What a pity can You feel to murderer who comes to your home and kills your wife and children? Greetings for Russians. We must forgive ourselves our history. Polish :)
It still amazes me after studying WW2 for 30+ years that those Prussian Generals didn't kill Hitler out of frustration. No conspiracy required, no "well organized operation". Just pull out your Luger and shoot the Bastard in a staff meeting. These Generals were men that had devoted their entire lives to studying warfare and attended the finest Military Academies. Hitler was a Meth addicted Austrian Corporal who lacked any formal military education. (continued next post...)
Continued- Hitler lacked the education to even gain admittance to a Military Academy. Any one of those Prussian Generals could have killed Hitler and spared their beloved Fatherland its utter destruction. Possibly it was the personal Oath they had all sworn in the late 30's, perhaps it was cowardice. Hitler was the leader of a cult of personality, but I doubt his Prussian Generals "admired" the little Sociopath. We will never know why no one acted to save their Nation...
@randy109 There are 40 confirmed attempts on Hitlers life. The most popular one was operation Valcary... But, trust me those Generals tried to kill Hitler or at least some of them... Stalin was smart... He killed Generals when they gained to much popularity :D
@havee3333333 Valkyries are the Nordic warrior goddesses that would select brave warriors on the field of battle and take them to Valhalla - the hall where Odin would serve them a feast during the night and have them war during the day in eternal paradise. Hitler named his contingency plan "Valkyrie" because it suited his taste for Nordic Mythology.
@havee3333333 Valkyrie is not the name of the man who had the plan, the man who had the plan was Claus Schenk Graf von Stauffenberg and what he actually did was modify the original "Valkyrie" plan drafted by Hitler. So, as you see, I do worry about history, and your spelling simply revealed how little you actually knew.... "my friend". Your spelling is a symptom of your lack of education.
I know enough about this you fucking retard I bet you just watched the movie and you think your a bad ass now... It was a guy who was a high ranking officer who had a plan to kill Hitler in a meeting. He put a dynamite inside a bag but wanted to put 2 inside it but didn't get the chance. He went into the room and placed the bag under the table. When it exploded only 4 people died and Hitler survived. I learned this 2 years ago so I'm sorry if I forgot some shit alright bro?
@havee3333333 hehe... Good Wikipedia moment there for ya! I read Roger Moorhouse's article "A Good German?: the questionable sainthood of Claus von Stauffenberg" ... but yeah, I also watched the movie with Tom Cruise and Kenneth Branagh, which is clearly something not even you did since the title of the freakin' movie is "Valkyrie" the way you couldn't even spell.
@havee3333333 I noticed you even mis-spelled the name of the city you live in on your youtube profile! You wrote San Fransisco!! HAHA.. I truly hope you're 12 years old....
@havee3333333 Hey.. at least I can spell better than a 3rd grader. By the way, why is it that I do not deserve to talk to humans? You got any solid arguments for that, Mr. "Valcary"?
@PrettyBrg They all fucked each other because there were no women left and they knew they were going to die. Probably so they didn't get any diseases or something...
One of my earliest memories is of watching this tape on cassette, and I was just staggered by the scale and sheer size of it all, and I still am this day. All those men...literally thousands and thousands stretching from horizon to horizon, as far as the eye could see, and you can bet at least half of them went to their deaths. Its just incredible.
Stalingrad in all actuality Stalingrad is the most important battle of the war because once the germans were defeated there the russian army lead by the victorious general Vasilli Kruchiv headed towards berlin and destroyed the remainder of german presence outside of germany
@Agamemnon862 Let me clear some of the gloom. At 1:42, this episode covers and shows the most important moment of all WW2 other than the A Bomb drop. The tide turned in favor of the Russians and by extension to the Allies at that very moment. Just before those two Russians soldiers reached each other, Germany was wining, they started to loose right after and never recovered. Almost makes me shiver !!!
I was wondering why there have been so few interviews of the German veterans during this Stalingrad espisode of the World at War.., like they have on the others. Then occured to me: only 1-20 Germans got back home alive...
The German magazine Stern ran an interview with one survivor in late 2007. He attributed his survival to being a keep-fit enthusiast before he was captured. He was 92 at the time he was interviewed, and living in Berlin.
king charles of sweden, napoleon, the germans of WW1 and the nazi devil threw hell at russia and somehow the country managed to survive. russia can be hit, can be bombed, you can slaughter millions, but russia can never be beaten. It is just a military impossibility. No other society has peered into the abyss of annhilation more times than the russians,and no other society has prevailed.
the russians' strategy is to hold up till winter and only attack during winter,where their army could fight better in great advantage against the well trained,actually ggreatly trained,german army...
i'll say it's very brilliant of them and i wonder the germans didnt get this plan n strategy and tried to do their best to counter it,tsk...
@teslagod2003 In 1814, General Barclay de Tolly inadvertently discovered Russia's greatest defensive tactic--trading space for time. BcT kept retreating, because he was afraid to do battle with the great Napoleon. Finally Alexander I dismissed him and appointed Katuzov in his place, with wide autonomous powers, but with the promise of doing battle. The battle accomplished nothing but time destroyed Napoleon.
@teslagod2003 This was part of a much longer discourse to show that it was more than just "hold up till winter". It is retreat into the interior without giving all out battle, destroy everything in the enemy's path that can sustain an occupier, employ guerrilla attacks to disrupt supplies and communications. It began with BdT, was successfully used against the Germans and would have been used against us if, during the cold war, we had been so foolish as to attack.
8 million guys who will sleep in the snow, have accurate and durable rifles and artillery and will drink 3 ounces of straight industrial Vodka before charging me. I'm freezing to death, 1,500 miles from home, hungry and haven't slept more than cat naps in weeks. I don't care how disciplined the Germans were they must have been quite demoralized and rightfully so! Germans outran their supply lines and back home they believed their own propaganda. German soldiers deserve SOME pity...
@randy95023 I applaud the courage and willingness of the German soldier to fight to the death for his comrades and his country. He deserved better than Hitler and his thugs.
@rangerbobcat I think not every act of barbarism committed by Germans at this time was at Hitler's behest. I think the ordinary German soldier murdered lots of civilians and enemy soldiers on his own without any order from anyone. They were arrogant, superior, and felt entitled to dispose of lesser breeds as they wished. Similarly, WWII wasn't just Hitler's doing; the General Staff was a lot more involved than they were inclined to admit once defeated.
@randy95023 No, they don't. Remember, they had behaved disgustingly when in Russia and killed over 95% of the Russian POWs; and wherever the German army went, they were the warm-up act for the death squads, the SS, the Gestapo. They'd enjoyed strutting around posing as the Master Race, turning a blind eye to atrocities and braying support for that monotesticular freak with the Charlie Chaplin moustache: the eastern front was the flip side of that - and tough luck!
@syl171 I agree... one absolutely must. But it was Shakespeare's ONLY language, not his favourite; and if he was commenting on here, he would use more expletives.
@GOfilms01 they should have unleashed their apocalypse tanks,kirov airships,tesla tanks,v3 launchers,siege choppers,and terror drones in the whole germany...
and no matter how much of them got destroyed or lost,they could be easily replaced...
In terms of efficiency, organisation and actual troop and equipment numbers, I have to say the Red Army was the best in the world, especially in 1943.
@ellisbaker93 yes, I think you're right there, I was thinking of early WWII, but then things changed on both sides, Germans got clumsy, Soviets became smarter, and in the end, despite heavy losses the Red Army came back and triumphed over the German Army (and its allies). Thanks for sharing an important point.
This is an example of what civilised cultured society are capable of...the most bloodiest battle in human history that we know of...this is history now, all we can do is look back and reflect and make sure it never happens again
stupid hitler he lost the war for the nazis he was a great speaker administrator and politician but he was a bad general and he had so many great generals at his disposal if he would have let them do their job now all the jews would be dead and we all would have lived in a great nazi society
They certainly wouldn't have been able to take on the German army alone that's for sure, but if Hitler had all of Europe it would have been another story. That's what I meant when I said they could not have won without the USSR, so you pay attention to what people say genius.
