Re: ATHEIST

[falotnek]

Einstein and Stephen Hawking are atheists. They used the word God as an example. quote mining will not work here .

[beastlt12]

Could the sort of manipulation that this video addresses, exist as a sort of meme in the religious population? Something that only exists to promote itself.

[fortunatus]

The FSM likes you!

[rozeboosje]

Yes indeed. I remember seeing this response. Very good.

[trystaelsky]

Wow. You are the best example of a hypocrite I've seen. "love4allmankind" and this crap you talk about atheists...bigot.

[murraythefrog22]

love4allmankind,

??????

didn't you just post this EXACT SAME post on sablechickens video? I should mark your comment as spam, but don't worry I won't.

[guaranaa]

Nothing at all in the video was even remotely rude . Your just showing your ignorance again ...Nothing about a human mind is simple , infact its one of the most complicated things being STUDIED (wait you might not know that word)today , not god. (because ofcourse you can't study a fictional character like the easter bunny , the tooth fairy or god ). Read a book or two , you ignorant waste to society ... then come back and talk , education isnt as scary as you think , try it..

[murraythefrog22]

love4allmankind,

"Both Albert Einstein and Stephen Hawking - the two most respected, brilliant minds of the last one hundred years - believe(d) in a God."

You posted this EXACT SAME comment as well. You're weird. Why do you do that?

[zeldarooles]

Wow. I've been saving this famous quote. Thank you for offering me an opportunity to use it.

"It was, of course, a lie what you read about my religious convictions, a lie which is being systematically repeated. I do not believe in a personal god and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly. If something is in me which can be called religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of the world so far as our science can reveal it." -Einstein

[scienceminded]

huh?h

[BrianJunglist]

shes a nut bar and needs help

[blackcat355]

Thanks for the background info. Skepticism is what keeps people like you and me on the light side ;)

[TheOptimisticSkeptic]

I think you hit the nail on the head with this video. As recently as April and May she was making comments on youtube and myspace such as "Jesus is my lord and savior, He is everything to me". Suddenly in June she's an atheist?.. uh huh sure.

[TheOptimisticSkeptic]

In addition wayofthemaster and repentandtrust dot org were sites she plugged just prior to her miraculous conversion to atheism. You don't go from extremly Christian to atheist overnight.

[TrueNorth15]

nicely said

[cramsa]

Good video response... thanks.

[danielnz1]

Very well communicated!

I also checked out her my-space website a few weeks ago and it was quite different than her youtube one, this quickly made her atheist video very suspect too me! I hope she gets a good reasoned balance in her young life soon.

[philhellenes]

Perfectly fair and respectful response, and VERY indicative of a certain level of inner dishonesty on Abiola's part. This issue is pretty much over right now, and at the end of it I MUST say I dislike religion even more than before it began (I wouldn't have thought this possible).

[Jbear9]

Optimistic17 said she was looking for this to happen. I've seen this happen many times, a brain chemical imbalance being mistaken for religious experience.

[VennomFangX]

Optimistic17 is bipolar.

[kitepilot]

For the first time I agree with you.

[Rhonda9]

You are such a nice person. You presented your opinions well.

[wanderingsociologist]

another interesting thing about optimistic, is in her video description she lists "atheist propaganda" and in that list is the da vinci code, which is in fact is a self proclaimed work of fiction by dan brown. it is a common christian mistake to think that the da vinci code was written as non-fiction, as we all know that propaganda is supposed to show a bent truth, not a self proclaimed fiction

just something to think about

[moonglow38]

One more thing, if she had been a Christian and this happened only with the voice said, there is no god and suddenly decided to become an atheist, would you all still advise her to seek medical attention? Also telling her not let her faith keep her from being a good person was rather sad, since Christians ARE suppose to be nice people. I realize too many aren't though and certainly aren't following Jesus' teachings by acting that way. :(

[thequantumflux]

"One more thing, if she had been a Christian and this happened only with the voice said, there is no god and suddenly decided to become an atheist, would you all still advise her to seek medical attention?"

