@lankinator24 Part of why some people like jokes is being able to relate to them. Since some countries, like the UK & the US, where comedians have a great deal of attention, have strong Christian populations, so Christianity is something the citizens have heard about a lot. It's the easiest idea for the audience to grasp.
@lankinator24 Because it's the easiest to attack. Not saying it's any dumber than any other religion, but it hits a nerve, especially with uneducated rednecks.
@oBARFLYo Really? I have heard stories opposite of that. Lee Srobel, I'm sure you've heard of him, was an atheist or agnostic (slips my mind at the moment) but he did research in hstory and the scriptures and completely turned his life around and began to follow Christ.
@CrossAlliance Keep living in the Bronze Age mate and the rest of us will leave you behind. I don't think it's a coincidence that he bulk of the creationists live in the southern states of America. They were also reluctant to give up slavery and racism so I guess the IQ is slightly lower down there.
@oBARFLYo Logical statements can easily be misinterpreted by stupid people as vague ramblings. It's easier than admitting that you couldn't follow a simple chain of reasoning. And this ends my participation in this discussion.
To believe in God requires the suspension of logic. I say this as a believer myself. If God exists, every piece of logic on Earth is nullified because God himself would dictate logic from day to day, and since God has a personality that means logic will change based on his moods. Therefore, any logical argument against God is nullified by faith.
@clockworkengine You should have just left that comment after the first sentence. It would be more accurate to say that faith is nullified by logic. Sounds like you're grasping at straws.
Creationism and atheism are equally ignorant positions. The only logical position to assume is that of agnosticism, if you think otherwise, you are a moron.
hey you all it doesn matter anything taht you all have said REMEMBER IT IS JUST A RIDE so dont be such stupid and tink enjoy the moment think, read and relax and explore.
@themediocrenontheist Oh now I see what you meant. Notice in the first verse it says, 'everyone shall be puut to death for his own sin.' First of all, that's not even talking about Hell and it's not talking about GOD'S punishment for people. It's talking about man's punishment for man. Also whether you like original sin or not, it is evident in our world. You don't teach your children to steal from the cookie jar, they just do! You must teach your children to be good or they'll be rotten!
@CrossAlliance If I lead a good life but my only crime is incredulity at believing one of the 2700 or so religions will I spend an eternity in hell? Seems a bit harsh when you consider how equally convinced the followers of those other religions are that theirs is the only God. Also if a child is born and raised a Hindu in India and subsequently dies at an early age, will it go to hell? Seems harsh.
@oBARFLYo "If I lead a good life but my only crime is incredulity at believing one of the 2700 or so religions..." Well my first question is what's your standard of "good." What do you mean you lead a "good" life? By whose standards is your life good? Certainly not God's divine standards. God is not harsh at all! He made hell for Satan and we soon followed him rather than God. Even after we rebelled against Him, He still sent a savior to redeem us! That's not harsh at all, that's love.
@CrossAlliance Ok. Lets say I lead a divine standard of living right up till I die. Would I still spend an eternity in hell for the crime of incredulity? Try not and play around with the "who's to say what a divine standard of living is" but rather, try and focus on what I'm actually asking you.
@oBARFLYo Part One) Well the "divine standard" that you are referring to is being perfect and sinless. A sin is any deliberate action, attitude, or thought that goes against God, so if you are skeptical of God then you are committing a sin and thus you do not live up to that "divine standard" that you are talking about. Furthermore, your question is irrelevant because no one on this planet now or ever before has lived such a life, with the exception of Jesus.
@CrossAlliance But God has never spoken to me. All I have to go by are the unconvincing words of preachers and a heavily flawed set of books by authors unknown. Earth 7000 years old? Noah's Ark? Dinosaurs and the extensive fossil record? Pope causing the death of tens of thousands in Africa due to AID's? Ritual child abuse by priests? And the heavily plagiarised account of the life of Christ? I could believe in God if it wasn't for my strong sense of perspective.
@CrossAlliance Yeah, when I was young and I watched my 10 year old brother slowly die of cancer. He had a tumour in his knee which eventually led to the loss of a leg and ultimately to his death after 17 months of agony. I believed back then, and prayed and prayed. It didn't work of course and any words the local minister had are as false and ridiculous now as they were then. Maybe I prayed to the wrong god.
@oBARFLYo "Seems a bit harsh when you consider how equally convinced the followers of those other religions are that theirs is the only God" Voddie Baucham is a very inspirational preacher to me because his mother was Buddhist. He was raised in a Buddhist home but is now a very firm believer in Christ. There are plenty of testimonies like his, just because you were born into another religion doesn't mean that you are immune to God's standards of righteousness!
@CrossAlliance I asked you about people in India who have been born and raised Hindu, not someone living in a large Christian 1st world country who converted to Christianity. I'm sure you can tell the difference. What about the tribes in Peru that have no access to the word of God? Are they all going to hell? Try and imagine there's a world outside of America. It might help with your sense of perspective.
@oBARFLYo "It might help with your sense of perspective." Oh you don't need to tell me about perspective. I've gone on several mission trips and Lord willing, may be a full time missionary in another country in the future. What do you think Matthew 28:19 means when it says, 'Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,'?...
@CrossAlliance I hope when you're on a missionary trip you're spreading the word of contraception and telling everyone that the Pope is wrong and that's why they're all dying of AID's.
@CrossAlliance Looks like someone is being deliberately ignorant. The Pope and the catholic church has been telling the masses for a long time that the use of condoms are a sin. Something along the lines of "AIDs is bad but condoms are much worse". As a result thousands of people have and are dying in the third world. How disgusting.
@oBARFLYo Ok well as a Protestant I don't keep up on everything the Pope does, so now I was certainly not being deliberately ignorant. And I disagree with many of the things that the Catholics do but don't blame the church for AIDs. If you want to see less cases of AIDs, have sex the way God intended it to be had, between two people.
@CrossAlliance I was also born a Protestant but I do like to keep abreast of current affairs. I didn't blame the Catholic church for AID's but rather for helping to cause the spread of it through fear. But you're probably right. Those third world savages should stop worrying about starvation and concentrate on monogamy.
@oBARFLYo I am sorry to hear about your brother but you can rest assured that he is waiting for you, just as several of my grandparents are for me. Death is never easy and we would be inhuman to never wonder why God would take the ones we love but the fact is that this world is far from perfect. You and I are what's wrong with this world as well as everyone else, that's really as kind as it can be put. But there is an alternative to the selfish and unrighteous path of this world.
@CrossAlliance Sounds to me you're weighed down with a lot of guilt for nothing. I'll lead a good life by my own definition and treat others as I'd like to be treated. If that's not good enough for whatever true deity there might be then that's fair enough. I wouldn't have had anything in common with him/her anyway.
@CrossAlliance I have never been called by any supernatural being at any time. If I ever do hear voices in my head I'll admit myself to the nearest hospital straight away.
@oBARFLYo "This was the largest collection of Nobel Prize winners to sign anything up to that point, providing the clearest statement by scientists in support of evolution yet produced." Translation 'You don't count as God sending me a sign, even though the Bible states that God will use His children to spread the gospel. If God actually does speak to me in person, I must be crazy because I am already convinced He doesn't exist.' Another reason atheism is no better than religion, too much bias.
@oBARFLYo check out: "Know Your Enemy" from TheFuelProject. Everything we have been cleverly divided over will become perfectly clear.
The Elite are using the Hegelian Dialectic. "Thesis v Antithesis= Synthesis" or "Problem - Reaction =Solution"
They've financed the extremes of two opposing (and fake) choices to achieve a false paradigm that will bring (their "solution" and version of) "Order out of Chaos".
"The more things change, the more they remain the same".
@oBARFLYo And I don't think you are understanding what I am telling you. We can debate back and forth whether or not God loves us forever but that accomplishes nothing. You could ask the same question of any religion! Why would a kind and loving Zeus not allow me to live in the Elysium Fields just because I was born a Christian?! You can't single out Christianity there! However, Christianity is the only religion where God stepped down and took our punishment FOR US. That is why he is loving.
@oBARFLYo 'Believing the world is 7000 years old takes a whopping big dollop of ignorance don't you think?' No I do not. Radiometric dating uses several bias assumption to come up with the dates wanted and has been wrong a countless number of times. On the other hand, there are dozens of evidences of a young earth such as the decay rate of our electromagnetic field and the amount of C14 in our atmosphere.
@CrossAlliance (PART1) Before we get into specifics I'll put your scientific point of view in perspective. The vast majority of the scientific community and academia supports evolutionary theory as the only explanation that can fully account for observations in the fields of biology, palaeontology, molecular biology, genetics, anthropology, and others.
@oBARFLYo The vast majority of the scientific community also agreed that maggots spontaneously arise from raw meet if you let it sit out for a few days. Spontaneous generation was an accepted theory in the scientific theory as were a flat Earth and the geocentric theory (neither of which are claimed in the Bible that is a popular misconception). The point is, the scientific community has been wrong a countless number of times and I seriously doubt 75% of them had encountered the creation theory!
@CrossAlliance Creation isn't a theory. It's a lie pushed by those that want it to be true. So you're clear - A scientific theory is a set of principles that explain and predict phenomena. Scientists create scientific theories with the scientific method, when they are originally proposed as hypotheses and tested for accuracy through observations and experiments. Once a hypothesis is verified, it becomes a theory. Hope that clears it up for you.
@oBARFLYo In case I never made the connection between creationism and ID (intelligent design) clear, I don't care if you consider it a science or not, therefore I also don't care if you consider creationism a theory or not. There is evidence. Maybe enough to convince you, maybe not. Keep in mind, God's not the one on trial; we are.
@CrossAlliance Science never claimed to be right. Science provides the best explanation for natural process with empiracle evidence. They then RETEST. Anyone can attempt to debunk current theories. BTW, you forgot to mention that it was science that disproved spontaneous generation and flat earth. In the words of a wise man ""I challenge anyone here to think of a question upon which we once had a scientific answer, however inadequate, but for which now the best answer is a religious one."
@aaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaa I agree, science did debunk spontaneous generation and other theory. That was actually the whole point top my comment. Science is constantly changing. What is "right" today could be "wrong" tomorrow. If science never claimed to be right I'd like my previous science teachers to get that memo. And I don't believe that God and religion are conflicting! But please RETEST the entire history of the planet Earth. You cant! Not everything in the text book is science.
@AgApE010 check out: "Know Your Enemy" from TheFuelProject. Everything we have been cleverly divided over will become perfectly clear.
The Elite are using the Hegelian Dialectic. "Thesis v Antithesis= Synthesis" or "Problem - Reaction =Solution"
They've financed the extremes of two opposing (and fake) choices to achieve a false paradigm that will bring (their "solution" and version of) "Order out of Chaos".
"The more things change, the more they remain the same".
@iskdude57 check out: "Know Your Enemy" from TheFuelProject. Everything we have been cleverly divided over will become perfectly clear.
The Elite are using the Hegelian Dialectic. "Thesis v Antithesis= Synthesis" or "Problem - Reaction =Solution"
They've financed the extremes of two opposing (and fake) choices to achieve a false paradigm that will bring (their "solution" and version of) "Order out of Chaos".
"The more things change, the more they remain the same".
@aaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaa Now that's a pretty stupid comment as well. The truth is both liberals and conservative americans are pretty stupid. With the far right being far more stupid, liberals tend to have more general common sense but not necessarily. Truth is americans are just dumb. I never lived anywhere else so I can't really say about people outside of america, it seems to be the case that non-american first world citizens are a step above; not that that's anything to brag about though...
What do you think made Osama Bin Laden feel like it was a good idea to have suicide bombers attack the world trade center and other monuments? God told him it was the right thing to do ha ha ah ha
@aaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaa check out: "Know Your Enemy" from TheFuelProject. Everything we have been cleverly divided over will become perfectly clear.
The Elite are using the Hegelian Dialectic. "Thesis v Antithesis= Synthesis" or "Problem - Reaction =Solution"
They've financed the extremes of two opposing (and fake) choices to achieve a false paradigm that will bring (their "solution" and version of) "Order out of Chaos".
"The more things change, the more they remain the same". They own the game.
@CrossAlliance Creation "theory" has been around, in this form, for thousands (thousands!) of years. 99% of scientists have undoubtedly encountered this idea. What's interesting about the examples you bring up is how similar they are to the creation myth. "God created the universe in 7 days" is a great way to explain why we are here when you have no other conflicting information, as is "the earth is the center of the universe." Now we know better, and we have overwhelming evidence of evolution.
@flumpis "overwhelming evidence of evolution" And I have overwhelming evidence for a creator! lol and I would love to hear some of that evidence for evolution.
@CrossAlliance Give me your overwhelming evidence of creation. The scientific community would be ripped apart with what you've discovered that undermines everything that's been discovered thus far. Please tell me about the earths magnetic field and C14 in the atmosphere so I may undermine you with facts. Tell me about the dinosaurs on the Ark that never existed.
If you want evidence of evolution ask a biologist, physicist, palaeontologist, geneticist, anthropologist. But you won't of course.
@oBARFLYo The earth's magnetic field is decaying at a seemingly constant rate. A million years ago the field would be so strong that life could not exist on Earth. Not go ahead and tell me about how the field fluctuates ever so often as though I hadn't heard it before. It would take about 30,000 years for the Earth's atmosphere to reach equilibrium with C14 and we still have more now than we did 10 years ago. Now go ahead and tell me how it is a radioactive element so it therefore doesn't count.
@CrossAlliance "The nature of Earth's magnetic field is one of heteroscedastic fluctuation. An instantaneous measurement of it, or several measurements of it across the span of decades or centuries, are not sufficient to extrapolate an overall trend in the field strength. It has gone up and down in the past for no apparent reason". Based on the fact that it's impossible to measure a trend how do Christians know what it was like millions of years ago? Answer is - they don't. That was too easy.
@oBARFLYo You're right, we don't know. We were just making the same Uninformatarian assumptions that scientists do when using other dating methods like various radiometric dating techniques. That's the problem with historical science. It can't be observed or repeated! When it comes to the "age of the earth", I believe it is young for multiple reasons (I only gave you two and called the "evidence" you would have against it before you even replied).
@CrossAlliance So you knew your statement was wrong but you went with it anyway. I like your style.
Scientists make assumptions like you creationists? That made me laugh. Do I need to define the scientific method for you yet again. It's not easy when you leave the Discovery Institute script and have to think for yourself, but at least try.
Tell me why creationists cling to radio carbon dating as proof of a young earth? It's my favourite.
@oBARFLYo "So you knew your statement was wrong but you went with it anyway" I still don't think I'm wrong about it, I just knew there was some controversy. I'll assume that you are correct for the sake of this discussion. And I don't have a "script" from the Discovery Institute and I don't use them as a resource very often. And I don't know what you mean by, "why creationists cling to radio carbon dating as proof of a young earth?"
@CrossAlliance You don't think you're wrong but you don't know why. Says a lot. There is no contraversy other than what you wre trying to claim. I explained it in fairly clear and concise terms and you couldn't counter it. If you are going cite reseach that is over four decades out of date you need to back it up. If I were you I would be more concerned about the reasons someone fed you this disinfomation in the first place. Requires an open mind though.
@oBARFLYo hahaha you are one to talk about having an open find ;) and sure let's ignore what I said about me assuming you were right for the sake of the discussion. Do me a favor and tell me why insects with short lifespans that were supposedly fossilized millions of years look nearly identical if not exactly alike when (according to evolution theory) there should be a slight difference in the genetic code every generation. Is 40 million years not enough to see a physical change?
@CrossAlliance So far you've offered up about six pieces of information for a young earth and I've debunked them all with ease. Or as you would put it "assumed I was right for the sake of discussion". Looks like you weren't really looking for answers. As for your insect theory. Dragonflies have been around in one shape or form for 250 million years as have some fish such as the Lungfish. What's your point? Do I have to explain evolution to you in 400 letters? It's not like you care about facts.
@CrossAlliance The information you're using is 44 years out of date. The guy that put that theory forward was working under the assumption that production and decay of C14 is constant. Thanks to science we now know that the production and decay of C14 in our atmosphere is anything but constant. The dipole moment of the earth's magnetic field, sunspot activity, the Suess effect, supernova explosions, and ocean absorption will effect the carbon-14 concentration. That was too easy.
@oBARFLYo I'll assume what you have said about C14 is correct without doing much in depth research simply because I am aware that scientists (regardless of their religious beliefs) make mistakes. What about the amounts of minerals in the oceans, biological material decay, the amount of mud on the sea floor, comet disintegration, and many others?
@CrossAlliance What about them? Offer them up in a logical argument and I'll answer. Your first two (pesumably your best two) offerings didn't fair too well for proving a young earth so don't hold out much hope for the runners up.
If you whole heartedly disbelieve in evolution then you should veto all vaccines and medicines which are built on evolutionary theory. Knowing how viruses evolve and mutate has saved millions. Not bad for something you don't believe in.
@oBARFLYo "Offer them up in a logical argument and I'll answer" okay. The moon is receding. Due to tidal friction (which would have been even greater in the past), the moon is gaining distance from the Earth, and if the Earth and moon are relatively the same age, Earth can't be older than 750 mil. Also, galaxies are supposed to lose their structure after about 4 or 5 revolutions, but haven't yet.
@CrossAlliance The reserch that you're putting credence in was discredited the second it was released. Walt Brown was the creationist who put the idea forward. A man who has the same qualification in Engineering as myself, and who is equally unqualified to be talking in such matters. The earth is slowing down by 0.005 seconds per year and not the 1 second per year that he dreamt up. Just ask the people who maintain the atomic clock. I doubt you're interested in facts though.
@oBARFLYo Can you be more specific with what comment you are responding to when you said 'The earth is slowing down by 0.005 seconds per year and not the 1 second per year that he dreamt up' because I didn't think I was talking about the Earth slowing down. My main point was that we can tell by means of measuring that our moon is receding, the Earth's speed was not the main part of that young earth evidence.
@Ragitsu Religion doesn't need to change. The Bible has withstood criticism for hundreds of years, science is different every year. I will never say "that makes science wrong," all I am saying is that we need to keep that in mind when we are questioning things that have held value for thousands of years.
@Ragitsu check out: "Know Your Enemy" from TheFuelProject. Everything we have been cleverly divided over will become perfectly clear.
The Elite are using the Hegelian Dialectic. "Thesis v Antithesis= Synthesis" or "Problem - Reaction =Solution"
They've financed the extremes of two opposing (and fake) choices to achieve a false paradigm that will bring (their "solution" and version of) "Order out of Chaos".
"The more things change, the more they remain the same".
@CrossAlliance check out: "Know Your Enemy" from TheFuelProject. Everything we have been cleverly divided over will become perfectly clear.
The Elite are using the Hegelian Dialectic. "Thesis v Antithesis= Synthesis" or "Problem - Reaction =Solution"
They've financed the extremes of two opposing (and fake) choices to achieve a false paradigm that will bring (their "solution" and version of) "Order out of Chaos".
"The more things change, the more they remain the same".
@CrossAlliance No it hasn't. The Bible has been steadily undermined for hundreds of years by things such a facts. Thats why so many christians have abandonded creation and opted for the path of intelligent design. Those with no shame and limited intelligence still push creationism, but as science and techology move forward at an ever increasing rate those left behind look increasingly like M Night Shyamalan's - "The Village".
