NO SIDE: Shinners, Ganley, Socialists, Coir, Eirigi, UKIP, Le Pen, BNP.
YES SIDE: all international chambers of commerce, 3 main political parties, IFA, IBEC, SIPTU, ICTU, most major trade unions, Ryanair, Intel, Microsoft.
Britain makes me physically suck - How a country can be so ignorant and small mided is beyond me. The Government gets away with extraditing innocent British Citizens to the US but it can't get away with trying to integrate more with Europe?! Never has an entire country been such a farce.
Ireland commissioner says most EU countries would reject Lisbon Treaty
Ireland's EU Commissioner, Charlie McCreevy, has conceded that voters in most EU countries would reject the stalled Lisbon Treaty.
======================
Mr McCreevy, the internal market commissioner, said that if the treaty had been put to a public vote, it would have been rejected by 95 per cent of the 27 member states.
The EU isn't undemoratic at all. By the lisbon treaty there will be more democrazy within the EU and the countries have the possibilties to leave it so if all people are against it ...as some of u say...you can make a party to leave the EU pretty simple or? and you vote your representitives in the EU so what's undemocratic here? It's just as undemoratic as your national states....Vote YES to lisbon treaty for a more powerful and free europe
You are either stoned or retarded. The EU is intentionally DESIGNED to be undemocratic. I guess you can call it anything you want but it doesn't make it anything other than an autocracy.
Please vote NO to the Lisbon Constitution. It is not good enough to have a European Constitution that reads like a phone book and that only the Irish citizens get to vote on. Democracy is in the hands of the Irish people. Voting no to Lisbon will not change the economic situation for the better or the worse. This is a tactic being used by the Government and certain media with vested interests in a yes vote to distract from the actual content of the Treaty. Please do not be fooled, vote NO.
It might help the multinationals in Ireland which is probably why they support it but remember they care nothing about the Irish people or your future.
I will certainly be voting NO this time. By ignoring our previous no vote, it shows what exactly the EU thinks of Democracy. Also the guarantees promised to us Irish are not even legally binding. I do not trust Sarkozy & co. by any means and will certainly be voting NO.
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! Im sick of this anti Europe bullshit! Put those British euroceptics without beer for a couple of days, to see if they start to think like intelligent people!! The EU a united, free, democratic peaceful, beautiful, lovely, Europe,- is for the best interests of the UK
Read the Lisbon Treaty before you speak again, ever.
Also, do you really think its a good idea to centralize that much power on such a large scale? Without allowing the people of alot of those countries to vote?
That the lisbon treaty is self amending and doesnt need to consult any individual government to do it!
I'm all for a united eu, but look at what you are allowing. If all fuzzy nice people are in power, it works great, but what if there isnt? we would be screwed.
I dont see any problem with EU power if his power is a democratic one!
Only united Europe can aspire to be something relevant in the XXI century! No country alone even the biggest Europeans countries like the Uk or Germany can shoulder with China, Russia, Brasil or India ..
Suport our Union and improve her is the best way to defend the best interest s of the europeans
HAHAHA! You don't have a chance. You will be a muslim dictatorship by 2050. First the EU will gut any semblance of democracy then your muslim majority will slowly install Sharia. Bye Bye europe!
I think its absolutely disgusting how these unelected hypocritical idiots can place laws on all these countries without a referendum to allow the people of each individual country to have there say on how they would want to live their lives.
To the politicians its about money & power but for the people of a certain country its about tradition, identity & love.
I am disgusted how the people have been treated by the this treaty.
The Lisbon Treaty is in violation of the United Nations International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights and therefore ilegal :
Article 1 : All peoples have the right to self-determination. By virtue of that right they freely determine their political status and freely pursue their economic and cultural development.
The European Arrest Warrant is also in violation of the same Covernant ( Article 9).
Restore justice and true democracy, vote EU-sceptic in June's European elections.
CaesarAugustus Ireland has paid a heavy price for the money that it was given-Part of the deal to enter the EEC in73 was that we surrender our claim to our territorial waters, which our useless politicians at the time agreed to - we have a larger coast than Iceland and their fishing industry is worth 3bn PA - our joining cost includes the loss of boatbuilding & fish processing industries too.
In 2002 we dismantled our sugar industry and now import all of our sugar fr germany/france(EU directive)
I wonder how Ireland´s youth will feel when drafted into a European Army by the un-elected Council of Europe ?
The Lisbon Treaty include the instruction that all states (including Ireland) :"shall undertake progressively to improve their military capabilities" ?
AND if Ireland´s youth protest on the streets...the DEATH PENALTY will apply "rioting,civil upheaval and during war"(as stated in a FOOTNOTE in the European Charter)is a capital crime!
If the Poles can put American missiles in their back yard and aim them at Russia, what does that say of the EU? Who wants to be part of another Pope inspired-war on secular Russia? The EU is a farce if the Poles are allowed unilaterally to behave in this manner... If the Poles are in, it is time to get out! The EU and the Poles has now given 'reason' to the Irish vote.Idiots.
A clear measure of the corruption & dishonesty of the entire EU project is that these obscenely over funded parasites: commissioners, MEPs, apparatchiks so obviously do not understand morality or decency - Note this publicity clip from EUXTV is titled: 'Lisbon Treaty rejection: Foreign Ministers discuss crisis' so it is clear that in the eyes of the corrupt self serving EU a DEMOCRATIC statement of the truth that does not support their scam is a CRISIS! It says it all! The EU has no legitimacy
Margot Wallstroem would not say a peace of shit. she LOBBOTOMY IN sWEDEN IN AVDELNING 67 INTO INVALIDITY AND DEATH SEVERAL THOUSAND CRITIAL TO SWEDISH FASCIST REGIME CITIZENS A YEAR!!! (pls read about tvångsbehandling and tvångsomhändertagande and their results in Swedish newspapper Dagens MEdicine, nr 47 from 2007l, article from Magnus Häröd!) newfascistical SHAME, Margot!!!
Lisbon-documentary-makers lobbotomy with neuroleptica in EUs own thousand of secret hospitals innocent EU-citizens, wich are critical to EU-regime of today. those people loose their nerve system and are put into invalide chairs to the rest of their lives. THIS IS EU-PARLAMENTS GENOCIDE- This happens in Sweden in Avdelning 67 (read pls newspapper Dagens Medicin, nr 47, 2007)!
If you ignore Ireland's vote on the Lisbon Treaty, next time I am over there, I don't want to hear any more about the 2000 US Election being bogus and how we don't honor the people's vote.
EU is a total non-sense, forcing Europeans into unnatural denial of their cultures, manufacturing, etc. It is totally undemocratic and a major step back in Europe's history. I am glad someone had the guts to say it loud. I am proud of Irish just as I am proud of Czechs for that matter.
The treaty was deliberately made hard to understand so the corrupt, appointed bureaucrats, domininated by the french and germans, would have, at their finger tips a European empire.(remind u of somthing from previous centries).
ramonnl We already have a two speed EU where the politicians, crooks, liars, cheats, lobbyists & parasites are moving backwards into some sort of arcane self serving, self enriching scam whilst the informed, forward seeing, fundamentally honest people want self determination, democracy, liberty, independence and sovereignty with dignity & justice for their peoples and the future. Intelligent informed thinking people do NOT want centralised corruption and a neo dictatorship destroying their lives
The EU Constitution/Lisbon Treaty must by its own LAWS be RATified by all 27 member regions. So far 19 Nations have surrendered to the RATification that's 19 countries or 5000 politicians!
France with a population of 64,473,140
Netherlands with a population of 16,428,071
& Ireland with a population of 4,339,000
EACH by a majority voted NO
In Democratic terms 85M to 5,000 AGAINST
The EU has no mandate - is it then a dictatorship? Ratifying a RATnest
CaesarAugustus1987 In 500 characters I regret I can not give you the full details tou counter the many Billions pent by the EU on propaganda. The facts & comments I put forward are not populist but popular if you truelly hope the peoples of EUrope will survive the provable damage & risks that are a result of the EU. Clearly the EU is suppressing democracy with its own commissioners talking of 'The post democratic era'! To date the EU has absolutely no achievement that justifies its costs NONE.
CaesarAugustus1987 More foolish conclusions as I am not a EUkip member but yes I assure you I am determined to scaremonger as I am scared by what the EU is doing and its aims - Perhaps having travelled widely over 60 years & almost 60 Countries PERHAPS I can offer an opinion with more insight of the dangers the EU is marching us into - eg. for the first time in history the peoples of EUrope can no longer feed themselves & HAVE TO import, consider the near total destruction of fisheries by the EU
CaesarAugustus1987 your endless emphasis on money has no resonance to me, it is not a value it is just worthless material gain. Yes of course needed but not to be worshipped, I value health andf smiles around me far beyond money.The EU with all its watdogs, guard dogs & regulation, endless laws but little justice, massive bribes from the public purse to BUY support. Don't regulate & stabilise artificially as the EU does, permit Nations & communities to interact that balances society NOT law.
MEP = Massively Expensive Parasite. Since the EU is an obscene & corrupt centralised construct engineered for the benefit of NWO the politicians, who have all but no democratic input as all is decided by the unelected commission & with over 3,000 executive committees with NO democratic input, NO respect for democracy, several known criminals on the commission & NO valid accounts for 13 years it is a matter of paying adequate bribes for the self selected MEPs to act as salesmen. EU has NO merit
4 months after the EU scam enquiry ONLY Tom Wise EUkip MEP has been arrested. 5,000 Politicians voted for their gravy train to keep rolling but 85,000,000 citizens voted to start to dismantle it! Guess who will fiddle it to win & whose money they are stealing!
Twice fired unelected morgage fraudster & Bilderberg plennary member Peter Mandelson on Newsnight said, "We have to find a way to repair the damage caused by the Irish Referendum." The damage DEMOCRACY caused to threaten their gravy train
Well, I think you see EU as a new kind of federal superstate on the model of former Roman Empire. That's quite evident. Anyway, I'm against this kind of tricky and hidden politic. I think UK will join to EU. Europe needs UK as UK needs Europe. Trust me.
No, you cannot understand... you're from Italy, a country that, such as Spain (who voted YES to the constitution by 70%) Portugal, Greece, and other countries from Soutern Europe are pro-european and don't have anti-EU movements. You like the Idea of European integration. In Britain 80% of the people don't want the EU, hate other european countries and only want to cooperate with America. That's why I think Britain should leave... it would be better for them and for us.
When I think to Europe, to be honest, I think to France and Germany. Other country are just satellites to this ancient and strong union. I'm for a free mediterrean union-like german hansa-for a free trade zone in the mediterrean including Spain, Italy, Greece, Tunisia, Algeria, Marocco, Turkey, Egypt and Israel. The germans have always brought war and disorders, like the french. I hate those kind of Europe. I'm from Sicily, so you can understand my point of view.
goodsoninc, NO I cannot understand you. To me Germany and France brought some of the best names in science and culture. Imperialists are to be found everywhere in Europe: Greece, Italy, Russia, Nordic Countries (Wikings), Great Britain. Napoleon was from Corsica, Stalin was from Georgia. Sicily brought the Mafioso! (sorry, that wasnt nice, but I had to make a point).
All European Countries has brought something good at some bad.
Well,you're quite shallow. Mafia in southern Italy was born after Unity of Italy, an hidden agreement between great landowners from south and great busineemen and great contractors from north with the help of the army and freemason to keep down the poor farmers and keep a feudalistic economy in the south. Mafia is a part of italian state, not a enemy of italian state. But Mafia works against sicily and for north italy benefits. You have to learn more about mafia. Go back to school
Mafia was brought to Sicily from northern Italy, trust me. Please learn more about real history of italian unity. We are innocent, we are not mafiosi, but for their faults they must blame us as mafiosi. Trust me. Please take a look on the web on the book "The force of destiny" by professor Christopher Duggan (an englishman, by the way).
CaesarAugustus1987 what a very limited perspective you have & with so little vision, bounded it would seem by fear & anger. Your view is too 'sloppy' you confuse Europe with EU, independence with freedom, law with Justice, hope with ambition and quite clearly greed with success.
The EU has brought NOTHING of value to man which justifies the costs, damage, risks & corruption. NATO forced peace on Europe which was broken by the EU. National competition brought developement not EU stagnation.
costs, damage, risks and corruption? By "COST" you mean the 8 billion euros that the EU gave to Ireland from 1994 to 2000? By "DAMAGE" you mean all the metros, train stations, roads that the EU is cofinancing in Eeastern Europe. Go to Warsaw and take a look at every "WORK in PROGRESS" Panel: It says "This is a project 50% financed by the European Union".
