazing fighter .it would be thebest fight johnson ever had
chrismck100 10 months ago
@chrismck100 Yes, amazing offense vs amazing defense.
carmodifire 10 months ago
Johnson never fought a fighter who threw combinations like Joe Louis --- Joe would definitely kayo Johnson. Also, many people think that because Johnson was a big strong guy, he must have been a big puncher. His record disproves that -- many 20 round fights, low kayo percentage. Lucky for Joe that he wasn't a contender when Jack was champ, or Johnson would have refused to fight him, just as he ducked Langford, Jeannette, McVea, the other outstanding black fighters of that time.
dempsey00 1 year ago
@dempsey00 Hi there, it would be a tough fight between Louis and Johnson. I would favor Louis slightly based on his power and hand speed. Johnson did beat the fighters you mentioned prior to being champion, but it was a different time back than. None of those fighters including Langford would beat Johnson while champion. Dempsey avoided the #1 contender from 1920 to 1924 as it was the sign of the times. Johnson is a top 5 all-time fighter
dorsi68 11 months ago
@dorsi68 --- Good to hear from you; it's been a long time. Joe would handle Johnson with little trouble, IMO. Johnson would be on the defensive the entire time, trying to clinch and tie Louis up, maybe land an occasional uppercut. But Joe's combinations would put an end to the matter. I agree, Johnson at his best would probably beat Langford et al, but he was notorious for high living and minimal training. Don't you think that Langford and Jeannette at least deserved a chance?
dempsey00 11 months ago
@dorsi68 -- And true, Johnson beat these guys earlier, but in several cases, it was very early in the opponent's career. Langford, for example, weighed only 156 when he fought Johnson. I think it would have been a more competitive fight if Sam was at 180.
Also, I know that as a historian of the sport, you are well aware that Dempsey did NOT avoid Wills and, in fact, signed to fight Wills twice. It just wasn't in the cards due to prevailing racial animosity.
Have you seen Langford-Jeanette?
dempsey00 11 months ago
@dempsey00 Hi there, I know Dempsey did not avoid Wills and he would have beaten and most likley KO'd Wills, but it was the sign of the times. Johnson beat Langford very easily the first time and I rank Langford as the greatest p4p fighter ever. But no one wanted to see two black fighters fight. If there was $50,000+ for Johnson, you do not think he would have fought Langford ??? Johnson still beats Langford regardless. Langford was inarguably the #1 contender during Johnson's reign
dorsi68 11 months ago
@dempsey00 but the size different would have made it difficult for Langford to beat Johnson. You must know Greb gave Dempsey some very good sparring matches and at times it was stated he beat and hurt Dempsey. Greb was the greatest middleweight ever, but if he fought Dempsey in a 15 round fight, he would lose based on the size difference. The same applies to Johnson and Langford plus Langford's style would not be as effective with Johnson as it was with the other top contenders you men
dorsi68 11 months ago
@dempsey00 you mentioned. How do you think a 1923 fight between Dempsey and Greb would go and a 1923 fight with Dempsey and Wills go ??? How about Tunney vs Dempsey in 1924 ??? I would say with Greb, it goes 11 rounds, with Wills 8 to 12 rounds with Dempsey winning both. In 1924, I would say Dempsey by maybe 2 points in a decision in a tough fight.
dorsi68 11 months ago
@dorsi68 -- I've read accounts of the sparring sessions between Dempsey & Greb. I can see Greb making Jack look bad for a few rounds but then the Mauler's body punching would slow him down. Dempsey by KO in 6, IMO. I believe that Greb was quoted as not wanting to fight these big, strong guys any more after his last fight with Tunney -- who was bigger and stronger or hit harder than Dempsey?
dempsey00 11 months ago
@dempsey00 Hi there, Arcel is one of the best trainers of all-time, but if he did say Wills was a journeyman, he is way off base as Wills is a better fighter than anyone Dempsey fought with the exception of Tunney. I read that Wills did not wnat to fight Tunney, but even if he did, its unlikley Tunney would have fought Wills. Greb beat Gibbons before Demnpsey beat him, so I can not see Dempsey KOing Greb in 6 rounds. He might KO Greb around the 12th or iy could be a 15 round decision.
