he is so geographically disoriented,First seen as failing to recognize the Scandinavian countries and second, Scandinavia is not a region it is peninsula like Balkan peninsula.
Η Ελλαδα ειναι ενα κρατος που αποτελειται απο Μακεδονες τουρκους ποντιους βλαχους βουλγαρους αλβανους-αρβανιτες αιγυπτιους πακιστανους και το μουνι της μανα σας!!Η Μακεδονια δεν ειναι ελληνικη!!!Macedonia for the Macedonians
@provenzano18 παρε τ αρχιδια μας μουνοπανο. σας εβαλε να μαθαινετε και ελληνικα ο παπαρας ο πρωθυπουργος σας? οταν την κανει νυχτα ο παπανδρεου και ανεβει καμια χουντα στην Ελλαδα παλι, τρεξτε να κρυφτειτε!
F.Y.R.O.M. is BULGARIA...Nothing more...Nothing less....MACEDONIA WAS IS AND WILL ALWAYS BE GREEK....Grujo,your end is very close...You will be in history as the Sandam Husein of balkans...LET'S GIVE AN END IN THIS ISSUE..F.Y.R.O.Mians speak Bulgarian,wrote bulgarian,they have Bulgarian names,surnames FOR GOD they have nothing with Ancient Greek Macedonia.
"The 20th century development of a "Macedonian" ethnicity, and its recent evolution into independent stathood following the collapse of the Yugoslav state in 1991, has followed a rocky road. In order to survive the vicissitudes of Balkan history and politics, the "Macedonians", WHO HAVE HAD NO HISTORY, NEED ONE" -Eugene Borza
"The political and military leaders of the Slavs of Macedonia at the turn of the century seem not to have heard Misirkov's call for a separate Macedonian national identity; they continued to identify themselves in a national sense as Bulgarians rather than Macedonians" - L. Danforth The Macedonian conflict.
isnt it funny how truebulgar brings up a stadium name while turning a blind eye to the Bulgarian character of his key national figures!
TruMoron has no retort for the words of the scholar his nationalist compatriots cite the most
"The !_20th century development of a Macedonian ethnicity_!, and its recent evolution into independent stathood following the collapse of the Yugoslav state in 1991, has followed a rocky road. In order to survive the vicissitudes of Balkan history and politics, the Macedonians, WHO HAVE HAD NO HISTORY, NEED ONE" -Eugene Borza
True OAF: read again and enjoy the words from one the FYROMian diaspora's most cited scholars:
"The 20th century development of a Macedonian ethnicity, and its recent evolution into independent stathood following the collapse of the Yugoslav state in 1991, has followed a rocky road. In order to survive the vicissitudes of Balkan history and politics, the Macedonians, WHO HAVE HAD NO HISTORY, NEED ONE" -Eugene Borza
TrueBulgar, I suggest you stay within the confines of BulgarNews where censorship and the mods keep you safe in your bubble. Out in the real world, your dreams are nothing more than delusional fantasies of the retarded.
Helleniphoney it seems that your only contribution to helping out boygeorge here is by making him look smarter than you.And that puts you in the vicinity of legally retarded if he is smarter than you lol
@truemoron, Connect the dots, Finlay, Gordon, Danforth, Brown, Borza and even hammond indicate that your identity is the newest one in the balkans. Your identity did not exist until recently, Go back and read the BORZA quote. These are your recommended sources retard.
@princegeorge57 Actually boygeorge you try and manipulate a text by saying "he may say this but he says that too" which is cool by me.Since you believe you know so much then you may know that not every book& author will prescribe to your general idea.If that would be the case then we could cut the fat and just read one author & one book instead of 10 of each.The fact is that Mazower,Herzfeld,Trudgill,Brown,& Faubion have called you people "newly invented"by philhellenes is most amusing to me lol
@moron, Herzfeld argues that Greek history was molded by philhellenes to emphasize Greece's ancient past, he does not claim that the Greek ethnicity was invented like you retards do. Herzfeld, if you ask him, will describe a Greek cultural continuity that has lasted centuries. Since you are so keen on naming authors, MORON, why don't you tell us which one of those that you list claim that your "ethnicity" is one of the oldest in the Balkans, as you nutjobs claim.
"During medieval and modem times, Macedonia was known as a Balkan region inhabited by ethnic Greeks, Albanians, Vlachs, Serbs, Bulgarians, Jews, and Turks. " - Eugene Borza
Yet another modern scholar, one that is cited to no end on your propaganda sites, that makes no mention of "ethnic Macedonians" making up any part of the population in Macedonia's history. This also destroys your propaganda that ethnic Greeks were invented. This is one of your diaspora's favorite scholars, TrueIDIOT!
I am happy you quote Borza but why not quote your beloved Hammond as well when he states "The Greek War for independence was ultimately won by the Albanians" LOLLOLOL
@trueMORON, Hammond states that your nationality is a modern concept and he certainly does not suggest that the Greek ethnicity was invented during the early 1800s like you retards do. I have absolutely no problem with the fact that Vlachs and Arvanites helped with the Greek cause. You on the other hand are deluded enough to believe that your national heroes of the turn of last century espouse the same fraudelent version of "Macedonism" that you do. What a joke you are.
@princegeorge57 And I am sure you have no problem in me telling everyone that Finlay states that Karaiskakis was a Gypsy and that one of your biggest futbol stadiums is named after a Gypsy. I mean it is fitting considering the people that inhabit your country lol.
@trueoaf, Finlay described populations of hundreds of thousands of Greeks. He distinguished Greeks from Albanians and Vlachs during a period in which you morons claim no Greeks existed. Finlay makes no mention of any "ethnic Macedonians". "Ethnic Macedonians" did not exist at the time. Even Borza states. this. You have no arguments other than talking about stadium names and talking about Arvanite contributions to the early Greek state, as if these are arguments. You R a joke.
Your arguments are pathetic and weak. You have no foundation to stand on Slav. We all know if this was BulgarNews I would be banned, but your lies and theft of Hellenic culture will be exposed for what they are. Identity theft is a crime Slav.
I would love to see you prove 4000 years of "greek" history in Macedonia.The newcomers to the region from asia were Christian Turks who spoke Turkish & not 'greek'.They were even culturally Turkish (Mazower,Salonica City of Ghosts).The newly arrived Pontic's were another set of refugees that didn't even know what a 'greek' was (Neal Ascherson,Black Sea).Identity theft is a crime Hellenephoney.Repent your crimes to God & swear to call yourself a Ponti & you'll be in his good graces
TrueIdiot: Ascherson states that Greek populations and culture dominated many areas of the Black Sea region and that those who did not have a national consciousness can retrospectively classified as Greeks. Also, stop lying: refugees that were non Greek speakers were in the minority. Stop citing Mazower, bonehead, he claims that hardly anybody affiliated with your "Ethnic identity" even during the early 20th century.He also makes no mention of "ethnic Macedonians" in Salonica's history. LIAR!
The Slavs of Dardania/Paeonia who speak Bulgarian always are desperate to find excuses as to why no Turk ever mentions anything about "Makedonski millet" in the 600+ years that they were being ruled.
No Turk ever mentions any "hellenes" either.You have yet to provide proof of their existence in the Ottoman empire prior to 1821.Go ahead Hellenphoney.Put up or shut up once and for all.Your repeat and post tactics are so obvious because your lack of arguement has no legs to stand on and no arms to flap in water to keep you from drowning.
"...the Macedonians are a NEWLY emergent people in search of a past to help legitimize their precarious present as they attempt to establish their singular identity in a Slavic world dominated historically by Serbs and Bulgarians. "- Eugene Borza
Are you starting to connect the dots yet trueBulgar? Finlay and Gordon did not record any "ethnic Macedonians" because they did not exist during the early 19th century.
Your soccer stadium is named after a gypsy.Why boygeorge?Your country's national costume is the Albanian fustanella.Why boygeorge?Your first president was an Albanian that spoke Albanian and could not speak one word of romaika.Why boygeorge?Kolokotronis was a major in General Churches Albanian regiment.Why boygeorge?Why not the "greek" regiment?
"Finally, Krste Misirkov, who had clearly developed a strong sense of his won personal national identity as a Macedonian and who outspokenly and unambiguously called for Macedonian inguistic and national separtism, ACKNOWLEDGED THAT A MACEDONIAN NATIONAL IDENTITY WAS A RELATIVELY RECENT HISTORICAL DEVELOPMENT." - Loring Danforth
LOL! Danforth, who hobnobs with many of your activists, tells you that your identity is a new one. Yet all you can do is harp about soccer stadium names in Greece!
"The 20th century development of a Macedonian ethnicity, and its recent evolution into independent stathood following the collapse of the Yugoslav state in 1991, has followed a rocky road. In order to survive the vicissitudes of Balkan history and politics, the Macedonians, WHO HAVE HAD NO HISTORY, NEED ONE" -Eugene Borza
LOL! Borza is cited by every one of you nut cases on all of your propaganda websites as a credible source!!!
In a 1944 U.S State Department Airgram, the U.S considered, talk of Macedonian nation, Macedonian Fatherland, or Macedonia national consciousness to be unjustified demagoguery representing no ethnic nor political reality, and sees in its present revival a possible cloak for aggressive intentions against Greece
US Department, CircularAirgram(868.014/26 Dec. 1944)
1907 Russian M.Petriev a Russian Consular official & keen balkan observer accompanied Hilmi Pasha to Macedonia.He reported to his Ministry of Foreign Affairs that in Kostur(Kastoria to you imposter hellenes)the people insisted that they were Macedonians and not "greeks" or "bulgarians"& that they were fed up with the oppression of various propagandas & that in them is beginning to awake a national consciousness different from those being imposed on them from the outside.
@truemoron,go figure a Russian, who was trying to push the serbian idea that the Slavs of Macedonia were not Bulgars wrote up some bullshit.Kastoria was never an "ethnic Macedonian" town you twit, even Brailsford,a staunch pro Bulgar sympathizer said that the town was not slavic.Since you are so keen on proving"ethnic Macedonians"existed in towns, how about the two biggest towns in the area Skopje and Salonica?What proof do you have of large "Macedonian" 19th century populations in those towns?
The lies of the Slavs of Dardania are coming to an end. Over 350 World renowned academics, historians, classicists, and linguists have rejected the false claims of the Slavs of Dardania and have clearly stated. The Macedonians were a Hellenic people with Hellenic names and have no association with the clearly Slavic language, culture, and names of the residents of Dardania/Paeonia.
The Slav Bulgars of Dardania/Paeonia cannot escape reality. Here is reality:
1906 census of Ottoman Macedonia by Hilmit Pasha reports:
Mulsims 423,000
Greeks 259,000
Bulgarians 178,000
Serbs 13,150
Jews 73,000
Where are "Makedonskis"? For 600+ years no Turk ever recorded any "Makedonskis". A fake "nation" of usurpers of Hellenic history, culture, and heroes.
LOL Helleniphoney you just provided us with a census of religious affiliations.Every modern scholar today will tell you that Ottoman census' were based on religion and not race.LOL you ArvanitoSlavoVlachs are too funny and are such rag heads LOL.
@truemidget, what early 19th century census or survey of the region mentions "ethnic Macedonians". Finlay and Gordon and Leake and a myriad of others did not record any of your ilk and they were there. Even teh 1914 Carnegie Commission failed to mention the alleged majority. What a joke you are and your neaveaux "Macedonism" is.
For 600+ years the Ottomans controlled Paeonia/Dardania and they never once recorded or made any mention of a "Makedonski millet". Only Hellenes (Rum), Serbs, Bulgarians, Albanians, Jews, Vlachs, Roma etc.
The Slavs of Dardania/Paeonia are unable to prove or show that they existed. Clearly their "national heroes" described themselves as Bulgarians. Their language is almost identical to Bulgarian save some Serbian loan words. Their "alphabet" was codified in 1945!
Helleniphoney can you please provide me and everyone here a solid source that the Ottomans described any type of "hellenes" before 1821?I can assure you that the Ottomans when they first heard the word 'hellenes' that they were confused as to who these people were.But since you are making these absurd claims I think it's time to put up or shut up.
f..k u greece, i m Macedonian, whit Macedonian language, so u don t have noting whit Macedonians. is been 7000 ears and wile be to the end of the world. nobody can destroy as,everybody how is born to this land is Macedonian.when baby is born the mother rise up the baby to the son,symbol of Macedonians,and baby know thet hi is Macedonian from the beginning. u cant change the history....
Thanks for falling for my trap boygeorge.LOL I'll tell you tomorrow what that trap was.And I'll remind you again why you are a rag head and why I end up wiping my ass with you every time.
@truemoron.The only trap here is between your ears in your empty racist head.You should go back to your mentor Stefovski and tell him not to use Finlay,Gordon,Leake,Brown,Mazower, Borza and Danforth as references.They make you and your lot look stupid when you claim total demographic dominance since the contemporary writers did not mention your ethnicity anwywhere and the modern scholars claim that your identity is the newest one in the Balkans.One that hardly anyone affiliated with 100 yrs ago.
