I wonder if they mention that the Moravians he was with on that boat starting singing hymns when the storm hit...hmm. I hope so considering parts of this movie are filmed in Old Salem, a Moravian settlement. And of course there are lovely shots of Salem College :)
As a reader of Wesley, I wonder if either the director or the one portraying Mr. Wesley ever read any of his works, especially his journal. I'm totally unimpressed with the lead actor's portrayal of Wesley in this trailer. I would not call his interpretation of Rev. Wesley as accurate, nor of the others, cowering in fear wondering what to do. Rev. Wesley was afraid of no one, especially not a little breaking of glass. I would imagine the rest of the film is just as inaccurate.
Of course I know he was a man, and I don't believe I've claimed otherwise. I never even hinted that he was Jesus and died for my sins or that I was looking to Rev. Wesley for my salvation. But by your comments you it seems like you think that I am. You can't compare the life of Wesley preconversion ( as on the ship to America) and post conversion after (Aldersgate-street). As I stated before he would not have coward in fear at a little broken glass. You need read Wesley yourself.
@originaldanman Actually, the Aldersgate St experience wasn't anywhere near the "Damascus Road" type of experience Methodist lore has it to be. It was a much more gradual process.
@EastofForever I really don't know much about "Methodist lore" I just read Wesley; his journal, his sermons, etc... I've never as yet heard anyone compare his experience to Paul's, (though I'm not saying that hasn't happened). But as for it being only a more gradual process I have to disagree. "I felt my heart strangely warmed" what is that but not instantaneous. Yet I also believe that it was continual growth from that point, a daily walk, and a daily filling (as with all true believers).
@originaldanman Well, it's really no big deal and I don't mean to be contentious, but I do remember from my Methodism studies 30 years ago reading where the comment was made that, yes, Wesley definitely did write about how much his Aldersgate experience moved him, but the author made the point that, as disciplined a journalist as Wesley was, the ensuing journal entries after the Aldersgate experience were quite bland and not indicative of someone who had a blinding "Damascus Road" experience.
@EastofForever Like I said I've never heard anyone compare his experience to Paul's as to the magnitude. But in his own words it was an instantaneous change. As for what other author's have to say, just read Wesley, not what others say about him. His works are still available for purchase. I am reading his journal now and I don't find it bland at all, but then again, that's just me.
@originaldanman My allusion to a "Damascus Road experience" is just short-hand for an unmistakeable life-quaking experience. That's all.
YouTube won't let us put links in so Google "John Wesley and the Second Blessing" by Timothy L. Smith."Wesley himself acknowledged his disappointment at the small measure of joy he had received when he thought the Holy Spirit bore witness to his regeneration at the famous prayer meetings in Aldersgate Street , London , in May, 1738.
@EastofForever Though he may have been wanting in joy, He definitely had peace: "But this I know, I have 'now peace with God.' And I sin not today..."
"And herein I found the difference between this and my former state chiefly consisted. I was striving, yea, fighting with all my might under the law, as well as under grace. But then I sometimes, if not often conqured; now, I was always conqueror. " Wesley May 1738 That he continued to grow from that point no one doubts.
Respond to this video.. and work of the Holy Spirit should have been evident immediately after he was assured of being God’s child. On the contrary, he found himself a few days afterward nearly “sawn asunder” by doubt, temptation, and the absence of joy. "
That was a quote you should find in the fifth paragraph of that article. Wesley, in his late 30s by this time, wasn't used to having a "warm" faith. It really took some getting used to for him.
@EastofForever No one will ever be without temptation, and because we are doesn't prove our experience real or false. "Then was I taught, that peace and victory over sin are essential to faith in the Captain of our salvation: But that, as to the transports of joy that usually attend the beginning of it, especially in those who have mourned deeply, God sometimes giveth, sometimes withholdeth them, according to the counsels of his own will." Wesley - May 1838
Respond to this video...I see the Aldersgate experience as one in a series, seen and unseen, obvious and subtle, of Wesley's maturing. Let's face it: he needed the disappointment of the Savannah experience. He needed to "hit rock bottom" in order to "get over himself" more. I see the Aldersgate experience as a continuation of his Georgia experience, including the passage to and from Georgia. Then, after the A experience, he continued to grow bit by bit. My take on it , my friend.
@EastofForever Well I don't see the Aldersgate experience as one among many. I see it as a unique experience just as Mr. Wesley himself said it was. I also never read in his journals anything before Aldersgate that he needed to "get over". He himself admits that he didn't even have believing faith which was what Aldersgate was all about. And if someone doesn't have one of those experiences then they aren't even saved! Also, no one ever said he (like all believers) didn't continue to grow.
@originaldanman " He was tempted to doubt whether he had actually experienced what the Scripture promised. This fact has prompted some modern scholars to denigrate the Aldersgate event. It seems to me, rather, to have reflected the fact that Wesley at that point understood the Bible to teach only one instantaneous experience of saving grace and that, therefore, all the promises of Scripture concerning the righteousness, peace, and joy which were to flow from the presence
I wonder if they mention that the Moravians he was with on that boat starting singing hymns when the storm hit...hmm. I hope so considering parts of this movie are filmed in Old Salem, a Moravian settlement. And of course there are lovely shots of Salem College :)
PantherPiccolo 8 months ago
Where can I buy this movie? Someone please tell me.