dorsi68 11 months ago
@dempsey00 Greb also said that Tunney would beat Denpsey both times and in the second fight, he told Dempsey he would not spar with him as he did not wnat to steal his money as he said Tunney would win easily (which he did). Greb fought all the best fighters of his era from middelwight to heavyweight except for Langford and Wills. It would have been interesting why these fights never occured as Greb never drew the colour line. In 1920 onward, Greb beats Langford and might decision Wills.
dorsi68 11 months ago
@dorsi68 -- Regarding Wills, Ray Arcel described him as 'a journeyman' and Harry was over the hill in '23 anyway. That's why his manager refused to let him fight Gibbons or Tunney. Wills was big and not particularly fast, the type of opponent Dempsey feasted on. I'd say Dempsey by KO within 3-4 rounds, even if they fought in 1918 or '19. And I think Tunney won those fights with his reflexes; I agree with your prediction had they fought earlier when Dempsey was younger and quicker.
dempsey00 11 months ago
Joe Louis was the best!
AcucarAmargoorBitter 1 year ago
joe louis the perfect uncle tom
jack johnson the most courageous of em all
sayanroy36 1 year ago
Maybe they handed Joe Louis a script telling Joe Louis how to behave, but he was a class act and a true gentleman naturally.
Chuckernut5 1 year ago
Shut the fucking hell up. Blacks are more dominant in boxing because they are poorer than whites, don't get the education they need, have nothing and thus turn to boxing. They put in more effort because It's the only thing they have.
Whites get education and don't turn to boxing because they don't need to. Are you forgetting Marciano? Gene Tunney? Yes I guess so. I've seen black boxers being bullied by white boxers. The boxer is good not because of skin pigmenation, racist fools!
TheDommeran 1 year ago
@TheDommeran we're not talking about skin color IDIOT, we're talking about blood heritage, NATIONALITY, and YES it's a fact that NEGROES are better and STRONGER THAN WHITE FOLK
washingyou 1 year ago
@washingyou Really? Explain why the heavyweight division has been dominated for almost a decade and is still dominated by eastern Europeans? It really does has to much to do with who is hungry at the time. The Irish, Jews, blacks, latinos have all had their periods of time where they dominated boxing.
andrewr62 1 year ago
I can't believe the Ali people are here. Your boy wasn't that good. Get the fuck out of here with that "would have never caught" bullshit. Jack Johnson might kill Ali, and Joe Louis is way too good with the left hook, right uppercut, counter jab combo. Seriously? Ali? wtf did Ali ever do to make some one think he could handle Jack fucking Johnson bombs. Ali would look stupid trying to rope-a-dope Jack. He's got no attack for Joe, Joe ain't slow and he ain't weak, and that combo would work
MrRoccoMarchegiano 1 year ago
@MrRoccoMarchegiano I agree, JJ would have handled Joe Louis. His footwork was better than Louis's IMO.
hazmat1000 1 year ago
1:46, wft....thats creepy as fuck
doug2bitemore 1 year ago
Ha! Johnson is the greatest fighter ever. He was the negro champion from 1903-1908 and fought the likes of lanford, mckvey,willis,jeanette, walcott at least 4 times a piece and won. All of those fighters and many more he fought would have been world champions.along with fighting all white fighters all over the world. From 1903-1915 he was champion. 12 years enough said.
mandeville1985 1 year ago
nice to c people are focusing on the boxing and not the pointless ness off coloure i love boxing a iam a fighter but i think there is no such thing as a iorn jaw but in stead a well trained anthaleat how is conditioned fighter how can well from a haymaker but you might have over looked that a lot of fights go to l8ter rounds after tking so many punches wouldent that make most fighters have a iorn jaw
88messy88 1 year ago
@88messy88 I have no idea what you just said. English please?
bptaylor11 1 year ago
what programme is this from?
05credito 1 year ago
lois was 10x the puncher of massively overrated jack..get real..jack hit willard a zillian times with no kd and smaller dempsey killed willard..lois would ko him rite away
finetubs 1 year ago
jack johnson is one of my favourite boxers because he had balls and courage .he was the baddest motherfucker in that time like ali and tyson later. he had fought against the racist society he was his own man and he didnt care what white people would say but i have to admit that joe louis was the greatest ever he had speed,tremendous punch,skills and a big heart he was the most complete heavyweight ever in my opinion
arr443 1 year ago
@arr443 Guess I have to disagree, Johnson looks like he was far superior athletically over Louis and was just as fast with his hands. Johnson was also bigger than Louis. Both Johnson and Jim Jeffries were far superior size wise for heavyweights in the early 1900s.
hazmat1000 1 year ago
It's says a lot about the mentality of people that they consider their champion boxer to be the representative of their hopes and hatred.
nitramgnal 1 year ago
That's a winning smile.
nitramgnal 1 year ago
WOW!In My Eye's?Joe Louis without a doubt....Louis had a better record and he fought black fighters...Johnson refused to fight black fighters the man was a bonafide bitch if u ask me.....Louis 27 title defences 12 years has Johnson done that?