Yes I would, if you are hearing voices there is a problem.

[moonglow38]

That was a nice video and respectful. I think the reason you don't see the Christians pushing the medical issues you all have brought up is because we believe in the super natural. A person doesn't just have a psychotic break out of the blue, usually they have been having major problems long before that. She also just didn't have the sleep paralysis either.

[moonglow38]

One thought here, if she had only been an atheist for a year, which isn't very long at all, what was she before? Probably a Christian and more then likely she was just a backsliden Christian. This is quite common to see, especially in young people trying to find their own way independent of their parents faith.

[Gisburne2000]

This seals the deal for me. If she wasn't trying to hide something then, well, she wouldn't be trying to hide it would she? I saw the link to her MySpace channel (now removed) but didn't follow it up. I'm glad you did. Once again showing the difference between blind faith and the sceptical, inquiring mind.

[pdoeman]

Great to hear your voice.

I'm still confused about the entire episode. I don't know what to think.

She hasn't adequately explained her alleged change of view and why she feels her experiences are convincing evidence for a Christian god.

[thequestionmarkofGod]

I've asked her twice privately in addition to the once on her channel which she deleted for the whole story, she still hasn't answered.

At this point the confusion is mutual and from your last vid I got the impression she may have openned up more to you than anyone.

What to think, what to think?

[Brainmold]

Interesting.

[ticijev]

what a beautiful video..

[8journey8]

There is still a video on youtube by Abiola from earlier times..search "christians-where is god now".This is why I'm so shocked she would be spouting all this godislove nonsense. I figured that she was atheist, but trying to make deists rethink their beliefs. But it was all a ruse, huh?

[imrational]

Very good video. 5 stars.

[HitchensFanatic]

Piro, I thought you were very nice, wishing her well. Here is where the RRS would enter, and call it Delusions of Grandeur...and that's what it seems like to me, by listening to her story.

[rozeboosje]

Excellent video. Very good indeed.

[florinmiu]

Such a big surprise... christians lying for their religion... I'm speechless... not...

[TogetherForPeace]

Sleep paralysis is a common experience. It was clear she is smart, articulate, and not living alone. I don't find much point in reading into one video and insinuating she may have some mental issues that I have no experience with. I wonder if some atheists are all up in arms over TAA and how he didn't report that kid from Finland? hmmm I gather not.

[Ender1zero1]

I asked you to describe your personal experience of sleep paralysis that's all, not give a medical opinion, your response was google it. Sorry I don't watch TAA well not sorry he bores me annoys me I'd rather watch paint dry.

[TogetherForPeace]

That comment was in reponse to Piro's video.

[thequantumflux]

Actually Jack I believe the point of the video is that some things dont add up.

For example she put a Way of the Master plug at the end of her video, seems quite an extreme to go for an atheist.

Even for one who has converted a month ago.

I dont beleive anyone is calling her stupid either.

[TogetherForPeace]

quantum-if it's just a made up story so be it. im not here for this lady although i can see that some are having a hay day with this drama saying stuff like "man those theists I just can't believe they don't show how much they care about someone they've never met, but me as an atheist I've posted up all these comments telling her to get checked out...see! see! those theists just dont really care about people" How stupid some people are 'acting'

[thequantumflux]

Yes some are and thats on them. It doesnt change the fact that the "godless heathens" showed concern for her somewhat erratic behavior and the majority did it without judgment of her.

I think it is really sad that so many took concern as some sort of attack. It speaks volumes about the atheist/theist community.

I wonder if the christian community would have been as kind had it been a christian converting to atheism?

I think that we all know the reaction they would have.