@oBARFLYo The entire point of Intelligent Design is to show that there must be a God. Creationists and ID believers don't butt heads much because they are pretty much on the same page. They both exist to provide a reason for the hope they have. The science stuff is only a fraction of the reason I am a Christian. My own testimony and personal experiences, along with the fact that the Bible's message has changed my life, is a huge reason I am a Christ follower.
@CrossAlliance What ID and Creationism have in common is that there is zero scientific proof for either. ID differs from Creationism because it divorces Creationist ideas and it's roots in Scripture, and tries to pass itself off as science. It was ruled in 2005 by the US Supreme court that Intelligent Design is not science. The modern concept of intelligent design is a creation of Phillip Johnson, an American professor of Law. Unsurprisingly he wasn't a Biologist, Palaeontologist, Geneticist...
@oBARFLYo So now the Supreme Court decides what is science and what isn't. So even if what they are saying is 100% true (not saying all of it is, but if) then it still would not ever be considered to be accurate information because some old people who studied LAW for all their lives deemed it "non-science." Unsurprisingly, I don't think any of the supreme court judges were biologists, paleontologists, geneticists...
@CrossAlliance Possibly the most retarded statement you've put into words so far. Which is quite an achievement considering some of the tripe you write. Scientists say it isn't science and the courts agreed. End of story on that I'm afraid.
By the way, you should read some of the stuff by Bart D Ehrman PhD. He used to be a Creationist but decided to research all the scripture that makes up the bible. After 30 years research he's now Agnostic. The contradictions in the Gospels are very worrying.
@CrossAlliance I'm just curious, have you actually read the bible cover to cover? Or are you a selective reader who claims the bible's message has changed their life? I'm asking because I was born into a uber religious family (every one is either a preacher or a missionary or a church organist and what not), and in my experince about 9/10 "Christians" have never actually read the entire text.
@RainxDog To answer your question with a yes or no, than no. However I am currently reading through the entire thing cover to cover and attending various Bible classes to help me understand and know as much as I can as fast as I can. I am reading through the OT right now and am in the middle of 2 Samuel. I certainly am not a "selective reader" if I am reading through the Old Testament first, I can tell you that!
@CrossAlliance (PART2) The U.S. National Academy of Sciences has stated that intelligent design and other claims of supernatural intervention in the origin of life are not science because they cannot be tested by experiment, do not generate any predictions, and propose no new hypotheses of their own. I sincerely hope you aren't getting your science info from The Discovery Institute website.
@oBARFLYo I really could care less if ID is considered science or not, just as I don't care if bowling is considered a sport or not. I see a valid point on either side and am personally unconcerned with which is correct. The point is that there is EVIDENCE for intelligent design and if that is not enough to be considered a science, fine. That also doesn't make it wrong. And my information comes from a variety of sources, the Discovery Institute is one I use on occasion.
@CrossAlliance So to summarise. You don't care if ID is science, you don't care what's correct, there is proof of ID but it's not science but that doesn't make it wrong. Sounds like you're seriously conflicted. To date, there are no scientifically peer-reviewed research articles that disclaim evolution listed in the scientific and medical journal search engine Pubmed. Not one.
Even the majority of Theists accept that evolution is the best explanation for life on earth.
@oBARFLYo George Washington was our first president. Not science but it's true. In the same way, I see evidence for ID and whether that's enough for you to consider it a science is indifferent as far as I am concerned. I am not conflicting at all on that.
Also, I encourage you to watch the movie "Expelled" and you will see why there are no peer review articles against evolution. For a "scientific community" there sure is a lot of bias...
@CrossAlliance Seen Expelled. It's shockingly bad. It's pure fiction, dressed in a fancy whore-costume and sold as a documentary. This "intelligent design" is not taught simply because it's not science in any sense of the word, and the makers seem to know it well. They had to come up with desperate conspiracies and accusations of destroying freedom of speech in order to make it effective to the regular religious American viewer. It's bollocks. I see why you loved it though.
@oBARFLYo Expelled game real scenarios of people getting fired for showing the dark side of evolution and you have not right or ability to disagree with that. Of course the documents won't come right out and say "they were fired because they disagreed with evolution" however the reasons filed would certainly not be an acceptable reason to fire someone under other circumstances. I know teachers that fear even bringing up flaws in the theory because of their jobs. That's not critical thinking.
@CrossAlliance Expelled got destroyed by the critics because it was a poorly put together piece of propaganda. Anyone who tries to teach creation in a science class deserves to get fired because it's disgusting, subversive behaviour that has no basis in science. If you want creation taught in the classroom I suggest you come up with some ground breaking research other than trying to pick flaws in the work of people who are smarter, better educated and have decades worth of research to call on.
@oBARFLYo "Anyone who tries to teach creation in a science class deserves to get fired" I agree, keep religion optional in the school systems. However, if you recall, the people in the documentary were fired for showing weaknesses in evolution, not creation.
@CrossAlliance They were pushing their own agenda. It had nothing to do with any supposed weakness in evolution. Evolutionary theory is put into practice every day by hundreds of industries such as those that research and produce medicines and vaccines. It's tried and tested over and over and over again. It's a process that's no longer in any doubt. Even the pope has thrown in the towel and accepted that evolution is the likely origins of man.
@oBARFLYo "the pope has thrown in the towel and accepted that evolution is the likely origins of man." If I had any respect for the Pope, I would care. Let's be honest. You are convinced of evolution, I'm not. Neither one of us will convince the other of anything so we'd might as well stop blowing steam. Some Christians do find reconciliation with evolution and the Bible, I can't. God has been faithful everywhere in my life; a few bones in the dirt and a strand of DNA will not make me stray.
I know you'll respond "I have faith in the word of god" or something similar, but doesn't the sheer weight of information available to you, that contradicts what you believe ever make you have doubts? Is there anything that could ever be discovered or shown to you that would ever make you doubt? I just can't understand the mindset.
@oBARFLYo "I just can't understand the mindset." Sure you can. If you can look into a living cell and study it and still conclude that it arranged itself from matter and luck after a few billion years, you have as much faith in something as I do.
@CrossAlliance So because you don't understand something and have never looked beyond the pages of The Discovery Institute or Conservapedia you simply dismiss it? To be fair it would be a very empty world if we were to remove everything you don't understand. So far every bit of science you've quoted as proof of creation has been embarrassingly far of the mark. Wilful ignorance and wishful thinking are all you have. Tell me about carbon dating and why it's so imprecise.
@CrossAlliance (PART3) In 1986, an amicus curiae brief, signed by 72 US Nobel Prize winners, 17 state academies of science and 7 other scientific societies, asked the US Supreme Court to reject a Louisiana state law requiring the teaching of creationism (which the brief described as embodying religious dogma). This was the largest collection of Nobel Prize winners to sign anything up to that point, providing the clearest statement by scientists in support of evolution yet produced.
@oBARFLYo "This was the largest collection of Nobel Prize winners to sign anything up to that point, providing the clearest statement by scientists in support of evolution yet produced." Big whoop. Science changes on a day to day basis, about once a decade or so a big change comes along and the entire foundation that the science beach house is built on is revealed to be shifting sand. My beliefs are built on the rock which, as I think I have said before, has withstood scrutiny for centuries.
@oBARFLYo ...or 2 Peter 3:9 when it says, 'The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. Instead he is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance.' Yes, if anyone is old enough to know right from wrong and and does not repent, he will not be able to enter the kingdom of Heaven because he is unclean. That is why Americans needs to stop being so casual with their faith and go out there and save people!
@CrossAlliance So your answer is yes. If someone never gets to hear the word of your God during their lifetime due to no more than geography, then they will spend an eternity in hell. How disgusting. How could you enjoy your time in heaven knowing about the undeserved suffering that would be going on down below? Loving God? Sounds more like a monster.
@oBARFLYo Everyone is called to witness and minister to people through mission trips. Everyone is called somewhere different to someone different. When we do not answer the call, then yes the result is people going to Hell. However, that's not at all God's fault, it's our own. And Hell is NOT eternal it is finite, just as the crime of sin is finite. And yes, just offering salvation for one person would make God loving but instead He offers it to EVERYONE. That is love.
@CrossAlliance So if I can grasp anything out of your vague rambling it is - If you live somewhere in the world that the word of your God hasn't reached then you're going to hell. The very opposite of a loving god no matter how much smoke you blow.
@oBARFLYo Vague? Let me be as specific as I possibly can. If you have sinned (which everyone has regardless of what color your skin is or how many miles away from a church you are) and you do not receive the free gift of salvation from the all loving God then you physically cannot enter heaven. NOT because God doesn't love you but because He is holy and just as light cannot be in the presence of darkness, God cannon be in the presence of sin. He died so we can be with Him. That is LOVE.
@CrossAlliance Sorry, that's not what I asked. You seem to need to find fairly elaborate answers for simple questions. "Just as light can't be in the presence of darkness"? Going to hell because you live somewhere that the word of God never reached is not your fault. It's an unfortunate consequence of where you were born. Therefore God letting them go to hell is compassionless and unloving.
@oBARFLYo 'if a child is born and raised a Hindu in India and subsequently dies at an early age, will it go to hell?' No children, regardless of their "religion" will go to hell because children have not reached the age of accountability. Once you're old enough to take responsibility for your sins you must accept Jesus Christ as your savior and repent.
Purpose of my life is to repent? To accept the words in an ancient book which has been edited countless times by men, and written by men? The "Word of God" EDITED by men over a thousand years ago.
I believe there is a God. I believe it will punish you for your ignorance of logic and reason and for your reverence for an ancient book with inhumane, violent teachings.
@rolandocbf Part one) If you haven't lived an absolutely perfect life, then yes you need to repent. But no it is not your purpose, your purpose to to have fellowship with God. Your purpose is to praise Him and bring glory to His name and in order to do that as a sinner, you must be redeemed by the blood of Jesus and repent. Also, you obviously have several misconceptions about the Bible. It was not written like the game "telephone" when one person writes it, then another, then another...
