Tyson beat Foreman ? The tin man would never make it out of the dressing room. A 42 year old Foreman would destroy the coward in two. Foreman at 25 against a "prime" tin man ? Tyson would shit his pants on the way to the rind. Tyson beat Jeffries? Maybe Jack Jeffries. There is only a handful of true heavyweight champs that the rapist could vave defeated. The most overated fighter in history. A compete fraud, cowardly chicken.
@1899sharkey Mike Tyson is definitely a Top 10 Heavyweight. He ranks above Lennox Lewis, Joe Frazier, Sonny Liston etc. Tyson resume is actually very impressive. He fought and beat all the followings fighters CONSECUTIVELY Trevor Berbick world champ Bonecrusher Smith world champ Pinklon Thomas world champ Tony Tucker world champ Tyrell Biggs Olympic gold medalist Larry Holmes world champ and HOF Tony Tubbs world champ Michael Spinks world champ and HOF Frank Bruno world champ
@illmatic826 - All the fighters you named would not make adequate sparring partners for Jeffries. Like i said bongo lips, only ignorant tTyson nuthuggers are ignorant enough to call the subhuman great. Jeffries wouldn't waste his time with the rapist, he would let Corbett take care of his light work. I've seen 10 different white boys school your inferior ass on here, WHEN WILL YOU LEARN YOU'RE NOT CAPABLE OF HANGING WITH THE BIG BOYS!! Ha,Ha, Ha, Ha, Ha.
@1899sharkey name ten pecker necks that schooled me??? like I said paper lips you cant hold me LIL BOY you just a sad confused low grade trash ass white boy, & its been plenty blacks,whites, & hispanics thats schooled your stupid low grade saltine ass on here, WHEN WILL YOU LEARN YOU'RE NOT CAPABLE OF HANGING WITH THE BIG BOYS!! Ha,Ha, Ha, Ha, Ha. Just stop it you just clowning yourself with that bum jeffries shit even you believe that jeffries cant beat Tyson, jeffries is just too weak & slow.
@1899sharkey LIL BOY you just getting OWNED XD there is no way you can beat me in this argument even PREZ150 thinks that bum jeffries is shit you just delusional sonny boy, the only thing that would of happened if Tyson would of fought bum jeffries is the parametics scraping that bitch jeffries up off the canvas LOL OWNED AGAIN XD just go to boxing sites and hold a vote between Iron Mike & bum jeffries & if jeffries gets more votes then I will give his sorry ass props but Mike will win anyway :)
@1899sharkey so you think that the great Larry Holmes wouldn't make a good sparring partner for jeffries when he sparred with Ali??? you more stupid than I thought if you put bum jeffries over Holmes & Ali & even Michael Spinks. I dont even know why im even wasting my time with your low grade ass, you just too pathetic for words, im really getting tired of verbally kicking your saltine ass just go somewhere & lay down.
@illmatic826 - 1st, you wont find any comment i've ever made on utube that Jeff is the best heavy ever. What makes Jeff great is a multitude of factors that i have no intention of laying out for someone who has no respect for Jim. 100 years after his career ended he was named 7th best heavy ever by the IBRO. Jack Johnson said in a ring interview in later years that he thought Jeff would beat Louis. Farewell my friend, stay the hell on your heros vids.
@1899sharkey no no no no no this argument aint over til I say the shit is over you have a personal grudge against blacks & Tyson & I wanna know why you call Tyson a rapist when it wasn't even proved he even raped that lying bitch & second of all ms washington pulled that stunt a couple of times before Tyson, you dont have to give a fuck about blacks or Tyson but you will respect it believe that buddy boy, saying Tyson isnt great is just stupid, the most feared champion EVER, Hall-Of-Famer
@1899sharkey as much as you may hate to say it you gotta admit the Heavyweight division has been shit since Tyson hung up the gloves, the division isnt as exciting its not a fighter out there that lets everyone in the whole fuckin division know that he is the best & there is no stopping of denying him, I just dont see that fire in the division anymore I dont see a dominant fighter in this era of boxing & thats the only thing in LIFE I can agree with you on. Now im done with this discussion.
@1899sharkey look here the way you feel about jim jeffries is the way I feel about Tyson, you say that "a multitude of factors make him great" ok cool but you talk like Tyson was glass joe. The things that made Tyson great was not only his physical ability & all the tools he had, but it was his ring savy his smartness of figuring out his opponents. When he was in jr olympics Cus knew he was gonna fight guys with long reach so he groomed him to deal with it, He was a student of the game
@1899sharkey & it wasnt just in the ring that made Mike great to people but it was things outside of the ring that made him a true champ we all know about all the run ins with the law & that fake rape case, but this man was sentenced to prison came out & won the title again yeah he had his losses just like any other fighter, but at the end of the day Tyson was one of the most exciting,explosive,dynamic champions that ever lived, so yeah Tyson is one of my heroes & im not one of those dummies.
@1899sharkey even though its wrong Tyson said that boxing was just like robbing a person even though they know its coming you gotta change up so they dont suspect it and then BOOM you got em.
Jeffries is easily one of the greatest of all times. Just because their is little footage of him does not detract from his greatness, he was champ over 100 years ago naturally there is going to be little video. So we must rely on expert opinion Nat Fleischer founder of ring magazine who saw all the greats, rated Jeffries as the best heavyweight ever. He is highly rated by all boxing historians, despite the fact it has been a 100 years. Tyson won't even be rated in 50 years time, get real people
Curious as to why no photos other than a handshake exist of the Jeffries vs Fitzsimmons fights. There are action shots of John L Sullivan almost 15 years earlier for christ shake. You would think at least some action pictures were taken of either of their fights.
I'll give you a new 'Boxing Warrior' to idolize, who is right now in his prime. The best pound for pound boxer in the World: ****Manny Pacquiao****. Check out the "Best of Manny Pacquiao" YouTube video.
The argument in regards would Jeffries be able to defeat boxers of today is a tad null & void - the conditioning is far better today, &c. But for his time, in his prime, he beat the best - Two former world champions included. Sadly for ol' JJ, he will always be remembered for his last fight, that beating he received from Johnson, & for being a racist. A product of his time perhaps. The one quality I have always admired about Jeffries was his durability - he could take a beating & come back.
@sugarraykirk -Thanx for clearing that up. I was wondering why guys like Jeffries could go 25 rounds and these bums today cant go ten. Its cause todays conditioning is far better.lmao. There is only one small thing wrong with your theory....its completely ass backwards. Don't reply with the typical... everything is better today.
@1899sharkey I kind of see what you are getting at about the conditioning, but what you have failed to keep in mind is the legal limit of boxing matches today. Yes, the pioneers of the sport would fight till they drop. In our world of today we can’t have that, unless the fight takes place in a disused car lot or something. Boxers/trainers work to those rounds, be they 10 or 12. Training methods of today (i.e. conditioning) are far superior.
@sugarraykirk - Wrong again. Jeffries fought under M of Q rules, 3-min. rounds, 1minute rest period. Same rules as today except the the number of rounds. What training methods of today are superior to the oldtimers methods?Do they run more miles? Spar more rounds? Even critics of the old timers admit that their conditioning was far superior to todays bums. Boxing has DEVOLVED not EVOLVED.Better conditiond today? What a joke. Absolutely nothing better about boxing today
@1899sharkey Here's one for you. If you took the Jeffries of yesteryear into the present, trained him with today's methods, today's techniques, who do you think would be the better fighter? The old Jeffries, or the new?
@sugarraykirk - Without a doubt, the old one. Todays methods? It's clear to see where todays methods have got boxing. Which of todays methods or techniques impresses you so much?
I go to these vids just to get a good laugh, ok first off jeffries was and will always be a bum, how could anybody even fix they mouth to say that bummy jeffries could even touch Tyson & Ali better yet beat em, Im ending the whold convo with this, when a group of guys are having a conversaion about who was the best boxer ever only a few names are gonna come up & thats Tyson, Ali, Frazier, foreman & Robinson, nobody is gonna say jim jeffries, ok jim jeffries was & is a nobody FACE IT.
@illmatic826 - Spoken like a true ignoramus - with a group of jocks - wannabees - who know little of boxing history. In your terms, a bunch of dummies !
@jhs1958 NO you dont know shit about boxing if you think that punk ass jeffries could even touch Tyson, Ali, Frazier, Foreman, oh let me guess you white arent ya??? nah dont be suprised my fathers black & my mothers italian but im BLACK dont get it twisted, BUT anyway jeffries would of been a tooth pic for Tyson, Ali, Frazier, & Foreman
@illmatic826 - Now you are lying, actually implying that you know who your daddy is! Btw, you like following white guys around on you tube, don't ya? I think you're a little on the fem side, aren't ya? No wonder you love The tin man so much. Dreaming of sharing a cell with the tin man, aren't ya?
@1899sharkey Now you are lying, actually implying that you know who your daddy is! guess your father is your uncle to huh??? hahahahaha Btw, your slutty mother like following black guys around on the street corners, don't she? I think you're a little on the fem side, aren't ya? No wonder you love Bummy Jeffries so much. Dreaming of sharing a cell with the bummy man, aren't ya?
@illmatic826 Ali could beat Jeffries on a given night, maybe he could. But tyson would be killed by Jeffries!! How can you call Jeffries a tooth pick, the man was 6'3" and 225lbs, all muscle. Jeffries would knock tyson around like a rag doll. Foreman would destroy tyson in one round too, here is a little fact for you mike tyson never rose to beat the count in his entire career, FACT. He has no heart!! Frazier rose six times against foreman, tyson wouldn't get up once. Tyson is the real bum!!
@XavierMarciano Tyson beat guys waaay bigger than that bum jeffries & Tyson also has more power than jeffries ever will, If Ali could knock out foreman & frazier with less power than Tyson then just imagine what Iron Mike would do to em, you guys kill me with that shit, how could you even call Tyson a bum the man was & is a All-Time Great Hall-Of-Fame boxer who was the youngest to EVER win the Title & was virtually unbeatable in his prime, The only thing that beat Tyson was Tyson. FACT!
@illmatic826 Tyson would be mauled by foreman, foreman has an 82 inch reach, mike has a 71 inch reach, get real boy!! Mike would never get inside, he would be nailed by foreman. Mike has good headmovement but can't dodge 100% of punches, the second he gets nailed he goes down and stays down, hasn't got the heart to get back up. Mike wouldn't last as long as frazier did, frazier had the heart to rise six times, mike never got up once in his entire career. Tyson beat nothing but washed up tin cans
@XavierMarciano man reach dont mean nothing you been playing too much fight night Tyson fought people that had longer reach than him all the time, & a prime tyson was trained & taught to slip jabs from long reach fighters, & you say Tyson would get nailed by a slow stationary target like foreman BUT what would happen if foreman get nailed by the hardest punch in boxing history A Tyson Uppercut, first of all Tyson would be too active for foreman to set his feet & hit, & Tyson would just kill him.
@illmatic826 I don't play fight night, I'm almost fifty. Reach is a big deal, it's a great advantage in boxing. As I said tyson can't slip 100% of punches, second he gets nailed by foreman it's goodbye tyson. Mike tyson can't hit as hard as foreman. Mike had to put his punches in combinations quite often to put a man down. Foreman has real one punch knockout power. Boxing historians rate foreman and shavers as the hardest punchers ever, not tyson. Oh and tyson was chicken to fight 40+ foreman.
