History is doomed to repeat itself, and it is happening right here and now in the U.S.
Everything that went wrong in the U.S can be tracked back to the 1900s, especially during the Red Scare. People are indoctrinated into believing things that were not true.
Examples: U.S use only capitalism. U.S is a Christian nation. U.S is the only free country.
All these lies added up through generations and came to bite us in the ass.
abortion is a form of sacrifice, so according to his logic, those who submit to an abortion are following his old testament decree. Xtian right believe that fetus is a live so aborting/killing/sacrificing is fulfilling bible.
@martiandog89 There aren't different sides to evidence. How am I closed minded? You are the one that believes in unsubstantiated mythology. You are the one who exchanges knowledge for religion, not me. Yes, I am secular, but I am a conservative and almost always vote republican. Nice try, with the liberal slander. As people, the human species, are becoming smarter, we have less need for religion. You think I have a disgusting nature, that's a nice judgement for a religious person.
I've got proof for this yahoo that what he said isn't true.My mother *never* had an abortion..and my little brother was born with autism and CP. ppl like him piss me off bc they read the Bible and don't do any friggin' research to the context behind what they're saying..God never said *anything* about abortion.He was quite fond of it in the OT 'the ppl of Sumeria have earned their guilt.you shall rip open their pregnant women and dash their little ones against the stones'.
@MCrushala That you shall set apart unto the LORD all that opens the womb, and every firstling that comes of a beast which you have; the males shall be the LORD'S.
13And every firstling of a donkey you shall redeem with a lamb; and if you will not redeem it, then you shall break its neck: and all the firstborn of man among your children shall you redeem.
Didn't those first born animals being 'dedicated to the Lord' mean that those animals were to be sacrificed to God as a faith offering that God would continue to allow the wombs of their livestock to be fertile?
"Reason must be deluded, blinded, and destroyed. Faith must trample underfoot all reason, sense, and understanding, and whatever it sees must be put out of sight and ... know nothing but the word of God."
The mythological deity of Christian cult has murdered 24,634,205 in their Bible.
And you Christians feel good worshiping and sticking up for that horrid monster? And you say your a Christian and proud! PROUD to have a delusion of that magnitude and support an indoctrination system that those leaders should be tried for crimes against humanity?
Bat-shit insane. Religion is dead. It just doesn't know it.
And questions have killed it. The one thing that it cannot stand up to. Scrutiny.
@martiandog89 Of course I care about people, that's why I want to do away with religion/mythology. Human aren't a primitive species anymore, it's not healthy for people to believe in things that don't have evidence. We are smarter than that.
@MrKGatl Everything you are saying is based on your own opinion and you choose to have one way of looking at evidence. You are a closed-minded person with secular-liberal views and personally i believe your claims to victory in your truth make you even more narrow-minded since you believe you are credible for dismissing views for the "less primitive human species". You don't consider many things of existence in the way that more wise person does, however, maybe your disgusting nature is correct.
@dancingnancy09 You can't prove anything in the Bible. There is no way a christian can say anything about the world we live in and the bible in the same sentence without making the atheist community angry.
How interesting that in a Virginia State Office a member of the LGBT community, in a management role, could hypothetically fire a "straight" person because they weren't gay. How ironic that a prejudicial law, ends up potentially being a tool for prejudice against the group he was trying to protect. Fail.
Seriously, it's almost 2012 and religious fanatics have been saying shit like this for hundreds of years. How have we not yet tacked on that they're full of shit? How are atheists still a minority in every country on the planet? Just what the fuck is wrong with people?
Also, the fact that God has a special place in his heart for children is a CENTRAL TENANT OF CHRISTIANITY. God would NEVER punish a child for its mother's actions, bc children are INNOCENT. The fact that some Christians believe this juts shows you that a lot of Christians don't read their Bibles. This is SUNDAY SCHOOL stuff ppl...smh
@sirjames45 I'm a Christian and I've never been preached to about abortion. I also don't recall reading anything in the New Testament about gay people, and yet God seems to love this pro choice, pro gay rights lefty all the same ( :
@bemyspaced It says let the unjust be unjust, let the filthy be filthy, let the righteous be righteous be righteous, and the holy be holy until the coming of Christ. Please do not think that Christianity has anything to do with Hinduistic beliefs, we don't believe in karma. God loves everyone and hates sin and any human who goes their own way has definitely put their self at odds with the possibility of the creator and our godma states that he will come to judge all before earth has passed away
@sirjames45 God (i'm pretending hes real for sake of argument) has killed off 50% of the human population since our existence before they were old enough to read the bible. He created a horrible reproductive system for the children he "loves" that causes 1/3 of all women to experience at least one miscarriage in their lifetime. and your telling me the abortionists are the murderers??? do some actual research and you will realize god kills more babies than we do...
@xXDISASTERPIECE934Xx I am pretty sure that childbirth is a very difficult part of human life and it does not disprove God. Death will come to all humans for dust ye are and to dust you will return. I'm not spitting bible jargon at you, I just think these arguments should never be stated in front of knowledgeable Christian because they are non sequitur on so many levels that I almost think it would not be worth arguing with you.
Seriously, it's almost 2012 and religious fanatics have been saying shit like this for hundreds of years. How have we not yet tacked on that they're full of shit? How are atheists still a minority in every country on the planet? Just what the fuck is wrong with people?
I appreciate him revealing Christianity for what it is... A primitive bronze age philosophy of ignorance that has no place in a modern peaceful world.
I'm a Christian and I think that VA State Delegate should be ashamed of himself. Men like him shouldn't represent anything. Not a state, not a country, and definitely not any kind of Church or religion.
at 0.02 wut? oh it gets sooo much better by 0.13 8-| So God is punishing women by making their firstborn children crippled ? perhaps note that an aborted fetus is not a born anything.
How many Israelites in the uSA, hands up so I can count . Tourists put your hands down . thanks.
@PlanetOfTheAtheist you should be ashamed of yourself. you sound no better then the christains wanting to deport muslims. so what if they believe in god.
I have a question.... If a person identifies themselves not as a man or a woman, but as a "gay" or "homosexual" man or woman, why can you not than take their orientation into consideration? I don't identify myself as a heterosexual man. I identify myself as a man. If you identify yourself as one thing or another, you are drawing a line in the sand. I don't see why it's OK for you to identify yourself as something, yet not OK to take that identify into consideration when offering employment.
I have many American friends, it was decided a long time ago to not discuss American politics and the religious zealots within their country. It causes too many arguments, and it embarrasses them. I fear that the 50% of America that is not anti-intellectual will have their voices drowned out by Gods flock of fucking morons. For an example, see Maddows ratings against those of the dip shits on Fox.
Turn out the lights on the way out, your empire is no more.
@mjfnicolson the original america, (I'm referring to after the revolution) is gone... After the founding fathers died religious morons took over. I hope everyday that we will have a religious revolution and return to our secular roots, but i know that cannot be a peaceful movement.
@mjfnicolson I don't think this man is correct in what he says, but your comments about Christianity and its adherents do not serve to make you look more intelligent.
@martiandog89 I never wanted or sought your opinion. I stand by what I say, even in the face of intellectual ombudsman you have presented yourself as. America is transforming, if its has not already fully developed into, the most dangerous country on the planet. As crazy as any country it invades to spread their brand of Christian "Freedom" but done with a white face and "supported" by the right God.
@mjfnicolson I live in America, born and raised, and love my country, but George Carlin was right when he said, "People in America are DUMB!" I went to a book store recently, the Christianity/religion section was about 8 or 9 bookshelves long right up against the main wall. The science section? 3 small bookshelves in the very back corner of the store next to the bathrooms. You actually have to go out of your way to find the science section. We're doomed.
I think its time to pull the plug on America before these Jesus freaks kill us all. They possess enough weaponry to destroy the global population many times over, how long until a REAL religious nut get into the White House, not like that monkey Bush who used these mindless bible thumpers to win elections.
@PlanetOfTheAtheist This is the biggest problem with people like you who think there is no God and most of us who believe in God. We just leave you along. With respect please tell me what you think is wrong or the problem with Christians.
@goohuman ,that old bitch theresa was no saint .She loved keeping people in poverty .Have you seen her orphanages ,i have seen racehorses kept in better conditions .She was a lying old witch ,and she wasnt a mother
I fail to see how an individual's sxuality affects that person's ability to execute their job in a governement office or department. It makes no sense at ll and really puts the governement at a disadvantage.
When gay people fight for the country in times of war, we are often reminded that htey are fighitng for our freedoms. I have to ask whose freedoms are they fighting for? Because they certainly don't have the same ones as everyone else.
WTF! These retards are no better than the Muslim fundamentalists in some countries who want to run their country by sharia law. Americans need to wake up & put a stop to this BS before the religious fruitcakes try to take over altogether.
