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From: LaneCh
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  • I'm a Calvinist because I believe God is a loving Father. I never really felt good or safe until I realized God was sovereign over every thing. I really feel sorry for people who don't believe this.

  • Spurgeon was a Baptist preacher.

  • Tha way it's shows seem to me that the time that calvinists will re-edit a self-doctrine-translation Bible just for them, just like Jeovah Witnesses is very close...

    ...the problem is,if they do that, will be too easy to see the forgery...

  • The prince of preachers was satan that couth many angels with him...

    So Ez 18 talks abou righeteous that TURNS to sin.

    Then the sinner that TURNS to the justice of GOD.

    If this calvinist god did exists he would be acused to be all sins author.

    And if the calvinist god would exist, no calviist should bother talk about him, 'caus it doesn't matter - "elected" will be save anyways...

    2P 2:1-3 shows church embers, safe, getting to be full of evil.

    Beware about this "deceitful workers"...

  • Hi, Thanks .Im new at this .Im leaning more and more to the reformed way.

  • This ist calvinism and not what the bible says.

  • I am still confused. What about free will?

  • @MsHannelore

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    Calvinism doesn't deny free will; that is to say, Calvinism doesn't deny that man makes real choices. What it does deny, and rightly so, is that man can choose God all on his own. The Bible says that because humans are sinners and are dead in sin (Eph 2:1) that there is no one who seeks for God (Romans 3:10-11) and thus that God is the one who draws us to Jesus in order that we may be saved (John 6:44).

  • @AgApE010 The Lord draws us, HOW? It's a mistery? Is "the secret" that the serpent insinuated to Eve?

    C'mon...

    Free will is the power that GOD gave to all spiritual creatures - angels and men.

    The man fall broke the spiritual relation with GOD. But did not made men without need of GOD. That's why you can find anywher you go on this planet people trying to comunicate to the spiritual world - that's a feeling os missing GOD. Unfortunately they never heard The Way to get there properly, 'till...

  • @marcelobetel

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    Where did I, or any Calvinist, ever say that man does not need God? Why do you falsely accuse people of such things?

    I posted Scripture references supporting my view. You gave me your opinion. I don't know about you, but my conscience is captive to the Word of God.

  • @AgApE010 Where did I said that?

    At least, for a calvinist, if you have Calvin's Bible understanding, youl almost don't need GOD that much...

    ...and that's the direction that Calvin and Augustine gave to the world. They got that from paganism (Greek mithology/philosophy), had a really poor Bible translation (Augustine principaly) and tried to build a Roformed Religious Empire out of Rome.

    But I don't remember to say that you don't need GOD. Note that you call calvinists like another class...

  • @AgApE010 Until you keep yourself under any other man t explain to you The Scriptures you will not fulfill this: "If the Sonne therfore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed - For there is one God, and one Mediatour betweene God and men, the man Christ Iesus - thisi is not what you live.

    So throw away Cauvin (Calvin)/Augustinus/greek phylosophers ideas about a god they never met.

  • @marcelobetel

    "And He gave some as apostles, and some as prophets, and some as evangelists, and some as pastors and teachers, for the equipping of the saints for the work of service, to the building up of the body of Christ."

    -Ephesians 4:11-12

    Teachers of doctrine and Scripture are given by God Himself for the equipping of the saints. So says the Holy Word. But if you want to argue with the Holy Spirit, that's your business... :)

  • @AgApE010

    But the anointing which ye haue receiued of him, abideth in you: and yee need not that any man teach you: But, as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is trueth, and is no lye: and euen as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him. (1Jo 2:27)

    No arguing at all, just showing to you that it was what I received since I was born from the water and the Spirit - The Scripture comes into you and then you start to recognize it when you read it.

    It's not the way you think...

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  • @marcelobetel

    Oh, I see. So John and Paul contradicted each other.

    Your exegesis is impeccable.

    You see? What you just did right here is a perfect example for why Christ gave the Body people to serve as teachers. You only proved my point.

  • @AgApE010 The point have to be that one that comes from ABOVE, not from you, Paul, Peter, Spurgeon, Cauvin, etc.