@XavierMarciano that shows how much your dumbass Tyson didn't fight foreman because he was scared but because of WHY??? it was no titles to win & nothing to prove by beating up on a old ass foreman
@illmatic826 -Well i see Xaviermarciano is the latest in a long list to school your racist ,ignorant ass. Go converse with other Tyson buttfuckers who like you yearn for a whiff of the cowards rectum. You're not only exceedingly stupid, apparently you're blind as well. Tyson must have loved the canvas because he sure the hell spent a lot of time lying on it! Mike da best man... cause buckwheat illmatic826 says so...
@1899sharkey OH another pedophile white boy that knows shit about boxing how could your goofy ass even say that Tyson spent alot of time on the canvas when he only lost six fights out of 58, its clear that you just dont like Tyson why because Iron Mike may have beat one of your uncles asses in the ring before huh??? & how am I being schooled little boy because yo stupid ass said that Tyson was "1 dimensional" LOL thats funny bum jeffries was NO dimensional with his sorry ass. bye jeffrey dahmer.
@1899sharkey like I said before ask ANYBODY who would win between Iron Mike Tyson & bum jeffries I guarantee 100% will say Iron Mike would mop bum jeffries ass, & now that I think about it nobody even know who bum jeffries is I dont even see why you even bother finding the sorry mother fucker. Because we ALL know that Tyson would K.O. bummy man without making a sweat just like he did 44 other victims. You just a hater plain & simple cause no matter what you say Tyson is a Hall-Of-Famer so STFU.
@illmatic826 The mere fact you came to my page to call me fagboy, just shows what an idiotic little man you really are. As for my top 10 I won't be putting tyson on it, let alone number 1. All ten men on my list would spank tyson all over a ring and all ten would knock him out. Lets see tyson isn't on bert sugars top 10, or ray arcels, or on any boxing historians top ten. Any intelligent man doen't rate tyson in the top ten, only redneck hicks like you could consider him number one.
@illmatic826 -Is it true your mammy is only 10 years older than you? Clevelefs said you thought she was your sista until she told you the truth while you were rear ending her. Is he right? You need help, nigga(and i say that affectionately) Have you considered turning yourself in?
How in the hell would Tyson beat Jeffries? Knock him out? Thats laughable. Decision him over a tough 15 rounder? Even funnier. Tyson's not a top tenner, Jeff would be just getting warmed up when Tyson started looking for the soft spot on the canvas.
@1899sharkey Tyson is arguably the greatest of all-time & he would bulldoze through jeffries bum ass, when you have a boxing conversation with boxing fans about who was the greatest I guarantee you that jeffries name would not come up you would hear Tyson, Ali, Foreman, Frazier Because those fighters where head & shoulders above anyone else & they would all beat the hell out that bummy ass jeffries.
@1899sharkey you so stupid you really think that this bummy ass fighter is better that Ali, Tyson, Frazier, & Foreman??? man you just another dumb ass white boy with his head up his ass
@jhs1958 How can you be so sure when there is little footage of him? The likes of Foreman, Liston, Ali, Tyson e.c.t. even Lennox Lewis would have beaten him.
The mere notion of tyson being able to beat jeffries is laughable. Jeffries would destroy tyson. Jim could take a punch far better than tyson, jim had huge heart, and jim had arguably the greatest stamina in heavyweight history. I can't predict the round but I'm certain jeffries would beat tyson by knockout. Jeffries is highly underated by the public, but still regarded highly by boxing historians. I'm sure the historians won't rate tyson in a hundred years time as highly as they have Jeffries.
It's difficult to compare an old time fighter like Jeffries to a Tyson or Ali, simply because the fights were longer in the old days. So, if the Jeffries v Ali fight was held over 15 rounds, then Ali would probably win a wide decision (I doubt Ali could stop a man like Jeffries). However, if the fight was set for say 30 Rounds, I think Ali would burn himself out and Jeffries would start to grind him down - Ali would be stopped before round 25.
how is it a fact that jeffries had more heart, strength and endurance? this is why your an idiot, you would have me believe that a fighter who fought almost one hundred years before mike tyson was stronger... and had more endurance.. yea ok buddy do you not see how that is flawed? people are way bigger now than they were 100 years ago.. our training is better diets are better and knowledge of kinesiology is better. thats like you telling me babe ruth would hit 60 home runs in todays MLB...
@msuperboy - So... The guy that informed us that Tyson won the Olymic gold medal is now gonna tell us that Tyson was bigger ,stronger and had more endurance than Jeffries. Babe Ruth would have hit 90 home runs off of this watered down minor league pitching. The junior olympics are an american tournament for 10-15 year olds.You're out of your league novice, back to your video games.
@1899sharkey You are so very RIGHT. Have to keep in mind that the boxers back then fought in a ring for more then 10 or 12 rounds like they do today. Jeffries Johnson or Jack Dempsey would have gutted most modern fighters. Also the fighters back then have to barrow a line from "Rocky III" "Had the eye of the Tiger!" So let face it Old School can kick the new kids on the blocks asses!
@LordTariq83 Who did Jeffries duck ??? He fought the best of his time and he continually improved. You are biased and do not know the heavyweight history from 1895 to 1905.
@dorsi68 I'll tell you who Jeffries ducked, he ducked Jack Johnson in 1904-05. Instead of fighting him while in his prime he basically gave his belt to one of the two guys he felt deserved it and retired for five years. Johnson had beat the brakes off Jeffries brother in a match at some point and Jim didn't want anything to do with him. Granted I'm sure politics played a big part in his decision not to fight Johnson also.
@mvpsmb1 Hi there, why do you think he ducked Jack Johnson in 1904 to 1905 ??? Do you think Johnson was a legitimate top 5 fighter at that moment ??? You know he was knocked out recently and lost some fights. If Johnson was a legitimate top 5 fighter in the beginning of 1905, maybe they would have fought, but probably not. But Johnson was not a top contender. Why do you think he was at that moment ???? Also, Jeffries brother is not a vliad point to fight for the title.
@dorsi68 I do believe that Johnson was undoubtedly a legitimate top 5 contender in early 1905. He had been the World Colored Heavyweight Champion since 1903! He had only lost to Hart and that was by decision, not by KO and had already been trying for years to get Jefferies to fight by that point. I mentioned the brother fight because Jim was in his corner and its widely believed that seeing Johnson's skills first hand gave him all the more reason to draw the color line and not fight Jack.
@mvpsmb1 If your objective, Jeffries was not afraid of Johnson. To say that would be foolish. If you look at Johnson's defenses as champion, he did not fight the best white fighters and avoided 4 of the top 5 contenders while champion (who were black) ... do you believe Johnson drew the colour line ??? Now its true that Johnson was KO'd by Choynski and lost to Griffin in 1901, but by losing to Hart and having a tough time beating Munroe (who Jeffries easily beat recently), Johnson
@mvpsmb1 did not deserve a title shot until mid to late 1906 to 1907 at best. Johnson was also DQ agaianst Jeanette. I rank Johnson as the 3rd greatest heavyweight behind Jeffries and Louis, but at 1904 to 1905 (even though Jeffries did not fight that year), you can not possibly say that Jeffries would lose to Johnson based on the above. Johnson started hitting his prime in 1906 (to about 1912/3) and he would have been KO'd in the 111th to 16th round
@mvpsmb1 depending when he fought Jeffries in 1904 to 1905. The fighter I feel worst for is Langford who is the greatest p4p fighter ever. Your argument has holes and is weak that he deserved a title shot with Jeffries in 1904 to early to mid-1905 with Jeffries, but Langford was clearly the best contender from 1908 to 1914 for Johnson, but he did nit fight him. Do you think Johnson was afarid of Langford ??? Of couse he was not, but there are reasons why he did not fight Langford.
Why are you so obsessed with a fighter from 100 years ago? Let's face it, he doesn't look like any special fighter from these old film clips. Now Jack Johnson was a great boxer!
@PoutinePete - Why are you so obsessed with a fighter from 100 years ago? Let's face it, he doesn't look like any special fighter from these old film clips. Now JIM JEFFRIES was a great boxer!
@PoutinePete - I appreciate greatness in boxers, whether they are oldtimers or moderns. Trouble is, there are so few great ones today. Something else, you can't judge a book by the cover - and you can't tell a great fighter just by looking.
@jhs1958 er.....he beat Jim Jeffries. In fact Jim later said that even in his prime he would'nt have been able to beat Johnson. Check your history books.
@PoutinePete - Well, let's see now. (1) YOU GUYS say Jeffries was nothing. So, according to your logic, Johnson did nothing special by beating Jeffries. (2) YOU CHECK YOUR HISTORY BOOKS. Jeffries later said, it was Father time who beat him, not Johnson. And, Johnson later said, in his opinion, Jeffries was the greatest. CHECK YOUR HISTORY BOOKS !!!
@PoutinePete - Johnson did say he thought Jeffries was the greatest - it's in a Ring magazine article by Fleischer. There is also a newspaper article in which Johnson said the only time he felt fear in the ring was against Jim Jeffries. I DON'T BLAME HIM FOR THAT - facing the greatest heavyweight ever, I'd be scared too.
@PoutinePete What you don't see in any of the existing clips is his punching power. Unlike the great Johnson,
in his prime Jeffries did have one punch knockout power, especially with his left. He was never a stylist like Johnson and was considered clumsy even in his day. His greatness in his prime was his power, stamina,heart
and the ability to absorb punishment. All of this was lacking by 1910. Greatness comes in many forms.
I think too many people tend to write off Jeffries without learning about him because of his appearance. They see him and the years he fought in and automatically assume that he was just a ruthles bear with no defense or skill. THEY DON't KNOW HOW WRONG THEY ARE!
I heard a story about Jeffries that one day he went hunting with his team and that he brought down a male buck I dunno, a 16 pointer or so. Well, the story I heard was that Jeffries hoisted the big buck across his immenser shoulders and jogged with it for 9 miles w/o a break! Meanwhile his team of trainers ran outta gas LoL!
These guys are the GOLD standards by which the past & present should be judged. Not films or by people who didn't literally see them train & fight. BS stuff like on coxs corner is nothing to be used to sway opinions. Just look at the crap people post on these sites. Most have never even put on gloves, let alone taught/studied boxing. i personally think Dempsey is the best ever,but again only from what I"ve read & watched.
i am very curious as to what kind of strength training these guys were doing. this was faaarrr before the popularization of weightlifting, so it makes a person wonder- were they encouraged to pull-ups and pushups? sprints too, i'd imagine. jeffries and johnson were both very well built.
Back in those days, manual labor was how things got done. Jeffries worked labor jobs growing up. The jobs he did built strength through dynamic tension which is far better than bulk conditioning - although he was put together. Weights were used some too. And, they wrestled in training - something today's fighters could profit from if they did it.
The older fighters did lots of things like pushups, pullups, chopping logs, carrying rocks, running - much more running - than today - plus WRESTLING.
Jeffries was a tremendous all-around athlete. He was bigger and stronger than either Dempsey or Marciano. He beat several men who fought like Jack and Rocky - Tom Sharkey (like Rock) and Bob Fitzsimmons (like Jack) - to name two.
