Just because he teaches similarity to Universalism doesn't mean he isn't entitled to his opinion. He is no false teacher, because Christianity is defined differently by every Christian with a relationship with God. Yours is obviously different then mind, doesn't mean I think your going to burn in Hell it means you have a different view.
This guy believes in universalism. He is a false teacher that teaches there is no judgement for sinners. Read 2 Peter and tell me what the Bible says about people like him.
The sad truth is that those who support and love this guy will not read 2 Peter, nor the Bible at all.
@TheEskatos You really believe this guy doesn't read the bible? Really? Have you actually read any of his stuff? Or do you follow the popular conservative-christian trends and just declare Rob Bell a universalist because that's what everyone else is doing? He isn't a universalist. He ha said that many, many times. Yet ignorant people like you continue to forget the actual point of his message and simply choose to besmirch him regardless.
I Believe God is a Type of energy, and energy cannot be created or Destroyed. It's been proven that Energy is what holds Matter in Existence. if your keyboard did not have the same energy, It would not Exist.
Everything we see or Do involves energy. It's amazing how everything falls back on Energy (God)
John 4:24 Says God is a spirit, and a spirit is a type of energy. It's so beautiful
@blessedguys how is this video weak? He is just saying that enlightened people throughout history who may have gone against the social grain believed "there is more". How is that weak?
"While there is more, you deserve none of it. You cannot earn more of it. You cannot work your way to it. All the work you do to reach it is pathetically insufficient. All your ideas of what is good is entirely offensive to God. All your intentions are corrupt and they stain all your attempts at right living.
"Only Christ accomplished anything pleasing to God. Fall at his feet and worship Him.
"Pray that you come to more fully appreciate His work."
@igystrvigy what u say is exactly right. that only Christ accomplished what is pleasing to God. so therefore all ur intentions and all ur attempts at doing good are pathetic stained and corrupt. so igystrvigy keep ur mouth shut until u come to know God urself before u go around parading ur foolishness infront of everyone.
@Farajyusufov Did I insult your idol (Rob Bell)? I know the Lord, Jesus Christ personally. I never attacked Bell's salvation. I criticized his fluffy approach that has little support in scripture. Who are you to judge my salvation?
@igystrvigy ( and everybody else) I'm happy that you all are Christians, but attacking each other about it is nonsense. I want to see some of that brotherly love. ok?
@JakeSchoby Being a Christian doesn't mean being an uncritical doormat idiot. Disagreeing is not unloving. But if Christianity is the power of God unto salvation, then you darn well better believe that I will take it very seriously and take to task its detractors.
@igystrvigy actually you probably shouldn't be putting anyone down who is willing to bring the fruit (although perhaps in an unorthodox method) of Jesus to the masses and really put himself out there. People are different (which goes without really needing to be said) and in those differences we look at things in different ways which means that perhaps in Rob can reach some that otheriwse could never be reached with the "standard approach". Good on him, for him willing to get out there.
@Farajyusufov even if mankind is in deed stained and corrupt (which i agree with), it should never be the excuse for us to stop trying to be more Christ-like. Although i might not agree with "parading" people ...sometimes softer words can help instead of "until u come to know God urself" slogans that have barbs attached in their meaning. Do any of us really "know" God? We come to understand His attributes & involvement on earth but we really fall short of "knowing" Him or His plan.
If you were describing to someone God, Christianity, and what this means for our lives ... how would you do this? What is the simplist way that allows that person to open their hearts to the idea of a loving God?
How would you describe what Jesus sacrifice for us and what he taught in a way that that person would feel at peace with your answer?
This is a question that takes time and has no definitative answer.
Living a Christian life in front of people is very important. But if we rely on this as our main evangelism tool, we are missing out on many witnessing opportunities. You don't know if a certain person will live long enough to be effected by your lifestyle. Verbal evangelism is very important. Read Scripture and observe what Christ and the Apostles did. They pointed people to their sin, often calling out particular sin. They used God's Law to show them that they were sinners a guilty...
"Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith." Gal. 3:24
It is Grace that saves us, but it is the law that makes us realize that we need salvation.
Read Acts 7 (especially v. 53). What got Stephen stoned? Was it that he called Christ the Messiah? No, because he pointed out to the Sanhedrin that they were breakers of God's Law.
Paul spent much of Romans pointing out how the Law made them guilty, then speaking of Grace.
they could care less about being ""lawbreakers" what got them was being accused of killing the Messiah, and it was only after hearing him PROCLAIM he saw Christ at the right hand of God did they become blood thirsty.
Then they cried out with a loud voice, and stopped their ears, and ran upon him with one accord,
how about acts 15 (vs24 esp)
furthermore let me ask you this
does the law have to be given in order to convict a sinner of sin?
"does the law have to be given in order to convict a sinner of sin?"