    The Truth is, when someone receives The Holy Spirit this persons is equiped and sealed to fight against the hell - so, the same person is, some times an apostle, some times a pastor or teacher, etc.

    There's NO piramidal hierarchy like in secular understanding like a company.

    There's NO better man or woman in The Real Church. We are absolutely equal, no matter what.

    to be continue

  • @AgApE010 Every regenerated in Christ is called to be a apostle, a priest and a king of The Creator on Earth (Ap 1:6, 5;10; Rm 1:1-8).

    Is up to each one of us to open our hearts and have TIME to be used by The Creator. As much you give yourself, much more HE uses you. Paul gave his full time and devotion so he was used as much as was possible, and became an apostle - THAT's ALL. He was used to teach, to preach, to start new congregations, to be a missionary, etc.

    Otherwise, more to evil, worse

  • @AgApE010 So, there's NO contradiction between paul and John - The Holy Spirit uses you more if you give Him time and dedication. Just like the devil does the oposite. More you start to hear the call to sin, more you pay attention to that, more you start to consider that an option, more you tend to pratice that. After that, the door is open and you'll not take much time to do that again. That's how it works!

    If you receive The Holy Spirit, HE will teach you, not Cauvin, and you'll be used too!

  • And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw ALL men unto me. John 12:32

  • "Men" is not in the Greek text of Jn. 12:32. Jn. 12:19-20: "The PHARISEES therefore said among themselves, Perceive ye how ye prevail nothing? behold, the WORLD (κόσμος) is gone after him. And there were certain GREEKS among them that came up to worship at the feast." Rom. 10:12: "For there is no difference between the JEW and the GREEK: for the same Lord over ALL is rich unto all that call upon him."

  • Now is the judgment of this WORLD: now shall the prince of this world be cast out. John 12:31 Every person of the world will be judged.... then follows v. 32 with Christ saying he will draw all men to himself

  • Jn. 12:31 is to be compared with Mat. 25:31-46; "men" is not in the Greek text of Jn. 12:32. Jn. 12:19-20: "The PHARISEES therefore said among themselves, Perceive ye how ye prevail nothing? behold, the WORLD is gone after him. And there were certain GREEKS among them that came up to worship at the feast." The Greek word translated "will draw" in Jn. 12:32 is "helko"; every time it is used in the N.T. it denotes an irresistible drawing (e.g., Jn. 6:44, Jn. 18:10, Jn. 21:6 & 11).

  • Who is lost because of sin? Who is a sinner?

  • Every single member of the human race, save Christ, is a sinner.

  • Christ died for the whole world but not every single person in the world. Every man without distinction of race nationality, etc not every man without exception! Read Jesus high priestly prayer to the father in John 17 and it is quite easy to discern the world at large from HIS elect in the world.

  • Isaiah 53:6...The truth is that someone is saved by grace by faith...not before it

  • Eph 2:8 By grace you have been saved through faith and that not of yourselves, it (Faith) is the gift of God, not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.

    If God does not give us even the very faith to believe in Christ, we cannot. We are born again by the spirit and then we believe. No one seeks God no one does good not even one!

  • @kimsponaugle Someone is not born again(becoming a child of God and saved) before saved...We're saved by faith...justified by faith...we become a child of God by faith

  • Acts 13:48: "And as many as were ordained to eternal life believed." Phil. 1:29: "For unto you IT IS GIVEN in the behalf of Christ, not only TO BELIEVE ON HIM, but also to suffer for his sake."

  • Whosoever can believe. Meaning that God died for everyone's sins or else whosoever couldn't have the opportunity to believe since Christs death for sins wasn't for them.

  • Jn. 3:27: "John answered and said, A man can receive nothing, except it be given him from heaven." Jn. 6:44: "No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day." Jn. 6:65: "And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father." Acts 13:48: "And as many as were ordained to eternal life believed."

  • I know it is a difficult thing for an Arminian to see things in the light of historical orthodox Christianity. I believed in free will (the pagan type of free will) before God graciously brought me to an understanding of Reformed theology. We need to show loving kindness and patience in the hope that God will reveal these precious truths to others. Thanks for holding to Gods truth as revealed in the scriptures. Soli Deo Gloria.