[imrational]

TogetherForPeace,

I was one of the atheists insinating that she needs to be checked for a mental issue. I delineated several clear reasons why. I freely admitted that a 9 minute video isn't long enough to judge, but if a person is hearing voices and feeling sensations not felt by others... wouldn't that constitute an evaluation to rule out harmful possibilities?

[TogetherForPeace]

Imrational-I wouldn't know because I'm not a doctor. Sleep paralysis is a common experience, hearing a voice while in sleep paralysis once again not so unusual. Does that constitute an evaluation? Off of one video I have no idea. I guess anytime I see some coughin on camera I can tell them to see a doctor just to show the youtube world I care. I seriously think this has become ridiculous.

[imrational]

TogetherForPeace,

Well, after seeing the WOTM blurb, I'm inclined to agree with you... it has become ridiculous.

As to the sleep paralysis, no I wouldn't advocate a doctor visit if that were the only thing we were talking about. It's not. I listed the other reasons in my SableChicken response video. You are also missing the first "reconversion" video she did (she pulled that one).

My Question for you is, at what point would you advocate a medical workup?

[TogetherForPeace]

imrational-the point is simply having only seen one video i find it completely ridiculous of ppl to suppose that I should have posted up a comment telling her to see a doctor. Had I seen this lady get on stickam and tell me about her experiences and how they were ongoing and more than just sleep paralysis then I would have said something.

[imrational]

TogetherForPeace,

Okay. I acknowledge your point. I based my comments on more than just her video (I just can't discuss it further).

[JSResponds]

It seems that you don't understand that sleep paralysis and apnea are closely related to some mental disorders. I Am a psych student, so I Can say that it's worth looking into.

[quasarsphere]

Kid from Finland?  To what dost thou refer, pray?

[JSResponds]

There is a point in questioning the possibility of a disorder, even if it isn't an issue. That's different from making a sudden diagnosis. Furthermore, she doesn't need a disorder to have non-spiritual events that seem spiritual be occurring, as I commented on your video.

[thequestionmarkofGod]

Hi Piro, thanks for the mention, it was better with pictures and captions, the text questions and comments were very good, right on point.

[TheDude0fLife]

Yep! We know it wasn't God so everything else just kinda falls in place.

[Optimistic17]

I was a little offended that you didn't contact me first before posting this video so that I could explain everything to you- instead of trying to expose me as a liar over the net. What was wrong with just sending me a message in the first place?

[thequantumflux]

I don't see how he called you a liar per se. But he did express doubts that you were more than agnostic.

I mean you were an atheist, why would you be offended by that?

And to be totally honest plugging way of the master ministries is fairly suspect for someone who claims to be well versed in science.

And seeing that is what made me (as a skeptic) suspicious.

But hey if this is a misunderstanding then simply make public your myspace page.

[thequantumflux]

I have no beef with you, if christianity makes you a better person and you don't fall into the divisive traps of religion then all the power to you.

[tingtangs]

Optimistic17, it's too bad that sleep paralysis and half-dreaming are not due to God.

Nor is water falling from the sky. There are a huge number of possible explanations for that, including someone pulling your leg.

[tingtangs]

Optimistic17: Oh, and here's from a comment from another christian on this page:

'hearing a voice while in sleep paralysis once again not so unusual'

So basically... OOPS!

[websnarf]

I can't speak for Piro, but it seems to me doing this out in the open prevents any potential shroud of deception. Piro is not the only person that is curious about this. If you have explanations, then why would you want to keep it private?

[xJediHowieX]

The Great PiroNiro speaks! :D

[Godisahomo]

You know that the SAT score don't go above 1600. She said that she got a 1700. o_0

[AtheistAaron]

I didn't hear her say that, but I believe she is a little younger than me. That being the case, she may have taken the new SAT. I was in one of the last classes to take the standard SAT. The new SAT has an additional segment, and scores range up to 2100.

[AtheistAaron]

Oops 2400, my bad. In that case, 1700 isn't so good, so maybe she did take the older tests. I'll have to rewatch her vid, because I don't remember the SATs being mentioned (I'm sure they were, I just have a very strange memory).

