Hitchens always refused to use formulas to understand the world but rather his own solid set of ideas grown in his vibrant intellectual world where disagreement is fine as long as one had evidence.
tail wagging the dog - the USA is on its knees begging Israel to re-fund the country after the USA expended thousands of men and trillions of dollars defending those who refuse to make Peace with their neighbours: Israel. One has to recall what the Russians had been saying before their Revolution "Jewish Bankers created the pretence of conflict - WW1 - to profit and manipulate the Goyim into creating a Jewish Homeland" which Balfour and the British did as soon as practicable. Nothing changes.
its very true- if you try reasoning with a zionists they will agree with you and do the opposite of what they say- the talmud teaches lying is ok to a goy anyway
if you tell the israeli to recognise palestine- he will insult you for it- because truth hurts
but if you are in a position of power- you put the gas chamber to the vile zionists face- i guarantee you-= I PROMISE YOU- the zionist will give palestine its land back in a day
@calmiced Well that's true of every religious person. An Islamic extremist also claims they have the right to lie to Jews and non-believers, so your argument is arbitrary. What it comes down to is 2 semitic peoples who can't live together because they have 2 different racist text which tell them they should hate eachother. The 2 state solution could've been in order 60 years ago, but religious nutjobs and extremists make it impossible.
Speaking from actual experience on the ground having lived in Jerusalem and gone through the process of emigration under the "law of return" I will agree with Hitchens. He is not letting anyone off the hook on the Muslim/so called Arab side, etc, he is simply pointing out facts per facts. If Hebrew and Arab speakers, in fact all Semites, can't introspect then we will never sort this sibling rivalry out.
Propaganda and lies come in so many forms.One irritating legend is that the Israelites were persecuted and run out of Egypt.Besides the bible no historic documentation states that that was what actually happened.The Egyptians meticulously made notes of all major events yet you will find nothing of an Exodus of the Jews from Egypt.It is more likely that they took off without being threatened. But it was crucial to build the story that "we have been persecuted for 4000 years".Bibi? Fascist.
@makiavelli999 Very good point. Similar to the belief that Germans were to blame for WW1. Fact is, the Germans offered a negotiated peace with England in 1916 but it was the Zionists who pushed the English to keep fighting with the promise of getting the USA involved in the war in return for a Jewish state in Palestine.
This man have a small brain he believe that there is no god. And we asked him where are we came from if there is no creation ? And he said I don't know. I say you have small brain and you are sick man evil man
@AHMEDBULAXUBEY You think he had a small brain because he refused to claim absolute knowledge of something for which there is zero evidence? I'd say he was being honest. Saying "I don't know" is orders of magnitude better than pretending to know something. Preaching absolute truth about something for which there can be no answer is dishonest, insipid and ultimately destructive. Fuck everyone who teaches their children to stop thinking. They deserve ridicule.
@AHMEDBULAXUBEY and you believe "Pooffff...and there was Adam". And a talking snake tricked a woman to eat a fruit that gave her wisdom. And Jews left Egypt walking around the desert for 40 years leaving NO evidence of this. or that god would send a message to an illiterate....and no one else? and god loves to play the invisible game and watch millions of children starve to death every year- MILLIONS! slowly starving to death. That's what you believe.
Five years ago or so two distingished American Academics Published a well documented book on the power of the Israel Lobby in the United States..showing a the hold was total but was rarely in America's best interests.Only published in Academic Circles, no American Newspaper would publish their article--a shortened versions of their thesis. Finally the NY Times published a heavily censored version with a headline text "These are not the views of this paper". America in the ealy 21st Century
@CobinRain Wow, two left-wing academics published an article endorsing a thoroughly left wing position and no one listened because it was exactly the same as every left-wing academic paper on the issue ever.
@StudentOfObjectivism No one listened because it wasnt properly published for fear of the Israel lobby, you wanker. Like the mohammad drawing. And in any event how is it "left wing" to write about the Israel lobby in the US? ..It was well-researched. What more do you want? As for "left wing" it is pretty similar to what Pat Buchanan meant when he called the US Congress "another Israeli occupied territory" . If youre a big Israel /netanyahu fan be warned; the party is over.
And you can continue to remain blind, even as the truth falls into your lap...
DAMN!!! How the hell have we become such sheep?
You go right on making this a left/right/up/down/ blue/red/man/woman argument...
It will not be people like you who will change the world, and people like me and CobinRain should not waste time on those who insist on maintaining the status quo of moral degradation this society has succumbed to... when illegal wars and murder are championed. SICK!
For every negative comment by sheep like StudentOfObjectivism, you will also reach someone who will actually take their time to do their homework on the literature which you wrote of, and they will do their own homework and come up with their own conclusion, not what Fox tv's Rupert Murdoch ( Jewish ) or what Wolf Blitzers CNN reports wish us to believe.
@SLAVESweARE I think our "student of objectivism" has spent far too long in the cold embrace of the seriously creepy Ayn Rand to expect too much coherence. He's been reading Ayn Rnd instead of real books and, of course, factual material.I am almost afraid to open dialogue with him on Isreal because I know that his views will be, er, "ill-informed". For example, I get the sense from one of his comments that he doesnt even know who Pat Buchanan is. Is it too much to hope he'll look him up?
Oh, trust me, these folks like StudentOfObjectivism play it off like they are avid readers and self-informed folk, even as they sputter verbatim what you hear daily from Fox News, CNN and all the lying politicians who visit all these MSM shows.
In the end, these people are ideologues who may not admit it upfront, but clearly believe that human being are not all created equal.
One Israeli soldiers life takes precedent over an entire Palestinian village...
Because we in Israel believe that one Israeli life is worth a thousend lives of everyone else. Not because of racism. For example, when Sharon made a prisioner swap with hezzbollah, he gave 4k prisioners for two corps and one Israeli man. Its hard to explain but its not because of racism we believe that.
Oh, I am well aware of Jewish opinion on "non-Jews".
All "non-Jew" are referred to as goyim, which basically means cattle. Its how the jews and the Zion master sees all non jews in particular whites.
If only all these pro-Isaeli bible thumping American Christians who willingly support the state of Israel knew the contempt Zionists have for "non-Jews", I dare say allegiances would change overnight, I am certain of this.
I remember my history professor once making the case using anecdotal evidence, that Adolf Hitler was not really a racist against peoples of African heritage.
For example,when the Olympics were held in Germany in 1936, he explained away Jesse Owens 4 gold medal performances by insisting that blacks were simply closer to the animal kingdom, and that it was as unfair as expecting a German to outrun,say,a panther.
But its not the same... Its for a fraternity... We dont use this phrase to say kill 1000 palestinians for a single Israeli killed. We use it when it comes for example in prisioner swaps we do with the arabs in which we always liberated thousends prisioners for a single Israeli prisioner be it living or dead.
In your opinion, do you think that it stands to reason that these "fraternal" traditions, if repeated and spoken often enough over a persons or nations lifetime, may further deteriorate into a belief that discriminatory treatment of those people, both socially and legally, is justified at unique moments?
Also, do you consider "anti-semitic" sentiment as racism against Jews. or do you also have an alternative definition for this mind-set?
Answering your first question, I think it depends on the person. I for example am not racist and fight racism in my country whenever I see it. Its not that its pumped into our minds from school its just something we get through life here since we feel really united with all the terror attacks and wars (now you can agree or not that Palestinian actions are terror actions but it doesnt have anything to do with the argument). I continue in next comment
Right now there isnt a racism of the state (Although I admit there some stuff that need to be fixed and changed). But unfortunatly there are racist people in Israel like there are in ebery other place on earth.
About your second question, I think that the term anti-semite more relates to Jews since up until the muslim immigration to europe arabs didnt face racism because they didnt live in Europe and faced it, unlike Jews who are semites and did. .
Sweden or even the UK (whose monarch is the head of the Anglican Church) does not actively fund the immigration of Christians into their countries and pursue policies that alienate and displace non-Christians...take the situation in East Jerusalem or the West Bank settlements and the rapid change in Demographics that Israel is inflicting on whatever is left of Palestine that they did not manage to rob off.
Israel doesnt displace anyone... Non Jews with Israeli citizienship live as good as any other Jew in Israel.... Germany, the most liberal country in europe, has also a law of return jusr like Israel. Same with France and almost every other country in Europe
Allowing settlements, infiltrating East Jerusalem (in fact it already decided that it owns all of Jerusalem based on archaic texts), and disallowing owners of the land, 2 million approximately to return.
Saying Germany and France exercise similar laws is irrelevant to a displaced Palestinian living as a third class citizen in Lebanese or Jordanian camps. Some still hold the keys to homes in Haifa. It is tragic.
There you have it! You said admitted that the arabs treat the Palestinian refugees in Lebanon, Jordan, Syria and other countries like third class citiziens... I uguess its Israel fault that the arab countries treat the Palestinians like dogs.... And sorry, no. They wont be able to return since they can only do so if they are willing to live in peace side by side with the Jews a thing I dubt they want to do... And what about the one million Jews kicked out of arab countries?
You'll notice that the degree of rejection or hostility towards the Palestenian refugees in Arabian countries is linked to the capacity of their fragile economies to cope with them.
You don't hear of the Palestenian plight in Dubai but you hear about Sabra/Shatila in Lebanon or Black September in Jordan. These countries are teetering on the edge of social economic meltdown. The Palestenian presence is an overwhelming burden. Thanks to Israel.
You dont hear them wanting to go back to Libya, Marocco, Algeria, Iraq, Iran or other places... You know why? Because they were asimilated into the Israeli society which was made 100% of european Jews with a completly different culture. The real solution is for the Palestinian refugees to be assimilated into the countries they now take refuge in. After all they are all arabs wether they are lebanese. Palestinians or Syrians.
You don't hear them wanting to go back to Libya or Morocco
because they are neither Libyans nor Moroccans.
Such is the balance of power that you can get away with proposing that Palestenians just go bugger off and assimilate into some random Arabian place! They ought not to be in such a predicament. The business of sponsoring Israelis to flourish and settle on land at the expense of the misery of its owners is simply breathtaking.