  • @kimsponaugle I'm not a calvinist or an armeniest..

  • @ kimsponaugle, Thanks for the encouragement.

  • @briancook007 I'm fine with John 3:27, John 6:44 and John 6:65 and Acts 13:48...none of them prove Calvinism right

  • Oh, yes, they do. Those Scriptures show that man is unable to save himself, and that he is saved only by God's sovereign grace; there's nothing you can do to change it.

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  • Friend, you never addressed John 12:47 and didn't address who Christ was addressing in Mark 9:45

  • Rom. 11:12: "Now if the fall of them be the riches of the WORLD, and the diminishing of them the riches of the GENTILES; how much more their fullness?"

  • ROMANS 11:12 Does not prove you right

  • Oh, yes, it does, whether or not you'll admit it. The Bible is a Jewish book, and always must be interpreted from a Jewish cultural perspective; "world" means "Gentiles" in reference to the extent of the Atonement.

  • The Bible is a jewish book?  I'm sure a ton of Israelites would disagree

  • The Bible is a Jewish book; every single letter of it was authored by Jews. It always must be interpreted from their cultural perspective; just as "Hamlet" always must be interpreted from a British cultural perspective, just as "War and Peace" always must be interpreted from a Russian cultural perspective, just as "The Three Musketeers" always must be interpreted from a French cultural perspective.

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  • @briancook007 Isn't the Bible's targeted audience more important than who wrote it? It wasn't just written to jews..

  • The Scriptures were written by Jews only almost completely to Jews; they always must be interpreted from their cultural perspective.

  • Romans, Corinthians, Galatians, Philipians, Colossians, Ephesians...Were these churches almost completely Jews?

  • Those churches had Jews in them, but that's not the point; all those epistles were written by the Apostle Paul, a Jew, as were all the other books of the Bible. The Scriptures always must be interpreted from a Jewish cultural perspective.

  • Do you really believe that when Jesus told Nicodemus "You must be born again" that he was telling him to have faith from himself or did he explain that the spirit is like the wind; you feel its effects but you can't see it and you don't know where it is going. It is so clearly explained in the text that you must be born from above before you can even see the kingdom of God. If you have faith and have believed in Christ, it is because God has graciuosly given it to you.

  • but, we become a saved child of God BY faith..not BEFORE faith...If a person is saved BEFORE faith, then, the Bible lies

  • @ThePottersvessel When Christ says he will draw all men unto himself; does that mean all men will be saved? Certainly not!

    For we know many will not inherit the kingdom of God. When Caesar taxed the whole world, did that include China or any other far off land? The answer is no. The term world and whole world has different meaning in different places in scripture.. Thats why it is important to study and understand the context of a verse.

  • @ThePottersvessel We must have faith and that is true but God gives us the ability to believe and the very faith to believe. To be sure, we do believe of our own free will; however, if God didn't change our natural disposition (will) toward him by making us alive in Christ then we could never come to him and put our trust in Him. Scripture never lies. the problem is we interpret it in the light of our own understanding.

  • @kimsponaugle John 12:47...was Christ only talking about some when saying he didn't come to judge the world? Everybody will be judged. Also when it says that all like sheep have gone astray in Isaiah 53...And when it says in Psalm 14 that all have gone aside..and in Romans 3 says that all have gone out of the way...Does it mean that only some have gone aside, astray, out of the way? Not every person?

  • Yes, Jn. 12:47 is to be taken in a limited sense, because the sins of God's elect were judged at Calvary, Christ died in our place; our sins were expiated, they "ain't no more". Jn. 12:47 is to be compared with Mat. 25:31-46. Isa. 53:6 says, "All we like SHEEP have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all." Compare Mat. 25:33; this Isaiah Scripture refers to God's elect only.

  • Both Psa. 14:3 and Rom. 3:10 qualify the contexts, referring to the entire human race; this argues against Arminianism, because if "all" always meant the entire human race there would have been no need for the authors to qualify those contexts. Even then this must be taken in a limited sense, because Christ was a man and He never sinned.

