pt 8 look at what this beast does in REV. 13.."makes war with the saints and overcomes them".Under the influence of Germanic customs and concepts, torture was little used , but with the revival of Roman law the practice was reestablished.In 1252 Innocent IV sanctioned the infliction of torture by the civil authorities upon heretics, and torture came to have a recognized place in the procedure of the inquisitional courts.(New Catholic Encyc., "Inquisition", "Massacre of St Barth.)
I have news for you, killing was used by the Israelites and sactioned BY GOD.....man, woman, child, INFANT and animal. David beheaded people and one warrior cut off a kings fingers(sounds like torture to me).
Oh and then there is Matt8:16, Mark9:41, Luke17:2, Luke19:27, Luke12:47, Matt18:24-25, etc, etc, etc.
If you have a problem with the Inquisition then you have a problem with the OT and Our Lord. READ SCRIPTURE!
Don't forget that the prots ahd their own inquistions. History shows them to have been brutal. W/o the Catholic Inquisition the moslems and jews would have overtaken Europe. Soon you prots will be begging the Church to defend you.
part 7.."Long ages ago, when Rome through the neglect of the Western emperors was left to the mercy of the barbarous hordes, the Romans turned to one figure for aid and protection, and asked him to rule them; and thus, . . . commenced the temporal sovereignty of the popes. And meekly stepping to the throne of Caesar, the vicar of Christ took up the scepter to which the emperors and kings of Europe were to bow in reverence through so many ages."--American Catholic Quarterly Review, April, 1911.
part 6 about 500 A.D., when the Roman Empire was crumbling to pieces:] "No, the [Catholic] Church will not descend into the tomb. It will survive the Empire . . . At length a second empire will arise, and of this empire the Pope will be the master--more then this, he will be the master of Europe. He will dictate his orders to kings who will obey them"--Andrea Lagarde, The Latin Church in the Middle Ages, 1915, p. vi.
THIS IS THE REV. 13 BEAST ..remember the horns on the daniel beast.
part #5 It [the Catholic Church] is a political creation, and as imposing as a World-Empire, because [it is a continuation of] the Roman Empire. The Pope, who calls himself 'King' and 'Pontifex Maximus' [the title of the Roman Emperor in the time of Christ], is Caesar's successor."--Adolf Harnack, What is Christianity? 1963, pp. 269-270.
part #4 "Whatever Roman elements the barbarians and Aryans left . . . [came] under the protection of the Bishop of Rome, who was the chief person there after the Emperor's disappearance . . . The Roman Church in this way privily pushed itself into the place of the Roman World-Empire, of which it is the actual continuation; the empire has not perished, but has only undergone a transformation . . . cont..
part 3..it has the same marks as the original beast in Daniel, the horns etc. so this tells us its the roman beast but it transformed into a creature that has risen again that had the WOUND (STRESSING THE WOUND), the wound came from the beatings it took from the barbarians...and again this would be the Holy Roman empire that took over for the pagan roman empire. cont..
if were concieved into sin by "law" or logic, you are a sinner who commits sins,, ALL of us....We are not sinners because we sin but rather we sin because we are all sinners it is our nature!
She needed someone to save her from being concieved ionto sin in the first place. God does not need to save her the same way He saved us. Have u ever been a pedophile? prob not! is that b/c anything YOU did? NO! It is b/c God saved u from such sin. Does that make u in any less need of a Savoir? NO!
I don't go be Scipture alone. I live by EVERY Word from the Mouth of God...not just the written Words. Ang AGAIN, Scriptrue says it but not in a direct sentence....like with the Tinity. The word is not used but the idea is there. "Full of Grace" means w/o sin.
@07braves This si a silly question. She needed a Savior too, nobody denies that. The Church has never made the claim that she was sinless of her own doing or merit. She was saved, by Our Lord, in that she was preserved from sin. By the anticipated merits of Our Lord God saved her from sin by His Grace, thus He saved her too, but in a different way then He saved us.
@evi410 yet the Bible does not say she was sinless., she also had to make a sin offering of cleansing of childbirth..SIN OFFERING, and # 2 this pretty much also destroys the perpetual virginty of Mary. she gave birth (NATURAL), Jesus also had half brothers and sisters. JOSEPH was a father., and he had his wife MARY, did he not?
@07braves The Bible doesn't say a lot of things, yet you believe them. Sin offering was the Law, she was sinless so she obeyed the Law. Our Lord was sinless so He didn't have to Die, yet He obeyed.
And no the Blessed Mother did not have children with St. Joseph. There is no evidence that she did. funny that you claim I can't believe something that isn't in the Bible then u turn around and make claim about something that ISN'T IN THE BIBLE.
@evi410 im not sure im following you, saying Mary was sinless (which is NOT in the BIBLE),, and going to Christ (who was sinless, and it WAS said in the Bible), he died because he obeyed because he knew he had to do so to give us redemption. cont.
@07braves So Our Lord had to obey the Law, yet the Blessed Mother didn't? Now I am not following you. I don't care if it doesn't say so in Scripture. Scripture also doesn't tell us of the Incarnation. Nor is the Word Trinity used. Nor is the word Bible. I am also willing to bet that you believe in the Feast of the Dedication, even though the source of it is nowhere to be found in your "bible"
@evi410 playing with words again huh?..of course it doesnt say trinity yet we know it is applied, FATHER ,SON ,HOLY GHOST. So you like to add to scripture, better think about what you are saying..REV. 22:18,19. take care , hope to talk to you later.
@07braves I see, so one standard 4 urself, another for Catholics. Of course it doesn't say she was sinless, but we know how it is applied. She is full of Grace, she is the New Eve, she is the New Ark, etc.
The verse from Rev is about THAT book, not Scripture. Nowhere does it say not to add to Scripture(it says not to add to the Word of God). But do tell, what is the Feast of the Dedication John 10:22. Here's a hint, you won't find it in your "bible."
@evi410 now its my turn friend, to ask you a few questions that are in the BIBLE, not outside, you should know these more than a book that is not in the BIBLE. What does daniel 9:24-27 mean, give its full answer.
ur turn? U didn't answer my questions. btw, The Feast of the Dedication IS in the Bible, I gave you the verse. The full answer 2 ur question wouldn't fit here. I'll abrev one AFTER you answer my question. What is the Feast of the Dedication and why was Our Lord in Jerusalem to celebrate it?
@evi410 playing with words again huh?..of course it doesnt say trinity yet we know it is applied, FATHER ,SON ,HOLY GHOST. So you like to add to scripture, better think about what you are saying..REV. 22:18,19. take care , hope to talk to you later.
@evi410 The scriptures are plain and decided about the fact that Jesus had brothers and sisters. "Is not this the carpenter's son?," the Jews asked, "is not his mother called Mary? And his brethren, James, and Joses, and Simon, and Judas? And his sisters, are thy not all with us? Whence then hath this man all these things?" (Matt. 13: 55, 56). It is evident that the Greek adelphos (brothers/sisters) is used in the case of Jesus' brothers and sisters in the flesh.
@07braves Again, is He the carpenter's Son? NO! So if the bystandars were wrong about that then they can be wrong about Him having blood bros/sis. Such people also say He was possessed in the Word. Comments from onlookers are not always accurate. Further, Sarah is called Abraham's sister even though they had different mothers Gen20:12, therefore bro/sis does not always mean what you think it means.
@evi410 rethink your thoughts on Mary not having sex with Joseph, and probably having children which are mentioned as Jesus brothers and sisters several times in the WORD..check Matthew 1:25..And he knew her not till she had brought forth her FIRSTBORN son: and he called his name JESUS." Matthew 1:25
notice that word "TILL", that means waited until after Mary 1st born JESUS, then they consumated the marriage...theres that word "TILL"
@07braves Don't need to rethink my thoughts. If u are going to rely on bystandars comments about Our Lord as Gospel then you must also accept that St. Joseph is His father(which he isn't!) The very same verses that talk about bros/sis also refer to Him being the SON OF THE CARPENTER.
Second, till does not denote action after, but rather lack of action before. The Word Till is used Gen8:7, the bird NEVER returned.
@evi410 you are simply denying things directly in your face, WHY would the Bible (GOD BREATHED), say Mary and Joseph waited until after Jesus was born, because thats what they did, they waited to consumate their marriage, God was telling us they indeed waited, but there is that word TILL..that means after Jesus was born they of course truly became 1 flesh, they KNEW each other. this till definatly tells us that, dont play with words. if they didnt have sex, why would God use the word TILL.
why would the Bible(GOD BREATHED) say that the raven didn't return till the waters dried up even though the raven never returned? The word is used to prove what did/didn't happen BEFORE not after. There are many many more examples of till used when NOTHING happened afterwards. I can list several.
If till means definitely then show me where the raven returned? He used the word to show that she was a Virgin at the time, not to show that she wasn't afterwards.
@evi410 anyone reading the text would see it the way i see it, till.. meaning after Jesus birth, they (joseph and Mary) did resume their marriage FULLY. You are reading into the text to fit RCC doctrine.
@07braves I see, so now that u have been given proof that till doesn't always do note action after, you appointed yourself the person who gets to decide its mean when it is used?
Be honest, is the point of that verse to assure us of the Virgin Birth or is it the point to tell us of what happened afterwards? It is my understanding that the Nativity is about Our Lord.
