Actually God is real and Biblical tradition has everything to do with running a productive society. Our society has started to fall apart recently. Whores, gays, and people addicted to drugs and alcohol are common place. If we return to the Bible we will be better.
@Fire23eater Hmmm... Tough call. The Bible mentions mass genocide and having to respect a man who guts his own son. I'll take my chances with the hookers, gays and junkies - at least they have a sense of humour.
Im for it with the highest burden of proof. I have known that if I take someones life intentionally and unjustified that I will stand a chance of forfeiting mine since I was a kid. I cant argue with a good bargain though.
The phrase that Penn kept alive "killing another human" doesn't make me think any less about doing it. Because we aren't talking about humans, we are an animal spiecies just like all the rest. We fight for our food in some places, if someone murdered my family member or a friend i would do in kind to them that is animal instinct 101.
You sorry mother fucking bleeding hearts that haven't had the experience of this loss would know no better.
This is just another issue of selfishness. A person commits murder and is sentenced to death. The family of the victim probably supports this punishment as the grieving father shown in this video. On the other hand people who were not personally touched by the crime may see the punishment as cruel, and feel the need to voice that opinion, but......what if it were their daughter or son? That is the problem in this issue. You have to walk in their shoes, and you can't possibly do that.
@zzyzx0788 I think you may have a point there. That also made me think of a question that I'm sure many people have asked before, but here it goes. is revenge our earliest and most instinctual form of justice? We have been operating off the same mental software for thousands and thousands of years. If it were not for that desire for revenge at a personal level, would we even seek justice?
@InteGrayting2 "If it were not for that desire for revenge at a personal level, would we even seek justice?" I think so. On a larger scale having justice is important for having a functional society
As long as it's possible that someone is wrongly sentenced to death, saving money is not a valid argument in a humane society. The moment we let economy overrule morality, we can start exterminating "parasites on society".
Moreover, the death penalty teaches society that killing people is a valid form of solving problems. Consequence is that every society that maintains the death penalty also has higher than average numbers of domestic abuse, violent crime, death of law enforcement officers etc.
@jac4020 that is true, but most people dont seem to care about that. Many say "why should my money be spent on keeping them alive", but they seem to think that MORE money spent on revenge is money well spent
@jac4020 Those costs come mainly from the inmate's right to legl representation. Obviously, if someone's life is on the line, he will usually take every option available to postpone being killed.
I've actually seen proponents of the death penalty say that they would just remove the inmate's right to legal representation, basically making it possible to execute people right after they're sentenced.
As we see in these comments, costs are more important to some people than basic human rights.
@blackwolf1200 To get argue one's you point of view you usually have to take into consideration what your opponent would consider valuable, ie cost. Besides going against everything this country stands for taking away a person's legal rights would be disastrous because it would simply trickle down to the lowest offenders. All in the name of swift "justice".
@blackwolf1200 Its not black and white. It not as if we're going to start lynching people proponents simply believe states like Texas and Virgina with a quicker appeals process do a better job of following the law. A death sentence in california is virtually life in prison as the appeals process takes 25 or 30 years. In Virginia and Texas it is generally 10 years. Not exactly marching them straight out to the hanging tree.
The problem here is that if you keep someone dangerous on ice for the rest of their life, you're hemorrhaging tax dollars that would go to education/sanitation/public works/etc. By executing from the get-go, you're saving time and resources, and ensuring the problem will not arise again from that person. This isn't even about morality, it's about economy.
@Galipheo Hey you know what, we could also make a lot more money if we didn't have to "pay" those pesky employees. It isn't even about morality, it's about economy. Now get your ass over to the coal mine
@TrueMetis Not paying your workers is the exact opposite of a functional economy, especially government workers. Regardless, I find it amusing how you compare the morality of compensation to that of executing a murderer.
The difference is the ones being executed committed something heinous to earn their punishment. Enslaving random people without reason is a huge moral issue. Stop talking out of your ass.
our society is not capable of enforcing the death penelty without people being railroaded i think that its bullshit that drugs get mandatory maxiumums because of the stupid war on drugs(which if your with me on our nations drug policies vote for ron paul) while sex crimes should be the one who recieved maxiumum sentencing i see for the most hanes crimes like rape and murder put someone in longtime solitary confinement
Sorry Penn, but although I respect you and agree with most of your views, I have to disagree with this one. Some people are just better off dead. Why should the tax payer foot the bill to keep this scum alive in prison. Or run the risk of these evil people being released and offending again? I'm afraid that I really believe these people need to die. this is to prevent re-offence, to deter others and to cleanse the gene pool of their deviant DNA.
You know what we're missing? The Colosseums, that would be the best way to tell who the murderers and criminals are and allows for justical punishment. The death penalty is useless, it barely if at all deters future criminals and murderers. buut, implement criminal arena fights and they might think before they shoot their next victim.
After watching the previous forty-one episodes prior to this one, this is the first one I'm on the fence about and don't totally agree with.
The death penalty thankfully is not law here in the U.K. but they seem to make out that killing a human being can never be justified - but if me, my family or close friends are being immediately threatened, my conscious would be completely clear if I killed the person posing that immediate threat.
You can't pretend to oppose the death penalty and support police stopping a shooter in a mall, or a school. Same concept. We must prevent the person from killing in the only means available to do so. In a spur of the moment decision, police do this directly. In jail, they do this to prevent future killings (yes, even in jail). Refute that.
i'm kind of ok with it as a way to take away a source of problem in the society. But as a punishment? c'mon! The guy is dead! He won't take the lesson to the grave!
I am totally for the death penalty. That cock sucker that killed that family at that motel room deserves to have his fucking balls fried off. Why would ANYONE protest the killing of that piece of shit? And I can almost guarantee that none of those idiots have ever had anyone they loved murdered...because if they did, I'm sure they'd be singing a different tune.
In fact, many criminals PURPOSELY try to get sent back to prison because they have become accustomed to it and PREFER it to living on the streets with no job. At least in prison they are guaranteed a roof over their head and food and a bed. THEY DONT CARE if they are in prison. I don't think you bleeding heart liberals quite comprehend that- they don't VIEW it as a horrible punishment in many cases. They do not deserve to exist, and you would certainly agree if it happened to you.
I also love how people assume this throne of moral superiority by saying "Oh, killing is wrong no matter what"...as if you wouldnt take great delight in torturing or killing a worthless pile of fucking shit who murdered and raped someone you love, much less a child or husband or wife or parent. Don't EVEN DARE pretend you are some saint who would wave your hand and say "you are forgiven"..PRISON is enough of a punishment? They are kept in a big house and fed and sheltered free of tax, dumbass.
People who claim they wouldnt want the piece of shit who raped and kiled their daughter killed either don't have a daughter or are full of shit. Don't EVEN pretend you understand what would be going on in your head if someone willingly took the life of someone you love more than life its self after raping them brutally - you don't even HAVE a frame of refrerence for that kind of pain unless you''ve gone through it. Yeah, I'm sure you'd feel fine knowing they are warm and fed in prison. Idiots.