  • @kimsponaugle Friend, do you believe that we are born again, becoming a saved child of God, before we believe?

  • @ThePottersvessel Its called being made alive in Christ. You believe your faith brings about your salvation. I believe God regenerates the heart of stone thus giving us a new heart to believe and repent. Your view was not accepted by most of the church fathers historically because it gives autonomy or Sovereignty to the creature rather than the creator. Every one will be judged according to their works. That is true. God said to Moses, "I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy".

  • @ThePottersvessel Do you believe a depraved wicked heart will choose a Holy God on its own or do you think something must happen first? The Bible calls this something happening being born from above or MADE Alive. We don't make ouselves alive in Christ. However, when the spirir does changes our heart (will) disposition toward God then we exercise faith in Christ. The problem is we have been exposed to unbiblical teaching in the modern church for so long that we can't see it.

  • @ThePottersvessel As far as asking if I believe we are saved before having faith; The Bible teaches that saving faith comes from being born of the spirit. You believe that having faith in Christ and being born again is the very same thing. The Bible corrects that thinking when Jesus tells Nicodemus he must be born of the spirit. You cant produce that in and of yourself. It is of God from first to last. This is the Biblical view. We must start believing it instead of modern methods of theology.

  • And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment. 1 John 3:23. All are supposed to follow this commandment(Ecclesiastes 12:13). God commands all to believe in Christ. Christ's death for sins was for all.

  • L (limited [or, definite] atonement)--Jn. 10:11, 15: "The good shepherd giveth his life for the SHEEP.....I lay down my life for the SHEEP." Rom. 8:32-33: "He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for US ALL, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things? Who shall lay any thing to the charge of GOD'S ELECT? It is God that justifieth." Eph. 5:25: "Husbands, love your wives, EVEN AS Christ also loved the CHURCH, and gave himself for IT."

  • 2 Corinthians 5 14For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead: 15And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.

  • Yes, now read II Cor. 5:14-15 in context; Paul is talking about God's elect: "For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for ALL, then were ALL dead: And that he died for all, that THEY WHICH LIVE should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for THEM, and rose again."

  • all are dead, not just the saved people from Corinth

  • The context of II Cor. 5:14-15 shows very clearly that Paul is talking about God's elect only; he is using "all" in a limited sense, as he does numerous times in his epistles.

  • The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the SIN of the WORLD. John 1:29

  • Rom. 11:12: "Now if the fall of them be the riches of the WORLD, and the diminishing of them the riches of the GENTILES; how much more their fullness?"

  • Romans 11:12 doesn't go against what I believe

  • Oh, yes, it does, because it destroys the Arminian definition of the term "world" with reference to the extent of the Atonement. What saith the Scripture (Rom. 11:12)? "Now if the fall of them be the riches of the WORLD, and the diminishing of them the riches of the GENTILES; how much more their fullness?"

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  • And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the WHOLE world. 1 John 2:2

  • Jn. 11:51-52: "And this spake he not of himself: but being high priest that year, he prophesied that Jesus should die for THAT NATION; And NOT FOR THAT NATION ONLY, but that also he should gather together in one the children of God that were scattered abroad."

  • Did Christ give himself for Paul? yes. For the Church, also? Yes. For the WHOLE WORLD? Yes...John 1:29, 2 Corinthians 5:14-15, 1Timothy 2:4 and 6, John 12:47, 1 Timothy 4:10, Isaiah 53:6, 1 John 2:2, John 3:16

  • Rom. 11:12: "Now if the fall of them be the riches of the WORLD, and the diminishing of them the riches of the GENTILES; how much more their fullness?" Rom. 1:5, 8: "By whom we have received grace and apostleship, for obedience to the faith among ALL NATIONS, for his name.....First, I thank my God through Jesus Christ for you all, that your faith is spoken of throughout the WHOLE WORLD." The sense of the Greek word "soter" in I Tim. 4:10 is "preserver".

