sun ra john gilmore oakland april 89

[ponchocervantes]

this cat is one of the GIANTS on tenor...listen to his work with art blakey in the early 60s...

[earinsound]

john gilmore is NOT expressing himself...he's a conduit for the original vision of SUN RA.

[Carlinhosviolao]

Can I get a tenor transcriptions of that?

[jakbre]

stupid coon

[pollydaktyl]

hes reaching for an intensity of expression in a very personal language

[benmillerintx]

we saturnites have different taste in music. go listen to winton marsalis and help him bash with a smile everyone that threatens his bland music.

[TheTheurgist]

Beautiful reminds me of the Chod practice. Excellent for new neuron growth also!

[decus69]

Clifford Jordan and john Gilmore: Blowing in from Chicago. Bet you couldn't play that shit!

[stankballz71]

the last 6 or so seconds of this is what its all about. he simply plays into registers the normal human ear cant even go. just vibes out of this space at the end.if u your 2 year old starts doing that,u better call mensa.

[budnowerlater]

This Is Awful. In no way does this sound like anything different than that of what my 2 year old niece could do who has no idea as to how to play the saxophone.

[jazzmunky]

Man, I've been playing sax for 9 years, soon to study jazz and composition at conservatoire level, and I can tell you, whether you like it or not (which you seem to not) these altissimo notes are incredibly hard to play! If you doubt Gilmore's musical credentials, listen to his earlier, straight-ahead stuff with SUn Ra from the 50s, he was an amazing bop saxman and admired by John COltrane amongst others....

[budnowerlater]

I don't doubt what you say, but it doesn't take 1:50 for me to appreciate the fact that he's hitting some altissimo notes. I can appreciate it for about 2 to 3 seconds. 95% of everyone and everything will agree that that is just not pleasant to listen to. So why the heck would someone say, "Hey guys. This'll be awesome- I'm gonna solo for 2 minutes like this!"

-"Yeah! Neat!"

[jazzmunky]

Fair point. Personally I like the squeeks, but then I enjoy my washing machine rattling the saucepans in my kitchen. It's a shame we never got to see the whole solo. My point is not to diss other players, I stopped it a few years ago because a) we have to recognise they have mastered their personal form of expression, e.g. Cezanne was a master but not to everyone's taste b) it's disabling for people who want to succeed in self-expression, though maybe I should care less what others think.

[budnowerlater]

You have made a fair point as well in saying that it's not the best idea to diss others.

[jibsmokestack1]

@budnowerlater Idiot!!

[budnowerlater]

@jibsmokestack1 ---- "Yeah! Yeah! That's amazing! Yes! Yes!!" This is what everyone who is SITTING there is thinking... No. That was sarcasm. They're probably thinking... "Oh my. He's on drugs." And I say 'sitting' because people are up dancing??? No. No one is enjoying what's happening here. How 'bout you Jibsmokestack1 take this solo and put it in your car CD player and groove with it down the road. Doubtful. You're a terrible person.

[TonyaStewart2009]

i can tell this one is disturbing my dogs ears....

i'm psyched - there is a Sun Ra Exhibit tonight in Durham that I won tix to from WNCU radio. Very psyched!

[barisax42]

I honestly think this music (or any music for that matter) does not go beyond ANYONE's understanding. Music is a form of expression, he is expressing himself through his unique way of playing his horn. What it means to you when you hear it, is exactly how he wants you to perceive it. He is really just playing straight from the heart.

[alcorderyjr]

It's absolutely amazing the way brother gilmore is playing the tenor sax ... if my eyes were closed i'd never of guessed what instrument he was playing, it's like max roach playing horn notes on the drums, absolutely amazing

[snubbs741]

@barisax42 exactly, if it blew person A's mind, it was supposed to do that, if it pissed person B off, it was supposed to do that

[MickBReedy]

im new to sun ra, but i personally dont understand this style. can someone explain this to me? im not bashing him, i just wanna understand it

[justin2535]

To understand Sun Ra, you need to listen to a large amount of it. Not just what is on youtube either. His work becomes more clear after about 10 albums. There's a larger picture, MUCH LARGER. It takes some time to fully become aware of it, but there are running themes through all the albums, almost like it makes up one gigantic 'universe' of recordings. Its actually quite incredible. I truly believe he was trying to communicate something real and profound.

[MickBReedy]

yeah i kinda assumed that i guess. it sucks though cuz they dont have anything on youtube. i might try to go find some albums and take a peek at this whole avant garde genre

[MagicRain505]

If you're interested in like.... the hard beginnings of avant-garde, then check out Trane's 1961 recordings on The Complete Village Vanguard, to start you off.... beautiful music, bro, and I personally coin Trane as the master of it. Him, Pharoah Sanders ESPECIALLY, Cecil Taylor, who sorta introduced it along with others, Eric Dolphy of course, Albert Ayler (caution, lol), and a lot others. But I recommend getting some Trane albums AFTER 1961. THAT'S where it REALLY hits you.

