Jack Nicklaus 16th Tee 1970 British Open

[Dukesy50]

the way he shifts his weight is poetry

[grdakota]

I love that swing.

[bigboycat1]

MIKE AUSTIN WAS THE GREAT TEACHER IN THE WORLD OF GOLF AND HE HIT THE GOLF BALL 515 YARD AT AGE 64, DAN SHAUGER LEARNED FROM THE BEST TEACHER MIKE AUSTIN, I HAD SEVERAL LESSON FROM DAN AND NOW I HIT MY GOLF BALL STRAIGHT DOWN THE LINE NOW AND WITHOUT BACK PAIN AND HE HELP WITH MY PUTTING AND SHORT GAME, DAN HAS 2 BOOK AND 27 DVD AND HE WORKING ON 3RD BOOK NOW aperfectswing I PLAY A BETTER AROUND OF GOLF NOW AND WITHOUT BAC PAIN AND CHECKOUT DAN BOOT CAMP I DID HE HELP ME OUT ALOT GREAT TEACHER

[duckhunt08]

Tiger Woods>Jack Nicklaus

[pinboyjorf]

CHAMPION OF CHAMPIONS.

[stevepising]

Imagine Jack today as a 30 year old with a nike sumo driver and a Pro v1

[4golfonline]

Great footage of a legend.

[cebukid70]

I love Nicklaus' signature "trigger" move where he turns his head slightly to the right.

[fs1natra]

"sound and consistent golf techniques are more common now days."

just for the record jacks green in regulation figures in 1968 had not been equalled for the next 40 years.fact taken from mark shaws book about nicklaus

[SmallDannyJW]

Thats completely irrelevant?

[emncaity]

@fs1natra

Why would you need to hit greens or fairways when you can miss everything (if you're Tiger Woods), and your "great competition" will fall apart for you anyway, while the Tour runs its "these guys are good" commercials incessantly? In that Open at Torrey Pines a couple of years ago, Woods hit just about half the fairways for the week--and STILL made the playoff. Inexcusable. Then Rocco obliged by playing the 18th "not to lose" and shooting a mediocre round on Monday....

[ellis505]

your a prick, just because the game has been made easier you get all anal about it when you can go shoot that mediocre monday round that rocco shot give us a bell you out dated cunt

[emncaity]

@ellis505

Would be easier to answer if you could type in English, but anyway...

I don't object to improved conditions. I do object to the fact that there are dozens of pros who make a living on tour because they have equipment that minimizes their errors. I also object to people (like "duckhunt") who seem not to get the fact that the reason Tiger would've torn up these 6,500-yard courses (not all were that short, of course) is due partly to the improvements in equipment and conditioning.

[emncaity]

@ellis505

...Point is, the pro game HAS been made easier, so statements about how Tiger et al. would dominate the players of previous generations are just ridiculous. I do happen to think Tiger at his best would be one of the ones who would do find with persimmon and blades, because his contact is so much more precise than the average guy on tour. Point is, if you put a premium on qualities like precision and hitting fairways, you'd see a die-off of huge numbers of tour players.

[emncaity]

@emncaity

Correction: Previous post staing that "Tiger at his best would be one of the ones who would do find with persimmon and blades" should have read "do fine." Point is, he and a small group of others who have the skill to get the sweet spot on the ball a fairly high percentage of the time would rise to the top, while some of the others whose careers are being supported by game-improvement aspects of their equipment would die off.

[emncaity]

@ellis505

As for Rocco's "mediocre" round, I'm not saying it's all that easy to shoot even par at an Open, in a playoff. (Maybe you yourself are unqualified to comment on any of this because you couldn't do it either--although I have played at a plus-2 level and beat an awful lot of people, so I have a better idea of competitive golf than the average guy, I think). I'm saying that when two guys can get into a playoff for the Open title while hitting barely over 50% of the fairways...



[emncaity]

@ellis505

...(of the fairways), while using equipment designed to make the game easier and ball flight straighter, then acting like this generation is "better" is goofy. The PGA Tour knows how to market its products, and it's not about to make them look bad. This "our generation is SO much better than the old guys" is exactly the reaction they want, and they get it from people who don't know any better--because that money spends the same whether it comes from somebody knowledgeable or not.