We are no longer obligated to keep the ceremonial laws of the OT, but God's moral law is written in the conscience of every sinner. They already have the law. Trouble is, the unregenerate person thinks himself to be good. "yeah, I may lie or lust, but none of the BAD sins". They don't realize that ALL sin is an afront to God. That's why we use the law as a mirror.
Yes, lets examine Gal. 3 closer. Paul addresses Christians who still try to be justified thru the law. He says that we are justified thru faith not law. In 10 we find that those who don't keep the law are cursed. "But no one is justified by the law is evident (11)" Why? Cause noone can keep the law perfectly. (13) Thanks to Christ, Christians are redeemed from the curse of the law. Then in v.19 we see that Christ came to do what the law could not do, justify us...
Indded, it states that the law was given because of sin, 'until' Christ came. But he is talking to those who have already accepted Christ. Are unbelievers not still condemned by the law? If not then what need do they have of Christ? (22) "But the Scripture has confined all under sin, that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe." Sinners, to this day are still under the curse of God's holy law. Only believers are released from it....
...Which brings us back to v.24"Therefore the law was our (speaking to Chrisians) tutor to bring us to Christ, that we may be justified by faith." The OT saints were looking forward to Christ and we are looking back. They were justified by faith (because no one can keep the law with the perfection that God demands) but commanded to keep Gods commandments. Likewise, we are are saved by grace alone but ordered by Christ to keep His perfect law, the 10 commandments (John 14:15)...
...It is only when we are saved that we are freed from the bondage of the law. So just as the law was a 'tutor' to these early Christians that brought them to Christ, so is His 10 Commandments even today. We hold it up as a mirror for the unbeliever to see himself as God sees him, a sinner.
Look, as Christians, we know that the Grace of Christ is the cure for this world's sicknes (sin and damnation). But to tell a sinner of the good news of Christ without first impressing them of the need for Christ, our sinfulness that seperates us from God, is like a doctor trying to convince someone to have major surgery before he shows them the test results that confirm that they are dying.
yes but why then if we have to use the law to convict then did we need the Holy Spirit to convict sinners? the disciples could have just marched into town said hey follow these big ten and we will kool with pops.
but your validity of the laws is much like swiss cheese it has flavor but is full of holes.
"yes but why then if we have to use the law to convict then did we need the Holy Spirit to convict sinners?"
In the same way that "faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God." The Spirit does the saving, but does not save apart from one first hearing the Gospel. It is God's chosen way. In the same way, the law pointing out one's sinfulness does not take any credit away for the Spirit for convicting the heart.
" the disciples could have just marched into town said hey follow these big ten and we will kool with pops."
1st, I don't appreciate the flippant reference to God as 'pops'. I understand the point you are making but there are better ways to make it.
2nd, I don't advocate salvation by followind ANY set of rules. That's works-righteousness. As I stated the purpose of the law is to show us that we CAN"T be good enough for God and can only rely on His mercy.
If I were dodging the question, I wouldn't have answered in such painful detail.
"what faith ? faith in the seed that had come!
Now that faith has come, we are no longer under the supervision of the law. no longer under-"
Yes, before the "promise by faith in Jesus" came they were 'confined' and 'supervided' by the law. As stated before, we are no longer bound to ceremonial laws. But moral laws never change. We are still bound to them...
btw where does the bible put emphasis on the ten commandments?
Matthew 19:16-19, is one example that comes to mind. Not only did He reemphasize the commandments againts murder and adultery, He strengthened them by saying that hatred is murder and lust is adultery.
As far as the commandments being expounded on beyond the Gospels: commandment I= 1 cor. 8:6, II= 1 John 5:21, III= 1 Tim. 6:1, V=Eph. 6:2, VI=1 John 3:15, VII=Gal.5:19, etc. 1 Cor. 6:9-10 also, list moral laws (mostly from the 10 commandments) and states that these don't 'inherit the kingdom of God". By your logic, since God's law is written on our conscience, the writers shouldn't have bothered to list them. I mean, what's the point? The Holy Spirit convicts, after all.
Let no debt remain outstanding, except the continuing debt to love one another, for he who loves his fellowman has fulfilled the law. and whatever other commandment there may be, are summed up in this one rule: "Love your neighbor as yourself."Love does no harm to its neighbor. Therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.
17Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. 18For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled....
...19Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Yes, 17 and 19 are speaking of the prophecies and ceremonies that pointed forward to Christ, but 19 shifts to God's commandments. It shows that we are bound go keep God's law for all time. Now, other parts of Scripture show that we are...
...no longer bound to observe the OT ceremonial laws so what are we left with? God's moral law that are NOT replaced by loving God and loving your neighbor, but are summarized in them. If you love God and your neighbor you will keep the law because the law revolves around putting God first and putting others before yourself. This was not some new revelation that replaced the 10 commandments, but what they were all about.
For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it. seems James thinks otherwise no mention of the ten, you are bound by it all or you are bound by none of it.
