Great Job explaining the truth about the Sabbath Day. It is a weekly refreshing of the human body to Rest in the Lord to bask in God's Greatness as Our CREATOR. Keep up the good work that you are doing for the Lord. CONTACT ME
WWJD? Would Jesus steal? Would Jesus lie? Would Jesus disobey his Father's Sabbath? Would Jesus disobey the New Moons? Would Jesus disobey eating kosher? Etc... All the Law of God is summed up in one word Love. If God put His Love in your hearts through His firstborn son Yahoshua ha Moshiach by the Holy Spirit then you have the Law (Love) written on your heart. If you have this Love then you won't be disobeying the Word. Love fulfills the chores of the Law, plain and simple that a child gets.
""Not the last time I read the Bible!!! Matt. 5: 17-18! Idk ""
Precisely, u dont know, yet u read the bible and boast as if u understood it. Jesus said that to the people of his day. He later fulfilled the law in that he fulfilled the purpose of the law, which was to convince us that we are unable to be righteous unless God takes complete control of our lives by His SPirit.
The 10 commands were spoken to Israel in that time. You cant just unilaterally apply commands......
The false gospel is salvation by faith but sanctification by obeying the law. You all should be accursed, for you preach that we are saved by the SPirit but become mature or complete by the law and human effort to obey the law.
The Holy SPirit of God justified us and sanctifies us and will glorify us. Our part is just to trust God while He does ALL the work for His GLORY.
Rom 7 says we are dead to the law...ALL the law...you are all so deceived.
The mic sounds REALLY close to your mouth but other than that great job on explaining what the bible teaches and not what mainstream Chistianity does.
now when I sin, when I kill, steal, lie, or brake the Sabbath, I am covered bye the true lamb. As I said the israelites didn't sacrifice a lamb which symbolized Jesus when they broke one of the 613 laws you talked about, but they did when they broke one of the 10, Now you can see the difference between the Moon Sabbaths and the Sabbath in the Decalogue.
the Israelites had hundreds of laws,but when they went to the sancuary to offer a lamb. it was not to be redeemed from one of those 613 commandments, it was for those 10 that were inside the ark,in the most holy place of the sanctuary, yes they didn't offer a sacrificial lamb because they broke the law "you shall not eat the fat of the animals" etc etc.BUT IF YOU WILLINGLY CHOOSE TO BRAKE ONE OF THE 10 YOU MAKE CHEAP THE SACRIFICE OF THE LAMB OF GOD.THE REAL LAMB OF GOD.
when one is condemned to die He can be saved by grace. This cannot be cheap Grace, someone must take their place.The law says if you sin you shall die. TO FULFILL THE LAW SOMEONE MUST DIE. The law is so important that the price must be paid, that is the only why. If the law could have been changed annulled or made obsolete Jesus would not have had to die.
13If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words:
14Then shalt thou delight thyself in the LORD; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.THE SABBATH WAS NEVER A BURDEN.
@medusa210562 If you turn away from Christ, you are turning away from the Sabbath. If you continue in your sins, you have not enter God's rest. Believe the gospel message is entering God's rest. Circumcision is of the physical sign of repentance. A new creation in Christ is the inner change of a person. The shadow and the reality, which one are you in?
@GodIsSovereignty You have not answered my question. Or maybe I didn't ask it well. HOW WERE THE ISRAELITES SAVED? Now your theology is poetically beautiful but it is not biblical. If you obey the law to be saved you are condemned by the law. To be under grace and not under the law means that you obey the law because you love Jesus and what he did for you. It doesn't meat that He freed you from a BURDENSOME sabbath. God never created a burdensome law. And man was never saved by works.
@medusa210562 I believe you already answer your question. You said, "If you obey the law to be saved you are condemned by the law. To be under grace and not under the law means that you obey the law because you love Jesus and what he did for you". This is what you really say. To live in the US as a citizen, not under British Law, you must obey Bristish Law because you love the US and what the country did for you. Why don't you fight the British who imposes their law onto the US citizens?
@GodIsSovereignty No man who was ever saved,was ever saved by keeping the law. Ever, This counted for the Israelites as well. If you are addicted to sin the law condemns you. At that point there are only 2 thinks that can save us. Either the law is nullified so it doesn't condemn us anymore. Or by GRACE a Redeemer dies in your place, because the law is too precious to be nullified, or made obsolete. IF YOU WANT A REDEEMER, AND THE NULLIFICATION OF THE LAW AS WELL, YOU MAKE A CHEAP GRACE.
@medusa210562 You try to justify by keeping the law is cheap grace in your part. You said it yourself that no one can be saved by keeping the law. So what is wrong to live under grace and not the law? How can you be under grace and under the law at the same time? Unless you still dead in your sins and transgressions.
@GodIsSovereignty Do you really believe that when we are in heaven we will talk to each other and we will say I had this law, and which law did you have? And another person will say I was not under the law, but I was under grace. You are under Grace because you are not under THE CONDEMNATION of the law. Thanks to the grace of our lord. No one was ever saved by works. The true isrlaelite was free from condemnation. He or she knew that the lamb rapresented the Grace of the REAL LAMB.
@GodIsSovereignty Read carefully my last comments, look at the use of the words in the past tense "I had" "did you have" "I was" I was talking about what we will say to each other about our time on earth. After that I expalin that .....You are under Grace because you are not under THE CONDEMNATION of the law. Thanks to the grace of our lord. No one was ever saved by works. The true isrlaelite was free from condemnation. He or she knew that the lamb presented the Grace of the REAL LAMB.
@GodIsSovereignty But the most important comment you and others like you must understand is what I answered you about the 613 commandments. Please read is 1000 times. Home work for you.
if one is condemned to die and he if freed by grace is only because the commandments that accused him still stands. Grace and the law only make sense when they are both valid at the same time. And no one was ever saved by observing the law. But by faith in Jesus, represented in the lamb killed on the alter.
to know history is to cease to be protestant-John Henry Newman(former protestant turned Catholic) Everything The Catholic Church teaches today, the early church fathers taught, whom were all Catholic obviously, The Fathers know best- great book on the early church and history.
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
... You are confusing the "DAY OF REST" (Saturday, the day following the Work Week that begins on Monday and ends on Friday) with THE SABBATH (Sunday) which Moses correctly labels as the week day which should be kept “Holy” (through fine dress, communal gatherings, celebrations, displays, and respectful worship of our Creators).
... Only a Devil Cult would try to confuse the two by claiming that rest was a way of “Keeping Holy” God’s Day.
traditionally we our sabbath is sunday. but we dont need to worry about this. For what is the seventh day is that our sabbath day. .for me the important things to be focus is that we have faith to our only one almighty GOD. .more power to alL!..GODBLESS US ALL. .:-)
@93manzkie traditionally is the problem...Jesus was very DOWN on traditions that contradicted God's law. a person can come up with the most religious reasons for keeping sunday, but if he is not keeping the 7th day Sabbath of the fourth commandment, he is breaking God's law. God did not give us multiple choice, He commanded the 7th day, not sunday.
Owe nothing to anyone except to love one another ; for he who loves his neighbor has fulfilled the law. For this, "YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, YOU SHALL NOT MURDER, YOU SHALL NOT STEAL, YOU SHALL NOT COVET," and if there is any other commandment, it is summed up in this saying, "YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF." Love does no wrong to a neighbor ; therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.
I hope SDA's don't believe the Sabbath is fulfillment of the law.
@harvestsoulfly "I hope SDA's don't believe the Sabbath is fulfillment of the law"
I hope you dont thinking breaking God's law, any of it, is the fulfilling of the law either. the fact is that the reason love is the fulfilling of the law is because if you love God you'll keep the first 4 & if you love your neighbor you'll keep the last 6. anything else is only lip service. if you don't love Him, you wont keep His law.
Why put so much emphasis on the Sabbath when SDA's don't follow all the sabbatical laws?
Just a few:
lighting candles 18 minutes before sunset
Not carrying anything out of a "domain".
No lighting fire's
Orthodox Jew's who truly follow the Sabbath claim "lighting a gas stove, adding wood to a fire, changing a thermostat so as to start a gas or oil furnace, etc. Using (turning on and off) electricity or anything electronic is included in this rule"
@harvestsoulfly can you tell me where is the scripture it says we must light candles 18 minutes before sunset? I don't recall that. Not carrying anything out of a domain? you sound like the ones who told the paralytic man at the pool of Bethesda to stop carrying his bed when Jesus told him to do it. gas stoves? thermostat? electricity? I'd like to see that in scripture.
the penalty for breaking any of the ten commandments is death.
u need to quit quoting pharisees in order to bash SDA's.
Jesus taught it is right to do good on His Day. Matt 12:10-12, Mark 3:2-4, Luke 6:6-9, 13:14-16, John 9:14-16. Taking care of others is the very essence of His law of love. I know of many in the health care field who perform their jobs on the Sabbath but take no renumeration for that Day. God bless.
@Nirky Those people don't want anyone else but my wife.It's hard to find trust worthy people coming into their homes.Thanks alot and God bless you too
SDA believe they can receive salvation by worshiping on Sat, that's no different then the Jews putting their salvation in circumcision. Both believe they are Gods only chosen people because of their belief
To the rest of us... well, we're Gentiles, subject to condemnation because we don't worship on Sat & will receive the mark of the beast.
Nowhere in the Bible does it say you'll receive the mark because of this. It was only from EGW vision. So SDA must believe her visions are above the Bible.
@harvestsoulfly There may be people in every denomination that put their faith in works for salvation, the SDA church does not however do this, the Bible states that we are saved by grace through faith. The Bible is clear on this, we are not saved by works. Our justification however will save us from the shackles of sin and thus by Christ and in Christ we obey our Lord, it is the only expression our faith can have. By careful study of Scripture you will find that the Sabbath is the mark of God.
@harvestsoulfly ...and if the Sabbath is the mark of God, then what is the mark of the beast? The Beast, the papacy, declares that its Sunday is its mark of authority, and thus when the law of sunday worship are implemented and enforced the mark will be distributed. As for the gentiles, the Bible has no promise for the gentiles, when a gentile accept Christ they become a child of God, the seed of Abraham by faith. This is also a very clear doctrine in the Bible. =)
1. @harvestsoulfly you don't seem to be very educated on what SDA's believe. we dont believe any such thing. salvation is by grace thru faith alone. you seem to believe however that grace is a license to sin.
SDA's in fact believe that there are MANY more true christians in other denominations who will hear God's call to come out of babylon (false church teachings).
2. @harvestsoulfly Rev 14:11 tells us the LOST who worship the beast & receive the mark, "have NO REST".
then immediately Rev 14:12 tells us that the SAINTS, those that are SAVED, KEEP the commandments of God & have the FAITH of Jesus.
the faith of Jesus (true Christianity) involves KEEPING God's commandments. which is contrasted with those who DO NOT keep His commandments & have no REST. Which commandment has to do with REST? yep, that pesky old 4th.