[ellis505]

no i thought what they said was each generation gives way to the next, which is a fair comment as its true, as if it wasnt ben hogan would have one every major before he died

[ellis505]

no i thought what they said was each generation gives way to the next, which is a fair comment as its true, as if it wasnt ben hogan would have one every major before he died, and the course was probaly a lot harder than the ones from a generation ago, and dont forget 50% of fairways with one leg for one of the two guys is pretty good, they may not have hit the ball as good with new equipment but they chipped and putted alot better, and thats where technology has only had a slight effect

[emncaity]

@ellis505

As for making the game easier for the weekend player, that's fine for people who want to do it. Personally, I don't see what the challenge is when you do that--it seems to me like it'd be more fun and more meaningful to know where you stand relative to other players in this era and others, with equipment that tells you when you're doing well and when you're not--but to each his own at the amateur level, I guess.

[ellis505]

you dont see what the challenge is, well you must be blind, golf is one of the hardest games in the world but to you its no challenge, and also you can see how good you are to other players in this era as they have all the game improving stuff as well because they have no talent remember

[emncaity]

@ellis505

As for you personally, if you can't make your point without calling somebody a "prick" and a "cunt" for having a well-supported opinion that differs from yours, you shouldn't be in the discussion at all.  Thanks for letting us know who you are, loud and clear.

[emncaity]

@fs1natra

...including using the same club for the tee shot in the sudden death that had gotten him into trouble again and again on that same hole.

I'm tellin' ya, give these guys forged and persimmon and make them play the old ball, and we'll see who was good.

[emncaity]

@fs1natra

I mean, do you know how many guys there are out here who would pay for a pay-per-view tournament where the guys all used the old equipment (never mind the overmanicured courses and absolutely perfect greens every week)? The Tour would NEVER let that happen. The MacGregor van brought an old Tourney persimmon driver to a tour stop a few years back, and nobody could come close to hitting it the way Nicklaus or even the lesser lights used to.

[jumpinjackflash102]

hell of a swing.

[lhwood777]

underrated swing

[emncaity]

@lhwood777

Boy, you said it. It's always been fashionable to downplay it, but he didn't become the greatest tournament player in the history of the world without doing a lot of things right.

[clubindiana4]

MStoneManiac.......stop messaging me. Im not gay and not interested. Give it up you dirty old troll!!!

[SmallDannyJW]

Of course, the advances in instruction have meant that sound and consistent golf techniques are more common now days.

[clubindiana4]

What I'm really curious about "MStoneManiac" is why your so obsessed with all the GAY topics that you constantly comment on. Are you a pole smoker?????

[SmallDannyJW]

The technique players used in the 60's and 70's was often different to the technique used now and thats due to the courses that they had to play on. For example the putting strokes.

[SmallDannyJW]

"It would be fun to see how well today's pros could play with yesterday's equipment on an typically conditioned public track...I bet on average they'd struggle to break par! " Like you said yourself, the changes in equipment have brought about changes in the set up of golf courses. If you took a pro from the 70s gave him a modern set of clubs and put him on the first tee at Oakmont, he would find it just as difficult as the situation you suggested.

[TheBlackDelorian]

theres a golf magazine out now this months issues, GOLF i think its called and they have harrington doing just that - hitting with an old skool driver 6 iron and 9 iron, distance isnt as far off as you'd expect but he did say he could break par easily but not compete against his felow pros if they were using todays clubs and he had old clubs

[SmallDannyJW]

Of course and noone would say that the older clubs would be as good as the new clubs. However I often read people write "Nicklaus would have hit it 400 yards with modern day clubs" and clearly this is a massive exaggeration of the difference in distance between old and new clubs.

[sretsam68]

400 yards is a stretch to some degree, but the golf ball itself is the bigger factor for distance than the old marshamllows previously used.

[sretsam68]

What kind (or vintage) of golf ball was he using?

[TheBlackDelorian]

it wasnt a vintage ball mate it was the one harrington uses just now on tour thats the only part of the test that wasnt accurate i suppose. wilson tour ball i think he uses?

[sretsam68]

MStoneManiac - you are correct.