I worship God out of Love and thankfulness. But obedience to God is part of the evidence of salvation. 1John, for example makes it clear that those who are save do not continue in a lifestyle of sin. The Scripture I listed in 1 Cor. says that if you are one of these you don't go to are not saved. In Romans, Pauls, indepth explaination of Justification, he makes clear that the old man is dead, the new man strives to follow Christ in all ways...
...We obey out of love, not fear. Still we are bound to obey. And the things that we are told not to do in the New Testament are the moral laws of the OT. Some were even made more strict (lust being murder and unjust anger being murder.)
Repentance is more than just 'changing your mind, as some suggest. Repentance leads to obedience. The word for repentance, Metanoia was a military term that ment to do an about face. We can't say se love God and people if we keep sinning.
Love God and love your neighbor are not the replacement of the law. They are the summary. Matthew 22:40 says the law DEPENDS on these two not are REPLACED by these two.
...of breaking God's perfect Law. Once they were convicted of their sin, they would tell them of what Christ did for them; suffering, dying and ressurecting to atone for sin.
Taking someone to Grace without convincing them of their need for Grace (due to their sin) is like a doctor proclaiming a cure to a cancer patient without ever telling the patient that they have cancer.
to me i would simply show and do show God working through my life, i preach the gosplel every where i go and sometimes use words. it can take years but walk along side them and let them walk along side you.
Hey man, i could not figer out how to massage you, but just woundering how your surch is going? i would love to love to help you make some sence of all this God stuff, as I am still figuring it all out. You took the most important step though you reached asked a question, i really think thats the type of people he is looking for, send me a message if you want to talk more one on one, peace man and i am prayen for you and just did
i think you's are looking at this and trying to sound rele intelligent ...rob bell is a great man ... explaining things that seem unclear which is rele difficult to do .. rather then cursing him ... see his greatness and how he helps us see god ... he uses the gifts that god gave him in the right ways .. spreading the good news and allowing us to see god in ways we may have been confuzed before
Discounting someones intelligence is not the best idea when you can't spell simple words. I mean did you REALLY spell "REALLY" as"rele". How on earth did you pass 3rd grade?
i dunno if you have ever wrote a comment and tryed to fit it all in a little box of 500 words but sometimes you have to make your words SMALLER e.g REALLY - RELE ... so it all fits in :D !! and now its a habbit of mine ...
PS - when u say confused is spelt with a ''s'' your actually ment to say AN ''s'' !!
haha how did u pass 3rd grade (in a stupid voice tone)
I'm surprised comments haven't been disabled on these videos. there is a major difference between respectful discussion and jumping at each others' throats and the need to be right and someone else to be wrong. newsflash: you're arguing in youtube comments, and you are not going to change anyone's mind. you may think you're making someone look stupid but where and how you're doing it speaks volumes over anything you are saying. just so you know.
In Velvet Elvis he denies the Virgin Birth, in a Christianity Today article he said the Bible is a 'product of human hands', and he likes to make Jesus a mystic rabbi instead of our Saviour and Lord. Plus he never speaks of sin or repentance or the Doctrine of Election.
I haven't read far enough into Velvet Elvis to find that he denies the Virgin Birth, but the Bible was written by humans, in conjunction with God. He probably talks about Jesus as a rabbi because some people understand him better that way. The reason that he does not focus much on sin may be that enough people do already, and what is the Doctrine of Election?
If Rob Bell is a true pastor/teacher and if he is up there 'rightly dividing the Word of Truth as a True Born-Again Christian, then he would NEVER even suggest these things. Matthew 24 - false teachers arising and deceiving many....
Yes, John MacArthur. He's a dinosaur and needs to quietly go away before he makes too mush of a fool of himself (and so do you, "poskmarkedbuttocks").
What's up with that name... You and John Mac have some fun spanking each other?
To suggest that all Christians today are uneducated or that all atheists today are educated is simply preposterous. The problem with some scientists today is they try and explain how God does not exist through science, which is the study of everything physical. Well, God is a spiritual being. Science cannot be used as a means to say God does or does not exist.
He claims that it is the non-christians claiming that 'Theres no more this is how it is, bow down to the roman emperor'. Look at the educated compared with the uneducated: the uneducated or those who have been forced to beleive that there is a God simply say: there is a God, he made the universe, bow down to God, while it the scientists, the atheists who say today, 'No! this is not all there is, there's much more to it than that (and definitely don't bow down to God or the Roman emperor)!'
so you assume that all Christians were forced to believe in Christianity? Most Christians believe because THEY want to believe it, and it makes sense. And when atheists and scientists say "theres much more to it that that", what do they really mean? I believe that they believe dont take orders from anyone. Live the way you want, and for SOME atheists, not all, would lead them to do bad stuff i.e. sex, drugs, robbery, murder.
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ROB BELL = NEW AGE COURSE ON MIRACLES EMERGENT CHURCH GURU EXTRAORDINARE ..
