We absolutely agree with you - Members of the old commonwealth still have UK laws on the statute book - We know that when UK have full marriage equality other nations will follow - weather we like it or not UK still has a moral lead on social issues well beyond its boarders - Just look how often the UK military position on gays serving openly impacted on the abolition of DADT in America - President Obama quoted the UK several times as an example of intergration and integrity.
The problem is people identify marriage, a religious construct, as the goal of a relationship. I think that, while gay couples should be entitled to the same legal recognition as heterosexual couples, since the term marriage is a religious one it should be left to the religious community to say whether or not it's still called marriage. Mixing religion and law doesn't the way to go.
"What's in a name? That which we call a rose
By any other name would smell as sweet." ~Shakespeare
A neurotic sexual fetish affected by modeling the opposite sex parent to compensate for a complication of intimacy with distant or absent mother or father is hardly a basis for a marriage relationship. Underlying all neurotic conditions are ego problems accompanied by low self-esteem. Once the person begins engage in homosexual relations it becomes a sexual addiction with an intense compulsive desire for only same sex relationships. Self-esteem will not improve until the person abstains.
I will never understand why gay marriage is debated so heatedly. If two consenting adults want to get married, there is no reason to stop them from doing so. I understand the religious aspects of the argument, but since religion has absolutely no place in government, the fanatics should just shut their mouths and let the rest of us get on with our lives.
...(cont) that homosexuality is not a god damned sin, and forcing the church to finally recognise and DO SOMETHING about the rampart discrimination in their institution, and that goes across the board, in schools, churches, everywhere up to and including The Vatican.
P.S. I thought you were bisexual? Didn't you blog about this years ago?
I think it's because we're so far removed from religion. Civil partnership is marriage without the church, but often marriage is marriage without the church. In America, they're waaaaay more religious than we are, and the church is still a major factor in politics, so of course the debate will be more fierce. Over here, we don't care. I do however agree with you that gay marriage should be legalised, however, I believe this should be more in the context of forcing the church to recognise (cont)
I think that you're completely right, I'm gay, and I'd like to think that someday I could get married and be classified as having the same relationship as a heterosexual couple. I never really thought that it was different until I saw this video, it really put it in perspective for me. I go to a catholic high school, and although I don't shout it from the rooftops, I'd like to think that if somebody asked, I could openly say that I was gay. But it seems that when somebody did ask me that, I fro
@ahbalin how could a same sex couple ever have a relationship that is classified the same as a hetero couple? Surely it defeats the classification system - unless you think marriage only involves love and not procreation?
@ConspiracyLoon Hey you need to look at a marriage licence - Its an exclusive contract between two consenting adults - it says nothing about procreation - Gay people can & do have kids
@trevortrevortsr2 A gay couple cannot have 'their own' children. Yeah, you can marry two people together - but in the eyes of whom? the state? I suggest if they feel love for each other it doesn't matter who does or doesn't know it. All that matters is their love and the state not coming inbetween it. Why not just make their own 'legally binding' contract? Why do you need permission from the state? U know that's what a license is right?
@ConspiracyLoon No shit - no wonder my b/f is not pregnant LOL
Think we would say first of all it a recongnised lifetime commitment to each other witnessed by everyone important in our live - then it lets everyone we don't know identify our importance to each other - and lastly it allows us to access the legal securities to suport our family in a crisiss ( pretty much the same reasons as st8 people marry) Yes we know what a licence is - do you know what real equality is?
@trevortrevortsr2 (1/2)The simple answer to that is; No, I do not know what "real equality" is. Equality before the law? Sexuality, Gender, Race, Culture, Inclination, I say give all freedom to do what they want so long as they do not infringe upon the rights of others. I do not see any reason for gay people not to have a "gay old time" together, married infront of witnesses yada. What I do mind is telling "institutional mindsets", or, to put it another way, telling tax payers
@ConspiracyLoon (2/2) that they must believe in something that isn't life threatening like LGBT/Union subsidies, so much, that they should not even question their "tax dollar" going on it. Like telling the church they have to "let gays adopt the children they have saved", like telling the old christian couple in a BnB if they don't allow bumsex in their rooms, they're not allowed a BnB. I'd like to make it clear, I don't have a problem with gay marriage passe, more (ok, 3rd, lol)
@ConspiracyLoon the subtle connections the legislation has with procreation and making people accept what has nothing to do with them anyway i.e. taxes and "group psychology".
@ConspiracyLoon It's crazy my partners genitals are his, mine and occassionaly our doctors buisness no one elses - why do people obsess about things that don't concern them - bum sex is not an exclusive gay activity though many st8's kid themselves it is to fit in with their desire to distance themselves from somthing they percieve as a bit icky - bum sex is one of the reasons gay guys get grief more than lesbians
@ConspiracyLoon Welcome to our world - pleased you don't have a problem with gay marriage - taxes bother you - had you thought about all the things funded by taxes that most gay people don't access but seldom gripe about ?- moderate tax expenditure to assist establish equality seems reasonable - its no good waxing lyricly about equality then when people discriminate not challenge it - I have no sympathy for the church adoption or B&B who think they are above the law
I really don't think there's any point in talking about governments forcing churches to acknowledge same sex religious marriages because that's out of their control, and will come with time. But the fact that the relationship between a same sex couple and heterosexual couple are at all different is ridiculous. Marriage is no longer 'religious' it's more 'together for life' and I don't like a government telling anyone their love isn't right for that title.
I'm Irish, so I don't know the ins and outs of Westminister but I know over here we're unlikely to make any big move towards legalising gay marriage until you do. There's an annual march for marriage in Dublin that's been ignored for years. Since the introduction of civil partnership politicians seem to have wiped their hands of the gay community, but until gay marriage is legalised we don't have EQUALITY. It's time the concept of "traditional family" faces the reality of the 21st century.
I constantly hear "yea, but two gay blokes with love is a better upbringing for a child than two straight people without love" - they seem to be missing quite a big point here, and that is balance - all children need role models of both sexes, they also need to see how they functionally interact/relate to one another. The question oughtta be rephrased - "who'd be better as parents, two loving straights? or two loving homosexuals?" I think the answer is obviously upsetting for the latter.
What rights does marriage give you? I thought it meant you can't own 2 homes without paying capital growth tax? they take benefits away from couples and made it more financially lucrative to stay single actually... fuck staying together for the kids.... I don't understand why homothexuals are so obssessed with getting acceptance from the straight community. Perhaps the benefits marriage traditionally bought to a couple were actually for the benefit of their offspring??
The only issue is equality and I think the right wing MP's are against smuggled immigrant spouses and fictitious marriages which they should own up to. Because that's not the point.
I'm German and we have a similar status to the UK: Civil partnerships but no same-sex marriage. In both cases it's strange, because the state has legalised marriage (nothing to do with the church) and it has no reason to discriminate against same-sex marriage. Church marriage here is separate, that is a matter for the churches. But we need to hear why the politicians are against gay marriage, they need to come clean on this.
A man with a woman has been God's pattern for marriage since creation. To expect churches to legitimatise other unions as marriage is for the state to overstep its bounds. Enforcing the rights of one group can end up infringing on the rights of others, rights such as freedom of belief and speech.
@Oct23rd4004BC 1. a man with several women has been "God's pattern for marriage since creation". Read the first few pages of Genesis. Polygamy was the norm back in the day...
2. He isn't asking the church to legitimatize. He's asking the government to legalize. And in what way would the church be overstepping their bounds?
@Oct23rd4004BC 3. you're right. Enforcing the opinions ("right"? so you admit it's a right they're entitled to?) of one group can infringe the rights of others. Like not allowing 2 consenting adults to marry bc of bigotry. Legalizing gay marriage would in no way infringe your right to oppose it and express that opposition.
@welaughindoors91 So it wouldn't infringe the rights of the old couple when they refused to let homosexuals enjoy bumsex in one of their BnB rooms? It doesn't infringe the rights of the church who have always been opposed to homosexuality to be forced into letting homosexual people adopt the children they have previously looked after (please no jokes about catholic paedophilia....).
@ConspiracyLoon I'm not all that knowledgable about the nuances of UK law but yeah, pretty sure it wouldn't. the sort of discrimination you described in the bed and bathroom scenario is already illegal, regardless of the legal stance of gay marriage (not to mention arguing intolerance of intolerance is intolerant is a really stupid argument). Same goes for your church example. Gay adoptions are already allowed.
This is just a theory but I think that the reason there has been more activism about gay marriage in America is that they are more religious than we are. To them marriage means a lot more, even to the gay community.
One more point. Churches have always been allowed to discrimate on who they marry, based on their faith tenets. Why should it be different with gay marriage. I think that this is a real red herring by the antigay marriage folks. Remember, the Catholic church has prevented divorced straight people from marrying in their churches and face no legal sanctions for it.
you are right...love is love and it should be legal to anyone. its 2012!! time to finally realize the equality thought. politicians always talk about it but also should do something about it.
Gays are convinced they are all Divas.!!! It is just out of the best comedy.! I have actually enjoyed watching a group of homossexuals when Patrick Swayze , Wesley Snipes acted in the excellent comedy "Thanks for everything Julie Newmar". Being gay is good for comedy....not to be taken seriously!
@YourFavoriteAries - You must be confusing me with all of your boyfriends lady! We bring into the coversation our experiences and if you mention trolling it means you are used having it around you! Obviously, it is quite shamefull, hum?!
Talking about Nazis, I think Hitler was gay as well otherwise, I am 100% sure there would be much much less gay people on Earth. Very unfair situation for the JEWS. Everybody knows to be true that just watching a man acting and talking like a woman is quite embarrassing and a woman acting and talking like a man very weird to say the least. It is like, you have a skin cancer condition and you go around showing it off for the sake of attention. Sad!