@rolandocbf Part 2) ...God inspired man to write the Bible (2 Timothy 3:16) and since the time it was written it has been both the best preserved and most sold book in the history of mankind, I would not call that just a silly old book as many (maybe even you) seem to think it is. Also, "violent teachings" is only what you want to see the Bible as because you don't like the Bible You bluntly ignore every actual "teaching" in the Bible which all revolve around peace, love, faith and joy.
@Budgie1608 But I am not referring to our planet, I am talking about our universe as a whole. Min order for what you are saying to even have the slightest chance of being true, there would have to be multiple universes, which there is not a shred of evidence for. The entire multiple universes hypothesis was just an attempt to dodge the unavoidable probability of a divine creator.
@oBARFLYo I personally believe the world (and universe) are about 6-10 thousand years old however when talking to someone about science, I usually have to switch mindsets. You don't believe the earth is young so what is the point of debating with you if we are already on separate pages? My goal is to turn your hole world view inside out, then maybe you'll consider mine ;)
@CrossAlliance When you swap mindsets, what's happening is you're switching from the belief mindset that has been drummed into you at an early age to the logic mindset that is dictated by facts. If you'd rather follow third, fourth, fifth hand accounts written by someone unknown about a bronze age myth and claim it is more accurate than what is taught by every branch of science then good luck with that. If you could reason with a Christian there wouldn't be Christians.
@oBARFLYo I hear that a lot, "bronze age". As though that somehow disqualifies it from being true. You're argument is not uncommon but I would like to point out several things about it that just don't make sense. Your worldview is unstable. If you put all your faith in science then you will never be right because science is constantly changing and shifting to fit new knowledge. That's good don't get me wrong, but it leaves a lot of room for error. Evolution and billions of years could be..
@CrossAlliance Bronze age is used for perspective, nothing more. I would rather put my faith in those who strive for the truth rather than those who seek to bend or distort it to fit a heavily flawed and contradictory set of books by authors unknown.
@oBARFLYo ..right today and wrong tomorrow. My worldview however (that you are assuming that I have been forced to believe when I was young, which is not the case. I believed that earth was old because it was drummed into me at an early age in the public school system) is solid. The Bible is flawless with the exception of a few mis-transliterations into English and the original Hebrew copies are still available and accurate. My worldview withstands scrutiny, yours completely changes by it.
@CrossAlliance Your worldview, as you like to call it, doesn't stand up to primary level scrutiny, that's the problem. That's always been the problem. That's why some Christians say the world is 6000 years old and that there were dinosaurs on the Ark, whilst others claim stories like that were metaphorical and that God instead had a hand in evolution. If you like I'll list all the contradictions in the Gospels or some of the abhorrent atrocities commanded by your loving God in the Old Testament.
@oBARFLYo 1) I believe in a young earth and if any Christian doesn't, I fear that they may have a harder time having a connection with God for two reasons: first of all, it is impossible to compromise the Bible and evolution no matter how you look at it so you must put the Bible second and the always changing science first. secondly, you may have a tough time believing the rest of the Bible if you doubt the very first chapter.
@oBARFLYo 2) I would love to hear some of the contradictions that you think there are in the Bible because there aren't any. In some cases, translations were off in numbers or punctuation (numbers because of misreading the number in the original text and punctuation because there were no commas, colons, etc in the original language so some guess work was required). In other cases, man has misunderstood the meaning of a verse or taken it out of context to make it seem like a contradiction.
@CrossAlliance " I would love to hear some of the contradictions that you think there are in the Bible because there aren't any." - CrossAlliance
"Fathers shall not be put to death for their sons, nor shall sons be put to death for their fathers; everyone shall be put to death for his own sin." - Deut. 24:16
"I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children, and on the third and the fourth generations of those who hate Me..." - Deut. 5:9
@themediocrenontheist How is that contradictory? One verse says, 'Parents, no sacrificing your kids.' The other says, 'Hey man, if you hate me and teach your kids to hate me, I won't be very nice to them.' One's a command to man, the other is a promise from God. Not only are those two not contradictory but their not even talking about the same thing! And besides, I don't see where Deut. 5:9 says God would kill the children.
@CrossAlliance No, the one verse says, "I will not punish sons for the sins of their parents; every person will bear their own sin." The next one says, "I punish children for the sins of the parents, and that burden won't be lifted even for several generations after the parents." These two ideas are diametrically opposed to one another.
That doesn't even take Original Sin into consideration, which is essentially punishing *all life ever, and forever,* based on the actions of two people.
@oBARFLYo 3) Yes there are some seemingly horrific stories in the Old Testament until you get a better understanding of why they were. For example, invading other lands and killing men, women, and children would be called a genocide now, but actually was for a reason. Most enemies of the Israelite were sacrificing their own children for crying out loud! Also keep in find that mercy was harder to receive because Jesus had not yet come and not everything in the scriptures are approved by God.
@CrossAlliance " For example, invading other lands and killing men, women, and children would be called a genocide now, but actually was for a reason" A very interesting justification for killing children. God ordering the dashing of innocent suckling infants against rocks seems perfectly justified now. What was I thinking?
Also have you ever noticed how heavily plagiarised the Christian bible is? No wonder the Jews, Egyptians, Pagans and Greeks were so pissed at the invention of Jesus.
@CrossAlliance I understand that's what you've been told, but notice how you *included* children in there, and that there was a good reason to kill them.
"Guys, look, these people were SACRIFICING CHILDREN! Of COURSE Israel had to go there and kill them...AND their children
religion is not bad, people use it bad....i dont give a shit...most of ppl i know are stupid
MrSufkut 2 days ago
@MrSufkut Nah, religion's bad too.
TheLockon00 55 minutes ago
@oBARFLYo ;)
CrossAlliance 2 days ago
This is about 20 years old...some of the whiners need to start a car and let it run in their garage.
aeternusero 3 days ago
Christianity is a cult of human sacrifice. True story.
TheTexanCanadian 3 days ago
@TheTexanCanadian Well said, guy. Well said.
TheLockon00 58 minutes ago
No racism intended here but why do most comedians just concentrate on Christianity?
lankinator24 6 days ago
@lankinator24 Lol no racism intended but Christianity isn't a race,it's a silly little primitive religion.
MrCloudisgay 6 days ago 5
@lankinator24 Part of why some people like jokes is being able to relate to them. Since some countries, like the UK & the US, where comedians have a great deal of attention, have strong Christian populations, so Christianity is something the citizens have heard about a lot. It's the easiest idea for the audience to grasp.
TheBostonRage 5 days ago
@lankinator24 because it is the biggest, most powerful and most prestigious religion in the entire world
SpiritusPhantom 5 days ago
@lankinator24 Because it's the easiest to attack. Not saying it's any dumber than any other religion, but it hits a nerve, especially with uneducated rednecks.
Andy152R 5 days ago
@Andy152R Yes! Screw the rednecks!
Jorsalfar 4 days ago
@lankinator24 because they are afraid of Islam.
MentalSentinel 3 days ago
@lankinator24 Because Christianity is the major religion in most western English speaking countries.
Alexmarriedagoat 1 day ago
@oBARFLYo Really? I have heard stories opposite of that. Lee Srobel, I'm sure you've heard of him, was an atheist or agnostic (slips my mind at the moment) but he did research in hstory and the scriptures and completely turned his life around and began to follow Christ.
CrossAlliance 6 days ago
@CrossAlliance Keep living in the Bronze Age mate and the rest of us will leave you behind. I don't think it's a coincidence that he bulk of the creationists live in the southern states of America. They were also reluctant to give up slavery and racism so I guess the IQ is slightly lower down there.
oBARFLYo 3 days ago
Aint life great FUCK YOU
fuxu123 1 week ago
Religion is bollocks!
Mzungu64 1 week ago
Damn it! What was Bill's great idea for the movies?! D'=
rcarass1 1 week ago
it was all racial
andrewlewis963 1 week ago
it was all racial
andrewlewis963 1 week ago
fuck yeah! argument!
mojojojo2999 1 week ago
@oBARFLYo Logical statements can easily be misinterpreted by stupid people as vague ramblings. It's easier than admitting that you couldn't follow a simple chain of reasoning. And this ends my participation in this discussion.
clockworkengine 1 week ago
@clockworkengine Talk shit and run away. Well done.
oBARFLYo 1 week ago
@oBARFLYo I don't think you understood what I was trying to say...
clockworkengine 1 week ago
@clockworkengine That's the problem with vague ramblings.
oBARFLYo 1 week ago
To believe in God requires the suspension of logic. I say this as a believer myself. If God exists, every piece of logic on Earth is nullified because God himself would dictate logic from day to day, and since God has a personality that means logic will change based on his moods. Therefore, any logical argument against God is nullified by faith.
clockworkengine 1 week ago
@clockworkengine By the way, this, too, is a logical argument. Is it therefore nullified?
clockworkengine 1 week ago
@clockworkengine You should have just left that comment after the first sentence. It would be more accurate to say that faith is nullified by logic. Sounds like you're grasping at straws.
oBARFLYo 1 week ago
@aaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaa Whatever you say ;)
CrossAlliance 1 week ago
Creationism and atheism are equally ignorant positions. The only logical position to assume is that of agnosticism, if you think otherwise, you are a moron.
xMxRINOx 2 weeks ago
@xMxRINOx Thanks for enlightening us professor.
oBARFLYo 2 weeks ago
@xMxRINOx Wait, you dropped your derp.
tangledweb79 2 weeks ago
so eh watched terminator 2 and then...?