Its not israel's fault that the Palestinians are treated like sh*t in arab countries.... And there arent 2 mil Palestinians refugees since 700k left Israel in the 1948 war.... And according to international law the decendents of the refugees arent labled as refugees
Give them their homes back and they will not be treated so badly.
If Immigrant from all parts of Eastern Europe and Russia can just occupy the land
claiming that since their 80th ancestor was Israeli, then they are Israeli too and have a right to the land that none of their ancestors have lived in in centuries or even millennia...why wouldn't you label descendants of refugees as refugees?
Land ownership, apparently, is in the genes...right Zionist??
@Whocreatedgod the same number of pals who lost there homes after 48 around 700,000. jews living in arab lands the same number 700,000 lost there homes tragic yet no talk of those jews
@Whocreatedgod ur full of shit just type in sephardic jewish refugees 1948 and educate yourself. also in the case of pal refugees there would have been zero if they agreed to the un partition and would have a state but instead they choose war. thinking once arab armies crossed the boarder the new jewish state would be destroyed but we know what happened
Jewish Diaspora leaving their home countries willingly and be sponsored to come grab Palestenian land and establish a bastard country unknown to the region for two millennia.
That is what I've been saying all along you idiot !
And, If the Palestenian refugees agreed to what?????
Their land..they have every right to remain there and you come out of nowhere with thousands of immigrants to grab the land and then start imposing this and imposing that?
Academic material like "type in sephardic jewish 1948".... !!!!
What a tosser !!
Start by learning your caps first!
Imagine going to a bitter Palestinian, some still holding keys and deeds to homes in Yaffa and AlKhalil and say to them...
Fuck your homeland you are never getting them back because an American humorist that probably none of you care about claimed in 18-eighty-something he didn't see Arabs around...
!!!!
Zionist tosser. Without Western support you'd never even dare
@Whocreatedgod I have a course book full of articles abut the history of sephardic jews I took a 9 credit course last year at york university. I was never taking away anything from pal refugees I was just pointing out about the forgotten sephardic jewish refugees. To dismiss them as you have done and many people do is an injustice.
@Whocreatedgod if you care about people who have suffered and robbed of their land the most out of anyone in the history of humans that belongs to the jewish people. The jews the only exiled nation to return back to the homeland after 2000 years and survived is a story like no other. Be a champion for human rights stand up for israel!!
DNA studies prove that Ashkenazi Jews are so closely related to Palestenians that it is likely that Palestenians are but the Chrisitians and Jews who have adopted the language and religion of the conquering Arabs.
So, one group maintained the ownership of the land for millennia. Your so called modern jews are an offshoot that deserted their land and now want to come back to steal it all to themselves
@MrJapaneseboy1111 So what applies to Arafat applies to all Palestenians? Garbage! JUDEA = old rotten historical non-existent state PALESTINE = land owned by ancestors of Palestenians since before Judea JEWS= inhabitants of Palestine who left the land 2000 years ago. PALESTENIANS = inhabitants of Palestine who stayed despite the Byzantine and Persian innovations. So Jews have no right in Palestine. They had a right 3000 years ago in a kingdom that does not exist anymore !!
@Whocreatedgod "al-Mughrabi" = the Moroccan ("Maghreb" – meaning "West" in Arabic, and usually referring to North Africa or specifically to Morocco) ,"Dalal Mughrabi"
^ a b Nebel et al., "High-resolution Y chromosome haplotypes of Israeli and Palestinian Arabs reveal geographic substructure and substantial overlap with haplotypes of Jews." Human Genetics Vol. 107, No. 6, (December 2000), pp. 630–641
No Israeli Jew of Immigrant descent has any right whatsoever to land in modern day Israel or Palestine. It belongs to the gourps who have maintained continuous ownership of the land.
@momobear67 It has not however, been the capital of Israel for 2000 years. The state was forcibly created and was massively unfair to the people already living there.
@secretsantaone your right totally unfair, the fact that Jerusalem has been destroyed twice, besieged 23 times, attacked 52 times, and captured and recaptured 44 times is also unfair. reasons why jews used to live and now do live in jerusalem. Only nation who have been exiled and from their land and return. fact it happened 2000 years later dispersed throughout the word and survived is incredible. the story of the jewish people is one like no other. Love the Jews
@momobear67 I'm not saying I hate the Jews, I'm saying they have no right to the land. I cannot forcibly evict the owners of my old apartment just because 'I used to live there'. Even if my landlord evicted me unfairly.
@secretsantaone even if you believe israel was unjustly made into a state does that matter? it is here now. many countries and borders have been made unjustly or whatever does not mean they don't have a right to live.
@doritela2008 I know being jewish can just mean it is your race and not religion. Are you sure Israel has the most atheists per capita though? More than places like sweden, estonia, denmark, japan?
Since a person can convert to Jeudaism, your claim of ethno-nationalism are false... Everyone can immigrate to Israel if they convert.. Even after they convert they still remain atheist (Many women and men that got married to a Jewish partner, converted in order to immigrate to Israel but they still remained Jewish) .
No they dont... Since in order for your conversion to be regarded as legal, you need to do an orthodox convertion to Jeudaism... And just to remind you that orthodox Jews are anti zionists.... Therefore, you claim that they convert into zionism is false...
"gilad shalit one israeli soldior for 1000 pali prisoners "...
Yeah, that sounds about right. I mean, that's about what Israeli Jews are outnumbered by present day, right? About 1 Israeli Jew for every thousand Arabs, right?
The experiment called the state of Israel lasted longer than I ever would have expected... But now the bell tolls for thee.... So sad you know? The world will be one less military aggressor state.... Maybe not so sad after all:)
Do these people really believe it's a beautiful,wonderful world, with the manipulation, stealing of the public's treasury, famines, illegal war's of choice with it's Depleted Uranium and White Phosphorus, the dumbing down of the people through propagandized media and failed public educational school system?
So what is StudentOfObjectivism defending? The stauts quo?
Is he really fine with the way our "leaders" are going about things?
These are ideologues, who love conflict and require enemies:)
You know how many boobs out there actually consider Hollywood a history lesson?
There's a whole generation of Americans out there who's only history lesson of Pearl Harbor was Ben Aflecks movie by the same name... And so on and so on...
This is well known to the establishment...
The Jews of Hollywood self typecast themselves as the poor but wise victims of a crazy world full of irrational hatred, and they are always the ones who can free us...
Like UFO's, or the Soviet/Russian conspiracy in Angelina Jolie's recent movie SALT...
So where is there the Hollywood movie broaching the whole "Zionists control everything" mythology, which would make an interesting take on popular belief amongst millions, even if its not true...
NOT ONE MOVIE portraying Israel as the conspirator.
M oh my ,but how many movies have been made regarding Jews being the most persecuted lifeforms on Earth???
HA HA HA!!! How long has Hollywood been around for? 100 years+?
Russia/USSR, America, European countries, Africa, South America, Arabs as a whole have often been portrayed as the "ruthless bad guys" to the movie plot.
Name me ONE Hollywood movie where Israel was portrayed as the country behind the conspiracy... Or one mainstream HW movie which had Zionists as the puppet masters in a plot, even as fiction?
These are prevailing believed ideas by many, like UFO's.
You sure do spend a shit-load of time defending the State of ISrael...
-A state which has a smaller population than New York City!
-A country so small that it can fit into the State of Florida 8 times over!
-A country that relies on U.S taxpayers hand-outs for its military
-A country with almost 80 violations concerning U.N. Security Council Resolutions ,the U.N. Charter, the Geneva Conventions, international terrorism, or other violations of international law.
You blamed Muslims for the business of slavery in an earlier post...
Since u insist on ignoring my quotes showing Israeli leaders admitting that the 1967 war was an Israeli war of aggression, please share with me your thoughts on the well established history of Jewish involvement in the slave trade? The jews owned most of those slave ships and jews were the biggest majority owner of the slaves themselves.
But I am sure that you will dispute this- Google Rabbi Marc Lee Raphael
SInce 9/11, how many civilians have Muslims killed on American soil?
Average number of American civilians who die from murder, disease, accidents, smoking every year numbers over 2 MILLION per year ( government numbers).
Times that by 10, since 9/11...
And you are gonna attempt the whole "the sky is falling because of radical muslims" routine on me???
OH really? And I suppose long long ago a bunch of westerners took a troop of diggers to the Mideast who buried all the oil which exists in that part of the world and can now claim it theirs...
Oh, right... They owned the equipment which helped drill that oil, and this gives them the right to overthrow and install whichever dictators THEY choose, no matter how ruthless, and these ME nations can never put their own people ahead for the rest of history...
Ah...but BLOWBACK is only a legitimate excuse when used by AMERICA and ISRAEL!!!!
Ideologues like you are impossible...
-Good luck attempting to convince the world that the most powerful armies in the world, with their top-of-the-line weaponry are the underdog victims...
-Good luck attempting to convince the world that the use of Depleted Uranium and White Phosphorus on civilian targets is acceptable.
-Good luck attempting to convince the world that Israel is not enslaving an entire peoples
If Bin Laden was the mastermind of and admitted to 9/11, shouldn't I go to him for the reason the attacks were perpetrated?
-Israel says the Arabs are evil, its in their blood
-America says its cause " they hate us for our freedom"
No..... I think I will go to the group which admits responsibility... And when I do, they say it was protest against the way the Palestinians are treated by Israel, and by how U.S money supports this, and how the U.S opened military bases on S.Arabian soil.
The people of Egypt, Tunisia,Morocco,Bahrain,Yemen,Saudi Arabia,Algeria, and countless other Arab peoples are WELL AWARE that their dictatorial regimes are backed and propped up by U.S money...
AND U EXPECT NO BLOWBACK?
So only Israel and the U.S have right to self-defense,huh?
Spain, Uk, 9/11 are not self- defense and protests of the wars, huh?
YOU ARE COMPLETELY INCONSISTENT WITH YOUR STANDARDS IN JUDGEMENT!