....I'm a heterosexual women and to be honest, the gay community shouldn't be the only people fighting for this bill. If government decided to take another human right from the public such as the right to liberty I'm pretty sure a larger percentage of the public would have something to say
Europe does come into this, considering the fact we as a country cannot have law that is incompatible with EU law, gay marriage should have been legalised a long time a go. Article 9 of the Human Rights Act states of the right to marry and civil partnerships only supplement this right when in actual fact, if Britian believes in this Human Rights Act, the bill for gay marriage should have been passed in 1998! ..
Thanks for sharing on this issue as well as how it affects you personally. You're right, perhaps we're more vocal in the US because it's so much more of a fight against ignorance (we seem to like repeating mistakes we've made in this country despite the pain they've caused). Consider yourself lucky living in the UK. Separate but equal is not a reality and gay marriage doesn't mean that you would also be able to marry your dog (weak logic that's seriously accepted within large circles in the US).
Gay couples should stick with the "Civil Partnership" and leave Marriage alone. Marriage is God's Presence in this Union and, as far as I am aware, He has not created a sperm cell to run around completely lost in your intestine or stomach! The reason gay couples fight for MARRIAGE and CHILDREN is the same that makes a black person wanting to be white....an inferiority complex
All that is wrong about gay relationships has become "accepted" because from the beginning of life on Earth, sex has taken over intelligence. We watch animals killing each other because of it, powerful people forcing men/women and children to submit to their desires, sex being used to achieve personall goals. That is why we have law makers deciding in favour. Because people prefer to live with the illness than being cured.....
I see your point about how using different words for homosexual unions and heterosexual unions suggest that they are "equal, but different", but, by the same token, couldn't you say the same thing about the relationships between, say, mother & son and father & daughter? Different words; same relationship (in essence).
You know, I was actually discussing this very issue with my gay best friend back last month (he's also a member of the Conservative party and a gay porn star, incidentally). I'm paraphrasing here, but he raised the point that this is mainly an issue over semantics - if a homosexual civil partnership is every bit as legal as a heterosexual marriage, then is there really much of an issue? He felt that we should be more worked up about gay rights in other countries, e.g. the African nations.
I have tried to understand the opposition to gay marriage but I do not. At its core, marriage is a contractual arrangement between two people. Legalizing civil marriage between two people of the same sex would not force any religious institution to perform a rite of marriage were it against the rules of that faith tradition. There is so much inborn fear of being "the other" in people who protest against gay rights. I always wonder what such people are really afraid of.
What is making gay relationships very dangerous is the idea of children getting involved in this! This matter of gay couple getting children into the picture does nothing but prove the immaturity of these people. For them it is like playing mummys and daddys! To show the arrogance and irrespopnsability of these people, I mention the idea of removing the moment of conception when mum and dad were making love to what? Back to the bird dropping you through the roof Chimenea or " a glass tube?
@BROOL23 - I guess being gay is all very normal to you. I find it dangerous for my children, who are 9 and 4! I FEAR the times when they will meet people like you, in the future, who may turn them gay. When you have a gay sexual relationship you have missed the point of Life!
@markobmf - I can only feel sorry to know your parents have allowed/promoted your illness. I will support my children to understand what being gay means and maybe become psychologists/psychiatrists and find a cure for homossexuality. That would make my life on Earth definitely not a waste of energy&matter as being gay is!
@TheRuiMartins Your a disgusting human being to condemn people for no other reason than their sexual orientation. You think those people out there who are doctors and scientists and aid workers who just happen to be gay are wasting their life? You sicken me.
@v0tra - I am sure nothing can be more disgusting than allowing a penis into your rectum and probably afterwards put it in your mouth!!! That makes your more disgusting than I. surely! With regards to the gay doctors and scientists...were not for their skills they would indeed be a total waste of life but the majority are intelligent enough to change their lives. the same cannot be said about you, right?
since the very first day I saw your video(about 3 yrs ago), I knew you are gay, but the day you said Daily Mail is your fav paper, I began to doubt my gaydar.
This country's insidious homophobia is a haunting problem, which I can't understand, as a Chinese gay man
I'm totally in favour of gay marriage and think it should be passed whether it's a "pressing issue" or not. I myself am for the most part heterosexual, but for a while now I've been accepting of the fact that it is possible that the next person I fall in love with could be another girl/woman. I don't see why this is a problem. It's not an "illness"! That's a ridiculous thing to say! If homosexuality wasn't natural then it wouldn't have come to be, would it? Think about WHAT you're saying.
The supporting arguments of gay relationships are as weak as the ones that support corruption, the use of force against citizens for security reasons etc. They are used to defend hidden interests and a major problem in Society
All that is wrong about gay relationships has become "accepted" because from the beginning of life on Earth, sex has taken over intelligence. We watch animals killing each other because of it, powerful people forcing men/women and children to submit to their desires, sex being used to achieve personall goals. That is why we have law makers deciding in favour. Because people prefer to live with the illness than being cured.....
I agree with you, I think you do need to have a debate. I'm in Canada, and even though gay marriage is legalized here, we still need to keep talking about it otherwise people will get "grumpy" and start to openly rebel against it. I think as a general rule it's good to keep talking about things you believe in, and never let them rest, even if what you were fighting for has been achieved, always keep striving for the better.
My auntie is in a civil partnership and she has been with her wife as long as my parents have been together (over 20 years). Growing up with them in my family I have never seen the love that they share as any different from the love between, say, my parents. My auntie's wife had two children from a previous, heterosexual, marriage and they raised them together as a lesbian couple. Their way of parenting didn't seem any different from the way I was parented.
@theRuiMartins Did you just compare gay sex to sex with a animal/insect? I'm just speechless. WTF is wrong with you? How is raping some poor animal the same as two men who love each other, doing a natural thing?
@isaac78russell _ It is not natural. Anal sex is not natural! My comparison with animal and INCEST (NOT insect) comes from the fact that Nature did not evolved so that sex between 2 males made sense. Gay sex simply shows that the mind (even animals) is very weak in controling sexual impulses but that does not mean that we shouldn't! Many gay men and women became so because they were either abused as a child or as adults, they were in need of sex and took any chance. I have seen it happening!
@TheRuiMartins First of all, it is natural cause otherwise it wouldn't be able to happen. Secondly, you have completely missed the point of this debate. It's about gay MARRIAGE, which is to do with LOVE, not sex. It's about having equality in the eyes of society in being able to show the commitment that two people have to each other. And yet, in your line of reasoning, you make the jump from THAT to incest and bestiality?! And people like you think that WE are the weird ones?!
@strangebob2007 -About Marriage?! Please...!Gay sex is a psychological deviation.It is on this prespective that I say gay people fall in love for each other because of sex or on wrongly feel you are a man or a woman when you are not.It is natural because it happens?!Why is incest a crime?Because the law does not accept that close relatives fall for each other. Is it not Love? Does it not happen, too?Mainly on young people .Homossexuality is bestiality and it is sad. Sorry
@TheRuiMartins Anything that ever happens is "natural". Things that are unnatural include walking on water and coming back from the dead because these are things that can not occur in the natural world. Anal sex may be unusual, yes, but the very fact that it occurs, by definition, is natural.
And the sexual abuse and "taking what you can get" theories have been disproven so many times that there are reputable psychologist and scientists laughing at you. Educate yourself, dear.
@Minish - I do not see how a sperm cell looking for an egg in your rectum is considered "natural". Surely you live in a pighole and find it quite suitable to your needs. "Walking on water"? Just because you cannot do it, does not mean that some beings can't either, Educate yourself, maybe watching the National Geographic. Death is Natural, but you cannot kill, You may fall in love with your sister/brother but it is Incest and a crime. Gay sex should be as well. It is all about votes.
@TheRuiMartins Rofl, let me be honest with you, I'm not expecting you to change your mind. Bigotry and ignorance are a dangerous combination. And really, I wouldn't be surprised if you're even that bothered, just trolling for attention.
But I just wanna say, if it's unnatural to use parts of the body for sexual stimulation other than reproductive organs and should be criminalized, than masturbation and oral sex should be equally penalized. Think it through, mate.
@Minish - I have thought it through and stick with it! Just because you level yourself down to a beast does not mean I will do more than feel sorry for you!
@TheRuiMartins Right. Now I'm confident you're just trolling.
That's it for me in this conversation. No point in having a discussion with someone who just likes to stir up bile 'cuz they're bored or desperate for attention or something.
@isaac78russell - The romantic view of Gay sex is no more than the best medicine for it. It is more fun to accept you are gay than fight it back! And remember love is not based on sex, Love is much, much more than that!
I'm a straight female and the fact that marriage is still, in a way, "regulated" by the government makes me extremely uncomfortable, the fact that the law is so backwards and heteronormative in this respect makes me uncomfortable. It's easy for straight couples to say they don't want to get married, or that they prefer a civil partnership because they actually HAVE the choice, and I don't think anybody should be keeping same-sex couples from getting married if this is what they want.
Look, I COMPLETELY agree with you. I don't know what it's like in Britain but in Ireland (well in my life anyway) it is a very common topic of conversation. My family and friends are all very open about the issue and support it completely even though none of us (as far as I know) are gay. Gay marriages SHOULD be allowed and the government SHOULD be bombarded about this issues...
as an american i honestly didn't know that other countries aren't fighting as hard as we are. I am a straight female (high school student- 16 yrs old) but i am fairly active in my community on the issue and it is an issue discussed a lot in school and government. Even with all this attention though, i don't see the movement making any progress. it's quite sad, really. i just want to slap the conservatives in the face and tell them to wake up; people are angry, people are gay and that's okay.