STAY IN YOUR BIBLES PEOPLE, WORK OUT YOUR OWN SALVATION WITH FEAR AND TREMBLING.
ONE GREAT SOURCE FOR BIBLICAL UNDERSTANDING IS THIS:
AMAZINGDISCOVERIES.TV
LIBERTYALONE 2 months ago in playlist Tch: Rob Bell- Emergent church Preacher
Just because he teaches similarity to Universalism doesn't mean he isn't entitled to his opinion. He is no false teacher, because Christianity is defined differently by every Christian with a relationship with God. Yours is obviously different then mind, doesn't mean I think your going to burn in Hell it means you have a different view.
WorshipBassist 10 months ago
This guy believes in universalism. He is a false teacher that teaches there is no judgement for sinners. Read 2 Peter and tell me what the Bible says about people like him.
The sad truth is that those who support and love this guy will not read 2 Peter, nor the Bible at all.
TheEskatos 11 months ago
@TheEskatos You really believe this guy doesn't read the bible? Really? Have you actually read any of his stuff? Or do you follow the popular conservative-christian trends and just declare Rob Bell a universalist because that's what everyone else is doing? He isn't a universalist. He ha said that many, many times. Yet ignorant people like you continue to forget the actual point of his message and simply choose to besmirch him regardless.
davidpaulgillespie 1 month ago
Guys, he's just showing how science ultimately leads to Christ. It's fascinating really!
Trmnatr 1 year ago 10
@Trmnatr i agree!
AdamcanbeAdam 1 year ago
@Trmnatr I know? It's Awesome!!
I Believe God is a Type of energy, and energy cannot be created or Destroyed. It's been proven that Energy is what holds Matter in Existence. if your keyboard did not have the same energy, It would not Exist.
Everything we see or Do involves energy. It's amazing how everything falls back on Energy (God)
John 4:24 Says God is a spirit, and a spirit is a type of energy. It's so beautiful
ryourhm 7 months ago
Being a Christian or not, his teaching is still sensationalistic and, to say the least, weak.
blessedguys 1 year ago
@blessedguys how is this video weak? He is just saying that enlightened people throughout history who may have gone against the social grain believed "there is more". How is that weak?
hexusziggurat 1 year ago
what is flat land
chalatenango234 2 years ago
Comment removed
TifaLockhart2 1 year ago
@chalatenango234
2D world, he's using figurative speech
You need to see the whole thing to get it, it's my favorite part of the entire thing :)
TifaLockhart2 1 year ago
@chalatenango234 its just an expression
zombieslayerjack 1 year ago
Yes, Rob, how about this:
"While there is more, you deserve none of it. You cannot earn more of it. You cannot work your way to it. All the work you do to reach it is pathetically insufficient. All your ideas of what is good is entirely offensive to God. All your intentions are corrupt and they stain all your attempts at right living.
"Only Christ accomplished anything pleasing to God. Fall at his feet and worship Him.
"Pray that you come to more fully appreciate His work."
igystrvigy 2 years ago
@igystrvigy what u say is exactly right. that only Christ accomplished what is pleasing to God. so therefore all ur intentions and all ur attempts at doing good are pathetic stained and corrupt. so igystrvigy keep ur mouth shut until u come to know God urself before u go around parading ur foolishness infront of everyone.
Farajyusufov 1 year ago
@Farajyusufov Did I insult your idol (Rob Bell)? I know the Lord, Jesus Christ personally. I never attacked Bell's salvation. I criticized his fluffy approach that has little support in scripture. Who are you to judge my salvation?
igystrvigy 1 year ago
@igystrvigy ( and everybody else) I'm happy that you all are Christians, but attacking each other about it is nonsense. I want to see some of that brotherly love. ok?
JakeSchoby 1 year ago
@JakeSchoby Being a Christian doesn't mean being an uncritical doormat idiot. Disagreeing is not unloving. But if Christianity is the power of God unto salvation, then you darn well better believe that I will take it very seriously and take to task its detractors.
igystrvigy 1 year ago
@igystrvigy actually you probably shouldn't be putting anyone down who is willing to bring the fruit (although perhaps in an unorthodox method) of Jesus to the masses and really put himself out there. People are different (which goes without really needing to be said) and in those differences we look at things in different ways which means that perhaps in Rob can reach some that otheriwse could never be reached with the "standard approach". Good on him, for him willing to get out there.
hexusziggurat 1 year ago 3
@Farajyusufov even if mankind is in deed stained and corrupt (which i agree with), it should never be the excuse for us to stop trying to be more Christ-like. Although i might not agree with "parading" people ...sometimes softer words can help instead of "until u come to know God urself" slogans that have barbs attached in their meaning. Do any of us really "know" God? We come to understand His attributes & involvement on earth but we really fall short of "knowing" Him or His plan.
hexusziggurat 1 year ago
@igystrvigy wow what an amazing comment from a believer
GabrielProductions1 1 year ago
@GabrielProductions1 ????
igystrvigy 1 year ago
@igystrvigy w.e
GabrielProductions1 1 year ago
Wasn't the crucifixion of Jesus Christ caused by people who believed this isn't all there is?