You have fallen for my trap boygeorge.Not only have I made you take a 180 degree turn from your original thesis that you are hellenes for 4000 years now you change your defense to something completely different you fraud.I recommend everyone to go back & see how you back peddled yourself around like a rag head & how your posts don't make the slightest sense.Thanks for making it loud and clear how dumb you are boygeorge lol.
@trueracistbulgar you are the fraud. You and the crapnews morons claim Greeks were invented post Greek revolution. Finlay and Gordon clearly describe Greeks all over the place during the early 19th century. Hence you were proven to be A LIAR. Neither Gordon or Finlay made any mention of ANY "Ethnic Macedonians" because "ethnic Macedonians" did not exist at the time. You have nobody on record claiming to be an "ethnic Macedonian" during the period that Finlay wrote his accounts. LIAR.
Boygeorge the only fraud in here is you & your boyfriends who claim to be "hellenes" lol.I invite everyone to see what a giant fool boygeorge is and to read our posts and to see how he backpeddled like a peachka because his arguements were glass and mine were the stones that shattered them.
@true moron, what did I back peddle on? you are just trying to rack up the posts to push mine to the next page so that they are not in plain view. Tell us again why Finlay and Gordon did not record ANY "ETHNIC MACEDONIAN" populations anywhere.
MoronBulgarian harps on Rigas the Vlach,yet he ignores PituGuli the Vlach, he ignores Delchevs statement "we are Bulgarians"he ignores Misirkov claiming that they were Bulgarians,he ignores the fact that the 1914 Carnegie Report makes no mention of "ethnic macedonians" he ignores the fact that Finlay,Gordon and a vast number of others make no mentionof "ethnic Macedonians",he ignores his own state sponsored academics who claim their nation diverged from Bulgarians.All he can do is talk Stadiums!
This is all smoke and mirror by the fascist True Bulgarian. He cant explain why Finlay, Gordon and numerous others recorded large Greek populations and distinguished them from all of the other ethnic groups in the region, he cant explain why Finlay and Gordon did not mention "ethnic Macedonians" anywhere, hence he has resorted to bringing up the names of soccer stadiums. What a moron.
Your soccer stadium is named after a gypsy.Why boygeorge?Your country's national costume is the Albanian fustanella.Why boygeorge?Your first president was an Albanian that spoke Albanian and could not speak one word of romaika.Why boygeorge?Kolokotronis was a major in General Churches Albanian regiment.Why boygeorge?Why not the "greek" regiment?
Folks, according to the true bulgarian nazi bastard, Greece has a stadium named after a lowly Gypsy, (he has an obvious disrespect for gypsies) we had a president that only spoke Albanian, hence all greeks were invented post Greek revolution even though we have a plethora of first hand accounts that described Greeks everywhere in the region while making no mention of "ethnic Macedonians". The racist uneducated nazi bastard thinks the only real Greek is one who submits a blood test. NAZI FUCKWIT.
And you fail to show me how Frost came across the info that Makedonski (not a "greek" sounding name to me)was a "greek".Show me where he got that source from?Go ahead.Show me something that Gordon did not even once state in his book about Makedonski being a "greek".Go on show us all Frosts source? I know you can't because Frost just made it up.There is no source that describes Makedonski as a "greek" prior to Frost.
@truebulgar, Gordon makes no mention of :"ethnic Macedonians" anywhere in his book. Frost wrote a few decades later during the 19th century. According to you, Frost, Gordon, Finlay, LEake and others are all liars. Ill let the sane readers decide who to believe.
FOLKS, truelyingbulgar's only proof of someone claiming to be an "ethnic Macedonian"during the period of the Greek revolution is a reference to a "Makedonski" in a footnote of THomas Gordon's book.Problem for the lying bulgar is that Frost tells us that Makedonski was a Russian of Greek descent coupled with the fact that GORDON, along with FINLAY,make no mention of any "ethic Macedonian" population in their extensive and detailed first hand accounts of the populations in the region.What a joker!
Georgeygirl can you please tell me how it is that your first president,according to Finlay,was an Albanian who spoke only Albanian and did not know one word in "greek"?Or why it is that the Albanian fustanella is your country's national costume?Or why your revolutionary heroes were all Albanians,Vlachs,and Slavs?
Georgeygirl can you please tell me how it is that your first president,according to Finlay,was an Albanian who spoke only Albanian and did not know one word in "greek"?Or why it is that the Albanian fustanella is your country's national costume?Or why your revolutionary heroes were all Albanians,Vlachs,and Slavs?
@truelyingmoron, all of our revolutionary heroes were not Albanian, Vlachs and Slavs. Finlay and Gordon your own recommended sources, tell us this. Liar. On the other hand what do you think of Delchev and Gruev self describing as BULGARIANS. Oh yah, we should ignore that tiny fact. LOLOLOLOL. You cannot explain away Finlay and Gordon. You are a liar!
No one ignored anything gjoko.Macedonian revolutionaries did indeed call themselves Bulgarians at times.According to Mazower that is because of religious affiliation.You are trying to deflect my questions to you away because you cannot answer them.I will ask again and again and again until you have the balls to answer them.
Georgeygirl can you please tell me how it is that your first president,according to Finlay,was an Albanian who spoke only Albanian and did not know one word in "greek"?Or why it is that the Albanian fustanella is your country's national costume?Or why your revolutionary heroes were all Albanians,Vlachs,and Slavs?
@moronfromcrapnews, all of our revolutionary heroes were not Albanian Vlachs and Slavs you clown. Your own sources Finlay and Gordon tell you this. If we are albanians because the first president allegedly spoke albanian what should we say about you half wits who practically all of your national heroes recorded on PAPER that they were BULGARIANS. Delchev, Sandanski, Gruev etc etc etc. You claim no Greeks existed yet Finlay and Gordon who were there tell us that GREEKS were everywhere. LIAR!
Koundoriotis did not "allegedly speak Albanian". HE DID SPEAK ALBANIAN AND DID NOT SPEAK ONE WORD OF ROMAIKA!!!!AND THAT IS ACCORDING TO FINLAY.WHO'S LYING NOW RAG HEAD.Since you love Finlay so much then explain to everyone why Kariskakai's futbol stadium is named after a gypsy?LOL Because Finlay describes Karaiskaikis as a gypsy in his book lol.
@Bulgar, you are losing your cool throwing out racist terms like "Rag head" and by using the term "gypsy" in a derrogatory manner. What else should we expect from racists who talk about genetic testing and who think that they are the "Macedonoid" masters of the white race. Pathetic moron. If you are using "Koudoriotis" language as proof that I am albanian what should we say about you when your national heroes self described as BULGARIAN? FInlay describes hundreds of thousands of Greeks. LIAR!
True"macedonian" I am being serious here. I am genuinely suprised how stupid you are when you dont have the ability of flooding the board with your google book search scans and you cannot delete things which don't suit your agenda. Man, I almost feel sorry for you. LOL! You want a census and blood tests yet all you have to present as proof of total regional dominance is a footnote reference to someone called "makedonski". Man, you are pulling my leg right, you cant be that dumb!
boygeorge I recommend you seek counseling for how utterly retarded you become by the minute.I've proven you wrong so much that I almost feel bad for making fun of you now.You have yet to answer my questions regarding your Albanian past.Pathetic imbecile.
@bulgar, fact is you cannot explain away Finlay, gordon and tonnes of others. All differentated Greeks from every population group in the region during a period which you halfwits claim no Greeks existed. None describe "ethnic Macedonians" as forming any population group in the region. All you can do is fart on about Albanians even though practically all of your national heroes WROTE on paper that they were Bulgarians. What a half wit!
LOL you are a test tube experiment gone wrong.The philhellenes invented you.Gordon and Finlay were admitted philhellenes.You're just too brainwashed and slow to see what i have stated a million times already.Or are you trying to manipulate people into buying the idea that a "greek" ethnic consciousness was widespread amongst the people?If so then you are lying throw your 6 remaining teeth in your fat head lol.
@bulgar, you are now implying that Gordon and Finlay lied in their extensive first hand accounts that spanned hundreds of pages. Nice. Ill let the general reader decide who to believe, Finlay and Gordon supported by a vast mountain of other texts, or you whose only proof of someone claiming to be an "ethnic macedonian" is a reference to someone named "Makedonski" in Gordon's footnotes! BHAHAHAAHHAAH.You want a census and blood tests as proof yet all you have to provide is your opinion. JOKER!
Again Gordon had met Makedonski.They obviously must have conversed.Gordon describes him as a Russian of Macedonian origin.Not of 'greek' origin.Why would he do that georgakimu?And you mean to tell me that you'll believe that Gordon can tell who a "vlach" is and who a "albanian" is from sitting on his horse?LOL you are truly a rag head.
@bulgar, Macedonian origin means exactly the same as Canadian origin or Australian origin, FOOL! He was from Macedonia, thats it. You claimed that "Makedonski" claimed he was "ethnic MACEDONIAN" you are lying. Frost, who wrote decades later, tells us that Makedonski was Greek. Why would an "ethnic Macedonian" fight on the side of the Greeks you fool! Oh wait, he was a traitor like half of your nation is right?
And you fail to show me how Frost came across the info that Makedonski (not a "greek" sounding name to me)was a "greek".Show me where he got that source from?Go ahead.Show me something that Gordon did not even once state in his book about Makedonski being a "greek".Go on show us all Frosts source? I know you can't because Frost just made it up.There is no source that describes Makedonski as a "greek" prior to Frost.
@lyingbulgarian, you are claiming that Frost is lying. Prove it. You are claiming that Finlay and Gordon lied in most of their accounts when they described Greeks practically everywhere and distinguished them from Vlachs Arvanties and Slavs. Prove it. You are claiming that "Makedonski" claimed to be an "ethnic Macedonian"..prove it. Youve got nothing, other than your "Macedenoid" masters of the white race racist buillshit. Gordon makes no mention of "macedonians" anywhere. LIAR!
@truecrapnewsbulgar, if Gordon was so aware of "ethnic Macedonians" around him why does he make absolutely no mention of any 'ethnic macedonians"when he described IN GREAT DETAIL all of the different population groups in EUROPEAN TURKEY. He managed to record the Greeks as distinct from everyone else though, this contradicts what you liars claim. LOLOLOL!
Georgeygirl can you please tell me how it is that your first president,according to Finlay,was an Albanian who spoke only Albanian and did not know one word in "greek"?Or why it is that the Albanian fustanella is your country's national costume?Or why your revolutionary heroes were all Albanians,Vlachs,and Slavs?
Folks the likes of True Bulgar like to claim that the First president of Greece could only speak Albanian as this is proof that no Greeks existed at the time. Meanwhile he ignores the accounts of the likes of Finlay and GOrdon who describe very large Greek populations as distinct from Vlachs, Slavs and Albanians and he completely ignores the fact that many of his primary national heroes are on record claiming to be Bulgarian. Nice double standard! These liars cannot be trusted.
Georgeygirl can you please tell me how it is that your first president,according to Finlay,was an Albanian who spoke only Albanian and did not know one word in "greek"?Or why it is that the Albanian fustanella is your country's national costume?Or why your revolutionary heroes were all Albanians,Vlachs,and Slavs?
Georgeygirl can you please tell me how it is that your first president,according to Finlay,was an Albanian who spoke only Albanian and did not know one word in "greek"?Or why it is that the Albanian fustanella is your country's national costume?Or why your revolutionary heroes were all Albanians,Vlachs,and Slavs?
Georgeygirl can you please tell me how it is that your first president,according to Finlay,was an Albanian who spoke only Albanian and did not know one word in "greek"?Or why it is that the Albanian fustanella is your country's national costume?Or why your revolutionary heroes were all Albanians,Vlachs,and Slavs?
Georgeygirl can you please tell me how it is that your first president,according to Finlay,was an Albanian who spoke only Albanian and did not know one word in "greek"?Or why it is that the Albanian fustanella is your country's national costume?Or why your revolutionary heroes were all Albanians,Vlachs,and Slavs?
@bulgar,even if the first president could only speak Albanian what does it have to do with the fact that Finlay described Greeks as dominating the population of peninsular Greece during a period in which you liars claim that NO Greeks existed.He was there, you were not. Lets compare that with your people who were universally regarded as Bulgarian, even by Finlay and Gordon, up until recently. The Fustanella is not only Albanian fool. Delchev said that he was a Bulgar, yet you harp on Albanians.
FOLKS notice that TrueBulgar cannot explain why guys like Finlay, Gordon and Leake described large Greek populations during a period in which the halfwits TrueBulgar and Stefov claim none existed. These first hand accounts differentiate Greeks from all of the other groups in the Ottoman empire and none mention any "ethnic Macedonians". SHAMELESS LIARS!