My brother is gay and if I'm honest after 5 years I'm still adjusting to see him holding hands with guys. I'm not homophobic - that is, I'm not scared or offended by homosexuality but I don't think anybody can be truely at ease with it unless they are themselves homosexual or have been exposed to it from an early age. That said, I don't think it's right for two men to bring up a child either, its not fair on the child. Gay marriage is fine, as is sex - it's not my business what you choose to do.
How does public debate even operate in Britain today Jazza? Does newspapers ranting at us constitute debate? Does a Vicar, an Imam and a Rabbi debating on Newsnight count as public debate? Do you think that folk down the pub will really get into the debate? Debate essentially happens at the ballot box, and if the Tories were voted into power with a mandate to pass the law, then the debate is over save for the Parliamentary vote.
Quote from MP Andrew J Pelling when I sent him this video. "@Legendariums of course. Caring stable relationships help both people and society." Hopefully this will be adhered to by Mr Pelling and other MPs regardless of Party.
Most of the gay friends I have are content with Civil Partnerships and have been, if you like, socially conditioned to be a-okay with 2nd class. We don't have the religious right sticking the issue in our faces in the UK, so the debate isn't very heated or - may I say - very funded. We're likely to get Gay Marriage here and it's clear that anyone who disagrees will be on the wrong side of history.
as a Canadian I find it interesting that the UK still doesn't allow gay marriage and that they aren't really fighting for it. I am a straight female but many of my friends are gay and so it has always been something I've fought for. I think that a debate could be a good thing because literally the opposition would have is religious and the whole separation between church and state thing would come into play. Showing people how irrational their arguments are could be a really good thing.
I think here the activism is sparked from the courage of another group standing up; or as I'm referring it as the domino affect of national change. Americans tend to be hard-headed, so it's hard to not do something. Also religion takes part of it to. The government here is set to be operated as a separation of church and state, yet the two overlap quite a lot and people have a problem with that too.
I personally believe it's hard for me to wrap my brain for an answer on possible why the UK is more hush-hush than that of US in regards to same-sex marriage and the fight for equality. On the American standpoint, I think people in the US are more active because these laws that are trampled over are done so like a stamped of wild animals going in one direction in a small space. Every minority has faced discrimination and I believe that's what pushes us more. The ability to rebel and be outspoken
many different world views and ideologies within one nation, and I don't think, being a religious person myself, that leaders shouldn't be able make important decisions based on religious beliefs. Give people their freedom to decide for themselves, within reason, what they want to do with their lives. You can have a say within your place of worship, and your personal life. Even from a Christian perspective, God gave people the choice to do what they want.
because of that. In the original Living dead film, there is a scene where two lesbians are together, or making out, and they get eaten by zombies because of it. It was a social commentary in my opinion. It's important but if your focusing on things like that, your going to get eaten alive on the whole. I know it's your life, and that is very important. I think all people should have the same rights as everyone else in a country. Even if you are a politician with a religious background you have
I'm from America. I think it's important to talk about, but I also think there are way more important topics in government right now. I'm not saying gay rights are not important, but it is nothing like the American Civil rights movement back in the 60's. At this point most gay people are fighting for a right to marriage like everyone else and not for their life, for the right to sit where they want on a bus, or to be able to go to the same schools as other people. It may take more time
I'mstraight and would particually mind if gay marriage was legal but perp has I'm part of the problem, maybe it's passive beliefs that have delayed and immediate action for gay marriage.
I don't get why people can be against same sex marriage. According to the law it's just a contract and love isn't even mentioned. Civil marriage and marriage in a church or whatever are not the same. I live in Belgium and was 16 when same sex marriage became legal ( it's not gay because two heterosexual men/women can get married as well). I learned about it later and thought 'cool I'm equal'. Then you read the fine print and realize that for some strange reason gay equality has many small steps
Why is it you want to be legal partners? Contracted to the state in Marriage or Civil Partnership? If an institution disapproves of homosexuality, then why do you want their blessing? I don't understand.
@ConspiracyLoon Much of it has to do with legal rights and privileges. Married folk under the law have access to a slough of rights that unmarried or civil union people do not have. If the state only provided civil unions to all persons then that might be fair but they endow rights under the name of marriage.
I am surprised that there is not really much backlash against anti gay marriage politicians in the UK. I'm from Washington State and even though it is not clenched yet, we are one vote in the state senate away from gay marriage and the political action public out cry,and gay rights organized Corporate call is for gay marriage (with the states largest employers throwing their support behind gay marriage) Not to mention the stink raised over the Anti Gay GOP candidates.
The issue in the UK isnt a homophobic public, as is the issue in the USA. The majority of the UK public including Christians support gay rights and marriage, it is purely the fault of the politicians who simply place a complete ban on gay marriage.
If this issue had been put to public voting as it was in some parts of the USA, Gay Marriage would have legalised many many years ago in the UK, but our politicians dont believe in proper democracy.
@bhavvv Then like in the US the public has to get loud and pushy to get the politicians to do what needs to be done, and the gays are going to have to lead the charge. I know us Americans are seen as uncouth and down right rude and abrasive at times by many, but that Loud, Direct and Demanding way of doing things dose produce results. When it comes to such important things there is little room for high decorum.
... but this supposed sanctity can be dented by hetrosexual couples. Britney Spears & Jason Alexander's marraige lasted 2 days. Very recently Kim Kardashian & Kris Humphrie divorced after just 72 days. 51 year old actor Doug Hutchison married 16 y/o Courtney Stodden in Vegas in 2011. Gay couples like David and Michael Serkin-Poole have been together 25 years and raided three mentally disabled children, they can't marry. Any debate about gays ruining the sanctity of marriage in the UK is pathetic
Thankfully here in the UK I think legal restraints against lesbians and homosexuals are finally being lifted to the point of equality. Discrimination on a less governmental level, however, is perhaps something that could be tackled through debates. Conservatives, who are often also fundamentalist Christians, shout about the "sanctity" of marriage which they feel would be ruined by gays...
...and it was the ONLY such group in South East London, which is a big place. However, I knew so many people who would have benefited from such a group but just didn't know about it. This was partially due to funding, partially to schools' hesitation to advertise it (as if Section 28 was going to come back from the grave and bite them in the posterior). I tried to organise an assembly at my old secondary school was told it could potentially "encourage the problems you're looking to prevent."
@strangebob2007 I can't believe that the school wouldn't want it to be advertised. Surely it is in school where these battles are fought and won. It's a shame. Well done for standing up for our rights though. I don't remember my school having anything like that support network, but then I was lucky enough to never get any homophobic bullying.
@rhymingwithoranges Thing is, they consulted the Year 13 Prefects on it, which means that the prefects' ignorance and insecurities affected their decisions. Last thing I heard, there's only 5% of schools in the country with a specific anti-homophobia clause to their regulations. Most seem to think that covering it under "anti-bullying" suffices, even though they still do specific assemblies on racism, sexism, class divide and disability - but NOT on LGBT issues. And that scares me.
Whilst we have made a LOT of progress in this country in the past 50 years, there are a LOT of things that are still not really spoken about as much in comparison to the USA LGBT community - marriage and bullying being two of them. The US had campaigns like "NOH8" "FKH8" and "Think About What You Say". We do have Stonewall's "Some people are gay, get over it!" posters, but sometimes there doesn't feel like there's enough visible support, especially for gay youth. I used to go to a youth group...
There's no reason for gay marriage not to be legal. Oh sure there are those that are against it but they have issues with homosexuality in general and it bothers them that homosexuality exists so of course they're going to be bothered. Listening to such an argument against the idea would be pointless as the ones making it wouldn't be effected by a gay couple being married in the slightest. The ones who are effected are the gay couples, they want the right to marry thus they should have it.
@GaiashKetoji It's a good argument but is often torn to bits by opposition. I think it is often the religious connotation of marriage that freaks opposition out, even though nowadays religion plays a very small part marriage in the UK at least.
I agree, gay marriage should be legalised not because a relationship isn't enough but, because the title implies something. If a heterosexual couple are in a relationship that is classified as common law (that's what it's called in Canada) it doesn't seem to hold the same as having a husband or wife. So why should it be any different for homosexual couples?
LOVE IS A CONNETION WITH PEPOLE THAT FEEL AND CREATE A LOVE BOND WITH EACHOTHER LOVE IS LOVE NOT STRAGIT AND GAY NO LABILES LOVE IS JUST LOVE MALE WITH MALE MALE WITH FEMALE FEMALE WITH FEMALE DOSENT MATTER ITS OK
I'd much rather phrase it as same sex marriage rather than gay marriage since I find 'gay marriage' quite erasing (to bi and other people who don't fit within the binary of straight or gay). I'm pretty against marriage and I think that civil partnerships should be open to everyone and marriage should be got rid of and left as a religious thing. But I think also that there are other issues facing the LGBT+ community (like the whole homeless LGBT youths issue) that no one seems to be addressing.
@StarsSuspended1 That's fair enough, gay marriage just rolls off the tongue easier for me. I think to erase marriage would not work, it is too inbedded in our culture and I think it does have lovely ideals behind it. I do however agree tat civil partnerships should be allowed for hetero couples too.
I agree that being as the issue of gay marriage has not been one that we in Britain hear about too often in the political arena that it should brought up and debated in parliament. I think that it will eventually be passed largly because we don't have a very large militant anti-gay lobby in this country. The sooner this issue is raised in parliament the sooner I think it should pass but we cannot afford to be complacent about it.
@grnlfe01 Something that worried me was the appearance of an anti-gay movement I haven't seen in mainstream politics in my lifetime. I too have a habit of complacency as I have been lucky enough to never have any homophobia directed my way.
