You see, fanboys will fight for decades. Newsflash, Atari, Amiga, they both failed in the long run, at this stage is possible for us all to just enjoy them.
The ST's version has very annoying music - despite it being hyped with MIDI at the time. Amiga did chiptunes far better...
For the time, which is the mindset in which fanboys want to half-understandably relive.
Yes, both died out - thanks to superior marketing mechanisms and relative and comparative ubiquity from the competition. Ironic, given how inferior the IBM PC and its clones were, as were Macs of the time... but there is something to branding, that's for sure...
@LOveERDos - Lol, that makes sense. The Amiga has a better quality keyboard than the St one.... was this for gaming or typing do you think?
The Amigas were more professional looking, even compared to the Atari bigbox machines like the TT.
St was an intellectual (yes, this is how you spell it) machine? The Amiga was for teenagers (yes, again, this is how you spell it)? Grow up. They were both great machines, but the Amiga had a heap of extra hardware to let it do things the St could not.
@JasperAbraxxious thanks professor for lighting me , anyway you can not deny that 80% of the Amiga was sold just for fun, (everybody knows that it takes a big hardware to make the best games) Atari was the most widely used by intellectuals (I wrote well?, I'm Italian and can also understand why I can not write good English but I understand it , i understand Spanish and obviously the italian and unlike yours that you know only English because it is your language) and professionals
@LOveERDos - You are welcome (for enlightening you).
No idea where you got those "statistics" from, but yes, gaming was responsible for a lot of Amiga sales, as was tracker music, paint and animation, productivity and demos - all of which the Amiga could do better than the st, so what was your point?
Atari was NOT used primarily by intellectuals, the St had almost exactly the same audience as the Amiga, with the exception of midi authors.
u missed the most important thing about this game, push down and press space and u turn into a rollin spike ball, its like reviewing mario and not mentioning the mushrooms lol
i remember me and my brother having both machines in our bedroom and buying the same game for each machine and it was this game that my amiga blew the st out of the water along with every other game......sorry atari its just a fact though.
i had an Amiga which i paid almost 600 uk pounds back in the days (included monitor). it was a lot of money then. if you ask me today i would prefer STFM (without monitor). most of the games are the same except sound.
Actually, even the Game Boy declassifies the ST. Game Boy has variable pulse width on the square wave channels (Atari always 50%), and an additional wave table channel for playing 32 Byte samples.
Nope, the Atari's sound was not as good as the Amiga's. Atari only had a better reputation for music sequencing because it had a MIDI port, which musicians could use.
but its native sound chips used in games was not as good as the Amiga's.
Well, because it didn't have better sound. You probably think of the built-in MIDI stuff the ST has. That doesn't have anything to do with the actual audio capabilities of the computer - unless you send stuff to a synthesizer over MIDI.
The ST has a chip that only produces three channels worth of square wave and some noise, the Amiga has 4-channel hardware sample playback and some player routines even extend that to 6 or more channels (Turrican 2 is one of those games).
The Atari never had better sound than the Amiga neither did it have better Graphics, I know i had the good old st and my annouying mate had an Amiga :(
LOL you thought wrong, Atari's soundchip was even inferior to the c64. It's the same chip with spectrums. Atari never had better sound than the Amiga, except the Atari Falcon of course. But I'm not sure how many games actually put Falcon DSP to use (it's used in the games though) What you may have heard is that Atari is preferred by musicians, because of it's builtin midi ports, but of course they have nothing to do with game music.
Where did you get that impression from?!? The Amiga sound chip (Paula) was MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH more powerful than the pissy Ym chip in the Atari St... The Atari St did not even have a blitter chip for gfx.
Over all the Atari st was not even in the same league as the Amiga, Atari tried to play "catch up" with the StE, which had a blitter and 4 channel sound similar to the Amiga (which had it 4 years earlier). St= off the shelf parts, Amiga= custom chips.
I had an Amiga and loved it, it was my best machine ever, my mate had the Atari and I always made fun of him.
Yet when I was reading through Atari forums I couldn't understand why they said it was better, it wasnt my opinion at all, as it's quite clear Amiga is better, I just wanted to know how :D
And that's why the amiga sold for twice the price of an Atari. No one is arguing that the ST had better hardware, or at least I hope they aren't. But an ST was generally much more affordable.
I have a Mega STe, but I'm still perplexed as to why atari chose such an outdated sound chip. Oh well, I like the old school chiptunes a lot, and I wasn't bothered by it at the time.
Well, that's not entirely true. The ST does have custom chips (GLUE, SHIFTER), it's just that they are not nearly as powerful as the Amiga custom chips.
Furthermore, the STE does not have 4 channel sound. It has 3 YM2149 channels, plus 2 * 8-Bit digital sound. The digi channels, however, are quite limited, and not similar to the Amiga ones.