CaesarAugustus1987 The EU has indeed paid Ireland 40bn since 1973.90%of what has been paid has been paid to farmers through CAP. Irish farmers are now paid not to farm! A drive through the country will show how much unused land we have, Our Farmers regularly throw away millions of gallons of milk because of EU quotas yet we import 90% of our yoghurt from Germany, Our fisherman are paid to surrender their quotas yet french/spanish trawlers plunder our coasts & we import 80% of our fish.
By RISK You mean the euro after having entered which Italy, Greece and Portugal was finally compelled to meet stability criteria and start lowering their public debt whose increase by their reckless governments was making them become Argentina 1, 2 and 3? By "CORRUPTION" you mean the European Court of Justice sanctioning Italy because its TV Market is totally monopolized by one Media-Mogul called Berlusconi that happens to be Italy's Prime Minister and who uses his televisions to distortreality?
CaesarAugustus1987 RISK has little to do with money but much to do with values, liberty & moral values.
Whether Italy wishes to be ruled by electing a crook is absolutely none of my business nor yours.
The EU offers nothing of merit to mankind but much by way of bribes from the public purs4e for politicians & their parasites.
The EU has no merit to measure against the damage & costs. The differences BETWEEN Nations provides the incentives & competition that strengthens & regenerates peoples.
The EU is working as a "NEW MARSHALL PLAN" for Eastern European Countries helping them to develop. It is working as "WATCHDOG" for corrupted countries like Italy sanctioning them every time that they don't respect free-market rules or use public money to save companies that in the market would have already went bankrupt. It is working as a Financial Stabilizer for countries who are too lazy to purse strong reform in public finance and that recklessly increase DEBT and PUBLIC EXPENDITURE
I think the short-sighted one is you not me. You're one of those UKIP scaremongers who criticize everything that has the word EU in it without even knowing why, who do not accept to listen to (not necessarily agree with) other peoples' ideas, who call a person FASCIST or COMMUNIST (just so you know, there's a big difference between the two) only because he supports european integration. You're not eurosceptic, you're europaranoic, which is quite different.
Everytime that I read your comments and everytime that I watch your videos there is not one single thing you say which is based on DATA, FACTS, ANALYSIS, THINKING... There is only some fool illogically connecting words like INDEPENDENCE - CORRUPTION - CONSPIRACY - DEMOCRACY and who just doesn't manage to make a sense out of the entire speech. With your populist talk (the same one used by Hitler and Mussolini to win support of the people) are only killing democracy, not helping it.
I would like to listen to and understand your position. I live in the Netherlands, a country that has rejected the EU constitution and I know a lot of people that can be called Eurosceptic because they have real motives on which they base their ideas. For example I can assure you that 80% of no voters here are not against the EU.
CaesarAugustus1987 Primarily I am not against the EU but against being a member! I believe free from being shackled to a corpse in the making Britain can offer the peoples of Europe a hope & route to the future. Europe has had many attempts to create a centralised, undemocratic, militarised, supra national control. The strength of Europe in resisting famine & disaster has been by very different Nations with different values competing & co-operating in independent strength. Maintain the gene pool
All European countries depend on Russia by GAS. All European countries are subject to Mass Immigration. All European countries have China as main importer. All European countries are threaneted by terrorism. All European countries are trying so hard to preserve their Christian Identity from the Islamic Invasion. All European Countries are part of the NATO (except neutral ones like Ireland and Sweden). All European Countries have problems with the price of oil and food rising.
CaesarAugustus1987 All EU regions are being strangled by over regulation, all EU regions are being dangerously standardised, all EU regions are losing self determination, all EU regions are being harmed by centralised military concepts, all EU regions are being harmed by destruction of agriculture by CAP. What was your point? That human beings all use air, food & heat!
Clearly the peoples of Europe would be best served as separate Nations competing & co-operating as individual Nations.
All European countries are facing slow growth and financial turmoil along with North America.... All European countries are situated in the same position in this planet (Otherwise they wouldn't be called European countries) and therefore share the same geopolitical interests. Don't you that finding a common ground on this issues would be more effective in a world where the IMF predicts that by 2010 there won't be one individual european country in the list of the world's 10 largest economies?
CaesarAugustus1987 The IMF is hardly clever looking at Europe to claim that there won't be a single nation in the top 10. That is easy to show, look at the damage the EU is doing with over regulation & idiot projects. That all the Regions are locked together in a downward spiral to the lowest common denominator is inevitable, independent Nations trading eachother UP exploiting skills of diversity. The EU breeds disloyalty, indollence & corruption as proven. Hope for mankind is in its failure.
In 1945 Europe was the World. A war between european countries was actually a war between major powers.... Today a war between European Countries would be just a ridicolous regional conflict and the US, China, India, Russia and Brazil would see it as we see a war in the Balkans.
CaesarAugustus1987 In 1945 Europe had been broken by an attempt to conquer it by Germany, France, Austria, Italy, Croatia & tacit support of Spain, Portugal much of Holland & bye stander status profiting by Sweden, Ireland & Switzerland. It was appreciated a centralised Government was in so many ways inappropriate that the concept of Union was defeated. Forcing the economically, democratically, agriculturally & socially unsound concept of EU on peoples will inevitably lead to collapse again.
I'm sorry I do not agree with any of the points you're making.. The fact that by 2050 there won't be a single european county in the top 10 depends simply on the fact that there are nations on this planet that have huge territories, huge populations and huge resources. Their territories are bigger than the whole Europe together. Their populations range between half a 500 millions and 1.3 billions and their natural resources are immense.
It's stupid and illogical to want to believe that there is one single hope for a country like France, Germany, Britain or Italy to have their voice heard on the global scenario. And blaming everything on the EU is just stupid non-sense propaganda.
As the Financial Times rightly put it: "Everyone interprets the EU according to their own preconceptions rather than seeing it for the singular institution that it is. the EU's most enthusiastic fans and fiercest critics share the same trait: they all describe what they wish, or fear, to see rather than what really exists." Let me tell you, you are a typical example of that.
CaesarAugustus1987 As someone who was predicting in detail the present economic situation well over 5 years ago I am all too happy to be stereotyped by the Financial Times which has been proved wrong again & again on the issue. That I bring a different clarity of perspective to the discusion backed by fact & experience is not a problem for me & the fact that I believe you are wrong in your propaganda & over simplification is irrefutable. I appreciate the EU spends Millions on silencing reason.
The fact that you are older doesn't give you any "moral legitimacy" through which you can instruct people, however younger, who have different thoughts and beliefs. As a matter of fact, your being trapped in this scheme of a 1940 world instead of realizing that when the surrounding enviroment changes, the schemes on which we found our reasoning must change accordingly.
From this perspective European Integration is not that different from the ACT OF UNION that brought together England and Scotland centuries ago. The idea was: we've been fighting each other for a long time but now we have foreign powers (French Empire, Spanish Empire etc.) threatening us. If we stand together we can face them better. Today England and Scotland are the countries of the European Continent and the French and Spanish Empire are China, Russia, India and the emerging economies.
CaesarAugustus1987 Your understanding of history is unsound. Scotland begged England for amalgamation as the Scottish peoples were starving due to crop failures as a result of volcanic debris from Iceland cutting the hours of sunlight below that needed for grain production. Wales was conquered long ago as it never was a country it was a disperate band of squabbling tribes. Britain is NOT a continental Nation nor does it think thus it is a global trader within the Anglosphere stiffled by the EU
That's exactly what distances me from eurosceptics... their absurd belief that their little countries alone have some weight on a global scale. That's simply ridicolous and when one founds all its ideas on this assumption then the following reasoning must necessarily be wrong.
CaesarAugustus1987 When criticising it is often wise to consider the achievements of those you criticise relative to the failures of the platform on which one stands. To date the EU has not a single achievement anyone of integrity would value relative to the damage, cost & downside risk of its methodology & over burgeoning stature. As a concept it HAS failed on almost all counts. That it has done so in an unaccountable manner with other peoples money is beneath contempt. It is founded on lies.
"To date the EU has not a single achievement anyone of integrity would value relative to the damage, cost & downside risk of its methodology & over burgeoning stature" You're becoming annoying. You keep repeating this without specifying which achievements and costs you are referring to. If you were a person willing to listen to (not necessarily gree with) what others think I could list at list 100 benefits the EU brought about.
CaesarAugustus1987 said "I could list at list 100 benefits the EU brought about"
Clearly we have very different values & aspirations as I totally stand by my statement 'To date the EU has not a single achievement anyone of integrity would value relative to the damage, cost & downside risk of its methodology & over burgeoning stature' which beyond doubt is true - it is just that you seemingly have rather lower standards, expectations & perceptions - or you have swallowed the costly propaganda
Yeah... I just wonder how many times a day you repeat that line. You've become a scaremongering propaganda Robot. That may work when it comes to brainwash sheeps (sadly the majority) who are not able to make up their minds on their own.... but that doesn't work with people like me, whose brains are still functioning (sadly the minority)... You really resemble a guy a knew who passed away a long time ago... His name was Joseph Goebbels? I bet you've heard of him.
CaesarAugustus1987 Indeed I am well aware of Goebbels who as the Minister of propaganda for the aspirant dominant power for Europe as Germany was is now replaced by Maggot Wallstrom as minister of propaganda for the actual conquered EU who has a massively larger budget and a huge staff with many many propaganda offices across the naicent police state - the technique would seem to work both through bribes paid in the troughs on the Gravy Train & the gullibility of the many who believe the lies.
I would take your stances more seriously if you weren't one of those people who criticize everything just because it has the word "EU" in it without even try to understand (not necessarily agree with) how that thing works and which goal is that thing trying to reach.
"Menon (Birmingham University professor) ridicules the idea, beloved of many eurosceptics, that the EU Commission is some kind of bureaucratic monster sucking the lifeblood out of Europe's nation states. The Commission is a complement to the nation state, not a challenge to it, he argues. In total, the EU employs 30,000 officials compared with more than 1m civil servants in the UK alone."
CaesarAugustus1987 You quote Menon, a Government funded theorist, what would you expect him to say? He has all the credibility of the so called scientists funded by government grants to misrepresentat global warming as a method of control & taxation whilst all the independent scientists & climatologists debunk the 'Inconvenient Lies' of Al Gore & his ilk with fact.
Sadly I am self funded & thus unable to maintain the output of facts to refute the EU propaganda & your good self.
"Boris Johnson, the eurosceptic mayor of London, probably controls a bigger administrative budget than José Manuel Barroso, president of the EU Commission. The EU's central achievement, Menon argues, has been the creation of the single market, now considerably bigger than the economy of the US. Though incomplete, it has brought real, practical benefits to thousands of companies and millions of consumers, and sharpened European competitiveness."
CaesarAugustus1987 The cost of the EU bureaucracy alone right across its area of control dwarfs the cost of the EU London region. The single market requires so much regulation there is a huge industry of controllers & a drop off of producers as industry loses markets. The concept has brought no gain to companies merely a huge amount of additional red tape cost that has damaged competitive spirit. Your EU funded propaganda just doesn't stand up to scrutiny in the real world as EU exports diminish
"The creation of a single, EU standard for mobile phones, for example, has led to its adoption in 50 non-European countries. This has given European operators a significant advantage in the global marketplace." French Euroskeptics condemns those politicians (read Sarkozy) who blame the introduction of the euro for increasing prices -- even though the statistics show it has helped reduce inflation".
CaesarAugustus1987 Now that really is significant - rejoice the EU has achieved SOMETHING it completely loused up the competitive structure of the not very important telephone market. Woopie Do - £1,800,000 per hour cost of membership so little girls can chat on mobile phones at a standard rate! Meanwhile the CAP is destroying Europe's ability to feed itself & causing famine in the 3rd. world whilst the EU makes fools of itself with nonsense about global warming & bio fuels. They are a Sick Joke
"rejoice the EU has achieved SOMETHING it completely loused up the competitive structure of the not very important telephone market..." I'm realizing more and more your incapacity of speaking objectively about this issue. The Telephone market was obviously an example as you can find hundreds of them. Two are the possibilities 1) You're not able to tell a thesis from an example used to validate that thesis 2) You manipulate every quote you hear and turn it into your non-sense populist propaganda
In Both cases you are not a "EUROSCEPTIC", who is a person who criticizes the Eu and founds his criticism on a Knowledge on the subject giving it reason why this or that thing doesn't work accordint to him. You are what I call a "EUROPARANOIC" a person that keep on criticising things without knowing anything about them and tries no distort reality in order to create a populist effect and corrupt the masses... There was a guy called Goebbels in the Nazi German Government who used to do the same.
