Even Christians are taught about personal development. Matthew 7:5 "Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye."
@tonyyut1970 I agree brother. I get tired of other people telling me my beliefs when they are ignorant of them. Let me rephrase what you said though: "sin is very big issue in Gnosticism". That is true for Gnostic Christians like myself. However, many people do not realise that not all Gnostics were/are Christians. To say: "All Gnostics believed..." is like saying "All Christians handle snakes during the service!"
@tonyyut1970 That's correct. It becomes religion or at least another denomination. A true Gnostic Christian doesn't take scriptures as infallible because they were written by people. A Gnsotic Christian goes to the source and wisdom is given as the individual can contemplate.
The time has come for us all to seek truth and stop tolerating deception and division. Only the truth can stop the wars and make the world the paradise it can be. Search for "Truth Contest" in Google and click the 1st result, then click on "The Present" to open it. What it says will transform us and our world.
Thanks man. I am starting to realize that Gnostism is the way I'm going to go. I believe what they believe. Modern-day gnostism is what I believe. I do not believe Jesus was fully divine like the early gnostics believed. I believe he was fully man. Knowledge is the way to salvation. Not believing a man 2000 years ago died for your sins
that'sa good distinction: Christianity and Gnosticism are Contrary (not both true) but not necessarily Contradictory (one true one false).
People may choose which to follow, a Docetic view that all matter is evil or illusory, Christ only appeared to be flesh; or the view of Christianity taught by the Apostles, that Christ came in the flesh, that he was crucified, died, was buried, and rose on the 3rd day. They cannot both be true. Gnosticism and Christianity are incompatible,
Of course "the church" would dismiss gnosticism. The irony is, that just like science and religion, they're both right....in their way. Gnosticism doesn't cover everything just like traditional Biblical religion doesn't either. So they can both be wrong, too...in their way. Each needs to have the wheat separated from the chafe and it can only be accomplished by the individual. "Seek and ye shall find." "These things I do, you can do. Greater things than these can you do."
Wright's attempt to drive a wedge between Gnosticism and Early Christianity highlights (again) his inaccurate presumptions about what Jesus considered the kingdom of God to be. He makes Christianity into a post 1st Century form of Judaism. In reality, the development of ideas from the Dead Sea Scrolls through the Gospels into 2nd Century Gnosticism is quite tracable and shows that there is actually only a fine line between Christianity and the 'hidden' things of Gnosticism.
@mark1v15 What's it like believing in ancient fairy tales, awaiting the return of a cult leader (that never existed) and living a life of delusion? I'm just trying to understand the mind of a schizophrenic... sorry, I mean christian.
@mrbigblacknutz Watched 5s of your own video - sufficient to see that you are utterly ignorant about the Bible and bredth of 'Christian' understanding. Imagine that all the blokes YOU knew were under 5ft tall. It would be ignorant to tell ALL men they are too short to play basketball based on YOUR narrow experience, but your accusations against 'Christians' are just as narrow.
Go ahead--study Marcion, study the actual ideas of the early gnostics. The mysterious unknown seems enchanting, especially when you have been told it has been somehow "repressed." No, it wasn't repressed; it was dismissed as nonsense. It is nonsense.
@bdrhetoric The entire continuum of Pythagoreanism, Hermetism, Neoplatonism and the various sects that the Church fathers called "Gnostics" are the correct forms of religiosity. Judaism and Christianity are nonsense, and are incorrect.
Though the Nag Hammadi texts (which are quite diverse; Sethian, Valentinean, Hermetic, Neopythagorean) have been hijacked by lame New Agers (and will continue to be), they are still superior. Study Valentinian cosmology and the Trinity becomes absurd.
@bdrhetoric "No, it wasn't repressed; it was dismissed as nonsense"-- Yes, dismissed by orthodox Christians, who had to slander these sects and their ideas to dismiss them. If you tell a lie about someone, it is easier to push them out of view. Interestingly, the same tactics were used by the Christians when they became hegemonic that imperial Rome once used against Christians.
What he says at around 2:30 is false. Bart Ehrman doesn't think that gnosticism was part of the true historical life of Jesus. Ehrman thinks Jesus was a Jewish apocalyptic, predicting the end times in his generation, i.e. the coming of the PHYSICAL kingdom of god, then and there.
This is found everywhere in his books as well as in his historical Jesus series here on youtube, especially in part 14 / 24.
1 Timothy 6, 3-6 If anyone teaches otherwise and does not agree to the sound instruction of our Lord Jesus Christ and to godly teaching, they are conceited and understand nothing. They have an unhealthy interest in controversies and quarrels about words that result in envy, strife, malicious talk, evil suspicions and constant friction between people of corrupt mind, who have been robbed of the truth and who think that godliness is a means to financial gain.
Cannot be! 1 Timothy 1, 3-4 As I urged you when I went into Macedonia, stay there in Ephesus so that you may command certain people not to teach false doctrines any longer or to devote themselves to myths and endless genealogies. Such things promote controversial speculations rather than advancing God’s work—which is by faith.
What happend to the Katharen ? Yeah christians are a bunch of peace loving softies. Proof of that in historie al around. You sad people you. In dutch this is called a gotspe. A brutallity. Come on man. Ever heard of pius 10 he litterly clamed that that the only right we have is to listen and obey. You regonise a three by its fruit. That means in the case of orthodox christtianity that the only wise thing to do is to wipe it out with root and all. ( the gnostic, non violent way that is.)
@amandaknocks Too judgmental to be sovereign?? Do you read what you write before hitting the post button or do your fingers move faster than your brain? Let me tell you something you fascist twat, Greece is it's own country with its own reliigon and its own laws. We fought 9 years against the Turks to get our freedom from oppression and we lost more people by the Nazis due to rebellion than any other occupied country during WWII. Greeks are independent people. Stick your EU in your ASS!!!!
but gnosticism isnt popular, christianity in its normal form of looking for saviour being reddemed etc is still the more popular form and to be perefectly honest that is far less challenging than the process of self-discovery.
@amandaknocks I didn't say everything that is not Christian is from Satan. I said Gnosticism is from Satan. You obviously are ignorant of how Greeks do things. Greece is not western europe that gives anybody citizenship. We have already started to start mass deportations of illegal immigrants in Greece. Also, You don't know a fucking thing about my country so you are in no position to comment on whether it needs to be saved or not. Stick your fascist EU in your ass.
@amandaknocks My opinion against damnable heresies are analogous to somebody who kills over 90 people? You're a troglodyte. Also, you are the fascist here so you have more in common with him than i do. You probably helped him plan it you gestapo twat.
@Rotebuehl1 Gnosticism both transcends and OPPOSES normative Christianity. Paul was more Gnostic and anti-Jewish than most Christians realize. He is generally read through the distorting lens of later Church dogma.
Gnosticism is about Gnosis (Self-Knowlege) and not blind belief in supposed historical happenings.
@Rotebuehl1 Yes, exactly. though one does not need to leave the gospels of the Bible; simply come to understand the ARAMAIC words of Jesus and the Hellenism of Paul.
I was in your shoes back in 1989. I was "converted" to Christianity back in 81, and attended an evangelical church. I was an evangelist, trained by Vic Jacobson (friend of Cliff Richard) in the school of EE. I attended an evangelical college (Oak Hill) 88-91. Then I gradually came to see the LIGHT.
@02Blackbeard "LIGHT"? What light? IF "normative Christendom" is a lie, works of people like fallacious Elaine Pagels and buddhist, gnosticist, theosophical Anna Kingsford are truthful? One rejects the Bible and start to believe in oeuvres of some ladies? Didn't you get my ironic tone in the first place? Peace be with you and all the best
PS: b.t.w., with all due respect, Cliff Richards isn't an acceptable reference for me. I had the mixed blessing of having met him personally some years ago.
@Rotebuehl1 The Inner Light. George Fox? All the valuable thinkers of Christianity were thought, by the Church, to be heretics....Eckhart, Boehme, Pordage, Kingsford, Karadja et al.
Normative Christianity is wrong on just about every philosophical point. It believes in a load of crap like creation ex nihilo, free will as "could have done otherwise", an eternal Hell.....the list goes on and on. RCism and Evangelicalism is "based" on blind faith. True religion is Gnostic (Knowledge based).
I won't argue! All I wnated to say/write, i said/wrote! I'm not a missionary and it's not my pigeon, whether someone wants or not to believe, think, act otherwise! But I have to tell you, that, in our times, we all accept, that one's "freedom ends, where the freedom of others start"! I wouldn't dare trying to convince you, but don't you all dare trying to impose yourselves either! Times past were awful because of the church(es)? Cool! That's history! Now we deal with each other!
@02Blackbeard I definitely don't! One other thing, is valueing a person that might or not be a gnostic, depending, of course, on whether that person seems earnest or not! I will never go as far, as to disesteem a gnostic person by principle! But I make my point clear: gnosticism is a path to fake knowledge! If someone wants to go that way, that's his or her decision! I wouldn't question his/her free decision! But as long as a gnostic challenges my path, I'll challenge his! Just as simple!
@02Blackbeard I have a contempt with pretensions of knowledge in matters religious! Yes I do! Man trying to reach God by his own, shirking that it is God Who reaches man, is innacceptable! That Gnosis means knowledge is love of words! That's not what Gnosis means in this context! Of course one cares to achieve knowledge! That's what one does all life long, if one has a sound mind and an inquiring spirit! But, religiously, gnosis & its misteries are fake, vain, cirumventive & baleful!
@Rotebuehl1 You only believe that because geeks like Tom Wright have told you thus. And don't forget that Wright, as an Anglican Bishop, is living off the fat of the land at your expense.
@02Blackbeard Aw, c'mon! Now you're quibbling, mate! I'm sure you don't need that, as you're most certainly a bright mind, with all that knowledge, aren't you? Esoterics, spirituality and knowledge of hidden truths is ungodly! I remark one last time: God has revealed to us Who He is! He is Holy and One! Not one's "inner" dim lamp is light, but God is! He revealed us His will and that quite clearly! He's not a hidden God! You might not accept that! Ok, fine! It's down to you! I'm not holy either
@02Blackbeard I most certainly am not at all interestet in "this"! Never, ever! That is for certain! As for all those that prefer self chosen ways, the so-called "challenge of self-discovery", I can only say: good luck and may God be with you all days of your life and have mercy upon us all! Yes, I am definitely "unready for this"! But I suggest: do some Scriptures reading, over and over again! You're not scared of the Scriptures, are you? They have lots of material fit for "self-discovery"!
@02Blackbeard P.S. Your comment ""at your expense" does not mean yours, personally." was spammed! Please believe me, it wasn't me who spammed your comment! Just found out now! Can't understand, why people do that, just because they don't like what they read! I reiterate: it wasn't me who spammed your comment!
