@JaredsName, I am a former Christian and I have read the Bible multiple times. I just don't see how a perfect God could curse two people for eating a tree that GOD HIMSELF placed in some magical garden. Since God is omniscient and since he knew that Adam and Eve will be deceived, why did God place the tree of knowledge in the garden in the first place? God staged the fall. If God didn't curse Adam, we would still live forever and have colonized distant star systems by now.
He still did not explain why 5 year old girls get sold as sex slaves and spend there whole life getting raped to death!
O and also that 5 year old girl was born and died a muslim and did not understand the 3 gods father Jesus and the holy goast err...1 god...ops. Guess she will burn in hell for ever! Sick
do you people that say "God is hate" understand that God understands EVERYTHING? taking peoples life isnt a bad thing, death isnt a bad thing. its something of beauty.
people call Christians close minded. but in fact, it appears that those who judge us are close minded.
Hitler truly believed he was doing the right thing. He didn't think he was doing evil. Meanwhile, God sat back and watched millions upon millions of humans get slaughtered. He'll help give your christian event good weather and bless your family, but don't count on him when it comes to genocide or natural disasters.
Atheists don't need to answer 25 questions. We're not making an extraordinary claim, you are so the burden of proof is on you. Without even hearing the 25 questions, I already know that none of them provide evidence for God.
The children that GOD allows to suffer did not have this choice you speak of. "GOD" allows children to suffer? Innocent little children that did not choose to be raped. If he allows pure innocent children to suffer, I do not want to be friends with this GOD! If a child were being raped in front of me and I asked you to help stop it, and you said no. I wouldn't want to be your friend. That is evil, your god is evil.
@wannawatchu66 One example would be in the video he does on evidence for the resurrection of Jesus. He sites the verse Paul uses to say 500 people witnessed Jesus after he rose.( 1 COR. 15:6 ).
I find this laughable. But Lee finds these nameless faceless "500" people who have no written testimony to be evidence.
@wannawatchu66 Lee Strobel claims to be a serious investigator, involved in finding the truth about God, Jesus, Christianity, etc. When did Lee ever interview any serious working scientists or opposing Biblical scholars and get the other sides view? ( claims the bible makes that science can show to be very unlikely ) Instead he just interviews noted Christian theologians and acts like he did a fair and balanced investigation.
All your words are pointless. It doesn't matter if GOD has this great plan. If he has the power to stop the pain and suffering of innocent children and he allows these disgusting acts to continue, he is a twisted entity. What ever his plan is, it is not worth even one child being forced into prostitution and raped for years. To sit back and watch children suffering is sick and wrong no matter how you look at it!
@ulmer1138 WHO CAUSES OUR SUFFERING NOT GOD WE DO HAS ANYONE EVER WANTED GOD AS A RULER NO NOT REALLY THE WORLD IS FALLING INTO THE POWER IF THE WICKED ONE WHO IS SATAN THE DEVIL SO GOD WILL UNDO ALL THE BAD IN THE WORLD FOREVER IT WAS NEVER THE WILL OF GOD FOR US TO SUFFER
There is no god. However if you believe he does and more specifically he is the christian god, there is a simple reason why he permits suffering. Its so he can vindicate his name. Thats right, the reason he allows millions of people to starve to death, people to be murdered, children raped and abused and the other countless obscenities in his world is because he is such an egotist that he needs to prove himself right. Worse thing is that even knowing this he still demands our worship.
@hammnod Ha i love how your statement just increases my faith and just backs up the bible even more, why is murder, rape, starvation, abuse etc.. bad? by what standards are you making these judgments? what evidence do you have that there is no God? when Atheist like Hitchens couldn't prove God doesn't exist when he got smashed by William Lane Craig in a debate. Tell me what evidence do you have cuz i heard them all and i have not found one atheist to prove there is no God, Not one
@thecount1216 For you to suggest that a human being can not have an absolute morality without religion or god is just offensive. Is it because of the bibles 'moral' code that I feel sick when I read that 650 people died in floods in the Philippines or a man set his neighbor on fire over money, or is it basic human decency? But lets focus on bible standards and what your god has allowed, the thousands of years of human suffering all so he can vindicate his name? Wheres the decency in that?
@hammnod dude your completely wrong let me tell you the truth the world we live in god doesnot rule but us humans under the influence of satan this is the truth that not evryone knows because of satan who would hate for you to know AND BY THE WAY WHEN THEY SAY TO SANTIFY HIS NAME WHAT IS HIS NAME ISNT IT JEHOVAH
Read or listen Bhagvad Geeta on internet and all you will come to know why there is suffering in the world, but you have to read full book or need to hear full of it to understand the concept beyond it.
"Cannot" and "had to" are terms that do not apply to a being you dare to call God. If god is omnipotent, he could have created the world without suffering, or at least very little thereof, yet allow room for love and free will. Not possible? Then he is flawed. A true good god would not create a civilization without its permission... and then burn half of it in hell.
And I suppose this answer also explains the unspeakable suffering in the animal kingdom where beasts eat each other to survive.
There is also a powerful case for the existence of Leprechauns. They have a popular breakfast cereal based on them. Even God doesn't have one of those
God could stop it all and he will very soon. But. He allows things to happen so that we will learn from our mistakes,not keep doing the same things over and over. God does not cause evil to happen,we do that ourselves because of the choices we make.
If you stopped every bad decision that your child made,never let em get one single scratch then how would that child learn what to do and what not to do?
@Killer0fTheSun It's not my place to provide you with proof because no matter what you are told or shown,you will still not believe. When and if the day ever comes that seek you God with all of your heart then you will get the proof you need.
Matthew 7:8.For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.
Until then you will not have what you want,you will always be lost in the darkness of your own doubt.
@Killer0fTheSun You laughed,that's not surprising. Most people do.
As i said.It's not my place to explain anything to you.People like you have no desire to hear the truth so why wast my time. Besides.If you really wanted to know the truth, you would have done so on your own already.
I did laugh...at your inability to even reason.....nevertheless your faith has ZERO truth to it...the only truth however is that faith is the single most redundant premise for humanity.
@Killer0fTheSunThe laws of conservation of mass and conservation of energy, modified by Albert Einstein's theory of mass-energy equivalence state that no thing is created nor destroyed, it merely changes form from matter to energy, and vice versa. Based on Einstein's theorem, it should not be possible for creation ex nihilo to take place.
Now,reason with one of the greatest minds in history about what is the commonly accepted justification for the non-existence of God.The Big B theory
Strange how christians can study the bible and don't see all the faults and ignorance throughout the book. Wishfull thinking must be it. Oh I know lets just focus on the good parts and we'll ignore the wrong stuff cause that was for a different time or something like that...
@1coffeecupNo not at all, faith is not supposed to be blind. There are many things to understand. I called out to God in a very desperate moment in my life. I was not a true believer but I gave God a chance and not only was I delivered from that situation but I became renewed in every way. I suffered from depression for more than a decade, all that was gone, gone in a few days. I felt so amazing! At that moment I believed. Now I know I was blind.
@1coffeecup Just give God a chance. Say a prayer with an honest open heart and ask him to come into your life and if you allow him to come into your life he will. God gives free will to choose. You wont loose anything.
@C13SKY I really have tried that and nothing changed in the way I see the bible or religion for that matter. All the things I have experienced has led me to the realization that there is no god and the bible is an amazing tool used to control the masses. I will say this in defense of the bible though: without the threat of fire in hell there probably be even more ruthless scumbags destroying lives of others or themselves.
I wonder if he would still possess these sentiments, if he lived in China during the Mongol invasions? He would then acquire a good perspective on what true suffering is.
We have "free will" by nature, not because God gave it to us. It´s a matter of FREE WILL VS GOD´S WILL. This is the very battle that goes on in the human mind. "Free will" implies knowing BOTH GOOD AND EVIL. God does not know evil.
Once you do God´s will, you no longer have free will because you´re in "heaven", no longer knowing evil.
Manageable suffering is still suffering. And it's easy to say "our pain" is manageable when more than half of the world is living in poverty and millions of babies are born with diseases and deformities. I guess they all chose to be suffering?
Crying out from the church, their weak minds already enslaved. Voices of the shadowy realm, the beginning of the end. Powerful demons destroy holy light as he bursts from the earth. The sound of his voice from his kingdom calls to me. Soon, we shall crush their holy hypocrisy. Black magicks now working, powerful spells are cast. Evil in his eyes and darkest blasphemy. Church of christ dies while Lord Satan survives. Seizing power in Satan's name. A life of death is what he craves.
Does the Ethiopian widow, watching her children die of starvation, have a choice? Dr Strobel doesn't find her suffering repugnant because he believes a carpenter rose from the dead. Would he be happy to tell her she is suffering because his psychopathic God got angry when her ancestor ate an apple?