Georgeygirl I guess you are in the business of being blind.I answered you 3 times on why Finlay&Gordon saw these supposed "greeks".I will leave it up to the public to read these useless posts of yours and my responses to them to decide who is lying and who is telling the truth.
@crapnewsbulgar, you did not answer anything with regards to why Finlay and Gordon, two first hand witnesses, described large Greek populations and differentiated them from Vlachs, Arvanites, Albanians and Slavs during a period in which you LIARS claim no Greeks existed. Furthermore you cannot explain how or why Finlay and Gordon (not to mention a vast number of others) made absolutely no mention of "ethnic macedonians' as composing any population component in the region. All you can do is LIE!!
Yes I did answer you boygeorge.I said where did they get their genetics test results from?What laboratory did they commision to finance who was a bulgar,who was a "greek",and who was a vlach?What procedures did they take to make a 100% accurate description of what they claim they saw?In otherwords how can one man define what 600,000 people are?By guessing?Playing God maybe?Did he ask all of these people what they were?I am sure he did not.
@truebulgar, you are an idiot. You present a reference to the footnote of Gordon's book where he mentions a "Makedonski" as evidence of your nations dominance in the region for centuries yet you want us to discount a vast number of first hand accounts from the early 19th century that describe large Greek populations as seprate from Vlachs, Arvanites and Slavs, because a GENETICS test was not carried out.You are a racist and a moron. Who should we trust?Authors that were there or you peasants?
I trust Gordon as far as his close contact to people.Not when he's sitting on his horse and pointing at a village and calling the people "greeks" when they were most likely Albanians or Vlachs or Slavs.
@truemoron, if no Greeks existed why would Gordon distinguish between Greeks, Albanians Vlachs or Slavs. He was certainly capable of telling the difference and you are only speculating and lying. He made no mention of "ethnic Macedonians" just like countless others made no mention of "ethnic Macedonians" at the time.
@bulgar stop speculating and lying. You are sure of nothing. Dozens of other first hand accounts from the period describe Greeks and differentiate them from Vlachs, Albanians and Vlachs. None mention anything about "ethnic Macedonians" forming any population component.
boygeorge show everyone how reliable these 19th century writers were.Tell us his census procedure on how they recorded 600,000 people and what ethnicity they were?Show us boygeorge.Stop accusing and show us how reliable these geneticists were in the 19th century.
@bulgarboy, you are not smart enough to get it. YOU CLOWNS CLAIM THAT NO GREEKS EXISTED AT THE TIME OF FINLAY AND GORDON YET FINLAY AND GORDON DESCRIBE GREEKS EVERYWHERE. Just because they did not have a ticker counter and genetics blood tests does not mean that they could not differentiate between Vlachs Albanians and Greeks. Best of all none mentioned any "ethnic Macedonians". YOu want a census from me and proof of bloodtests yet all you think you have to do is mention "Makedonski" LOL!!
You are an utter idiot girlgeorge.You asked me who self-described as a Macedonian during the 'greek' war for independence & I provided you with ample proof.You keep telling me that Gordon describes hundreds of thousands of "greeks" yet I doubt his genetic research yielded 100% accuracy like you would like to believe.
@trumoron, who self described as "ethnic Macedonian"? You didnt provide any proof of anyone CLAIMING to be anything during the priod of the Greek revolution.
TrueBulgarian why did George Finlay, who was present in the area during the early 1800s, record large Greek populations along with Vlachs, Slavs and Albanians if no Greeks existed at the time. Furthermore, dear bulgar, why didnt Finlay mention any "ethnic Macedonians" as forming any population in European Turkey or the Ottoman Empire. Why didn't Thomas Gordon mention any "ethnic Macedonians" even though he was there.he did record Greeks though decades before you morons claim they were invented.
LOL You must have two eyebrows at this time and not one from plucking at yourself like a nervous chicken lol.Again show me where these peoples genetics tests are?And while your at it show me where there was a large concentration of ethnic "greeks" who referred to themselves as "hellenes' and not as "romaoi".
@true bulgarian only fascists speak of genetics tests you uneducated racist. Im not surprised that you would bring up genetics himmlerovski.There were plenty of Greek scholars who described themselves as Hellenes..Plethon, Chalcondyles etc etc.....now tell us who is on RECORD as describing themselves as an ethnic "Macedonian" during the early 1800s, prior to the Greek revolution. NOBODY. Danforth, Brown, Mazower and BORZA tell us this. These are the authors you brainwashed twits cite the most.
LOL Boygeorge your racism has far exceeded your limit to think.And if you do think for one second and look at your posts as compared to mine I already answered your questions.Now that you mention Plethon & Chakakhan (wow 2 people)show me where thousands of people called themselves "Hellenes" before 1833?I know you will never ever find anything like this because no such document exists(unless we go back to the classical era which you have nothing to do with lol).
@truemoron,yo uwant me to provide you with proof of thousands of people calling themselves hellenes yet your only proof of someone calling themselves an"ethnic Macedonian" at the time is an obscure reference to a "Makedonski"LOL!! Educated people were the first to espouse national/ethnic identities, i provided you examples of two. Where are your "ethnic Macedonian" scholars prior to the 19th century? WHERE.PUT UP OR SHUTUP!!
Boygeorge is this a game to you?You people suffer from an inferiority complex lol.Giorgio Giulio Clovio "il Macedone" was named as such because of his Macedonian origins.The synod records of the Ohrid archbishopric at the beginning of the thirteenth century contain the words, "Ivan Ierakar by birth Macedonian".Do your research boygeorgey instead of watching gay porn on the computer lol.You'll find these sources.
@truebulgar, you call that proof?All you have is speculation and some guys using a regional descriptor. Bulgars, Greeks, Vlachs and everyone else in the region used the regional descriptor "Macedonian".the 19th century writer Frederick Moore tells us this. Mazower, your recommended author tells us this. YOU HAVE NOTHING. provide us with a list of modern scholars who describe your ethnicity as being centuries old and the dominant population in the region.
@truebulgar, you asked me to provide you with people claiming to be Greeks. I provided you with Chalcondyles and Plethon. Where are your pre 19th century "ethnic Macedonian" shcolars describing your homeland and ethnicity/nation? YOu have nothing! Your own sources, Borza, Mazower and Brown tell us that your ethnicity is the newest one in the Balkans. You are serbianized bulgarians with an Aleksandar fantasy complex.
Hears your proof again georgeygirl.Boygeorge is this a game to you?You people suffer from an inferiority complex lol.Giorgio Giulio Clovio "il Macedone" was named as such because of his Macedonian origins.The synod records of the Ohrid archbishopric at the beginning of the thirteenth century contain the words, "Ivan Ierakar by birth Macedonian".Do your research boygeorgey instead of watching gay porn on the computer lol.You'll find these sources.
@trueBulgar, "Macedonian" was used in a Geographic sense nothing more nothing less. You have no proof of any modern scholars describing your nation/ethnicity as one that existed for centuries. You have no proof of anyone claiming to be an "ethnic Macedonian" and you cannot explain why Finlay and Gordon would make no mention of any ethnic "Macedonians".
For 600+ years the Ottoman Turks controlled Dardania/Paeonia, but somehow they "forgot" to even mention anything about a "Makedonski millet". Only Hellenes, Serbs, Bulgarians, Albanians, Vlachs, and Roma are mentioned, but never once did the Ottomans ever talk about "Makedonskis".
Actually no Ottoman source ever mentions any "hellenes" living in their territory in the Balkans.Show me one ounce of proof that they did.And show me where your mixed mongrel people called themselves hellenes.And provide proof that they had an ancient hellene self-conciousness at that. Imposter hellene I am positive you have never picked up a book in your entire teenage life.Go to a library little girl and open your eyes.
the abusrdity of a Slavic decedent race of Bulgarians trying to portray themselves as anything remotely close to what true Macedonian was or ever could be is laughable. The entire Slavic FYROMian hisotry is a joke. Delchev was a proud Bulgarian, the attempt at using the star of Vergina which is a reprentation of all the greek gods/elements of the earth, etc etc is PATHETIC. Why not be proud of your Bugian roots! No way to a Geographic title... They should be call Gypsiania. READ A BOOK !
Since when do Slavs of Dardania/Paeonia who speak a Slavic language almost identical to Bulgarian and whose country was never part of Macedonia except for the southern tip of Monastiri have anything to do with the Macedonians who were Hellenes, worshipped the Gods of Olympus, spoke Hellenic, participated in the Olympic Games. This is akin to saying that the Egyptians wish to be called Macedonians.
We shouldn't forget history like the man said. Because if we do then we'll forget the fact that modern "greece" was a country created by western powers, who in turn made Albanians,Vlachs,and Slavs into "hellenes" lol. Yes let's not forget history please.
You are a genius!! So, all the Albanians, Vlachs, and Slavs were taught to speak Greek by the western powers, they were taught the customs and traditions of the non-existent Greeks, and eventually they were assimilated by the non-existent Greeks!! You are trueMoron!!
So you think I am not a Greek, but an Albanian or a Slav who was made a Hellene? Let me tell you that it is fantastic being a Hellene...
So let me tell you that you too, as an Albanian or Slav, you should also become a Hellene! And once you are a true Hellene you can even become a Macedonian or an Athenian... It's the only way to go!
I wonder which Western Powers created the Greeks of Southern Italy, Sicily, Southern Albania, Odessa, Southern Crimea, Pontus, Syria, Palestine, and Egypt.
You're right...let's not forget history barbarian.
Can you even provide proof of these people calling themselves "hellenes" or "greeks" hellenicoon?I don't think so.The ones in Albania have already been proven to be Vlachs & Albanians of the Orthodox faith that were hellenized.But where are the ethnic "greeks"?In Odessa?Like the Vlach and Slav philiki eteria founders?Or the Pontis who only have a 70 year history in Macedonia but claim a 4000 year 'greek' history in Macedonia lol.Please let's not forget your history lol.
Rigas was an ethnic Vlach. A Fat one at that lol. He could've called himself French for all I care.But he was not an ethnic "greek".He was an ethnic Vlach.
Let's see. Rigas considered himself to be a Greek, but you know better!! To you he was a Vlach. Could it be that he saw Vlachs as Greeks? Or is it that you detest him because he did not mention any Makedonskis? Don't fault him for that. Ethnic Makedonskis had had not been inventend yet. Neither did he have the pleasure of reading Maknews and all the village idiots (Makedonskis) that post on it.
LOL but the fact is Rigas was an ethnic Vlach.He may have felt "greek" but in the end he was a fat Vlach.His constitution is an eye opener as well.Anyone who is a christian,according to the fat Vlach Rigas, was a "greek".LOL yeah that's a great ethnic qualifier right there lol.
Both had a religious consciousness.Delchev under the Exarchists and the Vlach rigas said anyone who was a christian was a "greek". There's your difference.
@truemoron, Delchev was not write "We Bulgarians" because of religious affiliation. Read Danforth, the anthropologist who studied your nation, he tells you this. Practically all key figures in your so called "illinden uprising" wrote that they were bulgarians and were regarded as Bulgarians yet you harp about Rigas the Vlach. YOU MORON!
@moronovski, my ancestors, unlike yours, never sided with nazis or commies. You are the one talking about genetics tests and blood lineages. You are the one that is claiming that finlay, gordon, frost and practically every other first hand witness in the region during the early 1800s is a liar. GO back to wearing your aleksandrovski unerwear and dream about riding bukefalovski into Skopje, that great "ethnic Macedonian" city LOLOLOL
Considering that your own people today admit that the philhellenes created you I find you a complete useless joke lol.Nikos Dimou states the truth"We spoke Albanian and called ourselves Romans" lol.
@truebulgar, oh great, Nikos Dimou. Some parts of the population spoke Albanian. Yay. Go study italian history moron. Numerous tribes who spoke unintelligible vernaculars and felt no kinship were molded into one nation who now consider ancient rome as a national heritage. A large Greek population assimilated Vlachs, Arvanites and SLavs. So what? THat does not measure up to your standars of racial purity you racist bastard?
Your soccer stadium is named after a gypsy.Why boygeorge?Your country's national costume is the Albanian fustanella.Why boygeorge?Your first president was an Albanian that spoke Albanian and could not speak one word of romaika.Why boygeorge?Kolokotronis was a major in General Churches Albanian regiment.Why boygeorge?Why not the "greek" regiment?
@truenazibastard, wow you are getting smart and very scholastic using names of stadiums. Your national heroes are practically all on record calling themselves Bulgarians, FINLAY AND GORDON recorded vast Greek populations and made no mention of "ethnic Macedonians" yet you have wet dreams over albanians. YOU COWARDS, who allegedly formed the majority during the balkan wars, were A NO SHOW to fight for your so called homeland. What a joke.
@truenazi. Your own scholars of less than 20 years ago, tell us that your population diverged from BULGARIANS during the middle 1800s. These are your own state sponsored scholars that wrote this you fool. You always try to apply standards of ethnic authenticity to Greeks that your own NEW NATION cannot meet. You are a joke.