3. @harvestsoulfly I don't why people like the bash SDA's so much but they do. they will lie about them, or say that the "must" believe this or that when they don't.
Ellen White herself said the bible was the FINAL authority and that is exactly what SDA's believe. Mrs. White's writings lead us to scripture, they do not eclipse scripture by any means, nor do they replace scripture.
@93manzkie No one will answer your question because the Bible doesn't say it. As a matter of fact, prior to Moses, none of the Israelite's knew there even was a sabbath! The Bible doesn't mention the sabbath once prior to Moses. Only in Gen 2:2 the bible says "God rested on the 7th day".
I've asked several times & have yet to get one coherent answer.
@harvestsoulfly Jesus is the Lord of the Sabbath, He gave it, He made it, He ordained it, He made it Holy. By what "Thus sayeth the Lord" do we break His Law? Where in the gospels do we find Jesus asking us to break His commandments? It is written about the children of Set, they were the sons of God, about Enoch, about Noah that they were rightous men, about Abraham keeping the commandments and statutes of Christ. Why do you object against the law of Christ anyway brother? Is he not our King?
@Mekelsior Christ worked on the Sabbath. He casted out demons and healed the sick. He defended his disciples from breaking the head grain and ate on the Sabbath. On and on, the Scripture tells us that on the Sabbath, Christ worked. So why? The Sabbaths God commanded the Israelites to observe teach them about a principle truth of the Sabbath, a spiritual rest. Being free from sickness and demon-possessed is entering into the Sabbath. Look to Christ for a spiritual rest, not physical rest.
@GodIsSovereignty yes He did work on the Sabbath...but He was never found in the carpenter shop doing His regular weekly job. Christ worked hard on many a sunday. sunday in the bible is just another work day...one of the 6. Jes nor God never blessed it, never sanctified it, never commanded it. nothing in the NT does away with the 4th commandment or changes it in any way. the change came about thru misguided men...thru tradition. Jesus never had a good word to say about traditions.
@Mekelsior Nowhere in the Bible does it mention that anyone from Adam until Moses followed the Sabbath.
Romans 4:1-5
For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God.
For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.
Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
@harvestsoulfly Yes it does. Jesus said Sabbath was made for man (not Jews). Adam was the first man. Sabbath was instituted/blessed/made holy at creation, 2300 years b4 Jews existed. EX 16 God asks "how long REFUSE ye to keep my commandments..." referring specifically to Sabbath. they had been "refusing" to keep a law they knew existed already since creation. God said "remember the Sabbath...". they could not remember something that never existed till then. the teaching is there.
Genesis 26:5 because Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my requirements, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws." This Laws were not just subjective feelings of love that is why Noah new which animals were clean and which were unclean, and this is not even as important as the 10 commandments. And also Cain new that a expiatory sacrifice should have spelled blood. Romans 4:4 is just saying that works by themselves mean nothing, it's not saying that you can sin read Rom 4:7
@harvestsoulfly the bible doesnt mention the Sabbath prior to moses? LOL :)
at creation, 2300 years before jews existed, the Seventh day is pronounce HOLY. you think God made a HOLY day just for Himself? Jesus disagrees with you..."the Sabbath was made FOR MAN...". notice He did not say it was made for Jews. Adam was the first man...made on the 6th day...then the Sabbath was made FOR ADAM (MAN).
maybe the answers arent coherent b/c u really arent interested in the truth? might require change.
@rusda2 Rom 4 What then shall we say that Abraham, our forefather according to the flesh, has found? For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God. For what does the Scripture say? “ABRAHAM BELIEVED GOD, AND IT WAS CREDITED TO HIM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS.”
You read between the lines! No where in the OT prior to Moses is there any mention of man keeping the Sabbath.
The sabbath was destroyed after creation, and God did not rest; He went back to work after Satan {sin} destroyed it. God finished his new work at the cross when Jesus called out, "It is finished!". Christ was exalted and seated at the right hand of God--He rested. And we can enter God's rest again if we go to him.
@GodIsSovereignty (John 5:16-18) The Jewish leaders harassed Jesus for breaking the Sabbath law. Jesus said “My Father is always working & so am I. So the Jewish leaders tried all the harder to find a way to kill him. For he not only broke the Sabbath, he called God his Father, thereby making himself equal with God.
@GodIsSovereignty Why did Israel keep the 7th day Sabbath? Why is it in the law if it was destroyed after creation? By what device can anyone destroy a period of time? How much power does the devil really have, can he truly destroy something that God have complete control over? Why is the focus on the Bible so strongly towards the Law of God and why does Jesus Christ ask us to keep His commandments as a sign of our love towards God?
@Mekelsior which day you worship/rest on is to be regarded as a remembrance of what our Lord did for us. That's all, otherwise creeds & laws start to govern it. And we know SDA's do not follow all the sabbath creeds!
I'm not big into eschatology but pretty sure it can be debated whether or not the Catholic church, or Pope is the antichrist (if thats what you believe) or those who work on sat might be condemned.
No one could force me to work on sat. I'd quit my job, get a new one.
@harvestsoulfly What Sabbath "creeds" would this be? No it cant be argued at all if one takes the bible for what it says. the bible is very clear that the antichrist will come from within the professing "christian" church.
@Mekelsior Simple answer. Sin destroyed it. The law reveals sin in the nature of man and how it destroys the relationship between man and God. Jesus came to destroy sin and free us from it. When Christ took our sins upon himself on the cross, He shouted, "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" Do you see how sin destroy the relationship between God the Father and the Son at that moment? Look upon to Jesus; cloth Christ as our righteousness, not the law.
@GodIsSovereignty being clothed in the righteousness of Christ does not do away with any of the ten commandments. Christians should love the Lord enough to keep His commandments. anything else is just lip service.
@rusda2 Of course, we are clothed in the righteousness of Christ because we are sinners--law breakers. We remain in Christ to produce good fruit. Jesus said "This is My commandment, that you love one another, just as I have loved you." Love is the fulfillment of the law. So just keep loving people.
@GodIsSovereignty Faith is claims God's blessings in obedience, presumption is claiming God's blessings in disobedience. Now both faith and presumption use God's love as their motivation, but faith trusts God's love. were as presumption tests God's love. Which one do you practice faith or presumption? Romans 3:31 Do we, then, nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather, we uphold the law.
@medusa210562 Many people have the idea that because we say we are not under the law but under grace, we freely sin. That is presumption. We came to grace by the guidance of the law. The law shows us that we are sinners and need Christ our Savior. The Sabbath is found in Christ. Jesus. Jesus said, "Come to Me, all who are weary and heavy-laden, and I will give you rest. Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and YOU WILL FIND REST FOR YOUR SOULS."
@GodIsSovereignty Look my brother you cannot talk of bananas and oranges as if they are the same thing, I need the spiritual rest that comes from knowing Jesus. I also drink of His water that quenches for ever, (that he was talking to the Samaritan woman about) But I still drink water. Romans 3:31 Do we then nulify the law by faith? not at all! Rather we uphold the law. If you know about the Sabbath and you do not observe it you sin. The sabbath is the Lord's day mentioned even in revelation
@GodIsSovereignty The law is like a mirror that shows you your condition, the law does not save, In fact no one was ever saved like that. Now if you are a pagan the spirit of God still tells you, you must not kill etc. But if you are a christian you can see more "on the Sabbath they rested according to the commandment" (Luke 23:56) In acts they met on the sabbath near the river nothing to do with synagogue custom. Revelation 21:8 stands for every sin not 3, or 5 or 7, but all 10 commandaments
@medusa210562 You said, "The law is like a mirror that shows you your condition". If you understand this thought, why don't you understand that the sabbath shows you your condition? Keeping the sabbath is a reminding that you're a sinner and cannot enter God's Sabbath--rest for the people of God. According to the commandment, keeping the sabbath is to stay home. So on the sabbath they met near the river indicates what day of the week that event took place. You're still wrong.
@GodIsSovereignty 1 every commandament showes my condition. "you shall not kill" when I kill it shows my condition "observe My Sabbath" when you brake this commandment shows your condition. "you shall not lie" when you brake this it shows your condition. If I take one comandament away it will stop to show me that sin I could commit. I wouldn't be a sinner without the law, but I am a sinner. But thank God for his Grace, I am forgiven.
@medusa210562 Wrong interpretation. "You shall not kill" indicates that you are a killer. "You shall not lie" declares you are a liar. You don't have to kill a person to become a killer. God said you already are a killer and a liar. "Remember the Sabbath" declares that you were kicked out from it. "Keep it holy" shows you fail to keep it holy. So my friend, we were sabbath breakers--we got kick out from God's rest. So when you try to keep the sabbath, you work your way back in which is...
@GodIsSovereignty every comandament idicates one of my characteristics as a sinner you are right, who gives you the authority to make one rule for 9 and another for one. If you don't "keep it holy" you sin if you "kill" you sin.
If you take one commandment away you brake all 10. As I said you are making a non biblical doctrine of this REST.
@GodIsSovereignty Let's start our conversation from the beginning if you are willing? And answer me this question? Do you think the Israelites were saved by obbeying the law?
@medusa210562 If obeying the law can save the Israelites, Christ would never have come. The fact that He came to save His people from their sins shows that all fall short, including you and I. Sinners are law breakers and we are sinners by nature. Keeping law perfectly has not merit; it does not change who you are.
@GodIsSovereignty Isn't is amazing that when Jesus was accused of braking the Sabbath he even used the old testament to defend Himself. In other words He was not changing anything He was explaining the true nature of the Sabbath. Please have a look at the youtube video "Jesus is my sabbath rest" by eraunaographe.
@GodIsSovereignty Jesus explained and demonstrated what was always true. In fact from the moment Adam and Eve fell. Look at this passage about divorce. Matthew 19:8 He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but FROM THE BEGINNING it was not so.
@GodIsSovereignty Finally you are starting to get something, In the beginning. "this is after sin because that is what you and I have been talking about all along". There was not law that said you can divorce, I just Said "YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT ADULTERY" The 10 commandments are a reflection of the character of God. Read Matthew 19 in its context. Or I forget you have been reading the word rest out of context all along as well.
@medusa210562 I thought you understand the purpose of the 10 Commandments. If the 10 Commandments are a reflection of God's character, are you saying God has a wife and God never commit adultery? The 10 Commandments is God's verdict that we are murders, idolaters, thiefs, coveters....We do not become a murder by killing someone; we are already a murder by birth--it's in our nature. Don't you understand this simple truth? Therefore, we cannot keep the 10 Commandments to merit righteousness.
@GodIsSovereignty The law is a reflection of God's character. Love is in the 10 commandments. All 10 amplified by the example of Jesus. If the law said "you must Kill" that would probably represent the character of Lucifer. Because that would be his law. Not God's law. The 10 commandments had to be kept perfectly. But because we didn't and don't. Jesus paid the price. HOW CAN YOU THEN PREACH SUCH CHEAP GRACE.