Of course the USSR bore the brunt of the German attack...however, given the location, size, strength, and industrial potential of the US there is no real means of making any sort of definitive 'certain,' conclusion that the US and it's allies, (minus the USSR), would have been unable to defeat Germany.
Besides, the Germans would most likely not have been able to mount any kind of amphibious operation across the Atlantic...Keep in mind, they could not even do so against England...and that was before Soviet intervention...Indeed, actually at that point the USSR was supplying the GERMANS.
...the germans would have had to either strike out across the middle east or construct an 'impenetrable' fortress Europe...either way, giving time for US industrial potential to be maximized. A United States at full capacity would have been more than a match for all Axis powers combined.
You might want to read before answering comments , I know much about ww2 and I know the americans offered support.
But it is a fact that without the soviet union the US would not have won, honestly you think they could have done d day that successfully without the USSR fighting the Germans in the East? They were able to take huge losses and weaken the wehrmacht. I never said the Americans didn't play a big part in it which is what your implying so pay attention to what you read Einstein
" it is a fact that without the soviet union the US would not have won, honestly you think they could have done d day that successfully without the USSR?"
That's your OPINION, not a FACT. Learn the difference. Anyways, the Soviets NOT being involved in the war would have changed the WHOLE dynamic in which the US and it's allies attempted to attack Germany. Most likely D-day would not have occurred in the manner, place, and time in which it did.
russians did excellent job at stalingrad, but the price was very dear in terms of military and civilian loses. ood thing for them was that... no one cared for that back then. peoples lives where less then worthless for soviet regime
That's not true at all...actually, if the Americans hadn't been there the soviets would have collapsed. Stalin himself said without American aid '...we would not be able to cope because we lost so much of our industry.'
To the Soviet Union the US supplied through Lend/Lease: 56.6% of soviet rails, 1,900 trains, 57.8% of aviation fuel, 53% of all explosives, 77,900 jeeps, 151,000 light trucks, over 200,000 Studebaker army trucks, half the wartime supply of copper, aluminum, and rubber tires...and finally a half pound of nourishment for every soviet soldier...every day of the war.
I would suggest you take your own advice from an earlier comment you made and "do some research" before commenting on things you obviously know very little about.
actually hitler had lost in north africa way before america even came to europe lol, he lost because he didnt give them the resources needed to win otherwise they probably would have. it was the obsession with the eastern front that made them lose it not the americans.
Hitler's greatest mistake of the war was NOT securing North Africa and the Med in the Summer of 1941. As Manstein, Raeder and Rommel all insisted- it could have been easily done. Germany's strategic and logistical situation would then be almost unbeatable; however, Hitler cared not for that flank- his eyes were only staring east at Russia. Stalin couldn't have attacked Germany in 1941- the Red Army wasn't even deployed for war- nor would he attack Germany peroid!
@BladerunnerNYC You should read Adam Tooze's book When Titans Clash. The book is a study about the nazi economy. In the book Tooze points out the reasons for the invasion in the east from an economic point of view.
his greatest mistake was declaring war on america. america didnt even declared war on germany. hitler could have won north africa if america wasnt in europe. so your north africa thing doesnt matter
@teslagod2003 yes, that was the story that the generals gave out. But I think there is a lot of evidence that it was they who botched things up and blamed Hitler for it. The books to read on this topic are Sönke Neitzel's, who shows that Hitler helped them get the war they wanted and that they botched the Russian campaign not Hitler. One or two of them have been translated into English.
attcking wont be the idea in the cold war,it'll be a matter of who can drop the nuke faster and at better targets,as well as who can endure these nukes more,would be the winner,tsk...
why send millions of your troops,if you could send the nukes,tsk...
@teslagod2003 That is the slant German generals put about after the war: that they were geniuses but he was stupid, that they were peace-loving but he wanted war. I don't believe it, and I think the latest scholarship based on 64,427 secretly taped conversations of German generals-prisons of war at Trent Park confirm. Just as they denied losing WWI (Ger was betrayed by [jewish] Socialist), they lied about the culpability in WWII too.
The other known and producing petroleum fields worldwide were these: Iraq & Persia (Iran) accounted for 5.4%.
the NEI (Dutch East Indies) 2.7%.
Romania 2.4%.
the British Empire (Malaysia, Burma, and British Borneo) 2.0%.
The Arabian and North African oil fields had not yet been found nor developed. UK imports of petroleum early in the war were running around 11-12 million metric tons (2,200 lbs).
The Persian Gulf was not nearly as significant an oil producer in WWII as it is now. In 1939, the US accounted for 60.4% of GLOPAL PETROLEUM PRODUCTION, and Latin America another 15.3%, so more than three quarters of the world's petroleum production was in the New World (Western Hemisphere). The USSR accounted for the largest single chunk of the remaining production, 10.6% (at that time) which came from both Baku and the Maikop and Grozny fields.
I saw that movie also. That quiagmire made a mockery out of those elite German forces. They had no place in that quagmire. Its like sending the best army in the world into the eye of a hurricane.
Or at least give them some heavy artillery with which to defend themselves. The prospect of shooting Russian tanks with pistols would have made any army retreat....
Have to admire the Russians for enduring. But it wasn't the red army that won Stalingrad. It was the ungogly Russian weather, and poor planning by the German high command.
The Red Army's asymmetrical tactics made it impossible for the germans to bring the superior armor and air support to bear in stalingrad. This is what made the Red Army victorious, not their winter. The winter only exacerbated what was an already doomed application of tactics by the germans.
Hitler was a meathead, that much is clear, but what does it say about the Germans that they were crazy enough to follow that lunatic over the side of a cliff. The first Russian winter should have been enough to get some Germans motivated to kill Hitler. But they let him lead them into Stalingrad and still he survived to perpetrate more atrocities. What a waste. The Germans needed a Uber-Kraut brave enough to take one for the team and kill that bastard early on. A pity nobody stepped forward.
The most amazing thing is how everyone, from the wealthiest and best educated down to the peasants in the field, believed totally in this uneducated Austrian misfit and all because he suddenly ended unemployment by spending money like water (the first to practice Keynesianism on the proper scale). Trouble is he had no plan to cut spending and reduce the debt his armaments program created with the result that the conquest of other nation's assets became a necessity.
thanks to the soviets, the world was saved. people believe that the Brits, France and US played a key role in the war to prevent the nazis but it is wrong.
US was involved in the pacific war against japan and it was impossible for them to ferry millions of troops to europe against the nazis.
France had already capitulated in a week.
The Brits could only defend their but never attack the Nazis.
It is only the soviets with their Counter offensive which brought the end of Nazi Germany
The Americans played a vital role on the west too. true that the Russians go to Berlin first, but even if Russia had no army America (at that time) had more industrial power than the world combined.
We were all in it together! The Soviets were superb!! The British were the first to challange Hitler, then hold out, rally the world against Germany and finally defeat them in North Africa, Italy and France. The Americans supplied Russia and Britain with incredible amounts of material and food supplies. They also fought bravely and made their contribution on the battlefield. There is no one power that won this war. We all won it TOGETHER!
Yeah, me and my friends got into a bar fight with a group of other guys once. My friends Joe, Nigel, and Luc ganged on one puny guy while they left me to deal with four other burly guys, whose asses I kicked. But hey, WE WON THAT FIGHT TOGETHER!
Do I have to spell it out for you? Which ever country you are supposed to represent--as taking on the 4 burly guys and won--the imbalance between the western allies does not correspond to that ratio. The Russians fought a concentrated land battle of tank and infantry in the East. GB and US fought a more scattered, land, sea and air battles against Ger, It and Ja. Everybody had burly adversaries. Having said that, the Russians did indeed fight 2-3 times more German division than the GB and US.