@porcorosso81 I'm pretty certain that what you have said isn't completely accurate. The STE had a DMA sound chip with 2 or 3 channels but also retained the Yamaha YM2149 for backwards compatibility reasons. The technical specs I found stated this..."3 voices + 1 noise channel, 8 octaves + two 8 bit PCM channels". Anyways, who cares now. :-P I just love playing all the old games no matter which system they are on.
@porcorosso81 It isn't the greatest sound chip in the world. Though it greatly depends upon the game. It is amazing what can be produced out of so little. Just reading through all of these comments it makes me wonder who are the biggest mugs here. Honestly, why are people STILL arguing now over what system is better. Both had their pros and cons. Both systems are now damned old (almost 26 years since they were both first released). I now emulate both of them and they all fun.
@JasperAbraxxious This is a video about a game played on an atari though.
If any of us wanted an amiga, don't you think we would buy one and then watch videos of games played on amiga (queue retarded use of puctuation) ?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!??!?!??!?!?!??!?!
@bobbystar101 - Thats it?! Thats the come back? "Duh, if I waníd one I woulda' bought one?" You could have spent the time to type that "response" doing what you obviously do best - talking to trees.
@JasperAbraxxious your a fuckwit, plain as. Yes thats the come back. If I gave a shit about you and your shitty little irrelevant amiga maybe it would have been different.
Clearly you have deep issues of insecurity, or you wouldnt bother trawling ST videos to try and wank over how much slightly a little bit better (though more expensive) the amiga used to be 25 years ago.
Its a cheesy comment but its SO relevant in your case: Get a life
Now, please don't reply as, being frank, your an arsehole.
@bobbystar101 - Lol, and this coming from a pissant little tosser. :) Please dont take offence if I, like most Im sure, take your opinion (and rant) with a pinch of salt.
Obviously you enjoy giving the world pleasure by making a complete tosspot out of yourself, thereby giving us all a good laugh.
As an ST owner and collector, it is not often I get accused of trawling (again, thanks for the laugh)! :)
But, how could you ask me not to reply? Dickheads need attention too... dont you?
@JasperAbraxxious LMAO everything you said there applies better to you than it does to me.
That rly is the funniest thing I've seen all week.
BTW if I am making a tosspot out of myself take a minute to think abt yourself there as well. I was parodying your style of comments. Such a complete hypocrite lol!
You do trawl, your inane "comments" get everywhere, and are all written in the same insecure pseudo-intellectual knowitall style and are all aimed at starting arguments. I CBA hence dont reply.
@bobbystar101 : Well if that wasnt the most pathetic insecure ranting of a silly little boy I have ever read, well, then Im Jimmy Hoffa!
The concept you are failing to grasp is that to be a smart arse, you must have 2 important qualities - the arse you have in bulk, but you are sadly lacking the other quality.
One of my weaknesses is taking the piss out of trumped up little shit stains, like yourself. If this was not your intention, then you should not have commented in the first place. :)
Frankly for me this is pretty hilarious to log on once in a while and find your inevitable, never ending and fruitless attempts to sound clever.
Why else do you keep replying?
I am not failing or even trying to grasp any concept, just trying to explain to you that your not making yourself look clever at all, in fact entirely the opposite. You really do sound like you have something wrong with you, attention seeker
@JasperAbraxxious Funniest thing is, your not even remotely coherent! Your replies arent so much replies as a series of random unconnected and irrelevant messages.
It really is most pointless trying to argue with you, as you have no argument.
So fuck it. Reply if you want, I barely use this account and probably wont bother even reading your pointless response whatever tangent it goes off on next time.
@JasperAbraxxious - Dont look now whilst Im talking to myself.... but I only just found out that the STe was not even as advanced as the original Amiga 1000 from 1985. Apparently the STe blitter chip is missing functions the Amiga blitter had, has no copper processor and only has TWO channel stereo sound, not four like the Amiga.
So whilst the STe was a vast improvement on the St, it was still behind the original Amiga.
Nice machine though, just bought one with 4mb ram and tos 2.06.
@JasperAbraxxious STe had 8 channel PCM sound and I believe there is a 32 channel tracker so??? and STe can emulate Paula... better than in the Amiga original....
@SuperGrahamw :) Noperz, the STe had EXACTLY the same crappy yamaha PCM sound as the ST (they reused the same chip for compatibility).
So the STe had only 3 PCM channels.
Also, the DMA sound of the STe was more primitive than the Amiga. The Amiga had FOUR channels of stereo DMA sound at infinitely variable frequency (sound can be played back at ANY frequency required).
The STe had TWO channels of Stereo DMA sound that can only be played back at set rates (6.25, 12.5, 25 and 50).
@JasperAbraxxious : The STe had inferior hardware to even the original Amigas, so exactly HOW could it emulate more powerful chips BETTER than the original?
