ELCA decisions explained

[NixonisLord]

"repugnant" is in the eyes of the beholder. I don't appreciate pre-emptive censorship any more than censorship of any other kind. I don't like prior restraint. Socially and psychologically could many anything and everything. If you don't like a joke, don't laugh at it. Don't like a book? Don't read it. A TV show or movie or song irritates or offends you? Don't watch or listen and don't buy.

[NixonisLord]

Religion parodies itself once again. Why anyone wants anything to do with religion, (and I don't care if you marry a cabbage) is beyond me.

[CoryTheRaven]

@NixonisLord It's kinda' like how if you're black or Jewish you're allowed to make jokes about blacks or Jews. We're able to make fun of ourselves because A) we have senses of humour, and B) they're our issues to deal with. If you're not religious and you make mean-spirited jokes about religion (though usually people skip making intentional jokes and just go straight for being mean-spirited), then you're just being a jerk.

[NixonisLord]

@CoryTheRaven Why can't non-Jews and non-Blacks make fun of them? People make fun of White people who aren't White. Is there some sort of committee that gets to make these decisions? Or are you just making it up to suit your politics or worldview? As an atheist, I would be ashamed to feel so pitifully self-conscious and weak to think that nobody but other atheists could make fun of me. Naturally, I think it's much tougher to make fun of atheists than believers but that's just me.

[CoryTheRaven]

@NixonisLord *sigh* I'm not even entirely sure I have the energy to explain to you how a group of people satirizing themselves is socially and psychologically different from other people insulting and slandering a group they're not a part of. Are you even cognizant of how much of a racist and a bigot your first sentence makes you sound? Do you actually need it explained to you why its repugnant for non-Jews and non-blacks, and non-whites, to make fun of those people, or are you just trolling?

[NixonisLord]

@CoryTheRaven try worrying about whether or not something is accurate. Leave the rhetorical questions and the "sighs" to the drama queens, many of whom clearly seek ordination in the ELCA. Religion is unreal enough without refusing to address things that are asked with logic and examples provided.

[CoryTheRaven]

@NixonisLord That's just it: you're so caught up in the "logic and examples" of your argument and not in the braindead stupidity and classlessness of making fun of people who are different from yourself. Usually you can't talk someone out of being a douchebag, y'know?

[NixonisLord]

Wow-glad you're not using stereotypes about the middle classes who are too unenlightened to appreciate your "Prophetic ministries"! Really subtle! Your religion is boring; face it, both the ELCA and the Missouri Synod are shrinking away. Even the ELCA's head bishop says that the ELCA will be gone by 2060 if membership trends continue patterns from the past 35 years. You're all going the way of the Shakers and, as an atheist, I am glad. Waste of money, time and effort on nonsense.

[trevortrevortsr2]

The enlightened need to check the postings of one of your Pastors the Rev Ft Philip Mullen who is posting some really discusting comments on You tube which include gloating over the death of two teenagers, calling them fags. insighting others to murder, bosting about being a member of the Tea Party Patriots and suporting the racist Neo nazi BNP party who deny the holocust - You may not approve of gays however I assume you have some integrity about Hate messages -see USAsoldier1955's posts

[rjky1986]

lahainke, you know when I left the Roman church and went into Anglicanism for a while, I truly felt myself grow closer to God. I began to realize an assurance of my salvation through faith, and then working said faith out through my good works, as well as my desire to continue in fellowship with other Christians. I felt the same way in the ELCA congregations I have been involved with. I don't know what congregations you've been involved with, but I don't understand how you weren't "saved".

[rjky1986]

The contents of this video are mostly true, and full of priceless humour. Great video,

schmeckenbeckons! On another note, why is is that Gay ordinations are the issue causing everyone to get up in arms? Because isn't sin in any form still sin? What if they gamble compulsively or get wasted a lot? Or if they openly insult people on a regular basis? Should all those people never be pastors either? My point is if sin is sin, what's so radically different about being gay? (I'm straight by the way).

[rjky1986]

@peccator

I'm not sure why your comment was removed, as it was telling it like it was, but I certainly agree. Looks like some of the neocon Lutherans couldn't take the sarcasm I suppose. But regardless I agree. By our faith we are saved from the grace that comes through said grace. And I much prefer we follow the religion, the Christianity of Grace, rather than the religion of legalistics and unattainable perfection of following the Law. This is why Christ came.

[rjky1986]

@rjky1986

Sorry I meant "said faith".