@02Blackbeard I'm not Anglican, I'm not an Englishman, I don't have to pay church taxes at all & I don't even live in Britain! That shot missed the target! But now I'd ask you kindly, what makes you presume, one is solely depending on the opinions of others, unable to bring forward own arguments? That's neither true, nor very polite, is it? If I remember well, I didn't offend you in any of my replies, did I? If I, by any chance, did, please accept my apologies! Discourse, not reflex, is needed!
@KBThunder5 What does "true" gnosticism even mean? One might as well say "true" santa claus explains everything, and then present ones own ideas about santa claus as "true" (from the convenience of english language translations) - and completely ignore anything that contradicts that personal, eccentric "truth".
@KBThunder5 "Gnostic" means: "To Know"... as in to know Yeshua/Jesus (Logos) and Holy Spirit (Sophia) personally. If one can personally know, what need is there for clergy? So can you understand why the Church sees us as a threat? Jesus didn't tell us to go to church, he told us to BE the Church. Church institutions are businesses. The Gospel of Thomas predates the Gospels in the cannon. I left mainstream Christianity for Gnostic Christianity with no regrets.
@astrofrk, Gnosticism is dead and the gospel of Thomas doesn't predate the authentic gospels. The materials in the gospels give them a dating before the 2nd Century. We have P66 and P75 fragments of John dating to 125 A.D. and exhaustive quotes from the Early Church fathers from around that era. Textual criticism has already demonstrated that this book relies heavily on narratives from the 4 gospels meaning that this work is much later and a forgery at best, it cannot withstand harsh TC.
@LogosTheos You are talking to a Gnostic Christian telling him he doesn't exist, good luck. How do you proove my faith doesn't exist? At one time we WERE nearly wiped out by mainstream Christians slaughtering men, women and children to prove they had a more Loving God and you say I'M not for real"? Thomas was written as early as 50AD, as much as 15 years before Mark, the earliest Gospel. If you think Thomas relies heavily on the four Gospels in cannon, you never read the Gospel of Thomas.
@astrofrk, Your lying now, why are you lying brother? Gnostics were never wiped out by slaughter, that's a lie and I challenge you to provide documentary evidence of this either by providing 2nd Century quotations or credible patristic and general historians. What makes your assertion Ironic is that the Roman authorities were persecuting Christians for not adhering to the other pagan philosophies along with their binitarian monotheism. Gnostics on the other hand sastified romanism....
@LogosTheos Why are you calling me and historians liars? Ever heard of the Cathars? Ever heard of the Inquesition? Want proof of dates? Try earlychristianwritings website for a start. Then I can continue with biblical scholars and historians. I learned from Dr. Jay Forrest, who left mainstream Christianity from what he learned. Not all Gnostics are Christian, so SOME were not killed by the Romans. It is the Church that adhered to the Romans in the end. I am not a binitarian Gnostic.
@astrofrk, I'm calling you a liar until you can prove that textual critics date the gospel of Thomas to 50 A.D., I'v NEVER heard of that from any scholary work, neither from conservatives such as Dr. Bruce Metzger nor liberals like Bart Ehrman.
@LogosTheos I said "As early as 50AD". I also said 50-140AD. None of the texts have exact dates and if you know as much as you say, you know I am correct. I TOLD you to go to the earlychristianwritings website and if you refuse to look at it, that's your fault, not mine. This is confirmed with the Jesus Seminar. If you refuse to even look at the evidence, not even Jesus can help you.
140 A.D. is plausible but I have no idea where you got 50 A.D. from. Also I have a WHOLE volume of Christian writings from the first 800 years so don't ask me to look it up, im not an amatuer. Gnostics were not killed since they easily intergrated themselfs with Romanism and pagan philosophy unlike Christians who refused to give reverence to any other than the Father and the Son in a binitarian montheistic fashion.
@LogosTheos I meant read earlychristianwritings website, that's one source of my dating. Many Gnostics were not killed by the Romans, they were later killed by people like you! You can deny the inquesition and the Cathars all you want but anyone can look it up. Your church tortured and killed men, women and children in the name of God. I can understand the Roman Empire better than I can undertand the Inquesition, the Romans were Pagans.
But Jesus himself warned us of religious institutions.
@astrofrk, "they were later killed by people like you! You can deny the inquesition and the Cathars all you want but anyone can look it up. Your church tortured and killed men, women and children in the name of God"
>>Typical erroneous assertions from people who don't have a clue about patristic history. You said John was a Gnostic Christian, you are nuts to think that, do you see how he utterly refuted by the power of Christ the gnostic concept docetism in 1 John Ch. 4?
@LogosTheos I already told you, I believe Yeshua was a HUMAN! The Logos within him was not. The Logos within Yeshua was around at the creation of the earth as written in The Gospel of John Ch. 1, vs 1-5. Yeshua (Jesus) was THE WORD. Will you please stop telling me what I believe and listen when I am telling you my beliefs? I know what I believe, you do not!
@astrofrk, continue....Gnostics adhered to mysticism and other pagan philosophies along with Christianity causing them to avoid persecution. Gnosticism astrofrk...if you read Colossians and 1 John you would know that it is being refuted by Paul the apostle and the beloved disciple. Paul refuted the Aeon godheads while John refuted docetism which was another heretical gnostic view that asserted Christ had no flesh. Also you lied when you said Thomas dates to 50AD I had to chuckle...
@LogosTheos I am mystic only in that I believe in the Holy Spirit (Sophia). I do not believe in the Demiurge. You are stereotyping me as though all Gnostics are alike. Did I say "All mainstream Christians handle snakes?"
Valentinian Gnostic Christianity is based on Yeshua, Paul and Valentinus. I recognise Colossians & 1st John if you would be specific. When did I say Yeshua didn't have a body? Thomas dates from 50-140AD read it. You keep calling me a liar and I have not, false witness...
@astrofrk, I am aware of the various Christologies of the gnostics. So you follow Valentinian Gnosticism? I suggest you read Irenaus the Bishop of Lyons 2nd Century work "Against Heresies" which refutes Valentinian thought to expose the falsehood. Irenaus was a disciple of Polycarp who in turn was a disciple of John himself in the flesh, Irenaus was also murdered for professing Christ. Paul refutes Gnosticism in Colossians so their is not way he would support such heretical beliefs.
@LogosTheos I have read Against all Heresies, thank you. Iranius conformed to the church, not Paul. Valentinus was a 2nd generation student of Paul, which gives him at least as much credibility at Iranius. Valentinus almost became Pope and would have if not for Iranius. For the 2nd time I ask: Where in Collossians
@astrofrk, You said you read Irenaus' work "Against Heresies" but you asserted that Irenaus conformed to the church and not Paul? Pauline soteriology is present in his writings? extensive quotations of Paul's epistles? Pauline Christology and language usage also?
@LogosTheos What needs to be undertood is the writings. The Gnostic Christians took writings in a different way than the Roman Church. We can argue meanings forever but it only backs historical facts. Pauls belief in Salvation and the church was somewhat different from Peters. You listen to Peter, I listen to Paul. Pauline Christology and language usage also!
@astrofrk, Drop this "Roman Church" stuff, I do not adhere to Romanism or Roman Catholic doctrine, I am a protestant who subscribes to the solas. Please get off the Da Vinci Code/Zeigeist kool-aid with the "Roman Church did this" and "they hid that" this is typical language of someone ignorant of history . They were not the only Church at that time and still aren't today. You had more refutations of Gnosticism from the original Greek Churches founded by the apostles.
@LogosTheos I also used to be protestant. Protestants follow the same bible and many philosophies created by the Roman Catholic Church from Constantine. I have read many books and I have gone far beyond Davinci Code and Zeitgeist and that's why you are getting upset.
@astrofrk, "Protestants follow the same bible and many philosophies created by the Roman Catholic Church from Constantine"
What!? Can you provide any documenation or scholarship for this? Here we go with the Constantine myths again, it's sad, all the man did was legalize Christanity and tried to unit the Greek East during the controversy with Arius. Now you have fraud making all kinds of goofy myth "Constantine invented Jesus", "Constantine invented the Trinity", 'He did this and that"..
@LogosTheos It was under Constantine in the Council of Nicaea in 325AD, the Roman Church accepted four gospels and rejected the othe gospels and accepted most of the rest of the NT.. I will admit that the modern bible used by most protestants wasn't compleated until the 1600's but it is based on the same. When did I say Constantine invented the Trinity? Did I not tell you the Theos=God, Logos=Yeshua and Sophia=The Holy Spirit? I believe in the same trinity as YOU!
@astrofrk, Paul's theology isn't different from Peter because Paul got it from Peter! Have you not read Galatians 1:15-19? "Then after three years I went up to Jerusalem to visit Cephas and remained with him fifteen days. But I saw none of the other apostles except James the Lord's brother.” (Galatians 1:18-19). Paul used the Greek word "historeo"(visit) which literally means not only to visit but to obtain information from. Secondly this is the most absurb claim you have made thus far...
@LogosTheos So please explain the differences between Valentinus and Iranius? There were conflicts: Peter once believed one had to first be a Jew before becoming a christian. It was Paul who went to the gentiles when Peter would not. Peter strongly questioned Pauls authority because Paul was not a disciple and had never met Yeshua before he died. They had a major dispute over eating animals used in sacrifice to idols when visiting a Jewish-Christian church. Peter back-peddled.
@astrofrk, It's Irenaus, Irenaus was a disciple a of Polycarp Bishop of Smryna who in turn was a disciple of John. Irenaus followed what the apostles passed down and he was influenced by others who were alive during the the missions of the apostles, he died for his faith like Polycarp before him. Valentinus was a demon-inspired heretic who made of myths about Christ to find consistency with his hellenistic philisophical views, just like Marcion.
@LogosTheos Valentinus almost became the Pope. Marcion? That's another issue and I'm typing enough. Valentinus was a student of Theudas who was a student of Paul. Irenaus didn't start attcking Valentinus until after Valentinus died. At the time, Valentiniuns were often members of the church. Afterwords nearly all Gnostics were killed because of what Iranius started. At the time of Valentinus, there were no such thing as "Gnostic Christians" as they were just fellow Christians.
@astrofrk,...Their is not theological conflict with Peter and Paul's epistles! And this is the first time I heard this from anyone! As far as beliefs go you told me you were Gnostic so don't get angry at me because I represent Gnostic beliefs more accurately than you do. Leave that darkness and embrace Christ as Lord, turn from the error of pride in your own knowledge other than Christ, come to light in Jesus name!