Above all, the US supplied the Russians with everything imaginable to support themselves and to fight the Germans. The variety and quantity of supplies the US sent boggle the mind. And don't forget the greatest of all--spam. For 5 years the US fed the world on spam, and most of those who ate it loved it. They had not eaten so well in decades. Some Russians like to think they were left alone to take on the might of Hitler's armed forces, and some westerners have abetted them, but it isn't true!
Lend-Lease deliveries never surpassed Soviet industrial production; and represented only a fraction of materiel used. While it was helpful, it certainly was not decisive.
look, I am not claiming foreign aid was greater than Soviet production; I am only saying, having once read the figures of what was sent, that the quantities of raw materials, food, trucks, jeeps, etc. were enormous. The Soviets performed miracles of production themselves in the winter of 1941-42 and made the finest tank of the war, fine fighter aircraft and deadly rockets. But Roosevelt filled Stalin's shopping list. I make this point to show just one way we were a good ally for the Soviets!
wrong wrong wrong!, Countries populations where starved of grain and basic necessities so Russians can get their supplies, dont give yourself too much credit there buddy!
Hell yea what do u think the trans Iranian railroad that the Germans helped build, was used for. It transported Middle Eastern Oil and unlimited supplies of grain from Iran and neighboring countries, on top of limitless supplies from the USA to Russia. This my friend is what made the win possible for Russia, its amazing how long the Germans lasted facing these incredible odds!
What kind of clown are you? Iran and Saudi Arabian production was way ahead of Baku LOL!!! what a clow, end of your story jack ass. That oild was gushing and it was high!!!!!!! You are very stupid.
Here jack ass read.The oil export increased to its highest level of 10.16 million tons with the highest royalties of 3.54 million pounds in 1937. It dropped in 1938 and the shah wrote to Cadman as follows: "You will of course agree how unpleasant it for a progressive country like Iran, which must administer its affairs according to a definite programme [of modernisation]".
Yes, but I think you underestimate the extent to which the USSR's own productive efforts fueled its war effort. They performed amazing feats of production in the new Western Siberian industrial cities Stalin built during the first and second 5 Year Plans, and of course the USSR also produced vast quantities of petroleum.
The US certainly did supply the USSR, especially tinned foods, but the USSR vastly outproduced the Germans.
The thesis--without the US they would have lost--is unproven!
stalin is just merely buying his time,he has huge industrial force in his own arsenal,though he welcomed the support from britain and US,its mainly because he needed to use it to buy the time he needs...
and he has to be friendly to his new friends and new ally...
and denying their support could hurt their new alliance and their new friendship...
@teslagod2003 The USSR spend more on defence during the 20's and 30's than any other country, but most of it was outdated faced with Hitler's new tanks and aircraft. It was the productive miracle of the Winter of 1941-42 that put Stalin's new weapons in the hands of the Red Armed forces: the T-34, Katushas and Stormavik. US trucks and jeeps motorized the Red Army. I personally believe the USA helped the USSR enorously, which is why Stalin deferred to Roosevelt so much.
You're absolutely right! Except that after the war the British were dependent on the Americans in a way the Russians were not. The miracle of our time is that cracks are beginning to appear in that dependence.
@teslagod2003 That's usually the case when an alliance is made: you have a common enemy. Funny that Stalin only agreed to this when his own former ally, Nazi Germany, attacked him.
@jlnijholt um i dunno if you knew this,but there was no real alliance between the nazis and the reds,hitler need some breathing space,as well as stalin,they both have their motives at the nazi-soviet pact,they both benifited on it,but for stalin's side,he sure show some generosity to show how serious the reds are to the pact,but in reality,he's buying his time,coz his army is under reformation,tsk...
@mc0558 Well, the T-34 was already in production - though limited - in June 1941, when Barbarossa commenced. Having lost 3 million men in June-December 1941 alone - before the winteroffensive - meant they were basically out of reserves. The winteroffensive itself would have been impossible if the Siberian divisions could not have been moved form the Manchurian border.
@jlnijholt um,they are not out of reserves,most of the red army are still in reformation,that's why they have to improvise while most of their troops are training,tsk...
@jlnijholt True! But throughout the winter of 1941-42, Stalin was energetically producing tanks and weaponry of all kinds in the new Western Siberia industrial cities and raising new armies in Russia and the Asian republics. There was a minor miracle going on. The nation was rising to the challenge with remarkable clarity of purpose.
@mc0558 That was a wise decision on Stalin's part, but the loss of 3 million men and most of miltary equipment in the first six months of Barbarossa should also be written on his account. And ofcourse it wasn't Stalin who rebuilt those thousands of factories, it was the workers who put in 15 hour workshifts on meagre rations and no comfort at all, except that they were saving the nation.
@jlnijholt Stalin usually chose able assistants, but he was the chief. It was he who decided to build the new industrial cities in Western Siberia out of reach of German bombers. He organize the resources to do so. Yes, the workers did it (not the bosses); Stalin always gave the credit to workers. WWII was the people's victory (not the generals'), Stalin affirmed that. He was a communist, and communists love the workers. Feigned or not, he always played down his own role.
@jlnijholt yes it was the workers,but without stalin,they cant built at all,he's the one who gathered up the resources,supplies and workers to build them up.stalin is known as man of the poeple specially the poor,not a man for the rich men,where the west were really in the side of the rich men.that's why the west were doing their best to destroy stalin and his legacy,it's just sad that his successors were no diffirent to the western leaders,very corrupt,profiteers,liars,etc...
Middle eastern oil production at the time were slim to nil. And the Baku oil fields were the USSR's major oil source, that's why hitler was so keen on invading the USSR. If it was known that there were huge oil reserves in the middle east, then hitler would have just gone there instead of fighting his way through russia first.
Saudi Aramco dates back to May 29, 1933, when the Saudi Arabian government signed a concessionary agreement with Standard Oil of California (Socal), allowing the company to explore Saudi Arabia for oi
that is according to your fantasy story asshole. I can reference legitimate sites and writings, what can you reference other than that tiny brain of yours?
so 10.6 million tons per year is not mass production, what was baku producing 10 billion tons. Fuck your idiotic ass man, i am through with a jack ass such as yourself.
If Hitler went south he had to face all the US and British troops and supplies going from the persian guf to the north of Iran, there is no way the USA would have allowed that to happen guy!
Another huge supply route was Nome, Alaska. Russian freighters ferried supplies across the Bering Straits. They were put on the TransSiberian Railroad and sent Westwards to industrial cities in Western Siberia.
I knew a man who, as a young soldier, was stationed there to work as a translator with the Soviet captains. He learned about the true nature of Stalin's "socialist" system in his conversations with them.
As for holding out, Germany mobilized all of Western Europe for its war effort!
@jeffman3003 The Russians got a lot from outside, but it is a mistake to suppose that overwhelmingly Russia's victory in this war was not do to her own productive capacity, the superiority of here weaponry, unity under the superb wartime leadership of Stalin, and the courage of her own men and women in battle. They built the greatest Armed Force in the War. They cut the Germans to pieces, and thank God for it. It saved the lives of our men once we had invaded France.
@mc0558 WTF superb wartime leadership of that fucking murderer of millions? Superb my ass, when The Wermacht was at the gates of Moscow the bastard pissed in his pants and fled. It was all due to the US and UK lend lease and the Winter. don't give that bastard credit when non is deserved.
@jeffman3003 You are clearly a simple soul who needs historical characters to be cut of a single cloth. Revolutionary terrorist and ass murderer=cowardly, incompetent, dependent on others who bring home the bacon. Otherwise the moral universe would be out of kilter and that can't be. Satin would not use one of his servants to destroy another of his servants.