9/11 was not the start of anything...it was Arab protest for U.S involvement in ME.
The U.S/Israel and the west has meddled in the business of Arab/muslims for the greater portion of the last century, and continue to this day...AND U EXPECT NO BLOWBACK?????????
One 2 hour window on 9/11 is all the justification you need to have the U.S go around and set the world on fire with its bombs, yet 40+ years of Palestinian occupation is not going to foment anger and hatred in the Palestinian, of which app. 600,000 are young people were not even born then????????????????????????????
GO ahead with the standard propaganda line of the Western/Israeli version of history... That all of the Arab countries immediately tried to destroy Israel upon its creation...
Real history shows that only AFTER Israel expelled some 300,000 Palestinians form their existing homes and the Zionists took control of regions well beyond the area of the original Jewish state that was proposed by the U.N...only THEN was Israel attacked by its neighbors in 1948.
- there was "no threat of destruction" but that the attack on Egypt, Jordan and Syria was nevertheless justified so that Israel could "exist according the scale, spirit, and quality she now embodies." "There was never a danger of extermination. This hypothesis had never been considered in any serious meeting."
-General Ezer Weizman, Chief of Operations, Israeli Defence Forces, General Staff:
You know as well as I do that that there is vicious debate over the historical accuracy of the Torah and interpretations of archeological discoveries.
The discovery of a pottery shard with Hebrew inscription within the general area of modern day Israel is not proof of an Israeli Kingdom on par with Egypt, Rome,Babylon or Greece, so save your breath.
You take the Bible out of the equation, with the whole "right of Jews to this land" garbage, and what justification does Israel have to occupy?
Obviously, you have an answer for everything, so I'll be finishing with my last few comments, as you are simply an ideologue who has the whole good/guys vs bad guys and nothing in-between shit the U.S is famous for brainwashing its population in the fantastic public indoctrinating "education" system.
“ In June 1967 we had a choice…Egyptian army concentrations in the Sinai approaches did not prove that Nasser was really about to attack us. We must be honest with ourselves. We decided to attack him.” -MENACHEM BEGIN, Israeli PM
AND I QUOTE:
"I do not believe that Nasser wanted war. The two divisions which he sent into Sinai on May 14 would not have been enough to unleash an offensive against Israel. He knew it and we knew it."
DID I FORGET TO MENTION OUR LONG-TIME PARTNERSHIP WITH ISLAMIC,NUCLEAR ARMED, MILITARY RULED PAKISTAN?
I can mention many more Islamic nations/leaders who have been financed, supported, even installed or kept in power by the U.S and other western nations over this past century until the present...
But what are facts to you anyway, right?
You get to stay anonymous and post Youtube comments, because you would be crushed in an open, public forum and exposed as the ideologue you are.
Or U.S supported Muslim dictatorial leader Suharto of Indonesia,or of DIctatorial Kuwait ( who had the highest % of jailed journalists in the world when we "helped" them in 1991)?
Or Dictator countries of Morocco and Algeria who the U.S supports?
Wasn't Saddam supported for 2 full decades by the U.S, including the times when he was gassing innocent people?
WOW! For a religion and people that has "been at war for the rest of the world", they sure get huge support by our United State, huh????????
As I write,popular democratic citizen uprisings in Bahrain and Yemen are being suppressed with the help of the U.S, who backs those countries dictatorial leaders. And the Zionist media mentions nothing here.
Only after 40+ years were the people of Egypt able to rid themselves of U.S backed dictator Mubarak, and Tunisian people of dictator Ben Ali, who was given $100's of millions by the U.S.
Lets not forget our friends the Saudi's, of which 15 of the 19 9/11 hijackers and Osama hailed from.
@snackster27 "Islam has been at war for the rest of the world for as long as it has been around." Funny, I never remember my teacher teaching us about marauding Islamists invading the United States for 2 centuires. Dont think Canada has any war history with Muslims either. OR Switzerland...Or China, Japan, Australia. How about Mexico, Argentina. Anywhere in S.America? Maybe the U.K, Scotland? Iceland? Perhaps Norway or Finland? Germany maybe? Oh, I know... Costa Rica, right? You are a fool!
I see our U.S politicians insisting every day on tv, print and radio that America's interests lay with the practical and material factors and considerations,yet when it comes to Israel I see absolute ideological notions taking precedent.
How does it benefit Americans to be enemies with Iran rather than mutual business partners?
Iran would LOVE to do business with us...
This is but one of a million examples.
It does not make sense, except that our country has been hijacked, and I see the signs.
Remove the Jewish influence and I would be harping about the next scandal within the U.S ...
I grant you this...
The worlds never gonna be ideal, but I and many others get a real sick feeling when we are embroiling ourselves in wars on behalf of our Jewish "friends", or picking obvious sides in a conflict and adopting Israels enemies as our own.
I would sooner be friends and business partners with all the Arab states, than be their enemy for just little ol' Israel, who fits into Florida 8 times!
All these bankers, politicians, media moguls, with the vast Jewish influence, have created a shit world...
Absolute shit!
Would things be different if others had as strong an influence?
Not sure... But at this moment in time, I see a vast influence within my North American culture, and I want to hold people accountable...
If I'm gonna be screwed, may it be by the hands of my own, not by some Zionist nuts who see Americans as a strategic asset, to be thrown to the lions when no longer needed...
With the exception of 19 muslims and a window of 2 hours over the stretch of 235 years of American history, how have Americans daily lives been affected by these so called "islamic terrorists "?
Conversely, how has the the west and Israel meddled in the everyday lives of Arabs over the last century?
A terrorist is anyone who is not on the side of America or Israel.
Muslims today, Soviets earlier, space aliens tomorrow...
@snackster27 To broaden your mind, explore other ideas, different view points, form an opinion not based on one source...
The same reason that I, as a communist, read anarchist literature, Ayn Rand books and books from other Communist tendencies not my own. Why I watch Michael Moore, and turn to watch Fox News for a while.
I am not questioning the existence of the modern state of Israel, as defined post-1948...even if I disagree on how these events came about with the violent expulsion of the previous centuries inhabitants...
But to justify the ever-increasing encroachment on the Golan Heights,Gaza, West Bank and Jerusalem, what to speak of the gross attacks on Lebanon over the years,is utterly pitiful.
I do not defend Hamas, Hezbollah, et al, but that there are those who defend Israel is sickening...
I find nothing impressive about the state of Israel over any Arab country.
Jewish leaders have been involved in scandal... They wage illegal wars and kill children too..
if a Jew born and raised in Brooklyn,NY feels that he and his people have a right to land in the area which was called Palestine for the last thousand years prior to 1948, then why the hell does a Palestinian Arab living anywhere not have the same right to call parts of this area their home also?
Prove to me it's the Jews land then, WITHOUT using Bible stories of course...
Oh, and I love this quote,"Every time israel attempts peace"... Ha! What a joke! How can a country which is occupying land belonging to other peoples and still illegally expanding its territory even as we speak be at the same time attempting to make peace?
The lack of reasoning by you mainstream tv news viewers is appalling, to say the least...
I disagree with hitchens on 99% of issues but I love the way he insults people because he is so articulate that it almost sounds like a compliment....
@Propagandhi900 There are much more Jews who own deeds to much more land in Arab nations of N Africa and the middle east. They were evicted and kicked out by Arab governments.
@Propagandhi900 So the question then is why are you and everyone else so concerned with Palestinians. And Jews who have been evicted from Arab countries in greater numbers, given up more land and more wealth, you are not concerned about at all. Interesting double standard, what do you think the reason for it is?
@IBeatUpThugs First, i'm taking you at face value when you say that these Jews were evicted. I haven't researched or anything. I am playing along.
The difference is this: Israel is oppressing, collectively punishing, and treating Palestinians as sub-human. This isnt currently occuring with those evicted jews e;sewhere. Nor are those Jews actively seeking to return.
@Propagandhi900 Well sounds like you need to do your research than. Why even discuss the Arab-Israeli conflict when you don't know the basic facts? Jews were punished by Arab government some were even put in internment camps. Look up the documentary forgotten refugees it is a good story. The only difference between Jewish refugees and Arab Palestinians is that Israel absorbed all the Jewish refugees, while Arab countries will not allow Palestinians to become citizens.
@IBeatUpThugs Prior to the Zionist movement, Arab nations were the only nations who did NOT hold pogroms against jews.
As well, it's irrelevant whether Israel absorbed refugees or not. It's irrelevant whether other Arab nations want to "absorb" Palestinian refugees (the grand majority hold deeds to land AND WANT TO GO BACK TO PALESTINE)
I'll look up your documentary. But I want you to look up "Occupation 101", it too is a documentary/.
It goes to show that the Arab refugee problem is intentionally contrived by Arabs. My mom was born in a refugee camp in 1946 yet I am not a refugee now. "Palestinians" are not REAL refugees just aid recipients who have invented a fake definition of a refugee that only applies to them. The majority of "Palestinian refugees" do not own deeds, have never been to Israel and are simply the grandchildren of refugees. Jewish refugees own deeds to lands 5 times the size of Israel in Arab countries.
@IBeatUpThugs Right, because Jews who believed the land belonged to them, because a book says so, have the right to evict million of Palestinians, occupy their land, oppress them, and evoke an illegal blockade on Gaza.
The exodus of Jews from Arab countries was voluntary. btw.
Please allow me to use your argument about another topic...
Let's say that the Holocaust is intentionally contrived by Jews. My mom was a prisoner in a concentration camp in 1942 yet I am not a prisoner in a concentration camp now. Most Jews have not even been to Germany or Poland, or anywhere camps may have once been built, and many Jews are simply the grandchildren of concentration camp prisoners...
So now I have used your logic, but I doubt that you will be satisfied:)
As for your question of "why are you and everyone else so concerned with Palestinians"...
Maybe it has something to do with our unwavering political, moral and financial support of Israel ( to a tune of tens of BILLIONS over the years).