His chin was probably never equaled in hevayweight history. Stamina also.
Turn of the Century boxing lore states that Corbett and Fitzsimmons had massive upper bodies comparable to today's heavies. Is this true? Not according to the tale of the tape. I compared Fitzsimmons upper body stats to current middle weight champion Kelly Pavlik. They are almost identical with a slight edge to Pavlik. The same can be said for Corbett who is slightly bigger with a smaller chest. They were fit but no any bigger than today's
Andrew, keep searching the old aricles. You'll find different measures. Corbett never was a large man - but lean and very lithe and quick. Fitz was a middleweight but got larger in the upper torso. While trainng with Jeffries later on, he weighed over 200 pounds. Others too - 180-200 lbs - had upper bodies like today's 220-230 pounders.
According to the NY Times Fitzsimmons weighed 172lbs the day of the 2nd Jeffries fight. Even at the end of his career he was under 170lbs. You seem to be selective of what you choose to believe from early sources. If you doubt measurements, tangible facts, why are you so willing to accept non tangible facts from turn of the century sources such as their opinions and judgments of punching power, speed and boxing skill?
Nice try, Andrew, but I saw a report on Fitz of his weight over 200 lbs. That's a tangible number. Jeffries was named the #1 all-time heavyweight in many polls, all the way up to the 1950s. Tell me, why do you reject that tangible fact?
I would like to know what report you are referring too. I doubt it's authenticity simply because even in his last two fights Fitzsimons was under 180 lbs. I don't
reject the fact that a few polls named Jeffries number #1, I just don't have the same opionion. Of course those who participated in such polls had yet to see
fighters such as Ail, Joe Frazier, Larry Holmes, Mike Tyson or other modern greats.
Andrew, I do not recall the source. I do know Fitz and Jeffries went on exhibition tours. Perhaps, it was on a tour that Fitz was heavier. But, as to measurements, Fitz began as a middlweight and was smaller. Over the years, he got heavier and bigger - chest, biceps, neck.
Andrew, as to measures, a number of men in the old days, 180-200 pounds, had biceps, neck, chest as big as today's heavyweights who weight 210-220 lbs. So, they really weren't so much smaller in areas where hitting came to play.
If one is considering all era's and all rules, e.g. 45 round fights to the finish, both 5 and 10 oz gloves, bare knuckles, rules that allowed a lot of holding etc., then Jeffries could be argued into the top 5. However, when assessing boxing as a modern sport the standard should be a 20 foot ring, 8-10 oz gloves, modern rules and a 15 round standard that dominated most of the last 100 years.
@jhs1958 Well uhhhhhhhhh lol. (I 've been off line for 6 months lol and don't even remember writing this lol) ALL-TIME to me means the greatest period the Best Beyond the REST And that means that he along with those of his era (tough men but with crude styles) in my opinion would be further down the all time list.
@LVSWTZ - All-Time also means London rules or Queensberry (wrestling tactics and/or only hitting), gloves or bare-fists, small ring or large, limited rounds or finish fight, etc. I pick Jeffries as the best in any type of fight. Suppose you were going to a fight and did not know what conditions would exist for the contest. Who would you bring as your fighter? I'd bring Jeffries.
@jhs1958 Very nice I see your point But if that's the case I'd bring Ike Ibeabucci who's prime physique and measurements (6'2 ,235lbs Vs Tua) and allround atheleticsm were par on with Jeffries and modern day style ( Think Holyfield but 30LBS BIGGER!) would be an edge. Ruggedness and Heart goes along way but technique and preperation go even further.
@jhs1958 I appoligize for LMAO when I first read your comment. You maybe right but Ike wasn't a bleeder like Jeffries and Ike deafeated to polar opposite styled fighters in there prime. The Brute Force aggression of David Tua who may have been the Strongest and Powerful man HWT history and the award quick slick Chris byrd. Ike showed Brains Vs Byrd and Brawn Vs Tua. Ike was Holyfied and Tyson combined! Think about it
@LVSWTZ - Most of the true, top bruisers did NOT need style an technique to beat the others. They had strength, power, chin, etc. It was the others who needed style and technique in order to avoid them.
@jhs1958 "Most of the true, top bruisers did NOT need style" that's why they got beat when it mattered the most Foreman Frazier and Jeffries.Teddy Atlas said you have two tough fighters but one them has the skill. He's the tougher fighter like Ward Vs Gatti Trilogy. Both were equal in heart courage & toughness but Gatti's superior boxing skill won the war for him. Boxing is a thinkings mans game it worked for Jack Johnson and Ali and that's why they beat them.
Yes, and the guys who see Ali, Frazier, Holmes, Tyson and other moderns, didn't see Jeffries except on film clips. But, boxing people of the past were no fools and they ALL testify to Jeffries' greatness.
@andrewr62 "Dumb" Dan Morgan, old-time manager/trainer who saw them all from Sullivan thru Marciano, said Jeffries was the best. He talked about them all. Praised some, some not. Regarded Johnson, Dempsey & Tunney all highly. Asked about Dempsey vs Louis constantly. Simply said Dempsey in a round !! Said Marciano was crudest ever. Ray Arcel saw Dempsey thru Holmes, at least, said Ali & Homes were good "boxers". Laughed when asked how Dempsey would do against today's fighters.
Andrew, methinks you "generalize" like many fans of today - when you "put down" old fighters and athletes. Many of today's men are pansies compared to the toughies of past years.
Andrew, when you speak of Fitz fighting, you are talking about a rare exception - like Mozart in music (8-9-10 years old - writing symphonies). Fitz was slick and had exceptional, explosive hitting power plus an upper torso like 200 plus pound heavyweights.
Andrew, read some more articles about old Fitz versus other punchers of that day. Jeffries, Sullivan, Sharkey, etc., "pounded" their man down. Fitz "tapped" and they fell.
Andrew, Corbett was slicker than any of the heavies in the ring today. He fought however it took to win - brainy - like not seen today. He wouldn't take body shots vs Tyson, etc.
It is certainly true that Sam Langford advertised he would fight any man in the world except James Jeffries. It should be noted at that time Langford was about 150lbs. Even Johnson never took much credit when he easily outclassed Langford in their one sided1905 match because of the huge size difference. It was not until 1910 and after that Langford began to put on more weight but at his best he was never more than 175lbs.
It was Langford's manager, not Langford himself who came up with that concept. Langford would have fought anyone and he would have lost to Jefferies than and even in his peak. Langford was probbaly the greatest p4p ever. Too bad he was never given a chance to fight for the linear championship.
Years ago in Ring I saw several photo's of the Langford v
Ketchel fight. It looked as though they had been taken from
a film. Maybe one day that film will pop up. Would love to see it. The fight was a 5 round promo, a tame affair to promote and stir interest in a finish bout. Ketchel statrted quickly and Langford finished strong according to most newspapers. Unfortunately Ketchel passed away.
Listen a prime Ali would beat Tyson - Tyson admitted that but that ain't what matters Tyson respected Ali nd the same back - they wern't going to say they could beat eachother - there is a video of them on a talk show u will see what i mean
just think like this right - if these fighters were in todays time, todays fighters would be on the bottom of the list because these guys had great heart, and were better fighter.
Mohammed Ali praised Tyson: 'He is a real champ. He could have beaten me. Foreman was powerful but slow, Tyson was power and speed'
George Foreman also praised him:'If Tyson fought in my era he would have been the 2nd best after me' (he was implying that Tyson was better than Ali, Frazier, Holmes, Norton and the others of the 'golden era'
While fighters today and heavyweight boxing in general has declined in popularity the last 20 years many of the recent champions were /are in my opinion of good quality. Lennox Lewis was formidable as is Klitscho. Certainly there has been better in the past but there has been worse as well. Tyson at his peak I rank as one of the best though his peak did not last long. They would have done well in any
I agree with your to an extent as i know Lewis and Klitscho would be good fighters in any era , but they would by no means be chamions in most years except at the weakest era. Lewis could hit harder at 240 lbs than say Louis , Dempsey or marciano at there respective weights even if they all added 15 to 20 pounds based on nutrition etc. Klitscho is an excellent boxer and technically very sound and very few fighters would match him atheltically based on his size and strength.
But they lack two important quailities ... chin and stanima. Whenever they get tagged they lose. Corrie Sanders is a decent fighter at best who has game but tagged the younger Klitcho and knocked him out. Lewis was KO'd twice by decent fighters as well. Had they fought Jefferies for example , jefferies was still alot stronger even back than and he would fight in close range and his power was close to Lewis and harder than Klitcho.
Jefferies was never knocked down in his prime by harder punchers than Sanders or McCall for example. Both fighters would not last 5 rounds with Jefferies. Both would be in the top 10 for most eras but fighters in general could take a punch and were conditioned to fight at close range and that would be tough for the fighters todat in adjusting to. Remember , james Toney who is 12 years or so past his prime is close to a top 10 heavyweight now so that says alot about boxing today.
Tyson was very overrated as his opponents feared him. I know Tyson had a great punch and if you backed away from Tyson or were scared you lost. Eddie Futch even called Tyson overrated before his lose. Tyson did have trouble with Smith and Tucker for example who gave him little room. Tyson is made for Jefferies and Jefferies would give Tyson little room but would unload on him and Tyson would not last more than 3 rounds had they both fougbt in there primes.
Mike Tyson was underrated. He was not simply power on its own (like Foreman). He could combine that power with speed and accuracy. His footwork and head movement was superb, he could cut off the ring very well, and could dodge his opponent reasonably well.
You must remember that Tysons mental and emotional problems affected him in the ring. That is why he underperformed against Douglas. He had been drinking and whoring in Tokyo prior to the fight, was going through a divorce also.
@1899sharkey are u kidding me?its common sense that athletes evolve over time.jeffries was busted up badly by fitzsimmons there first fight.what o u thing a bigger stronger faster tyson would have done.jeffries was great for his time but would be no match for modern heavys.
@LordTariq83 - Boxing has devolved not evolved. There were more fighters in n.y. city in 1950 than in the whole world today. Things dont evolve when no one does it anymore. Jeffries was bigger, stronger,had 10 times the heart and endurance that the coward had. The modern heavys are a joke and a bad one at that. Tyson would probably quit within 3 rounds knowing he had an ass whippin coming just like he did against Holyfield. Get a new hero!
@1899sharkey lmao i cant even stand tyson but im being a realist.boxers of today are much more advanced than those of yesteryear.imo jeffries was a very big very hard puncher but thats all.i can name at least 10 heavyweights of all eras who woulda beaten him.this is a guy who ducked the top heavyweights of his day when he was champ and u wanna call him an all time great?time for u to get a new hero.the only hevyweight of that era who couldve fought in modern times was jack johnson
@LordTariq83 -Take a look at film of Tunney and Louis and tell me that todays boxers are more "advanced". Trainers and writers and managers and fighters who saw Jeffries in his prime all the way thru louis rated him at least their equal. You need to cath up, everyone knows that this crop of heavys we have today is by far the worst in history. You're like a parrot just repeating what you've heard. J.J thought Jeff would beat Louis and Dempsey.