@astrofrk,...Their is not theological conflict with Peter and Paul's epistles! And this is the first time I heard this from anyone! As far as beliefs go you told me you were Gnostic so don't get angry at me because I represent Gnostic beliefs more accurately than you do. Leave that darkness and embrace Christ as Lord, turn from the error of pride in your own knowledge other than Christ, come to light in Jesus name!
@LogosTheos A pastor molested me when I was nine and you want me to FOLLOW clergy as a guide to Yeshua? Yeshua is within me as stated in Luke and Thomas and you have no place judging me, no controll over me! I follow the words of Yeshua and the guidence of Sophia (Holy Spirit) and you call that darkness because I won't put the words of men over the words of them? You are my brother in Yeshua, stop judging my kind. Only Love will unite.
@LogosTheos But that was the greatest reason the Gnostics were such a threat. We did not recognise any clergy or the church as an institution. That is why we were wiped out. I don't follow Sola Scriptura either. I follow Gnosis, a direct line of communication to the Pleroma. The Bible is not infallible as it was written by men, I would rather hedge my bets on the Holy Trinity that you just called Satanic.
@astrofrk Gnostic in the first century sound very much like American Protestants today. Don't recognise clergy, don't trust established church institution etc Puritanism has colluded with Gnosticism without knowing it. And Puritanical ideology is inherent in American evangelicalism - whether you are talking conservative or charismatic. American Protestantism, with its rapture, doctrine of total depravity, immortality of the soul etc really colludes with Gnosticism.
@brendos444 You are correct to a point. Protestants do have clergy (Pastors) but they don't give thier clergy as much power as the Roman Catholics. The Protestants have church buildings, the Gnostics met in homes and considder the Church is within. The Rapture is not a Gnostic belief, nor is it in any scriptures. I would be closest to the Penticostals but still very different. I accept other paths to salvation as valid as long as it is a path of Love to God.
@astrofrk Rapture isn't a Gnostic belief but it is in the same kind of spirit. Escape from this world to a heavenly, spiritual existence. Perhaps neo Platonism would be a better characterization.
@brendos444 The Penticostals got the mysic side of Yeshua right but missed the point: With Yeshua within and the Holy Spirit (Sophia) speaking to the soul... why would one need man-made institutions to tell one how to they are allowed to live? Yeshua didn't woo man-made religious institutions, he called them "Vipers" and cleared out the money-grabbers within them. The religious institutions had Yeshua killed and if he were to come to earth today, perhaps they would do it again.
@astrofrk There are a lot of similarities with Protestantism in your statement. The anti-establishment mentality. I disagree with the Gnostic world view. The Messiah led a thoroughly Jewish movement who were looking for the redemption of the world, not only humanity. This is Christianity. Christianity is not a private spiritual experience. When Jesus rode into Jerusalem on a donkey, this was a highly political statement.
@brendos444 Perhaps we can agree to disagree but in a respectfull manner. I see Christianity as a very personal matter. The gospels in the cannon can support both perspectives, it just depends on how one reads it. I was once a music minister at an Assemblies of God church and I spent decades in mainstream Christianity. The scriptures were written by men trying to explain God but God is more than humaity will ever understand and far more than political understanding.
@brendos444 Mainstream Christianity is often limited to understanding God because there is more of God than can be written in all books combined, much less one. One way to even start is by going directly to the source and even then, one is limited by ones capacity of understanding. Anyone seeking God through Love is on the right track, regardless of ones religion. Gnostic Christians are often seen as half Christian, half Buddhist. We can learn from all faiths that seek with Love.
Yes and that is why Eastern Orthodox and Catholics don't subscribe to the Protestant doctrine of sola scriptura. I've been told that an Eastern Orthodox service is deeply mystic. They have big emphasis on the Holy Spirit and the love of God. Christianity doesn't contradict anything that is good in other religions. But the true Chrisitan faith is about the restoration of the world thru Israel's Messiah, Jesus the Christ. Gnosticism does not have this political and cosmological dimension
@brendos444 Correct. Gnostic Christianity does have similarities with the Eastern Orthodox, although I have never been to an Eastern service, so I cannot say. Yeshua never called himself the Messiah of Jewish prophecy. We identify with the same guy you do, we just see a different identity. Mainstream Christianity may not contradict the good in other religions but they condemn those who follow other religions to hell. Gnostic Christians do not. With the Love of Yeshua and Sophia..
@astrofrk I would say the Eastern Orthodox Christianity is fundamentally opposed to gnosticism. The doctrine of the church is very much rooted and grounded in the material world. The Iconography, the sacraments, the priest's vestments etc. Orthodoxy is rooted in the Incarnation of Christ and the hope of resurrection. Gnosticism is about escape from our physical bodies to a more spiritual realm.
@brendos444 You are correct over the material side of the Eastern Orthodox but there are also similarities. For instance: The Gnostic Christian view of the mystic side of the Eucharist is much closer to the Eastern Orthodox. The Roman Church believes in a physical transformation of the bread and wine while the protestants see it as a symbolic ritual. I say: "Neither!" I think many Christians believe in an escape from our physical bodies to a more spiritual realm after death.
@astrofrk Yes many Christians do believe in an escape from physical bodies to a more spiritual realm. But this is not the ultimate future. The resurrection is the ultimate hope. Many Christians have imagined that going to heaven when we die is the be all and end all. They are colluding with gnosticism. This was never the Orthodox Christian belief
@astrofrk, You are my brother in Christ not in Gnosticism which distorts along with other worldy religions the true grace of Jesus Christ our Lord and Savior.
@LogosTheos Well there it is: I say man-made church institutions distort Jesus to the point that I only refer to him as "Yeshua". I feel your Jesus has been made into a hatefull God that creates people just to torture them for all eternity. You say the opposite. If you see me as a brother in Christ, perhaps we can agree to disagree with the rest. I hope you also feel that the most important factor is Love, just as Paul said in 1 Corinthians 13. If so, the Kingdom is near for both.
Thomas is dated to the middle of the 2nd Century, not 50AD! There is no data or scholary support for this from either side of textual criticism (conservative and liberal). I have read the gospel of Thomas have you? Which version? Arabic infancy? Coptic? Greek? As a matter of fact how man apocryphal works have you read? Do you know their are many others each having varying christologies?
@LogosTheos I already responded over the Gospel of Thomas. If you read Thomas, why did you tell me it "relies heavily on narratives from the 4 gospels" when it does not? Most of what is written in the Gospel of Thomas is not quoted anywhere in the cannon. I have read dozens of apocryphal books but I only recognise eight of them, five are Nag Hammadi. I recognise 17 books in the cannon. Now, where in the Bible does it tell me to go to a church institution and have clergy speak for God?
@LogosTheos There are some comparisons that can be made with Thomas. The 4 Gospels in the cannon repeat each other far more times, even word-for-word and you KNOW that. However, Thomas is much more independant in many of its EARLIER teachings. John was a Gnostic Christian but his gospel dates from 90-120AD (earlychristianwritings website). I ask anyone following this to read The Gospel of Thomas and decide for themselves who is deceiving: Gnostic Christians or the Catholic Church.
@amandaknocks The EU authorities?? Woah, sort of like the Nazi Gestapo you fascist scumbag? Gnosticism perverts the teachings of Christ. Therefore it is from Satan. Fuck the EU. We don't have EU "authorities" in Greece. We have our own sovereign police you Nazi. Aren't you late for your Waffen SS meeting?
@dobrinin Gnosticism is about goodness? No, you are sadly mistaken. Gnosticism is from Satan. Gnosticism is the antithesis of what Christ taught. Do not be ridiculous.
@AegeanKing christanity as made to its present day popularity by Paul, is a antithesis of what christ taught! christ didn't want another religion named after his teachings, he said it several times on top of that Paul somehow just converts to christianity over night & becomes a preacher???
NT Wright says that scholars like Bart Ehrman claim that the Christianity in the Gospel of Thomas was the real early Christianity, and that the 4 canonical gospels try to cover it up. Actually, Bart Ehrman thinks that the Gospel of Thomas post-dates the 4 canonical gospels.
Why must gnosticism be attacked (or re-murdered, as if a risen Christ)? It couldn't have anything to do with the fact the church is horrified by gnosticism's message that one doesn't need churches of wood and stone and gold? Christ is the word and the word has risen again; despite the best attempts to destroy it.
@holidaygolight If you think the Church means buildings, you are seriously mistaken. It means the people who believe in Jesus the Christ and His message. Jesus, to Peter, said that the gates of Hell would not prevail against His Church. If the Gnostics are correct, then the gates of hell prevailed from the beginning. Gnosticism, to me, seems a cheap dilution of Christ's message by people who prefer to reject a need for personal repentance and change and to take up their cross and follow HIm
@dabliss101 I assume you are refering to the gnostic interpretation of the crucifixion as a human sacrifice to an evil god (Satan). The interpretation of Satan as lord over this world exists in the canonical gospels-- it is Satan's to offer to Christ when he tempts the later in the desert.
God does not need us and we are filthy to him because we have sined. ISAIAH 64:6 But we are all like an unclean thing,And all our righteousnesses are like filthy rags; We all fade as a leaf, And our iniquities, like the wind, Have taken us away. WE NEED FORGIVENESS.
I am a Gnostic Christian. Accoring to many scholers, the Gospel of Thomas predates the connonised gospels. I do not believe in priests/pastors because it is Yeshua (Jesus) and the wisdom of Sophia (Holy Spirit) within that leads to the kingdom. This is why the Church wiped the Gnostic Christians out. Forgiveness is very important to my beliefs. Paul taught that the most important factor is Love and he founded Gnostic Christianity. It IS personal and cannot be put into one set of beliefs.
@astrofrk Exactly, I would challenge anyone to show that in the Gospel of Thomas it says kill non believers, a witch or an infadel.Its all about love and the divine spark within.
@zaxtar The church institutions have always seen Gnostic Christianity as a threat, hence, the inquesition. Gnostic Christianity is the only hope Christianity has left. Mainstream Christianity is dying at the church level, especially the Catholics. People are looking away from clergy and asking who this Jesus dude is for themselves. That is how Christianity should be. "Christian" means "Christ-like", not "pope-like, preist-like, preacher-like", interaction with the Logos is direct.
@adomjask Ok. But you give the impression you are a seeker of spiritual truths and a hater of hypocrisy, like I am. Sorry if I 've misinterpreted your messages. Take care. John
@dexietable Im very new to utube, as u can see from my profile, which shows my pic and info about me (have u not looked at it?)... anyway theres more info about me on it than most ppl on this site show about themselves! I find utube a bit scary, n im still learning how to communicate with ppl on it. Sorry if I dont know how to use this medium correctly! Ur profile says nothing about u except ur age and ur from USA! So u r an enigma 2 me. How can I rspond to an enigma? haha!