It's okay if the Bible doesn't make sense to people who don't want to believe in it. It's okay if you want to ridicule peoples' beliefs. Just don't bitch when the pendulum swings and it's your turn to be out of favor and your opinion is squashed.
You have a vote. Use it. Don't classify this guy as Christian and suggest he is wrong because of his values. There are a lot of Christians out there and they don't all think alike.
Well his values tell him to discriminate against gays and he got those values from the bible. If the bible said honor thy queer neighbor for he is close to the lord then I'm sure he wouldn't be saying what he says. Many christians have surpassed the bible in terms of morality (I dare say most christians have) and thus pick only what they consider nice bits like the golden rule. I even think most christians would be able to write a more moral book than the bible.
@omegavalerius We don't decide what is moral. Morality exists beyond us. I don't believe you can veer from God and come up with a better morality.
That being said, Christians interpret the Bible differently. Paul writes homosexual behavior is a sin, and so is fornication (before marriage), adultery, etc. He states it pretty strictly, just before he says we all fall into (at least) one of these categories, but were washed clean of our sins by Christ.
@omegavalerius ... that God made all of us, killers and clergy alike. It is our choice to listen and obey, or go our own way.
Bob Marshall may believe himself a Christian and interpret his mission as identifying sin and allowing gov to make judgement on others based on that particular sin. I would remind him that he himself is a sinner and was forgiven.
Rachel doesn't get it. This is only bad for someone if they want to be able to offend others openly. That's not good regardless the morality.
@omegavalerius ... that God made all of us, killers and clergy alike. It is our choice to listen and obey, or go our own way.
Bob Marshall may believe himself a Christian and interpret his mission as identifying sin and allowing gov to make judgement on others based on that particular sin. I would remind him that he himself is a sinner and was forgiven.
Rachel doesn't get it. This is only bad for someone if they want to be able to offend others openly. That's not good regardless the morality.
@Goohuman True, but christianity still made this monster and because of his christian "values" he gets a sizable portion of the ballot. Christians might not all be backward, but christianity creates these sort of people--that much is undeniable. Televangelists aren't making money because of the well educated after all.
@Figaera69 No, sir. Christianity did not make any monsters. Monsters use whatever they can to justify what they do. Christians who actually read the Bible would get that they are supposed to be forgiving, kind, help others in need and always love one another.
But I don't see why you call Bob a monster. He doesn't like abortion and he rewrote the non-discrimination clause to exclude homosexuals? Is that it? He has his view. He isn't killing anyone. Abortions actually DO kill people.
@Goohuman So he was born with the idea that god punishes the progeny of women who had an abortion? Christianity is completely unrelated. Or the governor that made it legal to discriminate against homosexuality in the work place (This guy's the monster, Bob's just an idiot). It wasn't christianity that told him that homosexuals were an abomination against god and should be persecuted? Not all christians are the same, but christianity is pathway that makes these sort of people. It happens.
@Figaera69 Funny you should say that. Christians have been protecting homosexuals, the lepers and every other outcast. It's always the self-righteous that persecute them. If you want to single out a belief system that ACTUALLY KILLS homosexuals, take a look at Islam.
The Bible does condemn homosexuality. It is a sin. It also says we are all sinners and we should help each other to be better people. Christianity is the path away from bad behavior, not towards it.
@Goohuman Umm, " Leviticus 20:13 If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They must be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads." Therefore christianity did put that idea in his head. Islam didn't (even if the only thing christianity has going for it is that it isn't Islam).
So I am a college student in Virginia and an Atheist... I live with my evangelical parents... They don't know I am atheist... If they knew I would not have a place to live and would likely have to drop out of school... Just to put Virginia in perspective for everyone.
And for eternal suffering are you willing to take the risk. Sure you can ask God for forgiveness, but by going into the whole ordeal with that mindset.... He knows your heart and knows your intentions to do wrong and just ask for forgiveness later.... A human judge may forgive that, but God?? I'm not judging you.... just God....
@jecsse4 Yeah, if yahweh turns out to be real he's going to have a lot more to answer for than I will and if his answers were satisfactory to me then I would join him if not I would ask to be exiled. But either way I cannot imagine a god who would damn me or anyone else for all eternity. That's just childish and petty. Anyway, yes, I'll take the risk and won't be asking for any forgiveness but from those I wrong themselves should it come up. Also religious politicians scare me not yahweh.
@jecsse4 You miss the point. Atheists can't help it. The idea of a god just seems silly and improbable. I can't pretend to believe, I just don't. Belief is not a choice, you're either convinced or you're not.
Forget politics here. It shouldn't be an issue. Deep down, everyone knows that killing a living, breathing infant is wrong (let alone any other human being). But if that is your choice, may God have mercy on you. It is not my place or job to judge you, so I won't, but someday God will judge you based on your life lived on Earth. If that doesn't frighten you, nothing will, but you will have to face it and saying that eternity is a long time doesn't do "eternity" justice. It is eternal suffering.
@jecsse4 I think bringing in an unloved child into a life of poverty is a worse sin than aborting him (or in my opinion "it"--at that point in development it barely counts as an organism, let alone a human being). In some cases death is known as the gift of mercy and would be the responsible thing to do. What if the baby is the result of rape? Or if the child would cost you your education? What if having a kid would be literally hazardous to your health? Where does your god draw the line?
@Figaera69 Here you argue the value of abortion. I'm glad you are so clear on this issue, especially since you can't possibly know what the future holds for you or the child you are ready to sacrifice to improve your odds of getting a good job.
Let me point out the obvious. Your position is amoral. Death of a child my benefit you, but if we all believe as you do, you may find yourself on the short end of amoral thought. Assuming all have the right to live protects you too.
@Goohuman Why don't you reply to the comment I actually sent you? Or why don't you consider the scenario where the unborn child is the result of rape? My comment was designed to be cynical and extreme. My actual view point is that the fetus is not a human being until the first neurons develop and connect. Before that it's no more a person than an used tampon. Even then, abortion is not something to do lightly--but there are circumstances in which it's a good option. Calling me a criminal. Pfft.
@Figaera69 Oh I did. I'm more than happy to expose ALL your poor, selfish, amoral ideas. Keep reading my older posts and I'm sure you will find it.
Your comparison of a fetus to a "used tampon" is classic amoral thought. If you have sex and for some odd reason a new life begins because of it, you figure that the place to correct the problem is not with your lack of responsibility to the woman or the sex act, but the life growing in some woman's womb.
@Goohuman Actually you didn't. The one I quote leviticus is still unchallenged. You call me amoral yet you're the one that has to resort to insults to try and get a point across. You don't even address where I define when the fetus becomes a person. More over you don't discuss any of the extenuating circumstances that justify abortion, what about rape?. You're the one that has to grow up with your petty absolutism, the world isn't black and white.
@Figaera69 Of course I didn't "challenge" the Bible. I agree with it. I said so.
Amoral describes you views to a T. It is not an insult, just pointing out the facts. In being amoral your logic fails outside of your skin. That creates poor ideas that are specifically selfish in nature. Those aren't insults. Just stating exactly how that thinking works.
Regarding rape, etc, if the woman is pregnant against her will AND she nor her family are willing or able to care for the child, abort away.
@Goohuman Well, it's good to see that you are willing to see some middle ground. And the amoral part isn't the insult (although it is a rather poor description), the insult is the rest of the adjectives you use in conjunction such as selfish, poor and criminal. There are times were abortion is acceptable, that was my point and finally you conceded. And the purpose behind the leviticus quote was to illustrate how christianity is bigoted against homosexuality, the point you were contesting before.
@Figaera69 Yes, and thank you for not saying that Christians are bigoted against homosexuals. We believe it is a sin, but the sinner is not the problem, the sin is.
Let me explain why a criminal has to be amoral. Laws are based on common or natural law. We as citizens must accept the law to live in peace with each other. A criminal dismisses the law and does what they believe is right. They think the law doesn't apply to them because they are "truly free".....
@Goohuman Also, what do you mean by "your logic fails out of your skin." Been trying to make sense of that, but ironically enough logic fails me here. I also fail to see why do you insist that my ideas are amoral, there isn't a protected good that's being broken by abortion. It all depends on how you define "life". Moreover, it's immoral to bring a child into this world to starve or contract a lethal disease or to sacrifice an existing life for a potential one. Maybe you mean godless instead.
@Figaera69 .... but their freedom is specifically selfish. Where they see a car they like, they can justify taking it because they need it at that moment. We would see that as selfish and criminal thinking. They don't buy the common law so they are comfortable in their amoral judgement.
If you are thinking of what is good for you and not what is good for those around you, you are thinking selfishly. We all do it. But when we act on it, it becomes good or bad for all, not just yourself.
@Goohuman The point stands, christian bigots are the result of christianity. That's all well and good, but that doesn't show how my ideas are amoral. I just value the current life of the pregnant woman more than the potential life of a fetus. Especially when the consequences are obviously negative and foreseeable. What that implies is that the moral valorization is different but not non-existing, ethics and morality are based on human thought not ancient texts, that'd be crazy.