  • "All men" in I Tim. 2:4 is defined by Acts 9:15 compared with Acts 22:15 & I Thes. 2:15-16. "All" in I Tim. 2:6 is defined by Rom. 10:12. The context of II Cor. 5:14-15 shows that Paul is talking about God's elect.

  • Who is Mark 9:45 addressing?

  • Mark 9:45 is a command to the entire human race to repent and to believe (Mk. 1:15).

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  • You're saying that God commands all to believe even though they can't believe since Christ's death is not for all? But, all can believe since Christ said WHOSOEVER(anybody, which is only possibly if Christ's death was for everybody)...If Christ only died for some, then, Christ lied when he said WHOSOEVER. "God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar.." Romans 3:4

  • Jn. 3:16 says "whosoever BELIEVETH IN HIM" shall not perish; that is a qualification. No man ever believes unless God allows that to him, for it is written, "For unto you IT IS GIVEN in the behalf of Christ, not only TO BELIEVE ON HIM, but also to suffer for his sake."

  • Friend...And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world. John 12:47

    The whole world will be judged. But Christ came to saved the whole world. How would that be so unless his death for sins wasn't for every person?

  • Isa. 55:8-9: "For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD. For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts."

  • "For God is not the author of confusion.." 2 Corinthians 14:33

  • Isa. 55:8-9: "For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD. For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts."

  • Rom. 9:16-18: "So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy. For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth. Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth." Acts 13:48: "And as many as were ordained to eternal life believed."

  • "...for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world." John 12:47 "..the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe." 1 Timothy 4:10 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth. 1 Timothy 2:4 .. If you believe that only some are predestined, please, address if Mark 9:45 is directed towards the predestined of your view or the people that are not predestined in your view, or both.

  • Rom. 11:12: "Now if the fall of them be the riches of the WORLD, and the diminishing of them the riches of the GENTILES; how much more their fullness?" "All men" in I Tim. 2:4 is defined by Acts 9:15 compared with Acts 22:15 & I Thes. 2:15-16. The sense of "soter" in I Tim. 4:10 is "preserver"; so say Greek scholars Berry, Darby, Vine, and the greatest Koine Greek grammarian of modern times, A.T. Robertson. Mk. 9:45 is a solemn warning to all men to repent (Lk. 13:5) and to believe (Acts 16:31).

  • @briancook007 Mark 9:45 Christ is saying if your foot is going to prevent you from being saved, cut it off. a literal foot, considering theres one left and hence meaning it can not mean merely the rejection of sin because he would be commanding to only reject half of your sin. Who is he addressing? As far as "Saviour"..I agree that Christ preserves me(which is contrary to the fifth point of Calvinism)..but how is he the Preserver of the people that are not saved and will be utterly destroyed?

  • You miss the point; Christ is saying that if your foot would prevent you from repenting and believing the Gospel (Mk. 1:15), it would be better for you to dismember yourself than to perish. He commands all men to repent and to believe. Neh. 9:6: "Thou, even thou, art LORD alone; thou hast made heaven, the heaven of heavens, with all their host, the earth, and all things that are therein, the seas, and all that is therein, and thou preservest them all; and the host of heaven worshippeth thee."

  • @briancook007 Why even bring up the scenario, though? If he's talking to the ones that are going to be saved, then, why cut off a foot? A foot CAN'T prevent them from believing in your view. Irresistible Grace. If he's talking to the ones that aren't going to be saved, then, why cut off a foot? Even if you do you CAN'T be saved. Total Depravity and the fact that Christ didn't die for them

  • Sir, you make the mistake of trying to bring God down to our level. What saith the Scriptures (Isa. 55:8-9)? "For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD. For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts." "World" in reference to the Atonement means that Christ gave Himself for Gentiles as well as for Jews (Jn. 12:19-20, Rom. 11:12).

  • @briancook007 In this case you are doing the same mistake(I do not feel in the wrong) since you are trying to understand the Bible as I also am

  • No, sir, you are trying to bring God down to our level, which is impossible to do (Isa. 55:8-9). I don't understand fully how He can be three Persons and one God simultaneously, but that doesn't nullify the fact that it's true.