Maybe because Bin Laden himself, in a taped interview released in Nov. 2004 blamed the 9'11 attack on America's military and financial support for Israel's actions against the Palestinian peoples.
Israels problems should not be ours, END OF STORY! ITS OUR MONEY
@kristopheraugust not the last one, as were still in a stalemate, but i concede Israel left Gaza for a few years until 2009... clap clap fucking clap. moron.
In any case, it's a silly analogy. Christians aren't trying to build an ark for themselves while they try wipe out everybody else. It simply has no application.
@OneEyedJack1970 No it's not, it tells people to get rid of the problem all together rather than to fix it properly. This kind of mentality can be very dangerous, specially for people like alcoholics and drug abusers.
@DoctorFJK No, the symbolism, if you will, represents God's power as Creator of the world, and His right and might to judge it. It's not meant as an example of how we should deal with our problems.
@OneEyedJack1970 That's your interpretation of that certain story isn't it though? The thing about the bible and all books for that matter is that they are open for interpretation . Why would God show his power through symbolism?
@DoctorFJK I think it actually happened, but that's beside the point. It still symbolizes something -- namely, God's power and authority. He judged the entire world once, and He's going to do it again.
To be fair, some of the laws in the Old Testament are symbolic, and only apply to certain groups (Levites, for example). Others are moral (seduction and rape certainly being among these) and apply universally.
@OneEyedJack1970 I've heard the symbolic argument several times with no consistency. Who decides whether they are symbolic or not and either way it's still bad symbolism. So according to the bible, when you rape a woman you have to marry her for life and pay her dad.
@OneEyedJack1970 Lets say Noah's ark is symbolism. It's bad symbolism because God decides to simply get rid of all the worlds population instead of fixing them. You apply that to real life and it doesn't look too good.
@DoctorFJK Noah's ark isn't a law or commandment. And how do you propose God fix the world's population, short of taking over everyone's mind? Why can't he just wipe them out and judge them? From a theistic perspective, they simply went from life to the after-life. It's not like they just ceased to exist.
@OneEyedJack1970 I never said it was, I said it was supposed symbolism. So why is it that Noah got to live? What your saying is God took the easy route. If God wanted to really help them he would have proved his existence and made everyone believe in him. He killed them and since most weren't believers most went to hell. That doesn't fix anything.
@DoctorFJK Who said the problem was that they didn't believe in Him? I'm trying to give you the benefit of the doubt when you say you've read the Bible, but you're kinda letting me down here. You keep reading your own notions into the text -- that's not a proper analysis.
@OneEyedJack1970 Sorry that's what the Muslims believe, I got my holy books mixed up. Either way getting rid of all those people is not the right thing to do, specially if its only to show his power. It shows God took the easy way out and everyone should follow god, and it was over use of his authority.
@OneEyedJack1970 Wiping out an an entire group of people isn't overusing authority? If someone was robbing a bank and holding hostages, and the policeman in charge just blew up the whole bank, is that not overusing authority? Anyway, I must go for now because I'm exhausted, I'll answer the rest tomorrow.
And Bush sr. was only a one-term President that stood up to the Jews.
That pretty much says it all.
poodtang1 1 week ago
Hitchens always refused to use formulas to understand the world but rather his own solid set of ideas grown in his vibrant intellectual world where disagreement is fine as long as one had evidence.
herringla 2 weeks ago
tail wagging the dog - the USA is on its knees begging Israel to re-fund the country after the USA expended thousands of men and trillions of dollars defending those who refuse to make Peace with their neighbours: Israel. One has to recall what the Russians had been saying before their Revolution "Jewish Bankers created the pretence of conflict - WW1 - to profit and manipulate the Goyim into creating a Jewish Homeland" which Balfour and the British did as soon as practicable. Nothing changes.
SmileyGarrish 2 weeks ago
israel has no decency
its very true- if you try reasoning with a zionists they will agree with you and do the opposite of what they say- the talmud teaches lying is ok to a goy anyway
if you tell the israeli to recognise palestine- he will insult you for it- because truth hurts
but if you are in a position of power- you put the gas chamber to the vile zionists face- i guarantee you-= I PROMISE YOU- the zionist will give palestine its land back in a day
calmiced 1 month ago
@calmiced Well that's true of every religious person. An Islamic extremist also claims they have the right to lie to Jews and non-believers, so your argument is arbitrary. What it comes down to is 2 semitic peoples who can't live together because they have 2 different racist text which tell them they should hate eachother. The 2 state solution could've been in order 60 years ago, but religious nutjobs and extremists make it impossible.
Faerlon123 1 month ago
Speaking from actual experience on the ground having lived in Jerusalem and gone through the process of emigration under the "law of return" I will agree with Hitchens. He is not letting anyone off the hook on the Muslim/so called Arab side, etc, he is simply pointing out facts per facts. If Hebrew and Arab speakers, in fact all Semites, can't introspect then we will never sort this sibling rivalry out.
jonny7748 1 month ago
Propaganda and lies come in so many forms.One irritating legend is that the Israelites were persecuted and run out of Egypt.Besides the bible no historic documentation states that that was what actually happened.The Egyptians meticulously made notes of all major events yet you will find nothing of an Exodus of the Jews from Egypt.It is more likely that they took off without being threatened. But it was crucial to build the story that "we have been persecuted for 4000 years".Bibi? Fascist.
makiavelli999 1 month ago
@makiavelli999 Very good point. Similar to the belief that Germans were to blame for WW1. Fact is, the Germans offered a negotiated peace with England in 1916 but it was the Zionists who pushed the English to keep fighting with the promise of getting the USA involved in the war in return for a Jewish state in Palestine.
doctorgerbs 1 month ago
fuckin a
jd88fan 1 month ago
@AHMEDBULAXUBEY
I suggest you Bill O'reilly as a friend. Your arguments sound really close.
MyBottletree 2 months ago
Farewell, Hitch. We'll miss you and your sheer brilliance.
toddles9 2 months ago
This man have a small brain he believe that there is no god. And we asked him where are we came from if there is no creation ? And he said I don't know. I say you have small brain and you are sick man evil man
AHMEDBULAXUBEY 2 months ago
@AHMEDBULAXUBEY troll?
TheAsymmetrical 2 months ago
@AHMEDBULAXUBEY I laugh at you in pity not mockery.
CaseRed0605 2 months ago
@AHMEDBULAXUBEY You think he had a small brain because he refused to claim absolute knowledge of something for which there is zero evidence? I'd say he was being honest. Saying "I don't know" is orders of magnitude better than pretending to know something. Preaching absolute truth about something for which there can be no answer is dishonest, insipid and ultimately destructive. Fuck everyone who teaches their children to stop thinking. They deserve ridicule.
jacksawild 1 month ago
@AHMEDBULAXUBEY and you believe "Pooffff...and there was Adam". And a talking snake tricked a woman to eat a fruit that gave her wisdom. And Jews left Egypt walking around the desert for 40 years leaving NO evidence of this. or that god would send a message to an illiterate....and no one else? and god loves to play the invisible game and watch millions of children starve to death every year- MILLIONS! slowly starving to death. That's what you believe.
tulipsontheorgan 1 month ago
This man has a fabulous brain.
GLAM8ERT 2 months ago
Five years ago or so two distingished American Academics Published a well documented book on the power of the Israel Lobby in the United States..showing a the hold was total but was rarely in America's best interests.Only published in Academic Circles, no American Newspaper would publish their article--a shortened versions of their thesis. Finally the NY Times published a heavily censored version with a headline text "These are not the views of this paper". America in the ealy 21st Century
CobinRain 7 months ago
@CobinRain Wow, two left-wing academics published an article endorsing a thoroughly left wing position and no one listened because it was exactly the same as every left-wing academic paper on the issue ever.
StudentOfObjectivism 7 months ago
@StudentOfObjectivism No one listened because it wasnt properly published for fear of the Israel lobby, you wanker. Like the mohammad drawing. And in any event how is it "left wing" to write about the Israel lobby in the US? ..It was well-researched. What more do you want? As for "left wing" it is pretty similar to what Pat Buchanan meant when he called the US Congress "another Israeli occupied territory" . If youre a big Israel /netanyahu fan be warned; the party is over.
CobinRain 7 months ago
@CobinRain You, your socialist academics and Pat Buchanan can all go fuck yourselves.
StudentOfObjectivism 7 months ago
@StudentOfObjectivism
And you can continue to remain blind, even as the truth falls into your lap...
DAMN!!! How the hell have we become such sheep?
You go right on making this a left/right/up/down/ blue/red/man/woman argument...
It will not be people like you who will change the world, and people like me and CobinRain should not waste time on those who insist on maintaining the status quo of moral degradation this society has succumbed to... when illegal wars and murder are championed. SICK!
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
@CobinRain
Do not let the sheep take you off your game mate!
For every negative comment by sheep like StudentOfObjectivism, you will also reach someone who will actually take their time to do their homework on the literature which you wrote of, and they will do their own homework and come up with their own conclusion, not what Fox tv's Rupert Murdoch ( Jewish ) or what Wolf Blitzers CNN reports wish us to believe.
Good luck in the struggle for truth!
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
@SLAVESweARE I think our "student of objectivism" has spent far too long in the cold embrace of the seriously creepy Ayn Rand to expect too much coherence. He's been reading Ayn Rnd instead of real books and, of course, factual material.I am almost afraid to open dialogue with him on Isreal because I know that his views will be, er, "ill-informed". For example, I get the sense from one of his comments that he doesnt even know who Pat Buchanan is. Is it too much to hope he'll look him up?
CobinRain 7 months ago
Oh, trust me, these folks like StudentOfObjectivism play it off like they are avid readers and self-informed folk, even as they sputter verbatim what you hear daily from Fox News, CNN and all the lying politicians who visit all these MSM shows.
In the end, these people are ideologues who may not admit it upfront, but clearly believe that human being are not all created equal.
One Israeli soldiers life takes precedent over an entire Palestinian village...
You cannot win with these mind-sets...