@medusa210562 You said "The 10 commandments had to be kept perfectly". Have you kept it perfectly? My friend, when you said the law is a reflection of God's character, you imply God is a sinner. The Scripture says the law reveals us our sins--the reflection of our character. The law is like a mirror; it shows our ugly faces. Did I preach cheap grace? On the contrary, you are. You think God's grace is cheap; it's not enough for you and you must try add merit by trying to keep the law perfectly.
@GodIsSovereignty THE LAW IS A REFLECTION OF GOD'S CHARACTER. IT REFLECTS HIS WILL FOR US. YESTERDAY, TODAY, AND TOMORROW. WE ARE NOT SAVED BY IT,Romas 3;31 Do we, then, nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather, we uphold the law. If you take away the law you make grace cheap. Jesus kept it perfectly, that how He fulfilled it. and Jesus was the expiatory lamb. that's how he furlfilled it
@medusa210562 You said, "Isn't is amazing that when Jesus was accused of braking the Sabbath he even used the old testament to defend Himself" So why did Jesus defend Himself? This is what I think. "Well if you can break it, why can't I?" So Jesus worked on the Sabbath. Should this be a sign that Jesus already told them the Sabbath must be a day of working? Jesus did the work the Father sent Him to do: to heal the sick, release the oppressed; He did this on the Sabbath; He set the captive free
@GodIsSovereignty Jesus used the Old Testament. So what He did on the Sabbath and what He didn't do was in accordance with the Old testament, not against it. Even before Jesus-it was not wrong to give water to the animals.(which Jesus uses as an example) was never wrong to heal the sik. HOW CAN YOU IMPLY THAT GOD MADE A BURDENSOME Commandment, then fixed it.The sabbath rest is a day of loving your God yourself and your neabour. You don't just observe it like a legalistic pharisee.
@medusa210562 To keep the Sabbath holy is to be free from sin, spiritual oppression, from sickness, from demon possession. The physical sabbath is a shadow of the real spiritual Sabbath--God's rest.
@medusa210562 is not possible. You try avoid being a killer or a liar by keeping the commandments, but you were already declared killer and liar...sabbath breaker. So my friend, that is the purpose of the Law.
@GodIsSovereignty Revelation 22;17 Jesus gives the water of life. John 18:12 Jesus is the light of the world.
Jesus is the way, He is the alpha and the omega. He is our rest. You can't take any of these and exchange them for commandments or make doctrines from your imagination, For example Jesus is the light of the world, but we still have the sun is the sky, we still drink water, we still sleep at night. And so Jesus is the lord of the Sabbath not the Sabbath. He is life but I still eat!!!!
@medusa210562 You said, "Jesus is the way,...He is our rest. You can't take any of these and exchanged them for commandments or make doctrines..." So why observe the Sabbath (Saturday), instead of go to him? "He is life but I still eat" So if you don't eat, you die. So food is better than Christ? You're very confuse. You need to know the difference between physical life and spiritual life.
@GodIsSovereignty The sabbath is not to stay home, the sabbath is to stay with God, You can stay with God all the time. But the sabbath is a special blessed time. Doesn't is say there in acts "THE SABBATH" The bible doesn't lie to us. it didn't say the 7th day or 1rst day or 3rd day it says "the Sabbath" as I said before. The Lord's day in revelation 1:10 is the sabbath for Jesus said "I am the Lord of the Sabbath". You are making you own doctrine from the word rest, You really are.
In your scenario that would be 4 days and 3 nights, let's count it out:
Thursday morn-1st day
Thursday eve-1st night
Fri morn -2nd day
Fri eve-2nd night
Sabbath morn-3rd day
Sabbath eve-3rd night
Sun morn-4th day
Jesus says His sign, the sign of Jonah, is "3 days and 3 nights" (Matt 12:40). Thursday morning doesn't fit scripture and it doesn't fit Jesus' only sign of 3 days and 3 nights.
"It means less hours from evening"--I have no idea what you are trying to say, can you please explain?
I count from Thursday evening to Sunday morning it was just as Jesus said--3 days and 3 nights--just as Jonah was, Jesus' sign that He would be in the heart of the earth, the clutches of the world, for 3 days and 3 nights.
Jonah was trapped in the belly of the great fish, and therefore Jonah was being controlled by the great fish, for 3 days and 3 nights. Likewise, Jesus willingly gave Himself over to the control of the world and began suffering for the world's sins on that Thursday.
In Matt 12:40 Jesus gives the scribes & pharisees His only sign when He compares Jonah's three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish with His being "in the heart of the earth" three days and three nights.
The problem here is that many assume "heart of the earth" means the grave. But nowhere does scripture call it the grave, it is simply a false assumption. If you don't think so, can you show a scripture which defines "heart of the earth" as the grave?
Again, the 3 days and 3 nights Jesus was in the "heart of the earth" or "clutches of the world" began that Thursday evening, when the Father began placing the world's sins upon Him, and Jesus said He was suffering greatly, even nearing death (Matt 26:38, Mark 14:34). That same Thursday night He was placed under arrest and taken prisoner, where He had several mockeries of trials before being condemned, beaten and finally crucified on Friday.
From the Garden of Gethsemane on that Thursday, Jesus was in the heart of the earth, translated another way He was in "the clutches of the world". He was so distressed at the weight of our sins that He prayed that the Father might pass the cup of suffering from Him, yet not His will be done, but the Father's. He could have left any time, but He loved us so much He took upon Himself the grief of our sins for those 3 days and 3 nights, until He breathed His last and gave up His spirit.
Jesus was in a similar yet massively more serious situation. It was on that Thursday in the Garden of Gethsemane that the Father began to place the sins of the world on Him. He became sorrowful, then distressed, then later in agony, and being in fervent prayer, He actually began to sweat drops of blood. He wanted to do the will of the Father and save us, yet He had never sinned, and never knew what is was like, but now He was feeling the sins of the whole world upon Him.
Jonah was in a situation not of his choosing, he was powerless and subject to the will of the big fish, and God. He was trapped, and it couldn't have been a pleasant situation, he probably felt as if he were dying. Feeling alone and probably barley able to breath, in hostile surroundings with no apparent way out. With his suffering, Jonah must have prayed his most fervent prayers ever in the belly of that fish.
So what does "heart of the earth" mean if it isn't the grave?
Think about the story of Jonah, Jesus says that is the sign. God called Jonah to warn the city of Nineveh of it's impending destruction if the people there didn't repent of their sins. But Jonah refused to go, and tried to run away. God needed Jonah to preach to those lost people, so He caused a storm and long story short, Jonah was thrown overboard his getaway ship and was swallowed by a big fish.
"For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth." Matt 12:40
Jesus compares Jonah's three days and three nights in the belly of the big fish with His being "in the heart of the earth" three days and nights. The problem here is that many assume "heart of the earth" means the grave. But nowhere does scripture call it the grave.
Our Lord rested in the grave on His Sabbath according to the 4th commandment. When those women came back to finish the job of preparing His body early Sunday morning, He had already risen. Mark tells us He rose early Sunday morning. Mark 16:9
Again, John chapter 19 tells us that the Jewish leaders hastened to take down His body from the Cross so it wouldn't be there for the 4th commandment Sabbath.
"And the women who had come with Him from Galilee followed after, and they observed the tomb and how His body was laid. Then they returned and prepared spices and fragrant oils. And they rested on the Sabbath according to the commandment." Luke 23:55-56
"And about the ninth hour Jesus cried out with a loud voice, saying, “Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?” that is, “My God, My God, why have You forsaken Me?” Matt 27:46
The "ninth hour" is 6PM. It was about the ninth hour and the sun was setting on that spring day, and it was nearing twilight. Jesus was sacrificed at the very same time the ceremonial sacrificial lamb was to be slain-twilight between Friday sunset and Sabbath. Lev 23:5
Our Lord was nailed to His Cross on the preparation day-Friday. Note also that the weekly Sabbath was a "high day", meaning a ceremonial sabbath fell also on the weekly Sabbath. This ceremonial sabbath was of course Passover. The shadowy ceremonial law met its substance that day, because all the ceremonial Passovers pointed to this one single event in the spring of 31AD-Jesus sacrificing Himself on the Cross, as our Passover!
Hi Popinion7, let's let scripture answer your question.
"Therefore, because it was the Preparation Day, that the bodies should not remain on the cross on the Sabbath (for that Sabbath was a high day), the Jews asked Pilate that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken away." John 19:31
Matthew 24 Jesus is speaking "himself" about the End of all ages or End times... Matthew 24:20 reads: "And pray your flight is not in the winter or on the SABBATH." This is biblical FACT that Jesus Himself is prophesying about the END TIMES which includes today 2/12/11 and beyond... Which makes the Sabbath still in effect...
Question: Why do we observe Sunday instead of Saturday?
Answer. We observe Sunday instead of Saturday because the Catholic Church in the Council of Laodicea, transferred the solemnity from Saturday to Sunday."
Peter Geiermann, C.S.S.R., The Converts Catechism of Catholic Doctrine Third Edition"
@Nirky Justin Martyr's writings 150 years after the death of Christ, said “On the day called Sunday, all who live in cities or in the country gather together to one place and the memoirs of the apostles or the writings of the prophets are read as long at time permit but Sunday is the day on which we all hold our common assembly because it is the first day on which God having wrought a change in the darkness and matter made the world and Jesus Christ our Savior on the same day rose from the dead.
@harvestsoulfly why is it you guys always quote the "church fathers" but not the bible? could it be because there is no bible support for sunday? yep.
the priciple you are missing is this...it does not matter...listen carefully...it does not matter what the church "fathers" said or did or told you to do if it contradicts a clear command of God, it's a tradition of men. Jesus never had a good word to say about traditions...he said if u will enter life, keep God's commandments.
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@Nirky Sunday is the sabbath now and the Lord's day. It USE TO BE saturday, (old testament) but when Jesus rose from the dead on Sunday, IT BECAME SUNDAY.
Matt. 28:1; Mark 16:2,9; John 20:1,19- the Gospel writers purposely reveal Jesus' resurrection and appearances were on Sunday. This is because Sunday had now become the most important day in the life of the Church.
@Nirky Acts 20:7 - this text shows the apostolic tradition of gathering together to celebrate the Eucharist on Sunday, the "first day of the week." Luke documents the principle worship was on Sunday because this was one of the departures from the Jewish form of worship.
Rev 1:10 - John specifically points out that he witnesses the heavenly Eucharistic liturgy on Sunday, the Lord's day, the new day of rest in Christ.
The Catholic Cardinal Gibbons, in Faith of Our Fathers, pg. 111, said,
"You may read the Bible from Genesis to Revelation, and you will not find a single line authorizing the sanctification of Sunday. The Scriptures enforce the religious observance of Saturday, a day which we (The Roman Catholic Church) never sanctify."
Sorry tramoliter but I can't find the comment that you responded to. In any case I am in complete agreement with you on the fact that the Law of Moses cannot be annulled.
People who teach against the law and the prophets are in great danger of hell.