CaesarAugustus1987 I am not for a moment a EUroSceptic as I have not one moment of scepticism as to the harm it is doing; nor am I EUroParanoic as I am not remotely frightened of the EU or the EUro but I do fear for mankind as a result of the clear & obvious damage the EU is doing & that which is inevitable due to its corrupt aims & greed not to mention confrontational nature of the EU. Like many with no experience they are making almost evry mistake possible. Endlessly congratulating themselves
The main reason they were opposing the Constitution and therefore Lisbon is because small countries would have lost VETO power. Not because they were against the EURO, Shengen or because they thought the EU was a conspiracy organization trying to destroy their country. My argument was "Yes but with every country vetoing enlargement cannot take place and I believe that qualified majority is a democratic way of dealing with certain issues.
One day you can be on the side of those who do not agree on that directive, one day you can be on the side of those who want to adopt that directive. The same for every country. So that's a balanced system according to me" They didn't agree with me, I didn't agree with them. Nobody is god and nobody is 100% right or 100% wrong. They voted NO, I voted YES. the NO side won and I respect that. But there was a conversation, there was a debate based on real issues.
Whereas with you British Europaranoic people this cannot happen! You don't want to understand, you don't want to debate, you don't want to know something about that. You just start with your Nigel-Farage-like populist talk screaming out things like "new world order" "military dictatorship" "deprivation of freedom".... that's what Hitler used to say to his people in order to convince them to vote for his NATIONAL-SOCIALIST PARTY, better known as NAZIST PARTY.
CaesarAugustus1987 unlike Hitler the commission & its president were not democratically elected. Though they would seem to seek to emulate him in the similarity of their equivallent 'enabling act' & subsequent disregard for democracy.
So I don't accept to be called "Short-sighted" by a populist scaremonger like you. Develop an Idea which is based on FACTS and ANALYSIS an not on POPULIST DEMAGOGIC PROPAGANDA. Then Learn to converse with and listen to people who have ideas that are different than yours. DEMOCRACY WORKS ONLY IF THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO ARE WELL INFORMED ABOUT THE TOPIC, WHO ARE READY TO DISCUSS THESE TOPICS WITH PEOPLE WHO HAVE DIFFERENT IDEAS and not with FOOLISH REDNECKS SCREAMING LIKE IDIOTS EVERYTIME:
The EU Constitution/Lisbon Treaty must by its own LAWS be RATified by all 27 member regions. So far 19 Nations have surrendered to the RATification that's 19 countries or 5000 politicians!
France with a population of 64,473,140
Netherlands with a population of 16,428,071
& Ireland with a population of 4,339,000
EACH by a majority voted NO
In Democratic terms 85M to 5,000 AGAINST
The EU has no mandate - is it then a dictatorship? Ratifying a RATnest
The same thing with Ireland. Polls show that the great majority of people voted NO because didn't understand what the treaty was about and would vote YES if EU Membership would be questioned. There may be countries where the majority of people are against the Lisbon Treaty, but being Dutch I can assure you that Britain (or better England, because Polls show that the majority of Scots support EU Membership) is the only country where the majority of the people is against the very idea of the EU
EU Treaty is uncostitutional for many reasons. First of all, this treaty was voted in many country by the Parlament, not by the people. Many people do not know what this treaty will lead them, and they're scared they will be ruled by a superpowerstate monster that ignores the needs of people. Second, the Central European Bank is uncostitutional and a new kind of superstate mafia, which raise prize of money and make high inflation on middle class. EU must be protectionist against China goods...
CaesarAugustus1987 Yes you do show just how Britain has been raped by membership of the EU - we can however look forward to liberty & a proud history, rightly proud of the values, discoveries, peace, stability, Justice & so much more we gave the world before those we had helped & aided like jackals turned & bit the hand that helped it. How ashamed you must be and it shows in your vitriolic abuse. Understandably we have less fear of our friends around the world and the language we gave the world.
Yes yes... keep on believing this stuff... You british people are incredible. The world have move forward, the international monetary fund forecasts that by 2050 the list of countries by economy's size will be 1. China 2. India 3. US. 4. Russia 5. Brasil 6. Japan 7. Mexico 8. Germany (before it get busted by some other emerging economy) and you still believe the pathetic voice of your little island still counts something??
The only ones you're useful to are the americans because when you send your boys to Iraq and let them die so that Mr. Bush can take all the oil before Russia and China get there, they can send some troops less and accordingly lower the cost of the mission. I find countries like Germany, France and Spain prouder than the UK when they said to Mr Bush: we don't agree with your war, I'm sorry, we're not coming whereas Britain HAD to send some troops so that it could remain America's favourite pet.
Europe is an opportunity for countries to keep their sovereignty but to cooperate on the same geopolitical interests they have (they all depend on Russia by gas, they are all subjected to mass immigration, they all face the threat of terrorism, they all face high inflation and slow growth, they all have worker's rights and face threats from China becoming the world's first economy by kicking the hell out of its workers, they are all Christian and face a threath by islamic extremism etc. etc.)
CaesarAugustus1987 could you try to be rather more adult & stop showing off with foul language which debases your credibility. 'bullshits about democratic answerability' no accounts for 13 years!! 'loss of sovereignty' Proposed EU Foreign Minister etc. imposed Corpus Juris replacing Justice, ECJ etc!!! 'military regime' Rapid Reaction Force, EUroPol etc!! 'scaremongering propaganda' NO FACT which should scare YOU too!! Yes we are the losers it costs us £1,800,000 per hour & demeans our values.
What an arsehole that David Milliband is. He stands there, keeping a straight face, and talks about the 'democratic right of the British people'. Where was OUR democratic right for a vote on the treaty (constitution)?
I am NOT a violent man, but I truly believe death is too good for these traitors, these Nazis.
Yet again we note that a pro EU supporter in his anger at being confronted by the truth resorts to abuse, obscenity and insult like a small child having a tantrum. One can be relatively certain that had the Irish, French & Dutch voters known how offensive the YES supporters were before the vote the NO VOTE would have been notably higher. Whether the scum that has risen to the top of the French septic tank or those that float in Britain or Ireland clearly they are angry at democracy & in denial
They are called PARLIAMENTARY ELECTIONS because you vote for the PARTY... they party that gets MAJORITY forms the government. The leader of the party (e.g. Cameron) appoints the ministers AND THE COMMISSIONER. Result? Mandelson is as answerable as Darling. the French commissioner is as answerable as the french minister of Agriculture. the italian commissioner is as answerable as the italian minister of Defence. plus every member state has a commissioner.
That's called representative democracy. if you don't like the EU just say: I DON'T WANT TO BE IN THE EU BECAUSE I DON'T WANT TO GIVE MONEY TO POLAND AND SLOVAKIA AND HELP THIS COUNTRIES TO DEVELOP SO THAT WE CAN CREATE A WEALTHY MARKET ALL OVER THE CONTINENT WHERE EVERY COMPANY FROM EVERY COUNTRY CAN INVEST FREELY (Take your own Vodafone). In this case I would understand your arrogant point ad accept it. But please stop talking about democratic bullshits.
I'm dutch, I voted YES to the EU Constitution. many of my friends voted NO but they all support EU Membership, the EURO and Shengen an they would never vote for leaving the EU or the EURO. The same with the French and the Irish. So you british idiots must stick your anti-EU sentiments in your ass, become the 51 fucking state of america and leave us alone.
CaesarAugustus1987 Are all the Dutch who support membership of the EU as foul mouthed, ignorant, ill mannered and offensive as you? Do they all have an inability to communicate intelligently in a civilised manner or is this the real aim of the EU to create a dumbed down society with little more to offer than aggression to support it being bereft of integrity, accountability or morality!
To understand the EU why not watch youtubeDOTcom / watch?v=xnMtc_QJ4-E it will help you understand the aims of the EU & those who are the minority pro group who welcome corruption, greed, centralisation and self enrichment. It makes it entirely understandable why Politicians are in favour & out of step with the peoples where France, Holland & Ireland VOTED NO to the Constitution now renamed Lisbon Treaty & note EU Commissioners have less democratic mandate than Mugabe NO ONE EVER voted for them!
An interesting thought from Maggot Wallstrom (EU Minister of Propaganda) Kemppinem head of the EU London enforcement offices 'WE did not lose one single referendum.' (This may suggest that the EC considers itself blameless re: Ireland) The other, a peach, reads: 'Yes is yes but no is unfortunate.' It was of course the ghastly Abba clone with her metronomic drone & ill kept roots who is supposedly responsible for communications! Well she failed to communicate in Ireland. Not even understanding NO
jupiterjjrm PLEASE HELP copy comments you agree with and post them on all the similar sites ;-) We need to distribute the truth as widely as we can so that people will understand the EU is a scam supported by those with their snouts in the troughs - most of whom were NEVER elected.
The disconnect between politicians & the people is huge & growing & if we do not fix this problem soon it will lead to war. The EU MUST be gently dismantled if mankind want peace in the future. Democratic VOTE WAS NO
just so you know dumbass, the commissioners (including the president) are elected by governments of member states. the British commissioner, Mandelson, is as elected as one of your ministers is. You don't elected every minister directly, do you? You vote for a Party. The party gains majority, the leader of the party forms a government where he is the PM and appoints ministers. the PM and the ministers appoint the commissioner. If commissioners are unelected, so are your ministers.
CaesarAugustus1987 As I said with less democracy than Mugabe. Mugabe was elected by the peoples of his Country but his mandate is ended - The EU Commission was NEVER ELECTED & is NOT answerable to the electorate! How any Sovereign State selects its representatives, within certain peramaters, is of no concern of those of other Countries. The EU has no meaningful democracy & that IS my business as being unfortunately in a vassal region the obscene supra national scam imposes itself undemocraticly
alright... then if the commissioners are not answerable to the electorate neither is your minister of finance, your minister of education, your minister of foreign affairs, defence etc... the british commissioner is appointed by the government you elected and so are the commissioners appointed by other countries... Mandelson is not less answearble than Darling.... when you vote for parliamentary election do you vote for every freaking minister of the british government??? NO!!
CaesarAugustus1987 Mostly ignored as yet again you are incapable of civil discussion.
British Ministers ARE elected British Politicians acting politically throughBritish Government structure.
Commissioners are unelected mostly foreigners acting as executive civil servants with no elected mandate.
The role of a Commissioner and their appointment compares with neither a British Minister or a civil servant. In fact they have a greater similarity to a Politbureau member in the USSR.
your brain and those of fool eurosceptics like you must be dismantled. You keep on talking about the people but you have to remember that there are also people who support EU integration and we're gonna kick your motherfucker eurosceptics ass.
CaesarAugustus1987 I note you are too stupid not to utterly demean any credibility you may have had by resorting to obscenity, abuse & revealing the foul workings of yet another thwarted pro EU supporter. Indeed there are some who support membership of the dishonest, corrupt, undemocratic, centralised gravy train (mainly those who feed in its troughs!) Yet in the Countries where a referendum was conducted showed that a majority voted NO in France, Holland & Ireland others were denied democracy!
I've study EU Law and there is absolutely no lack of democratic accountability plus the new treaty the Irish Rejected (by the way polls show that 90% of the people who rejected the treaties in Ireland, France and Holland wouldn't reject EU Membership, Anti-EU sentiments are only a british thing.) would have improved democratic accountability by giving more power to the EU parliament that you moron elect and by giving more power to national parliaments to block EU legislation.
CaesarAugustus1987 seems you learned little in your law studies if that is your understanding of the EU's near total democratic deficit nor it seems did you learn that to be legal one needs to account for other people's money!
It is unfortunate that you destroy your own arguments by using insult, obscenity & abuse like a child in a tantrum.
I'm not against people who say that don't like the EU because they say "I don't want to have anything to do with foreigners from other fucking nations or I don't want to give money to eastern europe". They are coherent. But what I cannot accept is people inventing bullshits about democratic answerability, loss of sovereignty, military regime and other pieces of scaremongering propaganda like this. You're just losers who are afraid to say what you really believe:
WHICH IS, YOU DON'T GIVE A FUCK ABOUT HELPING EASTERN EUROPE AND YOU PREFER HAVING THE AMERICANS, RUSSIANS AND CHINESE DECIDING EVERYTHING FOR YOU INSTEAD OF COOPERATION AND DECIDING TOGETHER WITH OTHER COUNTRIES THAT SHARE THE SAME GEOPOLITICAL INTERESTS. These are THE TRUE EUROSCEPTIC with whom I don't agree but of whom I respect ideas. Whereas propaganda scaremongers like this are idiots who do not deserve to be listened to.
CaesarAugustus1987 Though I may easily be able to discredit the arguments logically put by the intelligent proponents of EU - it is barely worth the effort responding to the offensive, foul mouthed, abusive, ill mannered and ill informed tantrums of those who can not reason in a civilised manner.
Sadly people are more easily affected by scaremongering propaganda like the one you are doing... That's how Hitler and Mussolini came to power... by scaring the hell out people inventing bullshits and making them believe that was true. This explains how the No vote won in Ireland: the No campaign started inventing things about abortion, european military union, or tax harmonisation (I'VE STUDIED THE TREATY, UNLIKE YOU, AND THESE THINGS ARE NOT PRESENT AT ALL). That's all.