@LordTariq83 Johnson would beat anyone today. Do you think Johnson defended his title against the best fighters from 1908 to 1915 ??? When Johnson lost the titel, did he fight the bst fighters possible after he was released from jail ???
@LordTariq83 - p.s.- I'll bet you dont think Einstein was very smart or the Wright bros. and henry Ford were just good inventors for "THEIR TIME". The very hard and difficult times they lived in is what formed these great fighters.
@LordTariq83 You know Holyfield started out as a light-heavyweight. You know Jones Jr. past his prime won a title and was one or two of the best heavyweighst in the world at the time. You know Toney who was about 15 years past his prime as a middelweight was one of the three best heayweights in the world. Fitzsimmons at 168 pounds and up would have beaten Greb who was the greatest middleweight ever, would have beaten Conn who gave Louis fits, beaten Moore, Charles, Michael Spinks etc.
@LordTariq83 Jeffries who was not in his prime beat the smaller man in a big ring. If Ali fought Carlos Monzón, it would be by decisision. If Holmes fought Hagler, it would be by decision and a tough fight. Holyfield who beat Lewis and Tyson (2x) lost to a 15 year past his prime middleweight in Toney. What is your point ??? Louis barely beat Conn (although he won easier the second time as Jeffries did), but Jeffries still won.
@LordTariq83 Hi there, Tyson would not last 3 rounds with Jeffries. In regards to skill-wise, do you mean working hard, great heart, training properly, having a granite chin and having a will to win ??? As Jeffries was much better than Tyson on this qualities. Tyson was faster, had better knock-out power in both hands and hit slightly harder than Jeffries, but Tyson could not take Jeffries punches and did not have the chin and heart to last beyound 3 rounds.
@dorsi68 you sir are an idiot.. Tyson might be the best heavyweight in history in his prime.. dont forget he won an olympic gold medal as well.. at 18...
@msuperboy -You're calling someone an idiot? The coward didn't even make the olympic team. He was soundly thrashed by the great Henry Tillman. You need to change your username to msuperstupidboy.
@msuperboy Hi there. You lose any sense of credibility by calling me an idiot which is a sad personal attack. First off, Tyson never went to the Olympics let alone win a gold medal. Secondly, how is Tyson "possibly" the best heavyweight in his prime. If you know anything about boxing, please do some research on Eddie Futch's comments on Tyson prior to losing to Douglas. Tyson had greta knockout power on both hands, was very fast, but like all bully's, he lose his focus when he fought
@msuperboy a fighter who did not fear him. Tucker and Smith lasted the distance with Tyson and they were both past there primes and decent heavyweights at best. Foreman would have KO'd Tyson in 2 to 4 rounds as well based on styles. In regards to Jeffries, Tyson would be rocked hard as he would go right at Jeffries and would be frustrated as he would be fighting someone who would not hear him, was bigger and stronger and would lose his focus and lose the fight by KO early in the fight.
@dorsi68 oh wow a junior gold medal.. yea I am way off base.. listen clown you are making comparisons based on your imagination.. you just outlined a fight for me that could/never did happen and are CERTAIN that you are correct.. and I am the idiot? Jeffries lost to Jack Johnson.. the only loss in jeffries career.. he admitted he couldnt have beat him at his best..
P.S tyson won the junior golds twice.. with every win by KO
@msuperboy Hi again, your back pettling which is not surprising. Lets say Tyson never won an Olympic Gold medal as that is a fact. Jeffries lost to Johnson when he had to lose over 80 pounds and was 20% of himself. Its true Jeffries made that comment. But hear are two facts you probably do not know. Jeffries later on stated he was wrong to come back and would have beaten Johnson. Point #2 ... Johnson ranked Jeffries consistently after 1916 and onward as the greatest heavyweight ever.
@msuperboy What is your opinion on that ??? In a 20 to 25 round fight, Jeffries would have beaten Johnson. If the fight was 6 to 10 rounds and both were in there primes, its possible Johnson may decision Jeffries, but 15 rounds and up, Jeffries was the greatest fighter ever as a heavyweight.
@msuperboy What is your point on being the youngest heavyweight ever ... was Floyd Paterson the 2nd or 3rd greatest heavyweight ever based on your logic ??? Tyson was always a bully and his handlers turned a blind eye on Tyson. Why do you not read Teddy Atlas who was a much better trainer than Rooney had to say about why he left Tyson's camp. Google it and learn something. If you know who Eddie Futch is, he was most likley the greatest trainer ever and he turned to work with Tyson
@msuperboy He also had interesting comments to say about Tyson character and ability as a fighter. fact is that Tyson was a bully and never had a good mentor ... that is why Atlas left. There are good mentors and not good mentors. Too bad you can not see what Tyson was ... a bully who would fold against a good and confident fighter. Tyson is not a top 20 heavyweight in the history of heavyweights. He was obviously a very good fighter, but not a great fighter.
@msuperboy Message me when you have some actual concrete facts that support your claim as thus far, you have very little and have backtracked on several occasions. Calling me an idiot and a clown shows your maturity level.
@dorsi68 I NEED REAL EVIDENCE???? you have exactly 0 facts to support what you have said.. in fact your whole argument is based off of your imagination.. the fact that I call you idiot and clown have to do with the fact that you are and idiot and a clown.. I dont care if you say " this makes you lose credibility" as I am arguing with a guy who thinks his imagination is a credible source to cite in an argument
@msuperboy Unless you can provide some facts on what you are saying and at the same time, point out what I am using my imagination on, I can not debate with someone who is immature and has anger issues. The facts I have clearly stated was Tyson never won an Olympic Gold Medal let aone made the Olympics. Fact #2, Tyson was a bully and a train wreck even before he was champion which is validated by Futch and Atlas. Fact #3, Johnson did rank Jeffries as the greatest heavyweight ever.
@msuperboy Fact #4, Jeffries did recant his statement that Johnson was better later on. Fact #5, just because Tyson was the youngest fighter to win a heavyweight belt does not make him the best heavyweight ever (your logic). Fact #6, Jeffries was bigger, had more heart, more endurance and stronger than Tyson. So unless you can state facts and constructive feedback as opposed to insults and anger managment issues, I can not debate with you.
Lewis, Klitschko and Tyson = super fighters at their best. So were Jeffries, Johnson, Dempsey, Louis, Marciano, etc. (Also, Fitz and Corbett in a larger ring.)
Although a good fighter, if you look at his record closely who
did he fight? Fitzsimmons, 170 lbs and 37 years old. Jim Corbett, far past his prime though he gave Jeffries the fight of his life the first time. Peter Jackson, already diagnosed with TB. Joe Choynski, and old middle weight. The only fighter Jeffries fought in his prime was Tom Sharkey who
lasted a total of 55 rounds with Jeffries in two fights. Many
Was this made for kids?
MrRoyalFatness 1 month ago
Tyson beat Foreman ? The tin man would never make it out of the dressing room. A 42 year old Foreman would destroy the coward in two. Foreman at 25 against a "prime" tin man ? Tyson would shit his pants on the way to the rind. Tyson beat Jeffries? Maybe Jack Jeffries. There is only a handful of true heavyweight champs that the rapist could vave defeated. The most overated fighter in history. A compete fraud, cowardly chicken.
1899sharkey 5 months ago
illmatic826 5 months ago
@illmatic826 - All the fighters you named would not make adequate sparring partners for Jeffries. Like i said bongo lips, only ignorant tTyson nuthuggers are ignorant enough to call the subhuman great. Jeffries wouldn't waste his time with the rapist, he would let Corbett take care of his light work. I've seen 10 different white boys school your inferior ass on here, WHEN WILL YOU LEARN YOU'RE NOT CAPABLE OF HANGING WITH THE BIG BOYS!! Ha,Ha, Ha, Ha, Ha.
1899sharkey 5 months ago
@1899sharkey name ten pecker necks that schooled me??? like I said paper lips you cant hold me LIL BOY you just a sad confused low grade trash ass white boy, & its been plenty blacks,whites, & hispanics thats schooled your stupid low grade saltine ass on here, WHEN WILL YOU LEARN YOU'RE NOT CAPABLE OF HANGING WITH THE BIG BOYS!! Ha,Ha, Ha, Ha, Ha. Just stop it you just clowning yourself with that bum jeffries shit even you believe that jeffries cant beat Tyson, jeffries is just too weak & slow.
illmatic826 5 months ago
@1899sharkey LIL BOY you just getting OWNED XD there is no way you can beat me in this argument even PREZ150 thinks that bum jeffries is shit you just delusional sonny boy, the only thing that would of happened if Tyson would of fought bum jeffries is the parametics scraping that bitch jeffries up off the canvas LOL OWNED AGAIN XD just go to boxing sites and hold a vote between Iron Mike & bum jeffries & if jeffries gets more votes then I will give his sorry ass props but Mike will win anyway :)
illmatic826 5 months ago
@1899sharkey so you think that the great Larry Holmes wouldn't make a good sparring partner for jeffries when he sparred with Ali??? you more stupid than I thought if you put bum jeffries over Holmes & Ali & even Michael Spinks. I dont even know why im even wasting my time with your low grade ass, you just too pathetic for words, im really getting tired of verbally kicking your saltine ass just go somewhere & lay down.
illmatic826 5 months ago
@1899sharkey & my last question to you is what makes jeffries so special over any other fighter???
illmatic826 5 months ago
@illmatic826 - 1st, you wont find any comment i've ever made on utube that Jeff is the best heavy ever. What makes Jeff great is a multitude of factors that i have no intention of laying out for someone who has no respect for Jim. 100 years after his career ended he was named 7th best heavy ever by the IBRO. Jack Johnson said in a ring interview in later years that he thought Jeff would beat Louis. Farewell my friend, stay the hell on your heros vids.
1899sharkey 5 months ago
@1899sharkey no no no no no this argument aint over til I say the shit is over you have a personal grudge against blacks & Tyson & I wanna know why you call Tyson a rapist when it wasn't even proved he even raped that lying bitch & second of all ms washington pulled that stunt a couple of times before Tyson, you dont have to give a fuck about blacks or Tyson but you will respect it believe that buddy boy, saying Tyson isnt great is just stupid, the most feared champion EVER, Hall-Of-Famer
illmatic826 5 months ago
@1899sharkey as much as you may hate to say it you gotta admit the Heavyweight division has been shit since Tyson hung up the gloves, the division isnt as exciting its not a fighter out there that lets everyone in the whole fuckin division know that he is the best & there is no stopping of denying him, I just dont see that fire in the division anymore I dont see a dominant fighter in this era of boxing & thats the only thing in LIFE I can agree with you on. Now im done with this discussion.
illmatic826 5 months ago
@1899sharkey look here the way you feel about jim jeffries is the way I feel about Tyson, you say that "a multitude of factors make him great" ok cool but you talk like Tyson was glass joe. The things that made Tyson great was not only his physical ability & all the tools he had, but it was his ring savy his smartness of figuring out his opponents. When he was in jr olympics Cus knew he was gonna fight guys with long reach so he groomed him to deal with it, He was a student of the game
illmatic826 5 months ago
@1899sharkey & it wasnt just in the ring that made Mike great to people but it was things outside of the ring that made him a true champ we all know about all the run ins with the law & that fake rape case, but this man was sentenced to prison came out & won the title again yeah he had his losses just like any other fighter, but at the end of the day Tyson was one of the most exciting,explosive,dynamic champions that ever lived, so yeah Tyson is one of my heroes & im not one of those dummies.
illmatic826 5 months ago
@1899sharkey even though its wrong Tyson said that boxing was just like robbing a person even though they know its coming you gotta change up so they dont suspect it and then BOOM you got em.
illmatic826 5 months ago
@illmatic826 Do you think Tyson,in his prime,could have beat Ali?
metalrod23 1 month ago
@metalrod23 yep but Ali would of made him work for it
illmatic826 1 month ago
Jeffries is easily one of the greatest of all times. Just because their is little footage of him does not detract from his greatness, he was champ over 100 years ago naturally there is going to be little video. So we must rely on expert opinion Nat Fleischer founder of ring magazine who saw all the greats, rated Jeffries as the best heavyweight ever. He is highly rated by all boxing historians, despite the fact it has been a 100 years. Tyson won't even be rated in 50 years time, get real people
XavierMarciano 5 months ago
Curious as to why no photos other than a handshake exist of the Jeffries vs Fitzsimmons fights. There are action shots of John L Sullivan almost 15 years earlier for christ shake. You would think at least some action pictures were taken of either of their fights.
andrewr62 6 months ago
I'll give you a new 'Boxing Warrior' to idolize, who is right now in his prime. The best pound for pound boxer in the World: ****Manny Pacquiao****. Check out the "Best of Manny Pacquiao" YouTube video.