It is time society thought long and hard as to what it is to be Human; then to have a better definition than mere possession of the human genome. Forget Penn's smoke-and-mirror bullshit about 'biblical revenge', 'deterrence', etc; certain individuals exclude themselves from the protection of human rights and we should feel neither guilt nor remorse in applying a permanent solution, to guarantee no possibility of repeat offending. Providing always there is absolute proof of guilt...
im sorry, i'm against killing, i'm against torture and all that kind of shit.
but tell that to the men who rape and kill innocent children and women.
tell them that America doesn't like to kill people who don't deserve it,
Protest against those who kill for pleasure, rape for pleasure, to kidnap someone's child for their own sick pleasure
the death penalty is not always an eye for an eye, it's taking away one less threat to society so that other innocent people will not die to their sick hands.
How about this thought: If a person has proved to just simply be a natural born killer, then locking them up with inmates and guards still leaves the potential to kill inmates and guards, not to mention the possibility - albeit unlikely - of an escape...the DP prevents THAT person from killing again once the sentence is carried out, and in that way in theory it could prevent further murders...I mean it's a stretch sure but is a ban on the DP really that good of an idea? Why not just not use it?
I like Penn. He is a very intelligent person. I would like to throw in a few things to consider. I have practiced criminal law for 29 years--8 as a state prosecutor and 21 as a criminal defense attorney. In the first 8 years, I have personal knowledge that the death penalty kept a predator from killing the victim. In the 21 following years, I had three clients who did not kill their victims because they feared the death penalty. So, they spared the victims. So, in my experience--it works.
@dantemike1 I'm not convinced of your credentials. I see on another video you commented "nazi bastard". That's not the behavor of someone whos spent 29 years in law. Infact, it could end your legal career tomorrow if it were to be connected to your real person.
Inside, I support the death penalty. Agnis makes me feel like a barbarian. I'm not sure I can stop raging against those who cause others the deepest hurt. I don't know if I could NOT want to kill a man who rapes and kills another man's wife or daughter. However, seeing a holocaust survivor say that the death penalty is barbarism makes me feel barbaric. I can't not be a barbarian, but I can avoid attempting to push my barbaric nature into law. I hope that's enough.
If you dont want to be burdened with responsibility of executing criminals as a society then let the families of the victims deal with those criminals as they see fit.You trying to convince that father of that girl doesnt have right to kill that scum if you as a society dont want to? What would you do put HIM in prison to stop him? Gtfo
In my opinion, I say do away with the death penalty, BUT lock them in a dungeon without feeding them or spending tax money on them. Just like 36% shouldn't be made killers, 64% shouldn't be made to spend a single dollar on taking care of these shits in prison.
Being the odd hypocritical beings that we are, in spite of not supporting the death penalty, I know that if my child were killed by someone I'd want them dead. But that's why we shouldn't allow law to ever be formulated by people's own personal tragedies.
im for the death penalty, i think if u kil some one (not out of self defense) you should die the same way they did even if that means someone has to stab you 15 times and let u bleed out for an hr........if you do the crime you deserve the punishment.
@Toadsanime well lets say u have a daughter...she gets raped and stabbed and left to die.. u catch the guy that did it...and say the death penalty is at least close to what i said.u saying u would ask them to just let him go? or have him live i a jail getting 3 warm meals a day sleeping in a bed and exercising all on the tax payers expense?..and to answer your question its not about anyone being better than anyone else its about getting what you deserve there will always be a bad guy
@biggunsnstuff I certainly, in the very least, don't think they should have whatever they did to someone inflicted upon them. That's beyond ridiculous.
Although I'm on the bench of whether the death penalty should be allowed, obviously if it were my own child I'd want them dead. But you can't let law be judged by someone's own personal grief.
@Toadsanime i see where your coming from there would deff. need to be guide lines and you are more then entitled to your own opinion. lets agree to disagree
nobody says im not for the death penalty except for. that means you are for the death penalty. im not for the death penalty except for petty theft and joyriding
if the death penalty was carried out by a non bias system and just logical i think it would be more understandable to see why people support it but that's just not it if the death penalty was used the same in every class system it would be alright i have no objection with killing a human being if they themselves have taken the life in an unjustifiable way why should they deserve that right to lives if they themselves have taken that away from someone else
you or me im sure could NEVER, EVER, EVER, understand what that man must have had to endure about his daughter, and i whole heartedly send my blessings. but i think it is wrong to kill a human being, especially in the name of revenge (which basically what this is).
@blindedbyturds I don't have a daughter, but if i did, and she was killed. no i wouldn't seek the death penalty, It doesn't make sense to kill killers to show killing is wrong. It won't bring her back, and i'm not a blood thirsty person
I'm only against the death penalty because of the margin of error - if you can know 100% that a man who murdered someone in cold blood, then I'm not going to shed a tear if he's put to death. But if under that policy you risk executing even one innocent man - you have to throw the whole thing out. But honestly, life in prison is probably more cruel than execution - so I'm for that.
@deathofsmokey I would agree with you, but I am for the death penalty not just for murder, but for multiple murders, and a combination of multiple hienous offences. I don't think many people would argue that states need to show they are not fucking around with violent and remorseless offenders.
The death penalty doesn't stop people from killing people. It's never acted as a warning that the states aren't fucking around - life in prison can easily be argued as being more "cruel" of a punishment. If these people we convict and execute are guilty without a shadow of a doubt, I'm not against their execution - but no innocent lives should be taken by our government. There's no justification for that, and there's no greater good. Our morals need to be consistent.
@deathofsmokey You are correct. The death penalty never intends to stop anyone from killing, but its there if you do. I want to dispose of recivistic scum who have no intention or realistic possibility of rehabilitation. I want states to be serious about destroying the lives of truly evil men, with multiple serious and violent offenses, and multiple murders or rapes or both.
I don't trust any government's judgement with the only exception being a completely clear video of the murder. It's best to stop doing it, not prosecute non-violent criminals to avoid over-spending, over-crowding, and being a shitty system in general, and combat the unhealthy impulse for revenge by just locking them up and forgetting they existed at all. There's not much in the way of actual value in these executions. As it stands, it's a horror.
And that's not the only way to be sure - this episode alone shows you a guy who came dangerously close to being a casualty of the system - and it goes on to prove it's inefficiency by keeping him in jail after admitting his innocence. The entire thing is broken, and based your own principles, you should simply not support the death penalty.
I haven't watched it yet, but I'm against the death penalty. There are a number of reasons I've against it, but... Since I refuse to carry out an execution myself, I cannot in good conscience back the death penalty. If you're not willing to carry out executions yourself, then you have no right to support something like the death penalty.