[schmeckenbeckons]

I think you've got it perfectly, RJKY. God bless your pastor, your confirmation teacher, or whoever taught you. Perhaps you are self-taught. Grace is a "stumbling block" and "foolishness" to humans (1 Cor 1:23-24), but it is the wisdom and power of God. My humor comes from the Grace which allows me to laugh first at myself, and second at human pretension.

[rjky1986]

@schmeckenbeckons

Well, honestly, I am the first person in my family (as far as I know) involved with a Lutheran denomination in at least five or six generations. I started becoming involved initially with the ELCA in early 2009 though. I've contemplated joining it, though I have been more involved with and was a member of an Episcopal/Anglican parish in far-western Kentucky in 2009-2010, and a cathedral in Cincinnati in 2007-2008.

[rjky1986]

@schmeckenbeckons I guess you could say it was a combination of all of the above. I have self-taught myself a considerable amount of Lutheran, Anglican, and even Wesleyan and Roman Catholic theology, but I also received counsel from various Episcopal priests, UMC pastors, and one ELCA pastor. Thank you, and the Lord bless you as well.

[schmeckenbeckons]

RKJY: Your astute comments are on target. Clergy are guilty of many sins. Divorce, which is explicitly prohibited in the New Testament, is allowed among the clergy. Bigotry, parochialism, abuse of Word and Sacrament, heresy, and sexism are runaway sins among clergy-- not just ELCA. The ELCA has failed to define what is ethically acceptable for lay people (divorce, homosexuality, premarital sex, etc.,) and in what ways clergy can be held to a higher standard, according to our theology..

[lahainke]

Obviosly you & the rest of ELCA are a cafeteria buffett Christians. It is sad. The words in this presentation only picks & shows some of His Word, instead of following HIS FULL BIBLE! Honestly, I used to be a ELCA member...that was until I was saved. My first 22 years at ELCA, I never knew Jesus Christ......then, he came into my life, and I've been saved! I get His truth! It makes you want to aim to follow his whole word. My opinion or your opinion doesn't matter--only God's Word matter.

[ExposeTheAgenda]

The campaign we outline in the book, though complex, depends upon a program of unabashed propaganda, firmly grounded in long-established principles of psychology and advertising.

Marshall Kirk & Hunter Madsen. After The Ball: How America Will Conquer Its Fear & Hatred Of Gays In The 90's. (New York: 1989), Page xxvi.

[bistokna70]

Ha ha ha... ha ha ha... Ohhhhh my stomach hurts... I'll tell my pastor about this.

[Paleolutheran]

You sound like you also went to Luther Seminary :-D...great and hilarious video!

[klockheed]

The LCMS eagerly awaits your membership.

[PUMAGUY66]

What a shame people, you only worry about attendance or language... Don't you see, this is about people and about living the love of God to the last consequences!

[vexxterr8095]

When I resigned from the ELCA church I wish I had said all of this and more. I couldn't take anymore of their turgid sanctimonious obscure verbiage. I had to leave before "the church finally drove me completely nuts." Thanks for making me laugh.

[CoryTheRaven]

Excellent, hilarious channelling of Garisson Keillor's spirit...

Wait, he's not dead?

[regorkcorb]

What's interesting is that ALL of the churches that have made this decision are experiencing big reductions in their attendance and memberships. The Churches that have not accepted this are eperiencing increases.

[Journeys2008]

I support allowing gay and lesbian pastors to be in committed relationships, and even I thought this was funny! The one thing I see uniting all Lutherans is our distress in not seeing the church speak with a clearer voice and not hide in all of the jargon and name-dropping and attempts at trying to be all things to all people.

[Journeys2008]

I still support allowing gay and lesbian pastors to be in committed relationships. Give me all the thumbs down you wish. Have a nice day! :)

[sthompson515]

Wow - I find it amazing how many people believe there is only one way to properly interpret scriptures....

[twk373]

Hilarious!

[pastorjackw]

I have to say, this would be funny, if it weren't so true. Well, it's still very funny-- and ingenious! You managed to work in every buzz word and buzz phrase with which we in the ELCA have been bombarded for years in the Lutheran magazine and all the official publications and statements coming out of Higgins Road. Who can take them seriously anymore? The only buzz term that you missed was "rostered leader," or as I like to say "people of roster." : )

[bones3414]

Too funny!

[lemmieemmie]

LOL!!!! -- proof that even this can be parodied with good humor -- but oh how good it is to be Missouri Synod Lutheran!