You're welcome!
PoutinePete 6 months ago
There is one thing that is better and its enough to fool most people... the cameras. Nothing else.
1899sharkey 6 months ago
The argument in regards would Jeffries be able to defeat boxers of today is a tad null & void - the conditioning is far better today, &c. But for his time, in his prime, he beat the best - Two former world champions included. Sadly for ol' JJ, he will always be remembered for his last fight, that beating he received from Johnson, & for being a racist. A product of his time perhaps. The one quality I have always admired about Jeffries was his durability - he could take a beating & come back.
sugarraykirk 6 months ago
@sugarraykirk -Thanx for clearing that up. I was wondering why guys like Jeffries could go 25 rounds and these bums today cant go ten. Its cause todays conditioning is far better.lmao. There is only one small thing wrong with your theory....its completely ass backwards. Don't reply with the typical... everything is better today.
1899sharkey 6 months ago
@1899sharkey I kind of see what you are getting at about the conditioning, but what you have failed to keep in mind is the legal limit of boxing matches today. Yes, the pioneers of the sport would fight till they drop. In our world of today we can’t have that, unless the fight takes place in a disused car lot or something. Boxers/trainers work to those rounds, be they 10 or 12. Training methods of today (i.e. conditioning) are far superior.
sugarraykirk 6 months ago
@sugarraykirk - Wrong again. Jeffries fought under M of Q rules, 3-min. rounds, 1minute rest period. Same rules as today except the the number of rounds. What training methods of today are superior to the oldtimers methods?Do they run more miles? Spar more rounds? Even critics of the old timers admit that their conditioning was far superior to todays bums. Boxing has DEVOLVED not EVOLVED.Better conditiond today? What a joke. Absolutely nothing better about boxing today
1899sharkey 6 months ago
@1899sharkey Here's one for you. If you took the Jeffries of yesteryear into the present, trained him with today's methods, today's techniques, who do you think would be the better fighter? The old Jeffries, or the new?
sugarraykirk 6 months ago
@sugarraykirk - Without a doubt, the old one. Todays methods? It's clear to see where todays methods have got boxing. Which of todays methods or techniques impresses you so much?
1899sharkey 6 months ago
I go to these vids just to get a good laugh, ok first off jeffries was and will always be a bum, how could anybody even fix they mouth to say that bummy jeffries could even touch Tyson & Ali better yet beat em, Im ending the whold convo with this, when a group of guys are having a conversaion about who was the best boxer ever only a few names are gonna come up & thats Tyson, Ali, Frazier, foreman & Robinson, nobody is gonna say jim jeffries, ok jim jeffries was & is a nobody FACE IT.
illmatic826 6 months ago
@illmatic826 - Spoken like a true ignoramus - with a group of jocks - wannabees - who know little of boxing history. In your terms, a bunch of dummies !
jhs1958 6 months ago
@jhs1958 NO you dont know shit about boxing if you think that punk ass jeffries could even touch Tyson, Ali, Frazier, Foreman, oh let me guess you white arent ya??? nah dont be suprised my fathers black & my mothers italian but im BLACK dont get it twisted, BUT anyway jeffries would of been a tooth pic for Tyson, Ali, Frazier, & Foreman
illmatic826 6 months ago
@illmatic826 - Now you are lying, actually implying that you know who your daddy is! Btw, you like following white guys around on you tube, don't ya? I think you're a little on the fem side, aren't ya? No wonder you love The tin man so much. Dreaming of sharing a cell with the tin man, aren't ya?
1899sharkey 6 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@1899sharkey Now you are lying, actually implying that you know who your daddy is! guess your father is your uncle to huh??? hahahahaha Btw, your slutty mother like following black guys around on the street corners, don't she? I think you're a little on the fem side, aren't ya? No wonder you love Bummy Jeffries so much. Dreaming of sharing a cell with the bummy man, aren't ya?
illmatic826 6 months ago
@illmatic826 Ali could beat Jeffries on a given night, maybe he could. But tyson would be killed by Jeffries!! How can you call Jeffries a tooth pick, the man was 6'3" and 225lbs, all muscle. Jeffries would knock tyson around like a rag doll. Foreman would destroy tyson in one round too, here is a little fact for you mike tyson never rose to beat the count in his entire career, FACT. He has no heart!! Frazier rose six times against foreman, tyson wouldn't get up once. Tyson is the real bum!!
XavierMarciano 5 months ago
@XavierMarciano Tyson beat guys waaay bigger than that bum jeffries & Tyson also has more power than jeffries ever will, If Ali could knock out foreman & frazier with less power than Tyson then just imagine what Iron Mike would do to em, you guys kill me with that shit, how could you even call Tyson a bum the man was & is a All-Time Great Hall-Of-Fame boxer who was the youngest to EVER win the Title & was virtually unbeatable in his prime, The only thing that beat Tyson was Tyson. FACT!
illmatic826 5 months ago
@illmatic826 Tyson would be mauled by foreman, foreman has an 82 inch reach, mike has a 71 inch reach, get real boy!! Mike would never get inside, he would be nailed by foreman. Mike has good headmovement but can't dodge 100% of punches, the second he gets nailed he goes down and stays down, hasn't got the heart to get back up. Mike wouldn't last as long as frazier did, frazier had the heart to rise six times, mike never got up once in his entire career. Tyson beat nothing but washed up tin cans
XavierMarciano 5 months ago
@XavierMarciano man reach dont mean nothing you been playing too much fight night Tyson fought people that had longer reach than him all the time, & a prime tyson was trained & taught to slip jabs from long reach fighters, & you say Tyson would get nailed by a slow stationary target like foreman BUT what would happen if foreman get nailed by the hardest punch in boxing history A Tyson Uppercut, first of all Tyson would be too active for foreman to set his feet & hit, & Tyson would just kill him.
illmatic826 5 months ago
@illmatic826 I don't play fight night, I'm almost fifty. Reach is a big deal, it's a great advantage in boxing. As I said tyson can't slip 100% of punches, second he gets nailed by foreman it's goodbye tyson. Mike tyson can't hit as hard as foreman. Mike had to put his punches in combinations quite often to put a man down. Foreman has real one punch knockout power. Boxing historians rate foreman and shavers as the hardest punchers ever, not tyson. Oh and tyson was chicken to fight 40+ foreman.
XavierMarciano 5 months ago
@XavierMarciano that shows how much your dumbass Tyson didn't fight foreman because he was scared but because of WHY??? it was no titles to win & nothing to prove by beating up on a old ass foreman
illmatic826 5 months ago
@illmatic826 -Well i see Xaviermarciano is the latest in a long list to school your racist ,ignorant ass. Go converse with other Tyson buttfuckers who like you yearn for a whiff of the cowards rectum. You're not only exceedingly stupid, apparently you're blind as well. Tyson must have loved the canvas because he sure the hell spent a lot of time lying on it! Mike da best man... cause buckwheat illmatic826 says so...
1899sharkey 5 months ago
@1899sharkey OH another pedophile white boy that knows shit about boxing how could your goofy ass even say that Tyson spent alot of time on the canvas when he only lost six fights out of 58, its clear that you just dont like Tyson why because Iron Mike may have beat one of your uncles asses in the ring before huh??? & how am I being schooled little boy because yo stupid ass said that Tyson was "1 dimensional" LOL thats funny bum jeffries was NO dimensional with his sorry ass. bye jeffrey dahmer.
illmatic826 5 months ago
@1899sharkey like I said before ask ANYBODY who would win between Iron Mike Tyson & bum jeffries I guarantee 100% will say Iron Mike would mop bum jeffries ass, & now that I think about it nobody even know who bum jeffries is I dont even see why you even bother finding the sorry mother fucker. Because we ALL know that Tyson would K.O. bummy man without making a sweat just like he did 44 other victims. You just a hater plain & simple cause no matter what you say Tyson is a Hall-Of-Famer so STFU.
illmatic826 5 months ago
@illmatic826 The mere fact you came to my page to call me fagboy, just shows what an idiotic little man you really are. As for my top 10 I won't be putting tyson on it, let alone number 1. All ten men on my list would spank tyson all over a ring and all ten would knock him out. Lets see tyson isn't on bert sugars top 10, or ray arcels, or on any boxing historians top ten. Any intelligent man doen't rate tyson in the top ten, only redneck hicks like you could consider him number one.
XavierMarciano 5 months ago
@illmatic826 - nobody, well, not black anyway, right ? Since, yo is not biased.
jhs1958 6 months ago
Respond to this video... Ali ? Anybody Spinks could beat is NOT great. Put that in yo smoke and pipe it.
jhs1958 6 months ago
@jhs1958 You mean put that in your pipe and smoke it.........stupid ass hahahahahaha what a loser OWNED XD
illmatic826 6 months ago
@illmatic826 - I meant what I wrote. Can't you read? I'm the ass, you're the hole.
jhs1958 6 months ago
@jhs1958 ok whatever you say "ASS" hahahaha dude just stop it OWNED XD!!!!
illmatic826 6 months ago
@illmatic826 -Is it true your mammy is only 10 years older than you? Clevelefs said you thought she was your sista until she told you the truth while you were rear ending her. Is he right? You need help, nigga(and i say that affectionately) Have you considered turning yourself in?
1899sharkey 5 months ago
How in the hell would Tyson beat Jeffries? Knock him out? Thats laughable. Decision him over a tough 15 rounder? Even funnier. Tyson's not a top tenner, Jeff would be just getting warmed up when Tyson started looking for the soft spot on the canvas.
1899sharkey 6 months ago
@1899sharkey Tyson is arguably the greatest of all-time & he would bulldoze through jeffries bum ass, when you have a boxing conversation with boxing fans about who was the greatest I guarantee you that jeffries name would not come up you would hear Tyson, Ali, Foreman, Frazier Because those fighters where head & shoulders above anyone else & they would all beat the hell out that bummy ass jeffries.
illmatic826 6 months ago
@illmatic826 - You're boring me with your unrivaled ignorance.