@Figaera69 Your point, if I understand it correctly, is that the religion of Christianity teaches bigotry. To that point, you have not made your point. If you are just calling Christians "bigots" because you disagree with them, then that makes you a bigot, by definition. Their bigotry is a sin, just like yours.
I would point out, no thinking human can KNOW what the future holds for the unborn, as much as you claim it is "foreseeable". Obvious wisdom survives and is preserved in "ancient texts"
@Goohuman Have you read leviticus and deuteronomy? If the bible is the word of god (as you believe), then your god commanded you to kill homosexuals. Isn't that intolerant discrimination because of a different view point? Isn't that christian value what motivated this nut-job into changing legislation?
I would point out science is all about making predictions. There are several assertions you can make based on your current situation and fiscal and medical facts concerning a child.
@Figaera69 Well there you go. God did NOT command me or any other Christian alive today to kill homosexuals. If you are going to interpret the Bible like that, there are ancient scientists that believe that the Sun revolves around the Earth. They were certain of it and had all the math worked out for it.
Me thinks you've been listening to radicals.
As for Bob, vote him out if you don't like it. Apparently, some people LIKE what he is doing and voted FOR him.
@Goohuman The problem is science does not claim to be an absolute source of morality. If the bible is the literal word of god, as christians believe, then whatever was written in the old testament should still be morally true. But it isn't. Stoning your kids is not okay under any circumstances, even if the bible says it is. Therefore, either the bible is not the word of god or god is not infallible. You don't need to be a radical, you just need to take the bible literally.
@Goohuman Also, " Obvious wisdom survives and is preserved in 'ancient texts' " I again ask, have you read leviticus and deuteronomy? I was raised a catholic, but it wasn't after I read the bible that I realized it was utter immoral nonsense. I'd hardly call stoning your children because they talked back wisdom. All the good things in the bible could be summarized in a sentence. The evil things though, those have several dedicated websites. Moreover, if it's obvious wisdom why keep it in a book?
@Figaera69 I'm reading through it again so that I can understand how you and the non-thinking Christians interpret the Old Testament to justify crazy stuff.
My perspective is thus: God wants what is best for us. We want what we want right now.
So right now, you want to bad-mouth Christianity and found some historical accounts showing barbarism in action. You dismiss the values the Bible teaches, the history of good Christians etc, because ... I dunno. You tell me. Why?
@Goohuman You're rationalizing what is written in the old testament. You're thinking god thinks like you. Since you're not a medieval middle eastern barbarian, but rather a reasonable modern westerner, then the old testament doesn't apply. You made the moral call, not god. Also, I'm not dismissing the value of some of the teachings of the bible, I accepted love thy neighbor was a good idea. I just don't deny the evils of the bible, they're there.
@Figaera69 You don't know the Bible at all. Even the stuff you think you know you don't know. God doesn't think. He knows. We are the ones who are clueless. Your solution is to just deny it. Mine is to recognize I don't know God's path, but I know what little I see of my own. I choose to follow the wisdom of what Christ taught and recall the ancient stories of the Jews as a historical record. God led Mother Theresa. I pray I can be 1/100th as good a follower as she was. Maybe a tenth?
@Goohuman I think you need to read the old testament again. It clearly says that god commanded the israelites to do heinous things, like killing children for cursing their parents and stoning rape victims because they didn't get help. That means that you're either ignoring god's will or his will isn't absolute. I don't deny my ignorance, I embrace it. I realize how little I know and strive to learn more. You choose to pretend to know things because they were written a long time ago.
@Figaera69 The historical accounts in the Old Testament do not tell us every bit of info needed to convince you of God's accuracy.
For example, Eisenhower ordered the destruction of every little building that was being used as a factory by the Germans, to include their inhabitants. That meant we were bombing homes in some cases. Was that just? I would say yes, if it meant the war was over faster. Killing those civilians meant fewer people would die. Just an example.
@Goohuman An example of what? I don't see your point. Anyway, I hope you read the old testament critically soon and sit to think about your faith. Maybe you'll be able to stop making excuses for your imaginary friend; if he's almighty he can take it.
@Figaera69 Your hard-headedness will be your downfall. I don't think any amount of my pointing out your logical fallacies will bring you to actually read the book you ridicule. You will just continue to believe the snipets you've heard or read about can only be evidence you're preconceived notions are justified.
For people like you, the truth will hurt so much that you may never accept it.
God loves us all. We need to remember that and we need to love each other as well. Especially our offspring. Regardless of reasons for pregnancy or mitigating circumstances, abortion should not have to made illegal because we should not be killing creatures of our own kind. You can claim any kind of right to your body or health that you want, but there is no excuse. The whole argument on health of the mother is ridiculous as well. What kind of mother wouldn't give her own life for her children?
@jecsse4 I can see your point. However, it really comes down to what you define as human. It is definitely wrong to kill another human being, but at what point do we become human? From your post, I would guess you believe that the fetus is human from conception. But not everyone sees it that way. I, for example, believe that what makes us human is our minds. So from my perspective, the fetus becomes a human when it can feel, and respond to stimuli. Before that, I don't consider it murder.
The bibles, old and new, were written by men. There is no question of that. And yet, somehow you believe that those very-human books detail an actual god.
There were historians alive during the claimed life of Jesus. It's just that none of them ever mentioned him.
If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide that proves they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument do you invoke to prove that they should value logic?
@Shoyudan Excellent point... However, the value of hearing the illogical reasoning and misrepresentations of reality such as this, allows intelligent, compassionate human beings to be able to converse openly about the shadowy, fear-driven hatred of those who are ignorant within society. The vocal extremists of the world can in fact show us the dangers of intolerance and serve as examples of the ways in which, if good folk are not diligent, that we can abuse, deny and neglect our fellow humans.
@Shoyudan Use their own filthy tactics against them. Make them scared, bribe them, and guilt them. It's the only way they understand when it comes to those topics. They are so used to rejecting logic and accepting appeals that, unfortunately, one needs to use it against them.
Wait. So you think it's odd and unnatural that "the universe came from nothing" (no scientist believes that by the way), and yet you have no problem with an all-powerful and knowing, invisible being coming from nothing. Huh.
Not that anyone really expects Christians to be consistent these days, but at least give it a try.
Sigh. So your evidence for the existence of Jesus is:
1. ONE, forged, TINY passage in the MASSIVE works of Josephus (a JEW who somehow called Jesus "a god") which somehow no-one noticed for 300 years, and which is called a forgery even by Christian historians; and
2. A historian who lived 130 years after the event.
I had an idea that you would struggle. I just didn't realise how much.
There's a reason that your words seem high on emotion but low on thought: They reflect you. You'll jump to any insult you can and you'll even capitalise it. Can you actually make a point though?
Ha! What a laugh. You can't find a SINGLE source to suggest that Jesus actually lived, aside from those who already believed in Christianity and had proven an interest in propagating the myth, and you have the gall to suggest others are "weakminded".
Historians of that era attested to wars, disease, disasters, and more, but you can't even find ONE that referred to a "god"?
Chronography, XVIII refers to writings by Thallus and Phlegon concerning the darkness during the Crucifixion:
On the whole world there pressed a most fearful darkness; and the rocks were rent by an earthquake, and many places in Judea and other districts were thrown down. This darkness Thallus, in the third book of his History, calls, as appears to me without reason, an eclipse of the sun...
If it's "true and written by historians" that a man called "Jesus Christ" lived 2,000 years ago and was crucified, please name and quote a historian, without resorting to a writer from the bible, who said so.
@arthurneddysmith OK. Jesus was mentioned by Josephus (A.D. 37 - c. A.D. 100) in his writings called Antiquities. Also mentioned by Tacitus (c. A.D. 55 - c. A.D. 117) in Annals, book XV: Also by Suetonius (c. A.D. 69 - c. A.D. 140) in Lives of the Caesars - Claudius, sec. 25:
Best of all was Julius Africanus (c. 160 - c. 240) Chronography, XVIII refers to writings by Thallus and Phlegon concerning the darkness during the Crucifixion:
@intrepidorator Ok, did you not notice that ALL your sources lived AFTER the fact? Some of them a century or so! They aren't CONTEMPORARIES of your supposed Jesus.
Oh and the Josephus reference has been proved to be a later insertion by Eusebius in the 4th century.
@ciaochowbella Yes I did notice that they lived after Jesus was alive, Most biographies are written after the person dies. The 4 gospels (which are eyewitness accounts) were written after Jesus was crucified. Jesus was the son of a carpenter who lived in an obscure part of Judea, Do you assume that the illiterate people of that time and age would have followed Him around with a stenographer. He was written about a few years after his crucifiction. But he was crucified. Its written in history.