ArmorOfGodMinistries 1 year ago
As a reader of Wesley, I wonder if either the director or the one portraying Mr. Wesley ever read any of his works, especially his journal. I'm totally unimpressed with the lead actor's portrayal of Wesley in this trailer. I would not call his interpretation of Rev. Wesley as accurate, nor of the others, cowering in fear wondering what to do. Rev. Wesley was afraid of no one, especially not a little breaking of glass. I would imagine the rest of the film is just as inaccurate.
originaldanman 2 years ago
@originaldanman
I didn't find this film to be so inaccurate. Rather, it shows the very HUMAN! John Wesley.
We can tend to make heroes larger than life. But, Wesley was a man. An ordinary mortal Earth man.
We must look to CHRIST! for our salvation. Wesley would not us do anything less (like looking to the man).
Wesley even himself realized how HE! was not converted--from the heart--in the midst of his missionary career.
dakotagerman1 1 year ago
Of course I know he was a man, and I don't believe I've claimed otherwise. I never even hinted that he was Jesus and died for my sins or that I was looking to Rev. Wesley for my salvation. But by your comments you it seems like you think that I am. You can't compare the life of Wesley preconversion ( as on the ship to America) and post conversion after (Aldersgate-street). As I stated before he would not have coward in fear at a little broken glass. You need read Wesley yourself.
originaldanman 1 year ago
@originaldanman Actually, the Aldersgate St experience wasn't anywhere near the "Damascus Road" type of experience Methodist lore has it to be. It was a much more gradual process.
EastofForever 1 year ago
@EastofForever I really don't know much about "Methodist lore" I just read Wesley; his journal, his sermons, etc... I've never as yet heard anyone compare his experience to Paul's, (though I'm not saying that hasn't happened). But as for it being only a more gradual process I have to disagree. "I felt my heart strangely warmed" what is that but not instantaneous. Yet I also believe that it was continual growth from that point, a daily walk, and a daily filling (as with all true believers).
originaldanman 1 year ago
@originaldanman Well, it's really no big deal and I don't mean to be contentious, but I do remember from my Methodism studies 30 years ago reading where the comment was made that, yes, Wesley definitely did write about how much his Aldersgate experience moved him, but the author made the point that, as disciplined a journalist as Wesley was, the ensuing journal entries after the Aldersgate experience were quite bland and not indicative of someone who had a blinding "Damascus Road" experience.
EastofForever 1 year ago
@EastofForever Like I said I've never heard anyone compare his experience to Paul's as to the magnitude. But in his own words it was an instantaneous change. As for what other author's have to say, just read Wesley, not what others say about him. His works are still available for purchase. I am reading his journal now and I don't find it bland at all, but then again, that's just me.
originaldanman 1 year ago
@originaldanman My allusion to a "Damascus Road experience" is just short-hand for an unmistakeable life-quaking experience. That's all.
YouTube won't let us put links in so Google "John Wesley and the Second Blessing" by Timothy L. Smith."Wesley himself acknowledged his disappointment at the small measure of joy he had received when he thought the Holy Spirit bore witness to his regeneration at the famous prayer meetings in Aldersgate Street , London , in May, 1738.
EastofForever 1 year ago
@EastofForever Though he may have been wanting in joy, He definitely had peace: "But this I know, I have 'now peace with God.' And I sin not today..."
"And herein I found the difference between this and my former state chiefly consisted. I was striving, yea, fighting with all my might under the law, as well as under grace. But then I sometimes, if not often conqured; now, I was always conqueror. " Wesley May 1738 That he continued to grow from that point no one doubts.
originaldanman 1 year ago
Respond to this video.. and work of the Holy Spirit should have been evident immediately after he was assured of being God’s child. On the contrary, he found himself a few days afterward nearly “sawn asunder” by doubt, temptation, and the absence of joy. "
That was a quote you should find in the fifth paragraph of that article. Wesley, in his late 30s by this time, wasn't used to having a "warm" faith. It really took some getting used to for him.
EastofForever 1 year ago
@EastofForever No one will ever be without temptation, and because we are doesn't prove our experience real or false. "Then was I taught, that peace and victory over sin are essential to faith in the Captain of our salvation: But that, as to the transports of joy that usually attend the beginning of it, especially in those who have mourned deeply, God sometimes giveth, sometimes withholdeth them, according to the counsels of his own will." Wesley - May 1838
originaldanman 1 year ago
Respond to this video...I see the Aldersgate experience as one in a series, seen and unseen, obvious and subtle, of Wesley's maturing. Let's face it: he needed the disappointment of the Savannah experience. He needed to "hit rock bottom" in order to "get over himself" more. I see the Aldersgate experience as a continuation of his Georgia experience, including the passage to and from Georgia. Then, after the A experience, he continued to grow bit by bit. My take on it , my friend.
EastofForever 1 year ago
@EastofForever Well I don't see the Aldersgate experience as one among many. I see it as a unique experience just as Mr. Wesley himself said it was. I also never read in his journals anything before Aldersgate that he needed to "get over". He himself admits that he didn't even have believing faith which was what Aldersgate was all about. And if someone doesn't have one of those experiences then they aren't even saved! Also, no one ever said he (like all believers) didn't continue to grow.
originaldanman 1 year ago
@originaldanman " He was tempted to doubt whether he had actually experienced what the Scripture promised. This fact has prompted some modern scholars to denigrate the Aldersgate event. It seems to me, rather, to have reflected the fact that Wesley at that point understood the Bible to teach only one instantaneous experience of saving grace and that, therefore, all the promises of Scripture concerning the righteousness, peace, and joy which were to flow from the presence
EastofForever 1 year ago