For a more plausible explanation of the reason for suffering, and a sensible suggestion for the meaning of your life, see the YouTube video 'God says sorry'.
Does the Ethiopian widow, watching her children die of starvation, have a choice? Todd Tyszka doesn't find her suffering repugnant because he believes a carpenter rose from the dead. Would he be happy to tell her she is suffering because his psychopathic God got angry when her ancestor ate an apple?
For a more plausible explanation of the reason for suffering, and a sensible suggestion for the meaning of your life, see the YouTube video 'God says sorry'.
Does the Ethiopian widow, watching her children die of starvation, have a choice? Todd Tyszka doesn't find her suffering repugnant because he believes a carpenter rose from the dead. Would he be happy to tell her she is suffering because his psychopathic God got angry when her ancestor ate an apple?
For a more plausible explanation of the reason for suffering, and a sensible suggestion for the meaning of your life, see the YouTube video 'God says sorry'.
@level7atheist You do realize that Epicurus lived from 341 - 270 BC "before Christ" and quoted "that the gods do not reward or punish humans" so he for one acknowledges that there are gods. Do your home work before you start listing off quotes from self taught philosophers, who stole their ideas from real philosophers such as Democritus.
@respekitmor And this quote could not apply to the God of the Bible how? Did I mention Christ? Why would I need to Know about the Philosopher to understand this quote? Christianity is just a religion built upon the foundations of religions before it. Christmas and Easter for example are just pagan traditions that Christianty stole. One doesen't have to know everything about epicurus to understand the truth of this quote. Something cannot possibly be omnipotent, omniscent and Omnimalevolent.
@level7atheist You need to get your "facts" straight. Judaism is the oldest religion. Then Christianity comes next from Judaism. Easter and Christmas are both holidays celebrating the birth and resurrection of Jesus christ.
@respekitmor Your Ignorance is Overwhelming. Please take the time to look up a timeline of Religion from any unbiased website, wikipedia as one exsample. Hinduism is generally considered the oldest living religion. Religions have been recorded emerging since at least 9831 BC If not sooner.
@respekitmor You can say that about Hinduism and I can say it is the same for all regigions, christianity included. But even if Hinduism is just a way of life, Scientists have found proof of Paleolithic religion that began at the latest at around 30,000BCE.
@level7atheist And Hinduism is "self described" as a "way of life" they say it themselves that they are not a religion. Nevertheless what are we arguing about? Are you saying that there is no god? or What?
@respekitmor Also, I appologise for my improper facts about christmas and easter. They are both Christian holidays that took some traditions from Paganism. For exsample, the Christmas tree is considered as Christianisation of pagan tradition and ritual surrounding the Winter Solstice, which included the use of evergreen boughs, and an adaptation of pagan tree worship. Same goes for eggs at easter.
Christmas wasn't even the first holiday in the winter solstice. there were at leat ten before it.
@level7atheist Thank you for your respect. I believe that the christmas tree and easter eggs came along way later for people. They just kind of incorporated it into the holidays. The real holidays are about jesus, no presents, trees, egg, or shopping spirits. sadly this is what has become the norm. You do make good points sir.
@level7atheist Stop debating so much and just ask God with all your heart if he is real. Go directly to the source dont just take anybodies word.God is giving you free will to seek him or not. After all if God is real eternity is a long time.
@C13SKY I was a Christian, I thought I had found him, but I only thought I did because I wanted to beleive in him. Now that my logic has matured, I can see how absurd my ideas were.
And if god is real in the end, shouldn't someone be judged on how they lived their life rather than which god they beleived in? If God is going to send the nicest person in the world to hell for not beleiving, that is not the kind of god I want to put faith in.
@level7atheist DUDE SERIOUSLY GOD CAN HE WILL AND HE WANTS TO ITS JUST A MATTER OF TIME THATS WHY THERE NEEDS TO BE A JUDGEMENT DAY THATS WHY ITS NECESARY
@level7atheist well ou see we are made in the image of god there fore we have good cualitlies because god has good qualitlies for instince do you feel sad when you see people suffer imagine how god feels, worse if you had the power would you change things on earth even i would so be faithful that god who has the power will do it gos is good and unable to act wickedly so this isnt his fault for all thats hapening
@108BEANER Congradulations. In that horrifically under-punctuated response you have proven to me that people have feelings. You're are still making no case for God. Why do you beleive he exists? You haven't given any good reasons why you beleive he will come back for Judgement day either.
Also, the last 3 lines of your response make no sense. Please use punctuation.
@level7atheist how would you think that the universe was created there shouldnt there be a creator and its in the bible that god will make judgement day happen
@108BEANER There doesen't have to have a creator. That always begs the question who created god. Creationists say "He has always been." then why cant we just say the universe has always been? And why do you beleive the bible? it's an old book.
If you can't tell, I am leading you into a circular arguement.
@level7atheist DO YOU HAVE ANY SOLID PROF OF THAT. THE BIBLE IS A SPECIAL BOOK LIKE NO OTHER IT IS NEEDED NOW IN DAY WITH WORDS FROM GOD AS A GIFT TO YOU OTHER WISE WE WOULDNT KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT HIM THE BIBLE PREVENTS US FROM GETTING HURT ANY QUESTIONS.
@108BEANER Please write your responses coherently. I honestly cant take you seriously.
How do you know the bible is accurate?
why not the quaran, or book of mormon?
I think you should stop readig the bible and pick up an actually educational book. it might teach you something, like how to spell and make proper sentences.
@level7atheist Thats my problem if i dont want to use punctuation and besides you didnt answer my question. There happy its like your my mother man. free will when i need to use puntuation i will.
@level7atheist Oh im sorry my question is that if you have a book or something that suports your theory, I do, not only that it says what will take place, how to deal with now and day situations, and to stay out of trouble, which has pretty much worked out for me very well. It warns me of the things that i should not do, makes my life simple and clean. The words it as are used now every were in the world, for example,not to kill, not to hurt others, man did not make this teaching.
@108BEANER There are thousands of books that support atheism and evolution, but none have specific rules on how to live your life because those rules are common sense. Even in the animal kingdom, civilized animals have the same rules. As well, there are several rules in the bible that we dont follow for good reasons. Only 3 of the 10 commandments are actually laws. the 2nd, 3rd, 4th, and 9th commandments have been slandered millions of times.
@108BEANER If we are going to discard so many of the bibles "Laws", why dont we just disregard all of them. Its not really a very good source of morality.
Natural means can describe where and why people act the way they do.
@warren52nz jajajaja Ok first of all the bible doesnt tell people to celebrate the
birthday of jesus its all man made, its the sacrifice of jesus what we should really
apretiate. Second I meant that in a way of what choices you decide to do in your life, im sorry for not being especific. What your telling me isnt what i meant, but i have the answer to why people even christians suffer.
@108BEANER Yes, Jesus' birthday is the same as a dozen other "Messiahs", it's really to mark the shortest day and they didn't even get that quite right! But why would they, the people that wrote the Bible were Bronze age primitives who thought the Earth was flat and the Sun revolved around it pushed by God.
I'm also having trouble understanding you and don't type in CAPS, it just pisses people off.
@warren52nz Are you sure those are "Messiahs"? none did what jesus did for us and to spite the fact that his lessons we use now in day and are very usefull and amaizing what he tought others no one could have ever thought of what he said its the word of jehovah god.
@108BEANER "none did what jesus did for us and to spite the fact that his lessons we use now in day and are very usefull"
First of all there's no evidence that Jesus even EXISTED never mind what he may have said. Maybe you should do some research into what you believe. Not one single person that knew Jesus wrote about him, everything was written decades later. And Jesus is only mentioned in the Bible and he condoned slavery! Not many would call that good morality!!!
@warren52nz Actually he was profecised before he even arived, it was foretold that the promised messia would arrive, I dont know if ther is proof but I just believe in him for the words that really get to me and ... YOU know what if you dont believe me get your own bible see what you can find out for yourself we are just arguing over and over and im not gonna get to you by just words, we need action so try it. At least you can say you proved me wrong. if your right we are doomed!!!!
@108BEANER "get your own bible" That's the difference between you and me, I don't have a single book that tells me about reality, my "Bible" is the millions of books in universities around the world that claim things about reality and then invites others to try to prove them wrong. If no one can, then eventually what they claim become scientific theories and at that point you can count on them far more than you can on a book written 2,000 years ago which is full of holes and inconsistencies.
@warren52nz Ok so ask for a sing for the real bible like I did and got the book with the title "New world translation of the holy scripture".like I said you read it and become amazed at what was written centuries ago aplies today. No man can ever do that you havent tried it, how do know if you dont even try.