Gool349 2 weeks ago
hey you all it doesn matter anything taht you all have said REMEMBER IT IS JUST A RIDE so dont be such stupid and tink enjoy the moment think, read and relax and explore.
mydream71003 2 weeks ago
random flag burning lol
TheZimmerman22 3 weeks ago
@themediocrenontheist Oh now I see what you meant. Notice in the first verse it says, 'everyone shall be puut to death for his own sin.' First of all, that's not even talking about Hell and it's not talking about GOD'S punishment for people. It's talking about man's punishment for man. Also whether you like original sin or not, it is evident in our world. You don't teach your children to steal from the cookie jar, they just do! You must teach your children to be good or they'll be rotten!
CrossAlliance 3 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance If I lead a good life but my only crime is incredulity at believing one of the 2700 or so religions will I spend an eternity in hell? Seems a bit harsh when you consider how equally convinced the followers of those other religions are that theirs is the only God. Also if a child is born and raised a Hindu in India and subsequently dies at an early age, will it go to hell? Seems harsh.
oBARFLYo 3 weeks ago
@oBARFLYo "If I lead a good life but my only crime is incredulity at believing one of the 2700 or so religions..." Well my first question is what's your standard of "good." What do you mean you lead a "good" life? By whose standards is your life good? Certainly not God's divine standards. God is not harsh at all! He made hell for Satan and we soon followed him rather than God. Even after we rebelled against Him, He still sent a savior to redeem us! That's not harsh at all, that's love.
CrossAlliance 3 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance Ok. Lets say I lead a divine standard of living right up till I die. Would I still spend an eternity in hell for the crime of incredulity? Try not and play around with the "who's to say what a divine standard of living is" but rather, try and focus on what I'm actually asking you.
oBARFLYo 2 weeks ago
@oBARFLYo Part One) Well the "divine standard" that you are referring to is being perfect and sinless. A sin is any deliberate action, attitude, or thought that goes against God, so if you are skeptical of God then you are committing a sin and thus you do not live up to that "divine standard" that you are talking about. Furthermore, your question is irrelevant because no one on this planet now or ever before has lived such a life, with the exception of Jesus.
CrossAlliance 2 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance But God has never spoken to me. All I have to go by are the unconvincing words of preachers and a heavily flawed set of books by authors unknown. Earth 7000 years old? Noah's Ark? Dinosaurs and the extensive fossil record? Pope causing the death of tens of thousands in Africa due to AID's? Ritual child abuse by priests? And the heavily plagiarised account of the life of Christ? I could believe in God if it wasn't for my strong sense of perspective.
oBARFLYo 2 weeks ago
@oBARFLYo "But God has never spoken to me" When have you asked Him to?
CrossAlliance 2 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance Yeah, when I was young and I watched my 10 year old brother slowly die of cancer. He had a tumour in his knee which eventually led to the loss of a leg and ultimately to his death after 17 months of agony. I believed back then, and prayed and prayed. It didn't work of course and any words the local minister had are as false and ridiculous now as they were then. Maybe I prayed to the wrong god.
oBARFLYo 2 weeks ago
@oBARFLYo "Seems a bit harsh when you consider how equally convinced the followers of those other religions are that theirs is the only God" Voddie Baucham is a very inspirational preacher to me because his mother was Buddhist. He was raised in a Buddhist home but is now a very firm believer in Christ. There are plenty of testimonies like his, just because you were born into another religion doesn't mean that you are immune to God's standards of righteousness!
CrossAlliance 3 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance I asked you about people in India who have been born and raised Hindu, not someone living in a large Christian 1st world country who converted to Christianity. I'm sure you can tell the difference. What about the tribes in Peru that have no access to the word of God? Are they all going to hell? Try and imagine there's a world outside of America. It might help with your sense of perspective.
oBARFLYo 2 weeks ago
@oBARFLYo "It might help with your sense of perspective." Oh you don't need to tell me about perspective. I've gone on several mission trips and Lord willing, may be a full time missionary in another country in the future. What do you think Matthew 28:19 means when it says, 'Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,'?...
CrossAlliance 2 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance I hope when you're on a missionary trip you're spreading the word of contraception and telling everyone that the Pope is wrong and that's why they're all dying of AID's.
oBARFLYo 2 weeks ago
@oBARFLYo What is the Pope telling Africa to give them AID's??? I'm not even catholic and I know that can't be right. Support your claims for once.
CrossAlliance 2 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance Looks like someone is being deliberately ignorant. The Pope and the catholic church has been telling the masses for a long time that the use of condoms are a sin. Something along the lines of "AIDs is bad but condoms are much worse". As a result thousands of people have and are dying in the third world. How disgusting.
oBARFLYo 2 weeks ago
@oBARFLYo Ok well as a Protestant I don't keep up on everything the Pope does, so now I was certainly not being deliberately ignorant. And I disagree with many of the things that the Catholics do but don't blame the church for AIDs. If you want to see less cases of AIDs, have sex the way God intended it to be had, between two people.
CrossAlliance 2 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance I was also born a Protestant but I do like to keep abreast of current affairs. I didn't blame the Catholic church for AID's but rather for helping to cause the spread of it through fear. But you're probably right. Those third world savages should stop worrying about starvation and concentrate on monogamy.
oBARFLYo 2 weeks ago
@oBARFLYo I am sorry to hear about your brother but you can rest assured that he is waiting for you, just as several of my grandparents are for me. Death is never easy and we would be inhuman to never wonder why God would take the ones we love but the fact is that this world is far from perfect. You and I are what's wrong with this world as well as everyone else, that's really as kind as it can be put. But there is an alternative to the selfish and unrighteous path of this world.
CrossAlliance 2 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance Sounds to me you're weighed down with a lot of guilt for nothing. I'll lead a good life by my own definition and treat others as I'd like to be treated. If that's not good enough for whatever true deity there might be then that's fair enough. I wouldn't have had anything in common with him/her anyway.
oBARFLYo 2 weeks ago
@oBARFLYo And you can live your life the way you want, but you have no excuse now. You have been called and I can't answer for you.
CrossAlliance 2 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance I have never been called by any supernatural being at any time. If I ever do hear voices in my head I'll admit myself to the nearest hospital straight away.
oBARFLYo 2 weeks ago 6
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@oBARFLYo "This was the largest collection of Nobel Prize winners to sign anything up to that point, providing the clearest statement by scientists in support of evolution yet produced." Translation 'You don't count as God sending me a sign, even though the Bible states that God will use His children to spread the gospel. If God actually does speak to me in person, I must be crazy because I am already convinced He doesn't exist.' Another reason atheism is no better than religion, too much bias.
CrossAlliance 2 weeks ago
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@oBARFLYo check out: "Know Your Enemy" from TheFuelProject. Everything we have been cleverly divided over will become perfectly clear.
The Elite are using the Hegelian Dialectic. "Thesis v Antithesis= Synthesis" or "Problem - Reaction =Solution"
They've financed the extremes of two opposing (and fake) choices to achieve a false paradigm that will bring (their "solution" and version of) "Order out of Chaos".
"The more things change, the more they remain the same".
They own the game.
1tonykirk 1 week ago
@oBARFLYo And I don't think you are understanding what I am telling you. We can debate back and forth whether or not God loves us forever but that accomplishes nothing. You could ask the same question of any religion! Why would a kind and loving Zeus not allow me to live in the Elysium Fields just because I was born a Christian?! You can't single out Christianity there! However, Christianity is the only religion where God stepped down and took our punishment FOR US. That is why he is loving.
CrossAlliance 2 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance You're right. Other religions are equally flawed. At least you don't have to justify 53 year old Mohammed raping a 9 year old girl.
Believing the world is 7000 years old takes a whopping big dollop of ignorance don't you think?
oBARFLYo 2 weeks ago
@oBARFLYo 'Believing the world is 7000 years old takes a whopping big dollop of ignorance don't you think?' No I do not. Radiometric dating uses several bias assumption to come up with the dates wanted and has been wrong a countless number of times. On the other hand, there are dozens of evidences of a young earth such as the decay rate of our electromagnetic field and the amount of C14 in our atmosphere.
CrossAlliance 2 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance (PART1) Before we get into specifics I'll put your scientific point of view in perspective. The vast majority of the scientific community and academia supports evolutionary theory as the only explanation that can fully account for observations in the fields of biology, palaeontology, molecular biology, genetics, anthropology, and others.
oBARFLYo 2 weeks ago
@oBARFLYo The vast majority of the scientific community also agreed that maggots spontaneously arise from raw meet if you let it sit out for a few days. Spontaneous generation was an accepted theory in the scientific theory as were a flat Earth and the geocentric theory (neither of which are claimed in the Bible that is a popular misconception). The point is, the scientific community has been wrong a countless number of times and I seriously doubt 75% of them had encountered the creation theory!
CrossAlliance 2 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance Creation isn't a theory. It's a lie pushed by those that want it to be true. So you're clear - A scientific theory is a set of principles that explain and predict phenomena. Scientists create scientific theories with the scientific method, when they are originally proposed as hypotheses and tested for accuracy through observations and experiments. Once a hypothesis is verified, it becomes a theory. Hope that clears it up for you.
oBARFLYo 2 weeks ago
@oBARFLYo In case I never made the connection between creationism and ID (intelligent design) clear, I don't care if you consider it a science or not, therefore I also don't care if you consider creationism a theory or not. There is evidence. Maybe enough to convince you, maybe not. Keep in mind, God's not the one on trial; we are.
CrossAlliance 2 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance Science never claimed to be right. Science provides the best explanation for natural process with empiracle evidence. They then RETEST. Anyone can attempt to debunk current theories. BTW, you forgot to mention that it was science that disproved spontaneous generation and flat earth. In the words of a wise man ""I challenge anyone here to think of a question upon which we once had a scientific answer, however inadequate, but for which now the best answer is a religious one."
aaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaa 2 weeks ago
@aaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaa I agree, science did debunk spontaneous generation and other theory. That was actually the whole point top my comment. Science is constantly changing. What is "right" today could be "wrong" tomorrow. If science never claimed to be right I'd like my previous science teachers to get that memo. And I don't believe that God and religion are conflicting! But please RETEST the entire history of the planet Earth. You cant! Not everything in the text book is science.