@jlnijholt The purges brought down despised Com Party bigwigs and were hugely popular. (Yes!) Armed Forces purge got rid of civil war deadwood, not enough as the defeats of 1941 demonstrated (Voroshilov/Budenny). Gulag camps provided slave labour that built infrastructure, elctrical power, etc. cheaply. Evil, yes, but beneficial to Russia's war-making ability, and that is what concerns me.
@jeffman3003 While thousands fled the city and the government left Stalin never did. As for "superb wartime leadership", that is ofcourse another matter.
@jlnijholt Stalin's military mistakes were made before the war and by generals like Voroshilov and Budenny at the start of the war, who were out of their depth facing the Wehrmacht. Overy points out, the RA learned modern warfare from the German invader. By1943 they'd added a few insights of their own adapted to Russian conditions. USSR beat Germans (1) by mastering German tactics, (2) by producing industrial miracles of their own, (3) US aid (4) by being stalwart and brave.
@jeffman3003 continued from above: the scale of Russia's prduction of weaponry of its own design and manufacture is a matter of record. Russia always had a small intellectual elite that were amongst the best. Russia lost WWI because she fell apart politically; in 1941-42 under Stalin, she held together because he had eliminated rivals beforehand. UK & US boys suffered less because the Russians under Stalin had kicked the guts out of the Wehrmacht BEFORE they took it on!
@jeffman3003 I don't like your tone! Either you deal with the arguments I put forward or you keep you mouth shut or I will block you. I am giving you a learned and insightful history lessons here. Pay attention! If you have knowledge to put in play or arguments to make, do so, and I will deal with them. But be civil or I will cut you off.
@mc0558 well,what can you to the people who knew nothing but hatred?they hated everything and everyone that the western propaganda said should be hated,tsk....
it'll be better to just ignore the haters and those who wants to spread their hate and the power of their western propagandas,tsk...
What a pity can You feel to murderer who comes to your home and kills your wife and children? Greetings for Russians. We must forgive ourselves our history. Polish :)
lukaszpjanus1 1 year ago
hitler didnt give a shit about his soldiers unless they were winning battles he could easily have saved thousands from stalingrad
mattbatley1 1 year ago
It still amazes me after studying WW2 for 30+ years that those Prussian Generals didn't kill Hitler out of frustration. No conspiracy required, no "well organized operation". Just pull out your Luger and shoot the Bastard in a staff meeting. These Generals were men that had devoted their entire lives to studying warfare and attended the finest Military Academies. Hitler was a Meth addicted Austrian Corporal who lacked any formal military education. (continued next post...)
randy109 1 year ago
Continued- Hitler lacked the education to even gain admittance to a Military Academy. Any one of those Prussian Generals could have killed Hitler and spared their beloved Fatherland its utter destruction. Possibly it was the personal Oath they had all sworn in the late 30's, perhaps it was cowardice. Hitler was the leader of a cult of personality, but I doubt his Prussian Generals "admired" the little Sociopath. We will never know why no one acted to save their Nation...
randy109 1 year ago
@randy109 There are 40 confirmed attempts on Hitlers life. The most popular one was operation Valcary... But, trust me those Generals tried to kill Hitler or at least some of them... Stalin was smart... He killed Generals when they gained to much popularity :D
havee3333333 1 year ago
@havee3333333 Really? Operation Valcary? wow... where did you learn to spell that word?
rikardduque 1 year ago
Comment removed
havee3333333 1 year ago
@havee3333333 Valkyries are the Nordic warrior goddesses that would select brave warriors on the field of battle and take them to Valhalla - the hall where Odin would serve them a feast during the night and have them war during the day in eternal paradise. Hitler named his contingency plan "Valkyrie" because it suited his taste for Nordic Mythology.
rikardduque 1 year ago
@havee3333333 Valkyrie is not the name of the man who had the plan, the man who had the plan was Claus Schenk Graf von Stauffenberg and what he actually did was modify the original "Valkyrie" plan drafted by Hitler. So, as you see, I do worry about history, and your spelling simply revealed how little you actually knew.... "my friend". Your spelling is a symptom of your lack of education.
rikardduque 1 year ago
Comment removed
havee3333333 1 year ago
@rikardduque
I know enough about this you fucking retard I bet you just watched the movie and you think your a bad ass now... It was a guy who was a high ranking officer who had a plan to kill Hitler in a meeting. He put a dynamite inside a bag but wanted to put 2 inside it but didn't get the chance. He went into the room and placed the bag under the table. When it exploded only 4 people died and Hitler survived. I learned this 2 years ago so I'm sorry if I forgot some shit alright bro?
havee3333333 1 year ago
@havee3333333 hehe... Good Wikipedia moment there for ya! I read Roger Moorhouse's article "A Good German?: the questionable sainthood of Claus von Stauffenberg" ... but yeah, I also watched the movie with Tom Cruise and Kenneth Branagh, which is clearly something not even you did since the title of the freakin' movie is "Valkyrie" the way you couldn't even spell.
rikardduque 1 year ago
@havee3333333 I noticed you even mis-spelled the name of the city you live in on your youtube profile! You wrote San Fransisco!! HAHA.. I truly hope you're 12 years old....
rikardduque 1 year ago
@rikardduque Wow how immature im ending this conversation as you do not deserve to talk to humans.
havee3333333 1 year ago
@havee3333333 Hey.. at least I can spell better than a 3rd grader. By the way, why is it that I do not deserve to talk to humans? You got any solid arguments for that, Mr. "Valcary"?
rikardduque 1 year ago
@havee3333333
Ah yes, the Tom Cruise school of history.
And here's yours:
watch?v=aEQcsuXnnnc&feature=related
anonUK 1 year ago
@anonUK
lol
havee3333333 1 year ago
"12 cases of contraceptive"
Im sorry...WHAT?!
spudnick3490 1 year ago
I found myself actually feeling bad for the Germans here.
gcard2112 1 year ago
lol a plane load of contraceptive, why would they need that ever?
PrettyBrg 1 year ago
@PrettyBrg They all fucked each other because there were no women left and they knew they were going to die. Probably so they didn't get any diseases or something...
havee3333333 1 year ago
We all owe Russia and the Ruskis a massive debt of gratitude -on we go
jnmklo9 1 year ago
7:39 That guy has two bullet holes in his helmet... lol
13lackLight 1 year ago
We fought for the future
destroyed the invaders
and brought to our homeland
the laurels of fame...
0NoName9 1 year ago
COME IN STALINGRAD
THIS IS STALINGRAD
THE FRONT ON THE VOLGA
THIS IS NOT A FAKE MESSAGE BY THE WAY
OH, AND THIS IS STALINGRAD
0NoName9 1 year ago
One of my earliest memories is of watching this tape on cassette, and I was just staggered by the scale and sheer size of it all, and I still am this day. All those men...literally thousands and thousands stretching from horizon to horizon, as far as the eye could see, and you can bet at least half of them went to their deaths. Its just incredible.
FightingForFreedom23 1 year ago
this was a dog fight to the death.
Dukeoftruth 1 year ago
This was the first military defeat that even the German propaganda machine could not lie about.
NYerintransit 1 year ago
Tank you mein furher for der opportunity to freezen der toes und der fingers too! Vat a marvelous opportunity it iz! Heil Hitlah!!!
TextCannon 1 year ago
that must have been some scene [thousands of horsemen charging in the midst of winter]
dodge96neon 1 year ago
Stalingrad in all actuality Stalingrad is the most important battle of the war because once the germans were defeated there the russian army lead by the victorious general Vasilli Kruchiv headed towards berlin and destroyed the remainder of german presence outside of germany
cheesemuffin94 1 year ago 3
Those cases of condoms the Luftwaffe delievered may not have been a mistake. Every day the 6th Army stayed in Stalingrad they were f*cked!
randy95023 1 year ago
This episode is so bleak and depressing.