@108BEANER I've asked for a sign dozens of times, I was brought up Christian. It's partly because I never had a scrap of anything that could count as a reply that I gave it up.
That and the fact that none of it makes any sense, it was really a no brainer.
@108BEANER Anything you can say about the Bible, I can say about any other holy book. Did you know there are over 300 man-made gods (including yours)? Starting with:
Agdistis or Angdistis Ah Puch Ahura Mazda Alberich Allah Amaterasu An Anansi Anat Andvari Anshar Anu Aphrodite Apollo Apsu Ares Artemis Asclepius Athena Athirat Athtart Atlas Baal Ba Xian Bacchus Balder Bast Bellona Bergelmir Bes Bixia Yuanjin Bragi Brahma Brigit Camaxtli Ceres Ceridwen Cernunnos Chac Chalchiuhtlicue Charun...
@warren52nz Not really the one i have warns me about false idols which mislead you or have doughts, this is the trick of satan which is mileading the entire inhabited world and making people suffer, my bible is special solves problems that we are going through now and day which no man can ever do. I know why tou have doughts god is something so increble that ours minds canot even imagine since were are inperfect.
@108BEANER " its the sacrifice of jesus what we should really apretiate (sic)"
I don't know. I'd be happy to die if 3 days later I got to rise from the dead and spend eternity in heaven. Doesn't sound like much of a sacrifice to me.
And anyway, I don't believe in original sin. So what if some tart ate a piece of fruit after taking advice from a talking snake, that's not my fault, fuck her.
The whole thing is fabricated and borrowed from Pagans who sacrificed goats ("scapegoat") to remove "sin".
@warren52nz Pagans seriously? well what did want to see him tortured for days or torn limb from its? its a sacrifice that needed to happen, a perfect life to pay for what adam and eve did, so god isnt unfair just for somehting you didnt do. Do not fear unless you are doing bad, otherwise be very afraid. for the apointed time is near and god will come like a tief in the night no one will know but him.
@108BEANER "a perfect life to pay for what adam and eve did, so god isnt unfair"
So if someone you didn't know murdered someone and the police came and arrested you for it that seems fair to you right? I didn't eat the fruit so it's not my problem. It wasn't me that took advice from a talking snake. 8^)
You've got it worse than most. Why don't you try thinking for yourself for once?
I'm guessing English isn't your first language... if it is you REALLY need to go back to school.
@warren52nz god is not responsable for the tragedy the world is going through, but the one who made us sin in te first place, god isnt the ruler of the world if it were things would be different from what you see now. Now you know why you suffer, dont blame god. for it the christinas dont even have the right idea of what is happening.
@108BEANER "god is not responsable for the tragedy the world is going through"
Well I'm an Atheist so of course I agree but that's probably the only thing I agree with you about.
But let's look at it from the Christian perspective. According to Christians, God is omniscient, that is he knows everything about the past and the future. So he knows every action every person will take forever. And he created us so how can you say he's not responsible? Tell me about "Free Will" so I can have some fun.
@warren52nz Ok we have free will but the demons tempt or lure us into doing exactly what god doesnt want us to do, and the only way to brake free from it is getting close to god and jesus; for satan does not have a grip on him. He is there to help us in the time of need with anything. Besides it was satan who got us into this mess in the first place.
@108BEANER Uh Huh. And the Flying Spaghetti Monster will come along and thwart his plans.
It's all just words mate.
Look, I'm not interested in having a discussion with someone who's as brainwashed as you are. I'll have a conversation with someone who wants to talk specifics and not just spout dogma. Your spelling and grammar is really putting me off, I want to have this discussion with someone with an education.
@108BEANER That video is a load of bullshit. Here's why God allows bad things to happen:
GOD DOESN'T EXIST!
Once you "get" that, everything in this world will suddenly make sense.
Anyway the poster of that video has blocked all Atheists he's come across from commenting which makes sense too, the last thing he wants is honest scrutiny!!!
Atheist videos get high ratings and always have comments enabled, religious videos don't. Guess why that is?
@108BEANER But I'll tell you ONE thing that's true about god in the "omni" category and it's something you can bet your life on:
God is omni-ABSENT! You can make any effort you care to try to get God to show up or do anything measurable and it will fail every time!!!
I know why but you don't.
And warm fuzzy feelings that make you think you're experiencing god's presence are just your Ego surfacing from within your own brain.Science has already shown that prayer doesn't have any effect. I'm bored
NEWSFLASH!!! Homo Sapiens is a member of the family of Great Apes, we evolved from common ancestors and that PROVES that there never was a first man and a first woman. You can look it up in the dictionary... "Homo Sapiens"
So it's been proven that Adam & Eve never existed. Not liking truth doesn't change the facts!
@warren52nz The bible isnt spesific man it could be in a way that it doesnt say, if it were like i said,it would be a relly really loooong book but here something that suports the fact that i am trying to explain. watch?v=gigORNB5-JY&feature=plcp&context=C3fc13bbUDOEgsToPDskII5n4ZL7ucs7bbxPdL8p9k
@vas13xtq yes there is free will, and there is no pain and suffering, only joy and happiness. Do you actually b/c there is free will there is pain and suffering? c'mon give me a break
@jlmshane Strobel is claiming that there is pain and suffering in the world because god gave us free will. But, as you mentioned, there will only be joy and happiness in heaven. So this notion of pain and suffering existing because god gave us free will Strobel illustrated is flawed. So if there is free will in heaven, his argument doesn't work.
@vas13xtq heaven is for the angels not humans a dead person is unconcient and unable to do anything in this wolrld or in any besides in heaven there is no tempations and you can see things more clearly the way god do its up to you if yoiu want to believe it
@108BEANER Will you not go to heaven if you follow christ? If so, it seems that heaven is for humans. Strobel claims in the video that the reason their is pain and suffering in the world is because god gave us free will. So if there is free will in heaven, then it follows that there is pain and suffering in heaven. Thats Strobel's logic for ya. Incoherent white noise.
@vas13xtq ok man what makes you think we go anywere when we die the dead are unconcient and canot be helped nor can we help them as if they were sleeping thats the thing not everyone knows no heaven nor hell. but if you follow christ its everlasting life and a place along with when he returns free will we have but there is also a big temptation in this world whick is why we sin and because were not perfect
okay Dr.Strobel abuse of choice cause most of the worlds suffering, that still doesnt explain the rest of suffering, like hmm lets see babies with birth defects, suck as being retarded or any sickness, and that would in no way be affected by freedom of choice, god isnt real, and if he is hes a fuckin asshole you cant deny that
oh btw, i think i read awhile ago, may be some can chime in, that the judeo chrstian doctrines ARE the deceit that the bible speaks of. There is just so much ancient symbolism of unverisal truths contained in the bible from other cultures that these pastors, either know or don't tell, or are just ignorant. Either way, the preachers and you followers don't seek unity amongst humans. If you guys did you would reach for fundamental teachings that have been around before you fucking jesus bs shit
christians are so simple, you guys really think we are here on earth, we die we go to heaven or hell, thats it? there are different dimensions and universes to explore and be apart of their development, since the number of universes and their size is perceived to be infinite, our eternity, our fate as spiritual beings, is to forever be intertwined with the birth death cycle of the cosmos. silly christians, go research other cultures.
That's not what he said. He said you need CHOICE in order to experience love and he's speaking about the love that you GIVE out. You can't be forced to love someone. He never even claimed that you need pain to experience love because in the beginning we were created to be with God for eternity. But we messed it up.
@TheJonsalazar So he gave us free will and then whinged and sulked for thousands of years because we did something that he gave us the capability to do? Even if he did exist, I wouldn't want to follow a grudge holding, hissy fit throwing god.
Haha I'm not even going to reply to this because you already know what happened. You should also know you're distorting it to how you see fit so you won't feel like you have to follow this God. It's your defense mechanism. Wish fulfillment to the max. You're the one holding a grudge and a hissy fit because you feel like God failed in creating us.
@TheJonsalazar Why would I stop complaining? People are wasting their lives following a fairy tale and I find that to be an enormous waste of human resources.
@TheJonsalazar If these people weren't believing fallacy, they could be contributing beneficially towards the human race. I consider it a productive use of my time to help convince them they are wasting their lives.
Where's the fallacy? What is the fallacy behind Christianity; please enlighten me. Hypothetically, lets say that God doesn't exist. Would you really trust these people that believed in this fallacy to contribute something beneficially to the human race when these people were dumb enough to believe it in the first place? Probably not.. you're just wasting your own time! Trust me!
Believing in God is a pretty big thing. Even Paul said "If in Christ we have hope in this life only, we are of all people most to be pitied." 1 Corinthians 15:19. My question to you is why even worry if they apply their thinking incorrectly? This is certainly just a belief that someone has right? Does it bother you? It's a belief in a deity; there are many intellectuals that are Christian, and not only Christian but believe in some sort of deity. Why does it bother you so much?
