And although it took me a lot longer then I expected, I was kinda of settled in for the night and didn't make a time constraint for myself... time vs meaning - hmmm... if it sounds looney let me know haha!
Not looney at all. I was half kidding, but now that you mention it, I didn't consciously consider how much time I had, but I almost always feel rushed when I finally get a chance to "play". And I think it does effect our approach, and maybe even our ability to discern the most accurate meaning.
Bubonicate, also, aren't you the only one who had any idea what circadian meant? I thought we handled things very similarly, and yes, you were much more relaxed than I was. Not a negative trait for learning in my estimation. I was quite intimidated by the experiment and initially tried to keep my vids private. My lack of ability to navigate youtube led me to swallow my pride and post the bloody vids.
I can't rememebr now but I think maybe Joshbuckler might have as well - but I know i had seen it before so I think it made things easier for me to understand. From what you are telling me, I'm getting the notion that our (the reader's) present situtation may be a large factor in how we find meaning in text? You made a judgement call about your time before you even sat down to read it perhaps?
wow - you ripped through that! haha don't watch my video - I'm embarassed. As far as efficiency - I think it was amazing how quickly you got through this... I think part of it was a sort of disregard for things you didn't understand and continuing search for more text in the hopes of something to relate the things you didn't udnerstand. I am amazed at your instincts/skills.
Thank you for the compliment. I already watched your first two vids. Didn't realize there were others until later. I definitley do keep reading, and I have a sense of urgency you may or may not have. Four kids and a wife who don't share my interest in youtube! lol Time is at a premium.
The best scenario for understanding would be one where both parties to the attempted communication are aware of the others context, situation, background, shared experiences, language, etc.
You have also given me something else to consider. Am I trying to make connections with the author? I believe that should be my intention, as i have suggested before, that the person attempting to understand must take the author's context into consideration. I suggest this is actually more critical than considerting one's own context at the time of reading.
rU - I started to type here but ran too long. I may try to address this issue in my summary vid. Just a note: Many EXCELLENT readers have BOTH a sense of shared USE with the author and they ALSO branch (what we might consider 'branching') "away" from text during reading.
We find that they have no trouble managing this. For example, imagine yourself thinking about all the times you've had jet lag...and even thinking about your wife at that time, your job, your trip, that you had a great time, etc.) You still wouldn't INSERT those thoughts into a summary--if I'd asked you to summarize the text.
rU - Can you feel how words are 'dead' when we have no shared use of a word (or words) with the author? I also see you doing your best to find ANY shared uses you have with word(s) with that of the author. (Attempting to make ANY links/connections you can--in a coherent way--with the author.)Also, look how you want to look up words in the dictionary.I think what we're doing here is wanting to find 'definitions' that will provide SOME link to our own experiences.
Yes I see what you "mean". Because we have continued to discuss this subject, I now see how we each describe what occurs when we encounter a word for the "first" time. I say "no such address exists in my brain, and hence no file to pull at such address. You say the word is dead. I think we should consider and compare our metaphors.
Instead of thinking 'files,' you might want to try out the word 'use(s).' I like the word 'use' (Wittgenstein's term, btw) because it is less likely to infer 'fixed meanings' or static definitions. Furthermore,with the word 'use,'we can better see that what we would normally define as 'meaning derived by context surrounding a word in text' - is actually the reader's perceived shared USE(s)--between reader & author.
Note: If what we would normally define as 'context surrounding an unknown word' had NO perceived, shared USE by the reader...even 'the context' would be dead. Hence, what I am trying to say is there is no intrinsic meaning...only perceived shared uses. Furthermore, there is no fixed use (i.e., intrinsic use/fixed meaning.) The same can be said for ALL language (so goes the argument).
One more point: When I say shared use, note that there are no FIXED SHARED USES - & what I am trying to say does NOT ONLY refer to words that we encounter for the first time. For example, in one of his vids, Az gave the example of a ruler...and how it means something different when USED to prop up a window.I gave a few examples in my paper, too. See what I mean?
I think this is the appropriate place to point out the distinction I make between "meaning" and "understanding". The reader is attempting to derive an understanding. An understanding might roughly percieve the meaning behind the text, or might quite accurately percieve the meaning. This could be tested by querrying (sp?) the author, or perhaps by.... following the instructions and getting the expected result, etc.