I see you are unwilling to discuss certain scripture which contradicts your held beliefs. I thought perhaps another dialog about entering His rest might edify, to get you to look at and answer specific points Bible writers make on an important subject such as this, but I realize now I cannot force, asking you to answer questions which, at the present time, you do not wish to look at. I'm always on YT if you should change your mind. May the grace of our LORD Jesus be with you.
Paul tells us in Hebrews ch 3&4 what entering into His rest is--who enters, why they enter, how they enter. If we want to understand His rest, exactly what it means to enter into His rest, Hebrews ch 3&4 is the place for answers.
You pledged not to avoid anymore-I'll trust you. Paul tells us His people Israel should have entered into His rest, they were intended to enter His rest, but failed. What reason in Hebrews 3&4 does Paul tell us they failed to enter His rest?
"For He has spoken in a certain place of the seventh day in this way: “And God rested on the seventh day from all His works”; and again in this place: “They shall not enter My rest.” Heb 4:4-5
Whether we willfully disobey the 4th, or the 8th commandments, we CANNOT enter into His spiritual rest, the Bible is clear.
Paul in Hebrews ch 3&4 tells us we ONLY enter into His spiritual rest when we obey Him by keeping His commandments. Israel was meant to enter into His rest, but they lacked faith and thus did not obey Him. They knew what the right thing was to do, but they did not follow God. We are told SPECIFICALLY not to repeat their example of disobedience!
Bible says you'll rest as God rested. Did God start his creative work back up on the eighth day, like you start your work back up? Or has he been in rest from that work since he completed it that very first seventh day?
Hey there:) It's great to hear from you. I hope you are doing well. It's been ages since I've spoken with prayer, not since the beginning of december if I remember, around the time she went on her sabbatical. Actually, I haven't seen any of you guys online until recent days. Has everything been going okay?
You have avoided addressing the scripture given. If we are to edify, to build on what God tells us, we must address, not avoid scripture. Can we agree on this?
Point I have brought up: Our LORD's people Israel should have entered into His rest, they were intended to enter His rest, but failed. What reason in Hebrews 3&4 does Paul tell us they failed to enter His rest?
However, the reason I never responded directly to your post yet is because you never addressed these points in my previous comments in regards to what I mentioned about God's rest which is a biblical explanation of his rest.
When we understand his rest, we can start to understand the passages of Hebrews 3&4. We need to understand God's rest.
@Myhopeisinhim God rested on the seventh day, and set it aside for a Holy purpose. Jesus kept each Sabbath also, it was also His custom to go in the synagogue on the Sabbath and no one can change that :). I'm sorry that that simple truth was missed but like i said i wont get in too deep, you know the truth. I pray you keep on abiding in Jesus' love and have a Happy Sabbath! :). God bless!
Patricia-you pledged just yesterday you would stop avoiding scripture and answer questions. You have one before you concerning the extensive information Paul gives in Heb 3&4 about entering into His rest. I've asked it twice now, and am losing hope in your promise. Please answer.
Paul tells us His people Israel should have entered into His rest, they were intended to enter His rest, but failed. What reason in Hebrews 3&4 does Paul tell us they failed to enter His rest?
Hbr 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God [did] from his.
My questions pertain to hebrews, and more specifically this verse. I promise you I'm not avoiding it. Why are you avoiding the questions I've given? And why are you refusing to address those particular points I've made?
Here are the questions again
Why did God rest? Did he rest because it was the seventh day? or because his work was complete? more
You may have to click on the "see all" to see my other comment, it tends to disappear from the main screen.
Please know that I am not avoiding hebrews, but these questions must be considered before the topic can continue. I've been asking them over and over again, and no one seems to want to answer them.
And did he start that work back up again on the eighth day, as you do, or has his work been complete since the creation of the world?
I promise you, that all this does pertain to the rest of God, and to Hebrews. I just pray that you will be willing to look into these questions and find the answers.
I've answered your questions for over a year now. All of them. Backed up by scripture. So far you have not reciprocated. You pledged you would stop avoiding scripture and start answering questions, but I've asked you the same question twice now, no answer. If you don't know, then say you don't know. If you do know, then please answer.
If you have I've never seen the answer to these particular questions. You've answered other questions yes. But not these ones that I have seen. Humor me.....and then we'll continue
Why did God rest? was it because it was the seventh day, or because his work was complete
Answer: He rested, ceased from his creative work, because it was finished. There wasn't anything more to be done. The term rest used meant ceased, stopped the work he was doing because he had finished, completed the work.
Question 2: Did he pick this work back up on the eighth day?
No, he was still in rest from this work even after the seventh day ended
And even today July 16, 2010, he is still in rest from that creative work. He didn't just rest on the seventh day from his creative work, he hasn't started that work again.
The only work God stopped was his creation of this world on the seventh day, and it's been done since that day. All his other work he was doing still continued, his governing of the universe, his watching over us, all that never stops. His rest started on that day, but it never ended......
Hebrews tells us that we will rest as God rested from his works, and it speaks of another certain day, that he limiteth again another day, calling that day TODAY, that if you will just believe, you will enter his rest.
What happens on the day you believe? If you don't harden your heart against Jesus, what does he do for you? He makes you whole, makes you complete.
And just like God rested when his work was complete, you too are entered into rest when you are made complete.....
His resting was not because it was a specific day, and our rest has nothing to do with a specific frame of time either, it has to do with a WORK being COMPLETED.
Genesis 2 tells us that he rested because his works were done, complete. The creation of the world was over. That was the work he ceased from, all his other work was still ongoing, which is why Jesus says that his father is always working.
The rest hebrews talks about is the rest people enter into when they believe....
And it is the moment you believe that Christ makes you complete in him, and just like his work has been done since that first seventh day, your work is complete that very moment that you are made complete. It doesn't end after the sun goes down on the seventh day.
I'm honestly not avoiding anything, it is all connected. And I was going to get to your question, once you posted the answers to mine here, but ah well. I pray you will take the time to consider what was said here.
In case you didn't see the answer to your question in there in the reversal mode, Hebrews speaks of people not entering into his rest due to unbelief. The problem with not believing is because if you don't believe in Jesus how can he make you complete in him?
And if you are not complete, and made perfect by him, then you have no rest because you are still trying to attain something that you cannot reach without Jesus.
Great Job explaining the truth about the Sabbath Day. It is a weekly refreshing of the human body to Rest in the Lord to bask in God's Greatness as Our CREATOR. Keep up the good work that you are doing for the Lord. CONTACT ME
GeraldBoydWilliams 1 week ago
@GeraldBoydWilliams So the weekly sabbath refreshes the body. So I can rest on Sunday and refresh my body too. It works the same.
GodIsSovereignty 15 hours ago
WWJD? Would Jesus steal? Would Jesus lie? Would Jesus disobey his Father's Sabbath? Would Jesus disobey the New Moons? Would Jesus disobey eating kosher? Etc... All the Law of God is summed up in one word Love. If God put His Love in your hearts through His firstborn son Yahoshua ha Moshiach by the Holy Spirit then you have the Law (Love) written on your heart. If you have this Love then you won't be disobeying the Word. Love fulfills the chores of the Law, plain and simple that a child gets.
yahokobbenyah 3 months ago
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""Not the last time I read the Bible!!! Matt. 5: 17-18! Idk ""
.....why dont u circle Jericho seven times and why dont you sell everything u have and give it to the poor? HYPOCRITES!!!!
j919or 3 months ago
""Not the last time I read the Bible!!! Matt. 5: 17-18! Idk ""
Precisely, u dont know, yet u read the bible and boast as if u understood it. Jesus said that to the people of his day. He later fulfilled the law in that he fulfilled the purpose of the law, which was to convince us that we are unable to be righteous unless God takes complete control of our lives by His SPirit.
The 10 commands were spoken to Israel in that time. You cant just unilaterally apply commands......
j919or 3 months ago
The false gospel is salvation by faith but sanctification by obeying the law. You all should be accursed, for you preach that we are saved by the SPirit but become mature or complete by the law and human effort to obey the law.
The Holy SPirit of God justified us and sanctifies us and will glorify us. Our part is just to trust God while He does ALL the work for His GLORY.
Rom 7 says we are dead to the law...ALL the law...you are all so deceived.
j919or 3 months ago
The mic sounds REALLY close to your mouth but other than that great job on explaining what the bible teaches and not what mainstream Chistianity does.
ortega9998 5 months ago 2
now when I sin, when I kill, steal, lie, or brake the Sabbath, I am covered bye the true lamb. As I said the israelites didn't sacrifice a lamb which symbolized Jesus when they broke one of the 613 laws you talked about, but they did when they broke one of the 10, Now you can see the difference between the Moon Sabbaths and the Sabbath in the Decalogue.
medusa210562 5 months ago
the Israelites had hundreds of laws,but when they went to the sancuary to offer a lamb. it was not to be redeemed from one of those 613 commandments, it was for those 10 that were inside the ark,in the most holy place of the sanctuary, yes they didn't offer a sacrificial lamb because they broke the law "you shall not eat the fat of the animals" etc etc.BUT IF YOU WILLINGLY CHOOSE TO BRAKE ONE OF THE 10 YOU MAKE CHEAP THE SACRIFICE OF THE LAMB OF GOD.THE REAL LAMB OF GOD.
medusa210562 5 months ago
when one is condemned to die He can be saved by grace. This cannot be cheap Grace, someone must take their place.The law says if you sin you shall die. TO FULFILL THE LAW SOMEONE MUST DIE. The law is so important that the price must be paid, that is the only why. If the law could have been changed annulled or made obsolete Jesus would not have had to die.
medusa210562 5 months ago
13If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words:
14Then shalt thou delight thyself in the LORD; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.THE SABBATH WAS NEVER A BURDEN.
medusa210562 5 months ago
@medusa210562 If you turn away from Christ, you are turning away from the Sabbath. If you continue in your sins, you have not enter God's rest. Believe the gospel message is entering God's rest. Circumcision is of the physical sign of repentance. A new creation in Christ is the inner change of a person. The shadow and the reality, which one are you in?
GodIsSovereignty 5 months ago
@GodIsSovereignty You have not answered my question. Or maybe I didn't ask it well. HOW WERE THE ISRAELITES SAVED? Now your theology is poetically beautiful but it is not biblical. If you obey the law to be saved you are condemned by the law. To be under grace and not under the law means that you obey the law because you love Jesus and what he did for you. It doesn't meat that He freed you from a BURDENSOME sabbath. God never created a burdensome law. And man was never saved by works.
medusa210562 5 months ago
@medusa210562 I believe you already answer your question. You said, "If you obey the law to be saved you are condemned by the law. To be under grace and not under the law means that you obey the law because you love Jesus and what he did for you". This is what you really say. To live in the US as a citizen, not under British Law, you must obey Bristish Law because you love the US and what the country did for you. Why don't you fight the British who imposes their law onto the US citizens?