[Godisahomo]

ok, cool, I did not know they have a deferent scale now.

[AtheistAaron]

Well, the thing is, if that is the scale she took, 1700 suddenly isn't much to brag about. =|

[Eyedunno]

I mentioned this on her ATHEIST video, but when I was in high school, the highest possible score was 1600. So it would seem to me that either she's lying about the old test, or she's bragging about a mediocre score on the new one. Which is worse?... hrmmph

[ReligionIsACrutch]

Most likely what has happened is that an atheist that didn't believe in gods for all the wrong reasons has now become a theist for all those same and wrong reasons.

In effect, nothing has changed, she's just on a different side of the fence. Please tell me when someone like Dawkins or Harris becomes a theist.

Of course even then it would still change nothing for me but at least that would be something worth mentioning.

[happyjesus123]

So Abiola was faking being an atheist and doing a brilliant job. She actually had ImRational trying to help her. But is the next video still more faking? Way of the Master? This has to be more parody. Abiola is brilliant she fakes being an Atheist and uses that to fake being an insane Christian. I can't wait to see her next video.

[thequantumflux]

I have to agree with you jesus, it was a pretty good fake.

But I have no remorse for taking someone at their word.

[thequestionmarkofGod]

I'm not sure she was entirely faking, the religious comments posted by her dated "preyoutube" so one can't be sure, but she certainly has not been fully honest about how long she disbelieved. Also the mere fact she was seeking god shows she was more likely agnostic, with some rejection of religion and perhaps with feelings of anger and resentment towards god fueling her questionning.

[thequantumflux]

Yeah that sounds more credible, and besides even if it was a hoax (which I hope wasn't) the atheist community here treated her better than a theist would an apostate.

I saw a majority of support and compassion from the atheist responses to her and it shows what the community is all about.

[OriginalHamster]

I wish I could have been as nice in my vid to her.

But sometimes you gotta call them out.

watch?v=Dc38cdCRdjc

[heatherlynblue]

Thank you piro, for not jumping down her throat given the information you have that does seem suspect.

Really great point on the Christian response -there are Christians who I hold in high esteem who have simply stated "praise god" comments without any concern, in my opinion, for her as a person.

[heatherlynblue]

I would be so disheartened to find that this was manufatured by wotm as some are suggesting. If anything, I think it is apparent that we have genuine concern for her and hold her well-being paramount.

If I've been had, it wouldn't be the first time. I'd rather be "had" and supportive and risk my own emotional investment than to jump to the conclusion that this is a hoax and risk not reaching out to someone in need of support.

[EMTRUE]

I agree with you heather, being supportive is best. It's so strange to me that christians view a supportive concern for her in a negative light. How can they not see the good in that?

[TogetherForPeace]

concern for her as a person? after watching one video of someone im supposed to show my concern by saying, 'hey you really should get checked out' that's showing concern...i hardly see it that way. I think some folks from both sides are really blowing this out of proportion.

[Ender1zero1]

I found it interesting that TogetherForPeace admitted he has had sleep paralysis but won't come forward and talk about it, actually, that's not quite true, I didn't find it interesting I found it incredibly predictable.

[TogetherForPeace]

"But won't come forward and talk about it?!" Yeah you know me I've been hiding out refusing to talk about it...lol whatever. Actually I've been ignoring the many emails of people asking, "Jack plz come forward and talk about it" (sarcasm) :)

[Ender1zero1]

Am I wrong did you speak about it and I missed it because honestly, your, google it, was the only response I saw when I asked you to describe sleep paralysis.

[TogetherForPeace]

You asked me to describe sleep paralysis to you..yeah my bad I guess I don't see how that led to "togetherforpeace...won't come forward and talk about it"

[Ender1zero1]

When your answer was google it after Sable and Geerup laughed sleep disorders off in general and acted like they aren't real I have to admit I was offended. I should have realized that maybe you were just trying to stay out of the drama and maybe I should have left it at that but I guess on some level I hoped since you suffer from a sleep disorder you would, I don't know maybe give a damn when people who have them are laughed at and made fun of, my bad.