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago 20
@SLAVESweARE
Because we in Israel believe that one Israeli life is worth a thousend lives of everyone else. Not because of racism. For example, when Sharon made a prisioner swap with hezzbollah, he gave 4k prisioners for two corps and one Israeli man. Its hard to explain but its not because of racism we believe that.
doritela2008 5 months ago
@doritela2008
Oh, I am well aware of Jewish opinion on "non-Jews".
All "non-Jew" are referred to as goyim, which basically means cattle. Its how the jews and the Zion master sees all non jews in particular whites.
If only all these pro-Isaeli bible thumping American Christians who willingly support the state of Israel knew the contempt Zionists have for "non-Jews", I dare say allegiances would change overnight, I am certain of this.
SLAVESweARE 5 months ago
@SLAVESweARE goy means nation, goyim- is nations (plural), thats all.
the only people who use this word as an insult are religious people who are dumb anyway
so why take offence?
shedmeraked 3 months ago
@shedmeraked
Excellent point!
I like you:)
SLAVESweARE 3 months ago
But to suggest that this is not racism is folly.
I remember my history professor once making the case using anecdotal evidence, that Adolf Hitler was not really a racist against peoples of African heritage.
For example,when the Olympics were held in Germany in 1936, he explained away Jesse Owens 4 gold medal performances by insisting that blacks were simply closer to the animal kingdom, and that it was as unfair as expecting a German to outrun,say,a panther.
But lets get real, it was racism
SLAVESweARE 5 months ago
@SLAVESweARE
But its not the same... Its for a fraternity... We dont use this phrase to say kill 1000 palestinians for a single Israeli killed. We use it when it comes for example in prisioner swaps we do with the arabs in which we always liberated thousends prisioners for a single Israeli prisioner be it living or dead.
doritela2008 5 months ago
@doritela2008
In your opinion, do you think that it stands to reason that these "fraternal" traditions, if repeated and spoken often enough over a persons or nations lifetime, may further deteriorate into a belief that discriminatory treatment of those people, both socially and legally, is justified at unique moments?
Also, do you consider "anti-semitic" sentiment as racism against Jews. or do you also have an alternative definition for this mind-set?
SLAVESweARE 5 months ago
@SLAVESweARE
Answering your first question, I think it depends on the person. I for example am not racist and fight racism in my country whenever I see it. Its not that its pumped into our minds from school its just something we get through life here since we feel really united with all the terror attacks and wars (now you can agree or not that Palestinian actions are terror actions but it doesnt have anything to do with the argument). I continue in next comment
doritela2008 5 months ago
@SLAVESweARE
part 2
Right now there isnt a racism of the state (Although I admit there some stuff that need to be fixed and changed). But unfortunatly there are racist people in Israel like there are in ebery other place on earth.
About your second question, I think that the term anti-semite more relates to Jews since up until the muslim immigration to europe arabs didnt face racism because they didnt live in Europe and faced it, unlike Jews who are semites and did. .
doritela2008 5 months ago
@doritela2008
Israel is a Jewish state.
A country defined by ethnicity.
It is a racist built for the purpose.
Whocreatedgod 4 months ago
@Whocreatedgod
you can convert into jeudaism... And just for you to know, Sweden is a decleared christian state
doritela2008 4 months ago
@doritela2008
Sweden or even the UK (whose monarch is the head of the Anglican Church) does not actively fund the immigration of Christians into their countries and pursue policies that alienate and displace non-Christians...take the situation in East Jerusalem or the West Bank settlements and the rapid change in Demographics that Israel is inflicting on whatever is left of Palestine that they did not manage to rob off.
Whocreatedgod 4 months ago
@Whocreatedgod
Israel doesnt displace anyone... Non Jews with Israeli citizienship live as good as any other Jew in Israel.... Germany, the most liberal country in europe, has also a law of return jusr like Israel. Same with France and almost every other country in Europe
doritela2008 3 months ago
@doritela2008
Of course it did and it still does.
Allowing settlements, infiltrating East Jerusalem (in fact it already decided that it owns all of Jerusalem based on archaic texts), and disallowing owners of the land, 2 million approximately to return.
Saying Germany and France exercise similar laws is irrelevant to a displaced Palestinian living as a third class citizen in Lebanese or Jordanian camps. Some still hold the keys to homes in Haifa. It is tragic.
Whocreatedgod 3 months ago 9
@Whocreatedgod
There you have it! You said admitted that the arabs treat the Palestinian refugees in Lebanon, Jordan, Syria and other countries like third class citiziens... I uguess its Israel fault that the arab countries treat the Palestinians like dogs.... And sorry, no. They wont be able to return since they can only do so if they are willing to live in peace side by side with the Jews a thing I dubt they want to do... And what about the one million Jews kicked out of arab countries?
doritela2008 2 months ago
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Whocreatedgod 2 months ago
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@doritela2008
Of course it is the Israeli fault.
You'll notice that the degree of rejection or hostility towards the Palestenian refugees in Arabian countries is linked to the capacity of their fragile economies to cope with them.
You don't hear of the Palestenian plight in Dubai but you hear about Sabra/Shatila in Lebanon or Black September in Jordan. These countries are teetering on the edge of social economic meltdown. The Palestenian presence is an overwhelming burden. Thanks to Israel.
Whocreatedgod 2 months ago 2
@Whocreatedgod
You dont hear them wanting to go back to Libya, Marocco, Algeria, Iraq, Iran or other places... You know why? Because they were asimilated into the Israeli society which was made 100% of european Jews with a completly different culture. The real solution is for the Palestinian refugees to be assimilated into the countries they now take refuge in. After all they are all arabs wether they are lebanese. Palestinians or Syrians.
doritela2008 2 months ago
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@doritela2008
You don't hear them wanting to go back to Libya or Morocco
because they are neither Libyans nor Moroccans.
Such is the balance of power that you can get away with proposing that Palestenians just go bugger off and assimilate into some random Arabian place! They ought not to be in such a predicament. The business of sponsoring Israelis to flourish and settle on land at the expense of the misery of its owners is simply breathtaking.
Whocreatedgod 2 months ago
@Whocreatedgod
Its not israel's fault that the Palestinians are treated like sh*t in arab countries.... And there arent 2 mil Palestinians refugees since 700k left Israel in the 1948 war.... And according to international law the decendents of the refugees arent labled as refugees
doritela2008 1 month ago
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@doritela2008
Give them their homes back and they will not be treated so badly.
If Immigrant from all parts of Eastern Europe and Russia can just occupy the land
claiming that since their 80th ancestor was Israeli, then they are Israeli too and have a right to the land that none of their ancestors have lived in in centuries or even millennia...why wouldn't you label descendants of refugees as refugees?
Land ownership, apparently, is in the genes...right Zionist??
Whocreatedgod 1 month ago
@Whocreatedgod the same number of pals who lost there homes after 48 around 700,000. jews living in arab lands the same number 700,000 lost there homes tragic yet no talk of those jews
momobear67 1 month ago
@momobear67
Of course not.
Jews emigrated out of Morocco, Egypt and Ethiopia out of their own will.
Arabs were forced out.
No comparison whatsoever.
Whocreatedgod 1 month ago
@Whocreatedgod ur full of shit just type in sephardic jewish refugees 1948 and educate yourself. also in the case of pal refugees there would have been zero if they agreed to the un partition and would have a state but instead they choose war. thinking once arab armies crossed the boarder the new jewish state would be destroyed but we know what happened
momobear67 1 month ago
@momobear67
Educate myself on what?
Jewish Diaspora leaving their home countries willingly and be sponsored to come grab Palestenian land and establish a bastard country unknown to the region for two millennia.
That is what I've been saying all along you idiot !
And, If the Palestenian refugees agreed to what?????
Their land..they have every right to remain there and you come out of nowhere with thousands of immigrants to grab the land and then start imposing this and imposing that?
Whocreatedgod 1 month ago
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momobear67 1 month ago
@Whocreatedgod Yes educate yourself read some academic material.
momobear67 1 month ago
@momobear67
Academic material like "type in sephardic jewish 1948".... !!!!
What a tosser !!
Start by learning your caps first!
Imagine going to a bitter Palestinian, some still holding keys and deeds to homes in Yaffa and AlKhalil and say to them...
Fuck your homeland you are never getting them back because an American humorist that probably none of you care about claimed in 18-eighty-something he didn't see Arabs around...
!!!!
Zionist tosser. Without Western support you'd never even dare
Whocreatedgod 1 month ago
@Whocreatedgod I have a course book full of articles abut the history of sephardic jews I took a 9 credit course last year at york university. I was never taking away anything from pal refugees I was just pointing out about the forgotten sephardic jewish refugees. To dismiss them as you have done and many people do is an injustice.
momobear67 1 month ago
@momobear67
Sounds like you took a university course in Propaganda.
I never dismissed your claims. Shameless liar.
Those refugees of yours were not kicked out by the Palestenians whose lands were stolen by your Zionist gangs.
I still have no idea why all your alleged Sephardic Jews would want to become
refugees only to go and steal the land and cause misery.
Israel is one big Settlement project for a nation of people
who are obsessed with their race and their delusional texts.
Whocreatedgod 1 month ago
@Whocreatedgod cool story bro
momobear67 1 month ago
@momobear67
Cool story?
You mock the suffering of the people whom you've humiliated and denigrated by robbing them of their land and dignity?
How would you like it if someone mocked your Holocaust and said to you "Cool Story"?
Whocreatedgod 4 weeks ago
@Whocreatedgod if you care about people who have suffered and robbed of their land the most out of anyone in the history of humans that belongs to the jewish people. The jews the only exiled nation to return back to the homeland after 2000 years and survived is a story like no other. Be a champion for human rights stand up for israel!!
momobear67 4 weeks ago 3
@momobear67
TOTAL TYPICAL ISRAELI Bollocks!
DNA studies prove that Ashkenazi Jews are so closely related to Palestenians that it is likely that Palestenians are but the Chrisitians and Jews who have adopted the language and religion of the conquering Arabs.