This is just not possible in our realm of reality. The STe was Atari's attempt at playing "catch up" to the original Amiga, and it was a fine machine, but its blitter is not as powerful as the original Amiga, its sound is inferior and it still has no copper unit.
@SuperGrahamw : Yessum, however, the simple open architecture of the St can work to its advantage. I remember being amazed the first time I heard an St running a Sif player emulation to play C64 Sids. The St/Ste etc can pre mix more channels than the hardware supports, and then play the mixed channels - just like the Amiga.
Anywho, regardless of its failings, the STe was a great machine - mine is equipped with TOS 2.06, 4mb ram and an UltraSatan and I would not part with it.
Actually, the jerkiness doesn't detract from the gameplay that much... I'm reminded of Nemesis on the MSX which has a type of stuttered scrolling, and that doesn't detract from gameplay. Gods is another good example. If the game play, pixel art and sound are up to scratch, the jerky scrolling is less annoying. Turrican 2 ST has these qualities. There were tons of excellent MD & SNES console games that could have been converted to the Amiga using a similar model as the Amiga to ST T2 conversion
twice as fast? Does the C64 do Turrican II in 50fps?
Also remember that increases in resolution have exponential increases in the total number of pixels to move around. 4 bit screens of 160*100 = 8kb, whereas 320*200 = 32kb. That's four times as much data to push around, and visually it's worth it.
I typed a reply to this earlier but it didn't appear!
A1200 Fastram is added the same way as Falcon fastram...via a card on the expansion slot. I doubt very much the A1200 fastram speeds were on par with the Falcons CT60 expansion (SDRAM).
The DSP is only good for audio usage?!? Are you mad? Please go check out some of DSP based 3D demos. In particular Sonolumineszenz by Avena...standard Falcon.
Ok, the Falcon is limited to 256 colours at 640x480 on VGA screens without any BUS speeders. On RGB screens it's capable of higher res and 16bit colour.
The Falcon does not have a 15 bit colour mode.
I know the differences between 16bit against higher colour modes. In day to day use you barely notice the difference. When viewing high res photos you see differences where there are gradients of colour.
HAM8 is has 1 use only. Falcons 16bit mode has MANY uses.
I first owned an ste 520 then upgraded to an amiga 1200. I still like the st and some of the tunes, regardless of soundchips sounded better than some amiga games. Blood moneys in game music was better than amigas for sure.
The YM2149 had 3 channel tone generator output and the Paula had 4 channel PCM output. Hard to compare those two.
The YM2149 is generating sound (and can play some digits in a 4th virtual channel using a trick inside of the sndh like in this game, thx to Mad-Max.) and the Paula is more oriented on "trackers" songs (TFMX, MOD, etc).
So we cant really compare, its just a question of taste i think, but for me i love the gritty sound of the YM2149 :D
yyah, it was brilliantly done. Amiga version was noticeably smoother and had constant (4 channel? ) sound in game - on ST one of the music channels was shared by the FX channel so FX would override teh music ingame. Intro music was the same on both tho ('cept for being Stereo on Amiga).
I remember my Atari ST well. i had turrican 2 and it was addictice as hell! but it was a proper computer of the times, i used to design graphics and stuff on it too. then print em off with my dot-matrix printer, lmao!
and the Falcon 030 litteraly own the Amiga in everything (and you can play ST games on it also ;p), shame Atari was already dieing when it came out, so nearly no games was created on this awesome machine ;_;
(continued) It's expensive, but remember that unlike the PS3, they were supposed to be "proper" computers. Of course, lots of people used them for games, but the potential for non-game use was there (and I guess good for persuading parents to chip in).
Still, yeah; the PS3 seems expensive, but people forget (or don't realise) how much the Atari VCS cost in real terms back in the late 1970s.
@NotATube You are spot on there. I used my machine as an allrounder, not just as a games machine. As a computer system (Atari Ste) it was great. It had its flaws but it never let me down.
I think the YM has it's own charm and i like the sound a lot. As far as what Atari was thinking to use the YM? It is said to be an emergency solution as the planned soundchip was not finnished in time or at all. And since the YM also does other things beside generating sound ( i think it had to do with the floppy controller) it was a 2 flies in 1 swat solution. Besides that the YM was already used in the MSX and Speccy and a lot of arcade machines so it was a pretty well know chip.
The YM has its charm, as do other 3/4-channel square wave sound chips, but let's be honest; they belonged on the 8-bit machines. Given the ST's more advanced graphics, it's disappointing that the sound chip wasn't even as advanced as the C64's SID, or even (arguably) the Atari 8-bit's POKEY (also square, but had 4 channels instead of three). Never heard the STE, apparently it had better sound.
Hard as nails, but oddly enough one of the very few games I've completed without cheating. ST version doesn't stack up at all well to the Amiga one, but apparently someone's doing an STE version of it.