1899sharkey 6 months ago
@1899sharkey you so stupid you really think that this bummy ass fighter is better that Ali, Tyson, Frazier, & Foreman??? man you just another dumb ass white boy with his head up his ass
illmatic826 6 months ago
@1899sharkey give me an educated reason why that no named bum jeffries is better than all these greats.
illmatic826 6 months ago
The best heavyweight ever? There are about 12 guys off the top of my head that would beat Jeffries primevprime
MrBumboclart 7 months ago
@MrBumboclart - 12? I don't think so ! There are only 3-4 and Jeffries could beat them too on any given night.
jhs1958 6 months ago
@jhs1958 How can you be so sure when there is little footage of him? The likes of Foreman, Liston, Ali, Tyson e.c.t. even Lennox Lewis would have beaten him.
MrBumboclart 6 months ago
@jhs1958 Jeffries was a bum, Ali would whip his ass all around the ring
illmatic826 6 months ago
The mere notion of tyson being able to beat jeffries is laughable. Jeffries would destroy tyson. Jim could take a punch far better than tyson, jim had huge heart, and jim had arguably the greatest stamina in heavyweight history. I can't predict the round but I'm certain jeffries would beat tyson by knockout. Jeffries is highly underated by the public, but still regarded highly by boxing historians. I'm sure the historians won't rate tyson in a hundred years time as highly as they have Jeffries.
XavierMarciano 7 months ago
@XavierMarciano - " the mere notion of Tyson being able to beat Jeffries is laughable" I love that line and agree 100%
1899sharkey 6 months ago
@1899sharkey "the mere notion of jeffries being able to beat Tyson is laughable" I love that line and agree 100%
illmatic826 6 months ago
It's difficult to compare an old time fighter like Jeffries to a Tyson or Ali, simply because the fights were longer in the old days. So, if the Jeffries v Ali fight was held over 15 rounds, then Ali would probably win a wide decision (I doubt Ali could stop a man like Jeffries). However, if the fight was set for say 30 Rounds, I think Ali would burn himself out and Jeffries would start to grind him down - Ali would be stopped before round 25.
SHEBAMENDES 7 months ago
how is it a fact that jeffries had more heart, strength and endurance? this is why your an idiot, you would have me believe that a fighter who fought almost one hundred years before mike tyson was stronger... and had more endurance.. yea ok buddy do you not see how that is flawed? people are way bigger now than they were 100 years ago.. our training is better diets are better and knowledge of kinesiology is better. thats like you telling me babe ruth would hit 60 home runs in todays MLB...
msuperboy 10 months ago
@msuperboy - So... The guy that informed us that Tyson won the Olymic gold medal is now gonna tell us that Tyson was bigger ,stronger and had more endurance than Jeffries. Babe Ruth would have hit 90 home runs off of this watered down minor league pitching. The junior olympics are an american tournament for 10-15 year olds.You're out of your league novice, back to your video games.
1899sharkey 10 months ago
@1899sharkey You are so very RIGHT. Have to keep in mind that the boxers back then fought in a ring for more then 10 or 12 rounds like they do today. Jeffries Johnson or Jack Dempsey would have gutted most modern fighters. Also the fighters back then have to barrow a line from "Rocky III" "Had the eye of the Tiger!" So let face it Old School can kick the new kids on the blocks asses!
jimymax58 10 months ago
i wouldnt even put jeffries as an alltime great.he ducked quite a few great fighters and used race as an excuse.sounds like a coward to me
LordTariq83 1 year ago
@LordTariq83 Who did Jeffries duck ??? He fought the best of his time and he continually improved. You are biased and do not know the heavyweight history from 1895 to 1905.
dorsi68 1 year ago
@dorsi68 I'll tell you who Jeffries ducked, he ducked Jack Johnson in 1904-05. Instead of fighting him while in his prime he basically gave his belt to one of the two guys he felt deserved it and retired for five years. Johnson had beat the brakes off Jeffries brother in a match at some point and Jim didn't want anything to do with him. Granted I'm sure politics played a big part in his decision not to fight Johnson also.
mvpsmb1 1 year ago
@mvpsmb1 Hi there, why do you think he ducked Jack Johnson in 1904 to 1905 ??? Do you think Johnson was a legitimate top 5 fighter at that moment ??? You know he was knocked out recently and lost some fights. If Johnson was a legitimate top 5 fighter in the beginning of 1905, maybe they would have fought, but probably not. But Johnson was not a top contender. Why do you think he was at that moment ???? Also, Jeffries brother is not a vliad point to fight for the title.
dorsi68 1 year ago
@dorsi68 I do believe that Johnson was undoubtedly a legitimate top 5 contender in early 1905. He had been the World Colored Heavyweight Champion since 1903! He had only lost to Hart and that was by decision, not by KO and had already been trying for years to get Jefferies to fight by that point. I mentioned the brother fight because Jim was in his corner and its widely believed that seeing Johnson's skills first hand gave him all the more reason to draw the color line and not fight Jack.
mvpsmb1 1 year ago
@mvpsmb1 If your objective, Jeffries was not afraid of Johnson. To say that would be foolish. If you look at Johnson's defenses as champion, he did not fight the best white fighters and avoided 4 of the top 5 contenders while champion (who were black) ... do you believe Johnson drew the colour line ??? Now its true that Johnson was KO'd by Choynski and lost to Griffin in 1901, but by losing to Hart and having a tough time beating Munroe (who Jeffries easily beat recently), Johnson
dorsi68 1 year ago
@mvpsmb1 did not deserve a title shot until mid to late 1906 to 1907 at best. Johnson was also DQ agaianst Jeanette. I rank Johnson as the 3rd greatest heavyweight behind Jeffries and Louis, but at 1904 to 1905 (even though Jeffries did not fight that year), you can not possibly say that Jeffries would lose to Johnson based on the above. Johnson started hitting his prime in 1906 (to about 1912/3) and he would have been KO'd in the 111th to 16th round
dorsi68 1 year ago
@mvpsmb1 depending when he fought Jeffries in 1904 to 1905. The fighter I feel worst for is Langford who is the greatest p4p fighter ever. Your argument has holes and is weak that he deserved a title shot with Jeffries in 1904 to early to mid-1905 with Jeffries, but Langford was clearly the best contender from 1908 to 1914 for Johnson, but he did nit fight him. Do you think Johnson was afarid of Langford ??? Of couse he was not, but there are reasons why he did not fight Langford.
dorsi68 1 year ago
Why are you so obsessed with a fighter from 100 years ago? Let's face it, he doesn't look like any special fighter from these old film clips. Now Jack Johnson was a great boxer!
PoutinePete 1 year ago
@PoutinePete - Why are you so obsessed with a fighter from 100 years ago? Let's face it, he doesn't look like any special fighter from these old film clips. Now JIM JEFFRIES was a great boxer!
jhs1958 1 year ago
@jhs1958 EXACTLY! So how can u tell Jim was a great fighter. as u say: can't tell a book....
PoutinePete 1 year ago
@PoutinePete - I appreciate greatness in boxers, whether they are oldtimers or moderns. Trouble is, there are so few great ones today. Something else, you can't judge a book by the cover - and you can't tell a great fighter just by looking.
jhs1958 1 year ago
@jhs1958 - Don't know if I'd call Jack Johnson a fighter or a runner - but he was good.
jhs1958 1 year ago
@jhs1958 a runner... please dude.. thats retarded
msuperboy 11 months ago
@jhs1958 a runner... please dude.. thats retarded Jim Jeffries admits he could never have beaten Jack Johnson even when he was in his prime
msuperboy 11 months ago
@PoutinePete - Because he was THE GREATEST !
jhs1958 6 months ago
@PoutinePete - Why do you call Johnson a great fighter? Who did he beat?
jhs1958 6 months ago
@jhs1958 er.....he beat Jim Jeffries. In fact Jim later said that even in his prime he would'nt have been able to beat Johnson. Check your history books.
PoutinePete 6 months ago
@PoutinePete - Well, let's see now. (1) YOU GUYS say Jeffries was nothing. So, according to your logic, Johnson did nothing special by beating Jeffries. (2) YOU CHECK YOUR HISTORY BOOKS. Jeffries later said, it was Father time who beat him, not Johnson. And, Johnson later said, in his opinion, Jeffries was the greatest. CHECK YOUR HISTORY BOOKS !!!
jhs1958 6 months ago
@jhs1958 Johnson never said that! Why must you turn YouTube into a house of lies?
PoutinePete 6 months ago
@PoutinePete - Johnson did say he thought Jeffries was the greatest - it's in a Ring magazine article by Fleischer. There is also a newspaper article in which Johnson said the only time he felt fear in the ring was against Jim Jeffries. I DON'T BLAME HIM FOR THAT - facing the greatest heavyweight ever, I'd be scared too.
jhs1958 6 months ago
@jhs1958 ....I think you meant to say Lennox Lewis was the greatest ever.
PoutinePete 6 months ago
@PoutinePete What you don't see in any of the existing clips is his punching power. Unlike the great Johnson,
in his prime Jeffries did have one punch knockout power, especially with his left. He was never a stylist like Johnson and was considered clumsy even in his day. His greatness in his prime was his power, stamina,heart
and the ability to absorb punishment. All of this was lacking by 1910. Greatness comes in many forms.
andrewr62 6 months ago
I think too many people tend to write off Jeffries without learning about him because of his appearance. They see him and the years he fought in and automatically assume that he was just a ruthles bear with no defense or skill. THEY DON't KNOW HOW WRONG THEY ARE!
Rockyfan10060 1 year ago
@Rockyfan10060 - I think you are right. If they research a little bit, they will find some phenomenal shots of a magnificent physical specimen.
jhs1958 1 year ago
I heard a story about Jeffries that one day he went hunting with his team and that he brought down a male buck I dunno, a 16 pointer or so. Well, the story I heard was that Jeffries hoisted the big buck across his immenser shoulders and jogged with it for 9 miles w/o a break! Meanwhile his team of trainers ran outta gas LoL!
TheSpoiler001 1 year ago
@TheSpoiler001 - I heard the same story.
jhs1958 1 year ago
I wish they had some HD films of Jeffries fights Then all the doubters and haters could see just how great he was.
CassiusAli67 1 year ago
These guys are the GOLD standards by which the past & present should be judged. Not films or by people who didn't literally see them train & fight. BS stuff like on coxs corner is nothing to be used to sway opinions. Just look at the crap people post on these sites. Most have never even put on gloves, let alone taught/studied boxing. i personally think Dempsey is the best ever,but again only from what I"ve read & watched.
faltagh 1 year ago
i am very curious as to what kind of strength training these guys were doing. this was faaarrr before the popularization of weightlifting, so it makes a person wonder- were they encouraged to pull-ups and pushups? sprints too, i'd imagine. jeffries and johnson were both very well built.
rygutz1 2 years ago
Back in those days, manual labor was how things got done. Jeffries worked labor jobs growing up. The jobs he did built strength through dynamic tension which is far better than bulk conditioning - although he was put together. Weights were used some too. And, they wrestled in training - something today's fighters could profit from if they did it.
jhs1958 2 years ago
The older fighters did lots of things like pushups, pullups, chopping logs, carrying rocks, running - much more running - than today - plus WRESTLING.
jhs1958 2 years ago
how do you think jim jefferies would have lasted against rocky marciano, or jack dempsey?
submissivelover 2 years ago
submissivelover, I think Jeffries would beat Dempsey and Marciano. But, it wouldn't be easy.
jhs1958 2 years ago
Jeffries was a tremendous all-around athlete. He was bigger and stronger than either Dempsey or Marciano. He beat several men who fought like Jack and Rocky - Tom Sharkey (like Rock) and Bob Fitzsimmons (like Jack) - to name two.