  • @briancook007 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified. Romans 8:30...the predestined are called. Mark 2:17 When Jesus heard it, he saith unto them, They that are whole have no need of the physician, but they that are sick: I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance. ..ALL are sinners.. ALL are called

  • Eze. 3:10: "Moreover he said unto me, Son of man, all my words that I shall speak unto thee receive in thine heart, and hear with thine ears." Acts 11:18: "When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life." Acts 13:48: "And as many as were ordained to eternal life believed."

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  • @briancook007  All are ordained to eternal life....but, if i get picked for a job it doesn't mean i have to accept the job...

  • No, sir, Acts 13:48b is in the passive voice in the Greek, which means that they were acted upon, they did not act upon themselves. Acts 16:14: "And a certain woman named Lydia, a seller of purple, of the city of Thyatira, which worshipped God, heard us: whose heart the Lord opened, that she attended unto the things which were spoken of Paul."

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  • Eze. 36:26-27: "A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them."

  • @briancook007 Friend, is a person that is born again saved? yes or no?

  • Yes, sir, a regenerated person is born again; they are saved.

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  • @briancook007 I will admit I'm not exactly sure what Acts 13:48 and Jude :4 mean. But, friend, will you at least admit you don't know how to answer John 12:47? And Who Christ is addressing in Mark 9:45? And admit that All can be many...but many, in your view(some), can not be all. Christ took on the iniquity of us all.

  • No, sir, please don't put words into my mouth. I've explained already Jn. 12:47; "world" means "Gentiles", or "nations". Please compare it with Mat. 25:31-46. I've explained also Mk. 9:45; it is a command to the entire human race to repent and to believe (Mk. 1:15). Jesus died for the elect only, securing our salvation at Calvary (Rom. 8:28-39).

  • John 12:47..When Christ said he came not to judge the world...he didn't mean everybody? He meant not only some jews, but some gentiles? No. ALL will be judged. IN CONTEXT Christ is saying he didn't come to judge the WORLD(EVERYONE) but to save the WORLD(EVERYONE).

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  • Mark 9:45 "And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:" I do not see the words "repent" or "believe" here. Mark 1:15. What Christ is saying here is; if your foot is going to prevent you from being saved CUT IT OFF for it's better to halt into life than to enter into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched, with 2 feet. Who is he talking to, friend?

  • Acts 17:30: "And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent."

  • @briancook007 Friend, a regenerated person is saved BEFORE faith, not by faith in calvinism

  • No, sir, that is incorrect. A person is regenerated first, which always produces saving faith and repentance (Acts 11:18, Acts 16:14, Jn. 4:10 cf. Eph. 2:8-9).

  • BUT, faith comes after they are saved, in your view. You believing regeneration produces a saving faith means that a person that is regenerated is saved before faith, not BY faith. Romans 5:1 "Therefore being justified BY faith.." not BEFORE faith Ephesians 2:8 "For by grace are ye saved THROUGH faith.." not BEFORE faith. Romans 3:28 "Therefore we conclude that a man is justified BY faith.." Not BEFORE faith

  • Eph. 2:8-9 tells us that faith is God's gift to man, not man's gift to God: "THAT not of yourselves". No man ever believes unless God allows that to him, for it is written (Acts 13:48), "and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed," and it is written again (Acts 16:14): "And a certain woman named Lydia, a seller of purple, of the city of Thyatira, which worshipped God, heard us: whose heart the Lord opened, that she attended unto the things which were spoken of Paul."

  • Isaiah 53:6...The truth is that someone is saved by grace by faith...not before it

  • Acts 5:31: "Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for TO GIVE REPENTANCE to Israel, and forgiveness of sins." Acts 11:18: "When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath GOD also to the Gentiles GRANTED REPENTANCE unto life."

  • @briancook007 GIVE REPENTANCE TO ISRAEL AND THE GENTILES...The Bible makes no mention of which Gentiles or which Jews...since it does not make an exclusion of any then one should take the Bible for what it says...ALL GENTILES AND ALL JEWS

  • Not so; God's election is unconditional and individual; what saith the Scriptures (Gal. 1:15-16)? "But when it pleased God, who separated ME from my mother's womb, and called ME by his grace, To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood." All those who are chosen to service are chosen first to salvation, save one: Judas Iscariot (Jn. 17:12).