If you can prove without a doubt that a person killed and murdered for fun they should die, on the other hand there's a chance for abuse or miscarriage of such laws so it's no surprise there's a huge debate. I don't feel bad when a serial rapist murderer get's executed but I also know that innocent people could end up dead as well. there's also the theory that imprisoning for life is better punishment than a quick death and I agree but i don't like paying to house these fuckers. its complicated
(cont) someone who tortures and then slaughters a child does not deserve the same as someone who committed robbery. and so what if killing for revenge(one argument for death penalty) is a barbaric instinct? so is breathing. or mating. just because something has been around a long time doesn't mean its "wrong".
the death penalty saves us time, money, and gives us that little bit of security between "maximum security" and "dead".
you can keep someone in prison, sure, but with a life sentence they will stop at nothing to escape. they will present a danger to other inmates and prison staff. its costing money to keep a cell open for these people, to feed them, just so they can eventually die. and its not that they deserve to die; its what they dont deserve. every criminal gets the death penalty, except those who deserve to live. someone who robs a store deserves to live.
IMHO, the only "moral" way to kill a human been is self-defense. And I think that death penalty is society's self-defense against monstruous assassins.
I don't know why would you even want to kill a serial killer, isn't it a much better punishment to let them rot in a cell for the rest of their lives?
This entire debate of the death penalty is flat out silly.. Innocent people starve to death in Africa all the time.. This debate is virtually a non-issue.. Also if the evidence is undeniable and irrefutable, then the death sentence is the solution.. If doubt exist in any form, then the person is immune from the death penalty.. It's quite simply, it's the idiot liberals that give too much a fuck about some random person's life..
So let's say we have Joe, who is 22 years old. Joe goes out and holds up a gas station and ends up shooting the cashier and two bystanders as he robs the place. He's caught, convicted & sent to prison for life.
Now modern medicine & living what it is, Joe might spend 50-60 years in a cell. A low-end estimate for keeping him boxed is $1mil. Who pays for it? I don't want to, and I don't want my taxes paying for it. I'm sure most feel the same.
If he'll never live free again, why keep him alive?
@Darusdei As is mentioned in this episode, if killing innocent people earns somebody the death penalty, then by that definition, all death penalty supporters deserve to be killed in turn if just one innocent person is condemned to death that way.
Killing all the murderers in the world is not enough to outweigh the loss of a clean life.
@Sorflakne The death penalty cost more. Why? Because if you're going to execute someone, you better be fucking sure that they did what you say they did. Executing just 1 innocent life is too much.
@DeadFishFactory People are too moral when it comes to taking a life, if I ruled a country.. the death penalty, will be death by live burial.. Obviously I would need undeniable proof of the person murdering someone before such extreme measures were to be taken..
07:05 ok, I've got a solution. Let's just chain the guy up, give you a gun and have you blow his brains out with the bullet you had to buy while looking him in the eyes.
you get around the "don't kill in my name" sign there, you get around the "this is justice" crap and you get your vengeance. pure and simple.
let's just see if you are going to be so gung ho about killing him when you actually have to do and not someone else.
@TheEndKing Please explain how it is wrong? I don't quite understand the concept of wrong when it comes to killing a murderer who slaughtered kids and woman..
@CrystalEye736 You know Mark Twain said that there are 3 kind of lies out there Lies, Damned Lies, and Statistics. I think that applies to the poll taken here.
@boxofrox619 what poll are you referring to exactly? The one about creationists? Or the data that the state of California collected which demonstrates how much money they spent executing 13 inmates? Or the simple statement of fact that there are victim's families that are opposed to the death penalty, without any statistics involved?
I think he missed a 4th kind of lie: calling bullshit on data just because you don't like what it concludes
@CrystalEye736 I wasn't referring to that at all. Sorry for not explaining what what I was referring to. I was talking about the stat about how 46% of Americans believe the the earth is 6,000 years old. The reason for that statement is that surveys like that can be very, very skewed. How many people were asked? 100? 1000? and where?
Its not bullshit if I just don't just accept a number from a poll as total fact. That would be just stupid. Now the cost of execution I can believe.
@boxofrox619 I state 46% because that is not only the most conservative estimate but also the most reliable, given that it had the largest sample size and taken by the gallup organization from all over the country. Polls like the CBS poll and MSNBC polls, being less reliable, put the number around 54. Also the gallup organization had three options 1 young earth and all creatures created fully formed 2 old earth but supernatural being guided evolution and 3 old earth, evolution no intervention
@boxofrox619 it is also a poll that has kept the exact same wording of the question and has been going on for the past 30-odd years in order to keep track of public opinion on the subject over time.
Im not saying that statistics cant be represented in a misleading way, but this one is solid and is the one that is accepted by the center for science education and the like. If I wanted to be more dramatic I could have gone with the MSNBC poll, but I felt it to be a less reliable source
@CrystalEye736 If you want an example of how stats can be very skewed. Just go to P&T second-hand smoke episode. They explain how smoke threat increase risk by 25%, however the actual number goes from 1x100,000 to 1x80,000.
@boxofrox619 The point twain was making, of course, was not that Statistics are by definition untrue, but how statistics can be made to say anything yet be presented as the undisputed truth.
It seems silly to me, how this conversation slipped to religious matters. I think this issue should be universial and definetly non-religious. Under extreme circumstances - when someone is clearly a sick s.o.b. who by doctors orders has no way of getting better with medication or time or whatever - the most humane punishment is to put the individual to sleep, rather than to keep him/her in a cell for decades. That pretty much sounds like torture.
its not right to kill a human being but that i exactly what those scum give up when they rape and murder....how can it be wrong to put down a crazed animal who will only hurt people again and again? are humans so arrogant to think that every life even the lives of butchers is precious?
@NotAG4yName bullshit. you can't play both sides of this argument. butcher or not, he is still a human being and does not magically stop being one due to the actions he committed, no matter how heinous they were.
Personally i don't think killing people is wrong. I think killing people for no reason, out of sadism or because it's the cheaper/simpler option (e.g. Hitler hanging old men by the end of the war) is wrong.
I may not be the anti-death penalty version of Dudley Sharp, but eye for an eye advocates are utter cunts. What the cunt can they offer beyond "he deserves the same treatment for the crime he committed"? If perpetrators of vicious crimes deserve to suffer, let em rot in solitary begging to live, thinking every day will be the last because of beatings they receive from guards or ground glass in their food.
@AntiMTVMovement because living in maximum security is too good.. in fact quality in life in prison is in fact better than life in most parts of Africa... Strange isn't it..
@TheDragonrage25 I don't think that's true. A lot of prisons, solitary inmates who've committed heinous crimes face beatings from guards every day and wonder if somebody spiked their food with ground glass. Fearing for your life every day is not fun.
If you've seen Dudley Sharp, you'd know that he's obsessed with the death penalty and trying to convince everybody that the death penalty is the answer. He may be a pro-death penalty nazi.
@TheDragonrage25 no im liberal this pathic watland you call the usa is bull this contry has no fecking right to kill a muman being first you drag the helpless person into a room strap the helpless person down and slowly torture them till they die
@TheDragonrage25 no im liberal and this pathic wasteland you call usa is bull murdering helpess inmates is fecking wrong and you know it you take drag or carry a helpless person into a dirty room strap them down and slowly torture them to death and you call THAT JUSTICE this country better abolish the death penalty
& if we step away from the moral aspect for a moment, think about it. Our prisons are plum full, we have people on Death Row that've been there for 20 years, just recently a guy on Death Row, for a good number of years, died of a heart attack. We need to speed up Death Row and that will free up space. We need a cheaper execution method too, what happened to firing squads?