Graphics look fine; okay, the gradient is a little coarser due to the more limited palette, but it's not the big a difference. The only problem is the "chippy" sound (and I can't recall what the Amiga version sounded like anyway).
IIRC the STE had much improved sound; unfortunately, because they didn't make it replace the STFM as the base model until 1991 (2 years or so after it came out and when the ST market was in serious decline), it never sold enough to get specific support.
Cheer's Paul, watching this inspired me to look for the Atari ST emulator "Steem" and now i,m getting to reply all those classic ST games i used to own way back when, Keep up the great work.
Remember that the Amiga was also pretty expensive when it first came out- as in *significantly* more expensive than the ST. It wasn't until later that it came much closer in price to the ST and its popularity picked up (that's why the ST was more popular in the early 16-bit era).
Also, Commodore had much greater access to design and manufacturing facilities (they owned MOS technologies), which made it easier for them to do nice custom chips.
You see, fanboys will fight for decades. Newsflash, Atari, Amiga, they both failed in the long run, at this stage is possible for us all to just enjoy them.
On an unrelated matter, ST for the win!
UFMastodon 4 months ago
@UFMastodon -
The ST's version has very annoying music - despite it being hyped with MIDI at the time. Amiga did chiptunes far better...
For the time, which is the mindset in which fanboys want to half-understandably relive.
Yes, both died out - thanks to superior marketing mechanisms and relative and comparative ubiquity from the competition. Ironic, given how inferior the IBM PC and its clones were, as were Macs of the time... but there is something to branding, that's for sure...
EnigmaticConondrum 2 days ago
st was an itellecutal machine, for music compositor and office, amiga was for teenanger
LOveERDos 1 year ago
@LOveERDos - Lol, that makes sense. The Amiga has a better quality keyboard than the St one.... was this for gaming or typing do you think?
The Amigas were more professional looking, even compared to the Atari bigbox machines like the TT.
St was an intellectual (yes, this is how you spell it) machine? The Amiga was for teenagers (yes, again, this is how you spell it)? Grow up. They were both great machines, but the Amiga had a heap of extra hardware to let it do things the St could not.
JasperAbraxxious 11 months ago
@JasperAbraxxious thanks professor for lighting me , anyway you can not deny that 80% of the Amiga was sold just for fun, (everybody knows that it takes a big hardware to make the best games) Atari was the most widely used by intellectuals (I wrote well?, I'm Italian and can also understand why I can not write good English but I understand it , i understand Spanish and obviously the italian and unlike yours that you know only English because it is your language) and professionals
LOveERDos 11 months ago
@LOveERDos - You are welcome (for enlightening you).
No idea where you got those "statistics" from, but yes, gaming was responsible for a lot of Amiga sales, as was tracker music, paint and animation, productivity and demos - all of which the Amiga could do better than the st, so what was your point?
Atari was NOT used primarily by intellectuals, the St had almost exactly the same audience as the Amiga, with the exception of midi authors.
Oh and I speak italian too - fluentemente. :)
JasperAbraxxious 11 months ago
i thought this wasnt particularly hard, especially when compared with the first one. as long as u keep finding secrets to get extra lives a plenty ;)
zakkattakk89 1 year ago
u missed the most important thing about this game, push down and press space and u turn into a rollin spike ball, its like reviewing mario and not mentioning the mushrooms lol
eleven38 1 year ago
May I ask how did you record this? Fraps won't work with Steem as long it doesn't support D3D or OpenGL. Thanks
Paar86 1 year ago
Chris Huelsbeck rules :)
B0mu 1 year ago
great reviewing style, it was funny. I love brummies.
C0mpre55m3 1 year ago
@Ahle2 Careful not to claim that all STs didn't have gaming hardware. The later STE for example had all that you listed. ;-)
deepblue69uk 1 year ago
Amiga's dead ...
r8qt7 1 year ago
i remember me and my brother having both machines in our bedroom and buying the same game for each machine and it was this game that my amiga blew the st out of the water along with every other game......sorry atari its just a fact though.
LiLLinz28 2 years ago
The data bar along the bottom of the screen looks more like the one from Turrican 1! very different from the one on the Amiga version of Turrican 2
katakisLives 2 years ago
i had an Amiga which i paid almost 600 uk pounds back in the days (included monitor). it was a lot of money then. if you ask me today i would prefer STFM (without monitor). most of the games are the same except sound.
SHINOBHS 2 years ago
actually the ST sound is similar to Gameboy
SHINOBHS 2 years ago
Actually, even the Game Boy declassifies the ST. Game Boy has variable pulse width on the square wave channels (Atari always 50%), and an additional wave table channel for playing 32 Byte samples.
porcorosso81 2 years ago
absolutely shocking music, sounds like a gameboy...
ipodsock 2 years ago
You use the same emulator I use, I really like the intro music or this game.