CrossAlliance 2 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance Anyone who "believes" in religion is a fucking tool.
aaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaa 2 weeks ago
@aaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaa Epithet fallacy. Go try that on an ignorant believer who has never asked themselves a question or two about God.
CrossAlliance 2 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance All believers are ignorant.
aaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaa 2 weeks ago 26
@aaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaa
This is the second stupid comment I've come across by you. The first was on a Bill Maher video.
Are you on some crusade for stupidity or something?
AgApE010 1 week ago
@AgApE010 I can only assume you believe in god...yeah?
aaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaa 1 week ago
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@AgApE010 check out: "Know Your Enemy" from TheFuelProject. Everything we have been cleverly divided over will become perfectly clear.
The Elite are using the Hegelian Dialectic. "Thesis v Antithesis= Synthesis" or "Problem - Reaction =Solution"
They've financed the extremes of two opposing (and fake) choices to achieve a false paradigm that will bring (their "solution" and version of) "Order out of Chaos".
"The more things change, the more they remain the same".
They own the game.
1tonykirk 1 week ago
@aaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaa actually that's a pretty ignorant statement to say that all believers are ignorant. But I get what you're saying...
iskdude57 1 week ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@iskdude57 check out: "Know Your Enemy" from TheFuelProject. Everything we have been cleverly divided over will become perfectly clear.
The Elite are using the Hegelian Dialectic. "Thesis v Antithesis= Synthesis" or "Problem - Reaction =Solution"
They've financed the extremes of two opposing (and fake) choices to achieve a false paradigm that will bring (their "solution" and version of) "Order out of Chaos".
"The more things change, the more they remain the same".
They own the game.
1tonykirk 1 week ago
@iskdude57 You're right. I meant to say all believers are fucking stupid and a anchor to the advancement of humankind.
aaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaa 1 week ago 23
@aaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaa Now that's a pretty stupid comment as well. The truth is both liberals and conservative americans are pretty stupid. With the far right being far more stupid, liberals tend to have more general common sense but not necessarily. Truth is americans are just dumb. I never lived anywhere else so I can't really say about people outside of america, it seems to be the case that non-american first world citizens are a step above; not that that's anything to brag about though...
iskdude57 1 week ago
@iskdude57 Yes, most Americans are pretty dumb. What do you expect? Most believe in a god. Dumb as fuck population.
aaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaa 1 week ago
@aaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaa
What do you think made Osama Bin Laden feel like it was a good idea to have suicide bombers attack the world trade center and other monuments? God told him it was the right thing to do ha ha ah ha
Amzingred 1 week ago
@Amzingred Right, the "Evil Doers" pulled off 911. LOL!
aaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaa 1 week ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@aaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaa check out: "Know Your Enemy" from TheFuelProject. Everything we have been cleverly divided over will become perfectly clear.
The Elite are using the Hegelian Dialectic. "Thesis v Antithesis= Synthesis" or "Problem - Reaction =Solution"
They've financed the extremes of two opposing (and fake) choices to achieve a false paradigm that will bring (their "solution" and version of) "Order out of Chaos".
"The more things change, the more they remain the same". They own the game.
1tonykirk 1 week ago
@aaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaa stereotypes are stupid as well
ForgotteMemories101 21 hours ago
@ForgotteMemories101 Who did I stereo type?
aaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaa 15 hours ago
@CrossAlliance Creation "theory" has been around, in this form, for thousands (thousands!) of years. 99% of scientists have undoubtedly encountered this idea. What's interesting about the examples you bring up is how similar they are to the creation myth. "God created the universe in 7 days" is a great way to explain why we are here when you have no other conflicting information, as is "the earth is the center of the universe." Now we know better, and we have overwhelming evidence of evolution.
flumpis 2 weeks ago
@flumpis "overwhelming evidence of evolution" And I have overwhelming evidence for a creator! lol and I would love to hear some of that evidence for evolution.
CrossAlliance 2 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance Give me your overwhelming evidence of creation. The scientific community would be ripped apart with what you've discovered that undermines everything that's been discovered thus far. Please tell me about the earths magnetic field and C14 in the atmosphere so I may undermine you with facts. Tell me about the dinosaurs on the Ark that never existed.
If you want evidence of evolution ask a biologist, physicist, palaeontologist, geneticist, anthropologist. But you won't of course.
oBARFLYo 2 weeks ago
@oBARFLYo The earth's magnetic field is decaying at a seemingly constant rate. A million years ago the field would be so strong that life could not exist on Earth. Not go ahead and tell me about how the field fluctuates ever so often as though I hadn't heard it before. It would take about 30,000 years for the Earth's atmosphere to reach equilibrium with C14 and we still have more now than we did 10 years ago. Now go ahead and tell me how it is a radioactive element so it therefore doesn't count.
CrossAlliance 2 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance "The nature of Earth's magnetic field is one of heteroscedastic fluctuation. An instantaneous measurement of it, or several measurements of it across the span of decades or centuries, are not sufficient to extrapolate an overall trend in the field strength. It has gone up and down in the past for no apparent reason". Based on the fact that it's impossible to measure a trend how do Christians know what it was like millions of years ago? Answer is - they don't. That was too easy.
oBARFLYo 1 week ago
@oBARFLYo You're right, we don't know. We were just making the same Uninformatarian assumptions that scientists do when using other dating methods like various radiometric dating techniques. That's the problem with historical science. It can't be observed or repeated! When it comes to the "age of the earth", I believe it is young for multiple reasons (I only gave you two and called the "evidence" you would have against it before you even replied).
CrossAlliance 1 week ago
@CrossAlliance So you knew your statement was wrong but you went with it anyway. I like your style.
Scientists make assumptions like you creationists? That made me laugh. Do I need to define the scientific method for you yet again. It's not easy when you leave the Discovery Institute script and have to think for yourself, but at least try.
Tell me why creationists cling to radio carbon dating as proof of a young earth? It's my favourite.
oBARFLYo 1 week ago
@oBARFLYo "So you knew your statement was wrong but you went with it anyway" I still don't think I'm wrong about it, I just knew there was some controversy. I'll assume that you are correct for the sake of this discussion. And I don't have a "script" from the Discovery Institute and I don't use them as a resource very often. And I don't know what you mean by, "why creationists cling to radio carbon dating as proof of a young earth?"
CrossAlliance 1 week ago
@CrossAlliance You don't think you're wrong but you don't know why. Says a lot. There is no contraversy other than what you wre trying to claim. I explained it in fairly clear and concise terms and you couldn't counter it. If you are going cite reseach that is over four decades out of date you need to back it up. If I were you I would be more concerned about the reasons someone fed you this disinfomation in the first place. Requires an open mind though.
oBARFLYo 1 week ago
@oBARFLYo hahaha you are one to talk about having an open find ;) and sure let's ignore what I said about me assuming you were right for the sake of the discussion. Do me a favor and tell me why insects with short lifespans that were supposedly fossilized millions of years look nearly identical if not exactly alike when (according to evolution theory) there should be a slight difference in the genetic code every generation. Is 40 million years not enough to see a physical change?
CrossAlliance 1 week ago
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oBARFLYo 1 week ago
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@CrossAlliance So far you've offered up about six pieces of information for a young earth and I've debunked them all with ease. Or as you would put it "assumed I was right for the sake of discussion". Looks like you weren't really looking for answers. As for your insect theory. Dragonflies have been around in one shape or form for 250 million years as have some fish such as the Lungfish. What's your point? Do I have to explain evolution to you in 400 letters? It's not like you care about facts.
oBARFLYo 1 week ago
@CrossAlliance The information you're using is 44 years out of date. The guy that put that theory forward was working under the assumption that production and decay of C14 is constant. Thanks to science we now know that the production and decay of C14 in our atmosphere is anything but constant. The dipole moment of the earth's magnetic field, sunspot activity, the Suess effect, supernova explosions, and ocean absorption will effect the carbon-14 concentration. That was too easy.
oBARFLYo 1 week ago
@oBARFLYo I'll assume what you have said about C14 is correct without doing much in depth research simply because I am aware that scientists (regardless of their religious beliefs) make mistakes. What about the amounts of minerals in the oceans, biological material decay, the amount of mud on the sea floor, comet disintegration, and many others?
CrossAlliance 1 week ago
@CrossAlliance What about them? Offer them up in a logical argument and I'll answer. Your first two (pesumably your best two) offerings didn't fair too well for proving a young earth so don't hold out much hope for the runners up.
If you whole heartedly disbelieve in evolution then you should veto all vaccines and medicines which are built on evolutionary theory. Knowing how viruses evolve and mutate has saved millions. Not bad for something you don't believe in.
oBARFLYo 1 week ago
@oBARFLYo "Offer them up in a logical argument and I'll answer" okay. The moon is receding. Due to tidal friction (which would have been even greater in the past), the moon is gaining distance from the Earth, and if the Earth and moon are relatively the same age, Earth can't be older than 750 mil. Also, galaxies are supposed to lose their structure after about 4 or 5 revolutions, but haven't yet.
CrossAlliance 1 week ago
@CrossAlliance The reserch that you're putting credence in was discredited the second it was released. Walt Brown was the creationist who put the idea forward. A man who has the same qualification in Engineering as myself, and who is equally unqualified to be talking in such matters. The earth is slowing down by 0.005 seconds per year and not the 1 second per year that he dreamt up. Just ask the people who maintain the atomic clock. I doubt you're interested in facts though.
oBARFLYo 1 week ago
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@oBARFLYo Can you be more specific with what comment you are responding to when you said 'The earth is slowing down by 0.005 seconds per year and not the 1 second per year that he dreamt up' because I didn't think I was talking about the Earth slowing down. My main point was that we can tell by means of measuring that our moon is receding, the Earth's speed was not the main part of that young earth evidence.