I care too. Why do you think I'm spending my time arguing with you? Cuz I got nothing better to do? The only thing I can say is that arguing probably isn't going to change anyone's view. It sure hasn't changed mine. Why do people believe in God? Cuz their prayers are getting answered; they see God work in their lives. Otherwise they wouldn't believe. You aren't going to change anyone's mind by using simple minded arguments like yours. And I'm not saying that to insult you.
@TheJonsalazar I'm not going to change your mind, but I'm not after you anyway, you were never going to see the facts (don't let them get in the way of a good story, eh?). If I encourage people to think about their beliefs then great, that's the first step.
At one time I didn't believe in God either. And I looked into it. Looking at both sides. Cuz of course that's the more scientific thing to do. The only thing that really irritates me is that you think believing in a God is foolish. Both sides of the Theist vs. Atheist argument make a good point. It's just up to you to choose which one you want to agree with. Even Dawkins says the Theistic argument makes a good argument; he just chooses not to believe it.
@HawkmanDude last time I checked the book is called 'The Case for the Creator' not 'The Debate for the Creator'. I'm guessing you wouldn't have any problem reading a book with a bunch of biased athiests trying to support their own bogus claims.
This guy is full of shit. We suffer because we are ALONE. Oh Jesus suffered? Got beat and crucified? How about dying slowly from a disease. How about growing up molested. How about a couple years in a POW camp. crucifixion is nothing. Jesus is GAY.
@MrTraumaMan Crucifixion was was the most painful form of execution of the day, in fact, it was so horrible, they couldn't do it to Roman citizens. do you relies He was whipped and battered for 3 hours until his intestines were showing? Then He was nail to a cross in a position that wouldn't let him breath! and left there for 3 more hours until He lost the strength to pull himself up and suffocated.
"Atheists must answer all 20; theists must only answer 1." Yeah, cuz the existence of pain and suffering is the only argument we have against God, right? What a hack. I can't believe this guy has a doctorate.
Ladies and Gentleman, here's Lee Strobel speaking for God once again. Amazing how this all powerful being can't even make his own You Tube video. Instead, he has to rely on idiots like this,
Worship this? I don't think so. Why would I worship a god so weak he can't even make his own video? Here's the deal God: You want me to worship you, make a video of yourself.
This man is so ignorant. How are viruses, diseases, and two headed babies the cause of human actions or is evidence of a perfect God? Pure ignorance.
Nashhinton 3 days ago
@Nashhinton YOU are ignorant. I you have read the bible then you would know the answer.
JaredsName 3 days ago
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Nashhinton 3 days ago
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@JaredsName, I am a former Christian and I have read the Bible multiple times. I just don't see how a perfect God could curse two people for eating a tree that GOD HIMSELF placed in some magical garden. Since God is omniscient and since he knew that Adam and Eve will be deceived, why did God place the tree of knowledge in the garden in the first place? God staged the fall. If God didn't curse Adam, we would still live forever and have colonized distant star systems by now.
Nashhinton 3 days ago
He still did not explain why 5 year old girls get sold as sex slaves and spend there whole life getting raped to death!
O and also that 5 year old girl was born and died a muslim and did not understand the 3 gods father Jesus and the holy goast err...1 god...ops. Guess she will burn in hell for ever! Sick
nateL1914 4 days ago
"Love must involve a choice."
And yet love of God is something indoctrinated into children, and parents are biologically conditioned to love their children on sight. Hmm.
No, Lee, it's NOT an intellectual response - particularly when you fail to define free will.
YaleBreaker 1 week ago
do you people that say "God is hate" understand that God understands EVERYTHING? taking peoples life isnt a bad thing, death isnt a bad thing. its something of beauty.
people call Christians close minded. but in fact, it appears that those who judge us are close minded.
bonniehahahaha 2 weeks ago
Hitler truly believed he was doing the right thing. He didn't think he was doing evil. Meanwhile, God sat back and watched millions upon millions of humans get slaughtered. He'll help give your christian event good weather and bless your family, but don't count on him when it comes to genocide or natural disasters.
LIGHTRONIX 2 weeks ago
Atheists don't need to answer 25 questions. We're not making an extraordinary claim, you are so the burden of proof is on you. Without even hearing the 25 questions, I already know that none of them provide evidence for God.
warren52nz 1 month ago
The children that GOD allows to suffer did not have this choice you speak of. "GOD" allows children to suffer? Innocent little children that did not choose to be raped. If he allows pure innocent children to suffer, I do not want to be friends with this GOD! If a child were being raped in front of me and I asked you to help stop it, and you said no. I wouldn't want to be your friend. That is evil, your god is evil.
ulmer1138 1 month ago
"Dr."Lee Strobel is an idiot.
metalsusa1 1 month ago
@metalsusa1 Why is he an idiot?
wannawatchu66 1 month ago
@wannawatchu66 One example would be in the video he does on evidence for the resurrection of Jesus. He sites the verse Paul uses to say 500 people witnessed Jesus after he rose.( 1 COR. 15:6 ).
I find this laughable. But Lee finds these nameless faceless "500" people who have no written testimony to be evidence.
Lee Strobel is an idiot.
metalsusa1 1 month ago
@wannawatchu66 Lee Strobel claims to be a serious investigator, involved in finding the truth about God, Jesus, Christianity, etc. When did Lee ever interview any serious working scientists or opposing Biblical scholars and get the other sides view? ( claims the bible makes that science can show to be very unlikely ) Instead he just interviews noted Christian theologians and acts like he did a fair and balanced investigation.
Lee Strobel Is an idiot.
metalsusa1 1 month ago
All your words are pointless. It doesn't matter if GOD has this great plan. If he has the power to stop the pain and suffering of innocent children and he allows these disgusting acts to continue, he is a twisted entity. What ever his plan is, it is not worth even one child being forced into prostitution and raped for years. To sit back and watch children suffering is sick and wrong no matter how you look at it!
ulmer1138 1 month ago
@ulmer1138 WHO CAUSES OUR SUFFERING NOT GOD WE DO HAS ANYONE EVER WANTED GOD AS A RULER NO NOT REALLY THE WORLD IS FALLING INTO THE POWER IF THE WICKED ONE WHO IS SATAN THE DEVIL SO GOD WILL UNDO ALL THE BAD IN THE WORLD FOREVER IT WAS NEVER THE WILL OF GOD FOR US TO SUFFER
108BEANER 1 month ago
There is no god. However if you believe he does and more specifically he is the christian god, there is a simple reason why he permits suffering. Its so he can vindicate his name. Thats right, the reason he allows millions of people to starve to death, people to be murdered, children raped and abused and the other countless obscenities in his world is because he is such an egotist that he needs to prove himself right. Worse thing is that even knowing this he still demands our worship.
hammnod 1 month ago
@hammnod Ha i love how your statement just increases my faith and just backs up the bible even more, why is murder, rape, starvation, abuse etc.. bad? by what standards are you making these judgments? what evidence do you have that there is no God? when Atheist like Hitchens couldn't prove God doesn't exist when he got smashed by William Lane Craig in a debate. Tell me what evidence do you have cuz i heard them all and i have not found one atheist to prove there is no God, Not one
thecount1216 1 month ago
@thecount1216 For you to suggest that a human being can not have an absolute morality without religion or god is just offensive. Is it because of the bibles 'moral' code that I feel sick when I read that 650 people died in floods in the Philippines or a man set his neighbor on fire over money, or is it basic human decency? But lets focus on bible standards and what your god has allowed, the thousands of years of human suffering all so he can vindicate his name? Wheres the decency in that?
hammnod 1 month ago
@hammnod dude your completely wrong let me tell you the truth the world we live in god doesnot rule but us humans under the influence of satan this is the truth that not evryone knows because of satan who would hate for you to know AND BY THE WAY WHEN THEY SAY TO SANTIFY HIS NAME WHAT IS HIS NAME ISNT IT JEHOVAH
108BEANER 1 month ago
Read or listen Bhagvad Geeta on internet and all you will come to know why there is suffering in the world, but you have to read full book or need to hear full of it to understand the concept beyond it.
vmanisham 2 months ago
"Cannot" and "had to" are terms that do not apply to a being you dare to call God. If god is omnipotent, he could have created the world without suffering, or at least very little thereof, yet allow room for love and free will. Not possible? Then he is flawed. A true good god would not create a civilization without its permission... and then burn half of it in hell.
And I suppose this answer also explains the unspeakable suffering in the animal kingdom where beasts eat each other to survive.