His chin was probably never equaled in hevayweight history. Stamina also.
jhs1958 2 years ago
Turn of the Century boxing lore states that Corbett and Fitzsimmons had massive upper bodies comparable to today's heavies. Is this true? Not according to the tale of the tape. I compared Fitzsimmons upper body stats to current middle weight champion Kelly Pavlik. They are almost identical with a slight edge to Pavlik. The same can be said for Corbett who is slightly bigger with a smaller chest. They were fit but no any bigger than today's
middleweights. Way smaller than modern heavies.
andrewr62 2 years ago
Andrew, keep searching the old aricles. You'll find different measures. Corbett never was a large man - but lean and very lithe and quick. Fitz was a middleweight but got larger in the upper torso. While trainng with Jeffries later on, he weighed over 200 pounds. Others too - 180-200 lbs - had upper bodies like today's 220-230 pounders.
jhs1958 2 years ago
According to the NY Times Fitzsimmons weighed 172lbs the day of the 2nd Jeffries fight. Even at the end of his career he was under 170lbs. You seem to be selective of what you choose to believe from early sources. If you doubt measurements, tangible facts, why are you so willing to accept non tangible facts from turn of the century sources such as their opinions and judgments of punching power, speed and boxing skill?
andrewr62 2 years ago
Nice try, Andrew, but I saw a report on Fitz of his weight over 200 lbs. That's a tangible number. Jeffries was named the #1 all-time heavyweight in many polls, all the way up to the 1950s. Tell me, why do you reject that tangible fact?
jhs1958 2 years ago
I would like to know what report you are referring too. I doubt it's authenticity simply because even in his last two fights Fitzsimons was under 180 lbs. I don't
reject the fact that a few polls named Jeffries number #1, I just don't have the same opionion. Of course those who participated in such polls had yet to see
fighters such as Ail, Joe Frazier, Larry Holmes, Mike Tyson or other modern greats.
andrewr62 2 years ago
Andrew, I do not recall the source. I do know Fitz and Jeffries went on exhibition tours. Perhaps, it was on a tour that Fitz was heavier. But, as to measurements, Fitz began as a middlweight and was smaller. Over the years, he got heavier and bigger - chest, biceps, neck.
jhs1958 2 years ago
Andrew, as to measures, a number of men in the old days, 180-200 pounds, had biceps, neck, chest as big as today's heavyweights who weight 210-220 lbs. So, they really weren't so much smaller in areas where hitting came to play.
jhs1958 2 years ago
@jhs1958
If one is considering all era's and all rules, e.g. 45 round fights to the finish, both 5 and 10 oz gloves, bare knuckles, rules that allowed a lot of holding etc., then Jeffries could be argued into the top 5. However, when assessing boxing as a modern sport the standard should be a 20 foot ring, 8-10 oz gloves, modern rules and a 15 round standard that dominated most of the last 100 years.
LVSWTZ 2 years ago
@LVSWTZ - That's right. What does ALL-TIME mean ?
jhs1958 1 year ago
@jhs1958 Well uhhhhhhhhh lol. (I 've been off line for 6 months lol and don't even remember writing this lol) ALL-TIME to me means the greatest period the Best Beyond the REST And that means that he along with those of his era (tough men but with crude styles) in my opinion would be further down the all time list.
LVSWTZ 1 year ago
@LVSWTZ - All-Time also means London rules or Queensberry (wrestling tactics and/or only hitting), gloves or bare-fists, small ring or large, limited rounds or finish fight, etc. I pick Jeffries as the best in any type of fight. Suppose you were going to a fight and did not know what conditions would exist for the contest. Who would you bring as your fighter? I'd bring Jeffries.
jhs1958 1 year ago
@jhs1958 Very nice I see your point But if that's the case I'd bring Ike Ibeabucci who's prime physique and measurements (6'2 ,235lbs Vs Tua) and allround atheleticsm were par on with Jeffries and modern day style ( Think Holyfield but 30LBS BIGGER!) would be an edge. Ruggedness and Heart goes along way but technique and preperation go even further.
LVSWTZ 1 year ago
@LVSWTZ - I tend to agree with you on Ike. Some kind of specimen ! Liston, Foreman too.
jhs1958 1 year ago
@jhs1958 Yep they were all gifted i wish they around now
LVSWTZ 1 year ago
@LVSWTZ - Something to think about. I believe Jeffries was better than Ike.
jhs1958 1 year ago
@jhs1958 I appoligize for LMAO when I first read your comment. You maybe right but Ike wasn't a bleeder like Jeffries and Ike deafeated to polar opposite styled fighters in there prime. The Brute Force aggression of David Tua who may have been the Strongest and Powerful man HWT history and the award quick slick Chris byrd. Ike showed Brains Vs Byrd and Brawn Vs Tua. Ike was Holyfied and Tyson combined! Think about it
LVSWTZ 1 year ago
@LVSWTZ - Most of the true, top bruisers did NOT need style an technique to beat the others. They had strength, power, chin, etc. It was the others who needed style and technique in order to avoid them.
jhs1958 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@jhs1958 "Most of the true, top bruisers did NOT need style" that's why they got beat when it mattered the most Foreman Frazier and Jeffries.Teddy Atlas said you have two tough fighters but one them has the skill. He's the tougher fighter like Ward Vs Gatti Trilogy. Both were equal in heart courage & toughness but Gatti's superior boxing skill won the war for him. Boxing is a thinkings mans game it worked for Jack Johnson and Ali and that's why they beat them.
LVSWTZ 1 year ago
Yes, and the guys who see Ali, Frazier, Holmes, Tyson and other moderns, didn't see Jeffries except on film clips. But, boxing people of the past were no fools and they ALL testify to Jeffries' greatness.
jhs1958 2 years ago 2
@andrewr62 "Dumb" Dan Morgan, old-time manager/trainer who saw them all from Sullivan thru Marciano, said Jeffries was the best. He talked about them all. Praised some, some not. Regarded Johnson, Dempsey & Tunney all highly. Asked about Dempsey vs Louis constantly. Simply said Dempsey in a round !! Said Marciano was crudest ever. Ray Arcel saw Dempsey thru Holmes, at least, said Ali & Homes were good "boxers". Laughed when asked how Dempsey would do against today's fighters.
faltagh 1 year ago
Andrew, let me repeat some of my last message -- keep searching the old articles. You'll find different measures.
jhs1958 2 years ago
Andrew, like Abe Lincoln said - you don't make a short man tall by cutting off the legs of tall men.
jhs1958 2 years ago
Andrew, methinks you "generalize" like many fans of today - when you "put down" old fighters and athletes. Many of today's men are pansies compared to the toughies of past years.
jhs1958 2 years ago
Andrew, when you speak of Fitz fighting, you are talking about a rare exception - like Mozart in music (8-9-10 years old - writing symphonies). Fitz was slick and had exceptional, explosive hitting power plus an upper torso like 200 plus pound heavyweights.
jhs1958 2 years ago
Andrew, read some more articles about old Fitz versus other punchers of that day. Jeffries, Sullivan, Sharkey, etc., "pounded" their man down. Fitz "tapped" and they fell.
jhs1958 2 years ago
Andrew, Tyson was overrated.
jhs1958 2 years ago
Andrew, Corbett was slicker than any of the heavies in the ring today. He fought however it took to win - brainy - like not seen today. He wouldn't take body shots vs Tyson, etc.
jhs1958 2 years ago
It is certainly true that Sam Langford advertised he would fight any man in the world except James Jeffries. It should be noted at that time Langford was about 150lbs. Even Johnson never took much credit when he easily outclassed Langford in their one sided1905 match because of the huge size difference. It was not until 1910 and after that Langford began to put on more weight but at his best he was never more than 175lbs.
andrewr62 2 years ago
It was Langford's manager, not Langford himself who came up with that concept. Langford would have fought anyone and he would have lost to Jefferies than and even in his peak. Langford was probbaly the greatest p4p ever. Too bad he was never given a chance to fight for the linear championship.
dorsi68 2 years ago
Years ago in Ring I saw several photo's of the Langford v
Ketchel fight. It looked as though they had been taken from
a film. Maybe one day that film will pop up. Would love to see it. The fight was a 5 round promo, a tame affair to promote and stir interest in a finish bout. Ketchel statrted quickly and Langford finished strong according to most newspapers. Unfortunately Ketchel passed away.
andrewr62 2 years ago
Listen a prime Ali would beat Tyson - Tyson admitted that but that ain't what matters Tyson respected Ali nd the same back - they wern't going to say they could beat eachother - there is a video of them on a talk show u will see what i mean
boxinglad95 3 years ago
The prehistoric fighters look different, cannot say how they will fare against todays boxers. It was simply too long ago.
sonofthedestroyer 3 years ago
just think like this right - if these fighters were in todays time, todays fighters would be on the bottom of the list because these guys had great heart, and were better fighter.
their mentality was just so different.
makpak 2 years ago
Mohammed Ali praised Tyson: 'He is a real champ. He could have beaten me. Foreman was powerful but slow, Tyson was power and speed'
George Foreman also praised him:'If Tyson fought in my era he would have been the 2nd best after me' (he was implying that Tyson was better than Ali, Frazier, Holmes, Norton and the others of the 'golden era'
sonofthedestroyer 3 years ago
yeah but Foreman has no right to sayanything about Ali because Ali whoped him. And im not sure foreman said what u quoted.
ur a lying tyson fan.