@rhymingwithoranges Not even here on the internet? That's impressive. Mind you it wasn't really until you mentioned in this video that I realized you were gay. Well in any case. It can't hurt to be proactive. I think the reason we in Britain aren't as militant about these issues is that they don't appear to be as pressing here because their is not the level of institutionalised homophobia in a lot of governmental policies. Lets hope Cameron doesn't backtrack on this.
as for you getting married to a man or a woman or a Martian i don't see why it's anyone else's friggin business who you love and nobody has the right to dictate that
I think you do really well old boy. Been following you for a long time and you always got some interesting debates going. for my part personally I don't agree with marriage full stop lol I think it's a redundant institution and that the reason the divorce rates are climbing is that we are living longer and longer "till death do us part" is 3 or 4 times the length of commitment it used to be lol so I personally think it should be scrapped
@snappingturtle101 Thanks :). I don't agree. I think marriage has some good values that our society can still learn from. Hence why I think we should be able to do so. Thanks for your input :)
@rhymingwithoranges Any time dude :-) I meant no disrespect its exactly as I phrased it lol I don't believe in the institution but I would fiercely defend your right to do it. I don't believe in abortion but I strongly believe in the right to choose that sort of thing. none of that has to do with same sex marriage :-) I mean I don't believe in marriage lol. All that being said NO JUMPED UP SUIT should get away with telling you who you can and cannot spend your life with.
I read something a few back, 'One day in the future, we're going to look back at this and laugh at how ignorant we were, just like we do now to the racism issues' and I think it has a point, there's no need to seperate people because they happen to fall in love with someone, be it man or female. I don't understand why kids in America get bullied so badly for being gay that they commit suicide, it just isn't right.
I never really understood what's wrong with gay marriage. Some people say that it's a different kind of love, but I don't think it even is that, it's just someone being attracted to one gender but not the other. It's just love, and people who love each other should be allowed to marry.
And I don't understand why people oppose gay marriage. If it's legalised, it doesn't affect them in any way.
@rhymingwithoranges I don't think a debate is absolutely necessary,but it's probably good if there is one, because you never know - a grumbling person might come up with a good reason against (the ones I've heard aren't very good and I can't think of a good one) and we'll have a clearer understanding of why they're so against it. I also think that it'd create a better atmosphere if people got to formally state their opinions,so yeah - imo a debate is better than no debate. :)
I have been following your videos for years. I always considered you an extremely articulate young man with a knack for getting current events out there and getting interesting debates going about them. I did not know/care/suspect that you were gay. I am a gay man in his sixties who wishes that he could have been born a little later during this more tolerate time. I must say that I am very proud of you for this thread and your brave declaration. I think you are my new hero.
@larry11656 Thank you so much for your kind words but really, it's nothing. I am very lucky to have grown up in a time when I have been able to be who I am and not be stereotyped by my sexuality. You just need to look at the comments in this video to see how far we have com. :)
@rhymingwithoranges You are so lucky to never have had issue with it, I mean I live in a liberal college town in North West Washington (State) and I still had quite a lot of trouble in school(and I'm only 24) with what others (correctly) perceived my sexuality to be, and I do also get stereotyped quite often too buy others.
I'm bisexual and i think everyone's equal. I mean we've got all rights for blacks, woman and gays should be next to be classed as equal so why are people even fighting against it? I don't see any reason why gay marriage is seen as wrong when 2 people are in love how can it be? and some gay people are religious so are you really going to destroy there dreams of say getting married in a religious place because you follow a dated book which regards woman is lesser? gays should have equal rights
@camden2010x So you believe that people should respect the rights of black people, women and gay people, but you are willing to make disparaging comments about a religion? If you promote respect for people's rights, then respect everyone's rights, including the rights and beliefs of religious organisations.
This is a really great analysis of the difference... I'm sorry to say I don't really pay much attention to this issue because it has no relevance to me immediately but the moment someone like you says something I may never have noticed - like your partner is not a husband... I'd be standing at parliament with you if you asked. Thanks for making me aware.
I think gay marriage should be legalised, as long as that means gay people choosing to get married in a secular ceremony. I don't think that any religious organisation should be forced to hold gay marriage ceremonies that would be completely against their beliefs. Slightly off topic, but I know it's a concern as the church is getting less and less power about how much choice they can have over who they marry.
@becomingbindy But non-religious people are allowed to get married in religious settings all the time. This is a little off topic, because we shouldn't be running before we walk, but it is hard for me to be okay with that. I understand a gay couple is against the teachings of many religions but... sigh. The thing is, the church of england allows gays to marry there anyway, so I'm covered.
@rhymingwithoranges I think it's fair enough if a religious leader feels comfortable holding a gay marriage service and chooses to, but I completely disagree with any law making it illegal for religious leaders to choose that they are uncomfortable with it and refuse. I equally disagree with any law that makes it illegal for religious leaders to choose not to marry non-religious people, but if they feel comfortable with it, I don't see a problem.
I'm not gay but I think if you're in a gay couple and the government says "you don't have the same relationship as straight couples" I'd be pretty pissed off. Perhaps I'm naïve, but I just don't see any reason why people are still homophobes in the 21st century. If you love someone, you should be able to marry them, regardless of sexuality. (Admittedly, I'm speaking from no experience in this field, but you get my point!)
@jellybeangravy Fear of change. That's why they're still scared. What our generation and the comments in this video suggest is that homophobia is on the down.
We absolutely agree with you - Members of the old commonwealth still have UK laws on the statute book - We know that when UK have full marriage equality other nations will follow - weather we like it or not UK still has a moral lead on social issues well beyond its boarders - Just look how often the UK military position on gays serving openly impacted on the abolition of DADT in America - President Obama quoted the UK several times as an example of intergration and integrity.
trevortrevortsr2 2 days ago
Ewwwww your gay!
luljackson 5 days ago
@luljackson that's kinda immature and it's your'e not your.
purplebob101010 6 hours ago
The problem is people identify marriage, a religious construct, as the goal of a relationship. I think that, while gay couples should be entitled to the same legal recognition as heterosexual couples, since the term marriage is a religious one it should be left to the religious community to say whether or not it's still called marriage. Mixing religion and law doesn't the way to go.
"What's in a name? That which we call a rose
By any other name would smell as sweet." ~Shakespeare
Qw3rtypop 1 week ago
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A neurotic sexual fetish affected by modeling the opposite sex parent to compensate for a complication of intimacy with distant or absent mother or father is hardly a basis for a marriage relationship. Underlying all neurotic conditions are ego problems accompanied by low self-esteem. Once the person begins engage in homosexual relations it becomes a sexual addiction with an intense compulsive desire for only same sex relationships. Self-esteem will not improve until the person abstains.
amerlibmov 2 weeks ago
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arp553 2 weeks ago
@arp553 Homsexuality can be "Adiquate" & somtime pretty fantastic : )
trevortrevortsr2 2 weeks ago in playlist Liked videos
I will never understand why gay marriage is debated so heatedly. If two consenting adults want to get married, there is no reason to stop them from doing so. I understand the religious aspects of the argument, but since religion has absolutely no place in government, the fanatics should just shut their mouths and let the rest of us get on with our lives.
Smogget 2 weeks ago 2
...(cont) that homosexuality is not a god damned sin, and forcing the church to finally recognise and DO SOMETHING about the rampart discrimination in their institution, and that goes across the board, in schools, churches, everywhere up to and including The Vatican.
P.S. I thought you were bisexual? Didn't you blog about this years ago?
OrgasmandTea 3 weeks ago
I think it's because we're so far removed from religion. Civil partnership is marriage without the church, but often marriage is marriage without the church. In America, they're waaaaay more religious than we are, and the church is still a major factor in politics, so of course the debate will be more fierce. Over here, we don't care. I do however agree with you that gay marriage should be legalised, however, I believe this should be more in the context of forcing the church to recognise (cont)
OrgasmandTea 3 weeks ago
I think that you're completely right, I'm gay, and I'd like to think that someday I could get married and be classified as having the same relationship as a heterosexual couple. I never really thought that it was different until I saw this video, it really put it in perspective for me. I go to a catholic high school, and although I don't shout it from the rooftops, I'd like to think that if somebody asked, I could openly say that I was gay. But it seems that when somebody did ask me that, I fro
ahbalin 3 weeks ago
@ahbalin how could a same sex couple ever have a relationship that is classified the same as a hetero couple? Surely it defeats the classification system - unless you think marriage only involves love and not procreation?
ConspiracyLoon 3 weeks ago
@ConspiracyLoon Hey you need to look at a marriage licence - Its an exclusive contract between two consenting adults - it says nothing about procreation - Gay people can & do have kids
trevortrevortsr2 3 weeks ago
@trevortrevortsr2 A gay couple cannot have 'their own' children. Yeah, you can marry two people together - but in the eyes of whom? the state? I suggest if they feel love for each other it doesn't matter who does or doesn't know it. All that matters is their love and the state not coming inbetween it. Why not just make their own 'legally binding' contract? Why do you need permission from the state? U know that's what a license is right?