Still whating 4 you 3 tell me what the Feast of the Dedication is.
@evi410 i agree it is showing that Christ was born of a virgin, no argument, what i am saying is that it says that Mary and Joseph didnt KNOW each other TILL after Jesus birth, as we have discussed. why would God even mention about them KNOWING each other at all unless he was telling us that they did so AFTER JESUS birth. its clear cut my friend. I just let some people read that scripture today. ..cont..
@07braves cont..non christians and christians, on both sides they read and seen it as i have already stated, i told them nothing about the verse except what "know" meant within the Bible, and again they seen it as Mary and Joseph had no sexual relations UNTIL after JESUS birth, anything outside of what the verse says is assuming something you cant prove, but in the verse it proves itself in its words they didnt know each other TILL..meaning after.
I don't care what popular opinion is! Now if you honestly want to tell me that the point of that verse is to make a statement about the Blessed Mother after and is not about Our Lord's Conception and Birth, then be my guest. But I know that you won't do that. B/c you know it isn't true. The statement is about Our Lord. Scripture proves that "until" doesn't always mean action after. I ahve given example.
@evi410 go ahead ..twist everything i say, i know that the verse speaks of Christ virgin birth, yet it also eradicates the false doctrine of perpetual virginity
Then why are u trying to make it about something else? It indicates no such thing. Btw the raven when to and fro until the waters receeded, then it never returned.
It doesn't say that. It says they didn't know each other before. That is all. And they didn't. God is telling us that b/c He is showing us of the Virgin Birth and Conception. What a silly question.
If it was clear sut why would God say the raven didn't return until the water dried.......when in fact the raven NEVER returned. You are ignoring other Scripture so u can make your heresy fit.
@evi410 what you are saying is completely contrary to scripture..the raven indeed returned..it went TO AND FRO..again in original hebrew ..going forth and RETURNING.
@evi410 you my friend are twisting scripture, you need to repent, something as simple as the raven you cant even get that correct..in english and in hebrew. i have noticed that the catholic bible , douay rheims bible, is the 1 bible that doesnt say to and fro as the meaning as in hebrew going forth and RETURNING.
So yuou are saying that the raven returned? Can I get a verse on that? ANd don't get me started on the errors in kjv.
If until means that action always happens after then tell me, are people forgive after death?
Isaias22
14 And the voice of the Lord of hosts was revealed in my ears: Surely this iniquity shall not be forgiven you till you die, saith the Lord God of hosts.
@evi410 ..genesis 8:7..and he sent forth, which went to and fro, until THE WATERS were dried up from off the earth.( how did it go to and fro until the waters dried up) it went to and fro meaning it went out and came back, it couldnt do this if water was still there, it couldnt land, it would have drown of course..in the hebrew text, i looked up and have a hebrew translation in my Bible clearly says .."GOING FORTH and RETURNING"
Y can't u understand this. the Hebrew language was corrupted in the council of Jamnia. Stop citing this corrupt verse as ur source. The bird never returned after the waters dried.
@evi410 what are you saying, im not sure how you want me to answer, where did it happen? Jerusalem, Epiphanes was a forerunner of a type of anti-christ, he desecrated the temple of God (PHYSICALLY) killed many of the hebrew nation, had them killed right on the altar, slaughtered a pig on the altar (maccabees). , the story is true itself but even in macabees, it has historical errors, time periods etc, some Rabbis have admitted this, as well as history shows the discrepancies .
And where is this God Breathed miracle in Scripture? Where are the Jews told to celebrate this as a sanctioned Feast?
Look, if you are going to use rabbis, who Our Lord says ae of the devil, as your source don't get shocked when you find yourself following who they follow.
Either the Feast and the miracle are of God or they aren't. Our Lord and the Evangelist thought they were. Why do you think otherwise?
@evi410 i looked at the verse of the raven..it says."and he sent forth a raven, which went to and fro , UNTIL the waters were dried up from the earth (in hebrew= in going forth and returning)..it did not leave and never came back , it returned several times..it still points out that Mary did indeed have sexual relations with Joseph after JESUS birth AND KNEW HER NOT TILL..
Read the entire passage, it went to and fro and when it failed to return the waters had receeded.
He so if I don't meet you until I die, does that mean that I will meet u after I die?
Please don't act the expert on Hebrew. If u were you would know that the jews changed the meaning of words by adding points at the council of Jamnia. Again, u follow the synagogue of satan and you are follow their father.
@evi410 i hate to tell you..ROME is the seat of SATAN always has been, always will be. satan certainly dwells there.all the paganism within that city is so very clear and overflowing.
@07braves Please read Scripture. Start with Rev2:9. Rev3:9 and Rev.22:8
They are the Synagogue and Jerusalem is compared to Egypt. There are many other verses. So don't preach that Rome is against God when oyu don't even know the basics.
I think you should know that I am boycotting smithfield. Until the day I die I will not buy their product. I have to wonder, according to your logic, will my corpse be comsuming a lot of ham after death?
@evi410 paganism # 1“The children gather wood, and the fathers kindle the fire, and the women knead their dough, to make cakes to the QUEEN OF HEAVEN...that they may provoke me to anger” -Jeremiah 7:18. Isnt that marys' title? sure is!
Well, unless you are claiming that the Blessed Mother is eternal, then you can't apply that to her. There was no Queen of Heaven at the time, so to honor any as queen would have been paganism.
@evi410 we need to deal with a little history before going forward, beast #1 was babylon, beast #2 was medo-persia, beast #3 was greece, so logically beast #4 is the beast that conquered greece..who was that?? the roman empire correct?, the iron beast. then the demise hit the roman beast and 10 horns were upon it, and a LITTLE HORN rose up on the beast and removed 3 horns. the end of the roman empire came from the goth barbarians, yet the empire survived its WOUND..HOW??..the holy roman empire
@07braves part 2 have you noticed that the beast in daniel 7 and 12, have the same time period of rulership as in REV. 11, 12 and 13? time, times and a half a time, 42 months, 1260 days or 1260 prophetic YEARS (EZEK.4:6). have you also noticed that the beast of REV. 13 has a WOUND!!?, we both know that the pagan roman beast is the 1 that ruled in Jesus day, even up into the time of his rise into Heaven, YET another beast rises up in REV. 13, that has that wound, and yet it has the same marks..
I see a load of speculation on your part. But Scripture tells us that Israel is the new Egypt. That is in black and white. Btw, you can't even use half your comments w/o using Macc. lol. Care to contradict yourself anymore?
@evi410 where is this speculation, if you cannot see the roman beast of daniel the 4th beast, and NOT see it in Rev.11,12,and 13..then you are truly blinded, im sorry, take care.
@07braves The speculation is you filling in Rome in the blank. Nowhere is this said, and u use Macc to try to make your case. I can't even follow your own rules.
@evi410 we have to back to the 4th beast..WHO DO YOU SEE AS THE 4th BEAST, it conquered greece, clear as a bell in daniel, and you see the time frames also in REV. chapters:11, 12, 13. what empire was in rule during Jesus day??? ADMIT who this is and we can go from there.
This 1st beast with 7 heads and 10 horns, is probably the whole company of infidels, enemies and persecutors of the people of God, from the beginning 2 the end of the world. The 7 heads R 7 kings or 7 principal kingdoms, which have/shall exercise, power over the people of God; of these, 5 were then fallen the Egyptian, Assyrian, Chaldean, Persian, and Grecian monarchies: 1 was present the empire of Rome: and the 7th and chiefest was to come the great A/C and his empire.
@evi410 ..hello..we still have to go back to daniel, the 4th beast is the beast that had the 10 horns on it , in which is shown again in its appearance in REV., yet has a wound in REV. so knowing this beast to be the same in daniel as in REV., chapters 11, 12 and 13..again what beast was it in daniel?? it is the roman beast (EMPIRE, KINGDOM), so it is not all the nations combined cont...
@07braves part 2..the previous beast were taken over by this 4th beast..proof..REV.13:2...then look back at daniel for confirmation..."feet of a bear..MEDO-PERSIA, "mouth of a lion..BABYLON", " like unto a leopard..GREECE ", notice that ALL the previous empires were swallowed up by this 4th beast..and again it has a wound..this wound is when PAGAN rome was being decimated, and then another beast arose from pagan rome and SAVED this beast. CONT...
@07braves part 3..What beast arose from within the pagan roman beast, it is the HOLY ROMAN EMPIRE. , the roman beast was NEVER fully defeated, and we all know this. it lost its power to Napoleon, and thus it will arise again in REV. 17, in which is the EU. WATCH!!!..the 2nd beast is the false prophet, notice this........is not the vatican , the hill of prophecy..WE HAVE A MATCH.
And as the body of the beast was like to a leopard, the centre and capital of the Roman empire, under antichrist will be the Grecian empire, denoted by the leopard, of which Constantinople became the capital. Various interpreters explain the whole of this vision by different ways.
@07braves I have already asnwered that it was Rome. Some understand this of the mortal wound, which the idolatry of the Roman empire (signified by the sixth head) received from Constantine; which was, as it were, healed again by Julian the Apostate.