@adomjask . Sorry Jeremy (?)... I thought I read ur name as Danny on ur profile b4. Have you changed it? haha! Do u want 2 giv ur email add? Its a bit dangerous on this public site, but you can delete it the next day, as I will email u as soon as I see it. I am new to utube so I dont know how safe it is to have conversations on it... u know what I mean? Iv been to USA few times, so where r u? I go2 India half the year. If u r a genuine seeker then I cd teach u a lot, if u want. Just ask ok?
@adomjask . Cont... I now have the same problems with all churches and other religions as Jesus did. They didn't believe him then, and they don't believe me now. But Revelation makes it clear there should be thousands of others like me in this present time and Age, who know their True Mother and Father in Heaven. Tell me more about yourself (not on youtube). Are you on Facebook?
@adomjask Thankyou Danny. I really appreciate you believing me. I pray God will bless you for that. I'm sure you will start to feel better "inside" as God touches you in ways only you will understand. I don't expect you to have the same spiritual experiences as me, although why not? It will blow your socks off if it happens to you! So keep in touch. It happened to me a year after my heart was broken by my family... see next message...
@adomjask Ok. No problem. I dont really know why I call myself a gnostic except that the Gospel of Thomas and the NHL are called gnostic gospels! Hence if I understand them, then I must be one right? I can't associate with any Church, RC or Protestant or New Age or whatever... they are all wrong and do not follow the Real Jesus. I just know that the words of Jesus in Thomas' Gospel are True. They prove my sanity. I thank God for Jesus, the greatest man who ever lived.
@adomjask Why are you swearing? And no I have nothing whatsoever to do with any organisations or churches or people who call themselves gnostics. I have found none worthy. I have yet to meet a genuine gnostic. I will know when I do.. 'cos we will be Brothers of Jesus. Revelation is unfolding just as God planned. All I can do is observe it happening... and speak out when I can't stand the lies any longer, just as I'm doing here.
Read M1 first. M2: E.g. I can describe in great detail the last line of logion 50. I've searched the world for any artistic work down the centuries that may portray what I've been shown, and portrays "the marriage place" mentioned in logion 75. I've found nothing remotely similar, nor anything as beautiful and as blissful as the sign of the Father (and Mother). Only another Gnostic could relate to my description.... in fact we would be able to finish each other's sentences in its description.
Read this Message 1 first: Thankyou for your reply. Of course, about 80% of the gospel can be interpreted accurately, since 60% of it is already in the NT. I'm talking about the logia 50, 101, 104, 105, 80, 75, 83 and 84, especially. I also understand your comment that it may be despisable to the reader, viz logion 70's meaning. However, there is no accurate interpretation of those logia above, except "interpretations" BY PEOPLE... they are not from first hand gnosis or "divine intervention"...
@adomjask Well, yes....many of these neo-gnostic churches are developed by "wandering bishops" who boast of an apostolic succession in the RC sense. I've been down that road. It's another dead-ender.
The wandering bishop churches are full of paedophiles and criminals. Best avoided.
The speaker has no idea that the Gospel of Thomas is only for enlightened souls (christs)... i.e. Baptised by the Holy Spirit in a True way... eg it describes God's Seal, the sign of the Father, in logion 50. Thus, he could never understand its controversial sayings. What this gospel DOES DO is expose the ignorance, hypocrisy and deceit within the Church. This gospel is succour for those who have genuinely been touched by God. There is no place for christs in Christianity today.
@Rotebuehl1 I'm an anarchist pantheist. I have no belief in any "personal" God. The Church has created God or Gods in its own image. God is an Egregore.
I hold to a Promethean Gnostic vision of the world. The Jewish God is the Demiurge, and Christians adopting Jewish ideas are devotees of this God. This has socio-political ramifications. The Establishment is basically "might is right" hiding behind a facade of religion and looking to that religion to legitimize it.
NO....They people are interested in Gnostics because the Gospels were left out of the Bible back then. There are more then 20 left out because they did not fit what the Church deemed as there agenda. People are leaving Churches and Catholics Churches because of corruption, Molestations and covering them up. THAT is not a Church of God!
I for one am all for self help, self causiting, self discovery WITHOUT a 'Religion' connotation. Most religions are man made and most promote fear and control. The GOD that lives in my heart values all life without judgement or disdain over a personal spiritual choice.
@Ambrosios777 The word gnosis is not in the nagg hammadi library.But Neo Gnostics and their churches are the ones claiming there is a divine experience called gnosis.There is nothing in there at all,and also ancient gnostics did not claim to have a experience called "GNOSIS".I enjoy the nagg hammadi library ,but I have come to realize that the word gnosis was raped way before the cool finding in 1945.
The label "Gnosticism" is basically the construct of heresiologists on the basis of what was perceived to be the self-definition of early Christian “heretics." Truth be known, there never was a "gnostic Christianity" or a gnostic movement or community. The Holy See has created its own monsters by its rigid and often narrow minded interpretation of the Gospels, etc. Please read: _Rethinking "Gnosticism": An Argument for Dismantling a Dubious Category_ by Michael Allen Williams.
@LifeLibertyLove You have the read the book that I cited. There were Christians, to be sure, who had a different views of Jesus than the Church, but they never called themselves Gnostics. This label was given to these Christians by the heresiiologists of the Church.
@mujaku Ah yes, I see what you are trying to say. However Gnosticism is a religion of it's own. I will admit it is bit of an umbrella religion. But hey so is the Label Christianity. Additionally Christians never originally called themselves Christian nor did Mormons originally call themselves Mormons. Nor did their founder. It was not until people called people who followed a man who was called Christ "Christians" and Mormon was just a play on words with the book of Mormon in order to make fun.
Even Christians are taught about personal development. Matthew 7:5 "Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye."
carlhenriksjodin 2 weeks ago
i just googled my name , i have no clue what is going on x)
tomathygit 1 month ago 2
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tonyyut1970 1 month ago
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tonyyut1970 1 month ago
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tonyyut1970 1 month ago
@tonyyut1970 I agree brother. I get tired of other people telling me my beliefs when they are ignorant of them. Let me rephrase what you said though: "sin is very big issue in Gnosticism". That is true for Gnostic Christians like myself. However, many people do not realise that not all Gnostics were/are Christians. To say: "All Gnostics believed..." is like saying "All Christians handle snakes during the service!"
astrofrk 1 month ago
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tonyyut1970 1 month ago
@tonyyut1970 That's correct. It becomes religion or at least another denomination. A true Gnostic Christian doesn't take scriptures as infallible because they were written by people. A Gnsotic Christian goes to the source and wisdom is given as the individual can contemplate.
astrofrk 1 month ago
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astrofrk 1 month ago
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astrofrk 1 month ago
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The time has come for us all to seek truth and stop tolerating deception and division. Only the truth can stop the wars and make the world the paradise it can be. Search for "Truth Contest" in Google and click the 1st result, then click on "The Present" to open it. What it says will transform us and our world.
jchijan 2 months ago
I like Ehrman, but Wright schools him. Come over to the dark side, Bart.
StormTrek 2 months ago
Thanks man. I am starting to realize that Gnostism is the way I'm going to go. I believe what they believe. Modern-day gnostism is what I believe. I do not believe Jesus was fully divine like the early gnostics believed. I believe he was fully man. Knowledge is the way to salvation. Not believing a man 2000 years ago died for your sins
ctsfinestjon 2 months ago
Ugh, conspiracy theories? Just plain ol' Dualism. What a pussy.
Fayarin 3 months ago
@kwgrid
that'sa good distinction: Christianity and Gnosticism are Contrary (not both true) but not necessarily Contradictory (one true one false).
People may choose which to follow, a Docetic view that all matter is evil or illusory, Christ only appeared to be flesh; or the view of Christianity taught by the Apostles, that Christ came in the flesh, that he was crucified, died, was buried, and rose on the 3rd day. They cannot both be true. Gnosticism and Christianity are incompatible,
bdrhetoric 3 months ago
Of course "the church" would dismiss gnosticism. The irony is, that just like science and religion, they're both right....in their way. Gnosticism doesn't cover everything just like traditional Biblical religion doesn't either. So they can both be wrong, too...in their way. Each needs to have the wheat separated from the chafe and it can only be accomplished by the individual. "Seek and ye shall find." "These things I do, you can do. Greater things than these can you do."
kwgrid 3 months ago
@wattsnick30 There are links, but Plotinus was generally suspicious of gnosticISM.
02Blackbeard 3 months ago
Oh MY !! Ungodly, nonsense ??? What have you done for mankind ? That you have so much time to nitpick ?
Try this , Oh Brilliant ones :
I am the LIGHT within ALL LIGHTS
He who steps within....SHALL be without
Don't understand it ? Then you need to go back to your nusery books, and be content !
serpentarius51 3 months ago
Wright's attempt to drive a wedge between Gnosticism and Early Christianity highlights (again) his inaccurate presumptions about what Jesus considered the kingdom of God to be. He makes Christianity into a post 1st Century form of Judaism. In reality, the development of ideas from the Dead Sea Scrolls through the Gospels into 2nd Century Gnosticism is quite tracable and shows that there is actually only a fine line between Christianity and the 'hidden' things of Gnosticism.
mark1v15 3 months ago
@mark1v15 Thank you Mark! This mans words are grosly inaccurate.
Fayarin 3 months ago
@mark1v15 What's it like believing in ancient fairy tales, awaiting the return of a cult leader (that never existed) and living a life of delusion? I'm just trying to understand the mind of a schizophrenic... sorry, I mean christian.
mrbigblacknutz 2 months ago
@mrbigblacknutz Well, obviously your mind is very closed as well, so I doubt you can understand what you don't want to.
astrofrk 2 months ago
@mrbigblacknutz Watched 5s of your own video - sufficient to see that you are utterly ignorant about the Bible and bredth of 'Christian' understanding. Imagine that all the blokes YOU knew were under 5ft tall. It would be ignorant to tell ALL men they are too short to play basketball based on YOUR narrow experience, but your accusations against 'Christians' are just as narrow.
mark1v15 1 month ago
Go ahead--study Marcion, study the actual ideas of the early gnostics. The mysterious unknown seems enchanting, especially when you have been told it has been somehow "repressed." No, it wasn't repressed; it was dismissed as nonsense. It is nonsense.
bdrhetoric 4 months ago
@bdrhetoric The entire continuum of Pythagoreanism, Hermetism, Neoplatonism and the various sects that the Church fathers called "Gnostics" are the correct forms of religiosity. Judaism and Christianity are nonsense, and are incorrect.