ArminVonLiberty 2 months ago
There is also a powerful case for the existence of Leprechauns. They have a popular breakfast cereal based on them. Even God doesn't have one of those
1963danno 2 months ago
So, there is disproportionate suffering because of the old Adam and Eve story (that couldn't possibly be true)? Utter nonsense.
HorrorIllogium 2 months ago
God could stop it all and he will very soon. But. He allows things to happen so that we will learn from our mistakes,not keep doing the same things over and over. God does not cause evil to happen,we do that ourselves because of the choices we make.
If you stopped every bad decision that your child made,never let em get one single scratch then how would that child learn what to do and what not to do?
zLOSTNOMOREz 2 months ago
@zLOSTNOMOREz
You have zero proof for such a wild and outrageous claim that a god exists...a personal god of the bible no le that enjoy brutality.
Killer0fTheSun 2 months ago
@Killer0fTheSun It's not my place to provide you with proof because no matter what you are told or shown,you will still not believe. When and if the day ever comes that seek you God with all of your heart then you will get the proof you need.
Matthew 7:8.For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.
Until then you will not have what you want,you will always be lost in the darkness of your own doubt.
zLOSTNOMOREz 2 months ago
@zLOSTNOMOREz
Way to cop out from explaining the position.And i laughed at you posting a scripture as if this will give you any creedence on your position.
Killer0fTheSun 2 months ago
@Killer0fTheSun You laughed,that's not surprising. Most people do.
As i said.It's not my place to explain anything to you.People like you have no desire to hear the truth so why wast my time. Besides.If you really wanted to know the truth, you would have done so on your own already.
zLOSTNOMOREz 2 months ago
@zLOSTNOMOREz
I did laugh...at your inability to even reason.....nevertheless your faith has ZERO truth to it...the only truth however is that faith is the single most redundant premise for humanity.
Killer0fTheSun 2 months ago
@Killer0fTheSunThe laws of conservation of mass and conservation of energy, modified by Albert Einstein's theory of mass-energy equivalence state that no thing is created nor destroyed, it merely changes form from matter to energy, and vice versa. Based on Einstein's theorem, it should not be possible for creation ex nihilo to take place.
Now,reason with one of the greatest minds in history about what is the commonly accepted justification for the non-existence of God.The Big B theory
zLOSTNOMOREz 2 months ago
@zLOSTNOMOREz
Are you still trying to make your invisible friend real?
Killer0fTheSun 2 months ago
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@Killer0fTheSun Are you still trying to make excuses for what you can not understand?
zLOSTNOMOREz 2 months ago
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@Killer0fTheSun The greatest ignorance is to reject something you know nothing about.
-H. Jackson Brown, Jr
......And that's all i got to say about that.
zLOSTNOMOREz 2 months ago
"In the real world of pain, how could one worship a God who was immune to it?"
In the real world of pain, how could one worship a God that can't make everyone immune to it?
SmallGreenPlanetoid 2 months ago
Strange how christians can study the bible and don't see all the faults and ignorance throughout the book. Wishfull thinking must be it. Oh I know lets just focus on the good parts and we'll ignore the wrong stuff cause that was for a different time or something like that...
1coffeecup 3 months ago
@1coffeecupNo not at all, faith is not supposed to be blind. There are many things to understand. I called out to God in a very desperate moment in my life. I was not a true believer but I gave God a chance and not only was I delivered from that situation but I became renewed in every way. I suffered from depression for more than a decade, all that was gone, gone in a few days. I felt so amazing! At that moment I believed. Now I know I was blind.
C13SKY 3 months ago
@1coffeecup Just give God a chance. Say a prayer with an honest open heart and ask him to come into your life and if you allow him to come into your life he will. God gives free will to choose. You wont loose anything.
C13SKY 3 months ago
@C13SKY I really have tried that and nothing changed in the way I see the bible or religion for that matter. All the things I have experienced has led me to the realization that there is no god and the bible is an amazing tool used to control the masses. I will say this in defense of the bible though: without the threat of fire in hell there probably be even more ruthless scumbags destroying lives of others or themselves.
1coffeecup 3 months ago
Religion kills
1coffeecup 3 months ago
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new song written and played live called God - Why God Why?
Click on to alwaystheway name to play.
alwaystheway 3 months ago in playlist Proof Of God - Creationist Videos
I wonder if he would still possess these sentiments, if he lived in China during the Mongol invasions? He would then acquire a good perspective on what true suffering is.
SamonMarquis 3 months ago
We have "free will" by nature, not because God gave it to us. It´s a matter of FREE WILL VS GOD´S WILL. This is the very battle that goes on in the human mind. "Free will" implies knowing BOTH GOOD AND EVIL. God does not know evil.
Once you do God´s will, you no longer have free will because you´re in "heaven", no longer knowing evil.
ruffomaldito 3 months ago
Manageable suffering is still suffering. And it's easy to say "our pain" is manageable when more than half of the world is living in poverty and millions of babies are born with diseases and deformities. I guess they all chose to be suffering?
shiya3 4 months ago
If Jesus existed forever, why would he wait until 2000 years ago to save us?
UnmaskedTuxedo 4 months ago
There is no such thing as free will. Will is not free. We cannot choose to disobey gravity, to make 2 + 2 equal 0, or to sculpt a Penrose Triangle.
UnmaskedTuxedo 4 months ago
TheDarkLordLucifer 4 months ago
also, why does the description of the video say Dr. Strobel? he isn't a doctor.
level7atheist 4 months ago
Does the Ethiopian widow, watching her children die of starvation, have a choice? Dr Strobel doesn't find her suffering repugnant because he believes a carpenter rose from the dead. Would he be happy to tell her she is suffering because his psychopathic God got angry when her ancestor ate an apple?
For a more plausible explanation of the reason for suffering, and a sensible suggestion for the meaning of your life, see the YouTube video 'God says sorry'.
lacontrabasse 4 months ago
Does the Ethiopian widow, watching her children die of starvation, have a choice? Todd Tyszka doesn't find her suffering repugnant because he believes a carpenter rose from the dead. Would he be happy to tell her she is suffering because his psychopathic God got angry when her ancestor ate an apple?
For a more plausible explanation of the reason for suffering, and a sensible suggestion for the meaning of your life, see the YouTube video 'God says sorry'.
lacontrabasse 4 months ago
Does the Ethiopian widow, watching her children die of starvation, have a choice? Todd Tyszka doesn't find her suffering repugnant because he believes a carpenter rose from the dead. Would he be happy to tell her she is suffering because his psychopathic God got angry when her ancestor ate an apple?
For a more plausible explanation of the reason for suffering, and a sensible suggestion for the meaning of your life, see the YouTube video 'God says sorry'.
lacontrabasse 4 months ago
"Atheists must answer 20 arguments and Theists must answer 1"
Er no Theist must provide positive proof whilst Atheists must counter them.
(plus there are lots of arguments against the existence of God, not just the problem of evil. Do a bit of research Strobel!)
TheOmegajuice 4 months ago
free choice doesn't effect wild fires caused by heat, and some random person who gets caught randomly, and killed.
Why couldn't that persons death not be so torturous? Why couldn't their death be w/o suffering?
I fail to see how free will effects suffering.
eivarden 4 months ago
“Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing?
Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing?
Then why call him God?”
-Epicurus
Case Closed.
level7atheist 4 months ago 10
@level7atheist Still the best and most rationnal answer to this usual nonsense. Thank you.
chapelierfoudre 4 months ago
@level7atheist You do realize that Epicurus lived from 341 - 270 BC "before Christ" and quoted "that the gods do not reward or punish humans" so he for one acknowledges that there are gods. Do your home work before you start listing off quotes from self taught philosophers, who stole their ideas from real philosophers such as Democritus.
respekitmor 4 months ago
@respekitmor And this quote could not apply to the God of the Bible how? Did I mention Christ? Why would I need to Know about the Philosopher to understand this quote? Christianity is just a religion built upon the foundations of religions before it. Christmas and Easter for example are just pagan traditions that Christianty stole. One doesen't have to know everything about epicurus to understand the truth of this quote. Something cannot possibly be omnipotent, omniscent and Omnimalevolent.
level7atheist 4 months ago
@level7atheist You need to get your "facts" straight. Judaism is the oldest religion. Then Christianity comes next from Judaism. Easter and Christmas are both holidays celebrating the birth and resurrection of Jesus christ.
respekitmor 4 months ago
@respekitmor Your Ignorance is Overwhelming. Please take the time to look up a timeline of Religion from any unbiased website, wikipedia as one exsample. Hinduism is generally considered the oldest living religion. Religions have been recorded emerging since at least 9831 BC If not sooner.
level7atheist 4 months ago
@level7atheist Hinduism is not considered a religion it is a way of life that man made up. Go back to wiki and read some more
respekitmor 3 months ago
@respekitmor You can say that about Hinduism and I can say it is the same for all regigions, christianity included. But even if Hinduism is just a way of life, Scientists have found proof of Paleolithic religion that began at the latest at around 30,000BCE.