Yes, let us deal w/ history. Israel, before it was Israel, was a pagan country on a hill. God conquered it and made it His Own. Same with Rome, a pagan city on a hill(you know what Our Lord says about a city on a hill?), Gid conquered it and made it His Own.
Why don't u read the OT and see the similairities of the 2? Then read NT and see that it is the synagogue of satan, not Rome, that is bad?
@evi410 where did i say i was an expert in hebrew, i took the text in its original form, that is it.dont act like you have the correct translation, which deviates from the original text, especially from the latin vulgate into the d.rheims, there are so many errors in the vulgate .
The original? WOW! Where did you get a peak at the original manuscripts? U hiding it under ur bed?
I don't act like I have the correct translation. The Latin Vulgate is the only inerrant Scripture. I have the DR, which is the best translation. I don't have the LV, only the DR. There are NO errors in the Vulgate. And please don't now act the expert on Latin, since u have already failed at pretending 2 b an expert in Hebrew.
I have shown u where Paul is not sure that he is saved. I told u 2 read the parables where some people fall away. ALL of Scripture says u must work not jsut believe. So all of ur statement contradicts ALL of Scrip.
If you are refering to 2 Corinthians 12, Paul is not talking about Salvation, he is talking about a vision he had of Going to Heaven, he could not tell if he was taken in body form or he was dreaming, he could not tell. So that he will not boast, God gave him a thorn in the Flesh(vs 7, which I believe it was bad eyesight) Oh, Jesus did all the work nessary, all I have to do in come to Christ in Faith, and take him as my personal savior.
If you have not trusted in Jesus Christ yourself, then you will not go to heaven, even if you lived in a catholic church, confess every sin to every believer, if you have not taken Jesus Chirst as your savior, then you will not make it to heaven.
U can only trust in Christ if u trust in the Church He established. The Saraments are necessary. If u don't believe that then u don't believe Our Lord.
"U can only trust in Christ if u trust in the Church He established. The Saraments are necessary. If u don't believe that then u don't believe Our Lord" Show me where that is in the bible.
No 1Cor7:40. Plus he talks about how he MAY become a castaway.
U still need to do work. Many will call Lord Lord....
A person who hears His Words and does not DO them is like a fool. A person who hears His Words and DOES them is like a wise man. Do u even read the Gospels or do u jsut read Paul?
this is in reference to the sin of Death, only a believer can commit such a sin, someone who is saved. When a believer is in sin, God deals with him, that is an evident of salvation, if the believer continues in sin, then the lord deals with him more, and then the Lord takes him home. If a person is in sin, and God does not deal with him at all then the person is not really a Christian.
I don't override the Gospel. I live by it. The Gospel is that Christ died for our sins. Every sin we commit is covered under the blood, all sin, past, present and future sins. Think about it, when Jesus died on the cross, all your sins and my sins were in the future, they were already covered, we just need to accept it as is. For someone who is already saved, sin does not take away our salvation, but we can loose reward and fellowship.
Sure u do. The Gospel is that Christ Died and that we MUST pick up our crosses and follow Him. OLJC also taught that we must be perfect like God is perfect or we will be sent to prison UNTIL THE DEBT IS PAID.
catholics do work as a work, like they are requirements for salvation, not so with christians, our works are evidence and a result of the grace of God, Christian was to serve him and joyfully do it! its our very new nature, a new creature in christ jesus! even when i sin God loves me and isnt mad at me, he loves me the same
OMgosh! "ALL have sinned and fallen short of the glory of god" that means mary too! AND Pauls wors and teaching are that of JESUS CHRIST, The FATHER, THE HLOY SPIRIT RERAD 2TIMOTHY 3:16 PAULS words are JESUS' WORDS
and mary got it on with joseph, yes mary had sex had had lots of chldren!
Then "all" does not mean "all" does it? U claim Paul means EVERYONE has sinned, does "all" mean "all" or doesn't it? The Bible most certainly does state that she is the exception. She is the New Eve. Like the New Adam , she is w/o sin.
The New Cov is the Old prefected. There is nothing lacking. So there MUST be a New Eve and a New Ark....only better than the Old. Read Scripture as a whole, you will see.
It still never refers to Mary as the New Eve. In fact Eve is rarely mention at all in the Bible, 6 or 7 maybe 8 or 9 times at the most is she mention in Scripture, Still Mary is not mention as the new Eve.
So the Old has something the New does not have? And she most certainly is...Gen talks about the seed of THE WOMAN. Who do u think that is? # of mentions means nothing. JTB was only metioned a few times, is he unimportant. We are told she is the Mother of God.....that is all we need to hear.
Mary is NOT mother of God. In order to be mother of God, you must be God and you must have been around before God. Reading the Bible you will see that Jesus was around in the OT, even before anything was created. Mary was not like any other mother.
No, she is the Mother of God...or is Scripture wrong? She is the Mother of His Human Nature not His Divine Nature. Come on man this is elementary stuff here.
Trinity means Three in One, You find Three in One in the Bible, in 1 John 5:7, so lets call them the Three in One, let's be biblical. Mary is not mention in scripture a whole lot, but what it does not talk about her being a new anything, and it does not talk about her being without sin, or queen of heaven(which is a demon, thats in Jeremiah), or it does not talk about her being a new anything.
Paul's words are inspired. But they are not the same as Our Lord's Words. Script makes the distinction b/t the them when Peter writes that Paul is hard to understand. Paul is writting LETTERS. Our Lord is speaking to us.
Never does it say celebacy as a requirement for anykind of leadership weather be for Bishop or Deacon. It is commanded that if they want to marry, they must be allowed.
no it won't. Sin is not all equal. Our Lord says this Himself. If sin is not equal than it would be unjust to punish it equally. The Catholic God is Just. Not so the prot god.
sin is equal in the sense that any sin even the least will damn a person to hell. but there are sins or people who live more evil wicked rebelious lives than others will undergo greater torment!
Luke 12:47 And that servant who knew his master's will, and did not prepare [himself] or do according to his will, shall be beaten with many [stripes].
adam & eve sinned 1 time & were cast out of his presence into a barren wasteland & if not for Jesus adam & eve would have went to hell along w/ all of us! God is so HOLY not 1 sin can ever be in his presence, LUCIFER SINNED 1 TIME AND WHERE IS HE? but hey if u want to pay money to get your sin forgiven or to spend less time in purgatory thats fine, go pay your indulgedces, but MY JESUS paid for my sins on the cross at calvarys mountain "IT IS FINISHED" -JESUS! salvation is a GIFT from God
Adam's sin was mortal. Satans sin was also. Indulgences are free, so is confession. Our Lord said that if we are not perfect than we will spend time in PRISON with TORTURERS. Read your Bible hun.
She was/is not sinful. But she needed a Savoir too. Christ saved her but in a different way than He saved us. She is not Immaculate b/c of her own doing but b/c of the ancticipated Merits of Christ.
I wonder, since he thinks all sin is equal, what he makes of this verse:
Jesus answered: Thou shouldst not have any power against me, unless it were given thee from above. Therefore, he that hath delivered me to thee, hath THE GREATER SIN.
Every sin will send you to hell, you will go to the same place. Stealing is no different than lying, cursing is no different than idol, boozing is no different than murder, and go on and on, they will all get you to the same place. But if you trust Christ as savior, then these sins will be forgiven.
Stealing and lying are both mortal sins. THere ARE differences in degrees....unless you think Our Lord is a liar when He said that the jews had the GREATER sin?
But it will send you to the same place, unless you have Jesus Christ as savior, I agree that the degrees of punishment will be different, basically the sins you commit and the light you recieve and rejected will be what the punishment will be. It will be easier for a young one, who rarely heard about the gospel and then someone who has been in church all his life and rejected the truth.
Eating meat on Friday, failing to praise God at the proper times, skipping prayer, laying in bed too long, slightly over eating, speeding....need I continue?
ok since we are under the new convenant lets make it simole and stick to the new testement k!
Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord"-- This means SIN not sins but ANY sin is punishable by eternal death seperated from God forever.
1Timothy 4:1 But the Spirit explicitly says that in later times some will fall away from the faith, paying attention to deceitful spirits and doctrines of demons,
1Ti 4:2 by means of the hypocrisy of liars seared in their own conscience as with a branding iron,
1Ti 4:3 {men} who forbid marriage {and advocate} abstaining from foods which God has created to be gratefully shared in by those who believe and know the truth.
1. The RCC was here b4 ur "church" so U came in later times.
2. I have no idea how u think this applies to the Church?
3. the RCC does not forbid marriage (Matt 19:12)and we abstain from meat b/c we like it, not b/c it is bad. That reference is 2 people who call food bad and demand abstaining ALL the time....like moslems jews and seventh day adventist.
Giving up good things for God is a praisworthy thing.
The real church is the Chirstian Church, every believer in Christ. Only those who have personally accepted Christ as their savior is apart of the True Church, if they don't then they are not apart of the True Church.
Then the "church" is a whore since it spawns and excepts confusion and rejects the necessity of Truth. I happen to know better. The Bible makes this clear
Yes. It speaks for itself. THe Church has never changed, every other denom has. The Church says there is ONE Truth, every other denom says only SOME Truth is essentials. OLJC is the way the TRUTH and the life. TO say some Truth is nonessential is to say that OLJC is nonessential.