CaesarAugustus1987 Again your studies seem to have let you down - I suggest you get someone of greater wisdom & experience of life to try to clarify the Treaty to you. ECB subsumed Politically, EUCouncil debased to a mere institution (read the rules that are to be applied to institutions of the EU). ECOFOR, EUroPol & Rapid Reaction Force are what if not a EU Military Union? Standardised taxation is what if not tax harmonisation? ECB Politicised! Do try to understand what you read in treaties.
CaesarAugustus1987 NO neither Hitler nor Mussolini came to power as you claim. Yet again like your study of law & your study of treaties it would seem your study of history has failed you also. As a point of interest in extensive exposure to the Irish NO campaign & a great deal of reading & communication never ONCE did I hear an Irishman raise the issue of abortion - It was first notably raised by Denis McShane an Anglo Polish British Politician supporting the Yes Campaign then YES claimed it
My only desire now is seeing the British Economy collapsing.... and it will happen my dear fucking Greg260640283, it will happen... actually it is happening. Then it will be the EU that will kick Britain out because of its incompatibility with EU economic standards. So don't you worry, you're on your way out.
CaesarAugustus1987 Please communicate like an adult without obscenity. You are right our politician's support of the EU has cost us dearly & £1,800,000 per hour cost of EU membership has been catastrophic. To stand with dignity, integrity, morality & values envied by the world in abject povert is to me of greater value than prostitution of my Country to the corruption, dishonesty, lack of dignity & self respect or the morally bankrupt EU. To die on ones feet is better than to live on ones knees!
Of course America keeps on saying: Britain is our best ally, we are brothers and b.s. like that... It is covenient to them having little Britain sending more troops than it can everytime that they must invade some poor desperate country. Again, I'm DUTCH, I live here, you do not know anything about Holland. We are not like YOU, We are not ANTI-EUROPEAN. 90% of the people who voted NO here are not against EU membership, Shengen and the EURO.
People in Spain voted YES to the EU CONSTITUTION by a 70% Majority... Polls show that people in Italy, Portugal, Greece, Germany and several parts of Eastern Europe would vote YES. France, Holland, Ireland and Scandinavian countries would vote NO to LISBON but would vote YES to EU MEMBERSHIP. England is the only place in Europe where people would vote NO to EU MEMBERSHIP... So, again, you better leave us alone and go back sucking your American Master big dick.
Plus in Europe that is no country that is enormously more powerful than the others (a siuation like North America with the USA dictating on Canada): There are Germany, UK and France balancing themselves... Italy and Spain balancing themselves, small countries safeguarding their own interesting uniting if big ones try to act as bullies... It's a perfect situation for countries with the same interests to cooperate without losing their sovreignty and by keeping their identiy.
If European Cooperation fails than YES we well be enslaved and we will lose our freedom... because global balances will be decided by the big 4: CHINA, INDIA, US and RUSSIA (and at one point BRAZIL) whereas individual european countries will just have to comply with what these giants have decided.
I love my country and it's because I love my country that I support European Integration... because only in Europe my country can at the same time remain sovreign and be safe from (real) bullies which are countries with population of more than 500 million people and huge economies that are keeping on growing not to talk about resources.
European Countries have to choices: cooperate or die. And you fool britis eurosceptics will discover it to your own expenses. Adieu, I've nothing more to share with arrogant, short-sighted imperialist-wanna-be idiots like you.
Britain will finally be a ridicolous island runned by Americans, Arabs, Russians and Chinese.... they prefer being submitted by superpowers than cooperate with countries of their size and with the same geographical position (other than historical ties). So that's the freedom you're talking about? Russkies, Yankees, Chings, Indians and Muslims feeding you? COOL! That's an interesting Idea of freedom and democracy.
AlanPartridge41M It is unfair to condemn either or both of the Millipied brothers for the fact that their Polish Jewish Father, to whom we gave sucour & sanctuary betrayed our trust espousing Marxism in his British State funded job. That they have turned out revolting is hardly surprising but revolting they are with clearly no interest in these United Kingdoms, liberty, Justice or the values of Britain.
It is clear whenever one hears Maggot Walstrom she is either mad, utterly stupid or just evil. Just what part of NO do these arrogant, self interested, corrupt & dishonest people not understand. Did you not
"We must as your leaders.." She does not even understand just how
loathed they are NOT leaders but unelected REPRESENTATIVES. These
Bast*rds in their self important greed are moving us step by step to
famine, war and 200,000,000 deaths in persuit of their personal
I note the French Sarkozy "The Irish are bloody fools," he told aides. "They have been stuffing their faces at Europe's expense for years and now they dump us in the s***." I gather the Irish politicians to keep their snouts in the trough have been told to Lobotomise the Irish so that they vote YES in a new referendum. The EU believes it can bully, bribe & threaten Ireland they knew the French & Dutch meant NO when they voted & won't be bullied. Of course Ireland was too stupid to understand!
How can so many be controlled, manipulated and conned by such a small, unelected minority on BOTH sides of the pond, for so long? The EU is as democratically elected as Kim Jong-il. Three nations said NO to the "Lisbon Treaty"! Bottom line democracy is one man, one vote. So if you want my vote, aks me. If you want my money, ask me. If you claim to uphold my civil Liberties, prove it by asking me. The EU cannot do so. Instead, it has declared war on Liberty and Democracy. Quite similar to the USA
The Germans are itching to have a cohesive military under the EU to move towards the Middle East as soon as possible. Don't give them the opportunity and oppose the EU "empire" - as Barroso calls it.
More people turned out for this vote than for the Nice vote.
Since we were denied democratic process in my country, the Irish vote was a nice birthday present. Politicians should remain accountable to the people, even after they are voted into office. This is one of the principles the Irish conveyed. I hope the EU-Parl remains accountable for its own rules of ratification after this.
The idea of a two speed Europe is an older idea. Here, it now sounds like a good idea. The progress of the European project must continue and the reforms must be put into place, especially with regard to European defense.
What do you think will happen if Declan Ganley was found to have gotten his money from the CIA?
It is well known that the CIA funds elections so that outcomes suit US interests. Declan Ganley also surrounds himself with Americans including a retired American military officer.
A "no" vote against the Lisbon Treaty is a "yes" vote for the continuance of America domination over Europe.
You've got to be kidding me? Do you have any idea how oppressive the EU will be in regard to individual rights? Do yourself a favor and read all you can about Corpus Juris.
Democracy? Just listen to sarkozy say that they'll just change the rules in order to ratify the treaty! And, on that note, ask yourself why not ONE citizen was allowed to VOTE, with the exception of IRELAND.
Luxembourg Prime Minister Jean-Claude Juncker said: "Of course there will be transfers of sovereignty. But would I be intelligent to draw the attention of public opinion to this fact?"
If the EU is to have any credibility at all then they much abandon this treaty. All 27 countries had to ratify it and the Irish have said no, end of story. If they try to ignore the wishes of the people, then they should all be forced to resign.
We have gone through this before with both the Maastricht and Nice treaties.
It is encouraging to see that Europe's leaders are exercising cool heads and allowing the Lisbon Treaty to continue.
"The people" through their elected leaders in 18 other member states have ratified the Treaty.
Ireland voted for Ireland - and not the rest of Europe! It is a tyranny of the minority of Irish "no" voters against the millions more in 18 other Member States and THIS in undemocratic!
"Tyranny of the minority of Irish" I think you need to wake up. Millions of people are overjoyed at this result especially when their own Governments refused to allow their own people to vote on it. At least Irealnd is still a democracy my friend and long may it continue. Oh and the only one who seems to be in a minority is you.
What we should be alarmed at is the misrepresentation of the word "democracy."
"Democracy" IS NOT about just referendums, but that is DIRECT democracy, there is as RESRESENATIVE democracy too, and it too is "democracy!"
so, people want to go back to the dark past when power politics and bloody wars reigned in Europe? The public simply cannot be informed enough to vote on a 250 page treaty. That is what elected parliments are for...
Over and over again the same propaganda. The US government ratifies treaties within the limited range of the power delegated to it (the US government) by the sovereign entity, the US people.
In this regard, in democracy, no goverment has the power to transfer the sovereignty which belongs exclusively to We the People.
I have recalled this very basic democratic principle to you but I guess you are much more interested in spreading your propaganda than sticking to facts.
The EU politicians have DENIED the people in their countries the right to vote on the Lisbon treaty. And when the irish people said NO, they try to ignore them.
EUamerican, I would agree that referendums are not needed in every question. However, in the case of EU Federation the politicians are clearly NOT in accordance with the majority of "normal" people - and they know it!
The Federational Empire has failed in EVERY known case throughout history: Roman Empire, Ottoman Empire, Habsburg Empire, Yogoslavia, USSR, Colonial Empires to mention but a few (with different economical and religious basis).
Torchmark PLEASE HELP - copy comments you agree with and post them on all the similar sites ;-) We need to distribute the truth as widely as we can so that people will understand the EU is a scam supported by those with their snouts in the troughs - most of whom were NEVER elected.
The disconnect between politicians & the people is huge & growing & if we do not fix this problem soon it will lead to war. The EU MUST be gently dismantled if mankind want peace in the future. Democratic VOTE WAS NO
'Countries that have no reservations'? How about the make a distinction between people and governments? I think that the Council and Commission have really shown their true colours in the contempt they have shown democratic process and sovereign nations
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yyeeeessss...
GO FUCK YOURSELVES ANTI EU LUNATICS!
urfadder 2 years ago
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NoHoeArmy 2 years ago
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NO SIDE: Shinners, Ganley, Socialists, Coir, Eirigi, UKIP, Le Pen, BNP.
YES SIDE: all international chambers of commerce, 3 main political parties, IFA, IBEC, SIPTU, ICTU, most major trade unions, Ryanair, Intel, Microsoft.
Who you going to trust?
urfadder 2 years ago
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Ireland, the ONLY country in europe that has a vote on this!
if u vote yes, u have voted to change your CONSTITUTION.
i think this is the REALLY FUNNY PART.
if u vote yes, you have voted TO (NEVER) VOTE AGAIN.
THINK OF ALL THE IRISH PPL THAT HAVE DIED FIGHTING FOR OUR COUNTRY.
Don't be a TRAITOR to our COUNTRY and
VOTE NO PLEASE.
THANK YOU IRELAND.
mtst71 2 years ago
Britain makes me physically suck - How a country can be so ignorant and small mided is beyond me. The Government gets away with extraditing innocent British Citizens to the US but it can't get away with trying to integrate more with Europe?! Never has an entire country been such a farce.
azz578 2 years ago
we irish know how to keep ye on ye're toes :)
Crowley483 2 years ago
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Ireland commissioner says most EU countries would reject Lisbon Treaty
Ireland's EU Commissioner, Charlie McCreevy, has conceded that voters in most EU countries would reject the stalled Lisbon Treaty.
======================
Mr McCreevy, the internal market commissioner, said that if the treaty had been put to a public vote, it would have been rejected by 95 per cent of the 27 member states.
WeAreTheBritish 2 years ago
The EU isn't undemoratic at all. By the lisbon treaty there will be more democrazy within the EU and the countries have the possibilties to leave it so if all people are against it ...as some of u say...you can make a party to leave the EU pretty simple or? and you vote your representitives in the EU so what's undemocratic here? It's just as undemoratic as your national states....Vote YES to lisbon treaty for a more powerful and free europe
Thexxmarcoxx 2 years ago
You are either stoned or retarded. The EU is intentionally DESIGNED to be undemocratic. I guess you can call it anything you want but it doesn't make it anything other than an autocracy.
FrankinHolland 2 years ago
Please vote NO to the Lisbon Constitution. It is not good enough to have a European Constitution that reads like a phone book and that only the Irish citizens get to vote on. Democracy is in the hands of the Irish people. Voting no to Lisbon will not change the economic situation for the better or the worse. This is a tactic being used by the Government and certain media with vested interests in a yes vote to distract from the actual content of the Treaty. Please do not be fooled, vote NO.
No1GorgeousLady 2 years ago 2
It might help the multinationals in Ireland which is probably why they support it but remember they care nothing about the Irish people or your future.
FrankinHolland 2 years ago
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I will certainly be voting NO this time. By ignoring our previous no vote, it shows what exactly the EU thinks of Democracy. Also the guarantees promised to us Irish are not even legally binding. I do not trust Sarkozy & co. by any means and will certainly be voting NO.
ANTONELIUSMCGREGOR 2 years ago
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! Im sick of this anti Europe bullshit! Put those British euroceptics without beer for a couple of days, to see if they start to think like intelligent people!! The EU a united, free, democratic peaceful, beautiful, lovely, Europe,- is for the best interests of the UK
kangurupt 2 years ago
Read the Lisbon Treaty before you speak again, ever.