level7atheist 3 months ago
@level7atheist Lets see it then ? post it, show me a link, and please spell check if your going to act all intelligent.
respekitmor 3 months ago
@level7atheist And Hinduism is "self described" as a "way of life" they say it themselves that they are not a religion. Nevertheless what are we arguing about? Are you saying that there is no god? or What?
respekitmor 3 months ago
@respekitmor Well that was my initial arguement, yes.
level7atheist 3 months ago
@respekitmor wikipedia... try actual research before you embarass yourself further
cattlexing 3 months ago
@cattlexing lol wiki is your only source! lol lazy lazy...
respekitmor 3 months ago
@respekitmor are you deliberately trying to misunderstand me? or is misunderstanding a default response of yours?
cattlexing 3 months ago
@cattlexing You make no sense wiki is not a credible source of info. You got an actual point to make on here? or are you just trollin ?
respekitmor 3 months ago
@respekitmor forget it, it has been lost in translation
cattlexing 3 months ago
@respekitmor Also, I appologise for my improper facts about christmas and easter. They are both Christian holidays that took some traditions from Paganism. For exsample, the Christmas tree is considered as Christianisation of pagan tradition and ritual surrounding the Winter Solstice, which included the use of evergreen boughs, and an adaptation of pagan tree worship. Same goes for eggs at easter.
Christmas wasn't even the first holiday in the winter solstice. there were at leat ten before it.
level7atheist 4 months ago
@level7atheist Thank you for your respect. I believe that the christmas tree and easter eggs came along way later for people. They just kind of incorporated it into the holidays. The real holidays are about jesus, no presents, trees, egg, or shopping spirits. sadly this is what has become the norm. You do make good points sir.
respekitmor 4 months ago
@respekitmor hinduism is older
cattlexing 3 months ago
@cattlexing Judaism Is older than Hinduism lol your not making any headway pal
respekitmor 3 months ago
@respekitmor actually, you are wrong... hinduism is older than judaism... deal with it
cattlexing 2 months ago
@cattlexing lol Ok i'm not going to argue with ignorance. Your clueless, do some homework on religion timelines.
respekitmor 2 months ago
@respekitmor i have sgt. stupid, and you are still wrong
cattlexing 2 months ago
@cattlexing lol dude show me what timeline your reading from! your ignorance its ridiculous !
respekitmor 2 months ago
@level7atheist Childish argument...give me a break please...
MrUrosSrb 3 months ago
@MrUrosSrb How is it childish? It's more thought provoking and logical than any christian arguement that has ever been posed.
level7atheist 3 months ago
@level7atheist Stop debating so much and just ask God with all your heart if he is real. Go directly to the source dont just take anybodies word.God is giving you free will to seek him or not. After all if God is real eternity is a long time.
C13SKY 3 months ago
@C13SKY I was a Christian, I thought I had found him, but I only thought I did because I wanted to beleive in him. Now that my logic has matured, I can see how absurd my ideas were.
And if god is real in the end, shouldn't someone be judged on how they lived their life rather than which god they beleived in? If God is going to send the nicest person in the world to hell for not beleiving, that is not the kind of god I want to put faith in.
level7atheist 3 months ago
@level7atheist DUDE SERIOUSLY GOD CAN HE WILL AND HE WANTS TO ITS JUST A MATTER OF TIME THATS WHY THERE NEEDS TO BE A JUDGEMENT DAY THATS WHY ITS NECESARY
108BEANER 1 month ago
@108BEANER R8BzqRvXxc4&feature=watch_response
108BEANER 1 month ago
@108BEANER How do you know he will? prove to me that he will.
level7atheist 1 month ago
@level7atheist well ou see we are made in the image of god there fore we have good cualitlies because god has good qualitlies for instince do you feel sad when you see people suffer imagine how god feels, worse if you had the power would you change things on earth even i would so be faithful that god who has the power will do it gos is good and unable to act wickedly so this isnt his fault for all thats hapening
108BEANER 1 month ago
@108BEANER Congradulations. In that horrifically under-punctuated response you have proven to me that people have feelings. You're are still making no case for God. Why do you beleive he exists? You haven't given any good reasons why you beleive he will come back for Judgement day either.
Also, the last 3 lines of your response make no sense. Please use punctuation.
level7atheist 1 month ago
@level7atheist how would you bielieve that he doesnt exist o could the universe create itself its impossible there just had to be a creator
108BEANER 1 month ago
@level7atheist how would you think that the universe was created there shouldnt there be a creator and its in the bible that god will make judgement day happen
108BEANER 1 month ago
@108BEANER There doesen't have to have a creator. That always begs the question who created god. Creationists say "He has always been." then why cant we just say the universe has always been? And why do you beleive the bible? it's an old book.
If you can't tell, I am leading you into a circular arguement.
level7atheist 1 month ago
@level7atheist DO YOU HAVE ANY SOLID PROF OF THAT. THE BIBLE IS A SPECIAL BOOK LIKE NO OTHER IT IS NEEDED NOW IN DAY WITH WORDS FROM GOD AS A GIFT TO YOU OTHER WISE WE WOULDNT KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT HIM THE BIBLE PREVENTS US FROM GETTING HURT ANY QUESTIONS.
108BEANER 1 month ago
@108BEANER Please write your responses coherently. I honestly cant take you seriously.
How do you know the bible is accurate?
why not the quaran, or book of mormon?
I think you should stop readig the bible and pick up an actually educational book. it might teach you something, like how to spell and make proper sentences.
level7atheist 1 month ago
@level7atheist Thats my problem if i dont want to use punctuation and besides you didnt answer my question. There happy its like your my mother man. free will when i need to use puntuation i will.
108BEANER 1 month ago
@108BEANER What question? how am I supposed to know what the question is or if there is a question if you don't use punctuation?
level7atheist 1 month ago
@level7atheist Oh im sorry my question is that if you have a book or something that suports your theory, I do, not only that it says what will take place, how to deal with now and day situations, and to stay out of trouble, which has pretty much worked out for me very well. It warns me of the things that i should not do, makes my life simple and clean. The words it as are used now every were in the world, for example,not to kill, not to hurt others, man did not make this teaching.
108BEANER 2 weeks ago
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@108BEANER "The words it as are used now every were in the world, for example,not to kill, not to hurt others, man did not make this teaching."
Morality doesn't come from the Bible, it's a necessary thing for a social species to exist. Morality came from Evolution.
Do you own slaves? The Bible says you can.
Have you ever worked on a Sunday? Ever eaten shellfish? The Bible says that's a sin.
We know which things to accept as moral and which to reject we don't need a 2,000 yr old book to tell us
warren52nz 2 weeks ago
@108BEANER There are thousands of books that support atheism and evolution, but none have specific rules on how to live your life because those rules are common sense. Even in the animal kingdom, civilized animals have the same rules. As well, there are several rules in the bible that we dont follow for good reasons. Only 3 of the 10 commandments are actually laws. the 2nd, 3rd, 4th, and 9th commandments have been slandered millions of times.
level7atheist 2 weeks ago
@108BEANER If we are going to discard so many of the bibles "Laws", why dont we just disregard all of them. Its not really a very good source of morality.
Natural means can describe where and why people act the way they do.
level7atheist 2 weeks ago
@108BEANER "THE BIBLE PREVENTS US FROM GETTING HURT ANY QUESTIONS."
Just one:
If that's true then how come 30 Christians were killed by Muslims on Xmas day while celebrating the birth of their lord?
Why did 7 kids from Elim Christian school get washed away their deaths by a flash flood if the Bible prevents them from getting hurt???
I know why, now let's hear your dodgy answer. 8^)
Don't be an idiot all your life!
warren52nz 1 month ago
@warren52nz jajajaja Ok first of all the bible doesnt tell people to celebrate the
birthday of jesus its all man made, its the sacrifice of jesus what we should really
apretiate. Second I meant that in a way of what choices you decide to do in your life, im sorry for not being especific. What your telling me isnt what i meant, but i have the answer to why people even christians suffer.
108BEANER 1 month ago
@108BEANER Yes, Jesus' birthday is the same as a dozen other "Messiahs", it's really to mark the shortest day and they didn't even get that quite right! But why would they, the people that wrote the Bible were Bronze age primitives who thought the Earth was flat and the Sun revolved around it pushed by God.
I'm also having trouble understanding you and don't type in CAPS, it just pisses people off.
warren52nz 1 month ago
@warren52nz Are you sure those are "Messiahs"? none did what jesus did for us and to spite the fact that his lessons we use now in day and are very usefull and amaizing what he tought others no one could have ever thought of what he said its the word of jehovah god.
