Beethoven Diabelli Variations - Artur Schnabel - 1° Part (1)

[AllTriadHexachord]

I seems that most of you are unclear of where Beethoven got his ideas for many of the variations from the theme. It is true that Beethoven hated the theme but he used it because Diabelli wanted the 50 best composers of the day to write a variation on his theme so he could publish them as a fundraiser for flood victoms. Beethoven worked fractally to create the variations. Each variation was based on a small part of the theme. Ex: Var. 1 is based off of the repeated C chord in measures 2-5.

[marcxopoco]

Schnabel large groups of measures at a time. He used something called 'phrasing.' So, disappointingly for youtube musical authority jonturner2003, Schnabel did not play in a mindless metronomic style.

[japanesesweet]

the theme itself isn't quite as impoverished as some people suggest- Melodically it's not a sensation, but the off accents are surprising and charcateristic of what Beethoven would've done.

[Dumplingmaster]

why did beethoven chose this theme to build his palace on?previously it had been a mere 'cobblers patch' to him.I would also love to understand the significance of the waltzes transformation into a beautiful',otherworldly minuet at the end,ta for any thoughts.thanks for the inspiring uploadlol

[jmhelfri]

I think by "cobbler's patch" B. meant he could do a variety of things with it, use it and turn it in many different ways.

[thereisonlyonething]

Beethoven hated the theme. Cobbler's patch was definitely meant in a derogatory manner. If you'll notice the beginning variations are very whimsical, satirical, mocking. Essentially he showcases how trite the theme is, then says "Watch this." and proceeds to extract from it some of the most phenomenal variations ever written. He wrote it a display of his prowess.

[RollaArtis]

I think Beethoven felt very much put out by Diabelli's theme - for the simple reason that Beethoven himself had previously composed it. A practically identical theme is to be found in one of his piano trios, so one can imagine that Beethoven would want to demonstrate in no uncertain fashion to his contemporaries that he and no one else 'owned' the tune.

[Timrath]

@RollaArtis Very interesting. From which trio is it?

[RollaArtis]

@Timrath It's the opening phrase in the Scherzo from Beethoven's earliest piano trio (Without Opus No. 38), presumably unpublished. It is not Diabelli's theme in its entirety but one can hear some close similarities with at least the first half of it.

[Timrath]

@RollaArtis Thank you! Is this the one you mean?

/watch?v=MB1mn5BDspQ

[RollaArtis]

@Timrath No, not this one. I don't think it's to be found on YT. It's the trio E flat major, WoO 38. It's to be found on the EMI disc which I have with Ashkenazy Perlman and Harrell.

[suiram85]

re. the comment made by Anisometropie below, erased by 7 reds of censor. RicePresident, the Diabelli and Goldberg can be compared, both late works of two giants of music, both variations on a theme, both on a huge scale in duration and harmonic exploration. A difference is that Bach composed his own theme, a quiet contemplative one, and Beethoven used a humourous quirky ditty by Diabelli. As to their relative value, whatever moves you more. Beethoven may well have agreed with Anisometropie!

[Endeavour88]

lentina...

[anisometropie]

De mon commentaire sans réelle recherche et plus provocateur qu'autre chose, tu commets dans ton 3) exactement la même erreur de jugement qui t'as choquée envers les goldberg que moi.

Je n'ai même pas écouté les diabelli en entier. Tout ce que je savais en ecrivant ce commentaire c'est que beethoven s'est inspiré des goldberg. du modèle de rigueur et de perfection qu'est la musique de Bach pour composer ses diabelli. je peux juste te conseiller exactement la reciproque concernant les goldberg.

[galaxyrainguy]

It's interesting to compare Artur Schnabel's playing from the period after he met Vladamir Horowitz to the period before he met Horowitz, this piece was recorded after, and there is a poetry that his earlier playing didn't possess, as well as an expressiveness that is more friendly and congenial without losing any flair, well performed.

[marcxopoco]

LOL I just learned on youtube that Artur Schnabel became more musical after he "met" Horowitz.

Keep the horsesh*t coming, galaxrainguy.

[anisometropie]

one, just one of the Goldberg variations, is ten times worth all the Diabelli variations together.

[paranapoleon]

ye well goldberg is for me the best but dont say it is ''ten times worth all the Diabelli variations together'' as there are many people who just like diabelli much more.

or at least add an ''imo''

[RicePresident]

Not to mention that those two pieces really don't warrant comparison.  Apples and oranges.

[semisavage]

Schnabel had far too much influence on the treatment of Beethoven's works in general. I believe he did much more damage through his score versions than performances and recordings like this. He took all kinds of liberties in the scores and these were passed to future generations of performers who took his notation and markings as gospel truth, leading to the 'conventional interpretation'. Schnabel was a fine performer in his own right, but he shouldn't have polluted the scores as he did.

[pianopill88]

Either is your heart beat

[irminek]

I love Diabelli Variations :) It' my favorite music :)I am 14 yers old :P