Whether you put blame on the Jews or Romans both believed in something more.
And others who had great power invested in maintaining this isn't all there is, ultimately have harmed lots and lots of people.
shunt19 2 years ago
losers!
FunnessOfOneness 2 years ago
"How would you describe what Jesus sacrifice for us and what he taught in a way that that person would feel at peace with your answer?"
But doesn't Scripture teach that the Gospel is SUPPOSED to be an offense and foolishness to the unrepentant sinner?
bikerdisciple 2 years ago
To all Christians
If you were describing to someone God, Christianity, and what this means for our lives ... how would you do this? What is the simplist way that allows that person to open their hearts to the idea of a loving God?
How would you describe what Jesus sacrifice for us and what he taught in a way that that person would feel at peace with your answer?
This is a question that takes time and has no definitative answer.
Musicpuzzle 2 years ago
The simplist way is to say living out a christian life is to have REAL christ like love for EVERYONE, no matter what and die to yourself daily.
Matthew 5-7
Christianity 101
and in Romans 13:8-10 it says Love fullfills the law (commandments)
FollowTheSon777 2 years ago
thank you for that wonderful explaination :-)
I'll check out those sections
It's nice to hear response that are not angry at my wanting to learn more about Christ
thank you again
Musicpuzzle 2 years ago
Living a Christian life in front of people is very important. But if we rely on this as our main evangelism tool, we are missing out on many witnessing opportunities. You don't know if a certain person will live long enough to be effected by your lifestyle. Verbal evangelism is very important. Read Scripture and observe what Christ and the Apostles did. They pointed people to their sin, often calling out particular sin. They used God's Law to show them that they were sinners a guilty...
bikerdisciple 2 years ago
@bikerdisciple
They used God's Law to show them that they were sinners a guilty...
really what verse? because there aren't to many I could even stretch to say the law was even involved.
MrBysa 2 years ago
"Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith." Gal. 3:24
It is Grace that saves us, but it is the law that makes us realize that we need salvation.
Read Acts 7 (especially v. 53). What got Stephen stoned? Was it that he called Christ the Messiah? No, because he pointed out to the Sanhedrin that they were breakers of God's Law.
Paul spent much of Romans pointing out how the Law made them guilty, then speaking of Grace.
OfWrathAndGrace 2 years ago
BTW, bikerdisciple is my old channel.
OfWrathAndGrace 2 years ago
@OfWrathAndGrace
they could care less about being ""lawbreakers" what got them was being accused of killing the Messiah, and it was only after hearing him PROCLAIM he saw Christ at the right hand of God did they become blood thirsty.
Then they cried out with a loud voice, and stopped their ears, and ran upon him with one accord,
how about acts 15 (vs24 esp)
furthermore let me ask you this
does the law have to be given in order to convict a sinner of sin?
MrBysa 2 years ago
"does the law have to be given in order to convict a sinner of sin?"
We are no longer obligated to keep the ceremonial laws of the OT, but God's moral law is written in the conscience of every sinner. They already have the law. Trouble is, the unregenerate person thinks himself to be good. "yeah, I may lie or lust, but none of the BAD sins". They don't realize that ALL sin is an afront to God. That's why we use the law as a mirror.
OfWrathAndGrace 2 years ago
@OfWrathAndGrace part 2
who is the seed spoken of in Galatians 3:19
it is the summary of the whole chapter.
what do these words mean: until ,was till,but now.
here is a clue they are all past tense.
MrBysa 2 years ago
Yes, lets examine Gal. 3 closer. Paul addresses Christians who still try to be justified thru the law. He says that we are justified thru faith not law. In 10 we find that those who don't keep the law are cursed. "But no one is justified by the law is evident (11)" Why? Cause noone can keep the law perfectly. (13) Thanks to Christ, Christians are redeemed from the curse of the law. Then in v.19 we see that Christ came to do what the law could not do, justify us...
OfWrathAndGrace 2 years ago
Indded, it states that the law was given because of sin, 'until' Christ came. But he is talking to those who have already accepted Christ. Are unbelievers not still condemned by the law? If not then what need do they have of Christ? (22) "But the Scripture has confined all under sin, that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe." Sinners, to this day are still under the curse of God's holy law. Only believers are released from it....
OfWrathAndGrace 2 years ago
...Which brings us back to v.24"Therefore the law was our (speaking to Chrisians) tutor to bring us to Christ, that we may be justified by faith." The OT saints were looking forward to Christ and we are looking back. They were justified by faith (because no one can keep the law with the perfection that God demands) but commanded to keep Gods commandments. Likewise, we are are saved by grace alone but ordered by Christ to keep His perfect law, the 10 commandments (John 14:15)...