There is no easy answer to this issue, yet the lesser of two evils is to execute the very worst criminals. Is it humane to let them rot in jail? Can they commit murder again in jail? It is easy to say the state has no right to murder. It is not murder, it is punishment. It is like a PETA argument. Dont kill animals, yet animals themselves kill. So, do we stop the animals from killing each other? It is highly improbable for an innocent person to be executed yet a killer will kill again.
@2Tellthetruth We're not animals, that's the difference. One human being killing another human being is murder no matter how many justifications you try to wrap it up in. The question is are you comfortable with being a murderer regardless of how many people think it's justified?
Actually God is real and Biblical tradition has everything to do with running a productive society. Our society has started to fall apart recently. Whores, gays, and people addicted to drugs and alcohol are common place. If we return to the Bible we will be better.
Fire23eater 2 days ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@Fire23eater 4/10
UberUberLegend91 2 days ago
@Fire23eater Hmmm... Tough call. The Bible mentions mass genocide and having to respect a man who guts his own son. I'll take my chances with the hookers, gays and junkies - at least they have a sense of humour.
frytechnician 3 hours ago
I always like the BS shows when the side Penn and Teller aren't arguing on, are not a bunch of loonies
maximillian5546 4 days ago
Im for it with the highest burden of proof. I have known that if I take someones life intentionally and unjustified that I will stand a chance of forfeiting mine since I was a kid. I cant argue with a good bargain though.
TheVinoThunderbird 5 days ago
... How much does it cost to shove a gun down their throat and pull the trigger?
AKArainkit 6 days ago
The phrase that Penn kept alive "killing another human" doesn't make me think any less about doing it. Because we aren't talking about humans, we are an animal spiecies just like all the rest. We fight for our food in some places, if someone murdered my family member or a friend i would do in kind to them that is animal instinct 101.
You sorry mother fucking bleeding hearts that haven't had the experience of this loss would know no better.
OliverFist 1 week ago
America has killed more people than any other country on this planet.
LLOYD19851012 1 week ago
Shut the fuck up
Goofyattack 1 week ago
This is just another issue of selfishness. A person commits murder and is sentenced to death. The family of the victim probably supports this punishment as the grieving father shown in this video. On the other hand people who were not personally touched by the crime may see the punishment as cruel, and feel the need to voice that opinion, but......what if it were their daughter or son? That is the problem in this issue. You have to walk in their shoes, and you can't possibly do that.
InteGrayting2 1 week ago
@InteGrayting2 I think the issue boils down to revenge vs. justice, though
zzyzx0788 4 days ago
@zzyzx0788 I think you may have a point there. That also made me think of a question that I'm sure many people have asked before, but here it goes. is revenge our earliest and most instinctual form of justice? We have been operating off the same mental software for thousands and thousands of years. If it were not for that desire for revenge at a personal level, would we even seek justice?
InteGrayting2 3 days ago
@InteGrayting2 "If it were not for that desire for revenge at a personal level, would we even seek justice?" I think so. On a larger scale having justice is important for having a functional society
zzyzx0788 1 day ago
As long as it's possible that someone is wrongly sentenced to death, saving money is not a valid argument in a humane society. The moment we let economy overrule morality, we can start exterminating "parasites on society".
Moreover, the death penalty teaches society that killing people is a valid form of solving problems. Consequence is that every society that maintains the death penalty also has higher than average numbers of domestic abuse, violent crime, death of law enforcement officers etc.
blackwolf1200 1 week ago
I'm told it cost more to kill someone via death penalty than keeping them locked up for life.
jac4020 1 week ago
@jac4020 that is true, but most people dont seem to care about that. Many say "why should my money be spent on keeping them alive", but they seem to think that MORE money spent on revenge is money well spent
CrystalEye736 1 week ago
@jac4020 Those costs come mainly from the inmate's right to legl representation. Obviously, if someone's life is on the line, he will usually take every option available to postpone being killed.
I've actually seen proponents of the death penalty say that they would just remove the inmate's right to legal representation, basically making it possible to execute people right after they're sentenced.
As we see in these comments, costs are more important to some people than basic human rights.
blackwolf1200 1 week ago
@blackwolf1200 To get argue one's you point of view you usually have to take into consideration what your opponent would consider valuable, ie cost. Besides going against everything this country stands for taking away a person's legal rights would be disastrous because it would simply trickle down to the lowest offenders. All in the name of swift "justice".
jac4020 1 week ago
@blackwolf1200 Its not black and white. It not as if we're going to start lynching people proponents simply believe states like Texas and Virgina with a quicker appeals process do a better job of following the law. A death sentence in california is virtually life in prison as the appeals process takes 25 or 30 years. In Virginia and Texas it is generally 10 years. Not exactly marching them straight out to the hanging tree.
Seaworldexists 5 days ago
If you want to keep the person alive....pay out of your own pocket. Nearly 3/4 of us dont want to.
USMarineRifleman0311 1 week ago
The problem here is that if you keep someone dangerous on ice for the rest of their life, you're hemorrhaging tax dollars that would go to education/sanitation/public works/etc. By executing from the get-go, you're saving time and resources, and ensuring the problem will not arise again from that person. This isn't even about morality, it's about economy.
Galipheo 2 weeks ago
@Galipheo Hey you know what, we could also make a lot more money if we didn't have to "pay" those pesky employees. It isn't even about morality, it's about economy. Now get your ass over to the coal mine
TrueMetis 1 week ago
@TrueMetis Not paying your workers is the exact opposite of a functional economy, especially government workers. Regardless, I find it amusing how you compare the morality of compensation to that of executing a murderer.
Galipheo 1 week ago
@Galipheo If executing people isn't a moral issue than neither is slavery.
TrueMetis 1 week ago
@TrueMetis
The difference is the ones being executed committed something heinous to earn their punishment. Enslaving random people without reason is a huge moral issue. Stop talking out of your ass.
Galipheo 4 days ago
@Galipheo Killing someone is always a moral issue, it doesn't matter what they did.
TrueMetis 4 days ago
I love the episodes of this where the solutions are a bit more ambiguous. The religious ones are so cut and dry if you're already atheist.
leftovers0 2 weeks ago
Life without parole is just fine. Keep the truly bad out of circulation.
roadmasterestate 2 weeks ago
our society is not capable of enforcing the death penelty without people being railroaded i think that its bullshit that drugs get mandatory maxiumums because of the stupid war on drugs(which if your with me on our nations drug policies vote for ron paul) while sex crimes should be the one who recieved maxiumum sentencing i see for the most hanes crimes like rape and murder put someone in longtime solitary confinement
handfulofpeter 2 weeks ago
Sorry Penn, but although I respect you and agree with most of your views, I have to disagree with this one. Some people are just better off dead. Why should the tax payer foot the bill to keep this scum alive in prison. Or run the risk of these evil people being released and offending again? I'm afraid that I really believe these people need to die. this is to prevent re-offence, to deter others and to cleanse the gene pool of their deviant DNA.