Also, do you really think its a good idea to centralize that much power on such a large scale? Without allowing the people of alot of those countries to vote?
That the lisbon treaty is self amending and doesnt need to consult any individual government to do it!
I'm all for a united eu, but look at what you are allowing. If all fuzzy nice people are in power, it works great, but what if there isnt? we would be screwed.
Use some sense.
Archivian01 2 years ago 3
I dont see any problem with EU power if his power is a democratic one!
Only united Europe can aspire to be something relevant in the XXI century! No country alone even the biggest Europeans countries like the Uk or Germany can shoulder with China, Russia, Brasil or India ..
Suport our Union and improve her is the best way to defend the best interest s of the europeans
kangurupt 2 years ago
Well thats the thing about the Lisbon Treaty, it would be democratic, but essentially 4 countries can decide the fate of every other country.
But that doesnt matter, coz they could make it not democratic without a vote from any sovereign governments.
I agree that an economic and military cooperation is needed against other super powers. But this really is not the way to go.
At least in the way they are trying to do it.
Its like their trying to rush it or something.
Archivian01 2 years ago
HAHAHA! You don't have a chance. You will be a muslim dictatorship by 2050. First the EU will gut any semblance of democracy then your muslim majority will slowly install Sharia. Bye Bye europe!
FrankinHolland 2 years ago
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kangurupt 2 years ago
I think its absolutely disgusting how these unelected hypocritical idiots can place laws on all these countries without a referendum to allow the people of each individual country to have there say on how they would want to live their lives.
To the politicians its about money & power but for the people of a certain country its about tradition, identity & love.
I am disgusted how the people have been treated by the this treaty.
LET THE PEOPLE SPEAK!!!!!!
ZeusZol0 2 years ago 2
The Lisbon Treaty is in violation of the United Nations International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights and therefore ilegal :
Article 1 : All peoples have the right to self-determination. By virtue of that right they freely determine their political status and freely pursue their economic and cultural development.
The European Arrest Warrant is also in violation of the same Covernant ( Article 9).
Restore justice and true democracy, vote EU-sceptic in June's European elections.
Spenner56 2 years ago 2
CaesarAugustus Ireland has paid a heavy price for the money that it was given-Part of the deal to enter the EEC in73 was that we surrender our claim to our territorial waters, which our useless politicians at the time agreed to - we have a larger coast than Iceland and their fishing industry is worth 3bn PA - our joining cost includes the loss of boatbuilding & fish processing industries too.
In 2002 we dismantled our sugar industry and now import all of our sugar fr germany/france(EU directive)
scraggymess 3 years ago 3
I wonder how Ireland´s youth will feel when drafted into a European Army by the un-elected Council of Europe ?
The Lisbon Treaty include the instruction that all states (including Ireland) :"shall undertake progressively to improve their military capabilities" ?
AND if Ireland´s youth protest on the streets...the DEATH PENALTY will apply "rioting,civil upheaval and during war"(as stated in a FOOTNOTE in the European Charter)is a capital crime!
Good luck kids !
Vote NO (again) to Lisbon.
Spenner56 3 years ago
If the Poles can put American missiles in their back yard and aim them at Russia, what does that say of the EU? Who wants to be part of another Pope inspired-war on secular Russia? The EU is a farce if the Poles are allowed unilaterally to behave in this manner... If the Poles are in, it is time to get out! The EU and the Poles has now given 'reason' to the Irish vote.Idiots.
sebreathnach 3 years ago
A clear measure of the corruption & dishonesty of the entire EU project is that these obscenely over funded parasites: commissioners, MEPs, apparatchiks so obviously do not understand morality or decency - Note this publicity clip from EUXTV is titled: 'Lisbon Treaty rejection: Foreign Ministers discuss crisis' so it is clear that in the eyes of the corrupt self serving EU a DEMOCRATIC statement of the truth that does not support their scam is a CRISIS! It says it all! The EU has no legitimacy
Greg260146 3 years ago 2
fight the NWO !!!!! Thank you Ireland !!
Blessings from the USA
narfer121 3 years ago
Margot Wallstroem would not say a peace of shit. she LOBBOTOMY IN sWEDEN IN AVDELNING 67 INTO INVALIDITY AND DEATH SEVERAL THOUSAND CRITIAL TO SWEDISH FASCIST REGIME CITIZENS A YEAR!!! (pls read about tvångsbehandling and tvångsomhändertagande and their results in Swedish newspapper Dagens MEdicine, nr 47 from 2007l, article from Magnus Häröd!) newfascistical SHAME, Margot!!!
jjamesbondoviza 3 years ago
Lisbon-documentary-makers lobbotomy with neuroleptica in EUs own thousand of secret hospitals innocent EU-citizens, wich are critical to EU-regime of today. those people loose their nerve system and are put into invalide chairs to the rest of their lives. THIS IS EU-PARLAMENTS GENOCIDE- This happens in Sweden in Avdelning 67 (read pls newspapper Dagens Medicin, nr 47, 2007)!
jjamesbondoviza 3 years ago
Dear Europe:
If you ignore Ireland's vote on the Lisbon Treaty, next time I am over there, I don't want to hear any more about the 2000 US Election being bogus and how we don't honor the people's vote.
Well done Ireland!
-1/300,000,000th of America
StraightKyBourbon 3 years ago
lisbon treaty realy sucks.thank you ireland!
laxeron84 3 years ago
EU is a total non-sense, forcing Europeans into unnatural denial of their cultures, manufacturing, etc. It is totally undemocratic and a major step back in Europe's history. I am glad someone had the guts to say it loud. I am proud of Irish just as I am proud of Czechs for that matter.
janib007 3 years ago
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The treaty was deliberately made hard to understand so the corrupt, appointed bureaucrats, domininated by the french and germans, would have, at their finger tips a European empire.(remind u of somthing from previous centries).
newmanwuk 3 years ago 2
ramonnl We already have a two speed EU where the politicians, crooks, liars, cheats, lobbyists & parasites are moving backwards into some sort of arcane self serving, self enriching scam whilst the informed, forward seeing, fundamentally honest people want self determination, democracy, liberty, independence and sovereignty with dignity & justice for their peoples and the future. Intelligent informed thinking people do NOT want centralised corruption and a neo dictatorship destroying their lives
Greg260146 3 years ago
Two speed europe is a good idea.
that way we can go on without the countries agains us and plotting with the enemy.
ramonnl 3 years ago
To take the figures & provide the FACTS
The EU Constitution/Lisbon Treaty must by its own LAWS be RATified by all 27 member regions. So far 19 Nations have surrendered to the RATification that's 19 countries or 5000 politicians!
France with a population of 64,473,140
Netherlands with a population of 16,428,071
& Ireland with a population of 4,339,000
EACH by a majority voted NO
In Democratic terms 85M to 5,000 AGAINST
The EU has no mandate - is it then a dictatorship? Ratifying a RATnest
Greg260146 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 In 500 characters I regret I can not give you the full details tou counter the many Billions pent by the EU on propaganda. The facts & comments I put forward are not populist but popular if you truelly hope the peoples of EUrope will survive the provable damage & risks that are a result of the EU. Clearly the EU is suppressing democracy with its own commissioners talking of 'The post democratic era'! To date the EU has absolutely no achievement that justifies its costs NONE.
Greg260146 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 More foolish conclusions as I am not a EUkip member but yes I assure you I am determined to scaremonger as I am scared by what the EU is doing and its aims - Perhaps having travelled widely over 60 years & almost 60 Countries PERHAPS I can offer an opinion with more insight of the dangers the EU is marching us into - eg. for the first time in history the peoples of EUrope can no longer feed themselves & HAVE TO import, consider the near total destruction of fisheries by the EU
Greg260146 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 your endless emphasis on money has no resonance to me, it is not a value it is just worthless material gain. Yes of course needed but not to be worshipped, I value health andf smiles around me far beyond money.The EU with all its watdogs, guard dogs & regulation, endless laws but little justice, massive bribes from the public purse to BUY support. Don't regulate & stabilise artificially as the EU does, permit Nations & communities to interact that balances society NOT law.
Greg260146 3 years ago
MEP = Massively Expensive Parasite. Since the EU is an obscene & corrupt centralised construct engineered for the benefit of NWO the politicians, who have all but no democratic input as all is decided by the unelected commission & with over 3,000 executive committees with NO democratic input, NO respect for democracy, several known criminals on the commission & NO valid accounts for 13 years it is a matter of paying adequate bribes for the self selected MEPs to act as salesmen. EU has NO merit
Greg260146 3 years ago
4 months after the EU scam enquiry ONLY Tom Wise EUkip MEP has been arrested. 5,000 Politicians voted for their gravy train to keep rolling but 85,000,000 citizens voted to start to dismantle it! Guess who will fiddle it to win & whose money they are stealing!
Twice fired unelected morgage fraudster & Bilderberg plennary member Peter Mandelson on Newsnight said, "We have to find a way to repair the damage caused by the Irish Referendum." The damage DEMOCRACY caused to threaten their gravy train
Greg260146 3 years ago
...and give job to the people, not to Chinese or corean workers on the other side of the planet.
goodsoninc 3 years ago
I'm Dutch... I just love Rome and Roman History :D... Anyway the EU cannot work as long as we have Britain in it. KICK EM OUT.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
Well, I think you see EU as a new kind of federal superstate on the model of former Roman Empire. That's quite evident. Anyway, I'm against this kind of tricky and hidden politic. I think UK will join to EU. Europe needs UK as UK needs Europe. Trust me.
goodsoninc 3 years ago
No, you cannot understand... you're from Italy, a country that, such as Spain (who voted YES to the constitution by 70%) Portugal, Greece, and other countries from Soutern Europe are pro-european and don't have anti-EU movements. You like the Idea of European integration. In Britain 80% of the people don't want the EU, hate other european countries and only want to cooperate with America. That's why I think Britain should leave... it would be better for them and for us.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
When I think to Europe, to be honest, I think to France and Germany. Other country are just satellites to this ancient and strong union. I'm for a free mediterrean union-like german hansa-for a free trade zone in the mediterrean including Spain, Italy, Greece, Tunisia, Algeria, Marocco, Turkey, Egypt and Israel. The germans have always brought war and disorders, like the french. I hate those kind of Europe. I'm from Sicily, so you can understand my point of view.
goodsoninc 3 years ago
goodsoninc, NO I cannot understand you. To me Germany and France brought some of the best names in science and culture. Imperialists are to be found everywhere in Europe: Greece, Italy, Russia, Nordic Countries (Wikings), Great Britain. Napoleon was from Corsica, Stalin was from Georgia. Sicily brought the Mafioso! (sorry, that wasnt nice, but I had to make a point).
All European Countries has brought something good at some bad.
But I am 100% pro free trade.
rmir2 3 years ago
Well,you're quite shallow. Mafia in southern Italy was born after Unity of Italy, an hidden agreement between great landowners from south and great busineemen and great contractors from north with the help of the army and freemason to keep down the poor farmers and keep a feudalistic economy in the south. Mafia is a part of italian state, not a enemy of italian state. But Mafia works against sicily and for north italy benefits. You have to learn more about mafia. Go back to school
goodsoninc 3 years ago
Mafia was brought to Sicily from northern Italy, trust me. Please learn more about real history of italian unity. We are innocent, we are not mafiosi, but for their faults they must blame us as mafiosi. Trust me. Please take a look on the web on the book "The force of destiny" by professor Christopher Duggan (an englishman, by the way).
goodsoninc 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 what a very limited perspective you have & with so little vision, bounded it would seem by fear & anger. Your view is too 'sloppy' you confuse Europe with EU, independence with freedom, law with Justice, hope with ambition and quite clearly greed with success.
The EU has brought NOTHING of value to man which justifies the costs, damage, risks & corruption. NATO forced peace on Europe which was broken by the EU. National competition brought developement not EU stagnation.
Greg260146 3 years ago
costs, damage, risks and corruption? By "COST" you mean the 8 billion euros that the EU gave to Ireland from 1994 to 2000? By "DAMAGE" you mean all the metros, train stations, roads that the EU is cofinancing in Eeastern Europe. Go to Warsaw and take a look at every "WORK in PROGRESS" Panel: It says "This is a project 50% financed by the European Union".
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 The EU has indeed paid Ireland 40bn since 1973.90%of what has been paid has been paid to farmers through CAP. Irish farmers are now paid not to farm! A drive through the country will show how much unused land we have, Our Farmers regularly throw away millions of gallons of milk because of EU quotas yet we import 90% of our yoghurt from Germany, Our fisherman are paid to surrender their quotas yet french/spanish trawlers plunder our coasts & we import 80% of our fish.
scraggymess 3 years ago
By RISK You mean the euro after having entered which Italy, Greece and Portugal was finally compelled to meet stability criteria and start lowering their public debt whose increase by their reckless governments was making them become Argentina 1, 2 and 3? By "CORRUPTION" you mean the European Court of Justice sanctioning Italy because its TV Market is totally monopolized by one Media-Mogul called Berlusconi that happens to be Italy's Prime Minister and who uses his televisions to distortreality?