JesseThe16 1 year ago
@JesseThe16 Johnson held the negro heavyweight title from 1903 to 1908. Where he fought all the tough black fighters that the white fighters were affraid to fight. Louis had 25 defenses. Johnson fought far more black fighters.
RayPFP 1 year ago
@RayPFP
Yep and no one ever wants to bring this up but Joe Louis really didn't have a cast-iron jaw. Whenever he faced an opponent who could take what he dished out, he ended up losing more often than not (Braddock being the exception but he did knock JL on his ass for the 2nd time in his pro career after Schmelling did it first). So the chin factor would really be the deciding factor and Johnson had a legendary chin and I think that would edge out Louis in the end.
zyphoid666 1 year ago
Joe Louis was the first black heavy weight boxing champion to fight black contenders also. Jack Johnson refused to fight black boxers once he became champion.
It's a fact.
JJHusker 1 year ago
@JJHusker he fought a black man for the title. It was vs Jim Johnson in Paris in 1911
eslubin 1 year ago
jack Johnson was the baddest dude to ever hold the HW crown. As hated as he was and high as the stakes and consequences were he lived the life he wanted and apologized to nobody
amensupremera 1 year ago
What was the title of this video? I'd like to see all of it.
cedspud 1 year ago
jacks the man
Blackjesus3 1 year ago
louis would murder johnson
aschindler22 1 year ago
hey look nigga, I am black, and joe louis said in hid AUTObiography that he had alot of native,blood in him, but that black folks are always trying to be indian, or whatever they were not, so he didnt advertise it, you can look at him and see that.
bassreeves1965 1 year ago
dude i just watched this 3 1/2 hour movie 2 days ago ey i have a hard time findin his fights but in the doc he looked real good one of the few truly technical slick guys from that far back
imsweetasallheezy 2 years ago
joe louis was almost half native american, but he never talked about it, because blacks were always trying to be something that they were not.
bassreeves1965 2 years ago
How can you be almost dumb ass he was black stop trying to take our shine if he had an ounce of white we wouldnt be talking about him!!!
methodmaned 1 year ago
Also i disagre that Louis would beat Ali. Flat footed Louis would never catch ALI all night and if he did Ali took a great punch. Ali had the right style to beat louis. Ali would beat Johnson aswell but this could be close as they both had similarities. I agree Johnson would defeat Louis. Johnson was one of the most intelligent boxers of all time like Ali.
greatest902 2 years ago
i think his flat footedness wouldnt matter..alli has trouble blocken the jab like agaisnt ken norton...joe louis i think would win a decision
aschindler22 1 year ago
UGLY444 I disagree that Ali didn't have great stamina compared to Johnson. It's true in Johnson's time they faught 40 rounds but they faught at a much slower pace, were flat footed, hardly threw combinations, lot's of clinches compared to Ali's time. Ali in his prime could dance for 15 rounds this requires a lot of stamina. I'm sure if ALI faught in Johnson's time he could box 40 rounds it' s all state of mind.
greatest902 2 years ago
Thats one fight i'd love to see ,Joe had more offense but Jack was the best defensive fighter ever. I'd make joe a 6-5 favorite.
TheRichmich 2 years ago
Johnson would destroy Louis !! Johnson was like Ali,not so fast but hits much harder and he had much much much more stamina !! he could fight for 30or 40 rounds at a high level and hits very hard..thats why i think,he would beat louis. I dont think ali could beat lousi,cause Ali couldn't hold his speed for 15 rounds and louis would catch him and hurt him and win the later rounds.but louis wouldnt be able to catch Johnson beacause of johnsons superior stamina,clevernes and movement.
ugly444444 2 years ago
Louis is a underrated fighter. Louis belongs in the top 4 pound for pound boxers of all time. Louis had more skill, power, accuracy and precision. He would have beaten Johnson.