1973Razorback 2 weeks ago
IT
IS
OK
TO
KILL
A
HUMAN
BEING.
Now, please. Kill all the scum bags.
hanyuo 3 weeks ago
You know what we're missing? The Colosseums, that would be the best way to tell who the murderers and criminals are and allows for justical punishment. The death penalty is useless, it barely if at all deters future criminals and murderers. buut, implement criminal arena fights and they might think before they shoot their next victim.
Shellgaja 3 weeks ago
Rick Perry convinced me that the death penalty is wrong.
dalecs47 3 weeks ago
Liberal propaganda
philster00700 3 weeks ago
@philster00700 Hahahahaha Penn and Teller are anything but liberals. They are probably center right actually. Learn your facts.
luigiman425 3 weeks ago
@luigiman425 They are libertarians, which tends to fall on the social liberal/fiscal conservative side.
Waywardpaladin 2 weeks ago
@philster00700 yes logical arguments are propaganda
iasnb17yt 2 weeks ago
After watching the previous forty-one episodes prior to this one, this is the first one I'm on the fence about and don't totally agree with.
The death penalty thankfully is not law here in the U.K. but they seem to make out that killing a human being can never be justified - but if me, my family or close friends are being immediately threatened, my conscious would be completely clear if I killed the person posing that immediate threat.
Toadsanime 3 weeks ago
You can't pretend to oppose the death penalty and support police stopping a shooter in a mall, or a school. Same concept. We must prevent the person from killing in the only means available to do so. In a spur of the moment decision, police do this directly. In jail, they do this to prevent future killings (yes, even in jail). Refute that.
AgentDuke007 4 weeks ago
@AgentDuke007 Tazers.
That took, what, literally one word to refute? There's a reasonable amount of non-deadly weapons that can be used to stop someone.
Toadsanime 3 weeks ago
that Dudley guy is wrong, most murderers ever re offend.
darkmantlestudios 1 month ago
i'm kind of ok with it as a way to take away a source of problem in the society. But as a punishment? c'mon! The guy is dead! He won't take the lesson to the grave!
ErgoProxy12345 1 month ago
I am totally for the death penalty. That cock sucker that killed that family at that motel room deserves to have his fucking balls fried off. Why would ANYONE protest the killing of that piece of shit? And I can almost guarantee that none of those idiots have ever had anyone they loved murdered...because if they did, I'm sure they'd be singing a different tune.
TwoHandedSledge 1 month ago
pro death penalty. but as someone already commented on here: only with absolute proof
bobmoore20 1 month ago
In fact, many criminals PURPOSELY try to get sent back to prison because they have become accustomed to it and PREFER it to living on the streets with no job. At least in prison they are guaranteed a roof over their head and food and a bed. THEY DONT CARE if they are in prison. I don't think you bleeding heart liberals quite comprehend that- they don't VIEW it as a horrible punishment in many cases. They do not deserve to exist, and you would certainly agree if it happened to you.
sonbuhitsunei 1 month ago
I also love how people assume this throne of moral superiority by saying "Oh, killing is wrong no matter what"...as if you wouldnt take great delight in torturing or killing a worthless pile of fucking shit who murdered and raped someone you love, much less a child or husband or wife or parent. Don't EVEN DARE pretend you are some saint who would wave your hand and say "you are forgiven"..PRISON is enough of a punishment? They are kept in a big house and fed and sheltered free of tax, dumbass.
sonbuhitsunei 1 month ago
People who claim they wouldnt want the piece of shit who raped and kiled their daughter killed either don't have a daughter or are full of shit. Don't EVEN pretend you understand what would be going on in your head if someone willingly took the life of someone you love more than life its self after raping them brutally - you don't even HAVE a frame of refrerence for that kind of pain unless you''ve gone through it. Yeah, I'm sure you'd feel fine knowing they are warm and fed in prison. Idiots.
sonbuhitsunei 1 month ago
Comment removed
blindedbyturds 1 month ago
It is time society thought long and hard as to what it is to be Human; then to have a better definition than mere possession of the human genome. Forget Penn's smoke-and-mirror bullshit about 'biblical revenge', 'deterrence', etc; certain individuals exclude themselves from the protection of human rights and we should feel neither guilt nor remorse in applying a permanent solution, to guarantee no possibility of repeat offending. Providing always there is absolute proof of guilt...
blindedbyturds 1 month ago
Poor Teller...
god0fgod 1 month ago
64% support the death penalty? But polling is bullshit! :P
god0fgod 1 month ago
an eye for an eye makes the whole world blind.
inlovewithbass 1 month ago
im sorry, i'm against killing, i'm against torture and all that kind of shit.
but tell that to the men who rape and kill innocent children and women.
tell them that America doesn't like to kill people who don't deserve it,
Protest against those who kill for pleasure, rape for pleasure, to kidnap someone's child for their own sick pleasure
the death penalty is not always an eye for an eye, it's taking away one less threat to society so that other innocent people will not die to their sick hands.
TheSexySockk 1 month ago
How about this thought: If a person has proved to just simply be a natural born killer, then locking them up with inmates and guards still leaves the potential to kill inmates and guards, not to mention the possibility - albeit unlikely - of an escape...the DP prevents THAT person from killing again once the sentence is carried out, and in that way in theory it could prevent further murders...I mean it's a stretch sure but is a ban on the DP really that good of an idea? Why not just not use it?
captainphoenix 1 month ago
I don't agree in the death penalty... But I think there should be capital punishment!
bcamara145 1 month ago
I like Penn. He is a very intelligent person. I would like to throw in a few things to consider. I have practiced criminal law for 29 years--8 as a state prosecutor and 21 as a criminal defense attorney. In the first 8 years, I have personal knowledge that the death penalty kept a predator from killing the victim. In the 21 following years, I had three clients who did not kill their victims because they feared the death penalty. So, they spared the victims. So, in my experience--it works.
dantemike1 1 month ago
@dantemike1
I liked him, too; now, not so sure- too much loud bluster, seems like trying to force his opinion...
blindedbyturds 1 month ago
@dantemike1 I'm not convinced of your credentials. I see on another video you commented "nazi bastard". That's not the behavor of someone whos spent 29 years in law. Infact, it could end your legal career tomorrow if it were to be connected to your real person.
22ness0hayden 1 month ago 14
@22ness0hayden r u not ok with someone calling someone a "nazi bastard". if hes a nazi hes a bastard, right?
bobmoore20 1 month ago
@bobmoore20 Maybe you should watch the video in question before commenting! It was of a crash landing at a German Airshow.
22ness0hayden 1 month ago
@dantemike1 But that is 4 people out of how many?
Richardscoat83 1 month ago
@Richardscoat83 YOU CAN BE #5 OK?
zrili 1 month ago
@dantemike1 it works against poor people, yeah it really works.
ennio997 1 month ago
5:48
id give my left arm just to fuck the living shit out of that man until he felt every kind of pain imaginable.