CoolDudeClem 2 years ago
I thought the Atari was meant to have better sound than the Amiga? How comes every game I stumble across has inferior sound to the Amiga?
Turrican rules, it's great that it's on all platforms
132000Volts 2 years ago
Turrican on the atari has a different style ... it's more mature and I like it.
r8qt7 2 years ago
It sounds more for kids to me, like how SNES/genesis game music
132000Volts 2 years ago
Uhhh, google for Super Turrican and compare it to this abomination.
porcorosso81 2 years ago
Nope, the Atari's sound was not as good as the Amiga's. Atari only had a better reputation for music sequencing because it had a MIDI port, which musicians could use.
but its native sound chips used in games was not as good as the Amiga's.
MustNotRead 2 years ago
Well, because it didn't have better sound. You probably think of the built-in MIDI stuff the ST has. That doesn't have anything to do with the actual audio capabilities of the computer - unless you send stuff to a synthesizer over MIDI.
The ST has a chip that only produces three channels worth of square wave and some noise, the Amiga has 4-channel hardware sample playback and some player routines even extend that to 6 or more channels (Turrican 2 is one of those games).
kometbomb 2 years ago
The Atari never had better sound than the Amiga neither did it have better Graphics, I know i had the good old st and my annouying mate had an Amiga :(
boghead 2 years ago
no, the amiga had the most advanced soundchip at this time
marzli 2 years ago 4
Actually, the Amiga had the superior sound chip.
303bassline 2 years ago
LOL you thought wrong, Atari's soundchip was even inferior to the c64. It's the same chip with spectrums. Atari never had better sound than the Amiga, except the Atari Falcon of course. But I'm not sure how many games actually put Falcon DSP to use (it's used in the games though) What you may have heard is that Atari is preferred by musicians, because of it's builtin midi ports, but of course they have nothing to do with game music.
jarjar2b 2 years ago
Lol?!?!? What?!?!?
Seriously?!?!
Where did you get that impression from?!? The Amiga sound chip (Paula) was MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH more powerful than the pissy Ym chip in the Atari St... The Atari St did not even have a blitter chip for gfx.
Over all the Atari st was not even in the same league as the Amiga, Atari tried to play "catch up" with the StE, which had a blitter and 4 channel sound similar to the Amiga (which had it 4 years earlier). St= off the shelf parts, Amiga= custom chips.
JasperAbraxxious 2 years ago
I had an Amiga and loved it, it was my best machine ever, my mate had the Atari and I always made fun of him.
Yet when I was reading through Atari forums I couldn't understand why they said it was better, it wasnt my opinion at all, as it's quite clear Amiga is better, I just wanted to know how :D
Thanks for your explanation and everybody elses!!
132000Volts 2 years ago
And that's why the amiga sold for twice the price of an Atari. No one is arguing that the ST had better hardware, or at least I hope they aren't. But an ST was generally much more affordable.
I have a Mega STe, but I'm still perplexed as to why atari chose such an outdated sound chip. Oh well, I like the old school chiptunes a lot, and I wasn't bothered by it at the time.
Daedalus117 2 years ago
Well, that's not entirely true. The ST does have custom chips (GLUE, SHIFTER), it's just that they are not nearly as powerful as the Amiga custom chips.
Furthermore, the STE does not have 4 channel sound. It has 3 YM2149 channels, plus 2 * 8-Bit digital sound. The digi channels, however, are quite limited, and not similar to the Amiga ones.
porcorosso81 1 year ago
@porcorosso81 I'm pretty certain that what you have said isn't completely accurate. The STE had a DMA sound chip with 2 or 3 channels but also retained the Yamaha YM2149 for backwards compatibility reasons. The technical specs I found stated this..."3 voices + 1 noise channel, 8 octaves + two 8 bit PCM channels". Anyways, who cares now. :-P I just love playing all the old games no matter which system they are on.
deepblue69uk 1 year ago
@deepblue69uk
Ummm, okay, then there is one additional "noise channel" *PSHH**PSHHH*. The YM2149 still sounds pretty bad.
porcorosso81 1 year ago
@porcorosso81 It isn't the greatest sound chip in the world. Though it greatly depends upon the game. It is amazing what can be produced out of so little. Just reading through all of these comments it makes me wonder who are the biggest mugs here. Honestly, why are people STILL arguing now over what system is better. Both had their pros and cons. Both systems are now damned old (almost 26 years since they were both first released). I now emulate both of them and they all fun.
deepblue69uk 1 year ago
@JasperAbraxxious This is a video about a game played on an atari though.
If any of us wanted an amiga, don't you think we would buy one and then watch videos of games played on amiga (queue retarded use of puctuation) ?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!??!?!??!?!?!??!?!
spacker
bobbystar101 1 year ago
@bobbystar101 - Thats it?! Thats the come back? "Duh, if I waníd one I woulda' bought one?" You could have spent the time to type that "response" doing what you obviously do best - talking to trees.