Tyson did however have a great prime, and had he held it, he would of easiyly bean crowned all time #1 great heavyweight, but he didnt.
makpak 2 years ago
While fighters today and heavyweight boxing in general has declined in popularity the last 20 years many of the recent champions were /are in my opinion of good quality. Lennox Lewis was formidable as is Klitscho. Certainly there has been better in the past but there has been worse as well. Tyson at his peak I rank as one of the best though his peak did not last long. They would have done well in any
era.
andrewr62 3 years ago
I agree with your to an extent as i know Lewis and Klitscho would be good fighters in any era , but they would by no means be chamions in most years except at the weakest era. Lewis could hit harder at 240 lbs than say Louis , Dempsey or marciano at there respective weights even if they all added 15 to 20 pounds based on nutrition etc. Klitscho is an excellent boxer and technically very sound and very few fighters would match him atheltically based on his size and strength.
dorsi68 3 years ago
But they lack two important quailities ... chin and stanima. Whenever they get tagged they lose. Corrie Sanders is a decent fighter at best who has game but tagged the younger Klitcho and knocked him out. Lewis was KO'd twice by decent fighters as well. Had they fought Jefferies for example , jefferies was still alot stronger even back than and he would fight in close range and his power was close to Lewis and harder than Klitcho.
dorsi68 3 years ago
Jefferies was never knocked down in his prime by harder punchers than Sanders or McCall for example. Both fighters would not last 5 rounds with Jefferies. Both would be in the top 10 for most eras but fighters in general could take a punch and were conditioned to fight at close range and that would be tough for the fighters todat in adjusting to. Remember , james Toney who is 12 years or so past his prime is close to a top 10 heavyweight now so that says alot about boxing today.
dorsi68 3 years ago
Tyson was very overrated as his opponents feared him. I know Tyson had a great punch and if you backed away from Tyson or were scared you lost. Eddie Futch even called Tyson overrated before his lose. Tyson did have trouble with Smith and Tucker for example who gave him little room. Tyson is made for Jefferies and Jefferies would give Tyson little room but would unload on him and Tyson would not last more than 3 rounds had they both fougbt in there primes.
dorsi68 3 years ago 8
Mike Tyson was underrated. He was not simply power on its own (like Foreman). He could combine that power with speed and accuracy. His footwork and head movement was superb, he could cut off the ring very well, and could dodge his opponent reasonably well.
You must remember that Tysons mental and emotional problems affected him in the ring. That is why he underperformed against Douglas. He had been drinking and whoring in Tokyo prior to the fight, was going through a divorce also.
sonofthedestroyer 3 years ago
@dorsi68 -Agreed. Jeff would weather Tysons early barrages and go about his work like he was chopping down a tree.
1899sharkey 1 year ago
@dorsi68 lmfao.jeffries was not even in the same league as tyson skills wise.he was way to easy to hit and hit him tyson would.
LordTariq83 1 year ago
@LordTariq83 -The tin man would quit after about 6 rounds with Jeff. All time greats dont lose to cowards.
1899sharkey 1 year ago
@1899sharkey are u kidding me?its common sense that athletes evolve over time.jeffries was busted up badly by fitzsimmons there first fight.what o u thing a bigger stronger faster tyson would have done.jeffries was great for his time but would be no match for modern heavys.
LordTariq83 1 year ago
@LordTariq83 - Boxing has devolved not evolved. There were more fighters in n.y. city in 1950 than in the whole world today. Things dont evolve when no one does it anymore. Jeffries was bigger, stronger,had 10 times the heart and endurance that the coward had. The modern heavys are a joke and a bad one at that. Tyson would probably quit within 3 rounds knowing he had an ass whippin coming just like he did against Holyfield. Get a new hero!
1899sharkey 1 year ago
@1899sharkey lmao i cant even stand tyson but im being a realist.boxers of today are much more advanced than those of yesteryear.imo jeffries was a very big very hard puncher but thats all.i can name at least 10 heavyweights of all eras who woulda beaten him.this is a guy who ducked the top heavyweights of his day when he was champ and u wanna call him an all time great?time for u to get a new hero.the only hevyweight of that era who couldve fought in modern times was jack johnson
LordTariq83 1 year ago
@LordTariq83 -Take a look at film of Tunney and Louis and tell me that todays boxers are more "advanced". Trainers and writers and managers and fighters who saw Jeffries in his prime all the way thru louis rated him at least their equal. You need to cath up, everyone knows that this crop of heavys we have today is by far the worst in history. You're like a parrot just repeating what you've heard. J.J thought Jeff would beat Louis and Dempsey.
1899sharkey 1 year ago
@LordTariq83 Johnson would beat anyone today. Do you think Johnson defended his title against the best fighters from 1908 to 1915 ??? When Johnson lost the titel, did he fight the bst fighters possible after he was released from jail ???
dorsi68 1 year ago
@LordTariq83 - p.s.- I'll bet you dont think Einstein was very smart or the Wright bros. and henry Ford were just good inventors for "THEIR TIME". The very hard and difficult times they lived in is what formed these great fighters.
1899sharkey 1 year ago
Comment removed
dorsi68 1 year ago
@LordTariq83 You know Holyfield started out as a light-heavyweight. You know Jones Jr. past his prime won a title and was one or two of the best heavyweighst in the world at the time. You know Toney who was about 15 years past his prime as a middelweight was one of the three best heayweights in the world. Fitzsimmons at 168 pounds and up would have beaten Greb who was the greatest middleweight ever, would have beaten Conn who gave Louis fits, beaten Moore, Charles, Michael Spinks etc.
dorsi68 1 year ago
@LordTariq83 Jeffries who was not in his prime beat the smaller man in a big ring. If Ali fought Carlos Monzón, it would be by decisision. If Holmes fought Hagler, it would be by decision and a tough fight. Holyfield who beat Lewis and Tyson (2x) lost to a 15 year past his prime middleweight in Toney. What is your point ??? Louis barely beat Conn (although he won easier the second time as Jeffries did), but Jeffries still won.
dorsi68 1 year ago
@LordTariq83 Hi there, Tyson would not last 3 rounds with Jeffries. In regards to skill-wise, do you mean working hard, great heart, training properly, having a granite chin and having a will to win ??? As Jeffries was much better than Tyson on this qualities. Tyson was faster, had better knock-out power in both hands and hit slightly harder than Jeffries, but Tyson could not take Jeffries punches and did not have the chin and heart to last beyound 3 rounds.
dorsi68 1 year ago
@dorsi68 you sir are an idiot.. Tyson might be the best heavyweight in history in his prime.. dont forget he won an olympic gold medal as well.. at 18...
msuperboy 11 months ago
@msuperboy Tyson won the Junior Olympic Gold Medal, not the real Olympic Gold.
He was a damn good heavyweight in his prime.
bptaylor11 11 months ago
@msuperboy -You're calling someone an idiot? The coward didn't even make the olympic team. He was soundly thrashed by the great Henry Tillman. You need to change your username to msuperstupidboy.
1899sharkey 11 months ago
@msuperboy Hi there. You lose any sense of credibility by calling me an idiot which is a sad personal attack. First off, Tyson never went to the Olympics let alone win a gold medal. Secondly, how is Tyson "possibly" the best heavyweight in his prime. If you know anything about boxing, please do some research on Eddie Futch's comments on Tyson prior to losing to Douglas. Tyson had greta knockout power on both hands, was very fast, but like all bully's, he lose his focus when he fought
dorsi68 11 months ago
@msuperboy a fighter who did not fear him. Tucker and Smith lasted the distance with Tyson and they were both past there primes and decent heavyweights at best. Foreman would have KO'd Tyson in 2 to 4 rounds as well based on styles. In regards to Jeffries, Tyson would be rocked hard as he would go right at Jeffries and would be frustrated as he would be fighting someone who would not hear him, was bigger and stronger and would lose his focus and lose the fight by KO early in the fight.
dorsi68 11 months ago
@dorsi68 oh wow a junior gold medal.. yea I am way off base.. listen clown you are making comparisons based on your imagination.. you just outlined a fight for me that could/never did happen and are CERTAIN that you are correct.. and I am the idiot? Jeffries lost to Jack Johnson.. the only loss in jeffries career.. he admitted he couldnt have beat him at his best..
P.S tyson won the junior golds twice.. with every win by KO
msuperboy 11 months ago
@msuperboy Hi again, your back pettling which is not surprising. Lets say Tyson never won an Olympic Gold medal as that is a fact. Jeffries lost to Johnson when he had to lose over 80 pounds and was 20% of himself. Its true Jeffries made that comment. But hear are two facts you probably do not know. Jeffries later on stated he was wrong to come back and would have beaten Johnson. Point #2 ... Johnson ranked Jeffries consistently after 1916 and onward as the greatest heavyweight ever.
dorsi68 11 months ago
@msuperboy What is your opinion on that ??? In a 20 to 25 round fight, Jeffries would have beaten Johnson. If the fight was 6 to 10 rounds and both were in there primes, its possible Johnson may decision Jeffries, but 15 rounds and up, Jeffries was the greatest fighter ever as a heavyweight.
dorsi68 11 months ago
@dorsi68 he also knocket out a super heavyweight gold medallist and is the youngest heavyweight champion in history..
he also wasnt a bully fighter he changed directions when his mentor and trainer died..
msuperboy 11 months ago
@msuperboy What is your point on being the youngest heavyweight ever ... was Floyd Paterson the 2nd or 3rd greatest heavyweight ever based on your logic ??? Tyson was always a bully and his handlers turned a blind eye on Tyson. Why do you not read Teddy Atlas who was a much better trainer than Rooney had to say about why he left Tyson's camp. Google it and learn something. If you know who Eddie Futch is, he was most likley the greatest trainer ever and he turned to work with Tyson
dorsi68 11 months ago
@msuperboy He also had interesting comments to say about Tyson character and ability as a fighter. fact is that Tyson was a bully and never had a good mentor ... that is why Atlas left. There are good mentors and not good mentors. Too bad you can not see what Tyson was ... a bully who would fold against a good and confident fighter. Tyson is not a top 20 heavyweight in the history of heavyweights. He was obviously a very good fighter, but not a great fighter.
dorsi68 11 months ago
@msuperboy Message me when you have some actual concrete facts that support your claim as thus far, you have very little and have backtracked on several occasions. Calling me an idiot and a clown shows your maturity level.
dorsi68 11 months ago
@dorsi68 I NEED REAL EVIDENCE???? you have exactly 0 facts to support what you have said.. in fact your whole argument is based off of your imagination.. the fact that I call you idiot and clown have to do with the fact that you are and idiot and a clown.. I dont care if you say " this makes you lose credibility" as I am arguing with a guy who thinks his imagination is a credible source to cite in an argument
msuperboy 11 months ago
@msuperboy Unless you can provide some facts on what you are saying and at the same time, point out what I am using my imagination on, I can not debate with someone who is immature and has anger issues. The facts I have clearly stated was Tyson never won an Olympic Gold Medal let aone made the Olympics. Fact #2, Tyson was a bully and a train wreck even before he was champion which is validated by Futch and Atlas. Fact #3, Johnson did rank Jeffries as the greatest heavyweight ever.
dorsi68 11 months ago
@msuperboy Fact #4, Jeffries did recant his statement that Johnson was better later on. Fact #5, just because Tyson was the youngest fighter to win a heavyweight belt does not make him the best heavyweight ever (your logic). Fact #6, Jeffries was bigger, had more heart, more endurance and stronger than Tyson. So unless you can state facts and constructive feedback as opposed to insults and anger managment issues, I can not debate with you.
dorsi68 11 months ago
Lewis, Klitschko and Tyson = super fighters at their best. So were Jeffries, Johnson, Dempsey, Louis, Marciano, etc. (Also, Fitz and Corbett in a larger ring.)
jhs1958 3 years ago
Although a good fighter, if you look at his record closely who
did he fight? Fitzsimmons, 170 lbs and 37 years old. Jim Corbett, far past his prime though he gave Jeffries the fight of his life the first time. Peter Jackson, already diagnosed with TB. Joe Choynski, and old middle weight. The only fighter Jeffries fought in his prime was Tom Sharkey who
lasted a total of 55 rounds with Jeffries in two fights. Many
feel Sharkey won the first fight.
andrewr62 3 years ago