GodIsSovereignty 5 months ago
@GodIsSovereignty Romans 3;21 Do we, then, nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather, we uphold the law.
medusa210562 5 months ago
@medusa210562 If you want to live correctly under grace, study Ephesians 2:1-10. The gospel message is summarized here.
GodIsSovereignty 5 months ago
@GodIsSovereignty No man who was ever saved,was ever saved by keeping the law. Ever, This counted for the Israelites as well. If you are addicted to sin the law condemns you. At that point there are only 2 thinks that can save us. Either the law is nullified so it doesn't condemn us anymore. Or by GRACE a Redeemer dies in your place, because the law is too precious to be nullified, or made obsolete. IF YOU WANT A REDEEMER, AND THE NULLIFICATION OF THE LAW AS WELL, YOU MAKE A CHEAP GRACE.
medusa210562 5 months ago
@medusa210562 You try to justify by keeping the law is cheap grace in your part. You said it yourself that no one can be saved by keeping the law. So what is wrong to live under grace and not the law? How can you be under grace and under the law at the same time? Unless you still dead in your sins and transgressions.
GodIsSovereignty 5 months ago
@GodIsSovereignty Do you really believe that when we are in heaven we will talk to each other and we will say I had this law, and which law did you have? And another person will say I was not under the law, but I was under grace. You are under Grace because you are not under THE CONDEMNATION of the law. Thanks to the grace of our lord. No one was ever saved by works. The true isrlaelite was free from condemnation. He or she knew that the lamb rapresented the Grace of the REAL LAMB.
medusa210562 5 months ago
@medusa210562 In heaven, the only law we have is love. The 10 Commandments are for law breakers.
GodIsSovereignty 5 months ago
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medusa210562 5 months ago
@GodIsSovereignty Read carefully my last comments, look at the use of the words in the past tense "I had" "did you have" "I was" I was talking about what we will say to each other about our time on earth. After that I expalin that .....You are under Grace because you are not under THE CONDEMNATION of the law. Thanks to the grace of our lord. No one was ever saved by works. The true isrlaelite was free from condemnation. He or she knew that the lamb presented the Grace of the REAL LAMB.
medusa210562 5 months ago
@GodIsSovereignty But the most important comment you and others like you must understand is what I answered you about the 613 commandments. Please read is 1000 times. Home work for you.
medusa210562 5 months ago
@medusa210562 So the law is not a burden, why don't you sacrifice animals today?
GodIsSovereignty 5 months ago
if one is condemned to die and he if freed by grace is only because the commandments that accused him still stands. Grace and the law only make sense when they are both valid at the same time. And no one was ever saved by observing the law. But by faith in Jesus, represented in the lamb killed on the alter.
medusa210562 5 months ago
to know history is to cease to be protestant-John Henry Newman(former protestant turned Catholic) Everything The Catholic Church teaches today, the early church fathers taught, whom were all Catholic obviously, The Fathers know best- great book on the early church and history.
MysticalCity 6 months ago
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... You are confusing the "DAY OF REST" (Saturday, the day following the Work Week that begins on Monday and ends on Friday) with THE SABBATH (Sunday) which Moses correctly labels as the week day which should be kept “Holy” (through fine dress, communal gatherings, celebrations, displays, and respectful worship of our Creators).
... Only a Devil Cult would try to confuse the two by claiming that rest was a way of “Keeping Holy” God’s Day.
… What is Sunday in your devil cult?
CivilizedMan444 6 months ago
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i like the term "Gods people" when speaking of the Jews. That helps people justify being under Law. SDA's are under the law.
UncleBadTouch100 8 months ago
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i like the term "God people" when speaking of the Jews. That helps people justify being under Law. SDA's are under the law.
UncleBadTouch100 8 months ago
traditionally we our sabbath is sunday. but we dont need to worry about this. For what is the seventh day is that our sabbath day. .for me the important things to be focus is that we have faith to our only one almighty GOD. .more power to alL!..GODBLESS US ALL. .:-)
93manzkie 8 months ago 2
@93manzkie traditionally is the problem...Jesus was very DOWN on traditions that contradicted God's law. a person can come up with the most religious reasons for keeping sunday, but if he is not keeping the 7th day Sabbath of the fourth commandment, he is breaking God's law. God did not give us multiple choice, He commanded the 7th day, not sunday.
rusda2 8 months ago
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93manzkie 8 months ago
Romans 13:8-10
Owe nothing to anyone except to love one another ; for he who loves his neighbor has fulfilled the law. For this, "YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, YOU SHALL NOT MURDER, YOU SHALL NOT STEAL, YOU SHALL NOT COVET," and if there is any other commandment, it is summed up in this saying, "YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF." Love does no wrong to a neighbor ; therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.
I hope SDA's don't believe the Sabbath is fulfillment of the law.
harvestsoulfly 8 months ago
@harvestsoulfly "I hope SDA's don't believe the Sabbath is fulfillment of the law"
I hope you dont thinking breaking God's law, any of it, is the fulfilling of the law either. the fact is that the reason love is the fulfilling of the law is because if you love God you'll keep the first 4 & if you love your neighbor you'll keep the last 6. anything else is only lip service. if you don't love Him, you wont keep His law.
rusda2 8 months ago 2
Why put so much emphasis on the Sabbath when SDA's don't follow all the sabbatical laws?
Just a few:
lighting candles 18 minutes before sunset
Not carrying anything out of a "domain".
No lighting fire's
Orthodox Jew's who truly follow the Sabbath claim "lighting a gas stove, adding wood to a fire, changing a thermostat so as to start a gas or oil furnace, etc. Using (turning on and off) electricity or anything electronic is included in this rule"
penalty for desecrating the Sabbath is death.
harvestsoulfly 8 months ago
@harvestsoulfly can you tell me where is the scripture it says we must light candles 18 minutes before sunset? I don't recall that. Not carrying anything out of a domain? you sound like the ones who told the paralytic man at the pool of Bethesda to stop carrying his bed when Jesus told him to do it. gas stoves? thermostat? electricity? I'd like to see that in scripture.
the penalty for breaking any of the ten commandments is death.
u need to quit quoting pharisees in order to bash SDA's.
rusda2 8 months ago 3
I believe it's saturday,but my wife takes care of ilderly people even on saturdays.Would God forgive her?They really depend on her
rob13740 9 months ago
@rob13740
Jesus taught it is right to do good on His Day. Matt 12:10-12, Mark 3:2-4, Luke 6:6-9, 13:14-16, John 9:14-16. Taking care of others is the very essence of His law of love. I know of many in the health care field who perform their jobs on the Sabbath but take no renumeration for that Day. God bless.
Nirky 8 months ago
@Nirky Those people don't want anyone else but my wife.It's hard to find trust worthy people coming into their homes.Thanks alot and God bless you too
rob13740 8 months ago
SDA believe they can receive salvation by worshiping on Sat, that's no different then the Jews putting their salvation in circumcision. Both believe they are Gods only chosen people because of their belief
To the rest of us... well, we're Gentiles, subject to condemnation because we don't worship on Sat & will receive the mark of the beast.
Nowhere in the Bible does it say you'll receive the mark because of this. It was only from EGW vision. So SDA must believe her visions are above the Bible.
harvestsoulfly 9 months ago
@harvestsoulfly There may be people in every denomination that put their faith in works for salvation, the SDA church does not however do this, the Bible states that we are saved by grace through faith. The Bible is clear on this, we are not saved by works. Our justification however will save us from the shackles of sin and thus by Christ and in Christ we obey our Lord, it is the only expression our faith can have. By careful study of Scripture you will find that the Sabbath is the mark of God.
Mekelsior 8 months ago
@Mekelsior I agree 100% with you, how we are saved through Christ.
harvestsoulfly 8 months ago
@Mekelsior Show me the bible passage that says the sabbath is the mark of God.
GodIsSovereignty 8 months ago
@harvestsoulfly ...and if the Sabbath is the mark of God, then what is the mark of the beast? The Beast, the papacy, declares that its Sunday is its mark of authority, and thus when the law of sunday worship are implemented and enforced the mark will be distributed. As for the gentiles, the Bible has no promise for the gentiles, when a gentile accept Christ they become a child of God, the seed of Abraham by faith. This is also a very clear doctrine in the Bible. =)
Mekelsior 8 months ago
1. @harvestsoulfly you don't seem to be very educated on what SDA's believe. we dont believe any such thing. salvation is by grace thru faith alone. you seem to believe however that grace is a license to sin.
SDA's in fact believe that there are MANY more true christians in other denominations who will hear God's call to come out of babylon (false church teachings).
rusda2 8 months ago 2
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@rusda2 I do believe that? So all Christians use grace as a license to sin, or just me? And you know me enough to judge me personally?
harvestsoulfly 8 months ago
2. @harvestsoulfly Rev 14:11 tells us the LOST who worship the beast & receive the mark, "have NO REST".
then immediately Rev 14:12 tells us that the SAINTS, those that are SAVED, KEEP the commandments of God & have the FAITH of Jesus.
the faith of Jesus (true Christianity) involves KEEPING God's commandments. which is contrasted with those who DO NOT keep His commandments & have no REST. Which commandment has to do with REST? yep, that pesky old 4th.
rusda2 8 months ago 2
3. @harvestsoulfly I don't why people like the bash SDA's so much but they do. they will lie about them, or say that the "must" believe this or that when they don't.
Ellen White herself said the bible was the FINAL authority and that is exactly what SDA's believe. Mrs. White's writings lead us to scripture, they do not eclipse scripture by any means, nor do they replace scripture.
rusda2 8 months ago 2
@rusda2 There's a reason Adventism won't fully enter into, or be excepted in the evangelical mainstream.
The real question is why? What makes Adventism so different then Christianity?
harvestsoulfly 8 months ago
what verses of the bible says that the first day of the week is sunday??
93manzkie 9 months ago
@93manzkie
"Now after the Sabbath, as the first day of the week began to dawn, Mary Magdalene and the other Mary came to see the tomb." Matt 28:1
Nirky 9 months ago
@93manzkie No one will answer your question because the Bible doesn't say it. As a matter of fact, prior to Moses, none of the Israelite's knew there even was a sabbath! The Bible doesn't mention the sabbath once prior to Moses. Only in Gen 2:2 the bible says "God rested on the 7th day".
I've asked several times & have yet to get one coherent answer.
Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath!
harvestsoulfly 9 months ago
@harvestsoulfly Jesus is the Lord of the Sabbath, He gave it, He made it, He ordained it, He made it Holy. By what "Thus sayeth the Lord" do we break His Law? Where in the gospels do we find Jesus asking us to break His commandments? It is written about the children of Set, they were the sons of God, about Enoch, about Noah that they were rightous men, about Abraham keeping the commandments and statutes of Christ. Why do you object against the law of Christ anyway brother? Is he not our King?
Mekelsior 8 months ago
@Mekelsior Christ worked on the Sabbath. He casted out demons and healed the sick. He defended his disciples from breaking the head grain and ate on the Sabbath. On and on, the Scripture tells us that on the Sabbath, Christ worked. So why? The Sabbaths God commanded the Israelites to observe teach them about a principle truth of the Sabbath, a spiritual rest. Being free from sickness and demon-possessed is entering into the Sabbath. Look to Christ for a spiritual rest, not physical rest.