Only Jesus Christ is truth, if the church is based their teachings on the Bible, then that church is a church of God, founded by Jesus Christ, regardless of when it was founded.
So every "church" that claims to be based on the BIble yet has different teachings...they all hear Our Lord and teach Truth? Sounds like confusion to me. The Church is the Mystical Body of Christ there is no contradiction b/t Him and the RCC.
There not all based on the Bible. A True church is an independent church, not affilliated with any denomination or other church group. We are all one in the same belief, independent from each other ,but follow Christ. If we all base on the Bible, then we will have the same belief. YEs we were around since Christ, this is what Christ intended, independent from each other, independent from nations, and other groups.
? Where does Scrip say the True Church is a collection of independent churches? lol. We are One like the Most Holy Trinity is One. OLJC spoke of THE Church not a church.
btw, NONE of the prots denoms are based on the Bibel. NONE!
I never said I was Prostant, the Pastor is to run the church with the help of the deacon board. Independent means in this case, one man or organization is to run all the churches, that is not what Christ intended. They are all together in a fact that they believe in Christ. Every Church that preaches the Bible is a Church of Christ.
7And when there had been much disputing, Peter, rising up, said 2 them: Men, brethren, u know, that in former days God made choice among us, that BY MY MOUTH the Gentiles should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.
Lk22
32But I have prayed 4 thee, that thy faith fail not: and thou, being once converted, confirm thy brethren.
Mtt16
18And I say 2 thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
Acts 15, is that we are to tell people what Christ has done for us, we are to do that even today. Luke 22:32 means that Jesus prays for those who follow him, Matt 16, means that Jesus build his church upon himself, through everyone that believes. The only reason why he said that to Peter is he was the first to respond. God is no repector of persons Romans 2:11, what I get is that every beleiver is equal in authority.
No, Acts is Peter announcing that Christ made coice that HE teach and gain beleivers.
Christ said I prayed FOR THEE. Not all of us(He does that in the garden). He prayed for Peter that PETER'S faith is infallible(that's what fail not means).
Where does it state that Christ said this b/c Peter respondeed first?
AGAIN, most people misinterprete Paul to their own destruction.
What Destruction are you talking about, if you are talking about hell, I can't go there now, I am sealed by the Holy Spirit, who lives inside me(1 Cor 6:19) because I have trusted in Jesus Christ as Savior, that is what gets me to Heaven(John 14:6) Also I know I am saved forever, because I have enternal life right now(1 John 5:13) There is a way you can know that you are saved(on the way to heaven.) Have you personally trusted in Jesus Christ alone for salvation, that is the only way the Heaven
Of course u can go to hell. I can through Script right back @ u to contradict what u have quoted. But it is no use since u are ur own interpreter of Scrip(which is condemmed by Scrip). Read the parables, a person can believe and not take root and fall away when hardship comes. Pick up ur Bible and read it. U are a PAUList, not a CHRISTian.
No I am not my own Interpreter, the Holy Spirit does it for me. Romans 8:16 the Holy Spirit witness to our spirit that we are children of God. John 1:12 Those who recieved him given power to be sons of God, when we become Children of God, how do we go back, show me where a Child of God did something where he is no longer a Child of God. If a Child of GOd can loose salvation, then many passages in Scripture don't mean what they say.
lol. how many prots make that claim and yet u all contradict each other. The Church interpretes PERIOD. Acts8:31.
The passages dn't mean what u THINK they say, but they still mean what they really say.
Matth13
21 Yet hath he not root in himself, but is only for a time: and when there ariseth tribulation and persecution because of the word, he is presently scandalized
The verse in Acts is not saying that only church officials can interpert scripture, that is saying that Believers led by the Holy Spirit can interpret scripture. The Eunuch was not saved, so he could not. The Parable of the Sower, the first two people were never saved, and the last two did get saved. You cannot loose salvation, but you can loose fellowship and you can loose reward(1 Corinthians 3:15)
The verse in Acts is not saying that only church officials can interpert scripture, that is saying that Believers led by the Holy Spirit can interpret scripture. The Eunuch was not saved, so he could not. The Parable of the Sower, the first two people were never saved, and the last two did get saved. You cannot loose salvation, but you can loose fellowship and you can loose reward(1 Corinthians 3:15)
The Rivials of late 1800's, where many Got Saved, Leaders like Dwight Moody, who lead many to the Lord. Moody was not roman catholic, he was a man of God. Many of the great hymms were created by non-catholics. So if it lead many people to repentence, many people were won to Jesus Christ, then how is that not of God?
How do u know that they were saved. How do u know they were won for Christ? If they followed error then they were NOT won, unless u think error is of God?
If they were faking it, believe me, they did a real good job, they were really good actors. You can only go so far in faking something, that is especially Christianity, you can only go so far.
pt 8 look at what this beast does in REV. 13.."makes war with the saints and overcomes them".Under the influence of Germanic customs and concepts, torture was little used , but with the revival of Roman law the practice was reestablished.In 1252 Innocent IV sanctioned the infliction of torture by the civil authorities upon heretics, and torture came to have a recognized place in the procedure of the inquisitional courts.(New Catholic Encyc., "Inquisition", "Massacre of St Barth.)
07braves 1 year ago
I have news for you, killing was used by the Israelites and sactioned BY GOD.....man, woman, child, INFANT and animal. David beheaded people and one warrior cut off a kings fingers(sounds like torture to me).
Oh and then there is Matt8:16, Mark9:41, Luke17:2, Luke19:27, Luke12:47, Matt18:24-25, etc, etc, etc.
If you have a problem with the Inquisition then you have a problem with the OT and Our Lord. READ SCRIPTURE!
evi410 1 year ago
Don't forget that the prots ahd their own inquistions. History shows them to have been brutal. W/o the Catholic Inquisition the moslems and jews would have overtaken Europe. Soon you prots will be begging the Church to defend you.
evi410 1 year ago
part 7.."Long ages ago, when Rome through the neglect of the Western emperors was left to the mercy of the barbarous hordes, the Romans turned to one figure for aid and protection, and asked him to rule them; and thus, . . . commenced the temporal sovereignty of the popes. And meekly stepping to the throne of Caesar, the vicar of Christ took up the scepter to which the emperors and kings of Europe were to bow in reverence through so many ages."--American Catholic Quarterly Review, April, 1911.
07braves 1 year ago
part 6 about 500 A.D., when the Roman Empire was crumbling to pieces:] "No, the [Catholic] Church will not descend into the tomb. It will survive the Empire . . . At length a second empire will arise, and of this empire the Pope will be the master--more then this, he will be the master of Europe. He will dictate his orders to kings who will obey them"--Andrea Lagarde, The Latin Church in the Middle Ages, 1915, p. vi.
THIS IS THE REV. 13 BEAST ..remember the horns on the daniel beast.
07braves 1 year ago
part #5 It [the Catholic Church] is a political creation, and as imposing as a World-Empire, because [it is a continuation of] the Roman Empire. The Pope, who calls himself 'King' and 'Pontifex Maximus' [the title of the Roman Emperor in the time of Christ], is Caesar's successor."--Adolf Harnack, What is Christianity? 1963, pp. 269-270.
07braves 1 year ago
part #4 "Whatever Roman elements the barbarians and Aryans left . . . [came] under the protection of the Bishop of Rome, who was the chief person there after the Emperor's disappearance . . . The Roman Church in this way privily pushed itself into the place of the Roman World-Empire, of which it is the actual continuation; the empire has not perished, but has only undergone a transformation . . . cont..
07braves 1 year ago
part 3..it has the same marks as the original beast in Daniel, the horns etc. so this tells us its the roman beast but it transformed into a creature that has risen again that had the WOUND (STRESSING THE WOUND), the wound came from the beatings it took from the barbarians...and again this would be the Holy Roman empire that took over for the pagan roman empire. cont..
07braves 1 year ago
Protestanism cooked up "the essentials" to blur denominational divisions.
AtomicMonster454 1 year ago
if were concieved into sin by "law" or logic, you are a sinner who commits sins,, ALL of us....We are not sinners because we sin but rather we sin because we are all sinners it is our nature!
educatedthug15 2 years ago
U are confusing the stain of sin with actual sin.
evi410 2 years ago
Eph 5:25 Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ also loved the church and gave Himself up for her
Eph 5:26 so that He might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the WASHING of WATER with the word,
educatedthug15 2 years ago 2
and if mary was not sinful why did she need a savior lol come on...
educatedthug15 2 years ago
She needed someone to save her from being concieved ionto sin in the first place. God does not need to save her the same way He saved us. Have u ever been a pedophile? prob not! is that b/c anything YOU did? NO! It is b/c God saved u from such sin. Does that make u in any less need of a Savoir? NO!
evi410 2 years ago
Show me from scripture where it says she did not sinned, do you think that the scriptures would say such on this matter.
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
I don't go be Scipture alone. I live by EVERY Word from the Mouth of God...not just the written Words. Ang AGAIN, Scriptrue says it but not in a direct sentence....like with the Tinity. The word is not used but the idea is there. "Full of Grace" means w/o sin.
evi410 2 years ago
where?
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
IN every statement u have made thus far.
evi410 2 years ago
so mary never sinned lol what a joke
educatedthug15 2 years ago
That's right she never sinned. I fail to see the joke? Do u think that God can't conquer sin?
evi410 2 years ago
@evi410... yet mary called Jesus her SAVIOR..why???, because she too needed a savior.