So, one group maintained the ownership of the land for millennia. Your so called modern jews are an offshoot that deserted their land and now want to come back to steal it all to themselves
No Israeli Jew has any right to any land there
Whocreatedgod 4 weeks ago
@Whocreatedgod world most famous "palestinian" ARAFAT =born in egypt !
His ancestral tribe "AL-QUDWA"= from syria !
JUDEA to the JEWS
ARABS back to saudi ARABIA !
MrJapaneseboy1111 1 week ago
Whocreatedgod 1 week ago
@Whocreatedgod "al-Mughrabi" = the Moroccan ("Maghreb" – meaning "West" in Arabic, and usually referring to North Africa or specifically to Morocco) ,"Dalal Mughrabi"
"al-Djazair"=the Algerian
"al-Qurashi"=saudi arabia "clan of Quraish"
"al-azd" =yemen "Azd tribe"
"al-Yamani"= the Yemeni "Issam Al Yamani"
MrJapaneseboy1111 1 week ago
@Whocreatedgod "Bardawil" ="salah bardawil" HAMAS legislator in gaza,egypt "bardawil lake" area
"nashashibi"= syria.
"Bushnak" =bosnia
"zoabi"= from iraq "Haneen Zoabi".
"Turki" =turkey "Daud Turki"
"al-Kurd" = kurdistan
MrJapaneseboy1111 1 week ago
@MrJapaneseboy1111
Are you retarded?
20% of Israelis are Arabs and there are 2 million displaced from land now called Israel used to be called Palesteine.
And so what if your stupid list of names is of non-local etymology?
What if all of Hamas has names of Japanese etymology...?
Does it make all those Palestenians less Palestenian?
Another youtube retard...I don't know why there are so many of them on this website.
Whocreatedgod 1 week ago
@Whocreatedgod a japanese living in sweden is still japanese
no such thing as a jewish arab or europian jews
even jews in europe used to be called palestinians by the europian
the only palestinians are= JEWS
MrJapaneseboy1111 6 days ago
@momobear67
Here is the reference:
^ a b Nebel et al., "High-resolution Y chromosome haplotypes of Israeli and Palestinian Arabs reveal geographic substructure and substantial overlap with haplotypes of Jews." Human Genetics Vol. 107, No. 6, (December 2000), pp. 630–641
No Israeli Jew of Immigrant descent has any right whatsoever to land in modern day Israel or Palestine. It belongs to the gourps who have maintained continuous ownership of the land.
Whocreatedgod 4 weeks ago
@momobear67 After 2000 years, it is not your homeland anymore.
secretsantaone 2 days ago
@secretsantaone jerusalem has been the jewish capital for more then 2000 years and has had a continuous jewish population since then
momobear67 2 days ago
@momobear67 It has not however, been the capital of Israel for 2000 years. The state was forcibly created and was massively unfair to the people already living there.
secretsantaone 2 days ago
@secretsantaone your right totally unfair, the fact that Jerusalem has been destroyed twice, besieged 23 times, attacked 52 times, and captured and recaptured 44 times is also unfair. reasons why jews used to live and now do live in jerusalem. Only nation who have been exiled and from their land and return. fact it happened 2000 years later dispersed throughout the word and survived is incredible. the story of the jewish people is one like no other. Love the Jews
momobear67 2 days ago
@momobear67 I'm not saying I hate the Jews, I'm saying they have no right to the land. I cannot forcibly evict the owners of my old apartment just because 'I used to live there'. Even if my landlord evicted me unfairly.
secretsantaone 1 day ago
@secretsantaone even if you believe israel was unjustly made into a state does that matter? it is here now. many countries and borders have been made unjustly or whatever does not mean they don't have a right to live.
momobear67 1 day ago
@doritela2008 Most people in sweden are atheists, it is traditionally a christian nation but now one of the most secular in the world.
TheLogicalKey 3 months ago
@TheLogicalKey
Israel has the highiest number of atheists per capita. Being Jewish doesnt mean being religious
doritela2008 3 months ago
@doritela2008 I know being jewish can just mean it is your race and not religion. Are you sure Israel has the most atheists per capita though? More than places like sweden, estonia, denmark, japan?
TheLogicalKey 3 months ago
@TheLogicalKey
From what I know, yes
doritela2008 2 months ago
@doritela2008
Can I convert to 'jeudaism' become an atheist ("Israel has the highiest number of atheists per capita") and still get a Right of Return?
LOL. Greatest scam on the planet.
ZionistsKillJews 1 month ago
@ZionistsKillJews
Actually yes you can
doritela2008 1 month ago
@doritela2008
Deceit LOL
ZionistsKillJews 1 month ago
@ZionistsKillJews
So whats the problem? Every country has the right to decide its own immigration policy
doritela2008 1 month ago
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ZionistsKillJews 1 month ago
@doritela2008 "Every country has the right to decide its own immigration policy"
Sure, but since the defeat of Hitler, 'ethno-nationalist' immigration policies are rejected in the civilianised world.
Oh well, guess there were 'winners and losers'.
ZionistsKillJews 1 month ago
@ZionistsKillJews
Since a person can convert to Jeudaism, your claim of ethno-nationalism are false... Everyone can immigrate to Israel if they convert.. Even after they convert they still remain atheist (Many women and men that got married to a Jewish partner, converted in order to immigrate to Israel but they still remained Jewish) .
doritela2008 1 month ago
@doritela2008
"Even after they convert they still remain atheist" i.e. convert to Zionism not Judaism.
Exactly, you prove Zionism is antithetical to Judaism.
ZionistsKillJews 1 month ago
@ZionistsKillJews
No they dont... Since in order for your conversion to be regarded as legal, you need to do an orthodox convertion to Jeudaism... And just to remind you that orthodox Jews are anti zionists.... Therefore, you claim that they convert into zionism is false...
doritela2008 1 month ago
@doritela2008
"still remain atheist" isn't Judaism, silly.
ZionistsKillJews 1 month ago
@SLAVESweARE gilad shalit one israeli soldior for 1000 pali prisoners
momobear67 1 month ago
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@momobear67
"gilad shalit one israeli soldior for 1000 pali prisoners "...
Yeah, that sounds about right. I mean, that's about what Israeli Jews are outnumbered by present day, right? About 1 Israeli Jew for every thousand Arabs, right?
The experiment called the state of Israel lasted longer than I ever would have expected... But now the bell tolls for thee.... So sad you know? The world will be one less military aggressor state.... Maybe not so sad after all:)
SLAVESweARE 1 month ago
Do these people really believe it's a beautiful,wonderful world, with the manipulation, stealing of the public's treasury, famines, illegal war's of choice with it's Depleted Uranium and White Phosphorus, the dumbing down of the people through propagandized media and failed public educational school system?
So what is StudentOfObjectivism defending? The stauts quo?
Is he really fine with the way our "leaders" are going about things?
These are ideologues, who love conflict and require enemies:)
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
How many movies have been made showing the suffering of the Palestenians at the hands of the Isrealis?
This may not be what YOU believe, but surely in a hundred years time you would expect SOMEONE to come about and make a movie on this subject,correct?
Not one movie??? Not one???
On a subject which is part of everyday American mainstream thought?
You need some reading up on how propaganda is prevalent not only in Hollywood but elsewhere too.
As for the U.S-Israel alliance,time will tell:)
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
You truly feel that this is pure luck???
You know how many boobs out there actually consider Hollywood a history lesson?
There's a whole generation of Americans out there who's only history lesson of Pearl Harbor was Ben Aflecks movie by the same name... And so on and so on...
This is well known to the establishment...
The Jews of Hollywood self typecast themselves as the poor but wise victims of a crazy world full of irrational hatred, and they are always the ones who can free us...
WAKE UP!
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
It all movie fiction and make-belief, right?
Like UFO's, or the Soviet/Russian conspiracy in Angelina Jolie's recent movie SALT...
So where is there the Hollywood movie broaching the whole "Zionists control everything" mythology, which would make an interesting take on popular belief amongst millions, even if its not true...
NOT ONE MOVIE portraying Israel as the conspirator.
M oh my ,but how many movies have been made regarding Jews being the most persecuted lifeforms on Earth???
WAKE UP
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
HA HA HA!!! How long has Hollywood been around for? 100 years+?
Russia/USSR, America, European countries, Africa, South America, Arabs as a whole have often been portrayed as the "ruthless bad guys" to the movie plot.
Name me ONE Hollywood movie where Israel was portrayed as the country behind the conspiracy... Or one mainstream HW movie which had Zionists as the puppet masters in a plot, even as fiction?
These are prevailing believed ideas by many, like UFO's.
Not ONE movie in a century!!!
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
I'm not sure how young you are, but the younger the better, so you can be witness to what Israel will become over the next 20 years...
This is a nation which has used up all its favors.
The U.S is finally waking up and realizing that its and Israeli interests are not identical.
AIPAC no longer fly's under the radar. Everyone acknowledges their agenda.
Many nations are now waking up.
Here in the U.S, things will take time, what with Zionist Hollywood and the MSM, but soon the sheeple will learn!
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
Check out the book "The Israeli Connection: Who Israel Arms and Why" by Benjamin Beit-Hallahmi to learn what Israel truly stands for...
Either way, you are indicative of many of the pro-Israeli lately, all angry, but I understand.
Turkey, a long-time ally, is no longer.
Egypt 1st act after ousting Israeli puppet Mubarek was to open the Rafah border crossing into Gaza permanently to most Palestinians .
Obama and his administration were insulted by Netanyahu's visit...
All are waking up buddy!!!
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
You sure do spend a shit-load of time defending the State of ISrael...
-A state which has a smaller population than New York City!
-A country so small that it can fit into the State of Florida 8 times over!
-A country that relies on U.S taxpayers hand-outs for its military
-A country with almost 80 violations concerning U.N. Security Council Resolutions ,the U.N. Charter, the Geneva Conventions, international terrorism, or other violations of international law.
And YOU are the good guy?
JERK
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
@snackster27
You blamed Muslims for the business of slavery in an earlier post...