GodIsSovereignty 8 months ago
@GodIsSovereignty yes He did work on the Sabbath...but He was never found in the carpenter shop doing His regular weekly job. Christ worked hard on many a sunday. sunday in the bible is just another work day...one of the 6. Jes nor God never blessed it, never sanctified it, never commanded it. nothing in the NT does away with the 4th commandment or changes it in any way. the change came about thru misguided men...thru tradition. Jesus never had a good word to say about traditions.
rusda2 8 months ago 2
@Mekelsior Nowhere in the Bible does it mention that anyone from Adam until Moses followed the Sabbath.
Romans 4:1-5
For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God.
For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.
Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
harvestsoulfly 8 months ago
@harvestsoulfly Yes it does. Jesus said Sabbath was made for man (not Jews). Adam was the first man. Sabbath was instituted/blessed/made holy at creation, 2300 years b4 Jews existed. EX 16 God asks "how long REFUSE ye to keep my commandments..." referring specifically to Sabbath. they had been "refusing" to keep a law they knew existed already since creation. God said "remember the Sabbath...". they could not remember something that never existed till then. the teaching is there.
rusda2 8 months ago
@harvestsoulfly
Genesis 26:5 because Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my requirements, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws." This Laws were not just subjective feelings of love that is why Noah new which animals were clean and which were unclean, and this is not even as important as the 10 commandments. And also Cain new that a expiatory sacrifice should have spelled blood. Romans 4:4 is just saying that works by themselves mean nothing, it's not saying that you can sin read Rom 4:7
medusa210562 5 months ago
@harvestsoulfly the bible doesnt mention the Sabbath prior to moses? LOL :)
at creation, 2300 years before jews existed, the Seventh day is pronounce HOLY. you think God made a HOLY day just for Himself? Jesus disagrees with you..."the Sabbath was made FOR MAN...". notice He did not say it was made for Jews. Adam was the first man...made on the 6th day...then the Sabbath was made FOR ADAM (MAN).
maybe the answers arent coherent b/c u really arent interested in the truth? might require change.
rusda2 8 months ago 2
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@rusda2 Rom 4 What then shall we say that Abraham, our forefather according to the flesh, has found? For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God. For what does the Scripture say? “ABRAHAM BELIEVED GOD, AND IT WAS CREDITED TO HIM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS.”
You read between the lines! No where in the OT prior to Moses is there any mention of man keeping the Sabbath.
harvestsoulfly 8 months ago
The sabbath was destroyed after creation, and God did not rest; He went back to work after Satan {sin} destroyed it. God finished his new work at the cross when Jesus called out, "It is finished!". Christ was exalted and seated at the right hand of God--He rested. And we can enter God's rest again if we go to him.
GodIsSovereignty 9 months ago
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@GodIsSovereignty (John 5:16-18) The Jewish leaders harassed Jesus for breaking the Sabbath law. Jesus said “My Father is always working & so am I. So the Jewish leaders tried all the harder to find a way to kill him. For he not only broke the Sabbath, he called God his Father, thereby making himself equal with God.
harvestsoulfly 9 months ago
@GodIsSovereignty Why did Israel keep the 7th day Sabbath? Why is it in the law if it was destroyed after creation? By what device can anyone destroy a period of time? How much power does the devil really have, can he truly destroy something that God have complete control over? Why is the focus on the Bible so strongly towards the Law of God and why does Jesus Christ ask us to keep His commandments as a sign of our love towards God?
Mekelsior 8 months ago
@Mekelsior which day you worship/rest on is to be regarded as a remembrance of what our Lord did for us. That's all, otherwise creeds & laws start to govern it. And we know SDA's do not follow all the sabbath creeds!
I'm not big into eschatology but pretty sure it can be debated whether or not the Catholic church, or Pope is the antichrist (if thats what you believe) or those who work on sat might be condemned.
No one could force me to work on sat. I'd quit my job, get a new one.
harvestsoulfly 8 months ago
@harvestsoulfly What Sabbath "creeds" would this be? No it cant be argued at all if one takes the bible for what it says. the bible is very clear that the antichrist will come from within the professing "christian" church.
rusda2 8 months ago 2
@Mekelsior Simple answer. Sin destroyed it. The law reveals sin in the nature of man and how it destroys the relationship between man and God. Jesus came to destroy sin and free us from it. When Christ took our sins upon himself on the cross, He shouted, "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" Do you see how sin destroy the relationship between God the Father and the Son at that moment? Look upon to Jesus; cloth Christ as our righteousness, not the law.
GodIsSovereignty 8 months ago
@GodIsSovereignty being clothed in the righteousness of Christ does not do away with any of the ten commandments. Christians should love the Lord enough to keep His commandments. anything else is just lip service.
rusda2 8 months ago
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@rusda2 Of course, we are clothed in the righteousness of Christ because we are sinners--law breakers. We remain in Christ to produce good fruit. Jesus said "This is My commandment, that you love one another, just as I have loved you." Love is the fulfillment of the law. So just keep loving people.
GodIsSovereignty 8 months ago
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@GodIsSovereignty "love" does not fulfill the law if a person is purposely breaking one of the ten. Jesus said if you love Me keep My commandments.
rusda2 8 months ago
@GodIsSovereignty Faith is claims God's blessings in obedience, presumption is claiming God's blessings in disobedience. Now both faith and presumption use God's love as their motivation, but faith trusts God's love. were as presumption tests God's love. Which one do you practice faith or presumption? Romans 3:31 Do we, then, nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather, we uphold the law.
medusa210562 5 months ago
@medusa210562 Many people have the idea that because we say we are not under the law but under grace, we freely sin. That is presumption. We came to grace by the guidance of the law. The law shows us that we are sinners and need Christ our Savior. The Sabbath is found in Christ. Jesus. Jesus said, "Come to Me, all who are weary and heavy-laden, and I will give you rest. Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and YOU WILL FIND REST FOR YOUR SOULS."
GodIsSovereignty 5 months ago
@GodIsSovereignty Look my brother you cannot talk of bananas and oranges as if they are the same thing, I need the spiritual rest that comes from knowing Jesus. I also drink of His water that quenches for ever, (that he was talking to the Samaritan woman about) But I still drink water. Romans 3:31 Do we then nulify the law by faith? not at all! Rather we uphold the law. If you know about the Sabbath and you do not observe it you sin. The sabbath is the Lord's day mentioned even in revelation
medusa210562 5 months ago
@medusa210562 Show me a bible passage that sabbath breakers are condemned throw into the lake of fire. My friend, do you know the purpose of the law?
GodIsSovereignty 5 months ago
@GodIsSovereignty The law is like a mirror that shows you your condition, the law does not save, In fact no one was ever saved like that. Now if you are a pagan the spirit of God still tells you, you must not kill etc. But if you are a christian you can see more "on the Sabbath they rested according to the commandment" (Luke 23:56) In acts they met on the sabbath near the river nothing to do with synagogue custom. Revelation 21:8 stands for every sin not 3, or 5 or 7, but all 10 commandaments
medusa210562 5 months ago
@medusa210562 You said, "The law is like a mirror that shows you your condition". If you understand this thought, why don't you understand that the sabbath shows you your condition? Keeping the sabbath is a reminding that you're a sinner and cannot enter God's Sabbath--rest for the people of God. According to the commandment, keeping the sabbath is to stay home. So on the sabbath they met near the river indicates what day of the week that event took place. You're still wrong.
GodIsSovereignty 5 months ago
@GodIsSovereignty 1 every commandament showes my condition. "you shall not kill" when I kill it shows my condition "observe My Sabbath" when you brake this commandment shows your condition. "you shall not lie" when you brake this it shows your condition. If I take one comandament away it will stop to show me that sin I could commit. I wouldn't be a sinner without the law, but I am a sinner. But thank God for his Grace, I am forgiven.
medusa210562 5 months ago
@medusa210562 Wrong interpretation. "You shall not kill" indicates that you are a killer. "You shall not lie" declares you are a liar. You don't have to kill a person to become a killer. God said you already are a killer and a liar. "Remember the Sabbath" declares that you were kicked out from it. "Keep it holy" shows you fail to keep it holy. So my friend, we were sabbath breakers--we got kick out from God's rest. So when you try to keep the sabbath, you work your way back in which is...
GodIsSovereignty 5 months ago
@GodIsSovereignty every comandament idicates one of my characteristics as a sinner you are right, who gives you the authority to make one rule for 9 and another for one. If you don't "keep it holy" you sin if you "kill" you sin.
If you take one commandment away you brake all 10. As I said you are making a non biblical doctrine of this REST.
medusa210562 5 months ago
@medusa210562 Who is taking away any commandment? The 10 Commandments are obsoleted.
GodIsSovereignty 5 months ago
@GodIsSovereignty Let's start our conversation from the beginning if you are willing? And answer me this question? Do you think the Israelites were saved by obbeying the law?
medusa210562 5 months ago
@medusa210562 If obeying the law can save the Israelites, Christ would never have come. The fact that He came to save His people from their sins shows that all fall short, including you and I. Sinners are law breakers and we are sinners by nature. Keeping law perfectly has not merit; it does not change who you are.
GodIsSovereignty 5 months ago
@GodIsSovereignty Isn't is amazing that when Jesus was accused of braking the Sabbath he even used the old testament to defend Himself. In other words He was not changing anything He was explaining the true nature of the Sabbath. Please have a look at the youtube video "Jesus is my sabbath rest" by eraunaographe.
medusa210562 5 months ago
@medusa210562 Who said anything about changing the Law? Jesus declared the Law obsolete.
GodIsSovereignty 5 months ago
@GodIsSovereignty Jesus explained and demonstrated what was always true. In fact from the moment Adam and Eve fell. Look at this passage about divorce. Matthew 19:8 He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but FROM THE BEGINNING it was not so.
medusa210562 5 months ago
@medusa210562 So there you have it. In the beginning, there was no adultery. There was no law given.
GodIsSovereignty 5 months ago
@GodIsSovereignty Finally you are starting to get something, In the beginning. "this is after sin because that is what you and I have been talking about all along". There was not law that said you can divorce, I just Said "YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT ADULTERY" The 10 commandments are a reflection of the character of God. Read Matthew 19 in its context. Or I forget you have been reading the word rest out of context all along as well.
medusa210562 5 months ago
@medusa210562 I thought you understand the purpose of the 10 Commandments. If the 10 Commandments are a reflection of God's character, are you saying God has a wife and God never commit adultery? The 10 Commandments is God's verdict that we are murders, idolaters, thiefs, coveters....We do not become a murder by killing someone; we are already a murder by birth--it's in our nature. Don't you understand this simple truth? Therefore, we cannot keep the 10 Commandments to merit righteousness.