ConspiracyLoon 2 weeks ago
@ConspiracyLoon No shit - no wonder my b/f is not pregnant LOL
Think we would say first of all it a recongnised lifetime commitment to each other witnessed by everyone important in our live - then it lets everyone we don't know identify our importance to each other - and lastly it allows us to access the legal securities to suport our family in a crisiss ( pretty much the same reasons as st8 people marry) Yes we know what a licence is - do you know what real equality is?
trevortrevortsr2 2 weeks ago
@trevortrevortsr2 (1/2)The simple answer to that is; No, I do not know what "real equality" is. Equality before the law? Sexuality, Gender, Race, Culture, Inclination, I say give all freedom to do what they want so long as they do not infringe upon the rights of others. I do not see any reason for gay people not to have a "gay old time" together, married infront of witnesses yada. What I do mind is telling "institutional mindsets", or, to put it another way, telling tax payers
ConspiracyLoon 2 weeks ago
@ConspiracyLoon (2/2) that they must believe in something that isn't life threatening like LGBT/Union subsidies, so much, that they should not even question their "tax dollar" going on it. Like telling the church they have to "let gays adopt the children they have saved", like telling the old christian couple in a BnB if they don't allow bumsex in their rooms, they're not allowed a BnB. I'd like to make it clear, I don't have a problem with gay marriage passe, more (ok, 3rd, lol)
ConspiracyLoon 2 weeks ago
@ConspiracyLoon the subtle connections the legislation has with procreation and making people accept what has nothing to do with them anyway i.e. taxes and "group psychology".
ConspiracyLoon 2 weeks ago
@ConspiracyLoon It's crazy my partners genitals are his, mine and occassionaly our doctors buisness no one elses - why do people obsess about things that don't concern them - bum sex is not an exclusive gay activity though many st8's kid themselves it is to fit in with their desire to distance themselves from somthing they percieve as a bit icky - bum sex is one of the reasons gay guys get grief more than lesbians
trevortrevortsr2 2 weeks ago
@ConspiracyLoon Welcome to our world - pleased you don't have a problem with gay marriage - taxes bother you - had you thought about all the things funded by taxes that most gay people don't access but seldom gripe about ?- moderate tax expenditure to assist establish equality seems reasonable - its no good waxing lyricly about equality then when people discriminate not challenge it - I have no sympathy for the church adoption or B&B who think they are above the law
trevortrevortsr2 2 weeks ago
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arp553 2 weeks ago
I really don't think there's any point in talking about governments forcing churches to acknowledge same sex religious marriages because that's out of their control, and will come with time. But the fact that the relationship between a same sex couple and heterosexual couple are at all different is ridiculous. Marriage is no longer 'religious' it's more 'together for life' and I don't like a government telling anyone their love isn't right for that title.
AwkwardAmo 4 weeks ago
I'm Irish, so I don't know the ins and outs of Westminister but I know over here we're unlikely to make any big move towards legalising gay marriage until you do. There's an annual march for marriage in Dublin that's been ignored for years. Since the introduction of civil partnership politicians seem to have wiped their hands of the gay community, but until gay marriage is legalised we don't have EQUALITY. It's time the concept of "traditional family" faces the reality of the 21st century.
AwkwardAmo 4 weeks ago
I constantly hear "yea, but two gay blokes with love is a better upbringing for a child than two straight people without love" - they seem to be missing quite a big point here, and that is balance - all children need role models of both sexes, they also need to see how they functionally interact/relate to one another. The question oughtta be rephrased - "who'd be better as parents, two loving straights? or two loving homosexuals?" I think the answer is obviously upsetting for the latter.
ConspiracyLoon 1 month ago
What rights does marriage give you? I thought it meant you can't own 2 homes without paying capital growth tax? they take benefits away from couples and made it more financially lucrative to stay single actually... fuck staying together for the kids.... I don't understand why homothexuals are so obssessed with getting acceptance from the straight community. Perhaps the benefits marriage traditionally bought to a couple were actually for the benefit of their offspring??
ConspiracyLoon 1 month ago
The only issue is equality and I think the right wing MP's are against smuggled immigrant spouses and fictitious marriages which they should own up to. Because that's not the point.
Marcomanseckisax 1 month ago
I'm German and we have a similar status to the UK: Civil partnerships but no same-sex marriage. In both cases it's strange, because the state has legalised marriage (nothing to do with the church) and it has no reason to discriminate against same-sex marriage. Church marriage here is separate, that is a matter for the churches. But we need to hear why the politicians are against gay marriage, they need to come clean on this.
Marcomanseckisax 1 month ago
A man with a woman has been God's pattern for marriage since creation. To expect churches to legitimatise other unions as marriage is for the state to overstep its bounds. Enforcing the rights of one group can end up infringing on the rights of others, rights such as freedom of belief and speech.
Oct23rd4004BC 1 month ago
@Oct23rd4004BC 1. a man with several women has been "God's pattern for marriage since creation". Read the first few pages of Genesis. Polygamy was the norm back in the day...
2. He isn't asking the church to legitimatize. He's asking the government to legalize. And in what way would the church be overstepping their bounds?
welaughindoors91 1 month ago
@Oct23rd4004BC 3. you're right. Enforcing the opinions ("right"? so you admit it's a right they're entitled to?) of one group can infringe the rights of others. Like not allowing 2 consenting adults to marry bc of bigotry. Legalizing gay marriage would in no way infringe your right to oppose it and express that opposition.
welaughindoors91 1 month ago
@welaughindoors91 So it wouldn't infringe the rights of the old couple when they refused to let homosexuals enjoy bumsex in one of their BnB rooms? It doesn't infringe the rights of the church who have always been opposed to homosexuality to be forced into letting homosexual people adopt the children they have previously looked after (please no jokes about catholic paedophilia....).
ConspiracyLoon 1 month ago
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welaughindoors91 4 weeks ago
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@ConspiracyLoon I'm not all that knowledgable about the nuances of UK law but yeah, pretty sure it wouldn't. the sort of discrimination you described in the bed and bathroom scenario is already illegal, regardless of the legal stance of gay marriage (not to mention arguing intolerance of intolerance is intolerant is a really stupid argument). Same goes for your church example. Gay adoptions are already allowed.
welaughindoors91 4 weeks ago
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welaughindoors91 1 month ago
@Oct23rd4004BC ....were you being satirical with this post? my troll senses are tingling
welaughindoors91 1 month ago
If gay marriage doesn't negatively affect my rights, I do not see why it is such a problem. I will fight for other rights any day.
littlemks 1 month ago
Gay or not you're still very hot! Lol, unintentional rhyme~
Ailacake 1 month ago
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TheRuiMartins 1 month ago
This is just a theory but I think that the reason there has been more activism about gay marriage in America is that they are more religious than we are. To them marriage means a lot more, even to the gay community.
whisperingsunbeams 1 month ago
One more point. Churches have always been allowed to discrimate on who they marry, based on their faith tenets. Why should it be different with gay marriage. I think that this is a real red herring by the antigay marriage folks. Remember, the Catholic church has prevented divorced straight people from marrying in their churches and face no legal sanctions for it.
kramkatz 1 month ago
So it is true. All perfect men are gay. T_T
YourFavoriteAries 1 month ago
you are right...love is love and it should be legal to anyone. its 2012!! time to finally realize the equality thought. politicians always talk about it but also should do something about it.
eastsidejess 1 month ago
Gays are convinced they are all Divas.!!! It is just out of the best comedy.! I have actually enjoyed watching a group of homossexuals when Patrick Swayze , Wesley Snipes acted in the excellent comedy "Thanks for everything Julie Newmar". Being gay is good for comedy....not to be taken seriously!
TheRuiMartins 1 month ago
@TheRuiMartins Obvious troll is obvious. :)
YourFavoriteAries 1 month ago 2
@YourFavoriteAries - You must be confusing me with all of your boyfriends lady! We bring into the coversation our experiences and if you mention trolling it means you are used having it around you! Obviously, it is quite shamefull, hum?!
TheRuiMartins 1 month ago
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Talking about Nazis, I think Hitler was gay as well otherwise, I am 100% sure there would be much much less gay people on Earth. Very unfair situation for the JEWS. Everybody knows to be true that just watching a man acting and talking like a woman is quite embarrassing and a woman acting and talking like a man very weird to say the least. It is like, you have a skin cancer condition and you go around showing it off for the sake of attention. Sad!
TheRuiMartins 1 month ago
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TheRuiMartins 1 month ago
People should have the basic human right to love whomever they want and not have to be judged by some backwards bible bashing Nazis.
v0tra 1 month ago
....I'm a heterosexual women and to be honest, the gay community shouldn't be the only people fighting for this bill. If government decided to take another human right from the public such as the right to liberty I'm pretty sure a larger percentage of the public would have something to say
amifoll94 1 month ago
Europe does come into this, considering the fact we as a country cannot have law that is incompatible with EU law, gay marriage should have been legalised a long time a go. Article 9 of the Human Rights Act states of the right to marry and civil partnerships only supplement this right when in actual fact, if Britian believes in this Human Rights Act, the bill for gay marriage should have been passed in 1998! ..
amifoll94 1 month ago
Thanks for sharing on this issue as well as how it affects you personally. You're right, perhaps we're more vocal in the US because it's so much more of a fight against ignorance (we seem to like repeating mistakes we've made in this country despite the pain they've caused). Consider yourself lucky living in the UK. Separate but equal is not a reality and gay marriage doesn't mean that you would also be able to marry your dog (weak logic that's seriously accepted within large circles in the US).
markobmf 1 month ago
Gay couples should stick with the "Civil Partnership" and leave Marriage alone. Marriage is God's Presence in this Union and, as far as I am aware, He has not created a sperm cell to run around completely lost in your intestine or stomach! The reason gay couples fight for MARRIAGE and CHILDREN is the same that makes a black person wanting to be white....an inferiority complex
TheRuiMartins 1 month ago
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TheRuiMartins 1 month ago
All that is wrong about gay relationships has become "accepted" because from the beginning of life on Earth, sex has taken over intelligence. We watch animals killing each other because of it, powerful people forcing men/women and children to submit to their desires, sex being used to achieve personall goals. That is why we have law makers deciding in favour. Because people prefer to live with the illness than being cured.....