Though the Nag Hammadi texts (which are quite diverse; Sethian, Valentinean, Hermetic, Neopythagorean) have been hijacked by lame New Agers (and will continue to be), they are still superior. Study Valentinian cosmology and the Trinity becomes absurd.
spinozareagan 4 months ago
@bdrhetoric "No, it wasn't repressed; it was dismissed as nonsense"-- Yes, dismissed by orthodox Christians, who had to slander these sects and their ideas to dismiss them. If you tell a lie about someone, it is easier to push them out of view. Interestingly, the same tactics were used by the Christians when they became hegemonic that imperial Rome once used against Christians.
spinozareagan 4 months ago
Watch my Youtube Videos on 12 Labourers of inner circle and 70 outer circle.
nijjhar1 4 months ago
What he says at around 2:30 is false. Bart Ehrman doesn't think that gnosticism was part of the true historical life of Jesus. Ehrman thinks Jesus was a Jewish apocalyptic, predicting the end times in his generation, i.e. the coming of the PHYSICAL kingdom of god, then and there.
This is found everywhere in his books as well as in his historical Jesus series here on youtube, especially in part 14 / 24.
AR333 5 months ago
Gnosticism is the thing which was Christianity in the first place. That was about 2000 years ago. (just my opinion).
dobrinin 5 months ago
@dobrinin
2)
1 Timothy 6, 3-6 If anyone teaches otherwise and does not agree to the sound instruction of our Lord Jesus Christ and to godly teaching, they are conceited and understand nothing. They have an unhealthy interest in controversies and quarrels about words that result in envy, strife, malicious talk, evil suspicions and constant friction between people of corrupt mind, who have been robbed of the truth and who think that godliness is a means to financial gain.
Rotebuehl1 4 months ago
@dobrinin
1)
Cannot be! 1 Timothy 1, 3-4 As I urged you when I went into Macedonia, stay there in Ephesus so that you may command certain people not to teach false doctrines any longer or to devote themselves to myths and endless genealogies. Such things promote controversial speculations rather than advancing God’s work—which is by faith.
Rotebuehl1 4 months ago
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tonyyut1970 5 months ago
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tonyyut1970 5 months ago
cool video i am sold
911TruthStalker 5 months ago
What happend to the Katharen ? Yeah christians are a bunch of peace loving softies. Proof of that in historie al around. You sad people you. In dutch this is called a gotspe. A brutallity. Come on man. Ever heard of pius 10 he litterly clamed that that the only right we have is to listen and obey. You regonise a three by its fruit. That means in the case of orthodox christtianity that the only wise thing to do is to wipe it out with root and all. ( the gnostic, non violent way that is.)
meandi10000 6 months ago
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meandi10000 6 months ago
@amandaknocks Too judgmental to be sovereign?? Do you read what you write before hitting the post button or do your fingers move faster than your brain? Let me tell you something you fascist twat, Greece is it's own country with its own reliigon and its own laws. We fought 9 years against the Turks to get our freedom from oppression and we lost more people by the Nazis due to rebellion than any other occupied country during WWII. Greeks are independent people. Stick your EU in your ASS!!!!
AegeanKing 6 months ago
but gnosticism isnt popular, christianity in its normal form of looking for saviour being reddemed etc is still the more popular form and to be perefectly honest that is far less challenging than the process of self-discovery.
rehanabey 6 months ago
@amandaknocks I didn't say everything that is not Christian is from Satan. I said Gnosticism is from Satan. You obviously are ignorant of how Greeks do things. Greece is not western europe that gives anybody citizenship. We have already started to start mass deportations of illegal immigrants in Greece. Also, You don't know a fucking thing about my country so you are in no position to comment on whether it needs to be saved or not. Stick your fascist EU in your ass.
AegeanKing 6 months ago
@amandaknocks My opinion against damnable heresies are analogous to somebody who kills over 90 people? You're a troglodyte. Also, you are the fascist here so you have more in common with him than i do. You probably helped him plan it you gestapo twat.
AegeanKing 6 months ago
True Gnosticism does not oppose traditional Christianity. Instead it transcends it.
KBThunder5 6 months ago 6
@KBThunder5 How on earth does Christianity to be "transcended"? I'm bursting with curiosity!
Rotebuehl1 4 months ago
@Rotebuehl1 Gnosticism both transcends and OPPOSES normative Christianity. Paul was more Gnostic and anti-Jewish than most Christians realize. He is generally read through the distorting lens of later Church dogma.
Gnosticism is about Gnosis (Self-Knowlege) and not blind belief in supposed historical happenings.
Read books by Elaine Pagels.
Also, Anna Kingsford, "The Perfect Way".
02Blackbeard 4 months ago
@02Blackbeard Wonderful! Leaving the Gospel of the Bible and embracing the Gospels of Elaine Pagels and Anna Kingsford. Brilliant alternative...
Rotebuehl1 4 months ago
@Rotebuehl1 Yes, exactly. though one does not need to leave the gospels of the Bible; simply come to understand the ARAMAIC words of Jesus and the Hellenism of Paul.
I was in your shoes back in 1989. I was "converted" to Christianity back in 81, and attended an evangelical church. I was an evangelist, trained by Vic Jacobson (friend of Cliff Richard) in the school of EE. I attended an evangelical college (Oak Hill) 88-91. Then I gradually came to see the LIGHT.
Normative Christianity is a lie!
02Blackbeard 4 months ago
@02Blackbeard "LIGHT"? What light? IF "normative Christendom" is a lie, works of people like fallacious Elaine Pagels and buddhist, gnosticist, theosophical Anna Kingsford are truthful? One rejects the Bible and start to believe in oeuvres of some ladies? Didn't you get my ironic tone in the first place? Peace be with you and all the best
PS: b.t.w., with all due respect, Cliff Richards isn't an acceptable reference for me. I had the mixed blessing of having met him personally some years ago.
Rotebuehl1 4 months ago
@Rotebuehl1 The Inner Light. George Fox? All the valuable thinkers of Christianity were thought, by the Church, to be heretics....Eckhart, Boehme, Pordage, Kingsford, Karadja et al.
Normative Christianity is wrong on just about every philosophical point. It believes in a load of crap like creation ex nihilo, free will as "could have done otherwise", an eternal Hell.....the list goes on and on. RCism and Evangelicalism is "based" on blind faith. True religion is Gnostic (Knowledge based).
02Blackbeard 4 months ago
@02Blackbeard
I won't argue! All I wnated to say/write, i said/wrote! I'm not a missionary and it's not my pigeon, whether someone wants or not to believe, think, act otherwise! But I have to tell you, that, in our times, we all accept, that one's "freedom ends, where the freedom of others start"! I wouldn't dare trying to convince you, but don't you all dare trying to impose yourselves either! Times past were awful because of the church(es)? Cool! That's history! Now we deal with each other!
Rotebuehl1 4 months ago
@Rotebuehl1 "Opposition is true friendship" (Blake). Think on it.
02Blackbeard 4 months ago
@02Blackbeard Who cares about what Blake says? You too please think on that one!
Rotebuehl1 4 months ago
@Rotebuehl1 You should care if you value gnosis.
02Blackbeard 4 months ago
@02Blackbeard I definitely don't! One other thing, is valueing a person that might or not be a gnostic, depending, of course, on whether that person seems earnest or not! I will never go as far, as to disesteem a gnostic person by principle! But I make my point clear: gnosticism is a path to fake knowledge! If someone wants to go that way, that's his or her decision! I wouldn't question his/her free decision! But as long as a gnostic challenges my path, I'll challenge his! Just as simple!
Rotebuehl1 4 months ago
@Rotebuehl1 So you have a contempt for Knowlege? because that is what gnosis means. "He who knoweth himself knoweth his Lord."
02Blackbeard 4 months ago
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Rotebuehl1 4 months ago
@02Blackbeard I have a contempt with pretensions of knowledge in matters religious! Yes I do! Man trying to reach God by his own, shirking that it is God Who reaches man, is innacceptable! That Gnosis means knowledge is love of words! That's not what Gnosis means in this context! Of course one cares to achieve knowledge! That's what one does all life long, if one has a sound mind and an inquiring spirit! But, religiously, gnosis & its misteries are fake, vain, cirumventive & baleful!
Rotebuehl1 4 months ago
@Rotebuehl1 You only believe that because geeks like Tom Wright have told you thus. And don't forget that Wright, as an Anglican Bishop, is living off the fat of the land at your expense.
02Blackbeard 4 months ago
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Rotebuehl1 4 months ago
@Rotebuehl1 "at your expense" does not mean yours, personally.
02Blackbeard 4 months ago
@02Blackbeard Aw, c'mon! Now you're quibbling, mate! I'm sure you don't need that, as you're most certainly a bright mind, with all that knowledge, aren't you? Esoterics, spirituality and knowledge of hidden truths is ungodly! I remark one last time: God has revealed to us Who He is! He is Holy and One! Not one's "inner" dim lamp is light, but God is! He revealed us His will and that quite clearly! He's not a hidden God! You might not accept that! Ok, fine! It's down to you! I'm not holy either
Rotebuehl1 4 months ago
@Rotebuehl1 "Esoterics, spirituality and knowledge of hidden truths is ungodly!"....in other words you are, as yet, unready for this.
02Blackbeard 4 months ago
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Rotebuehl1 4 months ago
@02Blackbeard I most certainly am not at all interestet in "this"! Never, ever! That is for certain! As for all those that prefer self chosen ways, the so-called "challenge of self-discovery", I can only say: good luck and may God be with you all days of your life and have mercy upon us all! Yes, I am definitely "unready for this"! But I suggest: do some Scriptures reading, over and over again! You're not scared of the Scriptures, are you? They have lots of material fit for "self-discovery"!
Rotebuehl1 4 months ago
@Rotebuehl1 The scriptures (when not interpreted through the distorting lens of later church dogma) point me towards gnosticism.
02Blackbeard 4 months ago
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@Rotebuehl1 "at your expense" does not mean yours, personally.
02Blackbeard 4 months ago
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@02Blackbeard P.S. Your comment ""at your expense" does not mean yours, personally." was spammed! Please believe me, it wasn't me who spammed your comment! Just found out now! Can't understand, why people do that, just because they don't like what they read! I reiterate: it wasn't me who spammed your comment!
Rotebuehl1 4 months ago
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@02Blackbeard I'm not Anglican, I'm not an Englishman, I don't have to pay church taxes at all & I don't even live in Britain! That shot missed the target! But now I'd ask you kindly, what makes you presume, one is solely depending on the opinions of others, unable to bring forward own arguments? That's neither true, nor very polite, is it? If I remember well, I didn't offend you in any of my replies, did I? If I, by any chance, did, please accept my apologies! Discourse, not reflex, is needed!