07braves 1 year ago
@07braves This si a silly question. She needed a Savior too, nobody denies that. The Church has never made the claim that she was sinless of her own doing or merit. She was saved, by Our Lord, in that she was preserved from sin. By the anticipated merits of Our Lord God saved her from sin by His Grace, thus He saved her too, but in a different way then He saved us.
evi410 1 year ago
@evi410 yet the Bible does not say she was sinless., she also had to make a sin offering of cleansing of childbirth..SIN OFFERING, and # 2 this pretty much also destroys the perpetual virginty of Mary. she gave birth (NATURAL), Jesus also had half brothers and sisters. JOSEPH was a father., and he had his wife MARY, did he not?
07braves 1 year ago
@07braves The Bible doesn't say a lot of things, yet you believe them. Sin offering was the Law, she was sinless so she obeyed the Law. Our Lord was sinless so He didn't have to Die, yet He obeyed.
And no the Blessed Mother did not have children with St. Joseph. There is no evidence that she did. funny that you claim I can't believe something that isn't in the Bible then u turn around and make claim about something that ISN'T IN THE BIBLE.
evi410 1 year ago
@evi410 im not sure im following you, saying Mary was sinless (which is NOT in the BIBLE),, and going to Christ (who was sinless, and it WAS said in the Bible), he died because he obeyed because he knew he had to do so to give us redemption. cont.
07braves 1 year ago
@07braves So Our Lord had to obey the Law, yet the Blessed Mother didn't? Now I am not following you. I don't care if it doesn't say so in Scripture. Scripture also doesn't tell us of the Incarnation. Nor is the Word Trinity used. Nor is the word Bible. I am also willing to bet that you believe in the Feast of the Dedication, even though the source of it is nowhere to be found in your "bible"
evi410 1 year ago
@evi410 playing with words again huh?..of course it doesnt say trinity yet we know it is applied, FATHER ,SON ,HOLY GHOST. So you like to add to scripture, better think about what you are saying..REV. 22:18,19. take care , hope to talk to you later.
07braves 1 year ago
@07braves I see, so one standard 4 urself, another for Catholics. Of course it doesn't say she was sinless, but we know how it is applied. She is full of Grace, she is the New Eve, she is the New Ark, etc.
The verse from Rev is about THAT book, not Scripture. Nowhere does it say not to add to Scripture(it says not to add to the Word of God). But do tell, what is the Feast of the Dedication John 10:22. Here's a hint, you won't find it in your "bible."
evi410 1 year ago
@evi410 now its my turn friend, to ask you a few questions that are in the BIBLE, not outside, you should know these more than a book that is not in the BIBLE. What does daniel 9:24-27 mean, give its full answer.
07braves 1 year ago
ur turn? U didn't answer my questions. btw, The Feast of the Dedication IS in the Bible, I gave you the verse. The full answer 2 ur question wouldn't fit here. I'll abrev one AFTER you answer my question. What is the Feast of the Dedication and why was Our Lord in Jerusalem to celebrate it?
evi410 1 year ago
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@evi410 playing with words again huh?..of course it doesnt say trinity yet we know it is applied, FATHER ,SON ,HOLY GHOST. So you like to add to scripture, better think about what you are saying..REV. 22:18,19. take care , hope to talk to you later.
07braves 1 year ago
@evi410 The scriptures are plain and decided about the fact that Jesus had brothers and sisters. "Is not this the carpenter's son?," the Jews asked, "is not his mother called Mary? And his brethren, James, and Joses, and Simon, and Judas? And his sisters, are thy not all with us? Whence then hath this man all these things?" (Matt. 13: 55, 56). It is evident that the Greek adelphos (brothers/sisters) is used in the case of Jesus' brothers and sisters in the flesh.
07braves 1 year ago
@07braves Again, is He the carpenter's Son? NO! So if the bystandars were wrong about that then they can be wrong about Him having blood bros/sis. Such people also say He was possessed in the Word. Comments from onlookers are not always accurate. Further, Sarah is called Abraham's sister even though they had different mothers Gen20:12, therefore bro/sis does not always mean what you think it means.
evi410 1 year ago
@evi410 rethink your thoughts on Mary not having sex with Joseph, and probably having children which are mentioned as Jesus brothers and sisters several times in the WORD..check Matthew 1:25..And he knew her not till she had brought forth her FIRSTBORN son: and he called his name JESUS." Matthew 1:25
notice that word "TILL", that means waited until after Mary 1st born JESUS, then they consumated the marriage...theres that word "TILL"
07braves 1 year ago
@07braves Don't need to rethink my thoughts. If u are going to rely on bystandars comments about Our Lord as Gospel then you must also accept that St. Joseph is His father(which he isn't!) The very same verses that talk about bros/sis also refer to Him being the SON OF THE CARPENTER.
Second, till does not denote action after, but rather lack of action before. The Word Till is used Gen8:7, the bird NEVER returned.
evi410 1 year ago
@evi410 you are simply denying things directly in your face, WHY would the Bible (GOD BREATHED), say Mary and Joseph waited until after Jesus was born, because thats what they did, they waited to consumate their marriage, God was telling us they indeed waited, but there is that word TILL..that means after Jesus was born they of course truly became 1 flesh, they KNEW each other. this till definatly tells us that, dont play with words. if they didnt have sex, why would God use the word TILL.
07braves 1 year ago
why would the Bible(GOD BREATHED) say that the raven didn't return till the waters dried up even though the raven never returned? The word is used to prove what did/didn't happen BEFORE not after. There are many many more examples of till used when NOTHING happened afterwards. I can list several.
If till means definitely then show me where the raven returned? He used the word to show that she was a Virgin at the time, not to show that she wasn't afterwards.
evi410 1 year ago
@evi410 anyone reading the text would see it the way i see it, till.. meaning after Jesus birth, they (joseph and Mary) did resume their marriage FULLY. You are reading into the text to fit RCC doctrine.
07braves 1 year ago
@07braves I see, so now that u have been given proof that till doesn't always do note action after, you appointed yourself the person who gets to decide its mean when it is used?
Be honest, is the point of that verse to assure us of the Virgin Birth or is it the point to tell us of what happened afterwards? It is my understanding that the Nativity is about Our Lord.
Still whating 4 you 3 tell me what the Feast of the Dedication is.
evi410 1 year ago
@evi410 i never said that, it is basic to see it that way of anyone that would read that text..and you know that.
07braves 1 year ago
@07braves It is not basic to see that. The basic is to see that the statement is made to prove the Virgin Birth. PERIOD.
evi410 1 year ago
@evi410 i agree it is showing that Christ was born of a virgin, no argument, what i am saying is that it says that Mary and Joseph didnt KNOW each other TILL after Jesus birth, as we have discussed. why would God even mention about them KNOWING each other at all unless he was telling us that they did so AFTER JESUS birth. its clear cut my friend. I just let some people read that scripture today. ..cont..
07braves 1 year ago
@07braves cont..non christians and christians, on both sides they read and seen it as i have already stated, i told them nothing about the verse except what "know" meant within the Bible, and again they seen it as Mary and Joseph had no sexual relations UNTIL after JESUS birth, anything outside of what the verse says is assuming something you cant prove, but in the verse it proves itself in its words they didnt know each other TILL..meaning after.
07braves 1 year ago
I don't care what popular opinion is! Now if you honestly want to tell me that the point of that verse is to make a statement about the Blessed Mother after and is not about Our Lord's Conception and Birth, then be my guest. But I know that you won't do that. B/c you know it isn't true. The statement is about Our Lord. Scripture proves that "until" doesn't always mean action after. I ahve given example.
evi410 1 year ago
@evi410 go ahead ..twist everything i say, i know that the verse speaks of Christ virgin birth, yet it also eradicates the false doctrine of perpetual virginity
07braves 1 year ago
Then why are u trying to make it about something else? It indicates no such thing. Btw the raven when to and fro until the waters receeded, then it never returned.
evi410 1 year ago
It doesn't say that. It says they didn't know each other before. That is all. And they didn't. God is telling us that b/c He is showing us of the Virgin Birth and Conception. What a silly question.
If it was clear sut why would God say the raven didn't return until the water dried.......when in fact the raven NEVER returned. You are ignoring other Scripture so u can make your heresy fit.
evi410 1 year ago
@evi410 what you are saying is completely contrary to scripture..the raven indeed returned..it went TO AND FRO..again in original hebrew ..going forth and RETURNING.
07braves 1 year ago
@evi410 you my friend are twisting scripture, you need to repent, something as simple as the raven you cant even get that correct..in english and in hebrew. i have noticed that the catholic bible , douay rheims bible, is the 1 bible that doesnt say to and fro as the meaning as in hebrew going forth and RETURNING.
07braves 1 year ago
So yuou are saying that the raven returned? Can I get a verse on that? ANd don't get me started on the errors in kjv.
If until means that action always happens after then tell me, are people forgive after death?