TheRuiMartins 1 month ago
I see your point about how using different words for homosexual unions and heterosexual unions suggest that they are "equal, but different", but, by the same token, couldn't you say the same thing about the relationships between, say, mother & son and father & daughter? Different words; same relationship (in essence).
charlyandjosh 1 month ago
You know, I was actually discussing this very issue with my gay best friend back last month (he's also a member of the Conservative party and a gay porn star, incidentally). I'm paraphrasing here, but he raised the point that this is mainly an issue over semantics - if a homosexual civil partnership is every bit as legal as a heterosexual marriage, then is there really much of an issue? He felt that we should be more worked up about gay rights in other countries, e.g. the African nations.
charlyandjosh 1 month ago
I have tried to understand the opposition to gay marriage but I do not. At its core, marriage is a contractual arrangement between two people. Legalizing civil marriage between two people of the same sex would not force any religious institution to perform a rite of marriage were it against the rules of that faith tradition. There is so much inborn fear of being "the other" in people who protest against gay rights. I always wonder what such people are really afraid of.
kramkatz 1 month ago
What is making gay relationships very dangerous is the idea of children getting involved in this! This matter of gay couple getting children into the picture does nothing but prove the immaturity of these people. For them it is like playing mummys and daddys! To show the arrogance and irrespopnsability of these people, I mention the idea of removing the moment of conception when mum and dad were making love to what? Back to the bird dropping you through the roof Chimenea or " a glass tube?
TheRuiMartins 1 month ago
@TheRuiMartins Dude whats Dangerous!!!! have you heard yourself,!!! God and your a human being!!!!!
BROOL23 1 month ago
@BROOL23 - I guess being gay is all very normal to you. I find it dangerous for my children, who are 9 and 4! I FEAR the times when they will meet people like you, in the future, who may turn them gay. When you have a gay sexual relationship you have missed the point of Life!
TheRuiMartins 1 month ago
@TheRuiMartins The fact that you're their parent should be your children's greatest fear
markobmf 1 month ago
@markobmf - I can only feel sorry to know your parents have allowed/promoted your illness. I will support my children to understand what being gay means and maybe become psychologists/psychiatrists and find a cure for homossexuality. That would make my life on Earth definitely not a waste of energy&matter as being gay is!
TheRuiMartins 1 month ago
@TheRuiMartins Your a disgusting human being to condemn people for no other reason than their sexual orientation. You think those people out there who are doctors and scientists and aid workers who just happen to be gay are wasting their life? You sicken me.
v0tra 1 month ago
@v0tra - I am sure nothing can be more disgusting than allowing a penis into your rectum and probably afterwards put it in your mouth!!! That makes your more disgusting than I. surely! With regards to the gay doctors and scientists...were not for their skills they would indeed be a total waste of life but the majority are intelligent enough to change their lives. the same cannot be said about you, right?
TheRuiMartins 1 month ago
since the very first day I saw your video(about 3 yrs ago), I knew you are gay, but the day you said Daily Mail is your fav paper, I began to doubt my gaydar.
This country's insidious homophobia is a haunting problem, which I can't understand, as a Chinese gay man
geomcqueen 1 month ago
@geomcqueen The daily Mail , Now known as the DaIiy Fail lol
BROOL23 1 month ago
I'm totally in favour of gay marriage and think it should be passed whether it's a "pressing issue" or not. I myself am for the most part heterosexual, but for a while now I've been accepting of the fact that it is possible that the next person I fall in love with could be another girl/woman. I don't see why this is a problem. It's not an "illness"! That's a ridiculous thing to say! If homosexuality wasn't natural then it wouldn't have come to be, would it? Think about WHAT you're saying.
LIZZIEfication 1 month ago
The reason I say Homossexuality=Bestiality is because animals do it but they are......beasts. I, quite happily know, have evolved!
TheRuiMartins 1 month ago
The supporting arguments of gay relationships are as weak as the ones that support corruption, the use of force against citizens for security reasons etc. They are used to defend hidden interests and a major problem in Society
TheRuiMartins 1 month ago
All that is wrong about gay relationships has become "accepted" because from the beginning of life on Earth, sex has taken over intelligence. We watch animals killing each other because of it, powerful people forcing men/women and children to submit to their desires, sex being used to achieve personall goals. That is why we have law makers deciding in favour. Because people prefer to live with the illness than being cured.....
TheRuiMartins 1 month ago
I agree with you, I think you do need to have a debate. I'm in Canada, and even though gay marriage is legalized here, we still need to keep talking about it otherwise people will get "grumpy" and start to openly rebel against it. I think as a general rule it's good to keep talking about things you believe in, and never let them rest, even if what you were fighting for has been achieved, always keep striving for the better.
therampantbookworm 1 month ago in playlist More videos from rhymingwithoranges
My auntie is in a civil partnership and she has been with her wife as long as my parents have been together (over 20 years). Growing up with them in my family I have never seen the love that they share as any different from the love between, say, my parents. My auntie's wife had two children from a previous, heterosexual, marriage and they raised them together as a lesbian couple. Their way of parenting didn't seem any different from the way I was parented.
I think gay marriage should be legal.
AnAbundanceOfKathryn 1 month ago
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TheRuiMartins 1 month ago
@theRuiMartins Did you just compare gay sex to sex with a animal/insect? I'm just speechless. WTF is wrong with you? How is raping some poor animal the same as two men who love each other, doing a natural thing?
isaac78russell 1 month ago
@isaac78russell _ It is not natural. Anal sex is not natural! My comparison with animal and INCEST (NOT insect) comes from the fact that Nature did not evolved so that sex between 2 males made sense. Gay sex simply shows that the mind (even animals) is very weak in controling sexual impulses but that does not mean that we shouldn't! Many gay men and women became so because they were either abused as a child or as adults, they were in need of sex and took any chance. I have seen it happening!
TheRuiMartins 1 month ago
@TheRuiMartins First of all, it is natural cause otherwise it wouldn't be able to happen. Secondly, you have completely missed the point of this debate. It's about gay MARRIAGE, which is to do with LOVE, not sex. It's about having equality in the eyes of society in being able to show the commitment that two people have to each other. And yet, in your line of reasoning, you make the jump from THAT to incest and bestiality?! And people like you think that WE are the weird ones?!
strangebob2007 1 month ago
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@strangebob2007 -About Marriage?! Please...!Gay sex is a psychological deviation.It is on this prespective that I say gay people fall in love for each other because of sex or on wrongly feel you are a man or a woman when you are not.It is natural because it happens?!Why is incest a crime?Because the law does not accept that close relatives fall for each other. Is it not Love? Does it not happen, too?Mainly on young people .Homossexuality is bestiality and it is sad. Sorry
TheRuiMartins 1 month ago
@TheRuiMartins Anything that ever happens is "natural". Things that are unnatural include walking on water and coming back from the dead because these are things that can not occur in the natural world. Anal sex may be unusual, yes, but the very fact that it occurs, by definition, is natural.
And the sexual abuse and "taking what you can get" theories have been disproven so many times that there are reputable psychologist and scientists laughing at you. Educate yourself, dear.
Minish 1 month ago
@Minish - I do not see how a sperm cell looking for an egg in your rectum is considered "natural". Surely you live in a pighole and find it quite suitable to your needs. "Walking on water"? Just because you cannot do it, does not mean that some beings can't either, Educate yourself, maybe watching the National Geographic. Death is Natural, but you cannot kill, You may fall in love with your sister/brother but it is Incest and a crime. Gay sex should be as well. It is all about votes.
TheRuiMartins 1 month ago
@TheRuiMartins Rofl, let me be honest with you, I'm not expecting you to change your mind. Bigotry and ignorance are a dangerous combination. And really, I wouldn't be surprised if you're even that bothered, just trolling for attention.
But I just wanna say, if it's unnatural to use parts of the body for sexual stimulation other than reproductive organs and should be criminalized, than masturbation and oral sex should be equally penalized. Think it through, mate.
Minish 1 month ago
@Minish - I have thought it through and stick with it! Just because you level yourself down to a beast does not mean I will do more than feel sorry for you!
TheRuiMartins 1 month ago
@TheRuiMartins Right. Now I'm confident you're just trolling.
That's it for me in this conversation. No point in having a discussion with someone who just likes to stir up bile 'cuz they're bored or desperate for attention or something.
Minish 1 month ago
@Minish - Looking for attention?...Trolling?! If you noticed that about me why bother writing it down?
TheRuiMartins 1 month ago
@isaac78russell - The romantic view of Gay sex is no more than the best medicine for it. It is more fun to accept you are gay than fight it back! And remember love is not based on sex, Love is much, much more than that!
TheRuiMartins 1 month ago
I'm a straight female and the fact that marriage is still, in a way, "regulated" by the government makes me extremely uncomfortable, the fact that the law is so backwards and heteronormative in this respect makes me uncomfortable. It's easy for straight couples to say they don't want to get married, or that they prefer a civil partnership because they actually HAVE the choice, and I don't think anybody should be keeping same-sex couples from getting married if this is what they want.
dianasof 1 month ago
Actually, watching this video for a second time has done nothing but convince me that Gay Marriage should remain forever banned in the UK.
Why? ....
/Activatestalkermode
Because Gay Marriage should only be legalized if rhymingwithoranges will marry me :p
/Deactivatestalkermode.
bhavvv 1 month ago 8
Awesome video.
thathoopy 1 month ago
@electrogear - Look up "Zach Wahls Speaks About Family" I think this well spoken young man might disagree with your opinion on gay's raising children
AdamB175 1 month ago
Look, I COMPLETELY agree with you. I don't know what it's like in Britain but in Ireland (well in my life anyway) it is a very common topic of conversation. My family and friends are all very open about the issue and support it completely even though none of us (as far as I know) are gay. Gay marriages SHOULD be allowed and the government SHOULD be bombarded about this issues...
