Homebrew Wednesday #8 - Sour Beer Update

[Mainebrewguy]

Currious to see if it works, as you are porbably aware that the cell wall structure of lactobacillus fermenti consists of peptidoglycan which the cell walls thick outer layer contains teichoic acid, which in the presense of alcohol will breakdown (lyse). the real question is, do they all perish when the alcohol reaches the tipping point where all lacobacillus lyse. Keep us posted on this one

[arrogantbastardale]

@Mainebrewguy I actually didn't know the biological details, so thanks! All of these sour beers are pretty big (8-9%), so we will see. I think the real test will be the Cascade only batch, since there's no Brett in that one.

[jakeanddar]

Oh cool,can't wait to see the outcome of these experiments,cheers!

[arrogantbastardale]

@jakeanddar Thanks, me too! I just wish it wouldn't take so long!

[rkhigh6]

Cool expirement looks like I am doing the White Labs equivilant of your yeast for the Hokie expirement Happy HBW!

[sjporr]

Great experiment man, I'm sure they will all 3 be great. Happy HBW Cheers!!

[arrogantbastardale]

@sjporr <3 Sj

[WarriorandHen]

This looks interesting. I was considering doing an Old Ale, and then souring a portion of the mash, and then adding it back in during fermentation. How different is this from what you have done?

[arrogantbastardale]

@WarriorandHen I read that mash souring works well, but is less complex than a traditional lacto souring. However, I was thinking the same, but adding in Brett in secondary to give it more complexity. So much to try, so little space! Gonna do a Berlinerweise with sour mashing this year for sure.

[WarriorandHen]

@arrogantbastardale I think I'm gonna add a little Lactobacillus to a portin of my Old Ale mash. Thats what Brad Smith mentions in an article he wrote. Then of course add to the fermentation later. Sounds good man. So much to try for sure!

[arrogantbastardale]

@WarriorandHen Yeah, I've read about that method too. You can also add in unmalted grain (lacto lives naturally on the husks). I bet that inoculating with an actual culture from Wyeast or White labs would produce better souring. Just a guess though.

[StumpyJoeJr]

If I use dregs from a bottle I'm going to make sure to step it up to make sure it's viable and create a sour starter. That way I know the critters are still alive. I'm still trying to figure out whether I want to ferment with Brett or use an ale yeast to start it.

[arrogantbastardale]

@StumpyJoeJr Yeah, starter is the way to go. I did that, but not sure if the bacteria survived in the bottles due to high alcohol. One source told me the lacto was dead in the bottles, but I need to research it. One trick to adding brett during secondary is to add additional sugar with it to get good, fast Brett character (see latest Can You Brew It).

[pookanc]

Mad Scientist Action Awesomeness..lol. Happy HBW, Cheers!

[arrogantbastardale]

@pookanc It's alive, it's aliiiiiive!

[thegentlearts]

Interesting experiment good job mate.

[arrogantbastardale]

@thegentlearts Thanks, mate!

[bearclaw336]

if they dont work out find some one who has a still and run it though it mite be good whisky. thats what i would do good brewing!!! BC

[arrogantbastardale]

@bearclaw336 Interesting idea, BC!

[leedorham]

You going to let them sit until the pellicle drops?

[arrogantbastardale]

@leedorham I've heard that the whole pellicle dropping thing is a myth, but at the same time I don't want the beer to oxidize. Of course, I don't know if the lacto or pedio are still alive at this point (the brett should be). I will probably just bottle (or blend) when I think it tastes good in a year.