GodIsSovereignty 5 months ago
@GodIsSovereignty The law is a reflection of God's character. Love is in the 10 commandments. All 10 amplified by the example of Jesus. If the law said "you must Kill" that would probably represent the character of Lucifer. Because that would be his law. Not God's law. The 10 commandments had to be kept perfectly. But because we didn't and don't. Jesus paid the price. HOW CAN YOU THEN PREACH SUCH CHEAP GRACE.
medusa210562 5 months ago
@medusa210562 You said "The 10 commandments had to be kept perfectly". Have you kept it perfectly? My friend, when you said the law is a reflection of God's character, you imply God is a sinner. The Scripture says the law reveals us our sins--the reflection of our character. The law is like a mirror; it shows our ugly faces. Did I preach cheap grace? On the contrary, you are. You think God's grace is cheap; it's not enough for you and you must try add merit by trying to keep the law perfectly.
GodIsSovereignty 5 months ago
@GodIsSovereignty THE LAW IS A REFLECTION OF GOD'S CHARACTER. IT REFLECTS HIS WILL FOR US. YESTERDAY, TODAY, AND TOMORROW. WE ARE NOT SAVED BY IT,Romas 3;31 Do we, then, nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather, we uphold the law. If you take away the law you make grace cheap. Jesus kept it perfectly, that how He fulfilled it. and Jesus was the expiatory lamb. that's how he furlfilled it
medusa210562 5 months ago
@medusa210562 You said, "Isn't is amazing that when Jesus was accused of braking the Sabbath he even used the old testament to defend Himself" So why did Jesus defend Himself? This is what I think. "Well if you can break it, why can't I?" So Jesus worked on the Sabbath. Should this be a sign that Jesus already told them the Sabbath must be a day of working? Jesus did the work the Father sent Him to do: to heal the sick, release the oppressed; He did this on the Sabbath; He set the captive free
GodIsSovereignty 5 months ago
@GodIsSovereignty Jesus used the Old Testament. So what He did on the Sabbath and what He didn't do was in accordance with the Old testament, not against it. Even before Jesus-it was not wrong to give water to the animals.(which Jesus uses as an example) was never wrong to heal the sik. HOW CAN YOU IMPLY THAT GOD MADE A BURDENSOME Commandment, then fixed it.The sabbath rest is a day of loving your God yourself and your neabour. You don't just observe it like a legalistic pharisee.
medusa210562 5 months ago
@medusa210562 According to the Torah, there are 613 commandments. But you reduce it to 10. Why not trying to keep 613?
GodIsSovereignty 5 months ago
@medusa210562 To keep the Sabbath holy is to be free from sin, spiritual oppression, from sickness, from demon possession. The physical sabbath is a shadow of the real spiritual Sabbath--God's rest.
GodIsSovereignty 5 months ago
@medusa210562 is not possible. You try avoid being a killer or a liar by keeping the commandments, but you were already declared killer and liar...sabbath breaker. So my friend, that is the purpose of the Law.
GodIsSovereignty 5 months ago
@medusa210562 Can you also explain what drinking water is? Are you saying keeping the law is drinking water?
GodIsSovereignty 5 months ago
@GodIsSovereignty Revelation 22;17 Jesus gives the water of life. John 18:12 Jesus is the light of the world.
Jesus is the way, He is the alpha and the omega. He is our rest. You can't take any of these and exchange them for commandments or make doctrines from your imagination, For example Jesus is the light of the world, but we still have the sun is the sky, we still drink water, we still sleep at night. And so Jesus is the lord of the Sabbath not the Sabbath. He is life but I still eat!!!!
medusa210562 5 months ago
@medusa210562 You said, "Jesus is the way,...He is our rest. You can't take any of these and exchanged them for commandments or make doctrines..." So why observe the Sabbath (Saturday), instead of go to him? "He is life but I still eat" So if you don't eat, you die. So food is better than Christ? You're very confuse. You need to know the difference between physical life and spiritual life.
GodIsSovereignty 5 months ago
@GodIsSovereignty The sabbath is not to stay home, the sabbath is to stay with God, You can stay with God all the time. But the sabbath is a special blessed time. Doesn't is say there in acts "THE SABBATH" The bible doesn't lie to us. it didn't say the 7th day or 1rst day or 3rd day it says "the Sabbath" as I said before. The Lord's day in revelation 1:10 is the sabbath for Jesus said "I am the Lord of the Sabbath". You are making you own doctrine from the word rest, You really are.
medusa210562 5 months ago
@Popinion7
In your scenario that would be 4 days and 3 nights, let's count it out:
Thursday morn-1st day
Thursday eve-1st night
Fri morn -2nd day
Fri eve-2nd night
Sabbath morn-3rd day
Sabbath eve-3rd night
Sun morn-4th day
Jesus says His sign, the sign of Jonah, is "3 days and 3 nights" (Matt 12:40). Thursday morning doesn't fit scripture and it doesn't fit Jesus' only sign of 3 days and 3 nights.
Nirky 11 months ago
@Popinion7
"It means less hours from evening"--I have no idea what you are trying to say, can you please explain?
I count from Thursday evening to Sunday morning it was just as Jesus said--3 days and 3 nights--just as Jonah was, Jesus' sign that He would be in the heart of the earth, the clutches of the world, for 3 days and 3 nights.
Nirky 11 months ago
@Popinion7
Thurs eve
Fri eve
Sat eve
3 evenings
Fri morn
Sat morn
Sun morn resurrection
3 days & nights
Nirky 11 months ago
Rom 10 :4
albusai 11 months ago
@Popinion7
Jonah was trapped in the belly of the great fish, and therefore Jonah was being controlled by the great fish, for 3 days and 3 nights. Likewise, Jesus willingly gave Himself over to the control of the world and began suffering for the world's sins on that Thursday.
Nirky 11 months ago
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@Popinion
In Matt 12:40 Jesus gives the scribes & pharisees His only sign when He compares Jonah's three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish with His being "in the heart of the earth" three days and three nights.
The problem here is that many assume "heart of the earth" means the grave. But nowhere does scripture call it the grave, it is simply a false assumption. If you don't think so, can you show a scripture which defines "heart of the earth" as the grave?
Nirky 11 months ago
@Popinion7
Again, the 3 days and 3 nights Jesus was in the "heart of the earth" or "clutches of the world" began that Thursday evening, when the Father began placing the world's sins upon Him, and Jesus said He was suffering greatly, even nearing death (Matt 26:38, Mark 14:34). That same Thursday night He was placed under arrest and taken prisoner, where He had several mockeries of trials before being condemned, beaten and finally crucified on Friday.
Nirky 11 months ago
@Popinion7
From the Garden of Gethsemane on that Thursday, Jesus was in the heart of the earth, translated another way He was in "the clutches of the world". He was so distressed at the weight of our sins that He prayed that the Father might pass the cup of suffering from Him, yet not His will be done, but the Father's. He could have left any time, but He loved us so much He took upon Himself the grief of our sins for those 3 days and 3 nights, until He breathed His last and gave up His spirit.
Nirky 11 months ago
@Popinion7
Jesus was in a similar yet massively more serious situation. It was on that Thursday in the Garden of Gethsemane that the Father began to place the sins of the world on Him. He became sorrowful, then distressed, then later in agony, and being in fervent prayer, He actually began to sweat drops of blood. He wanted to do the will of the Father and save us, yet He had never sinned, and never knew what is was like, but now He was feeling the sins of the whole world upon Him.
Nirky 11 months ago
@Popinion7
Jonah was in a situation not of his choosing, he was powerless and subject to the will of the big fish, and God. He was trapped, and it couldn't have been a pleasant situation, he probably felt as if he were dying. Feeling alone and probably barley able to breath, in hostile surroundings with no apparent way out. With his suffering, Jonah must have prayed his most fervent prayers ever in the belly of that fish.
Nirky 11 months ago
@Popinion7
So what does "heart of the earth" mean if it isn't the grave?
Think about the story of Jonah, Jesus says that is the sign. God called Jonah to warn the city of Nineveh of it's impending destruction if the people there didn't repent of their sins. But Jonah refused to go, and tried to run away. God needed Jonah to preach to those lost people, so He caused a storm and long story short, Jonah was thrown overboard his getaway ship and was swallowed by a big fish.
Nirky 11 months ago
@Popinion7
3 days? Do you mean Jesus' sign of Jonah?:
"For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth." Matt 12:40
Jesus compares Jonah's three days and three nights in the belly of the big fish with His being "in the heart of the earth" three days and nights. The problem here is that many assume "heart of the earth" means the grave. But nowhere does scripture call it the grave.
Nirky 11 months ago
@Popinion7
Our Lord rested in the grave on His Sabbath according to the 4th commandment. When those women came back to finish the job of preparing His body early Sunday morning, He had already risen. Mark tells us He rose early Sunday morning. Mark 16:9
Nirky 11 months ago
@Popinion7
Again, John chapter 19 tells us that the Jewish leaders hastened to take down His body from the Cross so it wouldn't be there for the 4th commandment Sabbath.
"And the women who had come with Him from Galilee followed after, and they observed the tomb and how His body was laid. Then they returned and prepared spices and fragrant oils. And they rested on the Sabbath according to the commandment." Luke 23:55-56
Nirky 11 months ago
@Popinion7
"And about the ninth hour Jesus cried out with a loud voice, saying, “Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?” that is, “My God, My God, why have You forsaken Me?” Matt 27:46
The "ninth hour" is 6PM. It was about the ninth hour and the sun was setting on that spring day, and it was nearing twilight. Jesus was sacrificed at the very same time the ceremonial sacrificial lamb was to be slain-twilight between Friday sunset and Sabbath. Lev 23:5
Nirky 11 months ago
@Popinion7
Our Lord was nailed to His Cross on the preparation day-Friday. Note also that the weekly Sabbath was a "high day", meaning a ceremonial sabbath fell also on the weekly Sabbath. This ceremonial sabbath was of course Passover. The shadowy ceremonial law met its substance that day, because all the ceremonial Passovers pointed to this one single event in the spring of 31AD-Jesus sacrificing Himself on the Cross, as our Passover!
Nirky 11 months ago
@Popinion7
Hi Popinion7, let's let scripture answer your question.
"Therefore, because it was the Preparation Day, that the bodies should not remain on the cross on the Sabbath (for that Sabbath was a high day), the Jews asked Pilate that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken away." John 19:31
Nirky 11 months ago
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Matthew 24 Jesus is speaking "himself" about the End of all ages or End times... Matthew 24:20 reads: "And pray your flight is not in the winter or on the SABBATH." This is biblical FACT that Jesus Himself is prophesying about the END TIMES which includes today 2/12/11 and beyond... Which makes the Sabbath still in effect...
CastingStonez 1 year ago
"Question: Which is the Sabbath day?
Answer: Saturday is the Sabbath day.
Question: Why do we observe Sunday instead of Saturday?
Answer. We observe Sunday instead of Saturday because the Catholic Church in the Council of Laodicea, transferred the solemnity from Saturday to Sunday."