And although it took me a lot longer then I expected, I was kinda of settled in for the night and didn't make a time constraint for myself... time vs meaning - hmmm... if it sounds looney let me know haha!
bubonicnate 4 years ago
Not looney at all. I was half kidding, but now that you mention it, I didn't consciously consider how much time I had, but I almost always feel rushed when I finally get a chance to "play". And I think it does effect our approach, and maybe even our ability to discern the most accurate meaning.
rUTokKIN2ME 4 years ago
We need to make another video series then - Meaning; Troubles in the 4th Dimension!
hehe
bubonicnate 4 years ago
Bubonicate, also, aren't you the only one who had any idea what circadian meant? I thought we handled things very similarly, and yes, you were much more relaxed than I was. Not a negative trait for learning in my estimation. I was quite intimidated by the experiment and initially tried to keep my vids private. My lack of ability to navigate youtube led me to swallow my pride and post the bloody vids.
rUTokKIN2ME 4 years ago
I can't rememebr now but I think maybe Joshbuckler might have as well - but I know i had seen it before so I think it made things easier for me to understand. From what you are telling me, I'm getting the notion that our (the reader's) present situtation may be a large factor in how we find meaning in text? You made a judgement call about your time before you even sat down to read it perhaps?
bubonicnate 4 years ago
wow - you ripped through that! haha don't watch my video - I'm embarassed. As far as efficiency - I think it was amazing how quickly you got through this... I think part of it was a sort of disregard for things you didn't understand and continuing search for more text in the hopes of something to relate the things you didn't udnerstand. I am amazed at your instincts/skills.
bubonicnate 4 years ago
Thank you for the compliment. I already watched your first two vids. Didn't realize there were others until later. I definitley do keep reading, and I have a sense of urgency you may or may not have. Four kids and a wife who don't share my interest in youtube! lol Time is at a premium.
rUTokKIN2ME 4 years ago
The best scenario for understanding would be one where both parties to the attempted communication are aware of the others context, situation, background, shared experiences, language, etc.
rUTokKIN2ME 4 years ago
You have also given me something else to consider. Am I trying to make connections with the author? I believe that should be my intention, as i have suggested before, that the person attempting to understand must take the author's context into consideration. I suggest this is actually more critical than considerting one's own context at the time of reading.
rUTokKIN2ME 4 years ago
rU - I started to type here but ran too long. I may try to address this issue in my summary vid. Just a note: Many EXCELLENT readers have BOTH a sense of shared USE with the author and they ALSO branch (what we might consider 'branching') "away" from text during reading.
scoutie111 4 years ago
We find that they have no trouble managing this. For example, imagine yourself thinking about all the times you've had jet lag...and even thinking about your wife at that time, your job, your trip, that you had a great time, etc.) You still wouldn't INSERT those thoughts into a summary--if I'd asked you to summarize the text.
scoutie111 4 years ago
rU - Can you feel how words are 'dead' when we have no shared use of a word (or words) with the author? I also see you doing your best to find ANY shared uses you have with word(s) with that of the author. (Attempting to make ANY links/connections you can--in a coherent way--with the author.)Also, look how you want to look up words in the dictionary.I think what we're doing here is wanting to find 'definitions' that will provide SOME link to our own experiences.
scoutie111 4 years ago
Yes I see what you "mean". Because we have continued to discuss this subject, I now see how we each describe what occurs when we encounter a word for the "first" time. I say "no such address exists in my brain, and hence no file to pull at such address. You say the word is dead. I think we should consider and compare our metaphors.
rUTokKIN2ME 4 years ago
Instead of thinking 'files,' you might want to try out the word 'use(s).' I like the word 'use' (Wittgenstein's term, btw) because it is less likely to infer 'fixed meanings' or static definitions. Furthermore,with the word 'use,'we can better see that what we would normally define as 'meaning derived by context surrounding a word in text' - is actually the reader's perceived shared USE(s)--between reader & author.
scoutie111 4 years ago
Note: If what we would normally define as 'context surrounding an unknown word' had NO perceived, shared USE by the reader...even 'the context' would be dead. Hence, what I am trying to say is there is no intrinsic meaning...only perceived shared uses. Furthermore, there is no fixed use (i.e., intrinsic use/fixed meaning.) The same can be said for ALL language (so goes the argument).
scoutie111 4 years ago
One more point: When I say shared use, note that there are no FIXED SHARED USES - & what I am trying to say does NOT ONLY refer to words that we encounter for the first time. For example, in one of his vids, Az gave the example of a ruler...and how it means something different when USED to prop up a window.I gave a few examples in my paper, too. See what I mean?
scoutie111 4 years ago
I think this is the appropriate place to point out the distinction I make between "meaning" and "understanding". The reader is attempting to derive an understanding. An understanding might roughly percieve the meaning behind the text, or might quite accurately percieve the meaning. This could be tested by querrying (sp?) the author, or perhaps by.... following the instructions and getting the expected result, etc.
rUTokKIN2ME 4 years ago