Rotebuehl1 4 months ago
@KBThunder5 What does "true" gnosticism even mean? One might as well say "true" santa claus explains everything, and then present ones own ideas about santa claus as "true" (from the convenience of english language translations) - and completely ignore anything that contradicts that personal, eccentric "truth".
pierresogol1 3 months ago
@KBThunder5 "Gnostic" means: "To Know"... as in to know Yeshua/Jesus (Logos) and Holy Spirit (Sophia) personally. If one can personally know, what need is there for clergy? So can you understand why the Church sees us as a threat? Jesus didn't tell us to go to church, he told us to BE the Church. Church institutions are businesses. The Gospel of Thomas predates the Gospels in the cannon. I left mainstream Christianity for Gnostic Christianity with no regrets.
astrofrk 2 months ago
@astrofrk, Gnosticism is dead and the gospel of Thomas doesn't predate the authentic gospels. The materials in the gospels give them a dating before the 2nd Century. We have P66 and P75 fragments of John dating to 125 A.D. and exhaustive quotes from the Early Church fathers from around that era. Textual criticism has already demonstrated that this book relies heavily on narratives from the 4 gospels meaning that this work is much later and a forgery at best, it cannot withstand harsh TC.
LogosTheos 2 months ago
@LogosTheos You are talking to a Gnostic Christian telling him he doesn't exist, good luck. How do you proove my faith doesn't exist? At one time we WERE nearly wiped out by mainstream Christians slaughtering men, women and children to prove they had a more Loving God and you say I'M not for real"? Thomas was written as early as 50AD, as much as 15 years before Mark, the earliest Gospel. If you think Thomas relies heavily on the four Gospels in cannon, you never read the Gospel of Thomas.
astrofrk 2 months ago
@astrofrk, Your lying now, why are you lying brother? Gnostics were never wiped out by slaughter, that's a lie and I challenge you to provide documentary evidence of this either by providing 2nd Century quotations or credible patristic and general historians. What makes your assertion Ironic is that the Roman authorities were persecuting Christians for not adhering to the other pagan philosophies along with their binitarian monotheism. Gnostics on the other hand sastified romanism....
LogosTheos 2 months ago
@LogosTheos Why are you calling me and historians liars? Ever heard of the Cathars? Ever heard of the Inquesition? Want proof of dates? Try earlychristianwritings website for a start. Then I can continue with biblical scholars and historians. I learned from Dr. Jay Forrest, who left mainstream Christianity from what he learned. Not all Gnostics are Christian, so SOME were not killed by the Romans. It is the Church that adhered to the Romans in the end. I am not a binitarian Gnostic.
astrofrk 2 months ago
@astrofrk, I'm calling you a liar until you can prove that textual critics date the gospel of Thomas to 50 A.D., I'v NEVER heard of that from any scholary work, neither from conservatives such as Dr. Bruce Metzger nor liberals like Bart Ehrman.
LogosTheos 2 months ago
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@LogosTheos I said "As early as 50AD". I also said 50-140AD. None of the texts have exact dates and if you know as much as you say, you know I am correct. I TOLD you to go to the earlychristianwritings website and if you refuse to look at it, that's your fault, not mine. This is confirmed with the Jesus Seminar. If you refuse to even look at the evidence, not even Jesus can help you.
astrofrk 1 month ago
@astrofrk , "Thomas dates from 50-140AD read it"
140 A.D. is plausible but I have no idea where you got 50 A.D. from. Also I have a WHOLE volume of Christian writings from the first 800 years so don't ask me to look it up, im not an amatuer. Gnostics were not killed since they easily intergrated themselfs with Romanism and pagan philosophy unlike Christians who refused to give reverence to any other than the Father and the Son in a binitarian montheistic fashion.
LogosTheos 2 months ago
@LogosTheos I meant read earlychristianwritings website, that's one source of my dating. Many Gnostics were not killed by the Romans, they were later killed by people like you! You can deny the inquesition and the Cathars all you want but anyone can look it up. Your church tortured and killed men, women and children in the name of God. I can understand the Roman Empire better than I can undertand the Inquesition, the Romans were Pagans.
But Jesus himself warned us of religious institutions.
astrofrk 1 month ago
@astrofrk, "they were later killed by people like you! You can deny the inquesition and the Cathars all you want but anyone can look it up. Your church tortured and killed men, women and children in the name of God"
>>Typical erroneous assertions from people who don't have a clue about patristic history. You said John was a Gnostic Christian, you are nuts to think that, do you see how he utterly refuted by the power of Christ the gnostic concept docetism in 1 John Ch. 4?
LogosTheos 1 month ago
@LogosTheos I already told you, I believe Yeshua was a HUMAN! The Logos within him was not. The Logos within Yeshua was around at the creation of the earth as written in The Gospel of John Ch. 1, vs 1-5. Yeshua (Jesus) was THE WORD. Will you please stop telling me what I believe and listen when I am telling you my beliefs? I know what I believe, you do not!
astrofrk 1 month ago
@astrofrk, continue....Gnostics adhered to mysticism and other pagan philosophies along with Christianity causing them to avoid persecution. Gnosticism astrofrk...if you read Colossians and 1 John you would know that it is being refuted by Paul the apostle and the beloved disciple. Paul refuted the Aeon godheads while John refuted docetism which was another heretical gnostic view that asserted Christ had no flesh. Also you lied when you said Thomas dates to 50AD I had to chuckle...
LogosTheos 2 months ago
@LogosTheos I am mystic only in that I believe in the Holy Spirit (Sophia). I do not believe in the Demiurge. You are stereotyping me as though all Gnostics are alike. Did I say "All mainstream Christians handle snakes?"
Valentinian Gnostic Christianity is based on Yeshua, Paul and Valentinus. I recognise Colossians & 1st John if you would be specific. When did I say Yeshua didn't have a body? Thomas dates from 50-140AD read it. You keep calling me a liar and I have not, false witness...
astrofrk 2 months ago
@astrofrk, I am aware of the various Christologies of the gnostics. So you follow Valentinian Gnosticism? I suggest you read Irenaus the Bishop of Lyons 2nd Century work "Against Heresies" which refutes Valentinian thought to expose the falsehood. Irenaus was a disciple of Polycarp who in turn was a disciple of John himself in the flesh, Irenaus was also murdered for professing Christ. Paul refutes Gnosticism in Colossians so their is not way he would support such heretical beliefs.
LogosTheos 2 months ago
@LogosTheos I have read Against all Heresies, thank you. Iranius conformed to the church, not Paul. Valentinus was a 2nd generation student of Paul, which gives him at least as much credibility at Iranius. Valentinus almost became Pope and would have if not for Iranius. For the 2nd time I ask: Where in Collossians
does Paul refute ALL Gnosticism?
astrofrk 1 month ago
@astrofrk, You said you read Irenaus' work "Against Heresies" but you asserted that Irenaus conformed to the church and not Paul? Pauline soteriology is present in his writings? extensive quotations of Paul's epistles? Pauline Christology and language usage also?
LogosTheos 1 month ago
@LogosTheos What needs to be undertood is the writings. The Gnostic Christians took writings in a different way than the Roman Church. We can argue meanings forever but it only backs historical facts. Pauls belief in Salvation and the church was somewhat different from Peters. You listen to Peter, I listen to Paul. Pauline Christology and language usage also!
astrofrk 1 month ago
@astrofrk, Drop this "Roman Church" stuff, I do not adhere to Romanism or Roman Catholic doctrine, I am a protestant who subscribes to the solas. Please get off the Da Vinci Code/Zeigeist kool-aid with the "Roman Church did this" and "they hid that" this is typical language of someone ignorant of history . They were not the only Church at that time and still aren't today. You had more refutations of Gnosticism from the original Greek Churches founded by the apostles.
LogosTheos 1 month ago
@LogosTheos I also used to be protestant. Protestants follow the same bible and many philosophies created by the Roman Catholic Church from Constantine. I have read many books and I have gone far beyond Davinci Code and Zeitgeist and that's why you are getting upset.
astrofrk 1 month ago
@astrofrk, "Protestants follow the same bible and many philosophies created by the Roman Catholic Church from Constantine"
What!? Can you provide any documenation or scholarship for this? Here we go with the Constantine myths again, it's sad, all the man did was legalize Christanity and tried to unit the Greek East during the controversy with Arius. Now you have fraud making all kinds of goofy myth "Constantine invented Jesus", "Constantine invented the Trinity", 'He did this and that"..
LogosTheos 1 month ago
@LogosTheos It was under Constantine in the Council of Nicaea in 325AD, the Roman Church accepted four gospels and rejected the othe gospels and accepted most of the rest of the NT.. I will admit that the modern bible used by most protestants wasn't compleated until the 1600's but it is based on the same. When did I say Constantine invented the Trinity? Did I not tell you the Theos=God, Logos=Yeshua and Sophia=The Holy Spirit? I believe in the same trinity as YOU!
astrofrk 1 month ago
@astrofrk, Paul's theology isn't different from Peter because Paul got it from Peter! Have you not read Galatians 1:15-19? "Then after three years I went up to Jerusalem to visit Cephas and remained with him fifteen days. But I saw none of the other apostles except James the Lord's brother.” (Galatians 1:18-19). Paul used the Greek word "historeo"(visit) which literally means not only to visit but to obtain information from. Secondly this is the most absurb claim you have made thus far...
LogosTheos 1 month ago
@LogosTheos So please explain the differences between Valentinus and Iranius? There were conflicts: Peter once believed one had to first be a Jew before becoming a christian. It was Paul who went to the gentiles when Peter would not. Peter strongly questioned Pauls authority because Paul was not a disciple and had never met Yeshua before he died. They had a major dispute over eating animals used in sacrifice to idols when visiting a Jewish-Christian church. Peter back-peddled.
astrofrk 1 month ago
@astrofrk, It's Irenaus, Irenaus was a disciple a of Polycarp Bishop of Smryna who in turn was a disciple of John. Irenaus followed what the apostles passed down and he was influenced by others who were alive during the the missions of the apostles, he died for his faith like Polycarp before him. Valentinus was a demon-inspired heretic who made of myths about Christ to find consistency with his hellenistic philisophical views, just like Marcion.
LogosTheos 1 month ago
@LogosTheos Valentinus almost became the Pope. Marcion? That's another issue and I'm typing enough. Valentinus was a student of Theudas who was a student of Paul. Irenaus didn't start attcking Valentinus until after Valentinus died. At the time, Valentiniuns were often members of the church. Afterwords nearly all Gnostics were killed because of what Iranius started. At the time of Valentinus, there were no such thing as "Gnostic Christians" as they were just fellow Christians.
astrofrk 1 month ago
@astrofrk,...Their is not theological conflict with Peter and Paul's epistles! And this is the first time I heard this from anyone! As far as beliefs go you told me you were Gnostic so don't get angry at me because I represent Gnostic beliefs more accurately than you do. Leave that darkness and embrace Christ as Lord, turn from the error of pride in your own knowledge other than Christ, come to light in Jesus name!