Agamemnon862 1 year ago
@Agamemnon862 None of the episodes are a laugh-a-minute!
TheBelovedButterfly 1 year ago
@Agamemnon862 Let me clear some of the gloom. At 1:42, this episode covers and shows the most important moment of all WW2 other than the A Bomb drop. The tide turned in favor of the Russians and by extension to the Allies at that very moment. Just before those two Russians soldiers reached each other, Germany was wining, they started to loose right after and never recovered. Almost makes me shiver !!!
syl171 1 year ago
4:20 "Though it did once deliver a planeload of ground pepper, and 12 cases of contraceptives."
Yeah, seasonings and 12 crates of condoms are gonna help the Wermacht hold out against the Red Army!
theotherscullycapguy 1 year ago
I was wondering why there have been so few interviews of the German veterans during this Stalingrad espisode of the World at War.., like they have on the others. Then occured to me: only 1-20 Germans got back home alive...
VipersHockeyLeftD 1 year ago 2
@VipersHockeyLeftD
The German magazine Stern ran an interview with one survivor in late 2007. He attributed his survival to being a keep-fit enthusiast before he was captured. He was 92 at the time he was interviewed, and living in Berlin.
SteveKaczynski 1 year ago
Really reinforces how Hitler's ego resulted in so many needless deaths, including those on his own side.
Thornfox 1 year ago
king charles of sweden, napoleon, the germans of WW1 and the nazi devil threw hell at russia and somehow the country managed to survive. russia can be hit, can be bombed, you can slaughter millions, but russia can never be beaten. It is just a military impossibility. No other society has peered into the abyss of annhilation more times than the russians,and no other society has prevailed.
kudolution 1 year ago 5
it's kinda funny,but effective...
the russians' strategy is to hold up till winter and only attack during winter,where their army could fight better in great advantage against the well trained,actually ggreatly trained,german army...
i'll say it's very brilliant of them and i wonder the germans didnt get this plan n strategy and tried to do their best to counter it,tsk...
teslagod2003 1 year ago
@teslagod2003 In 1814, General Barclay de Tolly inadvertently discovered Russia's greatest defensive tactic--trading space for time. BcT kept retreating, because he was afraid to do battle with the great Napoleon. Finally Alexander I dismissed him and appointed Katuzov in his place, with wide autonomous powers, but with the promise of doing battle. The battle accomplished nothing but time destroyed Napoleon.
mc0558 1 year ago
@mc0558 huh?is there anything i said that has to include napoleon and made you tell me that story?
teslagod2003 1 year ago
@teslagod2003 This was part of a much longer discourse to show that it was more than just "hold up till winter". It is retreat into the interior without giving all out battle, destroy everything in the enemy's path that can sustain an occupier, employ guerrilla attacks to disrupt supplies and communications. It began with BdT, was successfully used against the Germans and would have been used against us if, during the cold war, we had been so foolish as to attack.
mc0558 1 year ago
the invasion begins...
HungerStrikeUs 1 year ago
the invasion begins...
HungerStrikeUs 1 year ago
8 million guys who will sleep in the snow, have accurate and durable rifles and artillery and will drink 3 ounces of straight industrial Vodka before charging me. I'm freezing to death, 1,500 miles from home, hungry and haven't slept more than cat naps in weeks. I don't care how disciplined the Germans were they must have been quite demoralized and rightfully so! Germans outran their supply lines and back home they believed their own propaganda. German soldiers deserve SOME pity...
randy95023 1 year ago 25
@randy95023 I applaud the courage and willingness of the German soldier to fight to the death for his comrades and his country. He deserved better than Hitler and his thugs.
rangerbobcat 1 year ago 3
@rangerbobcat -You are absolutely right!
randy109 1 year ago
@rangerbobcat I think not every act of barbarism committed by Germans at this time was at Hitler's behest. I think the ordinary German soldier murdered lots of civilians and enemy soldiers on his own without any order from anyone. They were arrogant, superior, and felt entitled to dispose of lesser breeds as they wished. Similarly, WWII wasn't just Hitler's doing; the General Staff was a lot more involved than they were inclined to admit once defeated.
mc0558 1 year ago
@randy95023 No, they don't. Remember, they had behaved disgustingly when in Russia and killed over 95% of the Russian POWs; and wherever the German army went, they were the warm-up act for the death squads, the SS, the Gestapo. They'd enjoyed strutting around posing as the Master Race, turning a blind eye to atrocities and braying support for that monotesticular freak with the Charlie Chaplin moustache: the eastern front was the flip side of that - and tough luck!
TheBelovedButterfly 1 year ago
@TheBelovedButterfly One must admire TheBelovedButterfly's mastery of Shakespeare's favorite language. LOL
syl171 1 year ago
@syl171 I agree... one absolutely must. But it was Shakespeare's ONLY language, not his favourite; and if he was commenting on here, he would use more expletives.
TheBelovedButterfly 1 year ago
@TheBelovedButterfly
monotesticular freak! ROTFLMAO!
TheDevilsBit 1 year ago
@TheDevilsBit and thank god, that one didn't work!
TheBelovedButterfly 1 year ago
@randy95023 no they dont , they deserved what they where receivin , it was STILL more humane then what they where giving
isitcosimblack 1 year ago
@randy95023 nein! ze war musts go on!
juggep80 1 year ago
4:35 holy shit, red army snowmobiles!!!!! eat your heart out bear cavalry! you too skeleton army!
GOfilms01 1 year ago 11
LOL!
Danny77uk 1 year ago
@GOfilms01 they should have unleashed their apocalypse tanks,kirov airships,tesla tanks,v3 launchers,siege choppers,and terror drones in the whole germany...
and no matter how much of them got destroyed or lost,they could be easily replaced...
:D
teslagod2003 1 year ago
Ground Pepper and Contraceptives.... good job Luftwaffe.
Birdiche 1 year ago 3
@Birdiche well what the hell more do you need. you could do alot with those two things. burns like hell when you combine them though.
GOfilms01 1 year ago
The German army was by far, the best the world had ever seen. No army could have beaten it alone. Sad that they fought for a fruitcake.
ryan3571 1 year ago
In terms of efficiency, organisation and actual troop and equipment numbers, I have to say the Red Army was the best in the world, especially in 1943.
ellisbaker93 1 year ago
@ellisbaker93 yes, I think you're right there, I was thinking of early WWII, but then things changed on both sides, Germans got clumsy, Soviets became smarter, and in the end, despite heavy losses the Red Army came back and triumphed over the German Army (and its allies). Thanks for sharing an important point.
ryan3571 1 year ago
@ellisbaker93 i hate to say this,i'm a stalin fan and soviet fan,but its true that the red army isnt best in efficiency and organization...
they're just too damn many and their generals are also great commanders who knows how to take advantage of their own strength...
its in 1943...
but i'll second that that the red army is the best in the world...
teslagod2003 1 year ago
@ryan3571 They were also hopped up on meth!
mc0558 1 year ago
Comment removed
mc0558 1 year ago
go get em Ruskies
jtjcp88 1 year ago 2
This has been flagged as spam show
This is an example of what civilised cultured society are capable of...the most bloodiest battle in human history that we know of...this is history now, all we can do is look back and reflect and make sure it never happens again
dvega1 1 year ago
lool 1:43 guy trips
ToobatubbaTubbatooba 1 year ago
The thing is, this happened 70 years ago so im betting neither of you have any first hand experience. It's just a video
furstguy2467 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
stupid hitler he lost the war for the nazis he was a great speaker administrator and politician but he was a bad general and he had so many great generals at his disposal if he would have let them do their job now all the jews would be dead and we all would have lived in a great nazi society
TANTAREANU 2 years ago
They certainly wouldn't have been able to take on the German army alone that's for sure, but if Hitler had all of Europe it would have been another story. That's what I meant when I said they could not have won without the USSR, so you pay attention to what people say genius.
xdeliriumx1 2 years ago
@xdeliriumx1
Of course the USSR bore the brunt of the German attack...however, given the location, size, strength, and industrial potential of the US there is no real means of making any sort of definitive 'certain,' conclusion that the US and it's allies, (minus the USSR), would have been unable to defeat Germany.
johnnyphoenix74 2 years ago
Besides, the Germans would most likely not have been able to mount any kind of amphibious operation across the Atlantic...Keep in mind, they could not even do so against England...and that was before Soviet intervention...Indeed, actually at that point the USSR was supplying the GERMANS.
johnnyphoenix74 2 years ago 2
...the germans would have had to either strike out across the middle east or construct an 'impenetrable' fortress Europe...either way, giving time for US industrial potential to be maximized. A United States at full capacity would have been more than a match for all Axis powers combined.
johnnyphoenix74 2 years ago
You might want to read before answering comments , I know much about ww2 and I know the americans offered support.