[janjello]

We in the ELCA have no idea who we are, and what the Gospel is vis a vis the Bible. Luther said the Bible is the Word of God in that it POINTS to Christ. That is why we (weirdly) stand for the Holy Gospel and not all the other readings! It is time to name it what it is: Bibliolatry. And then again the new Trinity: Father, Son and Holy Bible. Its time to rewrite the creed and postpone baptism until sexual identity is determined. But then I am DEMON POSSESSED as I have epilepsy.

[Lemonholm]

Awesome video - I feel called to share this with my friends!

[sdrennan]

That section about the name dropping was spot on. Are you sure you aren't a pastor or seminarian? In any event, you are "well read, up to date, and popular"! :)

[camaroon4me]

Thank you very much for making this video. As an ELCA Lutheran myself, I need to find something funny about this whole situation. It has caused members to leave, and has actually severed some of our pastors friendships. (A real shame because my pastor is a very great man, and he has really great friends!)

Anyhow, I look forward to checking out more of your videos, and of course sending this to all of my lutheran friends! God Bless you,

John V.

[Toranut97]

This is THE FUNNIEST take on ELCA shenanigans I have ever seen! I laughed until I cried. You have a gift! Thanks!

[rothdm50]

thank you! whoever you are!!!

[djacobso1]

As the director of the ELCAs Book of Faith Initiative I totally agree that it is all about both the verbs and the Jello. As one who, with the whole church, is called, renewed, enlivened, empowered, and sent, I hope and trust and long and pray and invite you to consider that my Midwest, albeit decidedly not Scandinavian, belly laugh is sufficient unto the day.

[schmeckenbeckons]

Thank you for your belly laugh. And for your good work on behalf of us all. If there ever is a Book of Faith golf umbrella, I will proudly carry one.

[DissentingVoice]

Although I am distressed by what the ELCA has done, and have gone on to the LCMS, this is hilarious, Especially the bits about digging up old stuff that ALC, LCA, AELC said decades ago. It's like the ELCA never makes its own statements, just rehashes those oldies. Schmecken, you may have a future in stand-up comedy.

[schmeckenbeckons]

Sorry we lost you, DV. The LCMS is unambiguous on all issues, which makes me feel, um, ambiguous about the LCMS. But I love them for their German-ness, their love of Luther, and the beer which seems to flow freely whenever they are around. (Beer beats jello, in my book.) Keep your sense of humor, because the ELCA isn't the only place a Christian needs it.

[DissentingVoice]

I'm a bad Lootern...I don't drink...

[DissentingVoice]

Oh, no, you have to have a sense of humour to be Lootern of any kind. A former pastor told me "our problem is that we're like an airplane with two right wings." German? I'm half Swiss, so that's close, but also Ulster-Scots...

[rmswanny]

Brilliant. Simply the best 7 minutes and 21 seconds spent in a LONG time.

[schmeckenbeckons]

I try to tell members of my congregation that the hours I have spent reading Mark Noll's excellent textbook about 19th century American religion are some of the best hours of my life. But these Lutherans don't share my enthusiasm, and have politely suggested that I need to "get a life." I could conclude that you are as geeky and pathetic as I am. Or that I am as brilliant as Mark Noll, at least for seven minutes and 21 seconds. I choose the latter.

[rmswanny]

The latter, for SURE the latter. I never did make it through Turning Points though. Deadly stuff.

Thanks so much.

[revsusanrussell]

Thanks for helping this Episcopalian understand more about what's going on with our Lutheran cousins. BRAVO!

The Reverend Susan Russell

[schmeckenbeckons]

Rev. Susan, my colleague, I dearly love the ECUSA and the BCP, but it takes a translator for me to understand wardens, rectors, vestries, and canons. (It all sounds to me vaguely like a museum of 19th century medical treatments.) So if you can now speak "Lutheran," you may well be able to resolve perplexing semantic problems that have plagued both of our churches. (Grin.) Thanks for the good words!

[bourdon0774]

This was great!! Keep it up! "Martin Stephan was a sex addict." LOL!

[schmeckenbeckons]

Martin Stephan... it turns out to be a BIG inside joke. Most people don't even understand the reference. Even my favorite LCMS brothers and sisters are unaware of history BW (before Walther).

[acraigsettlage]

It's actually Vision and Expectations....

Thanks for a good laugh in this time of stress for many. I look forward to another video!

[schmeckenbeckons]

In my other life (the life that pays my salary), I am sinfully proud of my ability to correctly use terms and to grasp semantics. David Swartling, who is my secret hero, has made it impossible for me to ever again use the phrase "simple majority." I now, belatedly, grasp the difference between "vision" and "visions." I'm laughing out loud. Perhaps this distinction could be made into a YouTube video... Sincere thanks for your good work for this church, and a big shalom to you.