  • II Pet. 2:9, 12: "The Lord knoweth how to deliver the godly out of temptations, and TO RESERVE THE UNJUST UNTO THE DAY OF JUDGMENT TO BE PUNISHED.....But these, as natural brute beasts, MADE TO BE TAKEN AND DESTROYED, speak evil of the things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish in their own corruption." Rev. 17:8: "They that dwell on the earth shall wonder, WHOSE NAMES WERE NOT WRITTEN IN THE BOOK OF LIFE FROM THE FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD...."

  • Eze. 36:26-27: "A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them." Acts 16:14: "And...Lydia,...which worshipped God, heard us: whose heart the Lord opened, that she attended unto the things which were spoken of Paul."

  • @briancook007 Ez 36:28 And ye shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers; and ye shall be my people, and I will be your God. ..I don't dwell in this land...

  • Rom. 9:23-26: "And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory, Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles? As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved. And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people; there shall they be called the children of the living God."

  • Yes...by grace through faith

    BY grace God graciously shows us our sin and makes ALIVE the heart thus enabling us to Believe and have FAITH. God makes us BORN AGAIN by his spirit then once we are alive to God and his truth ...we choose Jesus. But we would never do it otherwise!

  • No, sir, not all are ordained to eternal life. Jude 4: "For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ."

  • @briancook007 1 Timothy 2:4 gives no reason to make a person think that all men is not all men. Consider that Paul was writing to Timothy, who was his "..own son in the faith.." 1 Tim. 1:2. Timothy, I would assume, would understand that not only jews were the ones God predestined to be saved...So all men we should take as all men...also 1 Timothy 2:6 "Who gave himself a ransom for all.." ..And John 12:47 the world, which is everyone. everyone will be judged.

  • No, sir, "all men" in I Tim. 2:4 is defined by Acts 9:15 compared with Acts 22:15 and I Thes. 2:15-16. "All" in I Tim. 2:6 is defined by Rom. 10:12. Paul is emphasizing the point that the Gospel is for the Gentile as well as for the Jew, as the context shows clearly (vs. 7); it is further noteworthy that Paul wrote that epistle to Timothy, a man who was half-Jewish and half-Gentile.

  • @briancook007 vs. 7 states "Whereunto I am ordained a preacher, and an apostle, (I speak the truth in Christ, and lie not;) a teacher of the Gentiles in faith and verity." ...That doesn't take away from the truth that all men is all men, my friend. I'm fine with the truth was a teacher of the Gentiles. Also, do you believe that Timothy thought up to that point that only jews could be saved, before he got this letter?

  • The idea that the Gospel was for the Gentiles was a radical concept in that day, a point that was emphasized in this context. "All men" in I Tim. 2:4 is defined by Acts 9:15 compared with Acts 22:15 & I Thes. 2:15-16: "Who both killed the Lord Jesus, and their own prophets, and have persecuted us; and they please not God, and are contrary to ALL MEN: Forbidding us to speak to the GENTILES that they might be saved, to fill up their sins alway: for the wrath is come upon them to the uttermost."

  • @briancook007 All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all. Isaiah 53:6 Is all many people? Yes.

  • Isa. 53:6, 11-12: "All we like SHEEP have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.....He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify MANY; for he shall bear their iniquities....and he bare the sin of MANY, and made intercession for the transgressors." This refers to believers, God's elect (Rom. 8:33).

  • @briancook007 Friend ALL people is MANY people, is it not?

  • Sir, you're forgetting Eph. 5:25: "Husbands, love your wives, EVEN AS Christ also loved the CHURCH, and gave himself for IT." Is Paul telling these Ephesian men that they ought to give themselves for other women in addition to their wives, or is he telling them that they ought to give themselves for their wives ONLY? Of course, the latter (Mk. 10:7-9).