ON A LIGHTER NOTE; im really a nice guy :)
lovetownsend 1 month ago
Inside, I support the death penalty. Agnis makes me feel like a barbarian. I'm not sure I can stop raging against those who cause others the deepest hurt. I don't know if I could NOT want to kill a man who rapes and kills another man's wife or daughter. However, seeing a holocaust survivor say that the death penalty is barbarism makes me feel barbaric. I can't not be a barbarian, but I can avoid attempting to push my barbaric nature into law. I hope that's enough.
pkemrin 1 month ago
8:18 He's against execution but look behind him.
YouAreABunghole 1 month ago
shoot them right away,fuck 20 years.
lilbeaveymac 1 month ago
@lilbeaveymac
my thoughts exactly. raping and killing an 11 year old girl...we should torture the sick fuck before we end him
lovetownsend 1 month ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@lilbeaveymac
my thoughts exactly. raping and killing an 11 year old girl...we should torture the sick fuck before we end him
lovetownsend 1 month ago
NOT 480p!!!!
symplystik 1 month ago
The sound quality of this video is "bullshit".
turbohusque 1 month ago 54
So is there any argument FOR the death penalty other than "I'm angry, grr!"?
Tleilaxu0 1 month ago
@Tleilaxu0 it would save a lot of money
mchandler2112 1 month ago
@mchandler2112 ... Except that it doesn't. It costs more money to execute someone than it does to to keep them in jail for life. Look it up.
Tleilaxu0 1 month ago
Harvest every single one of their useable organs short of causing death, before leaving them to be locked up for good without parole : )
ChowMeinChowdown 1 month ago
all convicted murderes should be relocated to the neighborhoods of hollywood types...that should solve several issues in one fell swoop.
bloozedaddy 1 month ago
If you dont want to be burdened with responsibility of executing criminals as a society then let the families of the victims deal with those criminals as they see fit.You trying to convince that father of that girl doesnt have right to kill that scum if you as a society dont want to? What would you do put HIM in prison to stop him? Gtfo
MrChosen76 1 month ago
In my opinion, I say do away with the death penalty, BUT lock them in a dungeon without feeding them or spending tax money on them. Just like 36% shouldn't be made killers, 64% shouldn't be made to spend a single dollar on taking care of these shits in prison.
JoseATurner 1 month ago
the sound quality reminds me of those long trips to arizona watching a dvd with some shitty headphones
theamazingempiricist 1 month ago
Being the odd hypocritical beings that we are, in spite of not supporting the death penalty, I know that if my child were killed by someone I'd want them dead. But that's why we shouldn't allow law to ever be formulated by people's own personal tragedies.
Toadsanime 1 month ago
Audio is fucked up. That really pisses me off.
Lherbistro 1 month ago
im for the death penalty, i think if u kil some one (not out of self defense) you should die the same way they did even if that means someone has to stab you 15 times and let u bleed out for an hr........if you do the crime you deserve the punishment.
biggunsnstuff 1 month ago
@biggunsnstuff And that'd make the person taking out your twisted form of justice upon the criminal any better than them how exactly?
Toadsanime 1 month ago
@Toadsanime well lets say u have a daughter...she gets raped and stabbed and left to die.. u catch the guy that did it...and say the death penalty is at least close to what i said.u saying u would ask them to just let him go? or have him live i a jail getting 3 warm meals a day sleeping in a bed and exercising all on the tax payers expense?..and to answer your question its not about anyone being better than anyone else its about getting what you deserve there will always be a bad guy
biggunsnstuff 1 month ago
@biggunsnstuff I certainly, in the very least, don't think they should have whatever they did to someone inflicted upon them. That's beyond ridiculous.
Although I'm on the bench of whether the death penalty should be allowed, obviously if it were my own child I'd want them dead. But you can't let law be judged by someone's own personal grief.
Toadsanime 1 month ago
@Toadsanime i see where your coming from there would deff. need to be guide lines and you are more then entitled to your own opinion. lets agree to disagree
biggunsnstuff 1 month ago
@biggunsnstuff Indeed yeah, we'll agree to sort-of-disagree then.
Toadsanime 1 month ago
nobody says im not for the death penalty except for. that means you are for the death penalty. im not for the death penalty except for petty theft and joyriding
aro327 1 month ago
if the death penalty was carried out by a non bias system and just logical i think it would be more understandable to see why people support it but that's just not it if the death penalty was used the same in every class system it would be alright i have no objection with killing a human being if they themselves have taken the life in an unjustifiable way why should they deserve that right to lives if they themselves have taken that away from someone else
swat105 1 month ago
the guy at 8:07 looks like larry david in a toupee
aaron19840904 2 months ago
honestly im for anything that thins out our numbers
halloweenfan92 2 months ago
you or me im sure could NEVER, EVER, EVER, understand what that man must have had to endure about his daughter, and i whole heartedly send my blessings. but i think it is wrong to kill a human being, especially in the name of revenge (which basically what this is).
lovetownsend 2 months ago
@lovetownsend so do I
11Sweeneytodd 2 months ago
@lovetownsend couldent it also be that if hes dead he cant kill any others and put others through the same thing those he has already effected
swat105 1 month ago
@lovetownsend If my daughter was killed. I still wouldn't seek the death penalty, since it won't bring her back
Myytmovies 1 month ago
@Myytmovies
RU quite certain about that? Does your daughter agree?
blindedbyturds 1 month ago
@blindedbyturds I don't have a daughter, but if i did, and she was killed. no i wouldn't seek the death penalty, It doesn't make sense to kill killers to show killing is wrong. It won't bring her back, and i'm not a blood thirsty person
Myytmovies 1 month ago
@Myytmovies If someone kills one of my children, the state won't get the chance to kill them. I will do it.
mike112769 1 month ago
Penn/Teller 2012
loves2splooge6969 2 months ago
@loves2splooge6969
right on. right on.
lovetownsend 2 months ago
I'm only against the death penalty because of the margin of error - if you can know 100% that a man who murdered someone in cold blood, then I'm not going to shed a tear if he's put to death. But if under that policy you risk executing even one innocent man - you have to throw the whole thing out. But honestly, life in prison is probably more cruel than execution - so I'm for that.
deathofsmokey 2 months ago
@deathofsmokey I would agree with you, but I am for the death penalty not just for murder, but for multiple murders, and a combination of multiple hienous offences. I don't think many people would argue that states need to show they are not fucking around with violent and remorseless offenders.
SAOrules 2 months ago
@SAOrules
The death penalty doesn't stop people from killing people. It's never acted as a warning that the states aren't fucking around - life in prison can easily be argued as being more "cruel" of a punishment. If these people we convict and execute are guilty without a shadow of a doubt, I'm not against their execution - but no innocent lives should be taken by our government. There's no justification for that, and there's no greater good. Our morals need to be consistent.
deathofsmokey 2 months ago
@deathofsmokey You are correct. The death penalty never intends to stop anyone from killing, but its there if you do. I want to dispose of recivistic scum who have no intention or realistic possibility of rehabilitation. I want states to be serious about destroying the lives of truly evil men, with multiple serious and violent offenses, and multiple murders or rapes or both.