DoctorWaffle1997 1 month ago
as an american i honestly didn't know that other countries aren't fighting as hard as we are. I am a straight female (high school student- 16 yrs old) but i am fairly active in my community on the issue and it is an issue discussed a lot in school and government. Even with all this attention though, i don't see the movement making any progress. it's quite sad, really. i just want to slap the conservatives in the face and tell them to wake up; people are angry, people are gay and that's okay.
HogwartsTimeLord 1 month ago
My brother is gay and if I'm honest after 5 years I'm still adjusting to see him holding hands with guys. I'm not homophobic - that is, I'm not scared or offended by homosexuality but I don't think anybody can be truely at ease with it unless they are themselves homosexual or have been exposed to it from an early age. That said, I don't think it's right for two men to bring up a child either, its not fair on the child. Gay marriage is fine, as is sex - it's not my business what you choose to do.
electrogear 1 month ago
How does public debate even operate in Britain today Jazza? Does newspapers ranting at us constitute debate? Does a Vicar, an Imam and a Rabbi debating on Newsnight count as public debate? Do you think that folk down the pub will really get into the debate? Debate essentially happens at the ballot box, and if the Tories were voted into power with a mandate to pass the law, then the debate is over save for the Parliamentary vote.
JoelJoel321 1 month ago
Quote from MP Andrew J Pelling when I sent him this video. "@Legendariums of course. Caring stable relationships help both people and society." Hopefully this will be adhered to by Mr Pelling and other MPs regardless of Party.
Legendariums 1 month ago
Most of the gay friends I have are content with Civil Partnerships and have been, if you like, socially conditioned to be a-okay with 2nd class. We don't have the religious right sticking the issue in our faces in the UK, so the debate isn't very heated or - may I say - very funded. We're likely to get Gay Marriage here and it's clear that anyone who disagrees will be on the wrong side of history.
brummyboypro 1 month ago
as a Canadian I find it interesting that the UK still doesn't allow gay marriage and that they aren't really fighting for it. I am a straight female but many of my friends are gay and so it has always been something I've fought for. I think that a debate could be a good thing because literally the opposition would have is religious and the whole separation between church and state thing would come into play. Showing people how irrational their arguments are could be a really good thing.
EightTobiins 1 month ago
I think here the activism is sparked from the courage of another group standing up; or as I'm referring it as the domino affect of national change. Americans tend to be hard-headed, so it's hard to not do something. Also religion takes part of it to. The government here is set to be operated as a separation of church and state, yet the two overlap quite a lot and people have a problem with that too.
edgehaedjr 1 month ago
I personally believe it's hard for me to wrap my brain for an answer on possible why the UK is more hush-hush than that of US in regards to same-sex marriage and the fight for equality. On the American standpoint, I think people in the US are more active because these laws that are trampled over are done so like a stamped of wild animals going in one direction in a small space. Every minority has faced discrimination and I believe that's what pushes us more. The ability to rebel and be outspoken
edgehaedjr 1 month ago
godspeed man, we deserve to has the same rights as everybody else.
Zaring15 1 month ago
You're a sweetheart! Thank you!! :)
093quicksilver 1 month ago
many different world views and ideologies within one nation, and I don't think, being a religious person myself, that leaders shouldn't be able make important decisions based on religious beliefs. Give people their freedom to decide for themselves, within reason, what they want to do with their lives. You can have a say within your place of worship, and your personal life. Even from a Christian perspective, God gave people the choice to do what they want.
mrjohnnylipps 1 month ago
@mrjohnnylipps I don't think leaders should* be able to make important decisions based on religious beliefs.
mrjohnnylipps 1 month ago
because of that. In the original Living dead film, there is a scene where two lesbians are together, or making out, and they get eaten by zombies because of it. It was a social commentary in my opinion. It's important but if your focusing on things like that, your going to get eaten alive on the whole. I know it's your life, and that is very important. I think all people should have the same rights as everyone else in a country. Even if you are a politician with a religious background you have
mrjohnnylipps 1 month ago
I'm from America. I think it's important to talk about, but I also think there are way more important topics in government right now. I'm not saying gay rights are not important, but it is nothing like the American Civil rights movement back in the 60's. At this point most gay people are fighting for a right to marriage like everyone else and not for their life, for the right to sit where they want on a bus, or to be able to go to the same schools as other people. It may take more time
mrjohnnylipps 1 month ago
I'mstraight and would particually mind if gay marriage was legal but perp has I'm part of the problem, maybe it's passive beliefs that have delayed and immediate action for gay marriage.
MostlySashaMostly 1 month ago
I don't get why people can be against same sex marriage. According to the law it's just a contract and love isn't even mentioned. Civil marriage and marriage in a church or whatever are not the same. I live in Belgium and was 16 when same sex marriage became legal ( it's not gay because two heterosexual men/women can get married as well). I learned about it later and thought 'cool I'm equal'. Then you read the fine print and realize that for some strange reason gay equality has many small steps
BachelorinLeuven 1 month ago
Why is it you want to be legal partners? Contracted to the state in Marriage or Civil Partnership? If an institution disapproves of homosexuality, then why do you want their blessing? I don't understand.
ConspiracyLoon 1 month ago
@ConspiracyLoon Much of it has to do with legal rights and privileges. Married folk under the law have access to a slough of rights that unmarried or civil union people do not have. If the state only provided civil unions to all persons then that might be fair but they endow rights under the name of marriage.
SanDiegoArtNut 1 month ago
Beautifully said. P.S. #CRUSH #SWOON
SoulTapestry 1 month ago
I am surprised that there is not really much backlash against anti gay marriage politicians in the UK. I'm from Washington State and even though it is not clenched yet, we are one vote in the state senate away from gay marriage and the political action public out cry,and gay rights organized Corporate call is for gay marriage (with the states largest employers throwing their support behind gay marriage) Not to mention the stink raised over the Anti Gay GOP candidates.
americancarguy 1 month ago
@americancarguy
I actually agree with you.
The issue in the UK isnt a homophobic public, as is the issue in the USA. The majority of the UK public including Christians support gay rights and marriage, it is purely the fault of the politicians who simply place a complete ban on gay marriage.
If this issue had been put to public voting as it was in some parts of the USA, Gay Marriage would have legalised many many years ago in the UK, but our politicians dont believe in proper democracy.
bhavvv 1 month ago
@bhavvv Then like in the US the public has to get loud and pushy to get the politicians to do what needs to be done, and the gays are going to have to lead the charge. I know us Americans are seen as uncouth and down right rude and abrasive at times by many, but that Loud, Direct and Demanding way of doing things dose produce results. When it comes to such important things there is little room for high decorum.
americancarguy 1 month ago
... but this supposed sanctity can be dented by hetrosexual couples. Britney Spears & Jason Alexander's marraige lasted 2 days. Very recently Kim Kardashian & Kris Humphrie divorced after just 72 days. 51 year old actor Doug Hutchison married 16 y/o Courtney Stodden in Vegas in 2011. Gay couples like David and Michael Serkin-Poole have been together 25 years and raided three mentally disabled children, they can't marry. Any debate about gays ruining the sanctity of marriage in the UK is pathetic
BiffyBiro 1 month ago
@BiffyBiro *raised three mentally disabled children, not raided, ohdear haha.
BiffyBiro 1 month ago
Thankfully here in the UK I think legal restraints against lesbians and homosexuals are finally being lifted to the point of equality. Discrimination on a less governmental level, however, is perhaps something that could be tackled through debates. Conservatives, who are often also fundamentalist Christians, shout about the "sanctity" of marriage which they feel would be ruined by gays...
BiffyBiro 1 month ago
...and it was the ONLY such group in South East London, which is a big place. However, I knew so many people who would have benefited from such a group but just didn't know about it. This was partially due to funding, partially to schools' hesitation to advertise it (as if Section 28 was going to come back from the grave and bite them in the posterior). I tried to organise an assembly at my old secondary school was told it could potentially "encourage the problems you're looking to prevent."
strangebob2007 1 month ago
@strangebob2007 I can't believe that the school wouldn't want it to be advertised. Surely it is in school where these battles are fought and won. It's a shame. Well done for standing up for our rights though. I don't remember my school having anything like that support network, but then I was lucky enough to never get any homophobic bullying.
rhymingwithoranges 1 month ago
@rhymingwithoranges Thing is, they consulted the Year 13 Prefects on it, which means that the prefects' ignorance and insecurities affected their decisions. Last thing I heard, there's only 5% of schools in the country with a specific anti-homophobia clause to their regulations. Most seem to think that covering it under "anti-bullying" suffices, even though they still do specific assemblies on racism, sexism, class divide and disability - but NOT on LGBT issues. And that scares me.
strangebob2007 1 month ago
Whilst we have made a LOT of progress in this country in the past 50 years, there are a LOT of things that are still not really spoken about as much in comparison to the USA LGBT community - marriage and bullying being two of them. The US had campaigns like "NOH8" "FKH8" and "Think About What You Say". We do have Stonewall's "Some people are gay, get over it!" posters, but sometimes there doesn't feel like there's enough visible support, especially for gay youth. I used to go to a youth group...
strangebob2007 1 month ago
There's no reason for gay marriage not to be legal. Oh sure there are those that are against it but they have issues with homosexuality in general and it bothers them that homosexuality exists so of course they're going to be bothered. Listening to such an argument against the idea would be pointless as the ones making it wouldn't be effected by a gay couple being married in the slightest. The ones who are effected are the gay couples, they want the right to marry thus they should have it.