But it is a fact that without the soviet union the US would not have won, honestly you think they could have done d day that successfully without the USSR fighting the Germans in the East? They were able to take huge losses and weaken the wehrmacht. I never said the Americans didn't play a big part in it which is what your implying so pay attention to what you read Einstein
xdeliriumx1 2 years ago
@xdeliriumx1
" it is a fact that without the soviet union the US would not have won, honestly you think they could have done d day that successfully without the USSR?"
That's your OPINION, not a FACT. Learn the difference. Anyways, the Soviets NOT being involved in the war would have changed the WHOLE dynamic in which the US and it's allies attempted to attack Germany. Most likely D-day would not have occurred in the manner, place, and time in which it did.
johnnyphoenix74 2 years ago
Comment removed
teslagod2003 1 year ago
@xdeliriumx1 where's einstein?isn't he german?
teslagod2003 1 year ago
russians did excellent job at stalingrad, but the price was very dear in terms of military and civilian loses. ood thing for them was that... no one cared for that back then. peoples lives where less then worthless for soviet regime
hzj79 2 years ago
Must have been good to be a member of the massive russian force who got through and saved the city
fecto3210 2 years ago
War is hell.
lancer89032 2 years ago 2
if the soviets hdant been there u can bet america would never have won
xdeliriumx1 2 years ago
very true,
TheRedRuski 2 years ago
@xdeliriumx1
That's not true at all...actually, if the Americans hadn't been there the soviets would have collapsed. Stalin himself said without American aid '...we would not be able to cope because we lost so much of our industry.'
johnnyphoenix74 2 years ago 2
@xdeliriumx1
To the Soviet Union the US supplied through Lend/Lease: 56.6% of soviet rails, 1,900 trains, 57.8% of aviation fuel, 53% of all explosives, 77,900 jeeps, 151,000 light trucks, over 200,000 Studebaker army trucks, half the wartime supply of copper, aluminum, and rubber tires...and finally a half pound of nourishment for every soviet soldier...every day of the war.
johnnyphoenix74 2 years ago
@xdeliriumx1
I would suggest you take your own advice from an earlier comment you made and "do some research" before commenting on things you obviously know very little about.
johnnyphoenix74 2 years ago
actually hitler had lost in north africa way before america even came to europe lol, he lost because he didnt give them the resources needed to win otherwise they probably would have. it was the obsession with the eastern front that made them lose it not the americans.
xdeliriumx1 2 years ago
It would have taken the nazis at least a year to get the oilfields back into production. No chance.
5000433 2 years ago
The soviet troops on the left seem to be giving high 5s at 1:58
5000433 2 years ago
Hitler's greatest mistake of the war was NOT securing North Africa and the Med in the Summer of 1941. As Manstein, Raeder and Rommel all insisted- it could have been easily done. Germany's strategic and logistical situation would then be almost unbeatable; however, Hitler cared not for that flank- his eyes were only staring east at Russia. Stalin couldn't have attacked Germany in 1941- the Red Army wasn't even deployed for war- nor would he attack Germany peroid!
BladerunnerNYC 2 years ago
@BladerunnerNYC You should read Adam Tooze's book When Titans Clash. The book is a study about the nazi economy. In the book Tooze points out the reasons for the invasion in the east from an economic point of view.
Matiyuuu 2 years ago
his greatest mistake was declaring war on america. america didnt even declared war on germany. hitler could have won north africa if america wasnt in europe. so your north africa thing doesnt matter
lifes40123 2 years ago
@lifes40123 no its not,hitler's big mistake is not listening to his generals and being and idiot commander...
and hitler would really love to declare war on america,he's just waiting for the japs to strike...
why?u idiot americans were the most stupid "NEUTRAL" country in the world!
teslagod2003 1 year ago
@teslagod2003 yes, that was the story that the generals gave out. But I think there is a lot of evidence that it was they who botched things up and blamed Hitler for it. The books to read on this topic are Sönke Neitzel's, who shows that Hitler helped them get the war they wanted and that they botched the Russian campaign not Hitler. One or two of them have been translated into English.
mc0558 1 year ago
@mc0558 and that's no longer my concern,tsk...
attcking wont be the idea in the cold war,it'll be a matter of who can drop the nuke faster and at better targets,as well as who can endure these nukes more,would be the winner,tsk...
why send millions of your troops,if you could send the nukes,tsk...
teslagod2003 1 year ago
@teslagod2003 In a nuclear armed world, using nuclear weapons is a strategic absurdity. Sane strategy is still about occupying and holding ground.
mc0558 1 year ago
@teslagod2003 That is the slant German generals put about after the war: that they were geniuses but he was stupid, that they were peace-loving but he wanted war. I don't believe it, and I think the latest scholarship based on 64,427 secretly taped conversations of German generals-prisons of war at Trent Park confirm. Just as they denied losing WWI (Ger was betrayed by [jewish] Socialist), they lied about the culpability in WWII too.
mc0558 1 year ago
@mc0558 im not argueing about that thing on german generals or other gemans wanting some peace of revenge and reversal of ww1...
however,that occupying and holding the group can be done after you nuke up your enemy...
teslagod2003 1 year ago
The other known and producing petroleum fields worldwide were these: Iraq & Persia (Iran) accounted for 5.4%.
the NEI (Dutch East Indies) 2.7%.
Romania 2.4%.
the British Empire (Malaysia, Burma, and British Borneo) 2.0%.
The Arabian and North African oil fields had not yet been found nor developed. UK imports of petroleum early in the war were running around 11-12 million metric tons (2,200 lbs).
BladerunnerNYC 2 years ago
The Persian Gulf was not nearly as significant an oil producer in WWII as it is now. In 1939, the US accounted for 60.4% of GLOPAL PETROLEUM PRODUCTION, and Latin America another 15.3%, so more than three quarters of the world's petroleum production was in the New World (Western Hemisphere). The USSR accounted for the largest single chunk of the remaining production, 10.6% (at that time) which came from both Baku and the Maikop and Grozny fields.
BladerunnerNYC 2 years ago
The reenactment of the Soviet Troops meeting is kind of funny.
BatteryEaters 2 years ago
I love the two blokes who fall over on the way in. Must have been a rare bit of fun for them!
crimpo 2 years ago 2
I watched the movie "Stalingrad" which was beyond discription in the suffering and horror of the movie. It was beyond pitiful.
PotatoGunsRule 2 years ago
I saw that movie also. That quiagmire made a mockery out of those elite German forces. They had no place in that quagmire. Its like sending the best army in the world into the eye of a hurricane.
jeffman3003 2 years ago
Note to self: "Next time we invade russia and make it to stalingrad, leave the italians, romanians and hungarians at home."
geekintheperimeter 2 years ago
Or at least give them some heavy artillery with which to defend themselves. The prospect of shooting Russian tanks with pistols would have made any army retreat....