108BEANER 2 weeks ago
@108BEANER "none did what jesus did for us and to spite the fact that his lessons we use now in day and are very usefull"
First of all there's no evidence that Jesus even EXISTED never mind what he may have said. Maybe you should do some research into what you believe. Not one single person that knew Jesus wrote about him, everything was written decades later. And Jesus is only mentioned in the Bible and he condoned slavery! Not many would call that good morality!!!
You've been brainwashed!
warren52nz 2 weeks ago
@warren52nz Actually he was profecised before he even arived, it was foretold that the promised messia would arrive, I dont know if ther is proof but I just believe in him for the words that really get to me and ... YOU know what if you dont believe me get your own bible see what you can find out for yourself we are just arguing over and over and im not gonna get to you by just words, we need action so try it. At least you can say you proved me wrong. if your right we are doomed!!!!
108BEANER 2 weeks ago
@108BEANER "get your own bible" That's the difference between you and me, I don't have a single book that tells me about reality, my "Bible" is the millions of books in universities around the world that claim things about reality and then invites others to try to prove them wrong. If no one can, then eventually what they claim become scientific theories and at that point you can count on them far more than you can on a book written 2,000 years ago which is full of holes and inconsistencies.
warren52nz 2 weeks ago
@warren52nz Ok so ask for a sing for the real bible like I did and got the book with the title "New world translation of the holy scripture".like I said you read it and become amazed at what was written centuries ago aplies today. No man can ever do that you havent tried it, how do know if you dont even try.
108BEANER 2 weeks ago
@108BEANER OK, you go read Dawkin's "The God Delusion" and I'll read that. I've already read most of the Bible by the way
warren52nz 2 weeks ago
@warren52nz i said it wrong ask for a sign . :*
108BEANER 2 weeks ago
@108BEANER I've asked for a sign dozens of times, I was brought up Christian. It's partly because I never had a scrap of anything that could count as a reply that I gave it up.
That and the fact that none of it makes any sense, it was really a no brainer.
warren52nz 2 weeks ago
@108BEANER Anything you can say about the Bible, I can say about any other holy book. Did you know there are over 300 man-made gods (including yours)? Starting with:
Agdistis or Angdistis Ah Puch Ahura Mazda Alberich Allah Amaterasu An Anansi Anat Andvari Anshar Anu Aphrodite Apollo Apsu Ares Artemis Asclepius Athena Athirat Athtart Atlas Baal Ba Xian Bacchus Balder Bast Bellona Bergelmir Bes Bixia Yuanjin Bragi Brahma Brigit Camaxtli Ceres Ceridwen Cernunnos Chac Chalchiuhtlicue Charun...
warren52nz 1 month ago
@warren52nz Not really the one i have warns me about false idols which mislead you or have doughts, this is the trick of satan which is mileading the entire inhabited world and making people suffer, my bible is special solves problems that we are going through now and day which no man can ever do. I know why tou have doughts god is something so increble that ours minds canot even imagine since were are inperfect.
108BEANER 2 weeks ago
@108BEANER " its the sacrifice of jesus what we should really apretiate (sic)"
I don't know. I'd be happy to die if 3 days later I got to rise from the dead and spend eternity in heaven. Doesn't sound like much of a sacrifice to me.
And anyway, I don't believe in original sin. So what if some tart ate a piece of fruit after taking advice from a talking snake, that's not my fault, fuck her.
The whole thing is fabricated and borrowed from Pagans who sacrificed goats ("scapegoat") to remove "sin".
warren52nz 1 month ago
@warren52nz Pagans seriously? well what did want to see him tortured for days or torn limb from its? its a sacrifice that needed to happen, a perfect life to pay for what adam and eve did, so god isnt unfair just for somehting you didnt do. Do not fear unless you are doing bad, otherwise be very afraid. for the apointed time is near and god will come like a tief in the night no one will know but him.
108BEANER 2 weeks ago
@108BEANER "a perfect life to pay for what adam and eve did, so god isnt unfair"
So if someone you didn't know murdered someone and the police came and arrested you for it that seems fair to you right? I didn't eat the fruit so it's not my problem. It wasn't me that took advice from a talking snake. 8^)
You've got it worse than most. Why don't you try thinking for yourself for once?
I'm guessing English isn't your first language... if it is you REALLY need to go back to school.
warren52nz 2 weeks ago
@warren52nz god is not responsable for the tragedy the world is going through, but the one who made us sin in te first place, god isnt the ruler of the world if it were things would be different from what you see now. Now you know why you suffer, dont blame god. for it the christinas dont even have the right idea of what is happening.
108BEANER 2 weeks ago
@108BEANER "god is not responsable for the tragedy the world is going through"
Well I'm an Atheist so of course I agree but that's probably the only thing I agree with you about.
But let's look at it from the Christian perspective. According to Christians, God is omniscient, that is he knows everything about the past and the future. So he knows every action every person will take forever. And he created us so how can you say he's not responsible? Tell me about "Free Will" so I can have some fun.
warren52nz 2 weeks ago
@warren52nz Ok we have free will but the demons tempt or lure us into doing exactly what god doesnt want us to do, and the only way to brake free from it is getting close to god and jesus; for satan does not have a grip on him. He is there to help us in the time of need with anything. Besides it was satan who got us into this mess in the first place.
108BEANER 2 weeks ago
@108BEANER "Ok we have free will but the demons tempt or lure us into doing exactly what god doesnt want us to do"
OK so God ISN'T omniscient because he doesn't know what's going to happen. So there's one problem with the claims about God.
Now, if he's omnipotent then he could just destroy Satan but he can't so he's not omnipotent either.
This is just TOO EASY!!!
warren52nz 2 weeks ago
@warren52nz He does, and he can with ease there is a time apointed for god to get rid of the ruler of the world and the system of thigs.
108BEANER 2 weeks ago
@108BEANER Uh Huh. And the Flying Spaghetti Monster will come along and thwart his plans.
It's all just words mate.
Look, I'm not interested in having a discussion with someone who's as brainwashed as you are. I'll have a conversation with someone who wants to talk specifics and not just spout dogma. Your spelling and grammar is really putting me off, I want to have this discussion with someone with an education.
Good luck with your pursuit of truth....
warren52nz 2 weeks ago
@warren52nz watch?v=R8BzqRvXxc4&feature=watch_response This will help and tell me what you think
108BEANER 2 weeks ago
@108BEANER That video is a load of bullshit. Here's why God allows bad things to happen:
GOD DOESN'T EXIST!
Once you "get" that, everything in this world will suddenly make sense.
Anyway the poster of that video has blocked all Atheists he's come across from commenting which makes sense too, the last thing he wants is honest scrutiny!!!
Atheist videos get high ratings and always have comments enabled, religious videos don't. Guess why that is?
warren52nz 2 weeks ago
@108BEANER But I'll tell you ONE thing that's true about god in the "omni" category and it's something you can bet your life on:
God is omni-ABSENT! You can make any effort you care to try to get God to show up or do anything measurable and it will fail every time!!!
I know why but you don't.
And warm fuzzy feelings that make you think you're experiencing god's presence are just your Ego surfacing from within your own brain.Science has already shown that prayer doesn't have any effect. I'm bored
warren52nz 2 weeks ago
@108BEANER.
NEWSFLASH!!! Homo Sapiens is a member of the family of Great Apes, we evolved from common ancestors and that PROVES that there never was a first man and a first woman. You can look it up in the dictionary... "Homo Sapiens"
So it's been proven that Adam & Eve never existed. Not liking truth doesn't change the facts!
warren52nz 2 weeks ago
@warren52nz The bible isnt spesific man it could be in a way that it doesnt say, if it were like i said,it would be a relly really loooong book but here something that suports the fact that i am trying to explain. watch?v=gigORNB5-JY&feature=plcp&context=C3fc13bbUDOEgsToPDskII5n4ZL7ucs7bbxPdL8p9k
108BEANER 2 weeks ago
Is there Free will in Heaven?? would that mean that pain and suffering is also in heaven? His argument doesn't work
vas13xtq 4 months ago 9
@vas13xtq yes there is free will, and there is no pain and suffering, only joy and happiness. Do you actually b/c there is free will there is pain and suffering? c'mon give me a break
jlmshane 4 months ago
Comment removed
vas13xtq 4 months ago
@jlmshane Strobel is claiming that there is pain and suffering in the world because god gave us free will. But, as you mentioned, there will only be joy and happiness in heaven. So this notion of pain and suffering existing because god gave us free will Strobel illustrated is flawed. So if there is free will in heaven, his argument doesn't work.
vas13xtq 4 months ago
@vas13xtq heaven is for the angels not humans a dead person is unconcient and unable to do anything in this wolrld or in any besides in heaven there is no tempations and you can see things more clearly the way god do its up to you if yoiu want to believe it
108BEANER 1 month ago
@108BEANER Will you not go to heaven if you follow christ? If so, it seems that heaven is for humans. Strobel claims in the video that the reason their is pain and suffering in the world is because god gave us free will. So if there is free will in heaven, then it follows that there is pain and suffering in heaven. Thats Strobel's logic for ya. Incoherent white noise.
vas13xtq 1 month ago
@vas13xtq ok man what makes you think we go anywere when we die the dead are unconcient and canot be helped nor can we help them as if they were sleeping thats the thing not everyone knows no heaven nor hell. but if you follow christ its everlasting life and a place along with when he returns free will we have but there is also a big temptation in this world whick is why we sin and because were not perfect
108BEANER 1 month ago
@vas13xtq try following ahat the bible says not what people think serously
108BEANER 1 month ago
LOL IDIOTS
Herticek 4 months ago
id rather watch david icke with my time
TomaCukor 5 months ago
Makes some sense somewhat.