What a wanker.....
JasperAbraxxious 11 months ago
@JasperAbraxxious your a fuckwit, plain as. Yes thats the come back. If I gave a shit about you and your shitty little irrelevant amiga maybe it would have been different.
Clearly you have deep issues of insecurity, or you wouldnt bother trawling ST videos to try and wank over how much slightly a little bit better (though more expensive) the amiga used to be 25 years ago.
Its a cheesy comment but its SO relevant in your case: Get a life
Now, please don't reply as, being frank, your an arsehole.
bobbystar101 11 months ago
@bobbystar101 - Lol, and this coming from a pissant little tosser. :) Please dont take offence if I, like most Im sure, take your opinion (and rant) with a pinch of salt.
Obviously you enjoy giving the world pleasure by making a complete tosspot out of yourself, thereby giving us all a good laugh.
As an ST owner and collector, it is not often I get accused of trawling (again, thanks for the laugh)! :)
But, how could you ask me not to reply? Dickheads need attention too... dont you?
JasperAbraxxious 11 months ago
@JasperAbraxxious LMAO everything you said there applies better to you than it does to me.
That rly is the funniest thing I've seen all week.
BTW if I am making a tosspot out of myself take a minute to think abt yourself there as well. I was parodying your style of comments. Such a complete hypocrite lol!
You do trawl, your inane "comments" get everywhere, and are all written in the same insecure pseudo-intellectual knowitall style and are all aimed at starting arguments. I CBA hence dont reply.
bobbystar101 10 months ago
@bobbystar101 : Well if that wasnt the most pathetic insecure ranting of a silly little boy I have ever read, well, then Im Jimmy Hoffa!
The concept you are failing to grasp is that to be a smart arse, you must have 2 important qualities - the arse you have in bulk, but you are sadly lacking the other quality.
One of my weaknesses is taking the piss out of trumped up little shit stains, like yourself. If this was not your intention, then you should not have commented in the first place. :)
JasperAbraxxious 10 months ago
@JasperAbraxxious STOP! LISTEN TO YOURSELF!
YOU are making a fool out of urself.
Frankly for me this is pretty hilarious to log on once in a while and find your inevitable, never ending and fruitless attempts to sound clever.
Why else do you keep replying?
I am not failing or even trying to grasp any concept, just trying to explain to you that your not making yourself look clever at all, in fact entirely the opposite. You really do sound like you have something wrong with you, attention seeker
bobbystar101 9 months ago
@JasperAbraxxious Funniest thing is, your not even remotely coherent! Your replies arent so much replies as a series of random unconnected and irrelevant messages.
It really is most pointless trying to argue with you, as you have no argument.
So fuck it. Reply if you want, I barely use this account and probably wont bother even reading your pointless response whatever tangent it goes off on next time.
bobbystar101 9 months ago
@JasperAbraxxious - Dont look now whilst Im talking to myself.... but I only just found out that the STe was not even as advanced as the original Amiga 1000 from 1985. Apparently the STe blitter chip is missing functions the Amiga blitter had, has no copper processor and only has TWO channel stereo sound, not four like the Amiga.
So whilst the STe was a vast improvement on the St, it was still behind the original Amiga.
Nice machine though, just bought one with 4mb ram and tos 2.06.
JasperAbraxxious 11 months ago
@JasperAbraxxious STe had 8 channel PCM sound and I believe there is a 32 channel tracker so??? and STe can emulate Paula... better than in the Amiga original....
SuperGrahamw 4 months ago
@SuperGrahamw :) Noperz, the STe had EXACTLY the same crappy yamaha PCM sound as the ST (they reused the same chip for compatibility).
So the STe had only 3 PCM channels.
Also, the DMA sound of the STe was more primitive than the Amiga. The Amiga had FOUR channels of stereo DMA sound at infinitely variable frequency (sound can be played back at ANY frequency required).
The STe had TWO channels of Stereo DMA sound that can only be played back at set rates (6.25, 12.5, 25 and 50).
JasperAbraxxious 4 months ago
@JasperAbraxxious : The STe had inferior hardware to even the original Amigas, so exactly HOW could it emulate more powerful chips BETTER than the original?
This is just not possible in our realm of reality. The STe was Atari's attempt at playing "catch up" to the original Amiga, and it was a fine machine, but its blitter is not as powerful as the original Amiga, its sound is inferior and it still has no copper unit.
It had analogue joyports though, which was nice.
JasperAbraxxious 4 months ago
@JasperAbraxxious Your right on the fixed frequencies for replay. YM is PSG DIGI is PCM. DBE Tracker v1.08demo
by ST-Ghost / Sector One
Sector One tracker with support for many fileformats. It can play 32 channels on plain STe and has DSP enhanced replay on Falcon
from dhs.nu
there's also hextracker 16 channels on a plain ST.