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 RISK has little to do with money but much to do with values, liberty & moral values.
Whether Italy wishes to be ruled by electing a crook is absolutely none of my business nor yours.
The EU offers nothing of merit to mankind but much by way of bribes from the public purs4e for politicians & their parasites.
The EU has no merit to measure against the damage & costs. The differences BETWEEN Nations provides the incentives & competition that strengthens & regenerates peoples.
Greg260146 3 years ago
The EU is working as a "NEW MARSHALL PLAN" for Eastern European Countries helping them to develop. It is working as "WATCHDOG" for corrupted countries like Italy sanctioning them every time that they don't respect free-market rules or use public money to save companies that in the market would have already went bankrupt. It is working as a Financial Stabilizer for countries who are too lazy to purse strong reform in public finance and that recklessly increase DEBT and PUBLIC EXPENDITURE
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
I think the short-sighted one is you not me. You're one of those UKIP scaremongers who criticize everything that has the word EU in it without even knowing why, who do not accept to listen to (not necessarily agree with) other peoples' ideas, who call a person FASCIST or COMMUNIST (just so you know, there's a big difference between the two) only because he supports european integration. You're not eurosceptic, you're europaranoic, which is quite different.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
Everytime that I read your comments and everytime that I watch your videos there is not one single thing you say which is based on DATA, FACTS, ANALYSIS, THINKING... There is only some fool illogically connecting words like INDEPENDENCE - CORRUPTION - CONSPIRACY - DEMOCRACY and who just doesn't manage to make a sense out of the entire speech. With your populist talk (the same one used by Hitler and Mussolini to win support of the people) are only killing democracy, not helping it.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
I would like to listen to and understand your position. I live in the Netherlands, a country that has rejected the EU constitution and I know a lot of people that can be called Eurosceptic because they have real motives on which they base their ideas. For example I can assure you that 80% of no voters here are not against the EU.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 Primarily I am not against the EU but against being a member! I believe free from being shackled to a corpse in the making Britain can offer the peoples of Europe a hope & route to the future. Europe has had many attempts to create a centralised, undemocratic, militarised, supra national control. The strength of Europe in resisting famine & disaster has been by very different Nations with different values competing & co-operating in independent strength. Maintain the gene pool
Greg260146 3 years ago
All European countries depend on Russia by GAS. All European countries are subject to Mass Immigration. All European countries have China as main importer. All European countries are threaneted by terrorism. All European countries are trying so hard to preserve their Christian Identity from the Islamic Invasion. All European Countries are part of the NATO (except neutral ones like Ireland and Sweden). All European Countries have problems with the price of oil and food rising.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 All EU regions are being strangled by over regulation, all EU regions are being dangerously standardised, all EU regions are losing self determination, all EU regions are being harmed by centralised military concepts, all EU regions are being harmed by destruction of agriculture by CAP. What was your point? That human beings all use air, food & heat!
Clearly the peoples of Europe would be best served as separate Nations competing & co-operating as individual Nations.
Greg260146 3 years ago
All European countries are facing slow growth and financial turmoil along with North America.... All European countries are situated in the same position in this planet (Otherwise they wouldn't be called European countries) and therefore share the same geopolitical interests. Don't you that finding a common ground on this issues would be more effective in a world where the IMF predicts that by 2010 there won't be one individual european country in the list of the world's 10 largest economies?
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 The IMF is hardly clever looking at Europe to claim that there won't be a single nation in the top 10. That is easy to show, look at the damage the EU is doing with over regulation & idiot projects. That all the Regions are locked together in a downward spiral to the lowest common denominator is inevitable, independent Nations trading eachother UP exploiting skills of diversity. The EU breeds disloyalty, indollence & corruption as proven. Hope for mankind is in its failure.
Greg260146 3 years ago
In 1945 Europe was the World. A war between european countries was actually a war between major powers.... Today a war between European Countries would be just a ridicolous regional conflict and the US, China, India, Russia and Brazil would see it as we see a war in the Balkans.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 In 1945 Europe had been broken by an attempt to conquer it by Germany, France, Austria, Italy, Croatia & tacit support of Spain, Portugal much of Holland & bye stander status profiting by Sweden, Ireland & Switzerland. It was appreciated a centralised Government was in so many ways inappropriate that the concept of Union was defeated. Forcing the economically, democratically, agriculturally & socially unsound concept of EU on peoples will inevitably lead to collapse again.
Greg260146 3 years ago
I'm sorry I do not agree with any of the points you're making.. The fact that by 2050 there won't be a single european county in the top 10 depends simply on the fact that there are nations on this planet that have huge territories, huge populations and huge resources. Their territories are bigger than the whole Europe together. Their populations range between half a 500 millions and 1.3 billions and their natural resources are immense.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
It's stupid and illogical to want to believe that there is one single hope for a country like France, Germany, Britain or Italy to have their voice heard on the global scenario. And blaming everything on the EU is just stupid non-sense propaganda.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
As the Financial Times rightly put it: "Everyone interprets the EU according to their own preconceptions rather than seeing it for the singular institution that it is. the EU's most enthusiastic fans and fiercest critics share the same trait: they all describe what they wish, or fear, to see rather than what really exists." Let me tell you, you are a typical example of that.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 As someone who was predicting in detail the present economic situation well over 5 years ago I am all too happy to be stereotyped by the Financial Times which has been proved wrong again & again on the issue. That I bring a different clarity of perspective to the discusion backed by fact & experience is not a problem for me & the fact that I believe you are wrong in your propaganda & over simplification is irrefutable. I appreciate the EU spends Millions on silencing reason.
Greg260146 3 years ago
The fact that you are older doesn't give you any "moral legitimacy" through which you can instruct people, however younger, who have different thoughts and beliefs. As a matter of fact, your being trapped in this scheme of a 1940 world instead of realizing that when the surrounding enviroment changes, the schemes on which we found our reasoning must change accordingly.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
From this perspective European Integration is not that different from the ACT OF UNION that brought together England and Scotland centuries ago. The idea was: we've been fighting each other for a long time but now we have foreign powers (French Empire, Spanish Empire etc.) threatening us. If we stand together we can face them better. Today England and Scotland are the countries of the European Continent and the French and Spanish Empire are China, Russia, India and the emerging economies.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 Your understanding of history is unsound. Scotland begged England for amalgamation as the Scottish peoples were starving due to crop failures as a result of volcanic debris from Iceland cutting the hours of sunlight below that needed for grain production. Wales was conquered long ago as it never was a country it was a disperate band of squabbling tribes. Britain is NOT a continental Nation nor does it think thus it is a global trader within the Anglosphere stiffled by the EU
Greg260146 3 years ago
That's exactly what distances me from eurosceptics... their absurd belief that their little countries alone have some weight on a global scale. That's simply ridicolous and when one founds all its ideas on this assumption then the following reasoning must necessarily be wrong.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 When criticising it is often wise to consider the achievements of those you criticise relative to the failures of the platform on which one stands. To date the EU has not a single achievement anyone of integrity would value relative to the damage, cost & downside risk of its methodology & over burgeoning stature. As a concept it HAS failed on almost all counts. That it has done so in an unaccountable manner with other peoples money is beneath contempt. It is founded on lies.
Greg260146 3 years ago
"To date the EU has not a single achievement anyone of integrity would value relative to the damage, cost & downside risk of its methodology & over burgeoning stature" You're becoming annoying. You keep repeating this without specifying which achievements and costs you are referring to. If you were a person willing to listen to (not necessarily gree with) what others think I could list at list 100 benefits the EU brought about.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 said "I could list at list 100 benefits the EU brought about"
Clearly we have very different values & aspirations as I totally stand by my statement 'To date the EU has not a single achievement anyone of integrity would value relative to the damage, cost & downside risk of its methodology & over burgeoning stature' which beyond doubt is true - it is just that you seemingly have rather lower standards, expectations & perceptions - or you have swallowed the costly propaganda
Greg260146 3 years ago
Yeah... I just wonder how many times a day you repeat that line. You've become a scaremongering propaganda Robot. That may work when it comes to brainwash sheeps (sadly the majority) who are not able to make up their minds on their own.... but that doesn't work with people like me, whose brains are still functioning (sadly the minority)... You really resemble a guy a knew who passed away a long time ago... His name was Joseph Goebbels? I bet you've heard of him.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 Indeed I am well aware of Goebbels who as the Minister of propaganda for the aspirant dominant power for Europe as Germany was is now replaced by Maggot Wallstrom as minister of propaganda for the actual conquered EU who has a massively larger budget and a huge staff with many many propaganda offices across the naicent police state - the technique would seem to work both through bribes paid in the troughs on the Gravy Train & the gullibility of the many who believe the lies.
Greg260146 3 years ago
I would take your stances more seriously if you weren't one of those people who criticize everything just because it has the word "EU" in it without even try to understand (not necessarily agree with) how that thing works and which goal is that thing trying to reach.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
"Menon (Birmingham University professor) ridicules the idea, beloved of many eurosceptics, that the EU Commission is some kind of bureaucratic monster sucking the lifeblood out of Europe's nation states. The Commission is a complement to the nation state, not a challenge to it, he argues. In total, the EU employs 30,000 officials compared with more than 1m civil servants in the UK alone."
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 You quote Menon, a Government funded theorist, what would you expect him to say? He has all the credibility of the so called scientists funded by government grants to misrepresentat global warming as a method of control & taxation whilst all the independent scientists & climatologists debunk the 'Inconvenient Lies' of Al Gore & his ilk with fact.
Sadly I am self funded & thus unable to maintain the output of facts to refute the EU propaganda & your good self.
Greg260146 3 years ago
"Boris Johnson, the eurosceptic mayor of London, probably controls a bigger administrative budget than José Manuel Barroso, president of the EU Commission. The EU's central achievement, Menon argues, has been the creation of the single market, now considerably bigger than the economy of the US. Though incomplete, it has brought real, practical benefits to thousands of companies and millions of consumers, and sharpened European competitiveness."
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 The cost of the EU bureaucracy alone right across its area of control dwarfs the cost of the EU London region. The single market requires so much regulation there is a huge industry of controllers & a drop off of producers as industry loses markets. The concept has brought no gain to companies merely a huge amount of additional red tape cost that has damaged competitive spirit. Your EU funded propaganda just doesn't stand up to scrutiny in the real world as EU exports diminish
Greg260146 3 years ago
"The creation of a single, EU standard for mobile phones, for example, has led to its adoption in 50 non-European countries. This has given European operators a significant advantage in the global marketplace." French Euroskeptics condemns those politicians (read Sarkozy) who blame the introduction of the euro for increasing prices -- even though the statistics show it has helped reduce inflation".
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 Now that really is significant - rejoice the EU has achieved SOMETHING it completely loused up the competitive structure of the not very important telephone market. Woopie Do - £1,800,000 per hour cost of membership so little girls can chat on mobile phones at a standard rate! Meanwhile the CAP is destroying Europe's ability to feed itself & causing famine in the 3rd. world whilst the EU makes fools of itself with nonsense about global warming & bio fuels. They are a Sick Joke
Greg260146 3 years ago
"rejoice the EU has achieved SOMETHING it completely loused up the competitive structure of the not very important telephone market..." I'm realizing more and more your incapacity of speaking objectively about this issue. The Telephone market was obviously an example as you can find hundreds of them. Two are the possibilities 1) You're not able to tell a thesis from an example used to validate that thesis 2) You manipulate every quote you hear and turn it into your non-sense populist propaganda
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
In Both cases you are not a "EUROSCEPTIC", who is a person who criticizes the Eu and founds his criticism on a Knowledge on the subject giving it reason why this or that thing doesn't work accordint to him. You are what I call a "EUROPARANOIC" a person that keep on criticising things without knowing anything about them and tries no distort reality in order to create a populist effect and corrupt the masses... There was a guy called Goebbels in the Nazi German Government who used to do the same.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 I am not for a moment a EUroSceptic as I have not one moment of scepticism as to the harm it is doing; nor am I EUroParanoic as I am not remotely frightened of the EU or the EUro but I do fear for mankind as a result of the clear & obvious damage the EU is doing & that which is inevitable due to its corrupt aims & greed not to mention confrontational nature of the EU. Like many with no experience they are making almost evry mistake possible. Endlessly congratulating themselves
Greg260146 3 years ago
The main reason they were opposing the Constitution and therefore Lisbon is because small countries would have lost VETO power. Not because they were against the EURO, Shengen or because they thought the EU was a conspiracy organization trying to destroy their country. My argument was "Yes but with every country vetoing enlargement cannot take place and I believe that qualified majority is a democratic way of dealing with certain issues.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
One day you can be on the side of those who do not agree on that directive, one day you can be on the side of those who want to adopt that directive. The same for every country. So that's a balanced system according to me" They didn't agree with me, I didn't agree with them. Nobody is god and nobody is 100% right or 100% wrong. They voted NO, I voted YES. the NO side won and I respect that. But there was a conversation, there was a debate based on real issues.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
Whereas with you British Europaranoic people this cannot happen! You don't want to understand, you don't want to debate, you don't want to know something about that. You just start with your Nigel-Farage-like populist talk screaming out things like "new world order" "military dictatorship" "deprivation of freedom".... that's what Hitler used to say to his people in order to convince them to vote for his NATIONAL-SOCIALIST PARTY, better known as NAZIST PARTY.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 unlike Hitler the commission & its president were not democratically elected. Though they would seem to seek to emulate him in the similarity of their equivallent 'enabling act' & subsequent disregard for democracy.