  • @briancook007 Did Christ only give himself for Paul(Galatians 2:20)? No.  Only for the church(Eph. 5:25)? No. The whole world...(Isaiah 53:6, John 12:47)

  • Rom. 11:12: "Now if the fall of them be the riches of the WORLD, and the diminishing of them the riches of the GENTILES; how much more their fullness?"

  • @briancook007 Friend, I have no problem with Romans 11:12

  • Sir, it appears that you do; you fail to interpret the Scriptures from a Jewish cultural perspective, and you fail to acknowledge that "world" means "Gentiles" in reference to the Atonement.

  • @briancook007 Friend...it appears you fail to acknowledge that world in John 12:47 means the whole world...

  • You fail to compare Jn. 12:47 with Mat. 25:31-46.

  • @briancook007 Matthew 25:31-46 does not contradict John 12:47...John 12:47 Christ came to save the whole world, just as the whole world will be judged..context

  • @briancook007 Would you say that a person that is born of the Spirit, has the Spirit, been regenerated and renewed by the Spirit, become a son/daughter of God is saved?

  • Jn. 3:8: "The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit." Tit. 3:5: "Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost."

  • @briancook007 So, a person that is born again is saved, being washed and renewed, correct?

  • Acts 15:7-9: "And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago GOD MADE CHOICE among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe. And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us; And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith."

  • @briancook007 Acts 15:7-9 does not contradict what I believe

  • Yes, sir, it does, if you're an Arminian.

  • @briancook007 My friend, do you believe in limited atonement? If you do, then, that means you believe that God is commanding people that Christ didn't die for to believe(You said all men are warned to believe) in Christ. This is not a truth of the Bible

  • L (limited [or, definite] atonement)--Jn. 10:11, 15: "The good shepherd giveth his life for the SHEEP.....I lay down my life for the SHEEP." Rom. 8:32-33: "He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for US ALL, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things? Who shall lay any thing to the charge of GOD'S ELECT? It is God that justifieth." Eph. 5:25: "Husbands, love your wives, EVEN AS Christ also loved the CHURCH, and gave himself for IT."

  • @briancook007 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me. ....So since this verse says that Christ gave himself for Paul does that mean that Paul was the only one whom Christ died for? No. Friend, Why command people to believe in Christ if Christ's death is not for them?

  • Again, you make the mistake of trying to bring God down to our level. What saith the Scriptures (Isa. 55:8-9)? "For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD. For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts." "World" in reference to the Atonement means that Christ gave Himself for Gentiles as well as for Jews (Jn. 12:19-20, Rom. 11:12).

  • For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God? 1 Peter 4:18

    All people are supposed to obey the gospel. But the gospel is not for all people? But with the truth that all people were died for, then, it makes sense that God would command all people to believe the gospel

  • if you listen to the message you can hear the word reject.a calvinist can not reject they have no free will they are totally depraved.calvinism is a doctrine that is out of the pits of hell.the book of Titus chapter 2 verse 11 destroys the whole thought of calvinism.grace is for all not just a certain few.if a person gets under conviction they can be saved.

  • I agree!I also believe that some want to be worshiped.

  • When will man stop worshiping preachers,and start worshiping God?

  • "God save the elect and then elect some more" CHS

  • C.H. Spurgeon is not a Calvinists, C.H. Spurgeon is baptist Church. and yes talk Elect. explain-

    We teach that election assures that those chosen will be saved, but it alone does not save them. People are saved through faith in the substitutionary death of Christ. Their election and personal faith are both necessary in the salvation of an individual. Individuals must take responsibility to repent and trust Christ to be saved (Romans 8:28-30; Ephesians 1:4; 1 Peter 1:2; Romans 10:9-10, 13).

  • Spurgeon wrote "A Defense of Calvinism." Do you hold that he was defending Arminianism in that treatise?

  • I was learn from Crown bible college in powell, TN and Preach and he did touch in England and history in C.H. Spurgeon's museum . and in crown bible college hall of museum different baptist history. abut C.H. Spurgeon frame and staff and C.H.'s own staff in Crown bible college is IFB.