GaiashKetoji 1 month ago
@GaiashKetoji It's a good argument but is often torn to bits by opposition. I think it is often the religious connotation of marriage that freaks opposition out, even though nowadays religion plays a very small part marriage in the UK at least.
rhymingwithoranges 1 month ago
I agree, gay marriage should be legalised not because a relationship isn't enough but, because the title implies something. If a heterosexual couple are in a relationship that is classified as common law (that's what it's called in Canada) it doesn't seem to hold the same as having a husband or wife. So why should it be any different for homosexual couples?
thedumbledorkable 1 month ago
@thedumbledorkable Well said, thanks for the input. :)
rhymingwithoranges 1 month ago
LOVE IS A CONNETION WITH PEPOLE THAT FEEL AND CREATE A LOVE BOND WITH EACHOTHER LOVE IS LOVE NOT STRAGIT AND GAY NO LABILES LOVE IS JUST LOVE MALE WITH MALE MALE WITH FEMALE FEMALE WITH FEMALE DOSENT MATTER ITS OK
cooltyler44567 1 month ago
@cooltyler44567 Thanks for the kind words but maybe go easier on the capslock next time. :)
rhymingwithoranges 1 month ago
YESSS it should be legalized
cooltyler44567 1 month ago
@cooltyler44567 And it probably will be, but do you think an open discussion needs to happen beforehand?
rhymingwithoranges 1 month ago
I'd much rather phrase it as same sex marriage rather than gay marriage since I find 'gay marriage' quite erasing (to bi and other people who don't fit within the binary of straight or gay). I'm pretty against marriage and I think that civil partnerships should be open to everyone and marriage should be got rid of and left as a religious thing. But I think also that there are other issues facing the LGBT+ community (like the whole homeless LGBT youths issue) that no one seems to be addressing.
StarsSuspended1 1 month ago
@StarsSuspended1 That's fair enough, gay marriage just rolls off the tongue easier for me. I think to erase marriage would not work, it is too inbedded in our culture and I think it does have lovely ideals behind it. I do however agree tat civil partnerships should be allowed for hetero couples too.
rhymingwithoranges 1 month ago
I agree that being as the issue of gay marriage has not been one that we in Britain hear about too often in the political arena that it should brought up and debated in parliament. I think that it will eventually be passed largly because we don't have a very large militant anti-gay lobby in this country. The sooner this issue is raised in parliament the sooner I think it should pass but we cannot afford to be complacent about it.
grnlfe01 1 month ago
@grnlfe01 Something that worried me was the appearance of an anti-gay movement I haven't seen in mainstream politics in my lifetime. I too have a habit of complacency as I have been lucky enough to never have any homophobia directed my way.
rhymingwithoranges 1 month ago
@rhymingwithoranges Not even here on the internet? That's impressive. Mind you it wasn't really until you mentioned in this video that I realized you were gay. Well in any case. It can't hurt to be proactive. I think the reason we in Britain aren't as militant about these issues is that they don't appear to be as pressing here because their is not the level of institutionalised homophobia in a lot of governmental policies. Lets hope Cameron doesn't backtrack on this.
grnlfe01 1 month ago
I'm for same-sex marriage all the way, for all the reasons you stated.
songsfrompaul 1 month ago
@songsfrompaul Thanks :)
rhymingwithoranges 1 month ago
as for you getting married to a man or a woman or a Martian i don't see why it's anyone else's friggin business who you love and nobody has the right to dictate that
snappingturtle101 1 month ago
I think you do really well old boy. Been following you for a long time and you always got some interesting debates going. for my part personally I don't agree with marriage full stop lol I think it's a redundant institution and that the reason the divorce rates are climbing is that we are living longer and longer "till death do us part" is 3 or 4 times the length of commitment it used to be lol so I personally think it should be scrapped
snappingturtle101 1 month ago
@snappingturtle101 Thanks :). I don't agree. I think marriage has some good values that our society can still learn from. Hence why I think we should be able to do so. Thanks for your input :)
rhymingwithoranges 1 month ago
@rhymingwithoranges Any time dude :-) I meant no disrespect its exactly as I phrased it lol I don't believe in the institution but I would fiercely defend your right to do it. I don't believe in abortion but I strongly believe in the right to choose that sort of thing. none of that has to do with same sex marriage :-) I mean I don't believe in marriage lol. All that being said NO JUMPED UP SUIT should get away with telling you who you can and cannot spend your life with.
snappingturtle101 1 month ago
@snappingturtle101 here here! :P
rhymingwithoranges 1 month ago
I read something a few back, 'One day in the future, we're going to look back at this and laugh at how ignorant we were, just like we do now to the racism issues' and I think it has a point, there's no need to seperate people because they happen to fall in love with someone, be it man or female. I don't understand why kids in America get bullied so badly for being gay that they commit suicide, it just isn't right.
BeyondBrii 1 month ago
@BeyondBrii I completely agree.
rhymingwithoranges 1 month ago
I never really understood what's wrong with gay marriage. Some people say that it's a different kind of love, but I don't think it even is that, it's just someone being attracted to one gender but not the other. It's just love, and people who love each other should be allowed to marry.
And I don't understand why people oppose gay marriage. If it's legalised, it doesn't affect them in any way.
nillyvanilla3 1 month ago
@nillyvanilla3 well said. Do you think there should still be at least a debate, even though the bill will almost certainly pass?
rhymingwithoranges 1 month ago
@rhymingwithoranges I don't think a debate is absolutely necessary,but it's probably good if there is one, because you never know - a grumbling person might come up with a good reason against (the ones I've heard aren't very good and I can't think of a good one) and we'll have a clearer understanding of why they're so against it. I also think that it'd create a better atmosphere if people got to formally state their opinions,so yeah - imo a debate is better than no debate. :)
nillyvanilla3 1 month ago
Marriage for everyone. Civil partnerships for those who don't like the idea of marriage. Done.
They should just put me in charge of the country.
MusicFromBlueSkies 1 month ago 25
@MusicFromBlueSkies I second this!
rhymingwithoranges 1 month ago
I hope one day you'll become a MP.
Asinktet 1 month ago
@Asinktet Lol, that would be terrible. I wouldn't be allowed to have opinions.
rhymingwithoranges 1 month ago
Gay marriage is a moral imperative for society. Period.
larry11656 1 month ago
@larry11656 Do you think we should still be having a discussion despite the general consensus of the bill needing to pass?
rhymingwithoranges 1 month ago
I have been following your videos for years. I always considered you an extremely articulate young man with a knack for getting current events out there and getting interesting debates going about them. I did not know/care/suspect that you were gay. I am a gay man in his sixties who wishes that he could have been born a little later during this more tolerate time. I must say that I am very proud of you for this thread and your brave declaration. I think you are my new hero.
larry11656 1 month ago
@larry11656 Thank you so much for your kind words but really, it's nothing. I am very lucky to have grown up in a time when I have been able to be who I am and not be stereotyped by my sexuality. You just need to look at the comments in this video to see how far we have com. :)
rhymingwithoranges 1 month ago
@rhymingwithoranges You are so lucky to never have had issue with it, I mean I live in a liberal college town in North West Washington (State) and I still had quite a lot of trouble in school(and I'm only 24) with what others (correctly) perceived my sexuality to be, and I do also get stereotyped quite often too buy others.
americancarguy 1 month ago
I'm bisexual and i think everyone's equal. I mean we've got all rights for blacks, woman and gays should be next to be classed as equal so why are people even fighting against it? I don't see any reason why gay marriage is seen as wrong when 2 people are in love how can it be? and some gay people are religious so are you really going to destroy there dreams of say getting married in a religious place because you follow a dated book which regards woman is lesser? gays should have equal rights
camden2010x 1 month ago
@camden2010x So you believe that people should respect the rights of black people, women and gay people, but you are willing to make disparaging comments about a religion? If you promote respect for people's rights, then respect everyone's rights, including the rights and beliefs of religious organisations.
becomingbindy 1 month ago
@camden2010x It takes time, at least it looks like we are moving in the right direction.
rhymingwithoranges 1 month ago
This is a really great analysis of the difference... I'm sorry to say I don't really pay much attention to this issue because it has no relevance to me immediately but the moment someone like you says something I may never have noticed - like your partner is not a husband... I'd be standing at parliament with you if you asked. Thanks for making me aware.
paperheartzz 1 month ago
@paperheartzz Thank you for taking notice. :)
rhymingwithoranges 1 month ago
I think gay marriage should be legalised, as long as that means gay people choosing to get married in a secular ceremony. I don't think that any religious organisation should be forced to hold gay marriage ceremonies that would be completely against their beliefs. Slightly off topic, but I know it's a concern as the church is getting less and less power about how much choice they can have over who they marry.
becomingbindy 1 month ago
@becomingbindy But non-religious people are allowed to get married in religious settings all the time. This is a little off topic, because we shouldn't be running before we walk, but it is hard for me to be okay with that. I understand a gay couple is against the teachings of many religions but... sigh. The thing is, the church of england allows gays to marry there anyway, so I'm covered.
rhymingwithoranges 1 month ago
@rhymingwithoranges I think it's fair enough if a religious leader feels comfortable holding a gay marriage service and chooses to, but I completely disagree with any law making it illegal for religious leaders to choose that they are uncomfortable with it and refuse. I equally disagree with any law that makes it illegal for religious leaders to choose not to marry non-religious people, but if they feel comfortable with it, I don't see a problem.
becomingbindy 1 month ago
I'm not gay but I think if you're in a gay couple and the government says "you don't have the same relationship as straight couples" I'd be pretty pissed off. Perhaps I'm naïve, but I just don't see any reason why people are still homophobes in the 21st century. If you love someone, you should be able to marry them, regardless of sexuality. (Admittedly, I'm speaking from no experience in this field, but you get my point!)
jellybeangravy 1 month ago
@jellybeangravy Fear of change. That's why they're still scared. What our generation and the comments in this video suggest is that homophobia is on the down.
rhymingwithoranges 1 month ago