[edcerc]

you have to hear the quarter tones. If you only think in 12 tones than you wont perceive whats happening.

[MickBReedy]

i dont understand what that means

[talkingwall]

It means there are tones in-between the 12 tones - C C# D D# E F F# G G# A A# B - used in Western music. Indian music has tones in-between our tones. Here, Gilmore is playing far above the "accepted" register on the tenor sax. You can't listen to this music with pre-conceived notions of what music is. You must become as a little child... I recommend you begin with Ornette Coleman's Shape of Jazz to Come and Eric Dolphy's Out to Lunch to learn to "get" this stuff.

[ExMachine]

My god this is an amazing sound- i don't need to understand another damn thing!

I think to appreciate the music as a listener you just need to grasp the aesthetic through repeated listens (including to Sun Ras references to cosmic themes and myth)- if you really want to understand it as a musician, that's another thing.

I seem to remember one of Sun Ras band said they thought Thelonius Monk was out there, till they found Sun Ra.. See if you can grasp Monk and take it from there

[MickBReedy]

I can understand Monk. I actually love Monk. I don't even find him that out there. This is just significantly more out there, I find it hard to believe someone wouldn't agree with me. I'm still tryin to get it though. Some stuff I find interesting. I even do stuff like this myself, but it's hard for me to like other's free jazz. I need more listening...

[bobgreen623]

I think in some ways this music goes beyond understanding, trying to 'understand' it is not always the point. If you are interested in these sounds, rather than repelled by them, you're already part way into it. Just keep your ears as open as you can and dig it if you can, it's a 'feel' thing in some ways. Of course, it's possible to analyse and understand the techniques and philosophy used to produce the music, but not necessary to just dig it. That's the great thing, it works on many levels.

[LP1378]

My suggestion would be to look for the jazz standards on Sun Ra's albums. He wrote a lot of original music, but also played standards, and played them in all sorts of unusual ways. I think when you listen to how the Arkestra could reconfigure familiar melodies, then you start to understand how stretched out Sun Ra's musical vision really was. This video is awesome, but its just a clip of a solo in the middle of a song, and the whole song might sound more "normal" than this.

[Angryjazz]

It seems like that ending was just the end of the sonic part of the solo. I'll bet that line is still ascending today.

[BoboBerlinsky]

I heard that John Gilmore would play like this for quite a while and then all of a sudden he would disappear for a while and then reappear eventually somewhere else in the room. He said he had teleported himself, for a short trip, to another galaxy and back.

And he claimed that he frequently visited the planet Kladen, on the other side of the Sun. Cool!

[krsoneg]

what most listeners won't understand about this music is that John Gilmore is actually capable of directing his playing into astro-travel, as in, he is reaching alternate dimensions and alternate planes of interpretation. In order to understand this music, you have to abandoned your western brainwashed idea of what music really is.

there is more substance than what you hear-

the sound vibrations will carry you to other corners of the universe. All you need to do is listen and feel.

[freejazzfree]

higher vibrational resonance.

[gwalkron]

tremendous. these guys really live[d] the life. gilmore was at the cutting edge of jazz but preferred to remain a relative unknown by playing in the arkestra, so dedicated was he to sun ra's music.

[ricshinn]

Sound truly is invisible but you can see it when you close your eyes.

[SidewalkFrequencies]

Just Beautiful !!!

how could anyone say that's just noise.

[TheSocialistsParty]

After doing this for years for little or no compensation I can still look at this and know that despite the seeming futility of being an artist of this nature I'm forging ahead down the sonic path of exploration started by my heroes. I do it for them, myself, and the savvy minority that feel and understand this intense music.

[ZamzarBob]

This is it! This is what Pharoah Sanders is doing on Red, Black, and Green. Listen around 30 seconds. I've always wondered how he made that sound.

[ContrabassSaxophone]

I can do it, and i'm only 12; but I think it's easier with metal mouthpieces. pharoah sanders is awesome.

[rafikcc]

Rare John Glmore footage! Who was a pioneering master of the altissimo register. FYI, he influenced Trane. Thanks for posting! You definitely ROCK!

[narrator6]

yeah, jc admired him immenseley. during the arkestra's stay in nyc mr.coltrane would sit at the front and study mr.gilmore's playing.

[mibellavida]

this is garbage.

[TheSocialistsParty]

No, in fact its quite an emotional expression and difficult to achieve this level of virtuosity.

[Leondale]

right, you have to be open and empathetic to understand the feeling he's expressing.

Miles goes there, Coltrane goes there, Hendrix sometimes went there, Radio head, squarepusher, Biosphere....

They all play in a language not all Humans are versed in....

[acidflower2]

Gilmore could overblow more extreme perhaps than anyone. Thanks.

[joyhorror]

nice. can't wait to see more from you on youtube !