Isaias22
14 And the voice of the Lord of hosts was revealed in my ears: Surely this iniquity shall not be forgiven you till you die, saith the Lord God of hosts.
evi410 1 year ago
@evi410 ..genesis 8:7..and he sent forth, which went to and fro, until THE WATERS were dried up from off the earth.( how did it go to and fro until the waters dried up) it went to and fro meaning it went out and came back, it couldnt do this if water was still there, it couldnt land, it would have drown of course..in the hebrew text, i looked up and have a hebrew translation in my Bible clearly says .."GOING FORTH and RETURNING"
07braves 1 year ago
Y can't u understand this. the Hebrew language was corrupted in the council of Jamnia. Stop citing this corrupt verse as ur source. The bird never returned after the waters dried.
evi410 1 year ago
@evi410 its Hanukkah., with the problems of Epiphanes.
07braves 1 year ago
@07braves All you did was repeat the question, since Hanukka simply means "Dedication."
I ask AGAIN, since you do believe things that aren't in Scripture, where and where is the Feast of the Dedication?
evi410 1 year ago
@evi410 what are you saying, im not sure how you want me to answer, where did it happen? Jerusalem, Epiphanes was a forerunner of a type of anti-christ, he desecrated the temple of God (PHYSICALLY) killed many of the hebrew nation, had them killed right on the altar, slaughtered a pig on the altar (maccabees). , the story is true itself but even in macabees, it has historical errors, time periods etc, some Rabbis have admitted this, as well as history shows the discrepancies .
07braves 1 year ago
And where is this God Breathed miracle in Scripture? Where are the Jews told to celebrate this as a sanctioned Feast?
Look, if you are going to use rabbis, who Our Lord says ae of the devil, as your source don't get shocked when you find yourself following who they follow.
Either the Feast and the miracle are of God or they aren't. Our Lord and the Evangelist thought they were. Why do you think otherwise?
evi410 1 year ago
@evi410 i looked at the verse of the raven..it says."and he sent forth a raven, which went to and fro , UNTIL the waters were dried up from the earth (in hebrew= in going forth and returning)..it did not leave and never came back , it returned several times..it still points out that Mary did indeed have sexual relations with Joseph after JESUS birth AND KNEW HER NOT TILL..
07braves 1 year ago
Read the entire passage, it went to and fro and when it failed to return the waters had receeded.
He so if I don't meet you until I die, does that mean that I will meet u after I die?
Please don't act the expert on Hebrew. If u were you would know that the jews changed the meaning of words by adding points at the council of Jamnia. Again, u follow the synagogue of satan and you are follow their father.
evi410 1 year ago
@evi410 i hate to tell you..ROME is the seat of SATAN always has been, always will be. satan certainly dwells there.all the paganism within that city is so very clear and overflowing.
07braves 1 year ago
@07braves Please read Scripture. Start with Rev2:9. Rev3:9 and Rev.22:8
They are the Synagogue and Jerusalem is compared to Egypt. There are many other verses. So don't preach that Rome is against God when oyu don't even know the basics.
evi410 1 year ago
I think you should know that I am boycotting smithfield. Until the day I die I will not buy their product. I have to wonder, according to your logic, will my corpse be comsuming a lot of ham after death?
What paganism is going on in Rome?
evi410 1 year ago
@evi410 paganism # 1“The children gather wood, and the fathers kindle the fire, and the women knead their dough, to make cakes to the QUEEN OF HEAVEN...that they may provoke me to anger” -Jeremiah 7:18. Isnt that marys' title? sure is!
07braves 1 year ago
Well, unless you are claiming that the Blessed Mother is eternal, then you can't apply that to her. There was no Queen of Heaven at the time, so to honor any as queen would have been paganism.
evi410 1 year ago
@evi410 we need to deal with a little history before going forward, beast #1 was babylon, beast #2 was medo-persia, beast #3 was greece, so logically beast #4 is the beast that conquered greece..who was that?? the roman empire correct?, the iron beast. then the demise hit the roman beast and 10 horns were upon it, and a LITTLE HORN rose up on the beast and removed 3 horns. the end of the roman empire came from the goth barbarians, yet the empire survived its WOUND..HOW??..the holy roman empire
07braves 1 year ago
@07braves part 2 have you noticed that the beast in daniel 7 and 12, have the same time period of rulership as in REV. 11, 12 and 13? time, times and a half a time, 42 months, 1260 days or 1260 prophetic YEARS (EZEK.4:6). have you also noticed that the beast of REV. 13 has a WOUND!!?, we both know that the pagan roman beast is the 1 that ruled in Jesus day, even up into the time of his rise into Heaven, YET another beast rises up in REV. 13, that has that wound, and yet it has the same marks..
07braves 1 year ago
I see a load of speculation on your part. But Scripture tells us that Israel is the new Egypt. That is in black and white. Btw, you can't even use half your comments w/o using Macc. lol. Care to contradict yourself anymore?
evi410 1 year ago
@evi410 where is this speculation, if you cannot see the roman beast of daniel the 4th beast, and NOT see it in Rev.11,12,and 13..then you are truly blinded, im sorry, take care.
07braves 1 year ago
@07braves The speculation is you filling in Rome in the blank. Nowhere is this said, and u use Macc to try to make your case. I can't even follow your own rules.
evi410 1 year ago
@evi410 so you are telling me the next great beast..the 4th beast wasnt the roman empire?
07braves 1 year ago
Either you are purposely flubbing ur language or u are asking an absurd question. The "next" beast "wasn't" doesn't make sense.
Now, u tell me, what does Scripture say is the next Egypt? Who is the synagogue of satan?
If killing and torturing saints is a mark of the beast, then u can't count out prots b/c you all had much more brutal inqusitions.
I'm still waiting to hear of paganism going on in the Holy See.
evi410 1 year ago
@evi410 we have to back to the 4th beast..WHO DO YOU SEE AS THE 4th BEAST, it conquered greece, clear as a bell in daniel, and you see the time frames also in REV. chapters:11, 12, 13. what empire was in rule during Jesus day??? ADMIT who this is and we can go from there.
07braves 1 year ago
This 1st beast with 7 heads and 10 horns, is probably the whole company of infidels, enemies and persecutors of the people of God, from the beginning 2 the end of the world. The 7 heads R 7 kings or 7 principal kingdoms, which have/shall exercise, power over the people of God; of these, 5 were then fallen the Egyptian, Assyrian, Chaldean, Persian, and Grecian monarchies: 1 was present the empire of Rome: and the 7th and chiefest was to come the great A/C and his empire.
evi410 1 year ago
@07braves Now you tell me, did God conquer a pagan city on a hill and make it His Own in the OC? Why do you think He wouldn't do the same for the NC?
evi410 1 year ago
@evi410 thats a strange thought, never thought about it...sorry.
07braves 1 year ago
B/c you havne't thought about it, that makes it not true? God is Immutable. I f He did it once, it is not beyond reason that He will do it again.
evi410 1 year ago
@evi410 ..hello..we still have to go back to daniel, the 4th beast is the beast that had the 10 horns on it , in which is shown again in its appearance in REV., yet has a wound in REV. so knowing this beast to be the same in daniel as in REV., chapters 11, 12 and 13..again what beast was it in daniel?? it is the roman beast (EMPIRE, KINGDOM), so it is not all the nations combined cont...
07braves 1 year ago
@07braves part 2..the previous beast were taken over by this 4th beast..proof..REV.13:2...then look back at daniel for confirmation..."feet of a bear..MEDO-PERSIA, "mouth of a lion..BABYLON", " like unto a leopard..GREECE ", notice that ALL the previous empires were swallowed up by this 4th beast..and again it has a wound..this wound is when PAGAN rome was being decimated, and then another beast arose from pagan rome and SAVED this beast. CONT...
07braves 1 year ago
@07braves part 3..What beast arose from within the pagan roman beast, it is the HOLY ROMAN EMPIRE. , the roman beast was NEVER fully defeated, and we all know this. it lost its power to Napoleon, and thus it will arise again in REV. 17, in which is the EU. WATCH!!!..the 2nd beast is the false prophet, notice this........is not the vatican , the hill of prophecy..WE HAVE A MATCH.
07braves 1 year ago
@07braves The Vatican is NOT Rome.
evi410 1 year ago
And as the body of the beast was like to a leopard, the centre and capital of the Roman empire, under antichrist will be the Grecian empire, denoted by the leopard, of which Constantinople became the capital. Various interpreters explain the whole of this vision by different ways.
Now answer my questions.
evi410 1 year ago
@07braves I have already asnwered that it was Rome. Some understand this of the mortal wound, which the idolatry of the Roman empire (signified by the sixth head) received from Constantine; which was, as it were, healed again by Julian the Apostate.
evi410 1 year ago
Yes, let us deal w/ history. Israel, before it was Israel, was a pagan country on a hill. God conquered it and made it His Own. Same with Rome, a pagan city on a hill(you know what Our Lord says about a city on a hill?), Gid conquered it and made it His Own.
Why don't u read the OT and see the similairities of the 2? Then read NT and see that it is the synagogue of satan, not Rome, that is bad?
evi410 1 year ago
@evi410 where did i say i was an expert in hebrew, i took the text in its original form, that is it.dont act like you have the correct translation, which deviates from the original text, especially from the latin vulgate into the d.rheims, there are so many errors in the vulgate .
07braves 1 year ago
The original? WOW! Where did you get a peak at the original manuscripts? U hiding it under ur bed?