Kralhonj 2 years ago
I love this scene, when the two soviet attacking groups link up with each other, giving bear-hugs to each other.
maanboy 2 years ago
Have to admire the Russians for enduring. But it wasn't the red army that won Stalingrad. It was the ungogly Russian weather, and poor planning by the German high command.
opiewontaylor 2 years ago
The Red Army's asymmetrical tactics made it impossible for the germans to bring the superior armor and air support to bear in stalingrad. This is what made the Red Army victorious, not their winter. The winter only exacerbated what was an already doomed application of tactics by the germans.
redmunkee 2 years ago
opiewontaylor
You don't know what you are talking about!
mc0558 2 years ago
Hitler was a meathead, that much is clear, but what does it say about the Germans that they were crazy enough to follow that lunatic over the side of a cliff. The first Russian winter should have been enough to get some Germans motivated to kill Hitler. But they let him lead them into Stalingrad and still he survived to perpetrate more atrocities. What a waste. The Germans needed a Uber-Kraut brave enough to take one for the team and kill that bastard early on. A pity nobody stepped forward.
jburke55 2 years ago
The most amazing thing is how everyone, from the wealthiest and best educated down to the peasants in the field, believed totally in this uneducated Austrian misfit and all because he suddenly ended unemployment by spending money like water (the first to practice Keynesianism on the proper scale). Trouble is he had no plan to cut spending and reduce the debt his armaments program created with the result that the conquest of other nation's assets became a necessity.
mc0558 2 years ago
You have no idea about History Jew
indianpatriot 2 years ago
I know the history of the Jewish people quite well actually. Why? Do you have a fight to pick?
mc0558 2 years ago
yah thanks to the glory russians who fucked up half europe after ww2.....
Felduin 2 years ago
thanks to the soviets, the world was saved. people believe that the Brits, France and US played a key role in the war to prevent the nazis but it is wrong.
US was involved in the pacific war against japan and it was impossible for them to ferry millions of troops to europe against the nazis.
France had already capitulated in a week.
The Brits could only defend their but never attack the Nazis.
It is only the soviets with their Counter offensive which brought the end of Nazi Germany
indianpatriot 2 years ago 2
The Americans played a vital role on the west too. true that the Russians go to Berlin first, but even if Russia had no army America (at that time) had more industrial power than the world combined.
cujonuke 2 years ago
Indianpatriot
We were all in it together! The Soviets were superb!! The British were the first to challange Hitler, then hold out, rally the world against Germany and finally defeat them in North Africa, Italy and France. The Americans supplied Russia and Britain with incredible amounts of material and food supplies. They also fought bravely and made their contribution on the battlefield. There is no one power that won this war. We all won it TOGETHER!
mc0558 2 years ago
Yeah, me and my friends got into a bar fight with a group of other guys once. My friends Joe, Nigel, and Luc ganged on one puny guy while they left me to deal with four other burly guys, whose asses I kicked. But hey, WE WON THAT FIGHT TOGETHER!
redmunkee 2 years ago
That's not the way it was!
mc0558 2 years ago
Well said, articulate as always.
redmunkee 2 years ago
Do I have to spell it out for you? Which ever country you are supposed to represent--as taking on the 4 burly guys and won--the imbalance between the western allies does not correspond to that ratio. The Russians fought a concentrated land battle of tank and infantry in the East. GB and US fought a more scattered, land, sea and air battles against Ger, It and Ja. Everybody had burly adversaries. Having said that, the Russians did indeed fight 2-3 times more German division than the GB and US.
mc0558 2 years ago
Above all, the US supplied the Russians with everything imaginable to support themselves and to fight the Germans. The variety and quantity of supplies the US sent boggle the mind. And don't forget the greatest of all--spam. For 5 years the US fed the world on spam, and most of those who ate it loved it. They had not eaten so well in decades. Some Russians like to think they were left alone to take on the might of Hitler's armed forces, and some westerners have abetted them, but it isn't true!
mc0558 2 years ago 2
Lend-Lease deliveries never surpassed Soviet industrial production; and represented only a fraction of materiel used. While it was helpful, it certainly was not decisive.
redmunkee 2 years ago
look, I am not claiming foreign aid was greater than Soviet production; I am only saying, having once read the figures of what was sent, that the quantities of raw materials, food, trucks, jeeps, etc. were enormous. The Soviets performed miracles of production themselves in the winter of 1941-42 and made the finest tank of the war, fine fighter aircraft and deadly rockets. But Roosevelt filled Stalin's shopping list. I make this point to show just one way we were a good ally for the Soviets!
mc0558 2 years ago
wrong wrong wrong!, Countries populations where starved of grain and basic necessities so Russians can get their supplies, dont give yourself too much credit there buddy!
jeffman3003 2 years ago
Hell yea what do u think the trans Iranian railroad that the Germans helped build, was used for. It transported Middle Eastern Oil and unlimited supplies of grain from Iran and neighboring countries, on top of limitless supplies from the USA to Russia. This my friend is what made the win possible for Russia, its amazing how long the Germans lasted facing these incredible odds!
jeffman3003 2 years ago
HAHAHA, middle eastern oil reserves where not discovered or tapped until 1945! Get your facts straight.
redmunkee 2 years ago
OMG you really made an idiot of yourself with that statement! The Anglo-Persian Oil Company (APOC) was founded in 1908 and producing oil by 1908
jeffman3003 2 years ago
Mass production of oil in the middle east did not start until 1945. End of story.
redmunkee 2 years ago
What kind of clown are you? Iran and Saudi Arabian production was way ahead of Baku LOL!!! what a clow, end of your story jack ass. That oild was gushing and it was high!!!!!!! You are very stupid.
jeffman3003 2 years ago
Here jack ass read.The oil export increased to its highest level of 10.16 million tons with the highest royalties of 3.54 million pounds in 1937. It dropped in 1938 and the shah wrote to Cadman as follows: "You will of course agree how unpleasant it for a progressive country like Iran, which must administer its affairs according to a definite programme [of modernisation]".
jeffman3003 2 years ago
Yes, but I think you underestimate the extent to which the USSR's own productive efforts fueled its war effort. They performed amazing feats of production in the new Western Siberian industrial cities Stalin built during the first and second 5 Year Plans, and of course the USSR also produced vast quantities of petroleum.
The US certainly did supply the USSR, especially tinned foods, but the USSR vastly outproduced the Germans.
The thesis--without the US they would have lost--is unproven!
mc0558 2 years ago 2
@mc0558 yes its true...
stalin is just merely buying his time,he has huge industrial force in his own arsenal,though he welcomed the support from britain and US,its mainly because he needed to use it to buy the time he needs...
and he has to be friendly to his new friends and new ally...
and denying their support could hurt their new alliance and their new friendship...
teslagod2003 1 year ago
@teslagod2003 The USSR spend more on defence during the 20's and 30's than any other country, but most of it was outdated faced with Hitler's new tanks and aircraft. It was the productive miracle of the Winter of 1941-42 that put Stalin's new weapons in the hands of the Red Armed forces: the T-34, Katushas and Stormavik. US trucks and jeeps motorized the Red Army. I personally believe the USA helped the USSR enorously, which is why Stalin deferred to Roosevelt so much.
mc0558 1 year ago
@mc0558 well the big 3 were merely using each other for their own interest,sad to say,but its the truth...
they were only allies bcoz they got common enemy...
teslagod2003 1 year ago
@teslagod2003
You're absolutely right! Except that after the war the British were dependent on the Americans in a way the Russians were not. The miracle of our time is that cracks are beginning to appear in that dependence.
mc0558 1 year ago
@teslagod2003 That's usually the case when an alliance is made: you have a common enemy. Funny that Stalin only agreed to this when his own former ally, Nazi Germany, attacked him.