@intrepidorator no they wrote it while they were alive...Luke was a doctor and spoke to eye witnesses to the events that took place Mark was a disciple of Peter who was a disciple of Jesus who was another eyewitness John was a disciple of Jesus and the books he wrote were after the Resurrection of Jesus Revelations was written while John was a prisoner on the Island of Patmos and remember this there are more than 6000 new testaments or fragments of the New testaments that have been found
@OOPS4U2CNOW sorry i thought i was replying to some one else and didn't notice till after i posted and then it was to late...this is what the education system is teaching today and if they can destroy our past they control the future and that is a very dangerous thing but very well planed out and working ---look at all the brain-dead followers of the Bamster
Bob Marshall, you should turn up to Sarah and Todd Palin's front door and tell them they are immoral "baby killers" because they have a disabled child. I'll pay for your ticket.
Or perhaps it's just time your children sent you off to a home for the elderly (and senile in this case), so you can stop insulting the citizens who you work for with your superstitious horseshit.
the exodus verse really means that children must be sacrificed to jehovah, just as firstborn animals were sacrificed. this was normal enough in antiquity that the bible recounts the story of jephtah, who sacrificed his own daughter ... and David also sacrificed several people atop a mountain to appease Jehovah and end a drought. Jesus was not the first human sacrificed celebrated in the Bible.
in Thomas Jefferson's letter to the Danbury Baptists Association in 1802. The original text reads: "...I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should 'make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof,'
We should have no qualm about scorning the self deluded, irrational, parasitic religious. They deserve no respect, only ridicule, disdain, and contempt. There ridicules beliefs are 1st century ignorance and fear at its worst. It is of the utmost importance for the health of civilization to eradicate the god virus. With information so easily available being ignorant today is by choice.
Perhaps you are merely a pathetic, feeble, doltish christian whom becomes upset when anyone pokes fun at your delusion. Now that is whats called intolerant rant, you fucking retard.
@scotttebben It has always been an intolerant rant, when it shows an inane intolerance. Name calling shows that you know you've lost the debate already..
@scotttebben that's a good come back, boy your smart, must keep you up nights looking at your self in the mirror, do you spend half your time being witty...with comebacks like that you must be a blast at parties..........................
@OOPS4U2CNOW As a result of digesting your comments, I conclude that your lack of intellect or cognitive skills simply implies further interaction would be of no interest.
I just finished watching "the Universe" on the history channel, and felt such awe of the vastness of the universe. Now watching this it brings me back to the stupid, shitty reality, in which primitive religions reign.
@rohanwotan2 really!!!! your the one who thinks that we came from nothing....that's right "NOTHING EXPLODED AND THAT'S HOW WE GOT HERE" REALLY AND YOU SAY WE CHRISTIANS ARE STUPID
BILLIONS OF YEARS THAT IS YOUR god...think on this...ever hear of "Limiting Factors" that blows about a billion holes in that theory you know the Theory of Evolution or as we stupid people say THE BIG LIE"
You have no idea what I do or do not think or believe. You assume thngs and simply show yourself to be an emotional fool.
According to xtians, their god cast various spells over the course of seven days to bring everything into existence. Magic. That's the explanation of the religious, simply magic: Goddidit!
You're an idiot. Please crawl back under your rock and hide in embarassment.
According to xtians, magic emanates from an invisible man in the sky that cares deeply about what we do with our genitals. It also comes from his son, who is also himself, along with a ghost, which is still him, but all three of these are still one, not three, even though they are three, but still one. As an added bonus, they throw in a virgin giving birth, talking snakes and donkeys and people living inside fish/whales for three days. It just doesn't get any more stupid.
Religions, as always, seek to take power.
History is doomed to repeat itself, and it is happening right here and now in the U.S.
Everything that went wrong in the U.S can be tracked back to the 1900s, especially during the Red Scare. People are indoctrinated into believing things that were not true.
Examples: U.S use only capitalism. U.S is a Christian nation. U.S is the only free country.
All these lies added up through generations and came to bite us in the ass.
Neosaigo 2 days ago
we are a DEMOCRACY. not a theology. if you want a theology based government, take a flight to Iran and have fun there.
Darcalott 1 week ago
@Darcalott Um....you mean 'theocracy' not 'theology'.
ciaochowbella 1 week ago
I seriously want to move to UK if these radical Jesus freaks are allowed to run for US office.
ThePhantom135 3 weeks ago
abortion is a form of sacrifice, so according to his logic, those who submit to an abortion are following his old testament decree. Xtian right believe that fetus is a live so aborting/killing/sacrificing is fulfilling bible.
glower125 3 weeks ago
@martiandog89 There aren't different sides to evidence. How am I closed minded? You are the one that believes in unsubstantiated mythology. You are the one who exchanges knowledge for religion, not me. Yes, I am secular, but I am a conservative and almost always vote republican. Nice try, with the liberal slander. As people, the human species, are becoming smarter, we have less need for religion. You think I have a disgusting nature, that's a nice judgement for a religious person.
MrKGatl 1 month ago
I've got proof for this yahoo that what he said isn't true.My mother *never* had an abortion..and my little brother was born with autism and CP. ppl like him piss me off bc they read the Bible and don't do any friggin' research to the context behind what they're saying..God never said *anything* about abortion.He was quite fond of it in the OT 'the ppl of Sumeria have earned their guilt.you shall rip open their pregnant women and dash their little ones against the stones'.
proud2bpagan 1 month ago
@proud2bpagan wow I missed that verse Where is that written?? I would really appreciate a response. thanks! :)
MCrushala 1 month ago
@MCrushala Exodus 13:1,13:12
proud2bpagan 1 month ago
@MCrushala That you shall set apart unto the LORD all that opens the womb, and every firstling that comes of a beast which you have; the males shall be the LORD'S.
13And every firstling of a donkey you shall redeem with a lamb; and if you will not redeem it, then you shall break its neck: and all the firstborn of man among your children shall you redeem.
proud2bpagan 1 month ago
@proud2bpagan Thank you! :)
MCrushala 1 month ago
They already do that here discreetly with housing..if you rent,you can put 'married couples or single ppl only'
proud2bpagan 1 month ago
Didn't those first born animals being 'dedicated to the Lord' mean that those animals were to be sacrificed to God as a faith offering that God would continue to allow the wombs of their livestock to be fertile?
proud2bpagan 1 month ago
"Reason must be deluded, blinded, and destroyed. Faith must trample underfoot all reason, sense, and understanding, and whatever it sees must be put out of sight and ... know nothing but the word of God."
-Martin Luther
Or Michelle Bachman. I forget which.
civwarfan 1 month ago
The mythological deity of Christian cult has murdered 24,634,205 in their Bible.
And you Christians feel good worshiping and sticking up for that horrid monster? And you say your a Christian and proud! PROUD to have a delusion of that magnitude and support an indoctrination system that those leaders should be tried for crimes against humanity?
Bat-shit insane. Religion is dead. It just doesn't know it.
And questions have killed it. The one thing that it cannot stand up to. Scrutiny.
civwarfan 1 month ago
@martiandog89 Of course I care about people, that's why I want to do away with religion/mythology. Human aren't a primitive species anymore, it's not healthy for people to believe in things that don't have evidence. We are smarter than that.
MrKGatl 1 month ago
@MrKGatl Everything you are saying is based on your own opinion and you choose to have one way of looking at evidence. You are a closed-minded person with secular-liberal views and personally i believe your claims to victory in your truth make you even more narrow-minded since you believe you are credible for dismissing views for the "less primitive human species". You don't consider many things of existence in the way that more wise person does, however, maybe your disgusting nature is correct.
martiandog89 1 month ago
Im so sick of christians actively publically lying-shit from the bible are not medical facts-dont go around telling stupid people that they are!
dancingnancy09 1 month ago
@dancingnancy09 You can't prove anything in the Bible. There is no way a christian can say anything about the world we live in and the bible in the same sentence without making the atheist community angry.
martiandog89 1 month ago
@martiandog89 yes I know that
dancingnancy09 1 month ago
How interesting that in a Virginia State Office a member of the LGBT community, in a management role, could hypothetically fire a "straight" person because they weren't gay. How ironic that a prejudicial law, ends up potentially being a tool for prejudice against the group he was trying to protect. Fail.