LOL but the truth is you cannot answer these questions.Nikos Dimou said the following of your people's recent past; "We spoke Albanian and called ourselves Romans". LOL
@truenazi, obviously you are too stupid to realize that Dimou wasnt talking about the whole Greek population, MORON. The fact that up till about 100 years ago your people were almost universally considered Bulgarian does not phase you though. Greeks assimilated Albanians, Vlachs and Slavs. A racist fuckwit nazi, like you, obviously has problems with tainted bloodlines. France, Italy, Germany and Spain are all artifical nations according to your fascist brain.
Your soccer stadium is named after a gypsy.Why boygeorge?Your country's national costume is the Albanian fustanella.Why boygeorge?Your first president was an Albanian that spoke Albanian and could not speak one word of romaika.Why boygeorge?Kolokotronis was a major in General Churches Albanian regiment.Why boygeorge?Why not the "greek" regiment?
@racisttruemoron, you have no answers so you have resorted to spamming. Great. At least my people were recorded by the likes of Leake, Finlay, Gordon and a vast number of others who made absolutely no mention of "ethnic Macedonians" in any of their accounts. At least my people showed up during the Balkan wars and were recorded by the Carnegie Commission who made no mention of "ethnic Macedonians" even in the early 1900s. Who is the boy george?
@princegeorge57 ,you have yet to answer any of my questions.Why are you afraid?Don't you have any balls?I've answered all of your questions.Here i'll ask you again.@truemacedonian
Your soccer stadium is named after a gypsy.Why boygeorge?Your country's national costume is the Albanian fustanella.Why boygeorge?Kolokotronis was a major in General Churches Albanian regiment.Why boygeorge?Why not the "greek" regiment?
@fascisttruepig, in your confined racist mind if a stadium is named after someone who does not have a pristine bloodline belonging to the dominant ethnicity the whole ethnos must be fake. Moron. The fustanella was worn by Greek populations centuries before the Albanians in regions where there were no Albanians. MORON. Now what should we say about your ethnicity that was not recorded by the likes of Finlay and Gordon, who had national heroes who self described as BULGARIAN?
@moronovski lying bulgar,Pitu Guli was a vlach re-baptised as an "ethnic Macedonian" by your historiography. Leave Rigas alone.One day you will grow up out of your racism,you know the "Macedonoid" masters of the white race drivel, and realize that self ascription and acceptance by others is key to an ethnic identity, not a blood test you tampon brain moron.You keep bringing up vlachs and albanians,you ignore hundreds of pages from Finlay and Gordon, and turn a blind eye to your Bulgarian heroes
You are a joke. You ask for proof of people calling themselves Hellenes but you have absolutely no proof of anyone claiming to be an "ethnic Macedonian" during the period of the Filiki Etheria. Double standard. But then what more can we expect from a group of people whose national heroes were practically all on record self describing as Bulgarians. Tonnes of accounts exist from the early 1800s differentiating Greeks from Vlachs, Slavs and Arvanites yet you jokers lie.
Actually boygeorge there's plenty of proof of Macedonians self-describing as Macedonians and outsiders describing them as Macedonians as well.But the truth is that the Filiki Eteria members used Albanian and Turkish passwords amongst their members.Why is that boygeorge?
Stop lying true bulgar boy. Who described themselves as an "ethnic Macedonian" during the period of the Greek revolution. Nobody. Danforth states hardly anybody even self identified as "Macedonian" during the early 1900's let alone during the early 1800s. Borza states that your so called ethnic identity is a new phenomenon. Filiki Eteria was an indigenous movement to free Greece and Greeks decades before you bafoons claim Greeks were invented. Read Finlay. Read Gordon dear fool
His name was Pavel Makedonski and he fought in the "greek" revolution.Filiki Etariea indigenous? HAHAHHA and that must explain the reason why Finlay is the man who describes the Albanian secret code words amongst the members of this secret society. I wonder if you even read Finlay.I recommend that you do.
@truemacedonian...what a moron. "Pavel Makedonski" is on record proclaiming that heis a "Macedonian". What a joke. Where is this record? LIAR. Makedonski was a Greek of russian descent. Gordon makes mention of him in his book and guess what, MORON, he makes no mention of any "ethnic Macedonians" when he described ALL of the populations in the Ottoman empire. Your people did not exist or else the likes of Gordon and Finlay would have mentioned them.
Excuse show me where Gordon states that Makedonski is a "greek"? I gurantee you that you are the one lying now. Come on prove me wrong right now and tell me what page that claim is on.
@truebulgar Gordon describes a Makedonski fighting on the side of the Greeks. You claimed that Makedonski is on record claiming that he is an "ethnic Macedonian" where is your proof? The 19th century writer frost described Makedonski as a Greek of Russian descent. Your only proof of someone claiming to be an "ethnic Macedonian" during the early 1800s is "Makedonski" LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! nice history you half wit. Gordon makes no mention of "ethnic Macedonians" anywhere half wit!
Makedonski's name is Makedonski.Gordon says he is a Russian of MACEDONIAN origin.Obviously Gordon asked him what he was.Show me where Frost,a man who was born way after the 'greek' war for independence,got his source that Makedonski was a "greek"?Go ahead I am sure he has a source right?Right?LOL of course he doesn't.And there's plenty of Macedonians who self-described as such in the 19th century.Tell me to pm you the proof and I will you mongolian.
@truemoron, if Gordon was aware of "ethnic Macedonians" and "ethnic Macedonian" populations why did he make no mention of "Macedonians" composing any part of the populations of the Ottoman empire in his detailed descriptions of the populations. "Macedonian" meant he was from the region,nothing more nothing less. YOU HAVE NO PROOF OF ANYONE CLAIMING TO BE AN "ETHNIC MACEDONIAN" during the time of Gordon and Finlay. NONE! Again, Gordon describes Greeks yet he makes no mention of your ilk. LIAR!
LOL Boygirgo your acting like a ignoramus now.Show me where there was a large population of self describing hellenes during the war for independece?Why were all of your freedom fighters Albanians?Why did the Albanian fustanella become the modern "greek" national costume of your modern country?Why were all the intelligentsia of your country ethnically Vlachs and Slavs?You have proven to be a complete and utter rag head.Not surprising at all considering what you really are lol.
@truebulgar, there were several committees who described themselves as Greek prior to Greek independence. You want afidavits from large Greek populations yet you cannot PROVIDE US WITH ONE INDIVIDUAL who claimed that they were an "ethnic Macedonian" during the period of the Greek revolution. Learn some history fool. If you are using the fact that Albanians fought on the Greek side what should we say about your national heroes who ALL claimed to be BULGARIAN. LYING UNEDUCATED FOOL!
Actually I will re-repost this info again for you.Boygeorge is this a game to you?You people suffer from an inferiority complex lol.Giorgio Giulio Clovio "il Macedone" was named as such because of his Macedonian origins.The synod records of the Ohrid archbishopric at the beginning of the thirteenth century contain the words, "Ivan Ierakar by birth Macedonian".Do your research boygeorgey instead of watching gay porn on the computer lol.You'll find these sources.
FOLKS, TrueBulgarian and his mentor Stefovski claim that Greeks were invented post Greek revolution. How do the halfwits TrueBulgar and Stefov explain why Finlay and Gordon who were both there during the early 19th century would record huge Greek populations and distinguish them from Vlachs, Arvanites and Slavs. Neither make any mention of "ethnic Macedonians" forming any population component yet the liars TrueBulgarian and Stefovski have the audacity to cite Finlay and Gordon as proof! LIARS!
I do have the audacity to cite them because they even destroy your lame myths.Like how Finlay describes Georgios Koundioriottis, the first president of modern"greece",as an Albanian who spoke only Albanian and could not speak one word of "greek".His Vice President had the same issue according to Finlay.And the Albanian secret passwords as well as how Gordon describes the Albanian revolutionaries is eye opening indeed.Yes I cite them to prove your myth wrong.And I have
@TRUEMORON, Albanians, Vlachs and Slavs fought on the side of the Greeks, So what? Finlay describes huge Greek populations and distinguishes them from the rest of the races. Since you are so keen on Albanian contributions to the Greek cause what should we say about your national heroes who were UNIVERSALLY regarded as Bulgarian. Brown tells us that the illinden uprising was remolded by the commies to make it into an "ethnic Macedonian" uprising. Halfwits like you fell for it.
Actually if you read Browns book in its entirity then you would see that you fell for Chris Philipukes dumb ploy on his blog lol.I recommend you do read it all from front to back georgeygirl.Brown calls your people Vlachs,Albanians and Slavs lol.
@moronfromcrapnews, I dont need anyone to tell me about Brown. Brown states that your people were once regarded as Bulgarian. Brown states that the "illinden" uprising was carried out by Vlachs and Bulgars and that the communists re-interpreted history to remold the uprising into an "ethnic Macedonian" uprising. Brown certainly does not think that Greeks were invented post Greek revolution like you illitereate peasants do. Man, this is too easy. Why dont you go back to crapnews and bring help.
Obviously you have never read Brown then lol.I recommend you do.He also describes why it is that the Macedonians did describe themselves as "bulgarians" and why the Vlachs described themselves as "greeks".
@bulgar, where does Brown state that your ethnicity has existed for centuries and dominated the demographics? Nowhere. Brown states that you people were once called Bulgarian. "Macedonian" had no ethnic or national meaning, at all, at the time. Where does Brown state that Greeks were invented post Greek revolution. LIAR.
He describes in detail how the commies manufactured history to dupe people like you into believing kruschevo was an "ethnic Macedonian" uprising! LOL!Come on, bring some help.
Georgeygirl you underplay Browns book to 3 choice pages when there's more than meets the eye in his book than Chris Philipuke posted on his worthless blog lol.Have you ever even read his book?
@bulgar, lets just ignore and cut out the pages from Brown that don't suit your agenda. LOL! Are you for real? Those three pages destroy all of your absurd theories. Yah, lets just discard them because they make you look like a fool!!!LOLOLOL
And then we should also discard from Browns book the fact that the term "Bulgarian" was a religious and social labor term.Same as "greek" was a social labor term and a religious term.Yes and while we're at it let's discard the fact that you have omitted an entire book because you never read it lol.You are dumber than a box of locks lol.
@Bulgar, this is irrelevant because BROWN basically tells us that "Macedonian" had no ethnic or national significance until relatively recently, until your people diverged from the Bulgars. This isn't rocket science. He also claims that the commies had a hand into molding your national identity to suit the notion of a continuous "ethnic Macedonian" existence.
@truemoron. Finlay desscribes Greek populations that numbered in the hundreds of thousands. He distinguished them from Albanians and Vlachs and he stated that Greeks formed the majority on the Greek peninsula and in the Pashalik of thessalonika. Why would he state this if Greeks were not invented yet, as you MORONS claim. Why would FInlay make no mention of any "MACEDONIAN" populations of your ilk you uneducated brainwashed liar?
laugh all, stupid poor bastard хахаха
brsjakpelaz 2 days ago
Оh !
he is so geographically disoriented,First seen as failing to recognize the Scandinavian countries and second, Scandinavia is not a region it is peninsula like Balkan peninsula.
brsjakpelaz 2 days ago
Evrybody are laughing at this guy what a joke
JIZOLGE 9 months ago
Η Ελλαδα ειναι ενα κρατος που αποτελειται απο Μακεδονες τουρκους ποντιους βλαχους βουλγαρους αλβανους-αρβανιτες αιγυπτιους πακιστανους και το μουνι της μανα σας!!Η Μακεδονια δεν ειναι ελληνικη!!!Macedonia for the Macedonians
provenzano18 1 year ago
Macedonia for the Macedonians, indeed. I am Macedonian, therefore Greek.