OfWrathAndGrace 2 years ago
...It is only when we are saved that we are freed from the bondage of the law. So just as the law was a 'tutor' to these early Christians that brought them to Christ, so is His 10 Commandments even today. We hold it up as a mirror for the unbeliever to see himself as God sees him, a sinner.
OfWrathAndGrace 2 years ago
@OfWrathAndGrace
the law was.
if I was something what am I know?
a) something different
b)the same thing
c)picking and choosing the words carefully to prove my point(and quite possibly wotm)
MrBysa 2 years ago
@OfWrathAndGrace
sinners are NOT condemned by the law.
yes it is on the heart yes, but the Holy spirit is what convicts the world of sin.
also the world condemns itself. everyone has an equal chance at salvation. it is a individual choice.
paul said
All who rely on observing the law are under a curse not everyone those who rely on it for salvation.
MrBysa 2 years ago
"also the world condemns itself."
Yes, but why? Because it is evil, rejecting God, His commands, and the way of redemption that He has provided.
OfWrathAndGrace 2 years ago
Look, as Christians, we know that the Grace of Christ is the cure for this world's sicknes (sin and damnation). But to tell a sinner of the good news of Christ without first impressing them of the need for Christ, our sinfulness that seperates us from God, is like a doctor trying to convince someone to have major surgery before he shows them the test results that confirm that they are dying.
OfWrathAndGrace 2 years ago
@OfWrathAndGrace
yes but why then if we have to use the law to convict then did we need the Holy Spirit to convict sinners? the disciples could have just marched into town said hey follow these big ten and we will kool with pops.
but your validity of the laws is much like swiss cheese it has flavor but is full of holes.
MrBysa 2 years ago
"yes but why then if we have to use the law to convict then did we need the Holy Spirit to convict sinners?"
In the same way that "faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God." The Spirit does the saving, but does not save apart from one first hearing the Gospel. It is God's chosen way. In the same way, the law pointing out one's sinfulness does not take any credit away for the Spirit for convicting the heart.
OfWrathAndGrace 2 years ago
" the disciples could have just marched into town said hey follow these big ten and we will kool with pops."
1st, I don't appreciate the flippant reference to God as 'pops'. I understand the point you are making but there are better ways to make it.
2nd, I don't advocate salvation by followind ANY set of rules. That's works-righteousness. As I stated the purpose of the law is to show us that we CAN"T be good enough for God and can only rely on His mercy.
OfWrathAndGrace 2 years ago
@OfWrathAndGrace
way to dodge the real question, i am quite used to it by now so i am not offended.
here we go I will break the verse down for you,
What, then, was the purpose of the law?
-It was added because of transgressions until the Seed to whom the promise referred had come.
until what had come? till the seed had come.(Jesus)
Before this faith came(23)what faith ? faith in the seed that had come!
Now that faith has come, we are no longer under the supervision of the law. no longer under-
MrBysa 2 years ago
"way to dodge the real question,"
If I were dodging the question, I wouldn't have answered in such painful detail.
"what faith ? faith in the seed that had come!
Now that faith has come, we are no longer under the supervision of the law. no longer under-"
Yes, before the "promise by faith in Jesus" came they were 'confined' and 'supervided' by the law. As stated before, we are no longer bound to ceremonial laws. But moral laws never change. We are still bound to them...
OfWrathAndGrace 2 years ago
...and they still point the sinner towards the Messiah and still guid believers in God's ways.
OfWrathAndGrace 2 years ago
you are still missing the whole point here
paul is speaking to the whole world about being free from the WHOLE LAW!!!
what did Jesus say? The Law and the Prophets were proclaimed until John. Since that time, the good news of the kingdom of God is being preached
so why dig up a dead horse to beat it?
the law is dead the law we practice is the perfect law not the "ten commandments"
and btw where does the bible put emphasis on the ten commandments? the whole law is all I ever see talked about
MrBysa 2 years ago
btw where does the bible put emphasis on the ten commandments?
Matthew 19:16-19, is one example that comes to mind. Not only did He reemphasize the commandments againts murder and adultery, He strengthened them by saying that hatred is murder and lust is adultery.
OfWrathAndGrace 2 years ago
As far as the commandments being expounded on beyond the Gospels: commandment I= 1 cor. 8:6, II= 1 John 5:21, III= 1 Tim. 6:1, V=Eph. 6:2, VI=1 John 3:15, VII=Gal.5:19, etc. 1 Cor. 6:9-10 also, list moral laws (mostly from the 10 commandments) and states that these don't 'inherit the kingdom of God". By your logic, since God's law is written on our conscience, the writers shouldn't have bothered to list them. I mean, what's the point? The Holy Spirit convicts, after all.