He7eroscedasticity 2 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Seriously, it's almost 2012 and religious fanatics have been saying shit like this for hundreds of years. How have we not yet tacked on that they're full of shit? How are atheists still a minority in every country on the planet? Just what the fuck is wrong with people?
kingachybraky 2 months ago
She's like the last bastion of a healthy human mind in America.
apfelipod 2 months ago
So if people who have kids with disabilities are being punished for having had an abortion, then I guess Sarah Palin must've had an abortion.
immoley 2 months ago
Also, the fact that God has a special place in his heart for children is a CENTRAL TENANT OF CHRISTIANITY. God would NEVER punish a child for its mother's actions, bc children are INNOCENT. The fact that some Christians believe this juts shows you that a lot of Christians don't read their Bibles. This is SUNDAY SCHOOL stuff ppl...smh
bemyspaced 2 months ago
@sirjames45 I'm a Christian and I've never been preached to about abortion. I also don't recall reading anything in the New Testament about gay people, and yet God seems to love this pro choice, pro gay rights lefty all the same ( :
bemyspaced 2 months ago
@bemyspaced It says let the unjust be unjust, let the filthy be filthy, let the righteous be righteous be righteous, and the holy be holy until the coming of Christ. Please do not think that Christianity has anything to do with Hinduistic beliefs, we don't believe in karma. God loves everyone and hates sin and any human who goes their own way has definitely put their self at odds with the possibility of the creator and our godma states that he will come to judge all before earth has passed away
martiandog89 1 month ago
@martiandog89 you stupid ass fairy tale believers crack me up.
MrKGatl 1 month ago 3
@MrKGatl You amuse me at how much you don't care.
martiandog89 1 month ago
@martiandog89 most importantly ....let the xians be batshit crazy!!!
milorosen 1 month ago
I am always stunned at the leftists being fine with innocent babies being murdered for CONVENIENCE. My how liberals "care" about others.
sirjames45 2 months ago
@sirjames45 God (i'm pretending hes real for sake of argument) has killed off 50% of the human population since our existence before they were old enough to read the bible. He created a horrible reproductive system for the children he "loves" that causes 1/3 of all women to experience at least one miscarriage in their lifetime. and your telling me the abortionists are the murderers??? do some actual research and you will realize god kills more babies than we do...
xXDISASTERPIECE934Xx 2 months ago
@xXDISASTERPIECE934Xx I am pretty sure that childbirth is a very difficult part of human life and it does not disprove God. Death will come to all humans for dust ye are and to dust you will return. I'm not spitting bible jargon at you, I just think these arguments should never be stated in front of knowledgeable Christian because they are non sequitur on so many levels that I almost think it would not be worth arguing with you.
martiandog89 1 month ago
In Virginia, Rachel Maddow could be fired from her job.
MenwithHill 2 months ago
The GOP is the bigotry party!
ginesdepasamonte 3 months ago 2
Seriously, it's almost 2012 and religious fanatics have been saying shit like this for hundreds of years. How have we not yet tacked on that they're full of shit? How are atheists still a minority in every country on the planet? Just what the fuck is wrong with people?
Stevie2Sxc 3 months ago 2
@Stevie2Sxc Not all countries. In the most peaceful nations, Atheism is the mainstay.
ridjenite 2 months ago
Wow. Just...wow.
Kalevala87 3 months ago
I appreciate him revealing Christianity for what it is... A primitive bronze age philosophy of ignorance that has no place in a modern peaceful world.
MyITRcom 3 months ago 2
religion is disgusting sometimes
mcdinkity 3 months ago
I'm a Christian and I think that VA State Delegate should be ashamed of himself. Men like him shouldn't represent anything. Not a state, not a country, and definitely not any kind of Church or religion.
houseofgaunt 3 months ago
at 0.02 wut? oh it gets sooo much better by 0.13 8-| So God is punishing women by making their firstborn children crippled ? perhaps note that an aborted fetus is not a born anything.
How many Israelites in the uSA, hands up so I can count . Tourists put your hands down . thanks.
SqueakerAlpha 3 months ago
@PlanetOfTheAtheist you should be ashamed of yourself. you sound no better then the christains wanting to deport muslims. so what if they believe in god.
lebronjamesXD 3 months ago
@PlanetOfTheAtheist
Thumbs Up if you find PlanetofTheAthiest's comment to be totalitarian and hypocritical.
help4343 4 months ago
I have a question.... If a person identifies themselves not as a man or a woman, but as a "gay" or "homosexual" man or woman, why can you not than take their orientation into consideration? I don't identify myself as a heterosexual man. I identify myself as a man. If you identify yourself as one thing or another, you are drawing a line in the sand. I don't see why it's OK for you to identify yourself as something, yet not OK to take that identify into consideration when offering employment.
hualni 4 months ago
@hualni It's because gay people are often discriminated against.
sptfgpn 3 months ago
@sptfgpn That isn't a response to my point. At least you tried I guess.
hualni 3 months ago
I have many American friends, it was decided a long time ago to not discuss American politics and the religious zealots within their country. It causes too many arguments, and it embarrasses them. I fear that the 50% of America that is not anti-intellectual will have their voices drowned out by Gods flock of fucking morons. For an example, see Maddows ratings against those of the dip shits on Fox.
Turn out the lights on the way out, your empire is no more.
mjfnicolson 4 months ago 28
@mjfnicolson LMAO brilliant post. as an american expat living in Germany i couldnt agree more!!!
Pisces31660 3 months ago
@mjfnicolson I HOPE you are not right but you may be you are at least close
It is almost impossible to have a discussion with people who's position is from a strictly emotional one
They dont like facts and when you prove them wrong they want to chide you for being intelligent
janinemichlib99 2 months ago
@mjfnicolson the original america, (I'm referring to after the revolution) is gone... After the founding fathers died religious morons took over. I hope everyday that we will have a religious revolution and return to our secular roots, but i know that cannot be a peaceful movement.
xXDISASTERPIECE934Xx 2 months ago
@mjfnicolson I don't think this man is correct in what he says, but your comments about Christianity and its adherents do not serve to make you look more intelligent.
martiandog89 1 month ago
@martiandog89 I never wanted or sought your opinion. I stand by what I say, even in the face of intellectual ombudsman you have presented yourself as. America is transforming, if its has not already fully developed into, the most dangerous country on the planet. As crazy as any country it invades to spread their brand of Christian "Freedom" but done with a white face and "supported" by the right God.
Sorry for not be intellect as you.
mjfnicolson 1 month ago
@mjfnicolson I live in America, born and raised, and love my country, but George Carlin was right when he said, "People in America are DUMB!" I went to a book store recently, the Christianity/religion section was about 8 or 9 bookshelves long right up against the main wall. The science section? 3 small bookshelves in the very back corner of the store next to the bathrooms. You actually have to go out of your way to find the science section. We're doomed.
MyloDude22 3 weeks ago
I think its time to pull the plug on America before these Jesus freaks kill us all. They possess enough weaponry to destroy the global population many times over, how long until a REAL religious nut get into the White House, not like that monkey Bush who used these mindless bible thumpers to win elections.
mjfnicolson 4 months ago 16
This has been flagged as spam show
If you believe in God and/or the Bible, you are either weak or an Idiot..or, the dreaded hybrid..
burnhardship 4 months ago
@PlanetOfTheAtheist This is the biggest problem with people like you who think there is no God and most of us who believe in God. We just leave you along. With respect please tell me what you think is wrong or the problem with Christians.
bnjones28 4 months ago
@goohuman ,that old bitch theresa was no saint .She loved keeping people in poverty .Have you seen her orphanages ,i have seen racehorses kept in better conditions .She was a lying old witch ,and she wasnt a mother
tontobones 4 months ago
God, I pray to you, let the next Pope be an Atheist
Defhrone 4 months ago
I fail to see how an individual's sxuality affects that person's ability to execute their job in a governement office or department. It makes no sense at ll and really puts the governement at a disadvantage.
When gay people fight for the country in times of war, we are often reminded that htey are fighitng for our freedoms. I have to ask whose freedoms are they fighting for? Because they certainly don't have the same ones as everyone else.
finitekosmos 4 months ago
why do people always argue in the comments with vids like this? jeez just watch the freakin video!
R963c 5 months ago
WTF! These retards are no better than the Muslim fundamentalists in some countries who want to run their country by sharia law. Americans need to wake up & put a stop to this BS before the religious fruitcakes try to take over altogether.
ACCSESS247 5 months ago
It's okay if the Bible doesn't make sense to people who don't want to believe in it. It's okay if you want to ridicule peoples' beliefs. Just don't bitch when the pendulum swings and it's your turn to be out of favor and your opinion is squashed.
naivetyenlivens 5 months ago
So, abortion is bad but child sacrifice is good?
csnowutube 5 months ago
@PlanetOfTheAtheist
I dont want youre brainless guys, so Greenland? OK!
MrJgraf 5 months ago
@PlanetOfTheAtheist Please don't, i'm not american and i don't want them to come here
Balmung3688 5 months ago
@PlanetOfTheAtheist Christians or those who proclaim to be Christinas. NOT the same thing! rather deport atheists!
jrwel14 5 months ago
Medieval ideas should've died with the dark ages, they have no place in the 21st century.
Figaera69 5 months ago
Typical BS from Maddow.
You have a vote. Use it. Don't classify this guy as Christian and suggest he is wrong because of his values. There are a lot of Christians out there and they don't all think alike.