I don't act like I have the correct translation. The Latin Vulgate is the only inerrant Scripture. I have the DR, which is the best translation. I don't have the LV, only the DR. There are NO errors in the Vulgate. And please don't now act the expert on Latin, since u have already failed at pretending 2 b an expert in Hebrew.
evi410 1 year ago
Oh, and not everything is in the Bible. nowhere does the Bible say that it is the sole source of God's Word.
evi410 2 years ago
I can show you where that comment contradicted the Word of God.
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
I have shown u where Paul is not sure that he is saved. I told u 2 read the parables where some people fall away. ALL of Scripture says u must work not jsut believe. So all of ur statement contradicts ALL of Scrip.
evi410 2 years ago
If you are refering to 2 Corinthians 12, Paul is not talking about Salvation, he is talking about a vision he had of Going to Heaven, he could not tell if he was taken in body form or he was dreaming, he could not tell. So that he will not boast, God gave him a thorn in the Flesh(vs 7, which I believe it was bad eyesight) Oh, Jesus did all the work nessary, all I have to do in come to Christ in Faith, and take him as my personal savior.
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
If you have not trusted in Jesus Christ yourself, then you will not go to heaven, even if you lived in a catholic church, confess every sin to every believer, if you have not taken Jesus Chirst as your savior, then you will not make it to heaven.
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
U can only trust in Christ if u trust in the Church He established. The Saraments are necessary. If u don't believe that then u don't believe Our Lord.
evi410 2 years ago
"U can only trust in Christ if u trust in the Church He established. The Saraments are necessary. If u don't believe that then u don't believe Our Lord" Show me where that is in the bible.
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
Throughout the Gospels. OLJC says Baptism is necessary TWICE. HE says to follow THE Church.
evi410 2 years ago
what verses, Baptism is only nessary for obedience, not for salvation.
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
Mark 16
16 He that believeth AND IS BAPTIZED, shall be saved: but he that believeth not shall be condemned.
John 3
5 Jesus answered: Amen, amen I say to thee, unless a man be born again of water and the Holy Ghost, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
Also OBEDIENCE IS NECESSARY.
evi410 2 years ago
Baptism is not born of water.
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
Our Lord says it is.
evi410 2 years ago 3
No 1Cor7:40. Plus he talks about how he MAY become a castaway.
U still need to do work. Many will call Lord Lord....
A person who hears His Words and does not DO them is like a fool. A person who hears His Words and DOES them is like a wise man. Do u even read the Gospels or do u jsut read Paul?
evi410 2 years ago
this is in reference to the sin of Death, only a believer can commit such a sin, someone who is saved. When a believer is in sin, God deals with him, that is an evident of salvation, if the believer continues in sin, then the lord deals with him more, and then the Lord takes him home. If a person is in sin, and God does not deal with him at all then the person is not really a Christian.
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
?talk about not being in the Bible. lol
evi410 2 years ago
1 John 5:16 is the sin unto death. Hebrews 12:5-9 also talks about correction from the Lord.
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
U grossly misinterpret these verses AND you use them to override Our Lord's Gospel.
evi410 2 years ago
I don't override the Gospel. I live by it. The Gospel is that Christ died for our sins. Every sin we commit is covered under the blood, all sin, past, present and future sins. Think about it, when Jesus died on the cross, all your sins and my sins were in the future, they were already covered, we just need to accept it as is. For someone who is already saved, sin does not take away our salvation, but we can loose reward and fellowship.
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
Sure u do. The Gospel is that Christ Died and that we MUST pick up our crosses and follow Him. OLJC also taught that we must be perfect like God is perfect or we will be sent to prison UNTIL THE DEBT IS PAID.
evi410 2 years ago
catholics do work as a work, like they are requirements for salvation, not so with christians, our works are evidence and a result of the grace of God, Christian was to serve him and joyfully do it! its our very new nature, a new creature in christ jesus! even when i sin God loves me and isnt mad at me, he loves me the same
educatedthug15 2 years ago
OMgosh! "ALL have sinned and fallen short of the glory of god" that means mary too! AND Pauls wors and teaching are that of JESUS CHRIST, The FATHER, THE HLOY SPIRIT RERAD 2TIMOTHY 3:16 PAULS words are JESUS' WORDS
and mary got it on with joseph, yes mary had sex had had lots of chldren!
educatedthug15 2 years ago
"all" have sinned? Then tell me what sin has a newborn infant committed? Or a baby in the womb? U said all well pony up.
evi410 2 years ago
But they have not reached the acountability. Nothing in the bible that states that mary is an exception.
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
Then "all" does not mean "all" does it? U claim Paul means EVERYONE has sinned, does "all" mean "all" or doesn't it? The Bible most certainly does state that she is the exception. She is the New Eve. Like the New Adam , she is w/o sin.
evi410 2 years ago
show me the scripture
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
Scripture 4 what?
evi410 2 years ago
that Mary is the second Eve.
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
The New Cov is the Old prefected. There is nothing lacking. So there MUST be a New Eve and a New Ark....only better than the Old. Read Scripture as a whole, you will see.
evi410 2 years ago
It still never refers to Mary as the New Eve. In fact Eve is rarely mention at all in the Bible, 6 or 7 maybe 8 or 9 times at the most is she mention in Scripture, Still Mary is not mention as the new Eve.
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
So the Old has something the New does not have? And she most certainly is...Gen talks about the seed of THE WOMAN. Who do u think that is? # of mentions means nothing. JTB was only metioned a few times, is he unimportant. We are told she is the Mother of God.....that is all we need to hear.
evi410 2 years ago
Mary is NOT mother of God. In order to be mother of God, you must be God and you must have been around before God. Reading the Bible you will see that Jesus was around in the OT, even before anything was created. Mary was not like any other mother.
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
No, she is the Mother of God...or is Scripture wrong? She is the Mother of His Human Nature not His Divine Nature. Come on man this is elementary stuff here.
evi410 2 years ago
why doesn't the Bible talk about her being the new eve.
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
It does. Just b/c Sctip does not use the words does not mean that it isn't there. U won't find "Trinity" in there either does tha make it less true?
evi410 2 years ago
Trinity means Three in One, You find Three in One in the Bible, in 1 John 5:7, so lets call them the Three in One, let's be biblical. Mary is not mention in scripture a whole lot, but what it does not talk about her being a new anything, and it does not talk about her being without sin, or queen of heaven(which is a demon, thats in Jeremiah), or it does not talk about her being a new anything.
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
Psalm 51:5 Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity, And in sin my mother conceived me.
educatedthug15 2 years ago
That is the STAIN of sin, not actual sin, which is what Pauls is talking about.
evi410 2 years ago
Paul's words are inspired. But they are not the same as Our Lord's Words. Script makes the distinction b/t the them when Peter writes that Paul is hard to understand. Paul is writting LETTERS. Our Lord is speaking to us.
evi410 2 years ago
Celebacy:
1Cor7
8 But I say to the unmarried, and to the widows: It is good for them if they so continue, EVEN AS I.
Penance:
Rom8
13 For if you live according to the flesh, you shall die: but if by the Spirit you mortify the deeds of the flesh, you shall live.
evi410 2 years ago
Never does it say celebacy as a requirement for anykind of leadership weather be for Bishop or Deacon. It is commanded that if they want to marry, they must be allowed.
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
Nor does the Church say this. Celebacy is entirely voluntary. Eatern Rite priest can be married, so can deacons.
Where is this "command"? A person is totally free to take a vow...as OLJC says "let him take it." Then priesthood is voluntary.
evi410 2 years ago
1 Corinthians 7
40 But more blessed shall she be, if she so remain, according to my counsel; and I THINK that I also have the spirit of God.
Paul was WORKING out his Salvation in fear and trembling, he THOUGHT he was saved, but not sure.
evi410 2 years ago
Answer's
1. No where! All doctrines are essential.
2. The Bible!
3. Christ only set up one Church.
JonathanDWhitehead 2 years ago
good q's man
funiron 3 years ago
no it won't. Sin is not all equal. Our Lord says this Himself. If sin is not equal than it would be unjust to punish it equally. The Catholic God is Just. Not so the prot god.
evi410 3 years ago
sin is equal in the sense that any sin even the least will damn a person to hell. but there are sins or people who live more evil wicked rebelious lives than others will undergo greater torment!
Luke 12:47 And that servant who knew his master's will, and did not prepare [himself] or do according to his will, shall be beaten with many [stripes].
educatedthug15 2 years ago
This is not true and that verse is about Purgatory. Some sin damns, some does not.
evi410 2 years ago
adam & eve sinned 1 time & were cast out of his presence into a barren wasteland & if not for Jesus adam & eve would have went to hell along w/ all of us! God is so HOLY not 1 sin can ever be in his presence, LUCIFER SINNED 1 TIME AND WHERE IS HE? but hey if u want to pay money to get your sin forgiven or to spend less time in purgatory thats fine, go pay your indulgedces, but MY JESUS paid for my sins on the cross at calvarys mountain "IT IS FINISHED" -JESUS! salvation is a GIFT from God
educatedthug15 2 years ago
Adam's sin was mortal. Satans sin was also. Indulgences are free, so is confession. Our Lord said that if we are not perfect than we will spend time in PRISON with TORTURERS. Read your Bible hun.
evi410 2 years ago
i have a question tho, was Mary the mother of jesus a sinful person in need of a savior- her son jesus christ?
educatedthug15 2 years ago
She was/is not sinful. But she needed a Savoir too. Christ saved her but in a different way than He saved us. She is not Immaculate b/c of her own doing but b/c of the ancticipated Merits of Christ.
evi410 2 years ago
for once you have good points.