Peter Geiermann, C.S.S.R., The Converts Catechism of Catholic Doctrine Third Edition"
Nirky 1 year ago 17
@Nirky Justin Martyr's writings 150 years after the death of Christ, said “On the day called Sunday, all who live in cities or in the country gather together to one place and the memoirs of the apostles or the writings of the prophets are read as long at time permit but Sunday is the day on which we all hold our common assembly because it is the first day on which God having wrought a change in the darkness and matter made the world and Jesus Christ our Savior on the same day rose from the dead.
harvestsoulfly 8 months ago
@harvestsoulfly why is it you guys always quote the "church fathers" but not the bible? could it be because there is no bible support for sunday? yep.
the priciple you are missing is this...it does not matter...listen carefully...it does not matter what the church "fathers" said or did or told you to do if it contradicts a clear command of God, it's a tradition of men. Jesus never had a good word to say about traditions...he said if u will enter life, keep God's commandments.
rusda2 8 months ago 2
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@Nirky Sunday is the sabbath now and the Lord's day. It USE TO BE saturday, (old testament) but when Jesus rose from the dead on Sunday, IT BECAME SUNDAY.
Matt. 28:1; Mark 16:2,9; John 20:1,19- the Gospel writers purposely reveal Jesus' resurrection and appearances were on Sunday. This is because Sunday had now become the most important day in the life of the Church.
MysticalCity 6 months ago
@Nirky Acts 20:7 - this text shows the apostolic tradition of gathering together to celebrate the Eucharist on Sunday, the "first day of the week." Luke documents the principle worship was on Sunday because this was one of the departures from the Jewish form of worship.
Rev 1:10 - John specifically points out that he witnesses the heavenly Eucharistic liturgy on Sunday, the Lord's day, the new day of rest in Christ.
MysticalCity 6 months ago
The Catholic Cardinal Gibbons, in Faith of Our Fathers, pg. 111, said,
"You may read the Bible from Genesis to Revelation, and you will not find a single line authorizing the sanctification of Sunday. The Scriptures enforce the religious observance of Saturday, a day which we (The Roman Catholic Church) never sanctify."
Nirky 1 year ago 17
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mark0454 1 year ago
Sorry tramoliter but I can't find the comment that you responded to. In any case I am in complete agreement with you on the fact that the Law of Moses cannot be annulled.
People who teach against the law and the prophets are in great danger of hell.
lillibeth13 1 year ago 2
@Myhopeisinhim
I see you are unwilling to discuss certain scripture which contradicts your held beliefs. I thought perhaps another dialog about entering His rest might edify, to get you to look at and answer specific points Bible writers make on an important subject such as this, but I realize now I cannot force, asking you to answer questions which, at the present time, you do not wish to look at. I'm always on YT if you should change your mind. May the grace of our LORD Jesus be with you.
Nirky 1 year ago 33
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Myhopeisinhim 1 year ago
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@Nirky
You asked me:
6 minutes ago
@Nirky
You asked: What reason in Hebrews 3&4 does Paul tell us they failed to enter His rest?
I answered your question in my long post, and more specifically in the final post I made. Did you manage to read it?
Myhopeisinhim 1 year ago
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Oops sorry for the mess up in the post there, copy and pasted from a previous message.
May God bless you on your journey:)
Patricia
Myhopeisinhim 1 year ago
Paul tells us in Hebrews ch 3&4 what entering into His rest is--who enters, why they enter, how they enter. If we want to understand His rest, exactly what it means to enter into His rest, Hebrews ch 3&4 is the place for answers.
You pledged not to avoid anymore-I'll trust you. Paul tells us His people Israel should have entered into His rest, they were intended to enter His rest, but failed. What reason in Hebrews 3&4 does Paul tell us they failed to enter His rest?
Nirky 1 year ago 12
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@Nirky Amen, my friend! Have a Happy Sabbath & God bless you!
Poplock009 1 year ago 7
"For He has spoken in a certain place of the seventh day in this way: “And God rested on the seventh day from all His works”; and again in this place: “They shall not enter My rest.” Heb 4:4-5
Whether we willfully disobey the 4th, or the 8th commandments, we CANNOT enter into His spiritual rest, the Bible is clear.
Nirky 1 year ago 9
Paul in Hebrews ch 3&4 tells us we ONLY enter into His spiritual rest when we obey Him by keeping His commandments. Israel was meant to enter into His rest, but they lacked faith and thus did not obey Him. They knew what the right thing was to do, but they did not follow God. We are told SPECIFICALLY not to repeat their example of disobedience!
Nirky 1 year ago 5
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@Nirky
Bible says you'll rest as God rested. Did God start his creative work back up on the eighth day, like you start your work back up? Or has he been in rest from that work since he completed it that very first seventh day?
Myhopeisinhim 1 year ago
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And most importantly why did God rest? Did he rest because it was the seventh day? or because his work was complete?
Myhopeisinhim 1 year ago
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lilylilylane 1 year ago 2
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@lilylilylane
Hey there:) It's great to hear from you. I hope you are doing well. It's been ages since I've spoken with prayer, not since the beginning of december if I remember, around the time she went on her sabbatical. Actually, I haven't seen any of you guys online until recent days. Has everything been going okay?
God bless
God bless
Myhopeisinhim 1 year ago
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lilylilylane 1 year ago 5
@Myhopeisinhim
You have avoided addressing the scripture given. If we are to edify, to build on what God tells us, we must address, not avoid scripture. Can we agree on this?
Point I have brought up: Our LORD's people Israel should have entered into His rest, they were intended to enter His rest, but failed. What reason in Hebrews 3&4 does Paul tell us they failed to enter His rest?
Nirky 1 year ago 9
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@Nirky
We must discuss scripture and not avoid it yes:)
However, the reason I never responded directly to your post yet is because you never addressed these points in my previous comments in regards to what I mentioned about God's rest which is a biblical explanation of his rest.
When we understand his rest, we can start to understand the passages of Hebrews 3&4. We need to understand God's rest.
Myhopeisinhim 1 year ago
@Myhopeisinhim God rested on the seventh day, and set it aside for a Holy purpose. Jesus kept each Sabbath also, it was also His custom to go in the synagogue on the Sabbath and no one can change that :). I'm sorry that that simple truth was missed but like i said i wont get in too deep, you know the truth. I pray you keep on abiding in Jesus' love and have a Happy Sabbath! :). God bless!
Poplock009 1 year ago 9
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@Poplock009
Yes, I am aware of what you think the truth is, and I happen to believe something different than you.
I will ask you and nirky these questions again and I pray that you won't side step them.
Why did God rest?
Did he rest because it was the seventh day, or because his work was finished? A
And did he pick that same work back up on the eighth day or has his work been finished since the creation of the world?
You might be surprised at how this relates to Hebrews, nirky.
Myhopeisinhim 1 year ago
@Myhopeisinhim
Patricia-you pledged just yesterday you would stop avoiding scripture and answer questions. You have one before you concerning the extensive information Paul gives in Heb 3&4 about entering into His rest. I've asked it twice now, and am losing hope in your promise. Please answer.
Paul tells us His people Israel should have entered into His rest, they were intended to enter His rest, but failed. What reason in Hebrews 3&4 does Paul tell us they failed to enter His rest?
Nirky 1 year ago 13
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@Nirky
God tells us in hebrews:
Hbr 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God [did] from his.
My questions pertain to hebrews, and more specifically this verse. I promise you I'm not avoiding it. Why are you avoiding the questions I've given? And why are you refusing to address those particular points I've made?
Here are the questions again
Why did God rest? Did he rest because it was the seventh day? or because his work was complete? more
Myhopeisinhim 1 year ago
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Myhopeisinhim 1 year ago
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You may have to click on the "see all" to see my other comment, it tends to disappear from the main screen.
Please know that I am not avoiding hebrews, but these questions must be considered before the topic can continue. I've been asking them over and over again, and no one seems to want to answer them.
Myhopeisinhim 1 year ago
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13 seconds ago
And did he start that work back up again on the eighth day, as you do, or has his work been complete since the creation of the world?
I promise you, that all this does pertain to the rest of God, and to Hebrews. I just pray that you will be willing to look into these questions and find the answers.
They will help one understand God's rest.
Myhopeisinhim 1 year ago
@Myhopeisinhim
I've answered your questions for over a year now. All of them. Backed up by scripture. So far you have not reciprocated. You pledged you would stop avoiding scripture and start answering questions, but I've asked you the same question twice now, no answer. If you don't know, then say you don't know. If you do know, then please answer.
Nirky 1 year ago 12
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@Nirky
If you have I've never seen the answer to these particular questions. You've answered other questions yes. But not these ones that I have seen. Humor me.....and then we'll continue
Myhopeisinhim 1 year ago
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Actually here, let me answer them....
Why did God rest? was it because it was the seventh day, or because his work was complete
Answer: He rested, ceased from his creative work, because it was finished. There wasn't anything more to be done. The term rest used meant ceased, stopped the work he was doing because he had finished, completed the work.
Question 2: Did he pick this work back up on the eighth day?
No, he was still in rest from this work even after the seventh day ended
more....
Myhopeisinhim 1 year ago
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And even today July 16, 2010, he is still in rest from that creative work. He didn't just rest on the seventh day from his creative work, he hasn't started that work again.
The only work God stopped was his creation of this world on the seventh day, and it's been done since that day. All his other work he was doing still continued, his governing of the universe, his watching over us, all that never stops. His rest started on that day, but it never ended......
Myhopeisinhim 1 year ago
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Hebrews tells us that we will rest as God rested from his works, and it speaks of another certain day, that he limiteth again another day, calling that day TODAY, that if you will just believe, you will enter his rest.
What happens on the day you believe? If you don't harden your heart against Jesus, what does he do for you? He makes you whole, makes you complete.
And just like God rested when his work was complete, you too are entered into rest when you are made complete.....
Myhopeisinhim 1 year ago
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His resting was not because it was a specific day, and our rest has nothing to do with a specific frame of time either, it has to do with a WORK being COMPLETED.
Genesis 2 tells us that he rested because his works were done, complete. The creation of the world was over. That was the work he ceased from, all his other work was still ongoing, which is why Jesus says that his father is always working.
The rest hebrews talks about is the rest people enter into when they believe....
Myhopeisinhim 1 year ago
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And it is the moment you believe that Christ makes you complete in him, and just like his work has been done since that first seventh day, your work is complete that very moment that you are made complete. It doesn't end after the sun goes down on the seventh day.
I'm honestly not avoiding anything, it is all connected. And I was going to get to your question, once you posted the answers to mine here, but ah well. I pray you will take the time to consider what was said here.
Myhopeisinhim 1 year ago
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In case you didn't see the answer to your question in there in the reversal mode, Hebrews speaks of people not entering into his rest due to unbelief. The problem with not believing is because if you don't believe in Jesus how can he make you complete in him?
And if you are not complete, and made perfect by him, then you have no rest because you are still trying to attain something that you cannot reach without Jesus.
Myhopeisinhim 1 year ago