Goohuman 5 months ago
@Goohuman
Well his values tell him to discriminate against gays and he got those values from the bible. If the bible said honor thy queer neighbor for he is close to the lord then I'm sure he wouldn't be saying what he says. Many christians have surpassed the bible in terms of morality (I dare say most christians have) and thus pick only what they consider nice bits like the golden rule. I even think most christians would be able to write a more moral book than the bible.
omegavalerius 5 months ago
@omegavalerius We don't decide what is moral. Morality exists beyond us. I don't believe you can veer from God and come up with a better morality.
That being said, Christians interpret the Bible differently. Paul writes homosexual behavior is a sin, and so is fornication (before marriage), adultery, etc. He states it pretty strictly, just before he says we all fall into (at least) one of these categories, but were washed clean of our sins by Christ.
All I'm saying is ...
Goohuman 5 months ago
@omegavalerius ... that God made all of us, killers and clergy alike. It is our choice to listen and obey, or go our own way.
Bob Marshall may believe himself a Christian and interpret his mission as identifying sin and allowing gov to make judgement on others based on that particular sin. I would remind him that he himself is a sinner and was forgiven.
Rachel doesn't get it. This is only bad for someone if they want to be able to offend others openly. That's not good regardless the morality.
Goohuman 5 months ago
@omegavalerius ... that God made all of us, killers and clergy alike. It is our choice to listen and obey, or go our own way.
Bob Marshall may believe himself a Christian and interpret his mission as identifying sin and allowing gov to make judgement on others based on that particular sin. I would remind him that he himself is a sinner and was forgiven.
Rachel doesn't get it. This is only bad for someone if they want to be able to offend others openly. That's not good regardless the morality.
Goohuman 5 months ago
@Goohuman True, but christianity still made this monster and because of his christian "values" he gets a sizable portion of the ballot. Christians might not all be backward, but christianity creates these sort of people--that much is undeniable. Televangelists aren't making money because of the well educated after all.
Figaera69 5 months ago
@Figaera69 No, sir. Christianity did not make any monsters. Monsters use whatever they can to justify what they do. Christians who actually read the Bible would get that they are supposed to be forgiving, kind, help others in need and always love one another.
But I don't see why you call Bob a monster. He doesn't like abortion and he rewrote the non-discrimination clause to exclude homosexuals? Is that it? He has his view. He isn't killing anyone. Abortions actually DO kill people.
Just vote.
Goohuman 5 months ago
@Goohuman So he was born with the idea that god punishes the progeny of women who had an abortion? Christianity is completely unrelated. Or the governor that made it legal to discriminate against homosexuality in the work place (This guy's the monster, Bob's just an idiot). It wasn't christianity that told him that homosexuals were an abomination against god and should be persecuted? Not all christians are the same, but christianity is pathway that makes these sort of people. It happens.
Figaera69 5 months ago
@Figaera69 Funny you should say that. Christians have been protecting homosexuals, the lepers and every other outcast. It's always the self-righteous that persecute them. If you want to single out a belief system that ACTUALLY KILLS homosexuals, take a look at Islam.
The Bible does condemn homosexuality. It is a sin. It also says we are all sinners and we should help each other to be better people. Christianity is the path away from bad behavior, not towards it.
Goohuman 5 months ago
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@Goohuman Umm, " Leviticus 20:13 If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They must be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads." Therefore christianity did put that idea in his head. Islam didn't (even if the only thing christianity has going for it is that it isn't Islam).
Figaera69 5 months ago
@PlanetOfTheAtheist Who the fuck would take them?
toelesshoe 6 months ago
So I am a college student in Virginia and an Atheist... I live with my evangelical parents... They don't know I am atheist... If they knew I would not have a place to live and would likely have to drop out of school... Just to put Virginia in perspective for everyone.
ono24 6 months ago
@ono24 this guy has it right. In my house, even the dog is christian....lol
Mizuonipwi 6 months ago
MADCOW is a CUNT...
bigbass49 6 months ago
Its Nobody's business if someone wants an abortion
canbuyu 6 months ago
The stuff scares me that we allow is religious freaks in our government
canbuyu 6 months ago
And for eternal suffering are you willing to take the risk. Sure you can ask God for forgiveness, but by going into the whole ordeal with that mindset.... He knows your heart and knows your intentions to do wrong and just ask for forgiveness later.... A human judge may forgive that, but God?? I'm not judging you.... just God....
jecsse4 6 months ago
@jecsse4 Yeah, if yahweh turns out to be real he's going to have a lot more to answer for than I will and if his answers were satisfactory to me then I would join him if not I would ask to be exiled. But either way I cannot imagine a god who would damn me or anyone else for all eternity. That's just childish and petty. Anyway, yes, I'll take the risk and won't be asking for any forgiveness but from those I wrong themselves should it come up. Also religious politicians scare me not yahweh.
wkrepelin 6 months ago
@jecsse4 You miss the point. Atheists can't help it. The idea of a god just seems silly and improbable. I can't pretend to believe, I just don't. Belief is not a choice, you're either convinced or you're not.
Figaera69 5 months ago
Forget politics here. It shouldn't be an issue. Deep down, everyone knows that killing a living, breathing infant is wrong (let alone any other human being). But if that is your choice, may God have mercy on you. It is not my place or job to judge you, so I won't, but someday God will judge you based on your life lived on Earth. If that doesn't frighten you, nothing will, but you will have to face it and saying that eternity is a long time doesn't do "eternity" justice. It is eternal suffering.
jecsse4 6 months ago
@jecsse4 I think bringing in an unloved child into a life of poverty is a worse sin than aborting him (or in my opinion "it"--at that point in development it barely counts as an organism, let alone a human being). In some cases death is known as the gift of mercy and would be the responsible thing to do. What if the baby is the result of rape? Or if the child would cost you your education? What if having a kid would be literally hazardous to your health? Where does your god draw the line?
Figaera69 5 months ago
@Figaera69 Here you argue the value of abortion. I'm glad you are so clear on this issue, especially since you can't possibly know what the future holds for you or the child you are ready to sacrifice to improve your odds of getting a good job.
Let me point out the obvious. Your position is amoral. Death of a child my benefit you, but if we all believe as you do, you may find yourself on the short end of amoral thought. Assuming all have the right to live protects you too.
Criminals are amoral.
Goohuman 5 months ago
@Goohuman Why don't you reply to the comment I actually sent you? Or why don't you consider the scenario where the unborn child is the result of rape? My comment was designed to be cynical and extreme. My actual view point is that the fetus is not a human being until the first neurons develop and connect. Before that it's no more a person than an used tampon. Even then, abortion is not something to do lightly--but there are circumstances in which it's a good option. Calling me a criminal. Pfft.
Figaera69 5 months ago
@Figaera69 Oh I did. I'm more than happy to expose ALL your poor, selfish, amoral ideas. Keep reading my older posts and I'm sure you will find it.
Your comparison of a fetus to a "used tampon" is classic amoral thought. If you have sex and for some odd reason a new life begins because of it, you figure that the place to correct the problem is not with your lack of responsibility to the woman or the sex act, but the life growing in some woman's womb.
Grow up.
Goohuman 5 months ago
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Figaera69 5 months ago
@Goohuman Actually you didn't. The one I quote leviticus is still unchallenged. You call me amoral yet you're the one that has to resort to insults to try and get a point across. You don't even address where I define when the fetus becomes a person. More over you don't discuss any of the extenuating circumstances that justify abortion, what about rape?. You're the one that has to grow up with your petty absolutism, the world isn't black and white.
Figaera69 5 months ago
@Figaera69 Of course I didn't "challenge" the Bible. I agree with it. I said so.
Amoral describes you views to a T. It is not an insult, just pointing out the facts. In being amoral your logic fails outside of your skin. That creates poor ideas that are specifically selfish in nature. Those aren't insults. Just stating exactly how that thinking works.
Regarding rape, etc, if the woman is pregnant against her will AND she nor her family are willing or able to care for the child, abort away.
Goohuman 5 months ago
@Goohuman Well, it's good to see that you are willing to see some middle ground. And the amoral part isn't the insult (although it is a rather poor description), the insult is the rest of the adjectives you use in conjunction such as selfish, poor and criminal. There are times were abortion is acceptable, that was my point and finally you conceded. And the purpose behind the leviticus quote was to illustrate how christianity is bigoted against homosexuality, the point you were contesting before.
Figaera69 5 months ago
@Figaera69 Yes, and thank you for not saying that Christians are bigoted against homosexuals. We believe it is a sin, but the sinner is not the problem, the sin is.
Let me explain why a criminal has to be amoral. Laws are based on common or natural law. We as citizens must accept the law to live in peace with each other. A criminal dismisses the law and does what they believe is right. They think the law doesn't apply to them because they are "truly free".....