[SmallDannyJW]

The equipment has improved but the golf courses themselves are far harder. A hell of a lot longer and much more narrow and the rough is thicker. I think its crazy to suggest the quality is actually decreasing. Despite the fact there are far more countries playing the game, more players worldwide, better systems bringing juniors through. Given this I think it is much more reasonable to say the reason the SA hasn't improved is because the golf courses have been adapted and made more challenging.

[SmallDannyJW]

Take any pro from the 70's and drop him in the US Open now days and the results would be just as poor as the other way round.

[sretsam68]

What?

[jumpinjackflash102]

Bullshit.

[SmallDannyJW]

You've certainly got a way with words.

[SmallDannyJW]

Players of any generation have to adapt and play with what they have at that given time. Its like saying Arnolds Palmer putting stroke would never be as effective on modern day greens as the guys on tour now. It probably wouldn't but he can't be judged on that because he had to adapt to the environment he played in.

[MotivoStudio]

i don't like his long and unstable backswing and his leg action as well

[danic18]

the distance he go with that material...today he´d be longer and easier than anybody... the only thig i dont like is the tension he created before taking the club away. but, who says what about him...

[anwealde]

@danic18 would he really be longer and easier than anybody today? Apparently not. He plays with modern material now, and I have not seen his name on any leaderboards lately

[fantastika08]

@anwealde hey nate, let's see how would you play after knee and hip replacement + back pain + age... Anyway he doesn't train to compete anymore, I guess he's done enough!!

[anwealde]

@fantastika08 my point exactly

[justinp766]

@danic18

The tension he creates is actually "Torque" from him cocking his wrist and body to unleash all hell upon the golf ball.

you probally do not hit that far ...other wise you would understand that.

[danic18]

@justinp766 a bit cocky from you to say how far i do hit the ball... anyway i meant before starting the swing, nothing to do with torque...

[maxpf]

@justinp766 read properly before you judge

[bossofalltime]

All this talk of how people have got it better today - can't blame people for making a f***ing living

[sretsam68]

Nope...just that the game is watered down.

[bossofalltime]

I must agree with that. All I'm saying is they're out there on tour props to them

[emncaity]

The great players in any era haven't seen the swing as an end in itself, as you see so many players doing now. At any range you'll see guys practicing hard on "positions" (as if the swing were a series of photographed positions anyway), holding the finish in a very photogenic way, but can't hit the ball on the center of the clubface and can't play at all.  You wonder what game they're actually playing. It isn't golf, because that's about scoring as low as you can. Posing, maybe?

[emncaity]

Change the course to an Open course a generation ago, complete with high rough, and I'd guarantee it--on the average, that is. I think what you'd see is that the top players would stand out more than they do now (including Tiger, who--significantly--has always played irons with no game-improvement features). But I'll bet we'd see a few surprises.

Y'know, the all-exempt tour has something to do with all this, too.

[emncaity]

Oh, yeah...I'd never argue that the average player ought to feel bad about good technology.  I'm with you on how it's affected the pro game, though. It's pretty well understood among the top players that there are quite a few guys making a living out there on the bottom rungs of the tour who probably wouldn't be there but for modern equipment--guys that would've been perennial club-champion amateurs, but not tour pros, a generation ago.

[emncaity]

But I do get your point. If that whole army is supposed to help, and the huge money is supposed to motivate players so much more, and conditions are perfect, and they hit 9-irons to greens where pros used to hit 4-irons, and they know distances to the inch, you'd think they'd break records every week.

As for the technology, it's ridiculous. Off the tee, I hit it 35 yards longer, at least, than I did 20 years ago, in my 20s. That really shouldn't happen.

[emncaity]

Yeah, but...do you think all those support-group people really help? At least to the extent that it's based on the underlying tendency of a specific player not to be self-reliant, it might actually be a detriment. It seems to play into that problem and make it worse, IMHO. Not that it's not possible for a guru or sports psych to push a guy toward real self-reliance, but I wonder how often that happens. You hear a lot of "helpless" talk among players.

[emncaity]

Actually, I'm not so sure. I think the effect of today's equipment is to even out the playing field to some extent, so that players who couldn't manage to win when it took the precision it used to (with forged, persimmon, and balata) might actually have a shot. To a very large degree, modern equipment covers a relative lack of skill.

That MacGregor ball was crap, for sure.