LogosTheos 1 month ago
@astrofrk,...Their is not theological conflict with Peter and Paul's epistles! And this is the first time I heard this from anyone! As far as beliefs go you told me you were Gnostic so don't get angry at me because I represent Gnostic beliefs more accurately than you do. Leave that darkness and embrace Christ as Lord, turn from the error of pride in your own knowledge other than Christ, come to light in Jesus name!
LogosTheos 1 month ago
@LogosTheos A pastor molested me when I was nine and you want me to FOLLOW clergy as a guide to Yeshua? Yeshua is within me as stated in Luke and Thomas and you have no place judging me, no controll over me! I follow the words of Yeshua and the guidence of Sophia (Holy Spirit) and you call that darkness because I won't put the words of men over the words of them? You are my brother in Yeshua, stop judging my kind. Only Love will unite.
astrofrk 1 month ago
@astrofrk, Did I say follow clergy? (Straw-Man) I made it clear that I follow the sola scriptura and the others.
LogosTheos 1 month ago
@LogosTheos But that was the greatest reason the Gnostics were such a threat. We did not recognise any clergy or the church as an institution. That is why we were wiped out. I don't follow Sola Scriptura either. I follow Gnosis, a direct line of communication to the Pleroma. The Bible is not infallible as it was written by men, I would rather hedge my bets on the Holy Trinity that you just called Satanic.
astrofrk 1 month ago
@astrofrk Gnostic in the first century sound very much like American Protestants today. Don't recognise clergy, don't trust established church institution etc Puritanism has colluded with Gnosticism without knowing it. And Puritanical ideology is inherent in American evangelicalism - whether you are talking conservative or charismatic. American Protestantism, with its rapture, doctrine of total depravity, immortality of the soul etc really colludes with Gnosticism.
brendos444 1 month ago
@brendos444 You are correct to a point. Protestants do have clergy (Pastors) but they don't give thier clergy as much power as the Roman Catholics. The Protestants have church buildings, the Gnostics met in homes and considder the Church is within. The Rapture is not a Gnostic belief, nor is it in any scriptures. I would be closest to the Penticostals but still very different. I accept other paths to salvation as valid as long as it is a path of Love to God.
astrofrk 1 month ago
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astrofrk 1 month ago
@astrofrk Rapture isn't a Gnostic belief but it is in the same kind of spirit. Escape from this world to a heavenly, spiritual existence. Perhaps neo Platonism would be a better characterization.
brendos444 1 month ago
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astrofrk 1 month ago
@brendos444 The Penticostals got the mysic side of Yeshua right but missed the point: With Yeshua within and the Holy Spirit (Sophia) speaking to the soul... why would one need man-made institutions to tell one how to they are allowed to live? Yeshua didn't woo man-made religious institutions, he called them "Vipers" and cleared out the money-grabbers within them. The religious institutions had Yeshua killed and if he were to come to earth today, perhaps they would do it again.
astrofrk 1 month ago
@astrofrk There are a lot of similarities with Protestantism in your statement. The anti-establishment mentality. I disagree with the Gnostic world view. The Messiah led a thoroughly Jewish movement who were looking for the redemption of the world, not only humanity. This is Christianity. Christianity is not a private spiritual experience. When Jesus rode into Jerusalem on a donkey, this was a highly political statement.
brendos444 1 month ago
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@brendos444 Perhaps we can agree to disagree but in a respectfull manner. I see Christianity as a very personal matter. The gospels in the cannon can support both perspectives, it just depends on how one reads it. I was once a music minister at an Assemblies of God church and I spent decades in mainstream Christianity. The scriptures were written by men trying to explain God but God is more than humaity will ever understand and far more than political understanding.
astrofrk 1 month ago
@brendos444 Mainstream Christianity is often limited to understanding God because there is more of God than can be written in all books combined, much less one. One way to even start is by going directly to the source and even then, one is limited by ones capacity of understanding. Anyone seeking God through Love is on the right track, regardless of ones religion. Gnostic Christians are often seen as half Christian, half Buddhist. We can learn from all faiths that seek with Love.
astrofrk 1 month ago
Yes and that is why Eastern Orthodox and Catholics don't subscribe to the Protestant doctrine of sola scriptura. I've been told that an Eastern Orthodox service is deeply mystic. They have big emphasis on the Holy Spirit and the love of God. Christianity doesn't contradict anything that is good in other religions. But the true Chrisitan faith is about the restoration of the world thru Israel's Messiah, Jesus the Christ. Gnosticism does not have this political and cosmological dimension
brendos444 1 month ago
@brendos444 Correct. Gnostic Christianity does have similarities with the Eastern Orthodox, although I have never been to an Eastern service, so I cannot say. Yeshua never called himself the Messiah of Jewish prophecy. We identify with the same guy you do, we just see a different identity. Mainstream Christianity may not contradict the good in other religions but they condemn those who follow other religions to hell. Gnostic Christians do not. With the Love of Yeshua and Sophia..
astrofrk 1 month ago
@astrofrk I would say the Eastern Orthodox Christianity is fundamentally opposed to gnosticism. The doctrine of the church is very much rooted and grounded in the material world. The Iconography, the sacraments, the priest's vestments etc. Orthodoxy is rooted in the Incarnation of Christ and the hope of resurrection. Gnosticism is about escape from our physical bodies to a more spiritual realm.
brendos444 1 month ago
@brendos444 You are correct over the material side of the Eastern Orthodox but there are also similarities. For instance: The Gnostic Christian view of the mystic side of the Eucharist is much closer to the Eastern Orthodox. The Roman Church believes in a physical transformation of the bread and wine while the protestants see it as a symbolic ritual. I say: "Neither!" I think many Christians believe in an escape from our physical bodies to a more spiritual realm after death.
astrofrk 1 month ago
@astrofrk Yes many Christians do believe in an escape from physical bodies to a more spiritual realm. But this is not the ultimate future. The resurrection is the ultimate hope. Many Christians have imagined that going to heaven when we die is the be all and end all. They are colluding with gnosticism. This was never the Orthodox Christian belief
brendos444 1 month ago
@astrofrk, You are my brother in Christ not in Gnosticism which distorts along with other worldy religions the true grace of Jesus Christ our Lord and Savior.
LogosTheos 1 month ago
@LogosTheos Well there it is: I say man-made church institutions distort Jesus to the point that I only refer to him as "Yeshua". I feel your Jesus has been made into a hatefull God that creates people just to torture them for all eternity. You say the opposite. If you see me as a brother in Christ, perhaps we can agree to disagree with the rest. I hope you also feel that the most important factor is Love, just as Paul said in 1 Corinthians 13. If so, the Kingdom is near for both.
astrofrk 1 month ago
Thomas is dated to the middle of the 2nd Century, not 50AD! There is no data or scholary support for this from either side of textual criticism (conservative and liberal). I have read the gospel of Thomas have you? Which version? Arabic infancy? Coptic? Greek? As a matter of fact how man apocryphal works have you read? Do you know their are many others each having varying christologies?
LogosTheos 2 months ago
@LogosTheos I already responded over the Gospel of Thomas. If you read Thomas, why did you tell me it "relies heavily on narratives from the 4 gospels" when it does not? Most of what is written in the Gospel of Thomas is not quoted anywhere in the cannon. I have read dozens of apocryphal books but I only recognise eight of them, five are Nag Hammadi. I recognise 17 books in the cannon. Now, where in the Bible does it tell me to go to a church institution and have clergy speak for God?
astrofrk 2 months ago
@astrofrk, "If you read Thomas, why did you tell me it "relies heavily on narratives from the 4 gospels" when it does not?"
Can you explain this please:
And he said, "Whoever finds the interpretation of these sayings will not experience death." (
Oxyrhynchus Fragment)
This saying parallels John 8:51, " Very truly I tell you, whoever obeys my word will never see death.”
John is dated to the late 90s which pushes the date of the gospel of Thomas further.
LogosTheos 2 months ago
@LogosTheos There are some comparisons that can be made with Thomas. The 4 Gospels in the cannon repeat each other far more times, even word-for-word and you KNOW that. However, Thomas is much more independant in many of its EARLIER teachings. John was a Gnostic Christian but his gospel dates from 90-120AD (earlychristianwritings website). I ask anyone following this to read The Gospel of Thomas and decide for themselves who is deceiving: Gnostic Christians or the Catholic Church.
astrofrk 1 month ago
@amandaknocks The EU authorities?? Woah, sort of like the Nazi Gestapo you fascist scumbag? Gnosticism perverts the teachings of Christ. Therefore it is from Satan. Fuck the EU. We don't have EU "authorities" in Greece. We have our own sovereign police you Nazi. Aren't you late for your Waffen SS meeting?
AegeanKing 6 months ago
Gnosticism: Man trying to reach God; Christianity: God reaching down to man. That is why I could never be gnostic.
Say7what7you7will 6 months ago
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dobrinin 6 months ago
@dobrinin Gnosticism is about goodness? No, you are sadly mistaken. Gnosticism is from Satan. Gnosticism is the antithesis of what Christ taught. Do not be ridiculous.
AegeanKing 6 months ago
@AegeanKing christanity as made to its present day popularity by Paul, is a antithesis of what christ taught! christ didn't want another religion named after his teachings, he said it several times on top of that Paul somehow just converts to christianity over night & becomes a preacher???
lexiconofskin165 6 months ago
NT Wright says that scholars like Bart Ehrman claim that the Christianity in the Gospel of Thomas was the real early Christianity, and that the 4 canonical gospels try to cover it up. Actually, Bart Ehrman thinks that the Gospel of Thomas post-dates the 4 canonical gospels.