jlnijholt 1 year ago
@jlnijholt um i dunno if you knew this,but there was no real alliance between the nazis and the reds,hitler need some breathing space,as well as stalin,they both have their motives at the nazi-soviet pact,they both benifited on it,but for stalin's side,he sure show some generosity to show how serious the reds are to the pact,but in reality,he's buying his time,coz his army is under reformation,tsk...
teslagod2003 1 year ago
@mc0558 Well, the T-34 was already in production - though limited - in June 1941, when Barbarossa commenced. Having lost 3 million men in June-December 1941 alone - before the winteroffensive - meant they were basically out of reserves. The winteroffensive itself would have been impossible if the Siberian divisions could not have been moved form the Manchurian border.
jlnijholt 1 year ago
@jlnijholt um,they are not out of reserves,most of the red army are still in reformation,that's why they have to improvise while most of their troops are training,tsk...
teslagod2003 1 year ago
@teslagod2003 Wow, two more posts full of "information". Check a history book some time. Cheers.
jlnijholt 1 year ago
@jlnijholt True! But throughout the winter of 1941-42, Stalin was energetically producing tanks and weaponry of all kinds in the new Western Siberia industrial cities and raising new armies in Russia and the Asian republics. There was a minor miracle going on. The nation was rising to the challenge with remarkable clarity of purpose.
mc0558 1 year ago
@mc0558 That was a wise decision on Stalin's part, but the loss of 3 million men and most of miltary equipment in the first six months of Barbarossa should also be written on his account. And ofcourse it wasn't Stalin who rebuilt those thousands of factories, it was the workers who put in 15 hour workshifts on meagre rations and no comfort at all, except that they were saving the nation.
jlnijholt 1 year ago
@jlnijholt Stalin usually chose able assistants, but he was the chief. It was he who decided to build the new industrial cities in Western Siberia out of reach of German bombers. He organize the resources to do so. Yes, the workers did it (not the bosses); Stalin always gave the credit to workers. WWII was the people's victory (not the generals'), Stalin affirmed that. He was a communist, and communists love the workers. Feigned or not, he always played down his own role.
mc0558 1 year ago
@jlnijholt yes it was the workers,but without stalin,they cant built at all,he's the one who gathered up the resources,supplies and workers to build them up.stalin is known as man of the poeple specially the poor,not a man for the rich men,where the west were really in the side of the rich men.that's why the west were doing their best to destroy stalin and his legacy,it's just sad that his successors were no diffirent to the western leaders,very corrupt,profiteers,liars,etc...
teslagod2003 1 year ago
Middle eastern oil production at the time were slim to nil. And the Baku oil fields were the USSR's major oil source, that's why hitler was so keen on invading the USSR. If it was known that there were huge oil reserves in the middle east, then hitler would have just gone there instead of fighting his way through russia first.
redmunkee 2 years ago
Saudi Aramco dates back to May 29, 1933, when the Saudi Arabian government signed a concessionary agreement with Standard Oil of California (Socal), allowing the company to explore Saudi Arabia for oi
jeffman3003 2 years ago
1938 Kingdom's first commercial oil field discovered at Dhahran. Crude is exported by barge to Bahrain.
1939 First tanker load of petroleum is exported. (Socals D.G. Scofield)
jeffman3003 2 years ago
Mass production of oil in the middle east did not start until 1945.
redmunkee 2 years ago
that is according to your fantasy story asshole. I can reference legitimate sites and writings, what can you reference other than that tiny brain of yours?
jeffman3003 2 years ago
so 10.6 million tons per year is not mass production, what was baku producing 10 billion tons. Fuck your idiotic ass man, i am through with a jack ass such as yourself.
jeffman3003 2 years ago
If Hitler went south he had to face all the US and British troops and supplies going from the persian guf to the north of Iran, there is no way the USA would have allowed that to happen guy!
jeffman3003 2 years ago
US and British forces in the area is much smaller than the red army.
redmunkee 2 years ago
@jeffman3003 given that they could send their troops there in time...
teslagod2003 1 year ago
Another huge supply route was Nome, Alaska. Russian freighters ferried supplies across the Bering Straits. They were put on the TransSiberian Railroad and sent Westwards to industrial cities in Western Siberia.
I knew a man who, as a young soldier, was stationed there to work as a translator with the Soviet captains. He learned about the true nature of Stalin's "socialist" system in his conversations with them.
As for holding out, Germany mobilized all of Western Europe for its war effort!
mc0558 2 years ago
@jeffman3003 The Russians got a lot from outside, but it is a mistake to suppose that overwhelmingly Russia's victory in this war was not do to her own productive capacity, the superiority of here weaponry, unity under the superb wartime leadership of Stalin, and the courage of her own men and women in battle. They built the greatest Armed Force in the War. They cut the Germans to pieces, and thank God for it. It saved the lives of our men once we had invaded France.
mc0558 1 year ago
@mc0558 WTF superb wartime leadership of that fucking murderer of millions? Superb my ass, when The Wermacht was at the gates of Moscow the bastard pissed in his pants and fled. It was all due to the US and UK lend lease and the Winter. don't give that bastard credit when non is deserved.
jeffman3003 1 year ago
@jeffman3003 You are clearly a simple soul who needs historical characters to be cut of a single cloth. Revolutionary terrorist and ass murderer=cowardly, incompetent, dependent on others who bring home the bacon. Otherwise the moral universe would be out of kilter and that can't be. Satin would not use one of his servants to destroy another of his servants.
mc0558 1 year ago
@mc0558 I'm sorry you must have missed the show trials of the 1930s, the decimation of Red Army leadership, the Gulag camps, etc etc.
jlnijholt 1 year ago
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mc0558 1 year ago
@jlnijholt The purges brought down despised Com Party bigwigs and were hugely popular. (Yes!) Armed Forces purge got rid of civil war deadwood, not enough as the defeats of 1941 demonstrated (Voroshilov/Budenny). Gulag camps provided slave labour that built infrastructure, elctrical power, etc. cheaply. Evil, yes, but beneficial to Russia's war-making ability, and that is what concerns me.
mc0558 1 year ago
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mc0558 1 year ago
@jeffman3003 While thousands fled the city and the government left Stalin never did. As for "superb wartime leadership", that is ofcourse another matter.
jlnijholt 1 year ago
@jlnijholt Stalin's military mistakes were made before the war and by generals like Voroshilov and Budenny at the start of the war, who were out of their depth facing the Wehrmacht. Overy points out, the RA learned modern warfare from the German invader. By1943 they'd added a few insights of their own adapted to Russian conditions. USSR beat Germans (1) by mastering German tactics, (2) by producing industrial miracles of their own, (3) US aid (4) by being stalwart and brave.
mc0558 1 year ago
Ok Heeman, lets not get too dilusional there!
jeffman3003 2 years ago
@jeffman3003 continued from above: the scale of Russia's prduction of weaponry of its own design and manufacture is a matter of record. Russia always had a small intellectual elite that were amongst the best. Russia lost WWI because she fell apart politically; in 1941-42 under Stalin, she held together because he had eliminated rivals beforehand. UK & US boys suffered less because the Russians under Stalin had kicked the guts out of the Wehrmacht BEFORE they took it on!
mc0558 1 year ago
@mc0558 2 words . EXTREME WINTER. Thats it, the rest is just words being pulled out of your anus. so keep yapping. YAP YAP YAP YAP YAP YAP
jeffman3003 1 year ago
@jeffman3003 I don't like your tone! Either you deal with the arguments I put forward or you keep you mouth shut or I will block you. I am giving you a learned and insightful history lessons here. Pay attention! If you have knowledge to put in play or arguments to make, do so, and I will deal with them. But be civil or I will cut you off.
mc0558 1 year ago
@mc0558 well,what can you to the people who knew nothing but hatred?they hated everything and everyone that the western propaganda said should be hated,tsk....
it'll be better to just ignore the haters and those who wants to spread their hate and the power of their western propagandas,tsk...
teslagod2003 1 year ago