GhostSnaipre 5 months ago
okay Dr.Strobel abuse of choice cause most of the worlds suffering, that still doesnt explain the rest of suffering, like hmm lets see babies with birth defects, suck as being retarded or any sickness, and that would in no way be affected by freedom of choice, god isnt real, and if he is hes a fuckin asshole you cant deny that
dopetoker1990 5 months ago
sorry for that last sentence, but LOLZ..........christians. Why are you supporting israel when in the talmud, the goyim is like insects to the jew?
MonkeySpecs301 5 months ago
oh btw, i think i read awhile ago, may be some can chime in, that the judeo chrstian doctrines ARE the deceit that the bible speaks of. There is just so much ancient symbolism of unverisal truths contained in the bible from other cultures that these pastors, either know or don't tell, or are just ignorant. Either way, the preachers and you followers don't seek unity amongst humans. If you guys did you would reach for fundamental teachings that have been around before you fucking jesus bs shit
MonkeySpecs301 5 months ago
christians are so simple, you guys really think we are here on earth, we die we go to heaven or hell, thats it? there are different dimensions and universes to explore and be apart of their development, since the number of universes and their size is perceived to be infinite, our eternity, our fate as spiritual beings, is to forever be intertwined with the birth death cycle of the cosmos. silly christians, go research other cultures.
MonkeySpecs301 5 months ago
It is utter crap to assert that having pain allows you to experience love. Do you have to taste bad food to know if good food tastes good?
Moppy1988 5 months ago
@Moppy1988
That's not what he said. He said you need CHOICE in order to experience love and he's speaking about the love that you GIVE out. You can't be forced to love someone. He never even claimed that you need pain to experience love because in the beginning we were created to be with God for eternity. But we messed it up.
TheJonsalazar 5 months ago
@TheJonsalazar So he gave us free will and then whinged and sulked for thousands of years because we did something that he gave us the capability to do? Even if he did exist, I wouldn't want to follow a grudge holding, hissy fit throwing god.
Moppy1988 5 months ago
@Moppy1988
Haha I'm not even going to reply to this because you already know what happened. You should also know you're distorting it to how you see fit so you won't feel like you have to follow this God. It's your defense mechanism. Wish fulfillment to the max. You're the one holding a grudge and a hissy fit because you feel like God failed in creating us.
TheJonsalazar 5 months ago
@TheJonsalazar How can I feel that your god failed at anything if I don't believe he exists?
Moppy1988 5 months ago
@Moppy1988
That's great! Stop complaining then! haha!
TheJonsalazar 5 months ago
@TheJonsalazar Why would I stop complaining? People are wasting their lives following a fairy tale and I find that to be an enormous waste of human resources.
Moppy1988 5 months ago
@Moppy1988
Why live worrying what other people believe? I think you're wasting your time and other valuable "human resources" haha!
TheJonsalazar 5 months ago
@TheJonsalazar If these people weren't believing fallacy, they could be contributing beneficially towards the human race. I consider it a productive use of my time to help convince them they are wasting their lives.
Moppy1988 5 months ago
@Moppy1988
Where's the fallacy? What is the fallacy behind Christianity; please enlighten me. Hypothetically, lets say that God doesn't exist. Would you really trust these people that believed in this fallacy to contribute something beneficially to the human race when these people were dumb enough to believe it in the first place? Probably not.. you're just wasting your own time! Trust me!
TheJonsalazar 5 months ago
@TheJonsalazar The fallacy is that god doesn't exist, duh? I'm not saying all Christians are dumb, they're just applying their thinking incorrectly.
Moppy1988 5 months ago
@Moppy1988
Believing in God is a pretty big thing. Even Paul said "If in Christ we have hope in this life only, we are of all people most to be pitied." 1 Corinthians 15:19. My question to you is why even worry if they apply their thinking incorrectly? This is certainly just a belief that someone has right? Does it bother you? It's a belief in a deity; there are many intellectuals that are Christian, and not only Christian but believe in some sort of deity. Why does it bother you so much?
TheJonsalazar 5 months ago
@TheJonsalazar Because I, unlike you, care about my fellow humans.
Moppy1988 5 months ago
@Moppy1988
I care too. Why do you think I'm spending my time arguing with you? Cuz I got nothing better to do? The only thing I can say is that arguing probably isn't going to change anyone's view. It sure hasn't changed mine. Why do people believe in God? Cuz their prayers are getting answered; they see God work in their lives. Otherwise they wouldn't believe. You aren't going to change anyone's mind by using simple minded arguments like yours. And I'm not saying that to insult you.
TheJonsalazar 5 months ago
@TheJonsalazar I'm not going to change your mind, but I'm not after you anyway, you were never going to see the facts (don't let them get in the way of a good story, eh?). If I encourage people to think about their beliefs then great, that's the first step.
Moppy1988 5 months ago
@Moppy1988
At one time I didn't believe in God either. And I looked into it. Looking at both sides. Cuz of course that's the more scientific thing to do. The only thing that really irritates me is that you think believing in a God is foolish. Both sides of the Theist vs. Atheist argument make a good point. It's just up to you to choose which one you want to agree with. Even Dawkins says the Theistic argument makes a good argument; he just chooses not to believe it.
TheJonsalazar 5 months ago
@TheJonsalazar A good argument is not equal to a correct argument. Theism is foolish if you value reason.
Moppy1988 5 months ago
@Moppy1988
You're foolish.
TheJonsalazar 5 months ago
@TheJonsalazar Good argument bro, you just lost.
Moppy1988 5 months ago
you can't have free will if god is all knowing, your life would be predestined. Fate or free will choose one.
Requiemxtoxinnocence 5 months ago
@HawkmanDude last time I checked the book is called 'The Case for the Creator' not 'The Debate for the Creator'. I'm guessing you wouldn't have any problem reading a book with a bunch of biased athiests trying to support their own bogus claims.
bxfguif 5 months ago
@HawkmanDude Have you ever read his books, which detail the evidence that led him to make the rational choice to follow Christ?
rwleif 5 months ago
This guy is full of shit. We suffer because we are ALONE. Oh Jesus suffered? Got beat and crucified? How about dying slowly from a disease. How about growing up molested. How about a couple years in a POW camp. crucifixion is nothing. Jesus is GAY.
MrTraumaMan 6 months ago
@MrTraumaMan Try it out =).
QUESTIONATORO 6 months ago
@MrTraumaMan Crucifixion was was the most painful form of execution of the day, in fact, it was so horrible, they couldn't do it to Roman citizens. do you relies He was whipped and battered for 3 hours until his intestines were showing? Then He was nail to a cross in a position that wouldn't let him breath! and left there for 3 more hours until He lost the strength to pull himself up and suffocated.
rwleif 5 months ago
I only mention that because the poster of this video calls him "Dr. Strobel", btw.
BigIdeaSeeker 6 months ago
Is Lee Strobel really a PhD now? He certainly wasn't when he made this segment.
BigIdeaSeeker 6 months ago
God loves you... He creates pain and suffering... Like a boss... :D
Bleskojd 6 months ago
Pain and suffering is allowing religious babble like this to continue.
BeBoBli 6 months ago
"Atheists must answer all 20; theists must only answer 1." Yeah, cuz the existence of pain and suffering is the only argument we have against God, right? What a hack. I can't believe this guy has a doctorate.
barrett314 6 months ago
Ladies and Gentleman, here's Lee Strobel speaking for God once again. Amazing how this all powerful being can't even make his own You Tube video. Instead, he has to rely on idiots like this,
Worship this? I don't think so. Why would I worship a god so weak he can't even make his own video? Here's the deal God: You want me to worship you, make a video of yourself.
Haroldbeavis1969 6 months ago