CrossAlliance 1 week ago
@CrossAlliance
Science is ever changing, as we learn more.
Religion is static.
The former often concedes that it is not absolute, while the latter claims it is.
Ragitsu 1 week ago
@Ragitsu Religion doesn't need to change. The Bible has withstood criticism for hundreds of years, science is different every year. I will never say "that makes science wrong," all I am saying is that we need to keep that in mind when we are questioning things that have held value for thousands of years.
CrossAlliance 1 week ago
@CrossAlliance
O Rly? Have you read the dogmatic and oppressive shit in there?
Ragitsu 1 week ago
@Ragitsu Yes. Have you read all of the revolutionary stuff about peace, love, hope, joy, commitment, equality, happiness, truth and faith?
CrossAlliance 1 week ago
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@Ragitsu check out: "Know Your Enemy" from TheFuelProject. Everything we have been cleverly divided over will become perfectly clear.
The Elite are using the Hegelian Dialectic. "Thesis v Antithesis= Synthesis" or "Problem - Reaction =Solution"
They've financed the extremes of two opposing (and fake) choices to achieve a false paradigm that will bring (their "solution" and version of) "Order out of Chaos".
"The more things change, the more they remain the same".
They own the game.
1tonykirk 1 week ago
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@CrossAlliance check out: "Know Your Enemy" from TheFuelProject. Everything we have been cleverly divided over will become perfectly clear.
The Elite are using the Hegelian Dialectic. "Thesis v Antithesis= Synthesis" or "Problem - Reaction =Solution"
They've financed the extremes of two opposing (and fake) choices to achieve a false paradigm that will bring (their "solution" and version of) "Order out of Chaos".
"The more things change, the more they remain the same".
They own the game.
1tonykirk 1 week ago
@CrossAlliance No it hasn't. The Bible has been steadily undermined for hundreds of years by things such a facts. Thats why so many christians have abandonded creation and opted for the path of intelligent design. Those with no shame and limited intelligence still push creationism, but as science and techology move forward at an ever increasing rate those left behind look increasingly like M Night Shyamalan's - "The Village".
oBARFLYo 1 week ago
@oBARFLYo The entire point of Intelligent Design is to show that there must be a God. Creationists and ID believers don't butt heads much because they are pretty much on the same page. They both exist to provide a reason for the hope they have. The science stuff is only a fraction of the reason I am a Christian. My own testimony and personal experiences, along with the fact that the Bible's message has changed my life, is a huge reason I am a Christ follower.
CrossAlliance 1 week ago
@CrossAlliance What ID and Creationism have in common is that there is zero scientific proof for either. ID differs from Creationism because it divorces Creationist ideas and it's roots in Scripture, and tries to pass itself off as science. It was ruled in 2005 by the US Supreme court that Intelligent Design is not science. The modern concept of intelligent design is a creation of Phillip Johnson, an American professor of Law. Unsurprisingly he wasn't a Biologist, Palaeontologist, Geneticist...
oBARFLYo 1 week ago
@oBARFLYo So now the Supreme Court decides what is science and what isn't. So even if what they are saying is 100% true (not saying all of it is, but if) then it still would not ever be considered to be accurate information because some old people who studied LAW for all their lives deemed it "non-science." Unsurprisingly, I don't think any of the supreme court judges were biologists, paleontologists, geneticists...
CrossAlliance 1 week ago
@CrossAlliance Possibly the most retarded statement you've put into words so far. Which is quite an achievement considering some of the tripe you write. Scientists say it isn't science and the courts agreed. End of story on that I'm afraid.
By the way, you should read some of the stuff by Bart D Ehrman PhD. He used to be a Creationist but decided to research all the scripture that makes up the bible. After 30 years research he's now Agnostic. The contradictions in the Gospels are very worrying.
oBARFLYo 1 week ago
@CrossAlliance I'm just curious, have you actually read the bible cover to cover? Or are you a selective reader who claims the bible's message has changed their life? I'm asking because I was born into a uber religious family (every one is either a preacher or a missionary or a church organist and what not), and in my experince about 9/10 "Christians" have never actually read the entire text.
RainxDog 1 week ago
@RainxDog To answer your question with a yes or no, than no. However I am currently reading through the entire thing cover to cover and attending various Bible classes to help me understand and know as much as I can as fast as I can. I am reading through the OT right now and am in the middle of 2 Samuel. I certainly am not a "selective reader" if I am reading through the Old Testament first, I can tell you that!
CrossAlliance 1 week ago
@CrossAlliance (PART2) The U.S. National Academy of Sciences has stated that intelligent design and other claims of supernatural intervention in the origin of life are not science because they cannot be tested by experiment, do not generate any predictions, and propose no new hypotheses of their own. I sincerely hope you aren't getting your science info from The Discovery Institute website.
oBARFLYo 2 weeks ago
@oBARFLYo I really could care less if ID is considered science or not, just as I don't care if bowling is considered a sport or not. I see a valid point on either side and am personally unconcerned with which is correct. The point is that there is EVIDENCE for intelligent design and if that is not enough to be considered a science, fine. That also doesn't make it wrong. And my information comes from a variety of sources, the Discovery Institute is one I use on occasion.
CrossAlliance 2 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance So to summarise. You don't care if ID is science, you don't care what's correct, there is proof of ID but it's not science but that doesn't make it wrong. Sounds like you're seriously conflicted. To date, there are no scientifically peer-reviewed research articles that disclaim evolution listed in the scientific and medical journal search engine Pubmed. Not one.
Even the majority of Theists accept that evolution is the best explanation for life on earth.
oBARFLYo 2 weeks ago
@oBARFLYo George Washington was our first president. Not science but it's true. In the same way, I see evidence for ID and whether that's enough for you to consider it a science is indifferent as far as I am concerned. I am not conflicting at all on that.
Also, I encourage you to watch the movie "Expelled" and you will see why there are no peer review articles against evolution. For a "scientific community" there sure is a lot of bias...
CrossAlliance 2 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance Seen Expelled. It's shockingly bad. It's pure fiction, dressed in a fancy whore-costume and sold as a documentary. This "intelligent design" is not taught simply because it's not science in any sense of the word, and the makers seem to know it well. They had to come up with desperate conspiracies and accusations of destroying freedom of speech in order to make it effective to the regular religious American viewer. It's bollocks. I see why you loved it though.
oBARFLYo 2 weeks ago
@oBARFLYo Expelled game real scenarios of people getting fired for showing the dark side of evolution and you have not right or ability to disagree with that. Of course the documents won't come right out and say "they were fired because they disagreed with evolution" however the reasons filed would certainly not be an acceptable reason to fire someone under other circumstances. I know teachers that fear even bringing up flaws in the theory because of their jobs. That's not critical thinking.
CrossAlliance 2 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance Expelled got destroyed by the critics because it was a poorly put together piece of propaganda. Anyone who tries to teach creation in a science class deserves to get fired because it's disgusting, subversive behaviour that has no basis in science. If you want creation taught in the classroom I suggest you come up with some ground breaking research other than trying to pick flaws in the work of people who are smarter, better educated and have decades worth of research to call on.
oBARFLYo 1 week ago
@oBARFLYo "Anyone who tries to teach creation in a science class deserves to get fired" I agree, keep religion optional in the school systems. However, if you recall, the people in the documentary were fired for showing weaknesses in evolution, not creation.
CrossAlliance 1 week ago
@CrossAlliance They were pushing their own agenda. It had nothing to do with any supposed weakness in evolution. Evolutionary theory is put into practice every day by hundreds of industries such as those that research and produce medicines and vaccines. It's tried and tested over and over and over again. It's a process that's no longer in any doubt. Even the pope has thrown in the towel and accepted that evolution is the likely origins of man.
oBARFLYo 1 week ago
@oBARFLYo "the pope has thrown in the towel and accepted that evolution is the likely origins of man." If I had any respect for the Pope, I would care. Let's be honest. You are convinced of evolution, I'm not. Neither one of us will convince the other of anything so we'd might as well stop blowing steam. Some Christians do find reconciliation with evolution and the Bible, I can't. God has been faithful everywhere in my life; a few bones in the dirt and a strand of DNA will not make me stray.
CrossAlliance 1 week ago
@CrossAlliance I agree with you here.
I know you'll respond "I have faith in the word of god" or something similar, but doesn't the sheer weight of information available to you, that contradicts what you believe ever make you have doubts? Is there anything that could ever be discovered or shown to you that would ever make you doubt? I just can't understand the mindset.
oBARFLYo 1 week ago
@oBARFLYo "I just can't understand the mindset." Sure you can. If you can look into a living cell and study it and still conclude that it arranged itself from matter and luck after a few billion years, you have as much faith in something as I do.
CrossAlliance 1 week ago
@CrossAlliance So because you don't understand something and have never looked beyond the pages of The Discovery Institute or Conservapedia you simply dismiss it? To be fair it would be a very empty world if we were to remove everything you don't understand. So far every bit of science you've quoted as proof of creation has been embarrassingly far of the mark. Wilful ignorance and wishful thinking are all you have. Tell me about carbon dating and why it's so imprecise.
oBARFLYo 1 week ago
@CrossAlliance (PART3) In 1986, an amicus curiae brief, signed by 72 US Nobel Prize winners, 17 state academies of science and 7 other scientific societies, asked the US Supreme Court to reject a Louisiana state law requiring the teaching of creationism (which the brief described as embodying religious dogma). This was the largest collection of Nobel Prize winners to sign anything up to that point, providing the clearest statement by scientists in support of evolution yet produced.
oBARFLYo 2 weeks ago
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@oBARFLYo "This was the largest collection of Nobel Prize winners to sign anything up to that point, providing the clearest statement by scientists in support of evolution yet produced." Big whoop. Science changes on a day to day basis, about once a decade or so a big change comes along and the entire foundation that the science beach house is built on is revealed to be shifting sand. My beliefs are built on the rock which, as I think I have said before, has withstood scrutiny for centuries.