And the STe had the Microwire interface.
SuperGrahamw 4 months ago
@SuperGrahamw : Yessum, however, the simple open architecture of the St can work to its advantage. I remember being amazed the first time I heard an St running a Sif player emulation to play C64 Sids. The St/Ste etc can pre mix more channels than the hardware supports, and then play the mixed channels - just like the Amiga.
Anywho, regardless of its failings, the STe was a great machine - mine is equipped with TOS 2.06, 4mb ram and an UltraSatan and I would not part with it.
JasperAbraxxious 4 months ago
@JasperAbraxxious Jasper is a faggy name
2smoothbra 3 months ago
@2smoothbra : .....says the dickhead with a name like "2smoothbra"!
What a tool. :)
JasperAbraxxious 3 months ago
Actually, the jerkiness doesn't detract from the gameplay that much... I'm reminded of Nemesis on the MSX which has a type of stuttered scrolling, and that doesn't detract from gameplay. Gods is another good example. If the game play, pixel art and sound are up to scratch, the jerky scrolling is less annoying. Turrican 2 ST has these qualities. There were tons of excellent MD & SNES console games that could have been converted to the Amiga using a similar model as the Amiga to ST T2 conversion
SupermansBoots 2 years ago
twice as fast? Does the C64 do Turrican II in 50fps?
Also remember that increases in resolution have exponential increases in the total number of pixels to move around. 4 bit screens of 160*100 = 8kb, whereas 320*200 = 32kb. That's four times as much data to push around, and visually it's worth it.
tosgem 2 years ago
Glad you liked it!
I have sent you a private message anyways ;-)
EvilFranky 2 years ago
I typed a reply to this earlier but it didn't appear!
A1200 Fastram is added the same way as Falcon fastram...via a card on the expansion slot. I doubt very much the A1200 fastram speeds were on par with the Falcons CT60 expansion (SDRAM).
The DSP is only good for audio usage?!? Are you mad? Please go check out some of DSP based 3D demos. In particular Sonolumineszenz by Avena...standard Falcon.
Then tell me it is good for audio only...
EvilFranky 2 years ago
*Sigh*
Ok, the Falcon is limited to 256 colours at 640x480 on VGA screens without any BUS speeders. On RGB screens it's capable of higher res and 16bit colour.
The Falcon does not have a 15 bit colour mode.
I know the differences between 16bit against higher colour modes. In day to day use you barely notice the difference. When viewing high res photos you see differences where there are gradients of colour.
HAM8 is has 1 use only. Falcons 16bit mode has MANY uses.
EvilFranky 2 years ago
No, compare it to A1200 as this machine was it's direct competition. Falcon030 vs A4000 is not a fair comparison.
I owned a Falcon for many many years.
Falcon could produce 16-bit colour @ 768*576 (give or take) in overscan mode.
Even with it's crippled data BUS, it still had faster memory transfer rates than the A1200.
And I'm fairly sure any of the 262k colour modes of the AGA chipset were for STILL images only.
EvilFranky 2 years ago
I first owned an ste 520 then upgraded to an amiga 1200. I still like the st and some of the tunes, regardless of soundchips sounded better than some amiga games. Blood moneys in game music was better than amigas for sure.
bazfanv2 2 years ago
This sounds quite good in this game, try listening to Atari's Lemmings, it sounds drunk.
wrestletube1 2 years ago
you're not very good at it m8
mypetsynapse 3 years ago
The YM2149 had 3 channel tone generator output and the Paula had 4 channel PCM output. Hard to compare those two.
The YM2149 is generating sound (and can play some digits in a 4th virtual channel using a trick inside of the sndh like in this game, thx to Mad-Max.) and the Paula is more oriented on "trackers" songs (TFMX, MOD, etc).
So we cant really compare, its just a question of taste i think, but for me i love the gritty sound of the YM2149 :D
(sorry for my bad english :p)
renegadeplatinum 3 years ago
I agree, haha the ST didn't have an awesome amiga only game called ALIEN BREED
furyplum44 3 years ago
it was an answer to retronostalgic but the quote didnt worked, dunno why ^^;
renegadeplatinum 3 years ago
I'm not impressed at all by 25fps. the c64 version does the same game in 50fps on a 10 times weaker machine. figure.
waskoma 3 years ago
Remember that the C64 had a lot fewer pixels to throw around as well, lower res.
tosgem 3 years ago
Why were you modded down? That's a good point actually.
TwinbeeUK 2 years ago
Atari ST rocks!
Blue206CC 4 years ago
thanks for the video! I had it on ST and I loved it. Omg feels so strange seeing videos of old games played couple of years ago =)
talluxx 4 years ago
yeah there isnt that much difference in the smoothness. i used to love this game
shanebongos 4 years ago
yyah, it was brilliantly done. Amiga version was noticeably smoother and had constant (4 channel? ) sound in game - on ST one of the music channels was shared by the FX channel so FX would override teh music ingame. Intro music was the same on both tho ('cept for being Stereo on Amiga).
