Light contact dagger sparring

[brianspost75]

So it looks like they would both be dead. Try using the fencers grip next time.

[DiabolusIgnis]

@brianspost75 Why do that? That grip is AFAIK generally better than the fencer's grip. If you mean the fencer's grip as in holding the dagger tip upwards, that is.

[DiabolusIgnis]

@brianspost75 Oh, BTW. "The survivor of a knife fight dies in the hospital." Something like that. It's IIRC an Italian

wisdom.

[brianspost75]

@DiabolusIgnis Good advice lol. 

[miraclemuaythai]

cool! great vid.

[punyo4u]

Your biggist advantage in a knife fight is REACH. While the reverse grip has strong stabbing power, and can produce a powerful forward slash, the tradeoff in reach over a sabre grip or quarter sabre grip can be deadly. Reverse grip has its place but should never be trained in this way (as shown in this video). Pick your target from a distance then move in and strike quickly and then back out - this can be hard to do from a reverse grip.

[temmy9]

@punyo4u Please keep in mind the context. The rondel was essentially a spike used to punch through mail armour. The techniques being shown were intended to be used by men in full armour against men in full armour. Slashing attacks with a knife will have little impact on a man in good mail. Forward stabs with a rondel will not the generate the needed energy to pierce the rings. To gain the needed energy, you need a powerful downwards stab.

[sikkco]

you know it would be a lot easier to test or practice if you both had armor or pads so that you could actually hit eachother with the dagger instead of having to hold back

[acerb45666555]

no not that way!! you nust hold the blade forward come in low and carefully and constantly slash block and lunge at the opponent, keep him off balance and distracted, tire him out.

[ChishioAme]

@acerb45666555 That's all well and good... In the movies. The rondel was used as a self defense weapon for centuries, so if these techniques didn't actually work, we wouldn't be having this discussion because Liechtenauer would never have included them in his fechtbuch.

[gaiamantic]

i like the grappling/disarming. much more realistic than other vids.

[bassreeves1965]

europen knife is a lot like arnis reverse grip.

[xtimtimx1198]

hello, i have found that most techniques left behind in manuals work best with a dedicated attack, would you agree with that? If you do, how do you deal with the feints used in sparring? It seems like you guys have either found a way to make them work, or are making some good dedicated attacks, or a combination of both.

[astrayl]

as a general rule most martials art techniques don't survive introduction to combat. they are only there to teach you the basic movements and how they mesh with your opponents. Learning a complex wrist and elbow lock to put an opponent down is all well and good but the opprotunity for such a lock will be few and far between. The basic defensive and offesive motions are the bread and butter of any weapon.

[Raithor83]

@astrayl You obviously don't study Martial Arts for self defense. I study traditional Jiu Jitsu and use locks and holds frequently at work; I currently do security at the University I am attending. I can't count the number of times I've subdued some drunk jock with a wrist lock or a simple throw/take down. Sober or drunk, there is an extreme advantage that comes with dedicated Martial Arts training and practice.

[VegaEtereo]

Excelente.

[npeverillable1]

Is this really how knights used to fight?

[Pourleduc]

What a ridicolous question. Do you know what a knight is?

[npeverillable1]

there is no such thing as a ridiculous question. Obviously I don't know or I wouldn't have asked.

[mmin3s]

better to be an idiot for 5 minutes than be an idiot for life (some wise man stuff there) ;)

[meversbergii]

This is a method of combat with daggers, which was in use by fighting men of the middle ages from at least the 13th or 14th centuries (daggers were not popular until around the 13th if I recall).

Usually you don't draw daggers unless its a self defense situation, or you're fighting in plate armor.

[beatthecrowd001]

The western medieval martial arts are amazing i would really love to learn it but over here in america is not as common to find where u can learn this syle.

[greenbrad182]

nice osoto gari

[Ranziel1]

That's not judo, that's German "ringen am dolch" techniques, though the technique might be identical to some another, it was not "borrowed", but independently developed in medieval German.

[illclint26]

dang gypsies.

[jekkep3kke]

skill right there..

[lordjuan12]

estan viejos para la gracia.,

[yinyangliger]

awesome vid

[mrdancingstar]

very nice video

[plummer337]

i looks very odd

[lindybeige]

This style is odd. Most knives are held the other way up, and a main attack is a cut to the wrist. My guess is that this is a specialist style designed solely for stabbing an armoured man.

[FoxtrotNinja]

I think it's just another style. The quick jerky movements look fairly unique to this style, probably used to not get stabbed in the throat/face/anywhere you don't want to get stabbed.

[colbol89]

@lindybeige Wrong. Most knifes are held the way they are using in all honesty. It's much more useful.  But you are right, it is a different style. Ze German style. The "upwards" other style you're talking. Is the Italian style.