CrossAlliance 2 weeks ago
@oBARFLYo ...or 2 Peter 3:9 when it says, 'The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. Instead he is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance.' Yes, if anyone is old enough to know right from wrong and and does not repent, he will not be able to enter the kingdom of Heaven because he is unclean. That is why Americans needs to stop being so casual with their faith and go out there and save people!
CrossAlliance 2 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance So your answer is yes. If someone never gets to hear the word of your God during their lifetime due to no more than geography, then they will spend an eternity in hell. How disgusting. How could you enjoy your time in heaven knowing about the undeserved suffering that would be going on down below? Loving God? Sounds more like a monster.
oBARFLYo 2 weeks ago
@oBARFLYo Everyone is called to witness and minister to people through mission trips. Everyone is called somewhere different to someone different. When we do not answer the call, then yes the result is people going to Hell. However, that's not at all God's fault, it's our own. And Hell is NOT eternal it is finite, just as the crime of sin is finite. And yes, just offering salvation for one person would make God loving but instead He offers it to EVERYONE. That is love.
CrossAlliance 2 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance So if I can grasp anything out of your vague rambling it is - If you live somewhere in the world that the word of your God hasn't reached then you're going to hell. The very opposite of a loving god no matter how much smoke you blow.
oBARFLYo 2 weeks ago
@oBARFLYo Vague? Let me be as specific as I possibly can. If you have sinned (which everyone has regardless of what color your skin is or how many miles away from a church you are) and you do not receive the free gift of salvation from the all loving God then you physically cannot enter heaven. NOT because God doesn't love you but because He is holy and just as light cannot be in the presence of darkness, God cannon be in the presence of sin. He died so we can be with Him. That is LOVE.
CrossAlliance 2 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance Sorry, that's not what I asked. You seem to need to find fairly elaborate answers for simple questions. "Just as light can't be in the presence of darkness"? Going to hell because you live somewhere that the word of God never reached is not your fault. It's an unfortunate consequence of where you were born. Therefore God letting them go to hell is compassionless and unloving.
oBARFLYo 2 weeks ago
@oBARFLYo 'if a child is born and raised a Hindu in India and subsequently dies at an early age, will it go to hell?' No children, regardless of their "religion" will go to hell because children have not reached the age of accountability. Once you're old enough to take responsibility for your sins you must accept Jesus Christ as your savior and repent.
CrossAlliance 3 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance
Purpose of my life is to repent? To accept the words in an ancient book which has been edited countless times by men, and written by men? The "Word of God" EDITED by men over a thousand years ago.
I believe there is a God. I believe it will punish you for your ignorance of logic and reason and for your reverence for an ancient book with inhumane, violent teachings.
rolandocbf 2 weeks ago
@rolandocbf Part one) If you haven't lived an absolutely perfect life, then yes you need to repent. But no it is not your purpose, your purpose to to have fellowship with God. Your purpose is to praise Him and bring glory to His name and in order to do that as a sinner, you must be redeemed by the blood of Jesus and repent. Also, you obviously have several misconceptions about the Bible. It was not written like the game "telephone" when one person writes it, then another, then another...
CrossAlliance 2 weeks ago
@rolandocbf Part 2) ...God inspired man to write the Bible (2 Timothy 3:16) and since the time it was written it has been both the best preserved and most sold book in the history of mankind, I would not call that just a silly old book as many (maybe even you) seem to think it is. Also, "violent teachings" is only what you want to see the Bible as because you don't like the Bible You bluntly ignore every actual "teaching" in the Bible which all revolve around peace, love, faith and joy.
CrossAlliance 2 weeks ago
The belief in Creationism is holding back humanity from expanding their knowledge
devilshomie 3 weeks ago 14
@devilshomie Hindu creationism is the way forward
Scooba87 2 weeks ago
@Scooba87 Your entitled to your belief
devilshomie 2 weeks ago
Why do people laugh at creationists.
faunos51 3 weeks ago
God exists, just because your a coward in general doesnt mean you know anything more than anyone else get real or be quiet
cmd1zz13 3 weeks ago
@cmd1zz13 suspend judgement before you've looked at multiple religions first, unless your a deist I guess
MArtinezNINux 3 weeks ago
@Budgie1608 But I am not referring to our planet, I am talking about our universe as a whole. Min order for what you are saying to even have the slightest chance of being true, there would have to be multiple universes, which there is not a shred of evidence for. The entire multiple universes hypothesis was just an attempt to dodge the unavoidable probability of a divine creator.
CrossAlliance 3 weeks ago
@oBARFLYo I personally believe the world (and universe) are about 6-10 thousand years old however when talking to someone about science, I usually have to switch mindsets. You don't believe the earth is young so what is the point of debating with you if we are already on separate pages? My goal is to turn your hole world view inside out, then maybe you'll consider mine ;)
CrossAlliance 3 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance When you swap mindsets, what's happening is you're switching from the belief mindset that has been drummed into you at an early age to the logic mindset that is dictated by facts. If you'd rather follow third, fourth, fifth hand accounts written by someone unknown about a bronze age myth and claim it is more accurate than what is taught by every branch of science then good luck with that. If you could reason with a Christian there wouldn't be Christians.
oBARFLYo 3 weeks ago
@oBARFLYo I hear that a lot, "bronze age". As though that somehow disqualifies it from being true. You're argument is not uncommon but I would like to point out several things about it that just don't make sense. Your worldview is unstable. If you put all your faith in science then you will never be right because science is constantly changing and shifting to fit new knowledge. That's good don't get me wrong, but it leaves a lot of room for error. Evolution and billions of years could be..
CrossAlliance 3 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance Bronze age is used for perspective, nothing more. I would rather put my faith in those who strive for the truth rather than those who seek to bend or distort it to fit a heavily flawed and contradictory set of books by authors unknown.
oBARFLYo 3 weeks ago
@oBARFLYo ..right today and wrong tomorrow. My worldview however (that you are assuming that I have been forced to believe when I was young, which is not the case. I believed that earth was old because it was drummed into me at an early age in the public school system) is solid. The Bible is flawless with the exception of a few mis-transliterations into English and the original Hebrew copies are still available and accurate. My worldview withstands scrutiny, yours completely changes by it.
CrossAlliance 3 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance Your worldview, as you like to call it, doesn't stand up to primary level scrutiny, that's the problem. That's always been the problem. That's why some Christians say the world is 6000 years old and that there were dinosaurs on the Ark, whilst others claim stories like that were metaphorical and that God instead had a hand in evolution. If you like I'll list all the contradictions in the Gospels or some of the abhorrent atrocities commanded by your loving God in the Old Testament.
oBARFLYo 3 weeks ago
@oBARFLYo 1) I believe in a young earth and if any Christian doesn't, I fear that they may have a harder time having a connection with God for two reasons: first of all, it is impossible to compromise the Bible and evolution no matter how you look at it so you must put the Bible second and the always changing science first. secondly, you may have a tough time believing the rest of the Bible if you doubt the very first chapter.
CrossAlliance 3 weeks ago
@oBARFLYo 2) I would love to hear some of the contradictions that you think there are in the Bible because there aren't any. In some cases, translations were off in numbers or punctuation (numbers because of misreading the number in the original text and punctuation because there were no commas, colons, etc in the original language so some guess work was required). In other cases, man has misunderstood the meaning of a verse or taken it out of context to make it seem like a contradiction.
CrossAlliance 3 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance " I would love to hear some of the contradictions that you think there are in the Bible because there aren't any." - CrossAlliance
"Fathers shall not be put to death for their sons, nor shall sons be put to death for their fathers; everyone shall be put to death for his own sin." - Deut. 24:16
"I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children, and on the third and the fourth generations of those who hate Me..." - Deut. 5:9
themediocrenontheist 3 weeks ago
@themediocrenontheist How is that contradictory? One verse says, 'Parents, no sacrificing your kids.' The other says, 'Hey man, if you hate me and teach your kids to hate me, I won't be very nice to them.' One's a command to man, the other is a promise from God. Not only are those two not contradictory but their not even talking about the same thing! And besides, I don't see where Deut. 5:9 says God would kill the children.
CrossAlliance 3 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance No, the one verse says, "I will not punish sons for the sins of their parents; every person will bear their own sin." The next one says, "I punish children for the sins of the parents, and that burden won't be lifted even for several generations after the parents." These two ideas are diametrically opposed to one another.
That doesn't even take Original Sin into consideration, which is essentially punishing *all life ever, and forever,* based on the actions of two people.
themediocrenontheist 3 weeks ago
@oBARFLYo 3) Yes there are some seemingly horrific stories in the Old Testament until you get a better understanding of why they were. For example, invading other lands and killing men, women, and children would be called a genocide now, but actually was for a reason. Most enemies of the Israelite were sacrificing their own children for crying out loud! Also keep in find that mercy was harder to receive because Jesus had not yet come and not everything in the scriptures are approved by God.
CrossAlliance 3 weeks ago
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@CrossAlliance " For example, invading other lands and killing men, women, and children would be called a genocide now, but actually was for a reason" A very interesting justification for killing children. God ordering the dashing of innocent suckling infants against rocks seems perfectly justified now. What was I thinking?
Also have you ever noticed how heavily plagiarised the Christian bible is? No wonder the Jews, Egyptians, Pagans and Greeks were so pissed at the invention of Jesus.
oBARFLYo 3 weeks ago
@CrossAlliance I understand that's what you've been told, but notice how you *included* children in there, and that there was a good reason to kill them.
"Guys, look, these people were SACRIFICING CHILDREN! Of COURSE Israel had to go there and kill them...AND their children