Greg260146 3 years ago
So I don't accept to be called "Short-sighted" by a populist scaremonger like you. Develop an Idea which is based on FACTS and ANALYSIS an not on POPULIST DEMAGOGIC PROPAGANDA. Then Learn to converse with and listen to people who have ideas that are different than yours. DEMOCRACY WORKS ONLY IF THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO ARE WELL INFORMED ABOUT THE TOPIC, WHO ARE READY TO DISCUSS THESE TOPICS WITH PEOPLE WHO HAVE DIFFERENT IDEAS and not with FOOLISH REDNECKS SCREAMING LIKE IDIOTS EVERYTIME:
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
To take the figures & provide the FACTS
The EU Constitution/Lisbon Treaty must by its own LAWS be RATified by all 27 member regions. So far 19 Nations have surrendered to the RATification that's 19 countries or 5000 politicians!
France with a population of 64,473,140
Netherlands with a population of 16,428,071
& Ireland with a population of 4,339,000
EACH by a majority voted NO
In Democratic terms 85M to 5,000 AGAINST
The EU has no mandate - is it then a dictatorship? Ratifying a RATnest
Greg260146 3 years ago
The same thing with Ireland. Polls show that the great majority of people voted NO because didn't understand what the treaty was about and would vote YES if EU Membership would be questioned. There may be countries where the majority of people are against the Lisbon Treaty, but being Dutch I can assure you that Britain (or better England, because Polls show that the majority of Scots support EU Membership) is the only country where the majority of the people is against the very idea of the EU
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
ma sei italiano od olandese?
goodsoninc 3 years ago
EU Treaty is uncostitutional for many reasons. First of all, this treaty was voted in many country by the Parlament, not by the people. Many people do not know what this treaty will lead them, and they're scared they will be ruled by a superpowerstate monster that ignores the needs of people. Second, the Central European Bank is uncostitutional and a new kind of superstate mafia, which raise prize of money and make high inflation on middle class. EU must be protectionist against China goods...
goodsoninc 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 Yes you do show just how Britain has been raped by membership of the EU - we can however look forward to liberty & a proud history, rightly proud of the values, discoveries, peace, stability, Justice & so much more we gave the world before those we had helped & aided like jackals turned & bit the hand that helped it. How ashamed you must be and it shows in your vitriolic abuse. Understandably we have less fear of our friends around the world and the language we gave the world.
Greg260146 3 years ago
Yes yes... keep on believing this stuff... You british people are incredible. The world have move forward, the international monetary fund forecasts that by 2050 the list of countries by economy's size will be 1. China 2. India 3. US. 4. Russia 5. Brasil 6. Japan 7. Mexico 8. Germany (before it get busted by some other emerging economy) and you still believe the pathetic voice of your little island still counts something??
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
The only ones you're useful to are the americans because when you send your boys to Iraq and let them die so that Mr. Bush can take all the oil before Russia and China get there, they can send some troops less and accordingly lower the cost of the mission. I find countries like Germany, France and Spain prouder than the UK when they said to Mr Bush: we don't agree with your war, I'm sorry, we're not coming whereas Britain HAD to send some troops so that it could remain America's favourite pet.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
Europe is an opportunity for countries to keep their sovereignty but to cooperate on the same geopolitical interests they have (they all depend on Russia by gas, they are all subjected to mass immigration, they all face the threat of terrorism, they all face high inflation and slow growth, they all have worker's rights and face threats from China becoming the world's first economy by kicking the hell out of its workers, they are all Christian and face a threath by islamic extremism etc. etc.)
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 could you try to be rather more adult & stop showing off with foul language which debases your credibility. 'bullshits about democratic answerability' no accounts for 13 years!! 'loss of sovereignty' Proposed EU Foreign Minister etc. imposed Corpus Juris replacing Justice, ECJ etc!!! 'military regime' Rapid Reaction Force, EUroPol etc!! 'scaremongering propaganda' NO FACT which should scare YOU too!! Yes we are the losers it costs us £1,800,000 per hour & demeans our values.
Greg260146 3 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
To take the figures & provide the FACTS
The EU Constitution/Lisbon Treaty must by its own LAWS be RATified by all 27 member regions.
So far 19 Nations have surrendered to the RATification
that's 19 countries or 5000 politicians!
France with a population of 64,473,140
Netherlands with a population of 16,428,071
& Ireland with a population of 4,339,000
EACH by a majority voted NO
In Democratic terms 85M to 5,000 AGAINST
The EU has no mandate - is it then a dictatorship?
Greg260146 3 years ago
"Lisbon Treason Treaty" mumbo djumbo.
Lets all raise awareness and together sidetrack these NWO fascists!
Selasia 3 years ago
What an arsehole that David Milliband is. He stands there, keeping a straight face, and talks about the 'democratic right of the British people'. Where was OUR democratic right for a vote on the treaty (constitution)?
I am NOT a violent man, but I truly believe death is too good for these traitors, these Nazis.
numbskullandy 3 years ago
Yet again we note that a pro EU supporter in his anger at being confronted by the truth resorts to abuse, obscenity and insult like a small child having a tantrum. One can be relatively certain that had the Irish, French & Dutch voters known how offensive the YES supporters were before the vote the NO VOTE would have been notably higher. Whether the scum that has risen to the top of the French septic tank or those that float in Britain or Ireland clearly they are angry at democracy & in denial
Greg260146 3 years ago
They are called PARLIAMENTARY ELECTIONS because you vote for the PARTY... they party that gets MAJORITY forms the government. The leader of the party (e.g. Cameron) appoints the ministers AND THE COMMISSIONER. Result? Mandelson is as answerable as Darling. the French commissioner is as answerable as the french minister of Agriculture. the italian commissioner is as answerable as the italian minister of Defence. plus every member state has a commissioner.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
That's called representative democracy. if you don't like the EU just say: I DON'T WANT TO BE IN THE EU BECAUSE I DON'T WANT TO GIVE MONEY TO POLAND AND SLOVAKIA AND HELP THIS COUNTRIES TO DEVELOP SO THAT WE CAN CREATE A WEALTHY MARKET ALL OVER THE CONTINENT WHERE EVERY COMPANY FROM EVERY COUNTRY CAN INVEST FREELY (Take your own Vodafone). In this case I would understand your arrogant point ad accept it. But please stop talking about democratic bullshits.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 unanswered because your assumptions are so wrong as to be risible.
Greg260146 3 years ago
I'm dutch, I voted YES to the EU Constitution. many of my friends voted NO but they all support EU Membership, the EURO and Shengen an they would never vote for leaving the EU or the EURO. The same with the French and the Irish. So you british idiots must stick your anti-EU sentiments in your ass, become the 51 fucking state of america and leave us alone.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 Are all the Dutch who support membership of the EU as foul mouthed, ignorant, ill mannered and offensive as you? Do they all have an inability to communicate intelligently in a civilised manner or is this the real aim of the EU to create a dumbed down society with little more to offer than aggression to support it being bereft of integrity, accountability or morality!
Greg260146 3 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
To understand the EU why not watch youtubeDOTcom / watch?v=xnMtc_QJ4-E it will help you understand the aims of the EU & those who are the minority pro group who welcome corruption, greed, centralisation and self enrichment. It makes it entirely understandable why Politicians are in favour & out of step with the peoples where France, Holland & Ireland VOTED NO to the Constitution now renamed Lisbon Treaty & note EU Commissioners have less democratic mandate than Mugabe NO ONE EVER voted for them!
Greg260146 3 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
47.9% Voted against Mugabe in Zimbabwe's elections.
The EU described it as 'travesty of democracy' & supported MDC decision not to stand in second round.
53.4% Vote against Lisbon Treaty in The Constitution/Lisbon Referendum.
The EU implied the Irish were stupid & didn't understand & said it 'regrets' and would like them to run again a second time.
At least Mugabe was elected by democratic means though his mandate has run out - The Commission was NEVER elected & MEPs have no say!
Greg260146 3 years ago
An interesting thought from Maggot Wallstrom (EU Minister of Propaganda) Kemppinem head of the EU London enforcement offices 'WE did not lose one single referendum.' (This may suggest that the EC considers itself blameless re: Ireland) The other, a peach, reads: 'Yes is yes but no is unfortunate.' It was of course the ghastly Abba clone with her metronomic drone & ill kept roots who is supposedly responsible for communications! Well she failed to communicate in Ireland. Not even understanding NO
Greg260146 3 years ago
"Maggot Wallstrom" :D BRAVO, that's even too generous for this hoe
jupiterjjrm 3 years ago
jupiterjjrm PLEASE HELP copy comments you agree with and post them on all the similar sites ;-) We need to distribute the truth as widely as we can so that people will understand the EU is a scam supported by those with their snouts in the troughs - most of whom were NEVER elected.
The disconnect between politicians & the people is huge & growing & if we do not fix this problem soon it will lead to war. The EU MUST be gently dismantled if mankind want peace in the future. Democratic VOTE WAS NO
Greg260146 3 years ago
just so you know dumbass, the commissioners (including the president) are elected by governments of member states. the British commissioner, Mandelson, is as elected as one of your ministers is. You don't elected every minister directly, do you? You vote for a Party. The party gains majority, the leader of the party forms a government where he is the PM and appoints ministers. the PM and the ministers appoint the commissioner. If commissioners are unelected, so are your ministers.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 As I said with less democracy than Mugabe. Mugabe was elected by the peoples of his Country but his mandate is ended - The EU Commission was NEVER ELECTED & is NOT answerable to the electorate! How any Sovereign State selects its representatives, within certain peramaters, is of no concern of those of other Countries. The EU has no meaningful democracy & that IS my business as being unfortunately in a vassal region the obscene supra national scam imposes itself undemocraticly
Greg260146 3 years ago
alright... then if the commissioners are not answerable to the electorate neither is your minister of finance, your minister of education, your minister of foreign affairs, defence etc... the british commissioner is appointed by the government you elected and so are the commissioners appointed by other countries... Mandelson is not less answearble than Darling.... when you vote for parliamentary election do you vote for every freaking minister of the british government??? NO!!
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 Mostly ignored as yet again you are incapable of civil discussion.
British Ministers ARE elected British Politicians acting politically throughBritish Government structure.
Commissioners are unelected mostly foreigners acting as executive civil servants with no elected mandate.
The role of a Commissioner and their appointment compares with neither a British Minister or a civil servant. In fact they have a greater similarity to a Politbureau member in the USSR.
Greg260146 3 years ago
your brain and those of fool eurosceptics like you must be dismantled. You keep on talking about the people but you have to remember that there are also people who support EU integration and we're gonna kick your motherfucker eurosceptics ass.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 I note you are too stupid not to utterly demean any credibility you may have had by resorting to obscenity, abuse & revealing the foul workings of yet another thwarted pro EU supporter. Indeed there are some who support membership of the dishonest, corrupt, undemocratic, centralised gravy train (mainly those who feed in its troughs!) Yet in the Countries where a referendum was conducted showed that a majority voted NO in France, Holland & Ireland others were denied democracy!
Greg260146 3 years ago
I've study EU Law and there is absolutely no lack of democratic accountability plus the new treaty the Irish Rejected (by the way polls show that 90% of the people who rejected the treaties in Ireland, France and Holland wouldn't reject EU Membership, Anti-EU sentiments are only a british thing.) would have improved democratic accountability by giving more power to the EU parliament that you moron elect and by giving more power to national parliaments to block EU legislation.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 seems you learned little in your law studies if that is your understanding of the EU's near total democratic deficit nor it seems did you learn that to be legal one needs to account for other people's money!
It is unfortunate that you destroy your own arguments by using insult, obscenity & abuse like a child in a tantrum.