SAOrules 2 months ago
@deathofsmokey Before execution, I want the justice system to be sure, and the only way to be sure, is the execute only the worst offenders possible.
SAOrules 2 months ago
@SAOrules
I don't trust any government's judgement with the only exception being a completely clear video of the murder. It's best to stop doing it, not prosecute non-violent criminals to avoid over-spending, over-crowding, and being a shitty system in general, and combat the unhealthy impulse for revenge by just locking them up and forgetting they existed at all. There's not much in the way of actual value in these executions. As it stands, it's a horror.
deathofsmokey 2 months ago
@SAOrules
And that's not the only way to be sure - this episode alone shows you a guy who came dangerously close to being a casualty of the system - and it goes on to prove it's inefficiency by keeping him in jail after admitting his innocence. The entire thing is broken, and based your own principles, you should simply not support the death penalty.
deathofsmokey 2 months ago
I haven't watched it yet, but I'm against the death penalty. There are a number of reasons I've against it, but... Since I refuse to carry out an execution myself, I cannot in good conscience back the death penalty. If you're not willing to carry out executions yourself, then you have no right to support something like the death penalty.
Soulsphere001 2 months ago
I'm all for the death penalty hell I'll even press the button myself. "Begin the Raging comments"
giant648 2 months ago
@giant648
I'm against the death penalty myself, but if you're willing to execute the person yourself then you have every right to support capital punishment.
Soulsphere001 2 months ago
I think that death penalty is pretty easy for a murderer. If you are on a sell for the rest of your life you are not gonna live happily
TlMPPA 2 months ago
If you can prove without a doubt that a person killed and murdered for fun they should die, on the other hand there's a chance for abuse or miscarriage of such laws so it's no surprise there's a huge debate. I don't feel bad when a serial rapist murderer get's executed but I also know that innocent people could end up dead as well. there's also the theory that imprisoning for life is better punishment than a quick death and I agree but i don't like paying to house these fuckers. its complicated
MrROTD 2 months ago
(cont) someone who tortures and then slaughters a child does not deserve the same as someone who committed robbery. and so what if killing for revenge(one argument for death penalty) is a barbaric instinct? so is breathing. or mating. just because something has been around a long time doesn't mean its "wrong".
the death penalty saves us time, money, and gives us that little bit of security between "maximum security" and "dead".
willtheoct 2 months ago
P&T: Bullshit! is Bullshit.
you can keep someone in prison, sure, but with a life sentence they will stop at nothing to escape. they will present a danger to other inmates and prison staff. its costing money to keep a cell open for these people, to feed them, just so they can eventually die. and its not that they deserve to die; its what they dont deserve. every criminal gets the death penalty, except those who deserve to live. someone who robs a store deserves to live.
willtheoct 2 months ago
IMHO, the only "moral" way to kill a human been is self-defense. And I think that death penalty is society's self-defense against monstruous assassins.
shapein 2 months ago
I don't know why would you even want to kill a serial killer, isn't it a much better punishment to let them rot in a cell for the rest of their lives?
WickedJ133 2 months ago
This entire debate of the death penalty is flat out silly.. Innocent people starve to death in Africa all the time.. This debate is virtually a non-issue.. Also if the evidence is undeniable and irrefutable, then the death sentence is the solution.. If doubt exist in any form, then the person is immune from the death penalty.. It's quite simply, it's the idiot liberals that give too much a fuck about some random person's life..
TheDragonrage25 2 months ago
Some crimes are so bad, the ones that comitted them deserve to die.
mike112769 3 months ago
it is ok to kill a human being under the right circumstances. our military does it every single day.
someoneiswakingup 3 months ago
So let's say we have Joe, who is 22 years old. Joe goes out and holds up a gas station and ends up shooting the cashier and two bystanders as he robs the place. He's caught, convicted & sent to prison for life.
Now modern medicine & living what it is, Joe might spend 50-60 years in a cell. A low-end estimate for keeping him boxed is $1mil. Who pays for it? I don't want to, and I don't want my taxes paying for it. I'm sure most feel the same.
If he'll never live free again, why keep him alive?
Sorflakne 3 months ago
@Sorflakne The cost to execute someone is more than the cost of life in prison, believe it or not.
UnitedAss 3 months ago
@Sorflakne Prisoners can be made to work. Whether it's done or not is another problem.
Here's another question: Who pays for the lives that were unjustly taken away by the death penalty? Oops.
1337DementedOne 3 months ago
@1337DementedOne who pays when an innocent is condemned to death,
how much does one innocent weigh on the scales?
Darusdei 3 months ago
@Darusdei As is mentioned in this episode, if killing innocent people earns somebody the death penalty, then by that definition, all death penalty supporters deserve to be killed in turn if just one innocent person is condemned to death that way.
Killing all the murderers in the world is not enough to outweigh the loss of a clean life.
1337DementedOne 2 months ago
@Sorflakne The death penalty cost more. Why? Because if you're going to execute someone, you better be fucking sure that they did what you say they did. Executing just 1 innocent life is too much.
DeadFishFactory 3 months ago
@DeadFishFactory it's a lot cheaper then keeping the fucker around and, feeding him, clothing him, giving him medical treatment, ect.
MultiBlood1997 3 months ago
@DeadFishFactory People are too moral when it comes to taking a life, if I ruled a country.. the death penalty, will be death by live burial.. Obviously I would need undeniable proof of the person murdering someone before such extreme measures were to be taken..
TheDragonrage25 2 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
We all know...
TheJonFawcett 3 months ago
Bullshit.
You're talking about evil here, and as the old saying goes "Pay Evil Unto Evil".
GarlicPudding 4 months ago
07:05 ok, I've got a solution. Let's just chain the guy up, give you a gun and have you blow his brains out with the bullet you had to buy while looking him in the eyes.
you get around the "don't kill in my name" sign there, you get around the "this is justice" crap and you get your vengeance. pure and simple.
let's just see if you are going to be so gung ho about killing him when you actually have to do and not someone else.
MatoVuc 4 months ago
The death penalty is wrong.
But sometimes, you need to be wrong.
TheEndKing 4 months ago
@TheEndKing that's about the shittiest reasoning I've ever heard.
If you need to do something, then it isn't the wrong thing to do.
right and wrong exist only if there are multiple choices to be made, where you can weigh in which is the "lesser evil"
I meant no offense and i know that you meant morally wrong, but even that does not work.
morality that does not work in certain situations is a morality that doesn't work at all.
that's why it is much more gray than black and white.
MatoVuc 4 months ago
@TheEndKing Please explain how it is wrong? I don't quite understand the concept of wrong when it comes to killing a murderer who slaughtered kids and woman..
TheDragonrage25 2 months ago
It's taking a life. Murdering a murderer is still murder.
But sometimes, it's just the only option open at the time.
TheEndKing 2 months ago
Odd. Also 64% of Americans believe that the Earth is about 6,000 years old.