MAKEDANOS 1 year ago
@provenzano18 παρε τ αρχιδια μας μουνοπανο. σας εβαλε να μαθαινετε και ελληνικα ο παπαρας ο πρωθυπουργος σας? οταν την κανει νυχτα ο παπανδρεου και ανεβει καμια χουντα στην Ελλαδα παλι, τρεξτε να κρυφτειτε!
priapus26 1 year ago
F.Y.R.O.M. is BULGARIA...Nothing more...Nothing less....MACEDONIA WAS IS AND WILL ALWAYS BE GREEK....Grujo,your end is very close...You will be in history as the Sandam Husein of balkans...LET'S GIVE AN END IN THIS ISSUE..F.Y.R.O.Mians speak Bulgarian,wrote bulgarian,they have Bulgarian names,surnames FOR GOD they have nothing with Ancient Greek Macedonia.
nikoscrx1 1 year ago
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"The 20th century development of a "Macedonian" ethnicity, and its recent evolution into independent stathood following the collapse of the Yugoslav state in 1991, has followed a rocky road. In order to survive the vicissitudes of Balkan history and politics, the "Macedonians", WHO HAVE HAD NO HISTORY, NEED ONE" -Eugene Borza
Hellenicone 1 year ago
"The political and military leaders of the Slavs of Macedonia at the turn of the century seem not to have heard Misirkov's call for a separate Macedonian national identity; they continued to identify themselves in a national sense as Bulgarians rather than Macedonians" - L. Danforth The Macedonian conflict.
isnt it funny how truebulgar brings up a stadium name while turning a blind eye to the Bulgarian character of his key national figures!
princegeorge57 2 years ago
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TruMoron has no retort for the words of the scholar his nationalist compatriots cite the most
"The !_20th century development of a Macedonian ethnicity_!, and its recent evolution into independent stathood following the collapse of the Yugoslav state in 1991, has followed a rocky road. In order to survive the vicissitudes of Balkan history and politics, the Macedonians, WHO HAVE HAD NO HISTORY, NEED ONE" -Eugene Borza
princegeorge57 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
True OAF: read again and enjoy the words from one the FYROMian diaspora's most cited scholars:
"The 20th century development of a Macedonian ethnicity, and its recent evolution into independent stathood following the collapse of the Yugoslav state in 1991, has followed a rocky road. In order to survive the vicissitudes of Balkan history and politics, the Macedonians, WHO HAVE HAD NO HISTORY, NEED ONE" -Eugene Borza
princegeorge57 2 years ago
TrueBulgar, I suggest you stay within the confines of BulgarNews where censorship and the mods keep you safe in your bubble. Out in the real world, your dreams are nothing more than delusional fantasies of the retarded.
Hellenicone 2 years ago
@Hellenicone
Helleniphoney it seems that your only contribution to helping out boygeorge here is by making him look smarter than you.And that puts you in the vicinity of legally retarded if he is smarter than you lol
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@truemoron, Connect the dots, Finlay, Gordon, Danforth, Brown, Borza and even hammond indicate that your identity is the newest one in the balkans. Your identity did not exist until recently, Go back and read the BORZA quote. These are your recommended sources retard.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57 Actually boygeorge you try and manipulate a text by saying "he may say this but he says that too" which is cool by me.Since you believe you know so much then you may know that not every book& author will prescribe to your general idea.If that would be the case then we could cut the fat and just read one author & one book instead of 10 of each.The fact is that Mazower,Herzfeld,Trudgill,Brown,& Faubion have called you people "newly invented"by philhellenes is most amusing to me lol
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@moron, Herzfeld argues that Greek history was molded by philhellenes to emphasize Greece's ancient past, he does not claim that the Greek ethnicity was invented like you retards do. Herzfeld, if you ask him, will describe a Greek cultural continuity that has lasted centuries. Since you are so keen on naming authors, MORON, why don't you tell us which one of those that you list claim that your "ethnicity" is one of the oldest in the Balkans, as you nutjobs claim.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
Slavs of Dardania, your lies are coming to an end.
Hellenicone 2 years ago
@Hellenicone
Yet you cannot answer any of my questions.Your paparigopolous BS has made you people inferior.You can't put up so shut up.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
"During medieval and modem times, Macedonia was known as a Balkan region inhabited by ethnic Greeks, Albanians, Vlachs, Serbs, Bulgarians, Jews, and Turks. " - Eugene Borza
Yet another modern scholar, one that is cited to no end on your propaganda sites, that makes no mention of "ethnic Macedonians" making up any part of the population in Macedonia's history. This also destroys your propaganda that ethnic Greeks were invented. This is one of your diaspora's favorite scholars, TrueIDIOT!
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
I am happy you quote Borza but why not quote your beloved Hammond as well when he states "The Greek War for independence was ultimately won by the Albanians" LOLLOLOL
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@trueMORON, Hammond states that your nationality is a modern concept and he certainly does not suggest that the Greek ethnicity was invented during the early 1800s like you retards do. I have absolutely no problem with the fact that Vlachs and Arvanites helped with the Greek cause. You on the other hand are deluded enough to believe that your national heroes of the turn of last century espouse the same fraudelent version of "Macedonism" that you do. What a joke you are.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57 And I am sure you have no problem in me telling everyone that Finlay states that Karaiskakis was a Gypsy and that one of your biggest futbol stadiums is named after a Gypsy. I mean it is fitting considering the people that inhabit your country lol.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
Comment removed
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@trueoaf, Finlay described populations of hundreds of thousands of Greeks. He distinguished Greeks from Albanians and Vlachs during a period in which you morons claim no Greeks existed. Finlay makes no mention of any "ethnic Macedonians". "Ethnic Macedonians" did not exist at the time. Even Borza states. this. You have no arguments other than talking about stadium names and talking about Arvanite contributions to the early Greek state, as if these are arguments. You R a joke.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
TrueBulgar,
Your arguments are pathetic and weak. You have no foundation to stand on Slav. We all know if this was BulgarNews I would be banned, but your lies and theft of Hellenic culture will be exposed for what they are. Identity theft is a crime Slav.
Hellenicone 2 years ago
@Hellenicone
I would love to see you prove 4000 years of "greek" history in Macedonia.The newcomers to the region from asia were Christian Turks who spoke Turkish & not 'greek'.They were even culturally Turkish (Mazower,Salonica City of Ghosts).The newly arrived Pontic's were another set of refugees that didn't even know what a 'greek' was (Neal Ascherson,Black Sea).Identity theft is a crime Hellenephoney.Repent your crimes to God & swear to call yourself a Ponti & you'll be in his good graces
truemacedonian 2 years ago
TrueIdiot: Ascherson states that Greek populations and culture dominated many areas of the Black Sea region and that those who did not have a national consciousness can retrospectively classified as Greeks. Also, stop lying: refugees that were non Greek speakers were in the minority. Stop citing Mazower, bonehead, he claims that hardly anybody affiliated with your "Ethnic identity" even during the early 20th century.He also makes no mention of "ethnic Macedonians" in Salonica's history. LIAR!
princegeorge57 2 years ago
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"The Communist regime of Tito had created the Republic of Macedonia with a view to annexing northern Greece";
T. Niles,
American ambassador to Athens.
(Hearing before the Subcommittee on Europe and the Middle East, June 23, 1992, Washington: US Government Printing Office, p. 14).
Hellenicone 2 years ago
The Slavs of Dardania/Paeonia who speak Bulgarian always are desperate to find excuses as to why no Turk ever mentions anything about "Makedonski millet" in the 600+ years that they were being ruled.
Hellenicone 2 years ago
@Hellenicone
No Turk ever mentions any "hellenes" either.You have yet to provide proof of their existence in the Ottoman empire prior to 1821.Go ahead Hellenphoney.Put up or shut up once and for all.Your repeat and post tactics are so obvious because your lack of arguement has no legs to stand on and no arms to flap in water to keep you from drowning.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
"...the Macedonians are a NEWLY emergent people in search of a past to help legitimize their precarious present as they attempt to establish their singular identity in a Slavic world dominated historically by Serbs and Bulgarians. "- Eugene Borza
Are you starting to connect the dots yet trueBulgar? Finlay and Gordon did not record any "ethnic Macedonians" because they did not exist during the early 19th century.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
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@princegeorge57
Your soccer stadium is named after a gypsy.Why boygeorge?Your country's national costume is the Albanian fustanella.Why boygeorge?Your first president was an Albanian that spoke Albanian and could not speak one word of romaika.Why boygeorge?Kolokotronis was a major in General Churches Albanian regiment.Why boygeorge?Why not the "greek" regiment?
truemacedonian 2 years ago
"Finally, Krste Misirkov, who had clearly developed a strong sense of his won personal national identity as a Macedonian and who outspokenly and unambiguously called for Macedonian inguistic and national separtism, ACKNOWLEDGED THAT A MACEDONIAN NATIONAL IDENTITY WAS A RELATIVELY RECENT HISTORICAL DEVELOPMENT." - Loring Danforth
LOL! Danforth, who hobnobs with many of your activists, tells you that your identity is a new one. Yet all you can do is harp about soccer stadium names in Greece!
princegeorge57 2 years ago
"The 20th century development of a Macedonian ethnicity, and its recent evolution into independent stathood following the collapse of the Yugoslav state in 1991, has followed a rocky road. In order to survive the vicissitudes of Balkan history and politics, the Macedonians, WHO HAVE HAD NO HISTORY, NEED ONE" -Eugene Borza
LOL! Borza is cited by every one of you nut cases on all of your propaganda websites as a credible source!!!
princegeorge57 2 years ago
In a 1944 U.S State Department Airgram, the U.S considered, talk of Macedonian nation, Macedonian Fatherland, or Macedonia national consciousness to be unjustified demagoguery representing no ethnic nor political reality, and sees in its present revival a possible cloak for aggressive intentions against Greece
US Department, CircularAirgram(868.014/26 Dec. 1944)
Hellenicone 2 years ago
@Hellenicone
1907 Russian M.Petriev a Russian Consular official & keen balkan observer accompanied Hilmi Pasha to Macedonia.He reported to his Ministry of Foreign Affairs that in Kostur(Kastoria to you imposter hellenes)the people insisted that they were Macedonians and not "greeks" or "bulgarians"& that they were fed up with the oppression of various propagandas & that in them is beginning to awake a national consciousness different from those being imposed on them from the outside.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@truemoron,go figure a Russian, who was trying to push the serbian idea that the Slavs of Macedonia were not Bulgars wrote up some bullshit.Kastoria was never an "ethnic Macedonian" town you twit, even Brailsford,a staunch pro Bulgar sympathizer said that the town was not slavic.Since you are so keen on proving"ethnic Macedonians"existed in towns, how about the two biggest towns in the area Skopje and Salonica?What proof do you have of large "Macedonian" 19th century populations in those towns?
princegeorge57 2 years ago
The lies of the Slavs of Dardania are coming to an end. Over 350 World renowned academics, historians, classicists, and linguists have rejected the false claims of the Slavs of Dardania and have clearly stated. The Macedonians were a Hellenic people with Hellenic names and have no association with the clearly Slavic language, culture, and names of the residents of Dardania/Paeonia.
Hellenicone 2 years ago
The Slav Bulgars of Dardania/Paeonia cannot escape reality. Here is reality:
1906 census of Ottoman Macedonia by Hilmit Pasha reports:
Mulsims 423,000
Greeks 259,000
Bulgarians 178,000
Serbs 13,150
Jews 73,000
Where are "Makedonskis"? For 600+ years no Turk ever recorded any "Makedonskis". A fake "nation" of usurpers of Hellenic history, culture, and heroes.
Hellenicone 2 years ago
@Hellenicone
LOL Helleniphoney you just provided us with a census of religious affiliations.Every modern scholar today will tell you that Ottoman census' were based on religion and not race.LOL you ArvanitoSlavoVlachs are too funny and are such rag heads LOL.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@truemidget, what early 19th century census or survey of the region mentions "ethnic Macedonians". Finlay and Gordon and Leake and a myriad of others did not record any of your ilk and they were there. Even teh 1914 Carnegie Commission failed to mention the alleged majority. What a joke you are and your neaveaux "Macedonism" is.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
For 600+ years the Ottomans controlled Paeonia/Dardania and they never once recorded or made any mention of a "Makedonski millet". Only Hellenes (Rum), Serbs, Bulgarians, Albanians, Jews, Vlachs, Roma etc.
The Slavs of Dardania/Paeonia are unable to prove or show that they existed. Clearly their "national heroes" described themselves as Bulgarians. Their language is almost identical to Bulgarian save some Serbian loan words. Their "alphabet" was codified in 1945!