Goohuman 5 months ago
@Goohuman Also, what do you mean by "your logic fails out of your skin." Been trying to make sense of that, but ironically enough logic fails me here. I also fail to see why do you insist that my ideas are amoral, there isn't a protected good that's being broken by abortion. It all depends on how you define "life". Moreover, it's immoral to bring a child into this world to starve or contract a lethal disease or to sacrifice an existing life for a potential one. Maybe you mean godless instead.
Figaera69 5 months ago
@Figaera69 .... but their freedom is specifically selfish. Where they see a car they like, they can justify taking it because they need it at that moment. We would see that as selfish and criminal thinking. They don't buy the common law so they are comfortable in their amoral judgement.
If you are thinking of what is good for you and not what is good for those around you, you are thinking selfishly. We all do it. But when we act on it, it becomes good or bad for all, not just yourself.
Goohuman 5 months ago
@Goohuman The point stands, christian bigots are the result of christianity. That's all well and good, but that doesn't show how my ideas are amoral. I just value the current life of the pregnant woman more than the potential life of a fetus. Especially when the consequences are obviously negative and foreseeable. What that implies is that the moral valorization is different but not non-existing, ethics and morality are based on human thought not ancient texts, that'd be crazy.
Figaera69 5 months ago
@Figaera69 Your point, if I understand it correctly, is that the religion of Christianity teaches bigotry. To that point, you have not made your point. If you are just calling Christians "bigots" because you disagree with them, then that makes you a bigot, by definition. Their bigotry is a sin, just like yours.
I would point out, no thinking human can KNOW what the future holds for the unborn, as much as you claim it is "foreseeable". Obvious wisdom survives and is preserved in "ancient texts"
Goohuman 5 months ago
@Goohuman Have you read leviticus and deuteronomy? If the bible is the word of god (as you believe), then your god commanded you to kill homosexuals. Isn't that intolerant discrimination because of a different view point? Isn't that christian value what motivated this nut-job into changing legislation?
I would point out science is all about making predictions. There are several assertions you can make based on your current situation and fiscal and medical facts concerning a child.
Figaera69 5 months ago
@Figaera69 Well there you go. God did NOT command me or any other Christian alive today to kill homosexuals. If you are going to interpret the Bible like that, there are ancient scientists that believe that the Sun revolves around the Earth. They were certain of it and had all the math worked out for it.
Me thinks you've been listening to radicals.
As for Bob, vote him out if you don't like it. Apparently, some people LIKE what he is doing and voted FOR him.
Goohuman 5 months ago
@Goohuman The problem is science does not claim to be an absolute source of morality. If the bible is the literal word of god, as christians believe, then whatever was written in the old testament should still be morally true. But it isn't. Stoning your kids is not okay under any circumstances, even if the bible says it is. Therefore, either the bible is not the word of god or god is not infallible. You don't need to be a radical, you just need to take the bible literally.
Figaera69 5 months ago
@Goohuman Also, " Obvious wisdom survives and is preserved in 'ancient texts' " I again ask, have you read leviticus and deuteronomy? I was raised a catholic, but it wasn't after I read the bible that I realized it was utter immoral nonsense. I'd hardly call stoning your children because they talked back wisdom. All the good things in the bible could be summarized in a sentence. The evil things though, those have several dedicated websites. Moreover, if it's obvious wisdom why keep it in a book?
Figaera69 5 months ago
@Figaera69 I'm reading through it again so that I can understand how you and the non-thinking Christians interpret the Old Testament to justify crazy stuff.
My perspective is thus: God wants what is best for us. We want what we want right now.
So right now, you want to bad-mouth Christianity and found some historical accounts showing barbarism in action. You dismiss the values the Bible teaches, the history of good Christians etc, because ... I dunno. You tell me. Why?
Goohuman 5 months ago
@Goohuman You're rationalizing what is written in the old testament. You're thinking god thinks like you. Since you're not a medieval middle eastern barbarian, but rather a reasonable modern westerner, then the old testament doesn't apply. You made the moral call, not god. Also, I'm not dismissing the value of some of the teachings of the bible, I accepted love thy neighbor was a good idea. I just don't deny the evils of the bible, they're there.
Figaera69 5 months ago
@Figaera69 You don't know the Bible at all. Even the stuff you think you know you don't know. God doesn't think. He knows. We are the ones who are clueless. Your solution is to just deny it. Mine is to recognize I don't know God's path, but I know what little I see of my own. I choose to follow the wisdom of what Christ taught and recall the ancient stories of the Jews as a historical record. God led Mother Theresa. I pray I can be 1/100th as good a follower as she was. Maybe a tenth?
Goohuman 5 months ago
@Goohuman I think you need to read the old testament again. It clearly says that god commanded the israelites to do heinous things, like killing children for cursing their parents and stoning rape victims because they didn't get help. That means that you're either ignoring god's will or his will isn't absolute. I don't deny my ignorance, I embrace it. I realize how little I know and strive to learn more. You choose to pretend to know things because they were written a long time ago.
Figaera69 5 months ago
@Figaera69 The historical accounts in the Old Testament do not tell us every bit of info needed to convince you of God's accuracy.
For example, Eisenhower ordered the destruction of every little building that was being used as a factory by the Germans, to include their inhabitants. That meant we were bombing homes in some cases. Was that just? I would say yes, if it meant the war was over faster. Killing those civilians meant fewer people would die. Just an example.
Goohuman 5 months ago
@Goohuman An example of what? I don't see your point. Anyway, I hope you read the old testament critically soon and sit to think about your faith. Maybe you'll be able to stop making excuses for your imaginary friend; if he's almighty he can take it.
Figaera69 5 months ago
@Figaera69 Your hard-headedness will be your downfall. I don't think any amount of my pointing out your logical fallacies will bring you to actually read the book you ridicule. You will just continue to believe the snipets you've heard or read about can only be evidence you're preconceived notions are justified.
For people like you, the truth will hurt so much that you may never accept it.
Goohuman 5 months ago
@Figaera69 Sorry for the multiposting btw, my computer had a recurring error when posting earlier.
Figaera69 5 months ago
Comment removed
Figaera69 5 months ago
God loves us all. We need to remember that and we need to love each other as well. Especially our offspring. Regardless of reasons for pregnancy or mitigating circumstances, abortion should not have to made illegal because we should not be killing creatures of our own kind. You can claim any kind of right to your body or health that you want, but there is no excuse. The whole argument on health of the mother is ridiculous as well. What kind of mother wouldn't give her own life for her children?
jecsse4 6 months ago
@jecsse4 I can see your point. However, it really comes down to what you define as human. It is definitely wrong to kill another human being, but at what point do we become human? From your post, I would guess you believe that the fetus is human from conception. But not everyone sees it that way. I, for example, believe that what makes us human is our minds. So from my perspective, the fetus becomes a human when it can feel, and respond to stimuli. Before that, I don't consider it murder.
tangent94 6 months ago
He's a republican, noooooooo. You're kidding.
baldurus1 6 months ago
@OOPS4U2CNOW
The bibles, old and new, were written by men. There is no question of that. And yet, somehow you believe that those very-human books detail an actual god.
There were historians alive during the claimed life of Jesus. It's just that none of them ever mentioned him.
arthurneddysmith 6 months ago
If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide that proves they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument do you invoke to prove that they should value logic?
Shoyudan 6 months ago 28
@Shoyudan Excellent point... However, the value of hearing the illogical reasoning and misrepresentations of reality such as this, allows intelligent, compassionate human beings to be able to converse openly about the shadowy, fear-driven hatred of those who are ignorant within society. The vocal extremists of the world can in fact show us the dangers of intolerance and serve as examples of the ways in which, if good folk are not diligent, that we can abuse, deny and neglect our fellow humans.
SouthernStargazer 5 months ago
@Shoyudan Use their own filthy tactics against them. Make them scared, bribe them, and guilt them. It's the only way they understand when it comes to those topics. They are so used to rejecting logic and accepting appeals that, unfortunately, one needs to use it against them.
BokuwaFdesu 3 months ago
@OOPS4U2CNOW
Wait. So you think it's odd and unnatural that "the universe came from nothing" (no scientist believes that by the way), and yet you have no problem with an all-powerful and knowing, invisible being coming from nothing. Huh.
Not that anyone really expects Christians to be consistent these days, but at least give it a try.
arthurneddysmith 6 months ago
@Intrepidorator
"Most biographies are written after the person dies."
Now you're just making up statistics.
You were asked for a contemporary historian, you said you could provide one, but instead you make excuses.
Contemporary historians documented so, so many events, and yet not one referred to Jesus. How odd.
arthurneddysmith 6 months ago
@intrepidator
Sigh. So your evidence for the existence of Jesus is:
1. ONE, forged, TINY passage in the MASSIVE works of Josephus (a JEW who somehow called Jesus "a god") which somehow no-one noticed for 300 years, and which is called a forgery even by Christian historians; and
2. A historian who lived 130 years after the event.
I had an idea that you would struggle. I just didn't realise how much.
arthurneddysmith 6 months ago
GOD LIKES BLOOD SACRIFICE!!!