Sdeleman1 2 years ago
joe louis being trained to act white?
what a stupid thing to say
he wasn't allowed to act white or black
DonaldBumsfeld 2 years ago
Joe Louis wasn`t allowed to be himself. Case point, Louis LOVED watermelon, however his handlers,advisors did not want ANY pictures showing him eating watermelon, for fear it woud re-enforce a negative sterotype of blacks and watermelon !
7980COOL1 2 years ago 2
I would put Jack Johnson ahead of Joe Louis. Louis would have came forward and Johnson would have tied him up, caught his punches on the gloves, moved around and frustrated him. If Louis got a few of his trademark hooks through who knows but I think Jack Johnson would have been too clever
chunkyscotty 2 years ago
Jack Johnson at the time he beat T.Burns vs Joe Louis when he beat Schmeling....holy crap, that would have been a fight, some how I still see it like a points win for Jack, but if Louis gets in one of those right hand bombs who knows. What do you guys think?
speddyg 2 years ago
@speddyg I would bet on Jack Johnson. The best defensive HW there ever was with plenty of speed and brain to beat anyone.
hazmat1000 2 years ago
Fuck what they think Jack Johnson was that dude. Joe Louis was an UNCLE TOM.
777Paully 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
you kiddin me?
intoccabile 2 years ago
black or white there is nothing wrong with being humble.people tend to stay on your side longer.
reg5381 2 years ago
I prefer Jack johnson. Jack johnson had a better boxing brain and didn't give a shit about anyone. Even jack blackburn Louis' manager who fought as a lightweight in johnson's era said Jack would beat Louis everyday of the week and twice on sunday and he disliked Johnson.
greatest902 2 years ago 2
"When Joe Louis asked Lena Horne, with whom he was then having a relationship, to keep score for him at a Hollywood golf benefit, the singer refused -- she was entertaining troops that day. Joe hit her with a left hook. Then he started to choke her. In his 1978 autobiography, written with Edna and Art Rust Jr., Louis said that the only thing that saved Lena's life was an aunt in the next room who threatened to call the police."
MrPalspal 2 years ago
That is some fucked up repugnant shit how white people portrayed Jack Johnson. I'm white but, my family isn't from here. 2nd gen polish on my dads side and 3rd or 4th gen irish on my mothers. Racism will never die. I'm completely convinced of that. Jack Johnson didn't give a shit and good for him he rubbed white's faces in his GLORY! Fuckin racist pigs.
Kostly 2 years ago
everyones a racist including you
and it will never die so just cope with it, this was what 60 years ago?
Forget about it.
veothrax 2 years ago
i think that jonhson would win
consta4891 2 years ago
Not "to act white" - but to seem humble, gentle and extremely nice - like we all want to be, to be liked by all.
fuhmeregan 2 years ago 2
Joe Louis was an uneducated Uncle Tom. Read about the lack of respect he gave Jack Johnson because the white man told him to. Joe Louis died a heroin addict. Jack Johnson died the way he lived -- fast!
abdullahthebutcher 2 years ago
joe louise was no uncle tom...his wit put to the sword any thrash that whitie may have had to say,joe was pound for pound the greatest ever boxer.
tommyboy21916 2 years ago
Joe Louis had a bum of the month club.
warrkrymez 2 years ago
@warrkrymez He just made everyone look like a bum, He was that good.
longslenderbody 6 months ago
@tommyboy21916
Very true. Joe Louis wasn't an Uncle Tom. He was simply a man who did what he had to get where he needed to go. Jack Johnson in the early 1900s made Black Fighters look like devils in racist America. Louis couldn't flaunt, and he had good management earlier on*, not so much later on, and they told him and he knew that to get respect for his people, he would have to work the system and be a great fighter.
This video, which I saw on tv 100x, says it all.
tftmc 1 year ago
Bert Sugar said it best in a couple interviews where he said basically, different immigrants and people of non-anglo ethnicity had to prove themselves to white America, and many times that is through boxing.
In Berts's words, first it was the Irish in the late 1800s, than Blacks, than Jews, and the last 20-30 years different Spanish ethnic groups, from Mexicans to Puerto Ricans, to Panamanians like Duran. It's odd how boxing has a huge effect on society.
tftmc 1 year ago
@tommyboy21916
Can't agree with ya on that, Ray Robinson was for me
waller1101 9 months ago
Man joe louis was an uncle tom
ybiru2009 2 years ago
nah Joe Louis wasn't an Uncle Tom...he did what he had to do in the ring...Louis was a shy guy...he would have never gloated in or out of the ring anyway...Johnson was the opposite of Louis.