OfWrathAndGrace 2 years ago
@OfWrathAndGrace
and while most of these are stretched references,
you overlook the key points there is morality.
Let no debt remain outstanding, except the continuing debt to love one another, for he who loves his fellowman has fulfilled the law. and whatever other commandment there may be, are summed up in this one rule: "Love your neighbor as yourself."Love does no harm to its neighbor. Therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.
MrBysa 2 years ago
cont....
By calling this covenant "new," he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and aging will soon disappear
the law is dead and gone there is only love for your brother.
MrBysa 2 years ago
Did the new covenant make God's law obsolete?
Matthew 5:
17Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. 18For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled....
OfWrathAndGrace 2 years ago
...19Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Yes, 17 and 19 are speaking of the prophecies and ceremonies that pointed forward to Christ, but 19 shifts to God's commandments. It shows that we are bound go keep God's law for all time. Now, other parts of Scripture show that we are...
OfWrathAndGrace 2 years ago
...no longer bound to observe the OT ceremonial laws so what are we left with? God's moral law that are NOT replaced by loving God and loving your neighbor, but are summarized in them. If you love God and your neighbor you will keep the law because the law revolves around putting God first and putting others before yourself. This was not some new revelation that replaced the 10 commandments, but what they were all about.
OfWrathAndGrace 2 years ago
Comment removed
Ipreachfromscripts 2 years ago
@OfWrathAndGrace
For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it. seems James thinks otherwise no mention of the ten, you are bound by it all or you are bound by none of it.
Ipreachfromscripts 2 years ago
@OfWrathAndGrace
what is the old covenant?
the new has replaced the old
do you worship God out of fear and service or do you worship God in friendship and love?
MrBysa 2 years ago
I worship God out of Love and thankfulness. But obedience to God is part of the evidence of salvation. 1John, for example makes it clear that those who are save do not continue in a lifestyle of sin. The Scripture I listed in 1 Cor. says that if you are one of these you don't go to are not saved. In Romans, Pauls, indepth explaination of Justification, he makes clear that the old man is dead, the new man strives to follow Christ in all ways...
OfWrathAndGrace 2 years ago
...We obey out of love, not fear. Still we are bound to obey. And the things that we are told not to do in the New Testament are the moral laws of the OT. Some were even made more strict (lust being murder and unjust anger being murder.)
Repentance is more than just 'changing your mind, as some suggest. Repentance leads to obedience. The word for repentance, Metanoia was a military term that ment to do an about face. We can't say se love God and people if we keep sinning.
OfWrathAndGrace 2 years ago
Love God and love your neighbor are not the replacement of the law. They are the summary. Matthew 22:40 says the law DEPENDS on these two not are REPLACED by these two.
OfWrathAndGrace 2 years ago
...of breaking God's perfect Law. Once they were convicted of their sin, they would tell them of what Christ did for them; suffering, dying and ressurecting to atone for sin.
Taking someone to Grace without convincing them of their need for Grace (due to their sin) is like a doctor proclaiming a cure to a cancer patient without ever telling the patient that they have cancer.
bikerdisciple 2 years ago
to me i would simply show and do show God working through my life, i preach the gosplel every where i go and sometimes use words. it can take years but walk along side them and let them walk along side you.
masterj22 2 years ago
thank you for your time in answering
the truth takes time to learn and I am slowly understand how God is special in my life through Jesus
people who open up and help others learn such as yourself allow me to see where my path is heading
Musicpuzzle 2 years ago
Hey man, i could not figer out how to massage you, but just woundering how your surch is going? i would love to love to help you make some sence of all this God stuff, as I am still figuring it all out. You took the most important step though you reached asked a question, i really think thats the type of people he is looking for, send me a message if you want to talk more one on one, peace man and i am prayen for you and just did
masterj22 2 years ago
The problem you guys have is that he is right. You just can't comprehend that his logic is true.
jonny12boy1991 2 years ago
Comment removed
jonny12boy1991 2 years ago
reminds me of an ipod with a cross on it
brand new, modern marketing, for an age-old fallacy
plastichrist 2 years ago
This guy reminds me of the Hale- Bopp comet guy.
This is some Heavens Gate type shit.
999sasha 2 years ago
These kind of comments are what drive Christians apart and give all of us a bad name to the modern world
warntjes07 3 years ago
i think you's are looking at this and trying to sound rele intelligent ...rob bell is a great man ... explaining things that seem unclear which is rele difficult to do .. rather then cursing him ... see his greatness and how he helps us see god ... he uses the gifts that god gave him in the right ways .. spreading the good news and allowing us to see god in ways we may have been confuzed before
55gary55 3 years ago
Discounting someones intelligence is not the best idea when you can't spell simple words. I mean did you REALLY spell "REALLY" as"rele". How on earth did you pass 3rd grade?