PT109Boat 4 months ago 11
@PT109Boat lol the stat is acutally 46%, but that is still a ridiculously high number
CrystalEye736 4 months ago 26
@CrystalEye736 Oh, the number of retards in America seems to have reduced from 49.3% over the past couple of years.
mariwanakid 4 months ago
@CrystalEye736 You know Mark Twain said that there are 3 kind of lies out there Lies, Damned Lies, and Statistics. I think that applies to the poll taken here.
boxofrox619 3 months ago
@boxofrox619 what poll are you referring to exactly? The one about creationists? Or the data that the state of California collected which demonstrates how much money they spent executing 13 inmates? Or the simple statement of fact that there are victim's families that are opposed to the death penalty, without any statistics involved?
I think he missed a 4th kind of lie: calling bullshit on data just because you don't like what it concludes
CrystalEye736 3 months ago 6
@CrystalEye736 I wasn't referring to that at all. Sorry for not explaining what what I was referring to. I was talking about the stat about how 46% of Americans believe the the earth is 6,000 years old. The reason for that statement is that surveys like that can be very, very skewed. How many people were asked? 100? 1000? and where?
Its not bullshit if I just don't just accept a number from a poll as total fact. That would be just stupid. Now the cost of execution I can believe.
boxofrox619 3 months ago
@boxofrox619 I state 46% because that is not only the most conservative estimate but also the most reliable, given that it had the largest sample size and taken by the gallup organization from all over the country. Polls like the CBS poll and MSNBC polls, being less reliable, put the number around 54. Also the gallup organization had three options 1 young earth and all creatures created fully formed 2 old earth but supernatural being guided evolution and 3 old earth, evolution no intervention
CrystalEye736 3 months ago 3
@boxofrox619 it is also a poll that has kept the exact same wording of the question and has been going on for the past 30-odd years in order to keep track of public opinion on the subject over time.
Im not saying that statistics cant be represented in a misleading way, but this one is solid and is the one that is accepted by the center for science education and the like. If I wanted to be more dramatic I could have gone with the MSNBC poll, but I felt it to be a less reliable source
CrystalEye736 3 months ago
@CrystalEye736 If you want an example of how stats can be very skewed. Just go to P&T second-hand smoke episode. They explain how smoke threat increase risk by 25%, however the actual number goes from 1x100,000 to 1x80,000.
boxofrox619 3 months ago
@boxofrox619 I hate when people use famous quotes and proverbs to justify beliefs.
PolitcalIslam 2 months ago
@boxofrox619 The point twain was making, of course, was not that Statistics are by definition untrue, but how statistics can be made to say anything yet be presented as the undisputed truth.
goji2099 2 months ago
It seems silly to me, how this conversation slipped to religious matters. I think this issue should be universial and definetly non-religious. Under extreme circumstances - when someone is clearly a sick s.o.b. who by doctors orders has no way of getting better with medication or time or whatever - the most humane punishment is to put the individual to sleep, rather than to keep him/her in a cell for decades. That pretty much sounds like torture.
t7y9u0 2 months ago
its not right to kill a human being but that i exactly what those scum give up when they rape and murder....how can it be wrong to put down a crazed animal who will only hurt people again and again? are humans so arrogant to think that every life even the lives of butchers is precious?
NotAG4yName 4 months ago
@NotAG4yName bullshit. you can't play both sides of this argument. butcher or not, he is still a human being and does not magically stop being one due to the actions he committed, no matter how heinous they were.
Personally i don't think killing people is wrong. I think killing people for no reason, out of sadism or because it's the cheaper/simpler option (e.g. Hitler hanging old men by the end of the war) is wrong.
MatoVuc 4 months ago
"An eye for an eye makes the world blind." - Ghandi.
Then again, in another episode Ghandi was bullshit.
DMAN123223 4 months ago 3
@DMAN123223 Ghandi was cool, just don't take everything he says word for word.. Like all religious thinkers, they tend to take in riddles..
TheDragonrage25 2 months ago
@TheDragonrage25 So... was he speaking in riddle here?
DMAN123223 2 months ago
6.20
Jesus christ, takes some balls for that guy to talk about it
He's still wrong though, he's just really angry
DeoMachina 4 months ago
Is it my I pad or is the audio fucked
australianbowhunter 4 months ago
@australianbowhunter
Audio is fucked.
SSTTEEAALLTTHH 4 months ago
I may not be the anti-death penalty version of Dudley Sharp, but eye for an eye advocates are utter cunts. What the cunt can they offer beyond "he deserves the same treatment for the crime he committed"? If perpetrators of vicious crimes deserve to suffer, let em rot in solitary begging to live, thinking every day will be the last because of beatings they receive from guards or ground glass in their food.
AntiMTVMovement 5 months ago
@AntiMTVMovement because living in maximum security is too good.. in fact quality in life in prison is in fact better than life in most parts of Africa... Strange isn't it..
TheDragonrage25 2 months ago
@TheDragonrage25 I don't think that's true. A lot of prisons, solitary inmates who've committed heinous crimes face beatings from guards every day and wonder if somebody spiked their food with ground glass. Fearing for your life every day is not fun.
AntiMTVMovement 2 months ago
If you've seen Dudley Sharp, you'd know that he's obsessed with the death penalty and trying to convince everybody that the death penalty is the answer. He may be a pro-death penalty nazi.
AntiMTVMovement 5 months ago
abolish the death penalty i am AGAINST the death penalty you muderious scum have no right to take human beings life
VampiresBiteHard666 5 months ago
@VampiresBiteHard666 Let me guess, you're a vegan.
TheDragonrage25 2 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@TheDragonrage25 no im liberal this pathic watland you call the usa is bull this contry has no fecking right to kill a muman being first you drag the helpless person into a room strap the helpless person down and slowly torture them till they die
VampiresBiteHard666 2 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@TheDragonrage25 no im liberal and this pathic wasteland you call usa is bull murdering helpess inmates is fecking wrong and you know it you take drag or carry a helpless person into a dirty room strap them down and slowly torture them to death and you call THAT JUSTICE this country better abolish the death penalty
VampiresBiteHard666 2 months ago
& if we step away from the moral aspect for a moment, think about it. Our prisons are plum full, we have people on Death Row that've been there for 20 years, just recently a guy on Death Row, for a good number of years, died of a heart attack. We need to speed up Death Row and that will free up space. We need a cheaper execution method too, what happened to firing squads?
fightingkentuckian2 5 months ago
@fightingkentuckian2 Morally zealous fuckwads aka extreme liberals are the problem.
TheDragonrage25 2 months ago
There is no easy answer to this issue, yet the lesser of two evils is to execute the very worst criminals. Is it humane to let them rot in jail? Can they commit murder again in jail? It is easy to say the state has no right to murder. It is not murder, it is punishment. It is like a PETA argument. Dont kill animals, yet animals themselves kill. So, do we stop the animals from killing each other? It is highly improbable for an innocent person to be executed yet a killer will kill again.
2Tellthetruth 5 months ago
@2Tellthetruth We're not animals, that's the difference. One human being killing another human being is murder no matter how many justifications you try to wrap it up in. The question is are you comfortable with being a murderer regardless of how many people think it's justified?
icemachine79 3 months ago