PimpMyParadigm 6 months ago
@bigbass49
There's a reason that your words seem high on emotion but low on thought: They reflect you. You'll jump to any insult you can and you'll even capitalise it. Can you actually make a point though?
-All I've seen is random insults so far.
arthurneddysmith 6 months ago
This UGLY ASS DYKE from MSLSD is GUTTER TRASH !!!
bigbass49 6 months ago
@bigbass49
your just angry cause you could never get a gorgeous women like her.
sigeram99 6 months ago
@sigeram99 LoL... well spoken you COMMIE LIBERAL FAG !!!
bigbass49 6 months ago
@bigbass49
lol now you be trollin 8D
sigeram99 6 months ago
@intrepidorator
Ha! What a laugh. You can't find a SINGLE source to suggest that Jesus actually lived, aside from those who already believed in Christianity and had proven an interest in propagating the myth, and you have the gall to suggest others are "weakminded".
Historians of that era attested to wars, disease, disasters, and more, but you can't even find ONE that referred to a "god"?
"Absurdity" you say?
arthurneddysmith 6 months ago
@arthurneddysmith Julius Africanus (c. 160 - c. 240)
Chronography, XVIII refers to writings by Thallus and Phlegon concerning the darkness during the Crucifixion:
On the whole world there pressed a most fearful darkness; and the rocks were rent by an earthquake, and many places in Judea and other districts were thrown down. This darkness Thallus, in the third book of his History, calls, as appears to me without reason, an eclipse of the sun...
intrepidorator 6 months ago
@intrepridorator
If it's "true and written by historians" that a man called "Jesus Christ" lived 2,000 years ago and was crucified, please name and quote a historian, without resorting to a writer from the bible, who said so.
arthurneddysmith 7 months ago
@arthurneddysmith OK. Jesus was mentioned by Josephus (A.D. 37 - c. A.D. 100) in his writings called Antiquities. Also mentioned by Tacitus (c. A.D. 55 - c. A.D. 117) in Annals, book XV: Also by Suetonius (c. A.D. 69 - c. A.D. 140) in Lives of the Caesars - Claudius, sec. 25:
Best of all was Julius Africanus (c. 160 - c. 240) Chronography, XVIII refers to writings by Thallus and Phlegon concerning the darkness during the Crucifixion:
There you go..
intrepidorator 6 months ago
@intrepidorator Ok, did you not notice that ALL your sources lived AFTER the fact? Some of them a century or so! They aren't CONTEMPORARIES of your supposed Jesus.
Oh and the Josephus reference has been proved to be a later insertion by Eusebius in the 4th century.
You're really proving my point most beautifully.
ciaochowbella 6 months ago
@ciaochowbella Yes I did notice that they lived after Jesus was alive, Most biographies are written after the person dies. The 4 gospels (which are eyewitness accounts) were written after Jesus was crucified. Jesus was the son of a carpenter who lived in an obscure part of Judea, Do you assume that the illiterate people of that time and age would have followed Him around with a stenographer. He was written about a few years after his crucifiction. But he was crucified. Its written in history.
intrepidorator 6 months ago
@intrepidorator no they wrote it while they were alive...Luke was a doctor and spoke to eye witnesses to the events that took place Mark was a disciple of Peter who was a disciple of Jesus who was another eyewitness John was a disciple of Jesus and the books he wrote were after the Resurrection of Jesus Revelations was written while John was a prisoner on the Island of Patmos and remember this there are more than 6000 new testaments or fragments of the New testaments that have been found
OOPS4U2CNOW 6 months ago
@OOPS4U2CNOW Hmmm. I meant that they wrote the boks after Jesus was crucified. I might have written it wrong.
intrepidorator 6 months ago
@OOPS4U2CNOW sorry i thought i was replying to some one else and didn't notice till after i posted and then it was to late...this is what the education system is teaching today and if they can destroy our past they control the future and that is a very dangerous thing but very well planed out and working ---look at all the brain-dead followers of the Bamster
OOPS4U2CNOW 6 months ago
Bob Marshall, you should turn up to Sarah and Todd Palin's front door and tell them they are immoral "baby killers" because they have a disabled child. I'll pay for your ticket.
Or perhaps it's just time your children sent you off to a home for the elderly (and senile in this case), so you can stop insulting the citizens who you work for with your superstitious horseshit.
arthurneddysmith 7 months ago
the exodus verse really means that children must be sacrificed to jehovah, just as firstborn animals were sacrificed. this was normal enough in antiquity that the bible recounts the story of jephtah, who sacrificed his own daughter ... and David also sacrificed several people atop a mountain to appease Jehovah and end a drought. Jesus was not the first human sacrificed celebrated in the Bible.
BoricuaChiTown 7 months ago
America, land of prejudice.
LoneRookRS1 7 months ago
Isn't it a federal law not to discriminate on the basis of sexuality? How the hell was this allowed to happen?
LoneRookRS1 7 months ago
This guy's retarded.
davetista 7 months ago
in Thomas Jefferson's letter to the Danbury Baptists Association in 1802. The original text reads: "...I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should 'make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof,'
intrepidorator 7 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
We should have no qualm about scorning the self deluded, irrational, parasitic religious. They deserve no respect, only ridicule, disdain, and contempt. There ridicules beliefs are 1st century ignorance and fear at its worst. It is of the utmost importance for the health of civilization to eradicate the god virus. With information so easily available being ignorant today is by choice.
scotttebben 7 months ago
Why do lions lick there assholes? To remove the taste of intolerant christians.
scotttebben 7 months ago 7
@scotttebben Do I really have to point out the intolerance in your antiChristian rant?.. what a fool you are.
intrepidorator 7 months ago
@intrepidorator When did a joke become an intolerant rant?
Perhaps you are merely a pathetic, feeble, doltish christian whom becomes upset when anyone pokes fun at your delusion. Now that is whats called intolerant rant, you fucking retard.
scotttebben 7 months ago
@scotttebben It has always been an intolerant rant, when it shows an inane intolerance. Name calling shows that you know you've lost the debate already..
intrepidorator 7 months ago
@scotttebben no they were getting used to the smell and taste of people like you
OOPS4U2CNOW 6 months ago
@OOPS4U2CNOW
I am perplexed by your droll comment, as it confirms my position.
scotttebben 6 months ago
@scotttebben that's a good come back, boy your smart, must keep you up nights looking at your self in the mirror, do you spend half your time being witty...with comebacks like that you must be a blast at parties..........................
OOPS4U2CNOW 6 months ago
@OOPS4U2CNOW As a result of digesting your comments, I conclude that your lack of intellect or cognitive skills simply implies further interaction would be of no interest.
scotttebben 6 months ago
@scotttebben yep, your brain dead,or brain washed buy this world either way your not worth it either
DANO509 6 months ago
@DANO509 Your an example of why religion is not benign but is parasitic to it's host. Your fucking delusional.
scotttebben 6 months ago
I just finished watching "the Universe" on the history channel, and felt such awe of the vastness of the universe. Now watching this it brings me back to the stupid, shitty reality, in which primitive religions reign.
jol223334 7 months ago
So, according to this fellow's logic, Sarah Palin's son has Down's Syndrome because she must have had an abortion?
The religious in the US seem to be becoming more stupid all the time.
rohanwotan2 7 months ago 15
@rohanwotan2 really!!!! your the one who thinks that we came from nothing....that's right "NOTHING EXPLODED AND THAT'S HOW WE GOT HERE" REALLY AND YOU SAY WE CHRISTIANS ARE STUPID
BILLIONS OF YEARS THAT IS YOUR god...think on this...ever hear of "Limiting Factors" that blows about a billion holes in that theory you know the Theory of Evolution or as we stupid people say THE BIG LIE"
OOPS4U2CNOW 6 months ago
@OOPS4U2CNOW
You have no idea what I do or do not think or believe. You assume thngs and simply show yourself to be an emotional fool.
According to xtians, their god cast various spells over the course of seven days to bring everything into existence. Magic. That's the explanation of the religious, simply magic: Goddidit!
You're an idiot. Please crawl back under your rock and hide in embarassment.
rohanwotan2 6 months ago
@rohanwotan2 really!! and were does this magic come from ...a rock!!!
OOPS4U2CNOW 6 months ago
@OOPS4U2CNOW
According to xtians, magic emanates from an invisible man in the sky that cares deeply about what we do with our genitals. It also comes from his son, who is also himself, along with a ghost, which is still him, but all three of these are still one, not three, even though they are three, but still one. As an added bonus, they throw in a virgin giving birth, talking snakes and donkeys and people living inside fish/whales for three days. It just doesn't get any more stupid.
rohanwotan2 6 months ago
@rohanwotan2 let me ask you something....is Satan real....
OOPS4U2CNOW 6 months ago