[schmeckenbeckons]

Thank you for making this video more viral than the H1N1 swine flu. I've posted a new video which illustrates the peculiarities of my own synod, the Grand Canyon Synod. Maybe it will make you chuckle. It is posted under video responses. Thanks again!

[GenizahGuard]

I positively roared out loud and belly laughed so much I had to go back and hear what I missed. Amazing!

[schmeckenbeckons]

Thank you for your affirmation. Is it true that you are Bishop Mark Hanson?

[GenizahGuard]

No, but I've met him at the ordination of some friends.

[schmeckenbeckons]

Shucks. I would feel great if I caused our presiding bishop to belly laugh. I met him in 2006 at a synod assembly. I was too scared to joke, at the time. But I'm glad you roared and belly laughed, even if you are not a presiding bishop.

[pastordan02]

Oh, man, you had this boring Lutheran laughing out loud whilst admiring your adept satirical take on who we are and where we are. Thanks!!!

[schmeckenbeckons]

Thanks for the good words, pastordan02.  I was really hoping to get viewed by pastordan01, but everybody says he's too busy these days.

[sarakdb]

Truly, inspired. Why don't I quite dare share this on my Facebook page??? Might be Lutheran Pastor's Wife Syndrome. Who are you, Schmeckenbeckons?? Keep up the great work!!

[schmeckenbeckons]

You are a pastor's wife?  Talk about visions and expectations...

[RFSJ]

Hilarious!

[schmeckenbeckons]

Thank you, RFSJ.

[timfrakes]

Brilliant! I love it!

[schmeckenbeckons]

Thank you, timfrakes.

[dolfan65]

would manna be the ancients jello??

[crimthann86]

oh hey maybe, I will have to check that out..

"Morning after morning they gathered it, till each had enough to eat; but when the sun grew hot, the manna melted away."

hmm maybe, 'cause Jello would melt away if it's not kept cold.. oh it's all so biblical now.. thanks

[dolfan65]

i am not trying to be mean,,,sorry ,, u have a big mess on ur hands.(in the lutheran church ).hopefully the preachers can keep the flock in the barnyard...and yes the movie was funny...the jello scene was funny,,a giggle is leaving me as i type..i will never eat jello again and not think of a lutheran :,))) martin in particular..

[schmeckenbeckons]

Dolfan65 and Crimthann86, just wait til the Methodists find this video. They will attack, because they feel that they own the Jello thing. (LOL) Anyway, it is great to have you, your humor, and your goodwill in the conversation. This whole thing is therapy for me. Thanks.

[crimthann86]

oh that old methodism thing is really a problem.. Charles Wesley and those hymns.. ugghh.. is this unity worth it? Personally i'm about gayed out with dolfan65 as he is my old good high school buddy who left Pennsylvania to go down south to be a baptist or whatever.. ;-) but he does understand quite rightly that God gave us the gift of humor.. it helps us to survive I think.

[crimthann86]

i hate Jello too now that I think of it.. There's no Jello in the bible even..

[jerclan]

umm, i don't know much about ELCA

plz enlighten me.

[schmeckenbeckons]

We are a very sincere church (did you ever see Linus in the pumpkin patch?). I am trying to get us to laugh at ourselves a little, after a big family argument. Does that make sense?

[jerclan]

i think so.

[dolfan65]

was this the lutheren micheal moore??

[schmeckenbeckons]

I would love to be the Lutheran Mark Twain. But the more weight I gain, the more I look like Michael Moore.

[crimthann86]

no silly and be nice or i won't share any more video with you.. i think it's a very funny video as at my very first synod assembly I became aware of how much Lutherans like to make statements of faith but i think the Jello and coffee must be a particularly Midwestern thing as I don't see Jello that much really and if you get coffee is hit or miss too.. perhaps it's a Scandinavian thing.

[crimthann86]

that's an amazingly accurate summation of how Lutherans do politics and a beautifully accurate grasp of dry Lutheran humor that when Eastern Lutherans hear it we think your talking about someone else and we're not sure why it's funny.

5 stars and I am sending this to my friends list.

[schmeckenbeckons]

Thanks for the 5 stars, and thanks for forwarding.

[crimthann86]

well this is very funny, even my wife laughed at it, and i hope you make more videos.. I enjoyed the Roseanna anna danna bit too.. humor makes life much better..  tnks..

[spaljoey]

Very funny and clever.

[schmeckenbeckons]

Thanks for the good words.