Hellenicone 2 years ago
@Hellenicone
Helleniphoney can you please provide me and everyone here a solid source that the Ottomans described any type of "hellenes" before 1821?I can assure you that the Ottomans when they first heard the word 'hellenes' that they were confused as to who these people were.But since you are making these absurd claims I think it's time to put up or shut up.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
f..k u greece, i m Macedonian, whit Macedonian language, so u don t have noting whit Macedonians. is been 7000 ears and wile be to the end of the world. nobody can destroy as,everybody how is born to this land is Macedonian.when baby is born the mother rise up the baby to the son,symbol of Macedonians,and baby know thet hi is Macedonian from the beginning. u cant change the history....
kalakurnik 2 years ago
Thanks for falling for my trap boygeorge.LOL I'll tell you tomorrow what that trap was.And I'll remind you again why you are a rag head and why I end up wiping my ass with you every time.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@truemoron.The only trap here is between your ears in your empty racist head.You should go back to your mentor Stefovski and tell him not to use Finlay,Gordon,Leake,Brown,Mazower, Borza and Danforth as references.They make you and your lot look stupid when you claim total demographic dominance since the contemporary writers did not mention your ethnicity anwywhere and the modern scholars claim that your identity is the newest one in the Balkans.One that hardly anyone affiliated with 100 yrs ago.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
You have fallen for my trap boygeorge.Not only have I made you take a 180 degree turn from your original thesis that you are hellenes for 4000 years now you change your defense to something completely different you fraud.I recommend everyone to go back & see how you back peddled yourself around like a rag head & how your posts don't make the slightest sense.Thanks for making it loud and clear how dumb you are boygeorge lol.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@trueracistbulgar you are the fraud. You and the crapnews morons claim Greeks were invented post Greek revolution. Finlay and Gordon clearly describe Greeks all over the place during the early 19th century. Hence you were proven to be A LIAR. Neither Gordon or Finlay made any mention of ANY "Ethnic Macedonians" because "ethnic Macedonians" did not exist at the time. You have nobody on record claiming to be an "ethnic Macedonian" during the period that Finlay wrote his accounts. LIAR.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
Boygeorge the only fraud in here is you & your boyfriends who claim to be "hellenes" lol.I invite everyone to see what a giant fool boygeorge is and to read our posts and to see how he backpeddled like a peachka because his arguements were glass and mine were the stones that shattered them.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@true moron, what did I back peddle on? you are just trying to rack up the posts to push mine to the next page so that they are not in plain view. Tell us again why Finlay and Gordon did not record ANY "ETHNIC MACEDONIAN" populations anywhere.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
MoronBulgarian harps on Rigas the Vlach,yet he ignores PituGuli the Vlach, he ignores Delchevs statement "we are Bulgarians"he ignores Misirkov claiming that they were Bulgarians,he ignores the fact that the 1914 Carnegie Report makes no mention of "ethnic macedonians" he ignores the fact that Finlay,Gordon and a vast number of others make no mentionof "ethnic Macedonians",he ignores his own state sponsored academics who claim their nation diverged from Bulgarians.All he can do is talk Stadiums!
princegeorge57 2 years ago
This is all smoke and mirror by the fascist True Bulgarian. He cant explain why Finlay, Gordon and numerous others recorded large Greek populations and distinguished them from all of the other ethnic groups in the region, he cant explain why Finlay and Gordon did not mention "ethnic Macedonians" anywhere, hence he has resorted to bringing up the names of soccer stadiums. What a moron.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
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@truemacedonian
Your soccer stadium is named after a gypsy.Why boygeorge?Your country's national costume is the Albanian fustanella.Why boygeorge?Your first president was an Albanian that spoke Albanian and could not speak one word of romaika.Why boygeorge?Kolokotronis was a major in General Churches Albanian regiment.Why boygeorge?Why not the "greek" regiment?
truemacedonian 2 years ago
Folks, according to the true bulgarian nazi bastard, Greece has a stadium named after a lowly Gypsy, (he has an obvious disrespect for gypsies) we had a president that only spoke Albanian, hence all greeks were invented post Greek revolution even though we have a plethora of first hand accounts that described Greeks everywhere in the region while making no mention of "ethnic Macedonians". The racist uneducated nazi bastard thinks the only real Greek is one who submits a blood test. NAZI FUCKWIT.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
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@princegeorge57
And you fail to show me how Frost came across the info that Makedonski (not a "greek" sounding name to me)was a "greek".Show me where he got that source from?Go ahead.Show me something that Gordon did not even once state in his book about Makedonski being a "greek".Go on show us all Frosts source? I know you can't because Frost just made it up.There is no source that describes Makedonski as a "greek" prior to Frost.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@truebulgar, Gordon makes no mention of :"ethnic Macedonians" anywhere in his book. Frost wrote a few decades later during the 19th century. According to you, Frost, Gordon, Finlay, LEake and others are all liars. Ill let the sane readers decide who to believe.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
FOLKS, truelyingbulgar's only proof of someone claiming to be an "ethnic Macedonian"during the period of the Greek revolution is a reference to a "Makedonski" in a footnote of THomas Gordon's book.Problem for the lying bulgar is that Frost tells us that Makedonski was a Russian of Greek descent coupled with the fact that GORDON, along with FINLAY,make no mention of any "ethic Macedonian" population in their extensive and detailed first hand accounts of the populations in the region.What a joker!
princegeorge57 2 years ago
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Georgeygirl can you please tell me how it is that your first president,according to Finlay,was an Albanian who spoke only Albanian and did not know one word in "greek"?Or why it is that the Albanian fustanella is your country's national costume?Or why your revolutionary heroes were all Albanians,Vlachs,and Slavs?
truemacedonian 2 years ago
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Georgeygirl can you please tell me how it is that your first president,according to Finlay,was an Albanian who spoke only Albanian and did not know one word in "greek"?Or why it is that the Albanian fustanella is your country's national costume?Or why your revolutionary heroes were all Albanians,Vlachs,and Slavs?
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@truelyingmoron, all of our revolutionary heroes were not Albanian, Vlachs and Slavs. Finlay and Gordon your own recommended sources, tell us this. Liar. On the other hand what do you think of Delchev and Gruev self describing as BULGARIANS. Oh yah, we should ignore that tiny fact. LOLOLOLOL. You cannot explain away Finlay and Gordon. You are a liar!
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
No one ignored anything gjoko.Macedonian revolutionaries did indeed call themselves Bulgarians at times.According to Mazower that is because of religious affiliation.You are trying to deflect my questions to you away because you cannot answer them.I will ask again and again and again until you have the balls to answer them.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
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Georgeygirl can you please tell me how it is that your first president,according to Finlay,was an Albanian who spoke only Albanian and did not know one word in "greek"?Or why it is that the Albanian fustanella is your country's national costume?Or why your revolutionary heroes were all Albanians,Vlachs,and Slavs?
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@moronfromcrapnews, all of our revolutionary heroes were not Albanian Vlachs and Slavs you clown. Your own sources Finlay and Gordon tell you this. If we are albanians because the first president allegedly spoke albanian what should we say about you half wits who practically all of your national heroes recorded on PAPER that they were BULGARIANS. Delchev, Sandanski, Gruev etc etc etc. You claim no Greeks existed yet Finlay and Gordon who were there tell us that GREEKS were everywhere. LIAR!
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
Koundoriotis did not "allegedly speak Albanian". HE DID SPEAK ALBANIAN AND DID NOT SPEAK ONE WORD OF ROMAIKA!!!!AND THAT IS ACCORDING TO FINLAY.WHO'S LYING NOW RAG HEAD.Since you love Finlay so much then explain to everyone why Kariskakai's futbol stadium is named after a gypsy?LOL Because Finlay describes Karaiskaikis as a gypsy in his book lol.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@Bulgar, you are losing your cool throwing out racist terms like "Rag head" and by using the term "gypsy" in a derrogatory manner. What else should we expect from racists who talk about genetic testing and who think that they are the "Macedonoid" masters of the white race. Pathetic moron. If you are using "Koudoriotis" language as proof that I am albanian what should we say about you when your national heroes self described as BULGARIAN? FInlay describes hundreds of thousands of Greeks. LIAR!
princegeorge57 2 years ago
True"macedonian" I am being serious here. I am genuinely suprised how stupid you are when you dont have the ability of flooding the board with your google book search scans and you cannot delete things which don't suit your agenda. Man, I almost feel sorry for you. LOL! You want a census and blood tests yet all you have to present as proof of total regional dominance is a footnote reference to someone called "makedonski". Man, you are pulling my leg right, you cant be that dumb!
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
boygeorge I recommend you seek counseling for how utterly retarded you become by the minute.I've proven you wrong so much that I almost feel bad for making fun of you now.You have yet to answer my questions regarding your Albanian past.Pathetic imbecile.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@bulgar, fact is you cannot explain away Finlay, gordon and tonnes of others. All differentated Greeks from every population group in the region during a period which you halfwits claim no Greeks existed. None describe "ethnic Macedonians" as forming any population group in the region. All you can do is fart on about Albanians even though practically all of your national heroes WROTE on paper that they were Bulgarians. What a half wit!
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
LOL you are a test tube experiment gone wrong.The philhellenes invented you.Gordon and Finlay were admitted philhellenes.You're just too brainwashed and slow to see what i have stated a million times already.Or are you trying to manipulate people into buying the idea that a "greek" ethnic consciousness was widespread amongst the people?If so then you are lying throw your 6 remaining teeth in your fat head lol.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@bulgar, you are now implying that Gordon and Finlay lied in their extensive first hand accounts that spanned hundreds of pages. Nice. Ill let the general reader decide who to believe, Finlay and Gordon supported by a vast mountain of other texts, or you whose only proof of someone claiming to be an "ethnic macedonian" is a reference to someone named "Makedonski" in Gordon's footnotes! BHAHAHAAHHAAH.You want a census and blood tests as proof yet all you have to provide is your opinion. JOKER!
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
Again Gordon had met Makedonski.They obviously must have conversed.Gordon describes him as a Russian of Macedonian origin.Not of 'greek' origin.Why would he do that georgakimu?And you mean to tell me that you'll believe that Gordon can tell who a "vlach" is and who a "albanian" is from sitting on his horse?LOL you are truly a rag head.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@bulgar, Macedonian origin means exactly the same as Canadian origin or Australian origin, FOOL! He was from Macedonia, thats it. You claimed that "Makedonski" claimed he was "ethnic MACEDONIAN" you are lying. Frost, who wrote decades later, tells us that Makedonski was Greek. Why would an "ethnic Macedonian" fight on the side of the Greeks you fool! Oh wait, he was a traitor like half of your nation is right?
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
And you fail to show me how Frost came across the info that Makedonski (not a "greek" sounding name to me)was a "greek".Show me where he got that source from?Go ahead.Show me something that Gordon did not even once state in his book about Makedonski being a "greek".Go on show us all Frosts source? I know you can't because Frost just made it up.There is no source that describes Makedonski as a "greek" prior to Frost.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@lyingbulgarian, you are claiming that Frost is lying. Prove it. You are claiming that Finlay and Gordon lied in most of their accounts when they described Greeks practically everywhere and distinguished them from Vlachs Arvanties and Slavs. Prove it. You are claiming that "Makedonski" claimed to be an "ethnic Macedonian"..prove it. Youve got nothing, other than your "Macedenoid" masters of the white race racist buillshit. Gordon makes no mention of "macedonians" anywhere. LIAR!
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@truecrapnewsbulgar, if Gordon was so aware of "ethnic Macedonians" around him why does he make absolutely no mention of any 'ethnic macedonians"when he described IN GREAT DETAIL all of the different population groups in EUROPEAN TURKEY. He managed to record the Greeks as distinct from everyone else though, this contradicts what you liars claim. LOLOLOL!
princegeorge57 2 years ago
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Georgeygirl can you please tell me how it is that your first president,according to Finlay,was an Albanian who spoke only Albanian and did not know one word in "greek"?Or why it is that the Albanian fustanella is your country's national costume?Or why your revolutionary heroes were all Albanians,Vlachs,and Slavs?
truemacedonian 2 years ago
Folks the likes of True Bulgar like to claim that the First president of Greece could only speak Albanian as this is proof that no Greeks existed at the time. Meanwhile he ignores the accounts of the likes of Finlay and GOrdon who describe very large Greek populations as distinct from Vlachs, Slavs and Albanians and he completely ignores the fact that many of his primary national heroes are on record claiming to be Bulgarian. Nice double standard! These liars cannot be trusted.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
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@princegeorge57
Georgeygirl can you please tell me how it is that your first president,according to Finlay,was an Albanian who spoke only Albanian and did not know one word in "greek"?Or why it is that the Albanian fustanella is your country's national costume?Or why your revolutionary heroes were all Albanians,Vlachs,and Slavs?
truemacedonian 2 years ago
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Georgeygirl can you please tell me how it is that your first president,according to Finlay,was an Albanian who spoke only Albanian and did not know one word in "greek"?Or why it is that the Albanian fustanella is your country's national costume?Or why your revolutionary heroes were all Albanians,Vlachs,and Slavs?
truemacedonian 2 years ago
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Georgeygirl can you please tell me how it is that your first president,according to Finlay,was an Albanian who spoke only Albanian and did not know one word in "greek"?Or why it is that the Albanian fustanella is your country's national costume?Or why your revolutionary heroes were all Albanians,Vlachs,and Slavs?
truemacedonian 2 years ago
Georgeygirl can you please tell me how it is that your first president,according to Finlay,was an Albanian who spoke only Albanian and did not know one word in "greek"?Or why it is that the Albanian fustanella is your country's national costume?Or why your revolutionary heroes were all Albanians,Vlachs,and Slavs?
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@bulgar,even if the first president could only speak Albanian what does it have to do with the fact that Finlay described Greeks as dominating the population of peninsular Greece during a period in which you liars claim that NO Greeks existed.He was there, you were not. Lets compare that with your people who were universally regarded as Bulgarian, even by Finlay and Gordon, up until recently. The Fustanella is not only Albanian fool. Delchev said that he was a Bulgar, yet you harp on Albanians.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
FOLKS notice that TrueBulgar cannot explain why guys like Finlay, Gordon and Leake described large Greek populations during a period in which the halfwits TrueBulgar and Stefov claim none existed. These first hand accounts differentiate Greeks from all of the other groups in the Ottoman empire and none mention any "ethnic Macedonians". SHAMELESS LIARS!