Since u insist on ignoring my quotes showing Israeli leaders admitting that the 1967 war was an Israeli war of aggression, please share with me your thoughts on the well established history of Jewish involvement in the slave trade? The jews owned most of those slave ships and jews were the biggest majority owner of the slaves themselves.
But I am sure that you will dispute this- Google Rabbi Marc Lee Raphael
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
Lastly, at no point did I mention that I felt any Muslims were exempt from blame.
In fact, I agreed with your earlier point about Islam countries corruption.
What I will say is that we need to rid ourselves of people with mind sets like yours as soon as possible.
People like u NEED conflict.
You need to have boogie men to justify your love of conflict.
You love to pick sides and believe in the whole “comic book” silliness of 100% good guy vs 100% bad guy.
You're all corrupt, you just dont care
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
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SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
SInce 9/11, how many civilians have Muslims killed on American soil?
Average number of American civilians who die from murder, disease, accidents, smoking every year numbers over 2 MILLION per year ( government numbers).
Times that by 10, since 9/11...
And you are gonna attempt the whole "the sky is falling because of radical muslims" routine on me???
You must be joking!
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
"building an economy for them?" HA
OH really? And I suppose long long ago a bunch of westerners took a troop of diggers to the Mideast who buried all the oil which exists in that part of the world and can now claim it theirs...
Oh, right... They owned the equipment which helped drill that oil, and this gives them the right to overthrow and install whichever dictators THEY choose, no matter how ruthless, and these ME nations can never put their own people ahead for the rest of history...
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
Ah...but BLOWBACK is only a legitimate excuse when used by AMERICA and ISRAEL!!!!
Ideologues like you are impossible...
-Good luck attempting to convince the world that the most powerful armies in the world, with their top-of-the-line weaponry are the underdog victims...
-Good luck attempting to convince the world that the use of Depleted Uranium and White Phosphorus on civilian targets is acceptable.
-Good luck attempting to convince the world that Israel is not enslaving an entire peoples
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
If Bin Laden was the mastermind of and admitted to 9/11, shouldn't I go to him for the reason the attacks were perpetrated?
-Israel says the Arabs are evil, its in their blood
-America says its cause " they hate us for our freedom"
No..... I think I will go to the group which admits responsibility... And when I do, they say it was protest against the way the Palestinians are treated by Israel, and by how U.S money supports this, and how the U.S opened military bases on S.Arabian soil.
BLOWBACK!
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
The people of Egypt, Tunisia,Morocco,Bahrain,Yemen,Saudi Arabia,Algeria, and countless other Arab peoples are WELL AWARE that their dictatorial regimes are backed and propped up by U.S money...
AND U EXPECT NO BLOWBACK?
So only Israel and the U.S have right to self-defense,huh?
Spain, Uk, 9/11 are not self- defense and protests of the wars, huh?
YOU ARE COMPLETELY INCONSISTENT WITH YOUR STANDARDS IN JUDGEMENT!
9/11 was not the start of anything...it was Arab protest for U.S involvement in ME.
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
The U.S/Israel and the west has meddled in the business of Arab/muslims for the greater portion of the last century, and continue to this day...AND U EXPECT NO BLOWBACK?????????
One 2 hour window on 9/11 is all the justification you need to have the U.S go around and set the world on fire with its bombs, yet 40+ years of Palestinian occupation is not going to foment anger and hatred in the Palestinian, of which app. 600,000 are young people were not even born then????????????????????????????
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
GO ahead with the standard propaganda line of the Western/Israeli version of history... That all of the Arab countries immediately tried to destroy Israel upon its creation...
Real history shows that only AFTER Israel expelled some 300,000 Palestinians form their existing homes and the Zionists took control of regions well beyond the area of the original Jewish state that was proposed by the U.N...only THEN was Israel attacked by its neighbors in 1948.
But u go on selecting only what u wish
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
AND I QUOTE:
- there was "no threat of destruction" but that the attack on Egypt, Jordan and Syria was nevertheless justified so that Israel could "exist according the scale, spirit, and quality she now embodies." "There was never a danger of extermination. This hypothesis had never been considered in any serious meeting."
-General Ezer Weizman, Chief of Operations, Israeli Defence Forces, General Staff:
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
Oh, of course!!!!
You will use the same baseless argument where you give justification for the U.S going around killing millions the last 50 years.
The U.S/Israel has enemies, and must defend,right?
Oh, I know, lets take the Israeli 6 day war, which is used as justification for military land grabs since then...
The story goes that Israel had to defend itself form the crazy Arabs... They had no choice...
It was survival or being taken over...RIGHT????
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
You know as well as I do that that there is vicious debate over the historical accuracy of the Torah and interpretations of archeological discoveries.
The discovery of a pottery shard with Hebrew inscription within the general area of modern day Israel is not proof of an Israeli Kingdom on par with Egypt, Rome,Babylon or Greece, so save your breath.
You take the Bible out of the equation, with the whole "right of Jews to this land" garbage, and what justification does Israel have to occupy?
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
@snackster27
Obviously, you have an answer for everything, so I'll be finishing with my last few comments, as you are simply an ideologue who has the whole good/guys vs bad guys and nothing in-between shit the U.S is famous for brainwashing its population in the fantastic public indoctrinating "education" system.
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
AND I QUOTE:
“ In June 1967 we had a choice…Egyptian army concentrations in the Sinai approaches did not prove that Nasser was really about to attack us. We must be honest with ourselves. We decided to attack him.” -MENACHEM BEGIN, Israeli PM
AND I QUOTE:
"I do not believe that Nasser wanted war. The two divisions which he sent into Sinai on May 14 would not have been enough to unleash an offensive against Israel. He knew it and we knew it."
-Yitzhak Rabin, Israeli Defence Forces and PM
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
@snackster27
DID I FORGET TO MENTION OUR LONG-TIME PARTNERSHIP WITH ISLAMIC,NUCLEAR ARMED, MILITARY RULED PAKISTAN?
I can mention many more Islamic nations/leaders who have been financed, supported, even installed or kept in power by the U.S and other western nations over this past century until the present...
But what are facts to you anyway, right?
You get to stay anonymous and post Youtube comments, because you would be crushed in an open, public forum and exposed as the ideologue you are.
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
Or U.S supported Muslim dictatorial leader Suharto of Indonesia,or of DIctatorial Kuwait ( who had the highest % of jailed journalists in the world when we "helped" them in 1991)?
Or Dictator countries of Morocco and Algeria who the U.S supports?
Wasn't Saddam supported for 2 full decades by the U.S, including the times when he was gassing innocent people?
WOW! For a religion and people that has "been at war for the rest of the world", they sure get huge support by our United State, huh????????
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
As I write,popular democratic citizen uprisings in Bahrain and Yemen are being suppressed with the help of the U.S, who backs those countries dictatorial leaders. And the Zionist media mentions nothing here.
Only after 40+ years were the people of Egypt able to rid themselves of U.S backed dictator Mubarak, and Tunisian people of dictator Ben Ali, who was given $100's of millions by the U.S.
Lets not forget our friends the Saudi's, of which 15 of the 19 9/11 hijackers and Osama hailed from.
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
I see our U.S politicians insisting every day on tv, print and radio that America's interests lay with the practical and material factors and considerations,yet when it comes to Israel I see absolute ideological notions taking precedent.
How does it benefit Americans to be enemies with Iran rather than mutual business partners?
Iran would LOVE to do business with us...
This is but one of a million examples.
It does not make sense, except that our country has been hijacked, and I see the signs.
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
Remove the Jewish influence and I would be harping about the next scandal within the U.S ...
I grant you this...
The worlds never gonna be ideal, but I and many others get a real sick feeling when we are embroiling ourselves in wars on behalf of our Jewish "friends", or picking obvious sides in a conflict and adopting Israels enemies as our own.
I would sooner be friends and business partners with all the Arab states, than be their enemy for just little ol' Israel, who fits into Florida 8 times!
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
All these bankers, politicians, media moguls, with the vast Jewish influence, have created a shit world...
Absolute shit!
Would things be different if others had as strong an influence?
Not sure... But at this moment in time, I see a vast influence within my North American culture, and I want to hold people accountable...
If I'm gonna be screwed, may it be by the hands of my own, not by some Zionist nuts who see Americans as a strategic asset, to be thrown to the lions when no longer needed...
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
@snackster27 It's not anti-israeli.
It's pro-truth.
Propagandhi900 7 months ago
@snackster27
Conspiracy shit what????
Look at many of the global financiers/bankers past and present...
All the heads of the major cable stations in the U.S...
Google "List of Jewish American politicians"...
Perhaps you are one who is proud of Jewish achievements to this extend...
Fair enough...
But do not suggest that this influence is conjured up by "conspiracy theorists".
Replace all these Jewish names with Scientologists, and tell me you would not put 2 and 2 together...
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
@snackster27
Islam presents a grave threat? TO WHOM???
With the exception of 19 muslims and a window of 2 hours over the stretch of 235 years of American history, how have Americans daily lives been affected by these so called "islamic terrorists "?
Conversely, how has the the west and Israel meddled in the everyday lives of Arabs over the last century?
A terrorist is anyone who is not on the side of America or Israel.
Muslims today, Soviets earlier, space aliens tomorrow...
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
@snackster27 To broaden your mind, explore other ideas, different view points, form an opinion not based on one source...
The same reason that I, as a communist, read anarchist literature, Ayn Rand books and books from other Communist tendencies not my own. Why I watch Michael Moore, and turn to watch Fox News for a while.
Propagandhi900 7 months ago
I am not questioning the existence of the modern state of Israel, as defined post-1948...even if I disagree on how these events came about with the violent expulsion of the previous centuries inhabitants...
But to justify the ever-increasing encroachment on the Golan Heights,Gaza, West Bank and Jerusalem, what to speak of the gross attacks on Lebanon over the years,is utterly pitiful.
I do not defend Hamas, Hezbollah, et al, but that there are those who defend Israel is sickening...