Obama4Mankind 2 years ago
wow whiteboys were such poor sports back then
walmartian555 2 years ago
my god that punch at 0:07 is fucking crazy
frombris 2 years ago
When whites get pissed, you better run boy.
teawead 2 years ago
shut your pie hole Monkey
theolympiclifter 2 years ago
Ohh look, one of them is pissed. Boy, i will knock you out.
teawead 2 years ago
whites never fight alone
tastyscabs 2 years ago
hhaha, only the racist ones.
teawead 2 years ago
WHy do people always say that Ali has Parkinsons because of Boxing??? How many fights did Michael J. Fox have?
And look at Alis career.... He didnt get hit nearly as much as others-Frazier, Chuvalo, Bonavena, Quarry. None of these guys have, or had, Parkinsons. Point is, peopel say Ali got it from Boxing because he is a household name with a disease. I think he would have gotten it anyways.
salbitre 2 years ago 3
its true what your saying but boxing didnt help it
allsports011 2 years ago 3
Very true. Taking repeated shots to the head cant really help anything. Im just saying that if boxing was THE cause for parkinsons, plenty more boxers would have it before Ali. Ali was actually hit alot less than the average fighter, even less than most great fighters, so I dont think boxing is the number one reason as to why he has the disease.
salbitre 2 years ago 2
actually parkinson's and alzheimers is known to be common to boxers. no one knows y though. besides of course getting walloped in the head
walkdeep 2 years ago
Freddy Roach also has Parkisons disease at 50 years old...a very brutal styled boxer who took a lot of shots and now a hall of fame trainer.
Obama4Mankind 2 years ago
It's difficult to believe that Ali's ring career didn't contribute in some way to his present condition. He took some serious poundings towards the end of his career, especially with the rope-a-dope tactics he liked to use. The Foreman, Frazier, Shavers and Norton fights were particularly bad, but also Wepner, Spinks, Lyle, Holmes etc.
FlaviusConstantius 2 years ago
Ali had more than Parkinson`s though.
He also has damage to the frontal lobe of his brain that affects speed and motor functions.
Even Micheal J Fox can speak better than that. He has the symptoms of Parkinson`s.
Ofcourse Ali has damage from boxing.
He fought killers for almost 20 years.
ExplosiveThinMan 2 years ago 2
Michal j fox got parkinson because o traveling thru time!
Molosserfreund 2 years ago 4
@Molosserfreund that was random. lol :D
PowerFlash82196 1 year ago
was there any other great black fighters we missed out on from the same era? who were held back from title fights coz of the need for a great white hope?
gardon86 2 years ago
Jack would've boxed th ears off Joe Louis. He had too much speed, skill and cunning. He was very well rounded, whereas Louis was strictly a bomber.
beenoon 3 years ago
Man... obviously, nobody can ever know for sure. But I'm forced to believe that the top fighters in some ways get better over time. I suspect that Joe Louis was objectively better than Jack Johnson, at least a little bit.
I'm glad I don't have to like one to the exclusion of the other. These are both two of my favourite champs of any weight division of all time. But I have to admit, despite how much I love Joe Louis, Jack Johnson is something of a sentimental favourite of mine.
IgnatzKolisch 2 years ago
well said. however i account for the fact that any given fighter would adapt to a later era having the advantage of evolved training and technique..
Joe was great, but you can clearly see that Jack J had the speed, conditioning, athleticism, quickness, reflexes and just overall cunning and ring mastery that would have translated well in any era, including this one...
beenoon 2 years ago 2
very well stated! IMO Jack Johnson was the greatest heavyweight of all time.
judaschongo 2 years ago
Comment removed
TheBoilermakr 2 years ago
Ali= The Greatest (the guy pretty much changed sports forever)!! Joe Louis= Best Heavyweight (conventional style: jab, right-hand, left- hook)! JL was the people's champ! Rocky Marciano= Hardest hittting and toughest to beat (I mean that literally too)!! Jack Johnson= A Boxing God!!! (inside the ring of course).. JJ had a flawless defense with "cat-like" reflexes.. Inside the ring the guy was way ahead of his time man, comparing him to JL doesn't make sense to me...
Grady1627 3 years ago 3