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
Georgeygirl I guess you are in the business of being blind.I answered you 3 times on why Finlay&Gordon saw these supposed "greeks".I will leave it up to the public to read these useless posts of yours and my responses to them to decide who is lying and who is telling the truth.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@crapnewsbulgar, you did not answer anything with regards to why Finlay and Gordon, two first hand witnesses, described large Greek populations and differentiated them from Vlachs, Arvanites, Albanians and Slavs during a period in which you LIARS claim no Greeks existed. Furthermore you cannot explain how or why Finlay and Gordon (not to mention a vast number of others) made absolutely no mention of "ethnic macedonians' as composing any population component in the region. All you can do is LIE!!
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
Yes I did answer you boygeorge.I said where did they get their genetics test results from?What laboratory did they commision to finance who was a bulgar,who was a "greek",and who was a vlach?What procedures did they take to make a 100% accurate description of what they claim they saw?In otherwords how can one man define what 600,000 people are?By guessing?Playing God maybe?Did he ask all of these people what they were?I am sure he did not.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@truebulgar, you are an idiot. You present a reference to the footnote of Gordon's book where he mentions a "Makedonski" as evidence of your nations dominance in the region for centuries yet you want us to discount a vast number of first hand accounts from the early 19th century that describe large Greek populations as seprate from Vlachs, Arvanites and Slavs, because a GENETICS test was not carried out.You are a racist and a moron. Who should we trust?Authors that were there or you peasants?
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
I trust Gordon as far as his close contact to people.Not when he's sitting on his horse and pointing at a village and calling the people "greeks" when they were most likely Albanians or Vlachs or Slavs.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@truemoron, if no Greeks existed why would Gordon distinguish between Greeks, Albanians Vlachs or Slavs. He was certainly capable of telling the difference and you are only speculating and lying. He made no mention of "ethnic Macedonians" just like countless others made no mention of "ethnic Macedonians" at the time.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
I am sure his philhellene attitude made him invent Hellenes from people who called themselves "christians"and "romans".
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@bulgar stop speculating and lying. You are sure of nothing. Dozens of other first hand accounts from the period describe Greeks and differentiate them from Vlachs, Albanians and Vlachs. None mention anything about "ethnic Macedonians" forming any population component.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
boygeorge show everyone how reliable these 19th century writers were.Tell us his census procedure on how they recorded 600,000 people and what ethnicity they were?Show us boygeorge.Stop accusing and show us how reliable these geneticists were in the 19th century.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@bulgarboy, you are not smart enough to get it. YOU CLOWNS CLAIM THAT NO GREEKS EXISTED AT THE TIME OF FINLAY AND GORDON YET FINLAY AND GORDON DESCRIBE GREEKS EVERYWHERE. Just because they did not have a ticker counter and genetics blood tests does not mean that they could not differentiate between Vlachs Albanians and Greeks. Best of all none mentioned any "ethnic Macedonians". YOu want a census from me and proof of bloodtests yet all you think you have to do is mention "Makedonski" LOL!!
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
You are an utter idiot girlgeorge.You asked me who self-described as a Macedonian during the 'greek' war for independence & I provided you with ample proof.You keep telling me that Gordon describes hundreds of thousands of "greeks" yet I doubt his genetic research yielded 100% accuracy like you would like to believe.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@trumoron, who self described as "ethnic Macedonian"? You didnt provide any proof of anyone CLAIMING to be anything during the priod of the Greek revolution.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
TrueBulgarian why did George Finlay, who was present in the area during the early 1800s, record large Greek populations along with Vlachs, Slavs and Albanians if no Greeks existed at the time. Furthermore, dear bulgar, why didnt Finlay mention any "ethnic Macedonians" as forming any population in European Turkey or the Ottoman Empire. Why didn't Thomas Gordon mention any "ethnic Macedonians" even though he was there.he did record Greeks though decades before you morons claim they were invented.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
LOL You must have two eyebrows at this time and not one from plucking at yourself like a nervous chicken lol.Again show me where these peoples genetics tests are?And while your at it show me where there was a large concentration of ethnic "greeks" who referred to themselves as "hellenes' and not as "romaoi".
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@true bulgarian only fascists speak of genetics tests you uneducated racist. Im not surprised that you would bring up genetics himmlerovski.There were plenty of Greek scholars who described themselves as Hellenes..Plethon, Chalcondyles etc etc.....now tell us who is on RECORD as describing themselves as an ethnic "Macedonian" during the early 1800s, prior to the Greek revolution. NOBODY. Danforth, Brown, Mazower and BORZA tell us this. These are the authors you brainwashed twits cite the most.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
LOL Boygeorge your racism has far exceeded your limit to think.And if you do think for one second and look at your posts as compared to mine I already answered your questions.Now that you mention Plethon & Chakakhan (wow 2 people)show me where thousands of people called themselves "Hellenes" before 1833?I know you will never ever find anything like this because no such document exists(unless we go back to the classical era which you have nothing to do with lol).
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@truemoron,yo uwant me to provide you with proof of thousands of people calling themselves hellenes yet your only proof of someone calling themselves an"ethnic Macedonian" at the time is an obscure reference to a "Makedonski"LOL!! Educated people were the first to espouse national/ethnic identities, i provided you examples of two. Where are your "ethnic Macedonian" scholars prior to the 19th century? WHERE.PUT UP OR SHUTUP!!
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
Boygeorge is this a game to you?You people suffer from an inferiority complex lol.Giorgio Giulio Clovio "il Macedone" was named as such because of his Macedonian origins.The synod records of the Ohrid archbishopric at the beginning of the thirteenth century contain the words, "Ivan Ierakar by birth Macedonian".Do your research boygeorgey instead of watching gay porn on the computer lol.You'll find these sources.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@truebulgar, you call that proof?All you have is speculation and some guys using a regional descriptor. Bulgars, Greeks, Vlachs and everyone else in the region used the regional descriptor "Macedonian".the 19th century writer Frederick Moore tells us this. Mazower, your recommended author tells us this. YOU HAVE NOTHING. provide us with a list of modern scholars who describe your ethnicity as being centuries old and the dominant population in the region.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@truebulgar, you asked me to provide you with people claiming to be Greeks. I provided you with Chalcondyles and Plethon. Where are your pre 19th century "ethnic Macedonian" shcolars describing your homeland and ethnicity/nation? YOu have nothing! Your own sources, Borza, Mazower and Brown tell us that your ethnicity is the newest one in the Balkans. You are serbianized bulgarians with an Aleksandar fantasy complex.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
Hears your proof again georgeygirl.Boygeorge is this a game to you?You people suffer from an inferiority complex lol.Giorgio Giulio Clovio "il Macedone" was named as such because of his Macedonian origins.The synod records of the Ohrid archbishopric at the beginning of the thirteenth century contain the words, "Ivan Ierakar by birth Macedonian".Do your research boygeorgey instead of watching gay porn on the computer lol.You'll find these sources.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@trueBulgar, "Macedonian" was used in a Geographic sense nothing more nothing less. You have no proof of any modern scholars describing your nation/ethnicity as one that existed for centuries. You have no proof of anyone claiming to be an "ethnic Macedonian" and you cannot explain why Finlay and Gordon would make no mention of any ethnic "Macedonians".
princegeorge57 2 years ago
The Bulgar Slavs of Paeonia are getting desperate.
Hellenicone 2 years ago
For 600+ years the Ottoman Turks controlled Dardania/Paeonia, but somehow they "forgot" to even mention anything about a "Makedonski millet". Only Hellenes, Serbs, Bulgarians, Albanians, Vlachs, and Roma are mentioned, but never once did the Ottomans ever talk about "Makedonskis".
Hellenicone 2 years ago
@Hellenicone
Actually no Ottoman source ever mentions any "hellenes" living in their territory in the Balkans.Show me one ounce of proof that they did.And show me where your mixed mongrel people called themselves hellenes.And provide proof that they had an ancient hellene self-conciousness at that. Imposter hellene I am positive you have never picked up a book in your entire teenage life.Go to a library little girl and open your eyes.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
scandinavians and macedonians LOL
no, not the same
there is no scandinavian nation
but there are macedonians
and they are indigenous to all of Macedonia
and they speak macedonian language
the greek ethnic cleaning done over macedonians in the last 100 years cannot be covered with "a name issue"
and certainly not by stupid analogies
mirwhitty 2 years ago
he sux
mirwhitty 2 years ago
the abusrdity of a Slavic decedent race of Bulgarians trying to portray themselves as anything remotely close to what true Macedonian was or ever could be is laughable. The entire Slavic FYROMian hisotry is a joke. Delchev was a proud Bulgarian, the attempt at using the star of Vergina which is a reprentation of all the greek gods/elements of the earth, etc etc is PATHETIC. Why not be proud of your Bugian roots! No way to a Geographic title... They should be call Gypsiania. READ A BOOK !
Terpsimos 2 years ago
Since when do Slavs of Dardania/Paeonia who speak a Slavic language almost identical to Bulgarian and whose country was never part of Macedonia except for the southern tip of Monastiri have anything to do with the Macedonians who were Hellenes, worshipped the Gods of Olympus, spoke Hellenic, participated in the Olympic Games. This is akin to saying that the Egyptians wish to be called Macedonians.
Hellenicone 2 years ago
We shouldn't forget history like the man said. Because if we do then we'll forget the fact that modern "greece" was a country created by western powers, who in turn made Albanians,Vlachs,and Slavs into "hellenes" lol. Yes let's not forget history please.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@truemacedonian
You are a genius!! So, all the Albanians, Vlachs, and Slavs were taught to speak Greek by the western powers, they were taught the customs and traditions of the non-existent Greeks, and eventually they were assimilated by the non-existent Greeks!! You are trueMoron!!
jolympos 2 years ago
@truemacedonian
So you think I am not a Greek, but an Albanian or a Slav who was made a Hellene? Let me tell you that it is fantastic being a Hellene...
So let me tell you that you too, as an Albanian or Slav, you should also become a Hellene! And once you are a true Hellene you can even become a Macedonian or an Athenian... It's the only way to go!
Filotimos 2 years ago
@TrueSlav
I wonder which Western Powers created the Greeks of Southern Italy, Sicily, Southern Albania, Odessa, Southern Crimea, Pontus, Syria, Palestine, and Egypt.
You're right...let's not forget history barbarian.
Hellenicone 2 years ago
@Hellenicone
Can you even provide proof of these people calling themselves "hellenes" or "greeks" hellenicoon?I don't think so.The ones in Albania have already been proven to be Vlachs & Albanians of the Orthodox faith that were hellenized.But where are the ethnic "greeks"?In Odessa?Like the Vlach and Slav philiki eteria founders?Or the Pontis who only have a 70 year history in Macedonia but claim a 4000 year 'greek' history in Macedonia lol.Please let's not forget your history lol.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@truemacedonian
Here is a test for you trueMoron. Did Rigas Feraios consider himself a Greek?
jolympos 2 years ago
@jolympos
Rigas was an ethnic Vlach. A Fat one at that lol. He could've called himself French for all I care.But he was not an ethnic "greek".He was an ethnic Vlach.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@truemacedonian
Let's see. Rigas considered himself to be a Greek, but you know better!! To you he was a Vlach. Could it be that he saw Vlachs as Greeks? Or is it that you detest him because he did not mention any Makedonskis? Don't fault him for that. Ethnic Makedonskis had had not been inventend yet. Neither did he have the pleasure of reading Maknews and all the village idiots (Makedonskis) that post on it.
jolympos 2 years ago
@jolympos
LOL but the fact is Rigas was an ethnic Vlach.He may have felt "greek" but in the end he was a fat Vlach.His constitution is an eye opener as well.Anyone who is a christian,according to the fat Vlach Rigas, was a "greek".LOL yeah that's a great ethnic qualifier right there lol.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@bukefalovskitruemoron, Rigas had a Greek consciousness, Delchev had a Bulgarian consciousness, he wrote that on paper. Tell us the difference.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
Both had a religious consciousness.Delchev under the Exarchists and the Vlach rigas said anyone who was a christian was a "greek". There's your difference.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@truemoron, Delchev was not write "We Bulgarians" because of religious affiliation. Read Danforth, the anthropologist who studied your nation, he tells you this. Practically all key figures in your so called "illinden uprising" wrote that they were bulgarians and were regarded as Bulgarians yet you harp about Rigas the Vlach. YOU MORON!