Mystagogia87 6 months ago
Those institutional religions are corrupt.
lurconis666 6 months ago
Why must gnosticism be attacked (or re-murdered, as if a risen Christ)? It couldn't have anything to do with the fact the church is horrified by gnosticism's message that one doesn't need churches of wood and stone and gold? Christ is the word and the word has risen again; despite the best attempts to destroy it.
holidaygolight 6 months ago
@holidaygolight If you think the Church means buildings, you are seriously mistaken. It means the people who believe in Jesus the Christ and His message. Jesus, to Peter, said that the gates of Hell would not prevail against His Church. If the Gnostics are correct, then the gates of hell prevailed from the beginning. Gnosticism, to me, seems a cheap dilution of Christ's message by people who prefer to reject a need for personal repentance and change and to take up their cross and follow HIm
dabliss101 5 months ago
@dabliss101 I assume you are refering to the gnostic interpretation of the crucifixion as a human sacrifice to an evil god (Satan). The interpretation of Satan as lord over this world exists in the canonical gospels-- it is Satan's to offer to Christ when he tempts the later in the desert.
holidaygolight 5 months ago
Gods coming she's just taking her time, living by the Nile where the water flowwwwwwwww
SumNJFella 7 months ago
God does not need us and we are filthy to him because we have sined. ISAIAH 64:6 But we are all like an unclean thing,And all our righteousnesses are like filthy rags; We all fade as a leaf, And our iniquities, like the wind, Have taken us away. WE NEED FORGIVENESS.
lastochka101 7 months ago
Ok, I don´t know what you mean with spam but anyway. You have your opinion and that´s fine. Peace to you!
royalsteven 7 months ago
Eum, is this a reaction to my video? And why do you assume things about me you don't understand?
royalsteven 7 months ago
Please watch my video 'To All The People In The World'. It tells a positive message to respect and love others no matter what religion.
royalsteven 7 months ago
I am a Gnostic Christian. Accoring to many scholers, the Gospel of Thomas predates the connonised gospels. I do not believe in priests/pastors because it is Yeshua (Jesus) and the wisdom of Sophia (Holy Spirit) within that leads to the kingdom. This is why the Church wiped the Gnostic Christians out. Forgiveness is very important to my beliefs. Paul taught that the most important factor is Love and he founded Gnostic Christianity. It IS personal and cannot be put into one set of beliefs.
astrofrk 7 months ago
@astrofrk Exactly, I would challenge anyone to show that in the Gospel of Thomas it says kill non believers, a witch or an infadel.Its all about love and the divine spark within.
zaxtar 6 months ago
@zaxtar The church institutions have always seen Gnostic Christianity as a threat, hence, the inquesition. Gnostic Christianity is the only hope Christianity has left. Mainstream Christianity is dying at the church level, especially the Catholics. People are looking away from clergy and asking who this Jesus dude is for themselves. That is how Christianity should be. "Christian" means "Christ-like", not "pope-like, preist-like, preacher-like", interaction with the Logos is direct.
astrofrk 6 months ago
My church is a gnostic church.We consider the platonists as all heritics.Those who think the bridal chamber is just a symbol are dumb
JordanStratford1 8 months ago
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jenniferhogan96 7 months ago
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jenniferhogan96 7 months ago
@adomjask Ok. But you give the impression you are a seeker of spiritual truths and a hater of hypocrisy, like I am. Sorry if I 've misinterpreted your messages. Take care. John
gnosticjohn 8 months ago
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gnosticjohn 8 months ago
@gnosticjohn I keep seeing your comments on the various Gnostic related videos but when I search your name/handle nothing comes up?
dexietable 8 months ago
@dexietable Im very new to utube, as u can see from my profile, which shows my pic and info about me (have u not looked at it?)... anyway theres more info about me on it than most ppl on this site show about themselves! I find utube a bit scary, n im still learning how to communicate with ppl on it. Sorry if I dont know how to use this medium correctly! Ur profile says nothing about u except ur age and ur from USA! So u r an enigma 2 me. How can I rspond to an enigma? haha!
gnosticjohn 8 months ago
@adomjask . Sorry Jeremy (?)... I thought I read ur name as Danny on ur profile b4. Have you changed it? haha! Do u want 2 giv ur email add? Its a bit dangerous on this public site, but you can delete it the next day, as I will email u as soon as I see it. I am new to utube so I dont know how safe it is to have conversations on it... u know what I mean? Iv been to USA few times, so where r u? I go2 India half the year. If u r a genuine seeker then I cd teach u a lot, if u want. Just ask ok?
gnosticjohn 8 months ago
@adomjask . Cont... I now have the same problems with all churches and other religions as Jesus did. They didn't believe him then, and they don't believe me now. But Revelation makes it clear there should be thousands of others like me in this present time and Age, who know their True Mother and Father in Heaven. Tell me more about yourself (not on youtube). Are you on Facebook?
gnosticjohn 8 months ago
@adomjask Thankyou Danny. I really appreciate you believing me. I pray God will bless you for that. I'm sure you will start to feel better "inside" as God touches you in ways only you will understand. I don't expect you to have the same spiritual experiences as me, although why not? It will blow your socks off if it happens to you! So keep in touch. It happened to me a year after my heart was broken by my family... see next message...
gnosticjohn 8 months ago
@adomjask Ok. No problem. I dont really know why I call myself a gnostic except that the Gospel of Thomas and the NHL are called gnostic gospels! Hence if I understand them, then I must be one right? I can't associate with any Church, RC or Protestant or New Age or whatever... they are all wrong and do not follow the Real Jesus. I just know that the words of Jesus in Thomas' Gospel are True. They prove my sanity. I thank God for Jesus, the greatest man who ever lived.
gnosticjohn 8 months ago
@adomjask Why are you swearing? And no I have nothing whatsoever to do with any organisations or churches or people who call themselves gnostics. I have found none worthy. I have yet to meet a genuine gnostic. I will know when I do.. 'cos we will be Brothers of Jesus. Revelation is unfolding just as God planned. All I can do is observe it happening... and speak out when I can't stand the lies any longer, just as I'm doing here.
gnosticjohn 8 months ago
Read M1 first. M2: E.g. I can describe in great detail the last line of logion 50. I've searched the world for any artistic work down the centuries that may portray what I've been shown, and portrays "the marriage place" mentioned in logion 75. I've found nothing remotely similar, nor anything as beautiful and as blissful as the sign of the Father (and Mother). Only another Gnostic could relate to my description.... in fact we would be able to finish each other's sentences in its description.
gnosticjohn 8 months ago
Read this Message 1 first: Thankyou for your reply. Of course, about 80% of the gospel can be interpreted accurately, since 60% of it is already in the NT. I'm talking about the logia 50, 101, 104, 105, 80, 75, 83 and 84, especially. I also understand your comment that it may be despisable to the reader, viz logion 70's meaning. However, there is no accurate interpretation of those logia above, except "interpretations" BY PEOPLE... they are not from first hand gnosis or "divine intervention"...
gnosticjohn 8 months ago
@adomjask Well, yes....many of these neo-gnostic churches are developed by "wandering bishops" who boast of an apostolic succession in the RC sense. I've been down that road. It's another dead-ender.
The wandering bishop churches are full of paedophiles and criminals. Best avoided.
Freemasons....that's another bunch of criminals.
Gnosticism is best aligned with non-conformity.
02Blackbeard 8 months ago
The speaker has no idea that the Gospel of Thomas is only for enlightened souls (christs)... i.e. Baptised by the Holy Spirit in a True way... eg it describes God's Seal, the sign of the Father, in logion 50. Thus, he could never understand its controversial sayings. What this gospel DOES DO is expose the ignorance, hypocrisy and deceit within the Church. This gospel is succour for those who have genuinely been touched by God. There is no place for christs in Christianity today.
gnosticjohn 8 months ago
The Cathars were right!
OrthodoxDarwinist 8 months ago
What a fucking idiot. No sane person believes that Jesus was conceived virginally and rose from the dead.
I attended Oak Hill College 1988-91, ordained 91/92. Left the priesthood in 2000.
It's all a load of tosh! Orthodox Christianity is garbage in both its RC and Evangelical developments.
Bishops are parasites.
The Church is nothing but the Establishment at prayer.
This man (Wright) is a deluded asshole.
02Blackbeard 8 months ago
@02Blackbeard What do you believe in then, if you beleive in anything? Just by curiosity!
Rotebuehl1 4 months ago
@Rotebuehl1 I'm an anarchist pantheist. I have no belief in any "personal" God. The Church has created God or Gods in its own image. God is an Egregore.
I hold to a Promethean Gnostic vision of the world. The Jewish God is the Demiurge, and Christians adopting Jewish ideas are devotees of this God. This has socio-political ramifications. The Establishment is basically "might is right" hiding behind a facade of religion and looking to that religion to legitimize it.
Vicious Circle.
02Blackbeard 4 months ago
The problem is that some of Paul's words have a gnostic flavor to them...the flesh vs the spirit dichotomy for example.
jhgosnell 8 months ago
Hi,
Can you tell me in whose name John baptised Jewish men in water? How many women were baptised by John?
nijjhar1 8 months ago
@nijjhar1 What?
jenniferhogan96 8 months ago
NO....They people are interested in Gnostics because the Gospels were left out of the Bible back then. There are more then 20 left out because they did not fit what the Church deemed as there agenda. People are leaving Churches and Catholics Churches because of corruption, Molestations and covering them up. THAT is not a Church of God!
chaksheba 8 months ago
I for one am all for self help, self causiting, self discovery WITHOUT a 'Religion' connotation. Most religions are man made and most promote fear and control. The GOD that lives in my heart values all life without judgement or disdain over a personal spiritual choice.
HHV89J1 8 months ago
@HHV89J1 AMEN BROTHER!
chaksheba 8 months ago
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kmichael212 9 months ago
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checkout my channel
0thetrooth0 9 months ago
@Ambrosios777 The word gnosis is not in the nagg hammadi library.But Neo Gnostics and their churches are the ones claiming there is a divine experience called gnosis.There is nothing in there at all,and also ancient gnostics did not claim to have a experience called "GNOSIS".I enjoy the nagg hammadi library ,but I have come to realize that the word gnosis was raped way before the cool finding in 1945.
kmichael212 9 months ago
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kmichael212 9 months ago
The label "Gnosticism" is basically the construct of heresiologists on the basis of what was perceived to be the self-definition of early Christian “heretics." Truth be known, there never was a "gnostic Christianity" or a gnostic movement or community. The Holy See has created its own monsters by its rigid and often narrow minded interpretation of the Gospels, etc. Please read: _Rethinking "Gnosticism": An Argument for Dismantling a Dubious Category_ by Michael Allen Williams.
mujaku 10 months ago
@mujaku There was a Gnostic Christianity. I know because I am a Gnostic Christian and I derive all of my beliefs from teachers before 200AD.
LifeLibertyLove 10 months ago
@LifeLibertyLove You have the read the book that I cited. There were Christians, to be sure, who had a different views of Jesus than the Church, but they never called themselves Gnostics. This label was given to these Christians by the heresiiologists of the Church.
mujaku 10 months ago
@mujaku Ah yes, I see what you are trying to say. However Gnosticism is a religion of it's own. I will admit it is bit of an umbrella religion. But hey so is the Label Christianity. Additionally Christians never originally called themselves Christian nor did Mormons originally call themselves Mormons. Nor did their founder. It was not until people called people who followed a man who was called Christ "Christians" and Mormon was just a play on words with the book of Mormon in order to make fun.
LifeLibertyLove 10 months ago