[thequantumflux]

Nice calm response

and of course on cue the peanut gallary comes in saying so what of shes got something wrong with her... Its about jesus!!

[8journey8]

Very calm and understated...well done. You are a credit to youtube, and I am glad you made the point that for almost everyone, it was about her health, not about shouting her out for duplicity. I too wish her well, but frankly I am glad the drama is over.

[sablechicken]

I really don't believe that she has anything wrong with her first off. Even if she does, so what! Give her the benefit of the doubt, The atheist would love to see her stuck with the stigma of being sick in the head rather then let her have a little time to settle down.

[thequantumflux]

If she has something wrong with her so what give her the benefit of the doubt?

Are you high?

Well remind me not to have an epileptic fit around you lest you think I am speaking in tongues.

[sablechicken]

thequantumflux, You are going around all over asking, "Are you high?"

Just how far do you think this is going to take you? You are wasteing my time with insults. I will not be talking to you again if you keep it up.

[thequantumflux]

Because no one in their right, sober mind would take someone showing concern as some sort of dirty trick.

Either you are a very callous and selfish person or you are on drugs.

Either type would concentrate so deeply on trying to hurt others with the snide, bitchy way you think you are "educating" people.

[sablechicken]

What does it matter if she was a atheist for 80yrs or one day? The change is still incredible. I only considered myself an atheist for a few weeks, before that I was more pagan or pantheist with a sence that there was a god but just not Jesus. But what does it matter where I was. I have meet Christians that did many things in the name of Jesus, and surprisingly said that they did not really know Jesus.

[thequantumflux]

Don't back track and start your "I was an atheist" bullshit when you know damn well that with your minuscule amount of knowledge of atheism that you were never an atheist.

[8journey8]

Sable, the fact that the change was so sudden is the point. Conversion into anything due to magic or wierd experiences is suspect to rational people. Unbelievers are also puzzled that your god is interested in magic tricks when he could be solving hunger issues on the other side of the world.

[thequestionmarkofGod]

It matters when you claim to obey a god who clearly commands: Thou shalt not bear false witness. Don't you think?

Also it makes a huge difference to how committed to disbelief you are, you claim she was a "hardenned atheist" when really if anything she merely experienced a period of questionning and since she was admittedly seeking god, then she must have believed or at least still hoped god existed.

[heatherlynblue]

sable chicken... would "the atheist" really love that? you sweeping generalizations are a function of your own stigmatization of a people group of which i am a part. i realize demonizing atheists is easy for you, given the fact that you choose to selectively listen to this community, but please don't think for a moment that "the atheist" would be happy for abiola - who is a real person, btw, to be mentally ill.

[thequestionmarkofGod]

Absolutely on point Heather, the last thing we want is for this girl to be sufferring any illness much less one that could cause her life long disruptions, that would be terrible.

[OriginalHamster]

sablechicken:

Arent you that creepy lady who does the impressions of judelicious while on the toilet?

[creationismisstupid]

Yes it was in response to a video of Judelicious iro Richard Dawkins. I think it was his birthday. She made several vids from her toilet I think it's her habitat where she feels happy and is comfortable.

[Godisahomo]

No, you prefer for her to stay sick than have any possibility for her claim, that she interacted with god(whatever that means), to be discredited in a medical sense. You're a sicko!

[worldlystone]

I think you're spot on.......

[PiroNiro]

Thanks for the support dude. :)

[worldlystone]

She mostly posted videos that she didn't make herself but when she did(From what i remember) she used very weak arguments like"the world is so violent and cruel so how could there be a god".Theses are the same things that fake former atheists say when they are asked why they were an atheist at one time.