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@truemacedonian
Did your parents/relatives welcome the Nazis and fought with them. You do sound like a Nazi.
jolympos 2 years ago
@moronovski, my ancestors, unlike yours, never sided with nazis or commies. You are the one talking about genetics tests and blood lineages. You are the one that is claiming that finlay, gordon, frost and practically every other first hand witness in the region during the early 1800s is a liar. GO back to wearing your aleksandrovski unerwear and dream about riding bukefalovski into Skopje, that great "ethnic Macedonian" city LOLOLOL
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
Considering that your own people today admit that the philhellenes created you I find you a complete useless joke lol.Nikos Dimou states the truth"We spoke Albanian and called ourselves Romans" lol.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@truebulgar, oh great, Nikos Dimou. Some parts of the population spoke Albanian. Yay. Go study italian history moron. Numerous tribes who spoke unintelligible vernaculars and felt no kinship were molded into one nation who now consider ancient rome as a national heritage. A large Greek population assimilated Vlachs, Arvanites and SLavs. So what? THat does not measure up to your standars of racial purity you racist bastard?
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
Your soccer stadium is named after a gypsy.Why boygeorge?Your country's national costume is the Albanian fustanella.Why boygeorge?Your first president was an Albanian that spoke Albanian and could not speak one word of romaika.Why boygeorge?Kolokotronis was a major in General Churches Albanian regiment.Why boygeorge?Why not the "greek" regiment?
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@truenazibastard, wow you are getting smart and very scholastic using names of stadiums. Your national heroes are practically all on record calling themselves Bulgarians, FINLAY AND GORDON recorded vast Greek populations and made no mention of "ethnic Macedonians" yet you have wet dreams over albanians. YOU COWARDS, who allegedly formed the majority during the balkan wars, were A NO SHOW to fight for your so called homeland. What a joke.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@truenazi. Your own scholars of less than 20 years ago, tell us that your population diverged from BULGARIANS during the middle 1800s. These are your own state sponsored scholars that wrote this you fool. You always try to apply standards of ethnic authenticity to Greeks that your own NEW NATION cannot meet. You are a joke.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
LOL but the truth is you cannot answer these questions.Nikos Dimou said the following of your people's recent past; "We spoke Albanian and called ourselves Romans". LOL
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@truenazi, obviously you are too stupid to realize that Dimou wasnt talking about the whole Greek population, MORON. The fact that up till about 100 years ago your people were almost universally considered Bulgarian does not phase you though. Greeks assimilated Albanians, Vlachs and Slavs. A racist fuckwit nazi, like you, obviously has problems with tainted bloodlines. France, Italy, Germany and Spain are all artifical nations according to your fascist brain.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@princegeorge57
@truemacedonian
Your soccer stadium is named after a gypsy.Why boygeorge?Your country's national costume is the Albanian fustanella.Why boygeorge?Your first president was an Albanian that spoke Albanian and could not speak one word of romaika.Why boygeorge?Kolokotronis was a major in General Churches Albanian regiment.Why boygeorge?Why not the "greek" regiment?
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@racisttruemoron, you have no answers so you have resorted to spamming. Great. At least my people were recorded by the likes of Leake, Finlay, Gordon and a vast number of others who made absolutely no mention of "ethnic Macedonians" in any of their accounts. At least my people showed up during the Balkan wars and were recorded by the Carnegie Commission who made no mention of "ethnic Macedonians" even in the early 1900s. Who is the boy george?
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57 ,you have yet to answer any of my questions.Why are you afraid?Don't you have any balls?I've answered all of your questions.Here i'll ask you again.@truemacedonian
Your soccer stadium is named after a gypsy.Why boygeorge?Your country's national costume is the Albanian fustanella.Why boygeorge?Kolokotronis was a major in General Churches Albanian regiment.Why boygeorge?Why not the "greek" regiment?
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@fascisttruepig, in your confined racist mind if a stadium is named after someone who does not have a pristine bloodline belonging to the dominant ethnicity the whole ethnos must be fake. Moron. The fustanella was worn by Greek populations centuries before the Albanians in regions where there were no Albanians. MORON. Now what should we say about your ethnicity that was not recorded by the likes of Finlay and Gordon, who had national heroes who self described as BULGARIAN?
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@moronovski lying bulgar,Pitu Guli was a vlach re-baptised as an "ethnic Macedonian" by your historiography. Leave Rigas alone.One day you will grow up out of your racism,you know the "Macedonoid" masters of the white race drivel, and realize that self ascription and acceptance by others is key to an ethnic identity, not a blood test you tampon brain moron.You keep bringing up vlachs and albanians,you ignore hundreds of pages from Finlay and Gordon, and turn a blind eye to your Bulgarian heroes
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@truebulgarian
You are a joke. You ask for proof of people calling themselves Hellenes but you have absolutely no proof of anyone claiming to be an "ethnic Macedonian" during the period of the Filiki Etheria. Double standard. But then what more can we expect from a group of people whose national heroes were practically all on record self describing as Bulgarians. Tonnes of accounts exist from the early 1800s differentiating Greeks from Vlachs, Slavs and Arvanites yet you jokers lie.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
Actually boygeorge there's plenty of proof of Macedonians self-describing as Macedonians and outsiders describing them as Macedonians as well.But the truth is that the Filiki Eteria members used Albanian and Turkish passwords amongst their members.Why is that boygeorge?
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@truebulgar
Stop lying true bulgar boy. Who described themselves as an "ethnic Macedonian" during the period of the Greek revolution. Nobody. Danforth states hardly anybody even self identified as "Macedonian" during the early 1900's let alone during the early 1800s. Borza states that your so called ethnic identity is a new phenomenon. Filiki Eteria was an indigenous movement to free Greece and Greeks decades before you bafoons claim Greeks were invented. Read Finlay. Read Gordon dear fool
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
His name was Pavel Makedonski and he fought in the "greek" revolution.Filiki Etariea indigenous? HAHAHHA and that must explain the reason why Finlay is the man who describes the Albanian secret code words amongst the members of this secret society. I wonder if you even read Finlay.I recommend that you do.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@truemacedonian...what a moron. "Pavel Makedonski" is on record proclaiming that heis a "Macedonian". What a joke. Where is this record? LIAR. Makedonski was a Greek of russian descent. Gordon makes mention of him in his book and guess what, MORON, he makes no mention of any "ethnic Macedonians" when he described ALL of the populations in the Ottoman empire. Your people did not exist or else the likes of Gordon and Finlay would have mentioned them.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
Excuse show me where Gordon states that Makedonski is a "greek"? I gurantee you that you are the one lying now. Come on prove me wrong right now and tell me what page that claim is on.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@truebulgar Gordon describes a Makedonski fighting on the side of the Greeks. You claimed that Makedonski is on record claiming that he is an "ethnic Macedonian" where is your proof? The 19th century writer frost described Makedonski as a Greek of Russian descent. Your only proof of someone claiming to be an "ethnic Macedonian" during the early 1800s is "Makedonski" LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! nice history you half wit. Gordon makes no mention of "ethnic Macedonians" anywhere half wit!
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
Makedonski's name is Makedonski.Gordon says he is a Russian of MACEDONIAN origin.Obviously Gordon asked him what he was.Show me where Frost,a man who was born way after the 'greek' war for independence,got his source that Makedonski was a "greek"?Go ahead I am sure he has a source right?Right?LOL of course he doesn't.And there's plenty of Macedonians who self-described as such in the 19th century.Tell me to pm you the proof and I will you mongolian.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@truemoron, if Gordon was aware of "ethnic Macedonians" and "ethnic Macedonian" populations why did he make no mention of "Macedonians" composing any part of the populations of the Ottoman empire in his detailed descriptions of the populations. "Macedonian" meant he was from the region,nothing more nothing less. YOU HAVE NO PROOF OF ANYONE CLAIMING TO BE AN "ETHNIC MACEDONIAN" during the time of Gordon and Finlay. NONE! Again, Gordon describes Greeks yet he makes no mention of your ilk. LIAR!
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
LOL Boygirgo your acting like a ignoramus now.Show me where there was a large population of self describing hellenes during the war for independece?Why were all of your freedom fighters Albanians?Why did the Albanian fustanella become the modern "greek" national costume of your modern country?Why were all the intelligentsia of your country ethnically Vlachs and Slavs?You have proven to be a complete and utter rag head.Not surprising at all considering what you really are lol.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@truebulgar, there were several committees who described themselves as Greek prior to Greek independence. You want afidavits from large Greek populations yet you cannot PROVIDE US WITH ONE INDIVIDUAL who claimed that they were an "ethnic Macedonian" during the period of the Greek revolution. Learn some history fool. If you are using the fact that Albanians fought on the Greek side what should we say about your national heroes who ALL claimed to be BULGARIAN. LYING UNEDUCATED FOOL!
princegeorge57 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@princegeorge57
Actually I will re-repost this info again for you.Boygeorge is this a game to you?You people suffer from an inferiority complex lol.Giorgio Giulio Clovio "il Macedone" was named as such because of his Macedonian origins.The synod records of the Ohrid archbishopric at the beginning of the thirteenth century contain the words, "Ivan Ierakar by birth Macedonian".Do your research boygeorgey instead of watching gay porn on the computer lol.You'll find these sources.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
FOLKS, TrueBulgarian and his mentor Stefovski claim that Greeks were invented post Greek revolution. How do the halfwits TrueBulgar and Stefov explain why Finlay and Gordon who were both there during the early 19th century would record huge Greek populations and distinguish them from Vlachs, Arvanites and Slavs. Neither make any mention of "ethnic Macedonians" forming any population component yet the liars TrueBulgarian and Stefovski have the audacity to cite Finlay and Gordon as proof! LIARS!
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
I do have the audacity to cite them because they even destroy your lame myths.Like how Finlay describes Georgios Koundioriottis, the first president of modern"greece",as an Albanian who spoke only Albanian and could not speak one word of "greek".His Vice President had the same issue according to Finlay.And the Albanian secret passwords as well as how Gordon describes the Albanian revolutionaries is eye opening indeed.Yes I cite them to prove your myth wrong.And I have
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@TRUEMORON, Albanians, Vlachs and Slavs fought on the side of the Greeks, So what? Finlay describes huge Greek populations and distinguishes them from the rest of the races. Since you are so keen on Albanian contributions to the Greek cause what should we say about your national heroes who were UNIVERSALLY regarded as Bulgarian. Brown tells us that the illinden uprising was remolded by the commies to make it into an "ethnic Macedonian" uprising. Halfwits like you fell for it.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
Actually if you read Browns book in its entirity then you would see that you fell for Chris Philipukes dumb ploy on his blog lol.I recommend you do read it all from front to back georgeygirl.Brown calls your people Vlachs,Albanians and Slavs lol.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@moronfromcrapnews, I dont need anyone to tell me about Brown. Brown states that your people were once regarded as Bulgarian. Brown states that the "illinden" uprising was carried out by Vlachs and Bulgars and that the communists re-interpreted history to remold the uprising into an "ethnic Macedonian" uprising. Brown certainly does not think that Greeks were invented post Greek revolution like you illitereate peasants do. Man, this is too easy. Why dont you go back to crapnews and bring help.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
Obviously you have never read Brown then lol.I recommend you do.He also describes why it is that the Macedonians did describe themselves as "bulgarians" and why the Vlachs described themselves as "greeks".
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@bulgar, where does Brown state that your ethnicity has existed for centuries and dominated the demographics? Nowhere. Brown states that you people were once called Bulgarian. "Macedonian" had no ethnic or national meaning, at all, at the time. Where does Brown state that Greeks were invented post Greek revolution. LIAR.
He describes in detail how the commies manufactured history to dupe people like you into believing kruschevo was an "ethnic Macedonian" uprising! LOL!Come on, bring some help.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
Georgeygirl you underplay Browns book to 3 choice pages when there's more than meets the eye in his book than Chris Philipuke posted on his worthless blog lol.Have you ever even read his book?
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@bulgar, lets just ignore and cut out the pages from Brown that don't suit your agenda. LOL! Are you for real? Those three pages destroy all of your absurd theories. Yah, lets just discard them because they make you look like a fool!!!LOLOLOL
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
And then we should also discard from Browns book the fact that the term "Bulgarian" was a religious and social labor term.Same as "greek" was a social labor term and a religious term.Yes and while we're at it let's discard the fact that you have omitted an entire book because you never read it lol.You are dumber than a box of locks lol.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@Bulgar, this is irrelevant because BROWN basically tells us that "Macedonian" had no ethnic or national significance until relatively recently, until your people diverged from the Bulgars. This isn't rocket science. He also claims that the commies had a hand into molding your national identity to suit the notion of a continuous "ethnic Macedonian" existence.
princegeorge57 2 years ago
@princegeorge57
LOL HAVE YOU READ BROWNS BOOK?ANSWER THIS QUESTION.
truemacedonian 2 years ago
@truemoron. Finlay desscribes Greek populations that numbered in the hundreds of thousands. He distinguished them from Albanians and Vlachs and he stated that Greeks formed the majority on the Greek peninsula and in the Pashalik of thessalonika. Why would he state this if Greeks were not invented yet, as you MORONS claim. Why would FInlay make no mention of any "MACEDONIAN" populations of your ilk you uneducated brainwashed liar?
princegeorge57 2 years ago