And I agree with your larger point. God only knows how far he could have hit a modern driver in his prime.

[hubomba]

Tiger deals with much stricter competition thatn Nicklaus did. The reason there are less "legends" is because there is a higher level of competition on the tour rather than just a handful of "good" golfers and the rest being sub-par.

[sretsam68]

A popular, but incorrect sentiment. The fields today may be "deeper", but the number of different champions during Nicklaus' first 48 majors as a pro is the same as during Tiger's first "eligible" 48 (since he missed the last two) as a pro. Players today (other than Tiger) haven't learned how to separate themselves from the others and much of it is due to the homogenized technique and all the cash available.

[sretsam68]

I agree. There will never be conclusiveness unless Tiger wins 30 majors and 100 events or more. Jack's total record is so deep and over such a long period - and vs. greater competition, IMO - that Tiger has a ways to go. I have been a believer that Tiger will win more than 18 since his 9th win at the 2005 Masters. But I don't concede he is the best ever.

I like what Roger Federer said when asked if he was the best to play tennis. He said, "No and I kind of like not knowing who the best is."

[sretsam68]

Agreed - Greg Norman said something similar to what you have written.

Check out the recent dialogue on "Hate to be Rude - Tiger Woods vs Jack Nicklaus", the version with more than 1,400 views. The comment on Dan Pohl speaks volumes to what you reference and that is only reflective of 1980, let alone the '60s, etc.

[RoathRipper]

its just the way the left foot peels off the floor, weakening the stance and possibly unhinging the swing plane.

[emncaity]

Jack talks about that in some of his books; he'd let the left heel come up (on the advice of Jack Grout) with the woods and sometimes with long irons because if he didn't, with the way he set up to it and the upright arc he was after, he would get into a reverse pivot. However, it's also true (as you state and/or imply) that particularly if you already have a reverse pivot, getting loose with the lead knee and foot like that can make it much worse and kill any chance at an effective plane.

[sretsam68]

The fallacy of comparing Jack and Tiger is if they were playing in their primes concurrently, there would be no record of Jack's for Tiger to be obsessed with. Jack's longevity would win out, in my opinion.

Yes, Tiger has a super short game, but Jack was a better driver and iron player - and more powerful.

The other view is give me Tiger's top five competitors and Jack's top five and I'll take Jack's any day.

[emncaity]

There still isn't another Nicklaus.

Tiger is indeed the consummate golfer of our time, no argument there--as long as "our time" is post-Nicklaus's prime. Level of competition isn't even close. Which one of these 1B players today would compare to the 1Bs of the Nicklaus era? We'll compare records anytime.

[emncaity]

...and by "records," I mean everything from tournament records to avg scores (esp. with adjustments for distances and improved conditions) to specific ballstriking stats.

I'd also agree that Tiger is a phenomenal putter. And he has "the drives of Palmer," all right--too often in the woods, requiring recovery. Nicklaus was easily a better driver of the ball than Palmer, overall.

[emncaity]

But there's no doubt about this: Tiger is the _only_ guy today who has the mental chops of Nicklaus, Hogan, etc., a total throwback to the days when the top guys played like they were playing not to have to go back home and work in dad's hardware store.

I have no problem putting him in the very small top group of players ever. I just object to the idea that he's so obviously superior to all of them. Strikes me as an adolescent "nobody was ever good before my generation" argument.

[fs1natra]

@emncaity

colin montgomerys former coach said that nicklaus had the greatest will to win of any golfer he ever saw

[emncaity]

Are you asking who'd win more against Tiger's present-day competition?

[RoathRipper]

his left leg at 0:03... tut-tut-tut. Seems to contradict his 'Golf My Way' video...

[emncaity]

Top of the backswing, you mean?

Which aspect of the video does it contradict?  (I'm not disputing that it might; he changed several aspects of his swing periodically, and the original GMW video didn't come out for something like 12 or 13 years after this film was shot.)

[huntersingle]

who would win more today Tiger or Jack?

[addamsmith]

It is one if my favorite of Jack to

[capotostoangelo]

its the best video on youtube if you wanna see jacks swing, back when he was actually swinging

[paulski5]

His grip looks stronger here.....

...?

[greenjacket12]

your welcome snow covered spam!

[emncaity]

Thanks for posting these...