DerektheDuctTape 3 years ago
I wonder, since he thinks all sin is equal, what he makes of this verse:
Jesus answered: Thou shouldst not have any power against me, unless it were given thee from above. Therefore, he that hath delivered me to thee, hath THE GREATER SIN.
I suppose he thinks Our Lord mispoke.
evi410 3 years ago
Every sin will send you to hell, you will go to the same place. Stealing is no different than lying, cursing is no different than idol, boozing is no different than murder, and go on and on, they will all get you to the same place. But if you trust Christ as savior, then these sins will be forgiven.
DerektheDuctTape 3 years ago
Stealing and lying are both mortal sins. THere ARE differences in degrees....unless you think Our Lord is a liar when He said that the jews had the GREATER sin?
evi410 3 years ago
But it will send you to the same place, unless you have Jesus Christ as savior, I agree that the degrees of punishment will be different, basically the sins you commit and the light you recieve and rejected will be what the punishment will be. It will be easier for a young one, who rarely heard about the gospel and then someone who has been in church all his life and rejected the truth.
DerektheDuctTape 3 years ago
No it won't. Have you read the Bible at all? There were degress of sin in the OT. Some deserved death, some didn't. God is immutable.
evi410 2 years ago
Name one sin that if commit, that itself will not send you to Hell.
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
Eating meat on Friday, failing to praise God at the proper times, skipping prayer, laying in bed too long, slightly over eating, speeding....need I continue?
evi410 2 years ago
ok since we are under the new convenant lets make it simole and stick to the new testement k!
Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord"-- This means SIN not sins but ANY sin is punishable by eternal death seperated from God forever.
educatedthug15 2 years ago
No, it's not ok. Man does not live by bread alone but by EVERY Word from the Mouth of God. (DT8:3, Matt4:4).
THe NEw is the perfection of the Old. That is what OLJC meant when He said "It is consummated." He showed us the perfet way to follow the Law,
AGAIN Scrip says Paul is hard to understand and many will be damned for misinterpreting him, 2Peter3 :16
evi410 2 years ago
1Timothy 4:1 But the Spirit explicitly says that in later times some will fall away from the faith, paying attention to deceitful spirits and doctrines of demons,
1Ti 4:2 by means of the hypocrisy of liars seared in their own conscience as with a branding iron,
1Ti 4:3 {men} who forbid marriage {and advocate} abstaining from foods which God has created to be gratefully shared in by those who believe and know the truth.
- does this sound familiar to you????
educatedthug15 2 years ago
1. The RCC was here b4 ur "church" so U came in later times.
2. I have no idea how u think this applies to the Church?
3. the RCC does not forbid marriage (Matt 19:12)and we abstain from meat b/c we like it, not b/c it is bad. That reference is 2 people who call food bad and demand abstaining ALL the time....like moslems jews and seventh day adventist.
Giving up good things for God is a praisworthy thing.
evi410 2 years ago
The real church is the Chirstian Church, every believer in Christ. Only those who have personally accepted Christ as their savior is apart of the True Church, if they don't then they are not apart of the True Church.
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
Then the "church" is a whore since it spawns and excepts confusion and rejects the necessity of Truth. I happen to know better. The Bible makes this clear
evi410 2 years ago
how so?
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
How is teaching and accepting error like a whore? u can't be serious?
evi410 2 years ago
everyone else but RCC is teaching error, show how that is.
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
Yes. It speaks for itself. THe Church has never changed, every other denom has. The Church says there is ONE Truth, every other denom says only SOME Truth is essentials. OLJC is the way the TRUTH and the life. TO say some Truth is nonessential is to say that OLJC is nonessential.
evi410 2 years ago
Only Jesus Christ is truth, if the church is based their teachings on the Bible, then that church is a church of God, founded by Jesus Christ, regardless of when it was founded.
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
So every "church" that claims to be based on the BIble yet has different teachings...they all hear Our Lord and teach Truth? Sounds like confusion to me. The Church is the Mystical Body of Christ there is no contradiction b/t Him and the RCC.
evi410 2 years ago
There not all based on the Bible. A True church is an independent church, not affilliated with any denomination or other church group. We are all one in the same belief, independent from each other ,but follow Christ. If we all base on the Bible, then we will have the same belief. YEs we were around since Christ, this is what Christ intended, independent from each other, independent from nations, and other groups.
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
? Where does Scrip say the True Church is a collection of independent churches? lol. We are One like the Most Holy Trinity is One. OLJC spoke of THE Church not a church.
btw, NONE of the prots denoms are based on the Bibel. NONE!
evi410 2 years ago
I never said I was Prostant, the Pastor is to run the church with the help of the deacon board. Independent means in this case, one man or organization is to run all the churches, that is not what Christ intended. They are all together in a fact that they believe in Christ. Every Church that preaches the Bible is a Church of Christ.
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
Acts15
7And when there had been much disputing, Peter, rising up, said 2 them: Men, brethren, u know, that in former days God made choice among us, that BY MY MOUTH the Gentiles should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.
Lk22
32But I have prayed 4 thee, that thy faith fail not: and thou, being once converted, confirm thy brethren.
Mtt16
18And I say 2 thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
evi410 2 years ago
Acts 15, is that we are to tell people what Christ has done for us, we are to do that even today. Luke 22:32 means that Jesus prays for those who follow him, Matt 16, means that Jesus build his church upon himself, through everyone that believes. The only reason why he said that to Peter is he was the first to respond. God is no repector of persons Romans 2:11, what I get is that every beleiver is equal in authority.
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
No, Acts is Peter announcing that Christ made coice that HE teach and gain beleivers.
Christ said I prayed FOR THEE. Not all of us(He does that in the garden). He prayed for Peter that PETER'S faith is infallible(that's what fail not means).
Where does it state that Christ said this b/c Peter respondeed first?
AGAIN, most people misinterprete Paul to their own destruction.
evi410 2 years ago
What Destruction are you talking about, if you are talking about hell, I can't go there now, I am sealed by the Holy Spirit, who lives inside me(1 Cor 6:19) because I have trusted in Jesus Christ as Savior, that is what gets me to Heaven(John 14:6) Also I know I am saved forever, because I have enternal life right now(1 John 5:13) There is a way you can know that you are saved(on the way to heaven.) Have you personally trusted in Jesus Christ alone for salvation, that is the only way the Heaven
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
Of course u can go to hell. I can through Script right back @ u to contradict what u have quoted. But it is no use since u are ur own interpreter of Scrip(which is condemmed by Scrip). Read the parables, a person can believe and not take root and fall away when hardship comes. Pick up ur Bible and read it. U are a PAUList, not a CHRISTian.
evi410 2 years ago
No I am not my own Interpreter, the Holy Spirit does it for me. Romans 8:16 the Holy Spirit witness to our spirit that we are children of God. John 1:12 Those who recieved him given power to be sons of God, when we become Children of God, how do we go back, show me where a Child of God did something where he is no longer a Child of God. If a Child of GOd can loose salvation, then many passages in Scripture don't mean what they say.
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
lol. how many prots make that claim and yet u all contradict each other. The Church interpretes PERIOD. Acts8:31.
The passages dn't mean what u THINK they say, but they still mean what they really say.
Matth13
21 Yet hath he not root in himself, but is only for a time: and when there ariseth tribulation and persecution because of the word, he is presently scandalized
evi410 2 years ago
The verse in Acts is not saying that only church officials can interpert scripture, that is saying that Believers led by the Holy Spirit can interpret scripture. The Eunuch was not saved, so he could not. The Parable of the Sower, the first two people were never saved, and the last two did get saved. You cannot loose salvation, but you can loose fellowship and you can loose reward(1 Corinthians 3:15)
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
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The verse in Acts is not saying that only church officials can interpert scripture, that is saying that Believers led by the Holy Spirit can interpret scripture. The Eunuch was not saved, so he could not. The Parable of the Sower, the first two people were never saved, and the last two did get saved. You cannot loose salvation, but you can loose fellowship and you can loose reward(1 Corinthians 3:15)
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
The Rivials of late 1800's, where many Got Saved, Leaders like Dwight Moody, who lead many to the Lord. Moody was not roman catholic, he was a man of God. Many of the great hymms were created by non-catholics. So if it lead many people to repentence, many people were won to Jesus Christ, then how is that not of God?
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
Mormonism and Jehovah's Witnesses have lead people to "repentance" too.
OneTrueChurch 2 years ago
did they really lead people to true repentance.
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago
How do u know that they were saved. How do u know they were won for Christ? If they followed error then they were NOT won, unless u think error is of God?
What does writting hyms have to do w/ anything?
many freemasons wrote great hyms too.
evi410 2 years ago
If they were faking it, believe me, they did a real good job, they were really good actors. You can only go so far in faking something, that is especially Christianity, you can only go so far.
DerektheDuctTape 2 years ago