I had an ST and this was one of my fave games.
DethLeppard 4 years ago
wow man you know your stuff! i used to love my atari in fact i still have it but no mouse :[
lethal0r 4 years ago
why does atari sound only pwn when your not in-game? like xenon 2 for example.
lethal0r 4 years ago
It really is jerky, especially if you played the Amiga Version just some time ago like I did ;)
Gamewitzer 4 years ago
I remember my Atari ST well. i had turrican 2 and it was addictice as hell! but it was a proper computer of the times, i used to design graphics and stuff on it too. then print em off with my dot-matrix printer, lmao!
thoughtless47 4 years ago
Amiga was always superior to the the st.
retronostalgic 4 years ago
and the Falcon 030 litteraly own the Amiga in everything (and you can play ST games on it also ;p), shame Atari was already dieing when it came out, so nearly no games was created on this awesome machine ;_;
renegadeplatinum 3 years ago 4
Wasn't the Amiga £450 or £499 for quite a while before it fell to £399? I remember that the ST got to £299 quite quickly though.
Anyway, if we assume that those were 1990 prices, that's £470 and £630 in today's money (using the standard retail price index).
NotATube 4 years ago 2
(continued) It's expensive, but remember that unlike the PS3, they were supposed to be "proper" computers. Of course, lots of people used them for games, but the potential for non-game use was there (and I guess good for persuading parents to chip in).
Still, yeah; the PS3 seems expensive, but people forget (or don't realise) how much the Atari VCS cost in real terms back in the late 1970s.
NotATube 4 years ago
@NotATube You are spot on there. I used my machine as an allrounder, not just as a games machine. As a computer system (Atari Ste) it was great. It had its flaws but it never let me down.
deepblue69uk 1 year ago
I think the YM has it's own charm and i like the sound a lot. As far as what Atari was thinking to use the YM? It is said to be an emergency solution as the planned soundchip was not finnished in time or at all. And since the YM also does other things beside generating sound ( i think it had to do with the floppy controller) it was a 2 flies in 1 swat solution. Besides that the YM was already used in the MSX and Speccy and a lot of arcade machines so it was a pretty well know chip.
RazorFastClaws 4 years ago 3
The YM has its charm, as do other 3/4-channel square wave sound chips, but let's be honest; they belonged on the 8-bit machines. Given the ST's more advanced graphics, it's disappointing that the sound chip wasn't even as advanced as the C64's SID, or even (arguably) the Atari 8-bit's POKEY (also square, but had 4 channels instead of three). Never heard the STE, apparently it had better sound.
NotATube 4 years ago 2
@NotATube It did. The DMA sound chip plus the Blitter did make a difference so long as the games supported it.
deepblue69uk 1 year ago
The Atari Sts version of the tune is great i love it but im in agreement with my bro lunaticrik - its vastly inferior to the amiga
paulisthebest3uk 4 years ago 3
Comment removed
TeamRocketReviews 5 months ago
@TeamRocketReviews Wow, you must have, erm, odd hearing. :(
How ar eyour eyes? Is the scrolling smoother in the ST version too? :)
JasperAbraxxious 4 months ago
@JasperAbraxxious I prefer the first level music on the ST. To be fair, I like both the Amiga and the Atari ST equally.
TeamRocketReviews 4 months ago
Hard as nails, but oddly enough one of the very few games I've completed without cheating. ST version doesn't stack up at all well to the Amiga one, but apparently someone's doing an STE version of it.
junosix 4 years ago
Graphics look fine; okay, the gradient is a little coarser due to the more limited palette, but it's not the big a difference. The only problem is the "chippy" sound (and I can't recall what the Amiga version sounded like anyway).
IIRC the STE had much improved sound; unfortunately, because they didn't make it replace the STFM as the base model until 1991 (2 years or so after it came out and when the ST market was in serious decline), it never sold enough to get specific support.
NotATube 4 years ago 2
Cheer's Paul, watching this inspired me to look for the Atari ST emulator "Steem" and now i,m getting to reply all those classic ST games i used to own way back when, Keep up the great work.
Fawltykog 4 years ago
teh Atari ST's soundchip is soooo inferior to the Amiga's. What we're they thinking?
lunaticrik 4 years ago
cost less money?
andyukmonkey 4 years ago
Remember that the Amiga was also pretty expensive when it first came out- as in *significantly* more expensive than the ST. It wasn't until later that it came much closer in price to the ST and its popularity picked up (that's why the ST was more popular in the early 16-bit era).
Also, Commodore had much greater access to design and manufacturing facilities (they owned MOS technologies), which made it easier for them to do nice custom chips.
NotATube 4 years ago 2