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
@snackster27
I find nothing impressive about the state of Israel over any Arab country.
Jewish leaders have been involved in scandal... They wage illegal wars and kill children too..
if a Jew born and raised in Brooklyn,NY feels that he and his people have a right to land in the area which was called Palestine for the last thousand years prior to 1948, then why the hell does a Palestinian Arab living anywhere not have the same right to call parts of this area their home also?
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
I am none too impressed with many of the Arab nations. Great point...
But in the end, I am concerned about my immediate family,friends, community and country.
I am tired of these damn Zionists taking over our tv, media, movies, politicians and foreign policy.
And DO NOT challenge me on those assertions. Its as plain as the nose on my face, and I refuse to be blinded like some sheep out there.
Let them all, Jews and Muslims, slaughter each other.
I don't want my tax dollars picking sides.
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
hitchens really doesnt like clinton hahaha
UtopiaMinor666 7 months ago
@snackster27 Yes. Zionism is justified by the Old Testament. God promised the land to the Jewish people.
The Jews didn't buy it. They evicted people from their homes, and STOLE it. The refugees still hold the deeds to the land.
You are so fucking ignorant to the facts. Go watch "Occupation 101".
Propagandhi900 7 months ago
@snackster27
It isn't their Palestinian land?
Prove to me it's the Jews land then, WITHOUT using Bible stories of course...
Oh, and I love this quote,"Every time israel attempts peace"... Ha! What a joke! How can a country which is occupying land belonging to other peoples and still illegally expanding its territory even as we speak be at the same time attempting to make peace?
The lack of reasoning by you mainstream tv news viewers is appalling, to say the least...
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
I disagree with hitchens on 99% of issues but I love the way he insults people because he is so articulate that it almost sounds like a compliment....
AegeanKing 8 months ago
I don't understand what he's saying. Is he saying that the 20% of arabs that live in Isreal own homes in Jerusalem?
lauraleesmithagain 8 months ago
@lauraleesmithagain He's saying that there are arabs all over Israel and Palesitne who hold deeds to homes and land.
They were evicted and kicked out by Jewish settlers.
Propagandhi900 7 months ago
@Propagandhi900 There are much more Jews who own deeds to much more land in Arab nations of N Africa and the middle east. They were evicted and kicked out by Arab governments.
IBeatUpThugs 7 months ago
@IBeatUpThugs So that gives them the right to evict Palestinians who had nothing to do with it?
Two wrongs don't make a right.
Propagandhi900 7 months ago
@Propagandhi900 So that gives Arab governments the right to evict 850k-1million Jews who had nothing to do with it?
IBeatUpThugs 7 months ago
@IBeatUpThugs No. I am saying, that the Jews did not have the right to evict the Palestinians.
As noone has the right ti evict anyone who can produce deeds to land and home.
Propagandhi900 7 months ago
@Propagandhi900 So the question then is why are you and everyone else so concerned with Palestinians. And Jews who have been evicted from Arab countries in greater numbers, given up more land and more wealth, you are not concerned about at all. Interesting double standard, what do you think the reason for it is?
IBeatUpThugs 7 months ago
@IBeatUpThugs First, i'm taking you at face value when you say that these Jews were evicted. I haven't researched or anything. I am playing along.
The difference is this: Israel is oppressing, collectively punishing, and treating Palestinians as sub-human. This isnt currently occuring with those evicted jews e;sewhere. Nor are those Jews actively seeking to return.
Propagandhi900 7 months ago
@Propagandhi900 Well sounds like you need to do your research than. Why even discuss the Arab-Israeli conflict when you don't know the basic facts? Jews were punished by Arab government some were even put in internment camps. Look up the documentary forgotten refugees it is a good story. The only difference between Jewish refugees and Arab Palestinians is that Israel absorbed all the Jewish refugees, while Arab countries will not allow Palestinians to become citizens.
IBeatUpThugs 7 months ago
@IBeatUpThugs Prior to the Zionist movement, Arab nations were the only nations who did NOT hold pogroms against jews.
As well, it's irrelevant whether Israel absorbed refugees or not. It's irrelevant whether other Arab nations want to "absorb" Palestinian refugees (the grand majority hold deeds to land AND WANT TO GO BACK TO PALESTINE)
I'll look up your documentary. But I want you to look up "Occupation 101", it too is a documentary/.
Propagandhi900 7 months ago
It goes to show that the Arab refugee problem is intentionally contrived by Arabs. My mom was born in a refugee camp in 1946 yet I am not a refugee now. "Palestinians" are not REAL refugees just aid recipients who have invented a fake definition of a refugee that only applies to them. The majority of "Palestinian refugees" do not own deeds, have never been to Israel and are simply the grandchildren of refugees. Jewish refugees own deeds to lands 5 times the size of Israel in Arab countries.
IBeatUpThugs 7 months ago
@IBeatUpThugs Right, because Jews who believed the land belonged to them, because a book says so, have the right to evict million of Palestinians, occupy their land, oppress them, and evoke an illegal blockade on Gaza.
The exodus of Jews from Arab countries was voluntary. btw.
Propagandhi900 7 months ago
@IBeatUpThugs
Please allow me to use your argument about another topic...
Let's say that the Holocaust is intentionally contrived by Jews. My mom was a prisoner in a concentration camp in 1942 yet I am not a prisoner in a concentration camp now. Most Jews have not even been to Germany or Poland, or anywhere camps may have once been built, and many Jews are simply the grandchildren of concentration camp prisoners...
So now I have used your logic, but I doubt that you will be satisfied:)
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
As for your question of "why are you and everyone else so concerned with Palestinians"...
Maybe it has something to do with our unwavering political, moral and financial support of Israel ( to a tune of tens of BILLIONS over the years).
Maybe because Bin Laden himself, in a taped interview released in Nov. 2004 blamed the 9'11 attack on America's military and financial support for Israel's actions against the Palestinian peoples.
Israels problems should not be ours, END OF STORY! ITS OUR MONEY
SLAVESweARE 7 months ago
@kristopheraugust not the last one, as were still in a stalemate, but i concede Israel left Gaza for a few years until 2009... clap clap fucking clap. moron.
shariotoflove 8 months ago
In any case, it's a silly analogy. Christians aren't trying to build an ark for themselves while they try wipe out everybody else. It simply has no application.
OneEyedJack1970 8 months ago
@OneEyedJack1970 No it's not, it tells people to get rid of the problem all together rather than to fix it properly. This kind of mentality can be very dangerous, specially for people like alcoholics and drug abusers.
DoctorFJK 8 months ago
@DoctorFJK No, the symbolism, if you will, represents God's power as Creator of the world, and His right and might to judge it. It's not meant as an example of how we should deal with our problems.
OneEyedJack1970 8 months ago
@OneEyedJack1970 That's your interpretation of that certain story isn't it though? The thing about the bible and all books for that matter is that they are open for interpretation . Why would God show his power through symbolism?
DoctorFJK 8 months ago
@DoctorFJK I think it actually happened, but that's beside the point. It still symbolizes something -- namely, God's power and authority. He judged the entire world once, and He's going to do it again.
OneEyedJack1970 8 months ago
To be fair, some of the laws in the Old Testament are symbolic, and only apply to certain groups (Levites, for example). Others are moral (seduction and rape certainly being among these) and apply universally.
OneEyedJack1970 8 months ago
@OneEyedJack1970 I've heard the symbolic argument several times with no consistency. Who decides whether they are symbolic or not and either way it's still bad symbolism. So according to the bible, when you rape a woman you have to marry her for life and pay her dad.
DoctorFJK 8 months ago
@DoctorFJK You're saying it's bad symbolism without even identifying the symbolic laws or what they symbolize. That's not rational position to take.
OneEyedJack1970 8 months ago
@OneEyedJack1970 Lets say Noah's ark is symbolism. It's bad symbolism because God decides to simply get rid of all the worlds population instead of fixing them. You apply that to real life and it doesn't look too good.
DoctorFJK 8 months ago
@DoctorFJK Noah's ark isn't a law or commandment. And how do you propose God fix the world's population, short of taking over everyone's mind? Why can't he just wipe them out and judge them? From a theistic perspective, they simply went from life to the after-life. It's not like they just ceased to exist.
OneEyedJack1970 8 months ago
@OneEyedJack1970 I never said it was, I said it was supposed symbolism. So why is it that Noah got to live? What your saying is God took the easy route. If God wanted to really help them he would have proved his existence and made everyone believe in him. He killed them and since most weren't believers most went to hell. That doesn't fix anything.
DoctorFJK 8 months ago
@DoctorFJK Who said the problem was that they didn't believe in Him? I'm trying to give you the benefit of the doubt when you say you've read the Bible, but you're kinda letting me down here. You keep reading your own notions into the text -- that's not a proper analysis.
OneEyedJack1970 8 months ago
@OneEyedJack1970 Sorry that's what the Muslims believe, I got my holy books mixed up. Either way getting rid of all those people is not the right thing to do, specially if its only to show his power. It shows God took the easy way out and everyone should follow god, and it was over use of his authority.
DoctorFJK 8 months ago
@DoctorFJK "It shows God took the easy way out and everyone should follow god, and it was over use of his authority."
Again, how so? Specifically, how was it an overuse of His authority?
OneEyedJack1970 8 months ago
@OneEyedJack1970 Wiping out an an entire group of people isn't overusing authority? If someone was robbing a bank and holding hostages, and the policeman in charge just blew up the whole bank, is that not overusing authority? Anyway, I must go for now because I'm exhausted, I'll answer the rest tomorrow.
DoctorFJK 8 months ago
@DoctorFJK "Wiping out an an entire group of people isn't overusing authority?"
This is God we're talking about. Not some human agency.
"If someone was robbing a bank and holding hostages, and the policeman in charge just blew up the whole bank, is that not overusing authority?"
I'm afraid it would be more than just that.
"Anyway, I must go for now because I'm exhausted, I'll answer the rest tomorrow. "
Take a break, and think about some of the things that've been said.
OneEyedJack1970 8 months ago