PS-confused is spelled with a "s".
theez14 3 years ago
i dunno if you have ever wrote a comment and tryed to fit it all in a little box of 500 words but sometimes you have to make your words SMALLER e.g REALLY - RELE ... so it all fits in :D !! and now its a habbit of mine ...
PS - when u say confused is spelt with a ''s'' your actually ment to say AN ''s'' !!
haha how did u pass 3rd grade (in a stupid voice tone)
55gary55 3 years ago
Mr. Bell flips around verses in the Bible to fit the times of today.
I think he does this to suit his lavish lifestyle.
999sasha 3 years ago
I'm surprised comments haven't been disabled on these videos. there is a major difference between respectful discussion and jumping at each others' throats and the need to be right and someone else to be wrong. newsflash: you're arguing in youtube comments, and you are not going to change anyone's mind. you may think you're making someone look stupid but where and how you're doing it speaks volumes over anything you are saying. just so you know.
restinginlove 3 years ago
the man is full of love.
statepark 3 years ago
couldn't agree more :)
restinginlove 3 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
this twerp is full of sh*t.
pockmarkedbuttocks 3 years ago
how so?
tdq11 3 years ago
In Velvet Elvis he denies the Virgin Birth, in a Christianity Today article he said the Bible is a 'product of human hands', and he likes to make Jesus a mystic rabbi instead of our Saviour and Lord. Plus he never speaks of sin or repentance or the Doctrine of Election.
pockmarkedbuttocks 3 years ago
I haven't read far enough into Velvet Elvis to find that he denies the Virgin Birth, but the Bible was written by humans, in conjunction with God. He probably talks about Jesus as a rabbi because some people understand him better that way. The reason that he does not focus much on sin may be that enough people do already, and what is the Doctrine of Election?
tdq11 3 years ago
Obviously you didn't read the book... but you have no problem spreading false rumors. (Hmmmmm.... false rumors..... who does that remind me of???)
He posed a hypothetical question about the virgin birth and only the dimmest bulb reading his example would have drawn that conclusion.
tomfooleryprod 3 years ago
If Rob Bell is a true pastor/teacher and if he is up there 'rightly dividing the Word of Truth as a True Born-Again Christian, then he would NEVER even suggest these things. Matthew 24 - false teachers arising and deceiving many....
pockmarkedbuttocks 3 years ago
Yes... he's actually an agent of the "Anti-Christ"!
Bury your heads in John MacArthur and Charles Stanley... at least you'll FEEL better about yourselves because you have the "TRUTH"!
Pathetic...
tomfooleryprod 3 years ago
You should be glad that some people have discernment to point out the false teachers. Enjoy your trip through the wide gate...
pockmarkedbuttocks 3 years ago
"this twerp is full of sh*t."
Your mentality pretty much says it all (and your ridiculous name).
tomfooleryprod 3 years ago
And I'm doing just fine at discerning false teachers: John MacArthur, James Dobson, Ray Comfort, Tim LaHaye, YOU...
tomfooleryprod 3 years ago
John MacArthur?! Ha! You gotta' be kiddin' me...! Maybe GOD will use my words of Rebuke as a megaphone to your deaf ears! Boo-yah!
pockmarkedbuttocks 3 years ago
Boo-yah?
Yes, John MacArthur. He's a dinosaur and needs to quietly go away before he makes too mush of a fool of himself (and so do you, "poskmarkedbuttocks").
What's up with that name... You and John Mac have some fun spanking each other?
tomfooleryprod 3 years ago
You're on the slippery slope towards apostasy...I'm done sounding the alarm bell
pockmarkedbuttocks 3 years ago
Your reply says a lot about you. What is in the heart will come out.
hardmod777 3 years ago
I don't know how to top "Boo-yah!"
I'm done... you win!
tomfooleryprod 3 years ago
To suggest that all Christians today are uneducated or that all atheists today are educated is simply preposterous. The problem with some scientists today is they try and explain how God does not exist through science, which is the study of everything physical. Well, God is a spiritual being. Science cannot be used as a means to say God does or does not exist.
weezbright43 3 years ago
He claims that it is the non-christians claiming that 'Theres no more this is how it is, bow down to the roman emperor'. Look at the educated compared with the uneducated: the uneducated or those who have been forced to beleive that there is a God simply say: there is a God, he made the universe, bow down to God, while it the scientists, the atheists who say today, 'No! this is not all there is, there's much more to it than that (and definitely don't bow down to God or the Roman emperor)!'
leesharkey342 3 years ago
so you assume that all Christians were forced to believe in Christianity? Most Christians believe because THEY want to believe it, and it makes sense. And when atheists and scientists say "theres much more to it that that", what do they really mean? I believe that they believe dont take orders from anyone. Live the way you want, and for SOME atheists, not all, would lead them to do bad stuff i.e. sex, drugs, robbery, murder.
6footSmurf 3 years ago
:) i like this video. i think that this is really good and i do think it helps you understand the bible and what God is trying to do
mrslovely213 3 years ago 2