[BelligerentAuthority]

How long are those daggers?

[Torashin]

cool, keep it up

[Paladin1983PL]

Wear a face and throat protection guys.

[ilikeit88]

they were wooden TRAINING daggers ,dude

[portal1337]

pretty cool, love the disarm and the grappling takedown in the beginning

[NewZealfighter]

at 1:00 green could have done a Sambo roll forward fliping black

[LostInMySelf1]

nich schlecht! würd gern mal nen richtigen kampf in rüstung sehen...

[shinzu4001]

Good light exploration work, but there is not enough fear of the blade. Both of these guys would be bloody messes if any of the exchanges were legit. The point of working with the knife is to increase the possibility that you will walk away with as little damage as possible. I suggest using shocknives if you can afford them, they will make you regret taking the cut.

[animematt]

SOrry, i know you said that 8 months ago. Not enough people ave views this.

Yes, they would of been a bloody mess. But there is this saying. "The winner of a knife fight dies at the hospital"

[jbujko]

This was actually pretty bad.. Both of them fought fearing no hit, bloodloss seemed not even being thought of and they continued with their grappling after both have been hit at least a few times. Their distance and whole footwork was weak and improper. What kind of a dagger did they fight with? Cut-and-thrust knife or a thrusting knife? In the first case the use of techniques was wrong for they were slashed several times. In the second - the choice of a knife was wrong as for fighting unarmed

[VikingWannaBe51887]

its a rondel dagger. a dagger used during the 14th century. Also it was just light sparring. Im sure if they were really trying to kill each other there foot work would differ.

[jbujko]

A rondel dagger with no sharp edges is only useful when trying to kill a downed armoured opponent. If they're simulating an armoured fight - they do it wrong. If they're simulating an unarmed fight - why don't they use knives that can cut? Such moves using that kind of dagger against a slashing and cutting knife wielding opponent would be a bad idea. And of course - it was light sparring so they should use at least some fencing masks.

[VikingWannaBe51887]

some or if not most rondel daggers have a single edge. It was first adopted as a tool but later on used as a weapon. The common man also had acess to weapon/tool. It wasn't just knights. You should check out the book called medieval combat.Its a series of 15th centery manuscripts and It covers rondel dagger close quarters fighting and you can pick it up for about $8. That should answer most of your questions. its a must get.

[jbujko]

Yes I know that about the edge. However on this video they completely ignore the blade ( f.e. they hold the dagger with the blade downwards and keep putting their left arm ahead continuously trying to grab the opponent). The common man would never, ever come to something even resebling this kind of knife fighting. I've seen such books and manuscripts - what i've seen looks like fighting with a sharpened stick, not with a sharp knife.

[animematt]

A cut wont dispatch someone. A stab will. Cutting will hurt them, make them bleed a bit. But it won't dispatch them.

In Medieval Europe, EVERYONE had a knife or dagger. IE A pointy bit of sharp metal. Fights, even among commoners, were common.

If you actually do read the manuscripts, they do involve cutting, but usually only to the wrist.

[jbujko]

Dude, google "knife wounds" and see for Yourself how a knife cut looks like..

[animematt]

Yes, cuts can be nasty. But to the body, cuts tend not to penetrate deep enough to actually kill (back in medieval time, they would kill slowly of infection).

Stabbing can go deep, between rips and into organs. This will kill a lot faster than a cut.

Like I said, they often had cuts to the wrists, which will cut the vein easily, since it is so shallow.

Also, of course there is no fear of the blade. Fear could only be there if they were real danger.

[jbujko]

Dude, I'm a med-guy, I've seen what a cut can do to flesh. Even though It's a bit different way to kill a human with a cut it is still a grievous and incapacitating wound. They cannot be ignored in the way this vid shows it

[Djemps]

I know I'm joining the conversation late, but I just wanted to mention that these weapons are supposed to simulate rondell daggers. They were more like ice picks, often with a triangular blade, and were meant to cause deep stab wounds and puncture armor.

[skooterkid]

Like a Stiletto? Those sounds similar.

[Djemps]

Exactly

[chuon19]

this is so emal

[Drago1337]

Realy nice video

[lusch3]

schöne ringeinlagen :)

top!

[Maximiliator1000]

Alter... ihr müsst ganzschoen trainieren um das so zu können !!! Respekt !!!

---

Max

[mogur13]

This is the best European dagger fighting video on youtube so far, guys. Great job!

[TheHolyWenzel]

Das ist europäischer Dolch oder Messer Kampf,

Schnell, Fies, Kompromisslos, tötlich!

[Wowerik]

gutes video was ist das für eine kampfsport art

[Kunstdesfechtens]

Well done.

[Djemps]

Thanks forthis video. It's very nice to see the Rondel dagger style in action!