Greg260146 3 years ago
I'm not against people who say that don't like the EU because they say "I don't want to have anything to do with foreigners from other fucking nations or I don't want to give money to eastern europe". They are coherent. But what I cannot accept is people inventing bullshits about democratic answerability, loss of sovereignty, military regime and other pieces of scaremongering propaganda like this. You're just losers who are afraid to say what you really believe:
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
WHICH IS, YOU DON'T GIVE A FUCK ABOUT HELPING EASTERN EUROPE AND YOU PREFER HAVING THE AMERICANS, RUSSIANS AND CHINESE DECIDING EVERYTHING FOR YOU INSTEAD OF COOPERATION AND DECIDING TOGETHER WITH OTHER COUNTRIES THAT SHARE THE SAME GEOPOLITICAL INTERESTS. These are THE TRUE EUROSCEPTIC with whom I don't agree but of whom I respect ideas. Whereas propaganda scaremongers like this are idiots who do not deserve to be listened to.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 Though I may easily be able to discredit the arguments logically put by the intelligent proponents of EU - it is barely worth the effort responding to the offensive, foul mouthed, abusive, ill mannered and ill informed tantrums of those who can not reason in a civilised manner.
Greg260146 3 years ago
PARDON, I meant the 51 fucking state of fucking America
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
Again the no was a yes if it was not for the no side scare mongering tactics.
That is why my country voted no.
and again it was not a resounding no it was close yes and no.
It was a sad day for the netherlands but we will still go on and I fully agree with it.
ramonnl 3 years ago
Sadly people are more easily affected by scaremongering propaganda like the one you are doing... That's how Hitler and Mussolini came to power... by scaring the hell out people inventing bullshits and making them believe that was true. This explains how the No vote won in Ireland: the No campaign started inventing things about abortion, european military union, or tax harmonisation (I'VE STUDIED THE TREATY, UNLIKE YOU, AND THESE THINGS ARE NOT PRESENT AT ALL). That's all.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 Again your studies seem to have let you down - I suggest you get someone of greater wisdom & experience of life to try to clarify the Treaty to you. ECB subsumed Politically, EUCouncil debased to a mere institution (read the rules that are to be applied to institutions of the EU). ECOFOR, EUroPol & Rapid Reaction Force are what if not a EU Military Union? Standardised taxation is what if not tax harmonisation? ECB Politicised! Do try to understand what you read in treaties.
Greg260146 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 NO neither Hitler nor Mussolini came to power as you claim. Yet again like your study of law & your study of treaties it would seem your study of history has failed you also. As a point of interest in extensive exposure to the Irish NO campaign & a great deal of reading & communication never ONCE did I hear an Irishman raise the issue of abortion - It was first notably raised by Denis McShane an Anglo Polish British Politician supporting the Yes Campaign then YES claimed it
Greg260146 3 years ago
My only desire now is seeing the British Economy collapsing.... and it will happen my dear fucking Greg260640283, it will happen... actually it is happening. Then it will be the EU that will kick Britain out because of its incompatibility with EU economic standards. So don't you worry, you're on your way out.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
CaesarAugustus1987 Please communicate like an adult without obscenity. You are right our politician's support of the EU has cost us dearly & £1,800,000 per hour cost of EU membership has been catastrophic. To stand with dignity, integrity, morality & values envied by the world in abject povert is to me of greater value than prostitution of my Country to the corruption, dishonesty, lack of dignity & self respect or the morally bankrupt EU. To die on ones feet is better than to live on ones knees!
Greg260146 3 years ago
Of course America keeps on saying: Britain is our best ally, we are brothers and b.s. like that... It is covenient to them having little Britain sending more troops than it can everytime that they must invade some poor desperate country. Again, I'm DUTCH, I live here, you do not know anything about Holland. We are not like YOU, We are not ANTI-EUROPEAN. 90% of the people who voted NO here are not against EU membership, Shengen and the EURO.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
People in Spain voted YES to the EU CONSTITUTION by a 70% Majority... Polls show that people in Italy, Portugal, Greece, Germany and several parts of Eastern Europe would vote YES. France, Holland, Ireland and Scandinavian countries would vote NO to LISBON but would vote YES to EU MEMBERSHIP. England is the only place in Europe where people would vote NO to EU MEMBERSHIP... So, again, you better leave us alone and go back sucking your American Master big dick.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
Plus in Europe that is no country that is enormously more powerful than the others (a siuation like North America with the USA dictating on Canada): There are Germany, UK and France balancing themselves... Italy and Spain balancing themselves, small countries safeguarding their own interesting uniting if big ones try to act as bullies... It's a perfect situation for countries with the same interests to cooperate without losing their sovreignty and by keeping their identiy.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
If European Cooperation fails than YES we well be enslaved and we will lose our freedom... because global balances will be decided by the big 4: CHINA, INDIA, US and RUSSIA (and at one point BRAZIL) whereas individual european countries will just have to comply with what these giants have decided.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
I love my country and it's because I love my country that I support European Integration... because only in Europe my country can at the same time remain sovreign and be safe from (real) bullies which are countries with population of more than 500 million people and huge economies that are keeping on growing not to talk about resources.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
European Countries have to choices: cooperate or die. And you fool britis eurosceptics will discover it to your own expenses. Adieu, I've nothing more to share with arrogant, short-sighted imperialist-wanna-be idiots like you.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
sorry for Grammar Mistakes, I'm working on it.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
Britain will finally be a ridicolous island runned by Americans, Arabs, Russians and Chinese.... they prefer being submitted by superpowers than cooperate with countries of their size and with the same geographical position (other than historical ties). So that's the freedom you're talking about? Russkies, Yankees, Chings, Indians and Muslims feeding you? COOL! That's an interesting Idea of freedom and democracy.
CaesarAugustus1987 3 years ago
AlanPartridge41M It is unfair to condemn either or both of the Millipied brothers for the fact that their Polish Jewish Father, to whom we gave sucour & sanctuary betrayed our trust espousing Marxism in his British State funded job. That they have turned out revolting is hardly surprising but revolting they are with clearly no interest in these United Kingdoms, liberty, Justice or the values of Britain.
Greg260146 3 years ago
It is clear whenever one hears Maggot Walstrom she is either mad, utterly stupid or just evil. Just what part of NO do these arrogant, self interested, corrupt & dishonest people not understand. Did you not
"We must as your leaders.." She does not even understand just how
loathed they are NOT leaders but unelected REPRESENTATIVES. These
Bast*rds in their self important greed are moving us step by step to
famine, war and 200,000,000 deaths in persuit of their personal
ambitions EVIL UNION!
Greg260146 3 years ago
I note the French Sarkozy "The Irish are bloody fools," he told aides. "They have been stuffing their faces at Europe's expense for years and now they dump us in the s***." I gather the Irish politicians to keep their snouts in the trough have been told to Lobotomise the Irish so that they vote YES in a new referendum. The EU believes it can bully, bribe & threaten Ireland they knew the French & Dutch meant NO when they voted & won't be bullied. Of course Ireland was too stupid to understand!
Greg260146 3 years ago
How can so many be controlled, manipulated and conned by such a small, unelected minority on BOTH sides of the pond, for so long? The EU is as democratically elected as Kim Jong-il. Three nations said NO to the "Lisbon Treaty"! Bottom line democracy is one man, one vote. So if you want my vote, aks me. If you want my money, ask me. If you claim to uphold my civil Liberties, prove it by asking me. The EU cannot do so. Instead, it has declared war on Liberty and Democracy. Quite similar to the USA
nopartyplease 3 years ago
Diabolical masterminds rule EU (look at the high inflation after euro, high unemployement and so on)
goodsoninc 3 years ago
The Germans are itching to have a cohesive military under the EU to move towards the Middle East as soon as possible. Don't give them the opportunity and oppose the EU "empire" - as Barroso calls it.
yanerosoli 3 years ago
More people turned out for this vote than for the Nice vote.
Since we were denied democratic process in my country, the Irish vote was a nice birthday present. Politicians should remain accountable to the people, even after they are voted into office. This is one of the principles the Irish conveyed. I hope the EU-Parl remains accountable for its own rules of ratification after this.
onepercent2008 3 years ago
The idea of a two speed Europe is an older idea. Here, it now sounds like a good idea. The progress of the European project must continue and the reforms must be put into place, especially with regard to European defense.
EUamerican 3 years ago
What do you think will happen if Declan Ganley was found to have gotten his money from the CIA?
It is well known that the CIA funds elections so that outcomes suit US interests. Declan Ganley also surrounds himself with Americans including a retired American military officer.
A "no" vote against the Lisbon Treaty is a "yes" vote for the continuance of America domination over Europe.
EUamerican 3 years ago
You've got to be kidding me? Do you have any idea how oppressive the EU will be in regard to individual rights? Do yourself a favor and read all you can about Corpus Juris.
Democracy? Just listen to sarkozy say that they'll just change the rules in order to ratify the treaty! And, on that note, ask yourself why not ONE citizen was allowed to VOTE, with the exception of IRELAND.
coultrane 3 years ago
Thank GOD that "democracy" is NOT just about referendums - and that most radtional and educated people know that!
EUamerican 3 years ago
Yes, democracy is also about limited power, the people as the source of all power and stuff like that.
And this limited power does not include transfer of sovereignty.
TheCZMan 3 years ago
Luxembourg Prime Minister Jean-Claude Juncker said: "Of course there will be transfers of sovereignty. But would I be intelligent to draw the attention of public opinion to this fact?"
eggymemories 3 years ago
If the EU is to have any credibility at all then they much abandon this treaty. All 27 countries had to ratify it and the Irish have said no, end of story. If they try to ignore the wishes of the people, then they should all be forced to resign.
celticlofts 3 years ago
We have gone through this before with both the Maastricht and Nice treaties.
It is encouraging to see that Europe's leaders are exercising cool heads and allowing the Lisbon Treaty to continue.
"The people" through their elected leaders in 18 other member states have ratified the Treaty.
Ireland voted for Ireland - and not the rest of Europe! It is a tyranny of the minority of Irish "no" voters against the millions more in 18 other Member States and THIS in undemocratic!
EUamerican 3 years ago
"Tyranny of the minority of Irish" I think you need to wake up. Millions of people are overjoyed at this result especially when their own Governments refused to allow their own people to vote on it. At least Irealnd is still a democracy my friend and long may it continue. Oh and the only one who seems to be in a minority is you.
celticlofts 3 years ago
What we should be alarmed at is the misrepresentation of the word "democracy."
"Democracy" IS NOT about just referendums, but that is DIRECT democracy, there is as RESRESENATIVE democracy too, and it too is "democracy!"
so, people want to go back to the dark past when power politics and bloody wars reigned in Europe? The public simply cannot be informed enough to vote on a 250 page treaty. That is what elected parliments are for...
How does the US ratify treaties?
It's "undemocratic!"
EUamerican 3 years ago
Over and over again the same propaganda. The US government ratifies treaties within the limited range of the power delegated to it (the US government) by the sovereign entity, the US people.
In this regard, in democracy, no goverment has the power to transfer the sovereignty which belongs exclusively to We the People.
I have recalled this very basic democratic principle to you but I guess you are much more interested in spreading your propaganda than sticking to facts.
TheCZMan 3 years ago
The EU politicians have DENIED the people in their countries the right to vote on the Lisbon treaty. And when the irish people said NO, they try to ignore them.
So much for democracy.
rmir2 3 years ago
Those Member states that ratified the Lisbon Treaty though their national parliaments do so by a practice that is accepted in Western democracies.
"Democracy" is not ONLY about referendums and it is misleading to suggest that the ONLY acceptable form of "democracy" is referendum.
How is a treaty ratified in the US - well its not be referendums...
EUamerican 3 years ago
EUamerican, I would agree that referendums are not needed in every question. However, in the case of EU Federation the politicians are clearly NOT in accordance with the majority of "normal" people - and they know it!
The Federational Empire has failed in EVERY known case throughout history: Roman Empire, Ottoman Empire, Habsburg Empire, Yogoslavia, USSR, Colonial Empires to mention but a few (with different economical and religious basis).
LEARN FROM IT!
rmir2 3 years ago
PS: Communist China and Sudan are next on the list
rmir2 3 years ago
True, well said.
Torchmark 3 years ago
Torchmark PLEASE HELP - copy comments you agree with and post them on all the similar sites ;-) We need to distribute the truth as widely as we can so that people will understand the EU is a scam supported by those with their snouts in the troughs - most of whom were NEVER elected.
The disconnect between politicians & the people is huge & growing & if we do not fix this problem soon it will lead to war. The EU MUST be gently dismantled if mankind want peace in the future. Democratic VOTE WAS NO
Greg260146 3 years ago
'Countries that have no reservations'? How about the make a distinction between people and governments? I think that the Council and Commission have really shown their true colours in the contempt they have shown democratic process and sovereign nations
perkele0079 3 years ago