The United States Amazing Role In Bible Prophecy by David Asscherick (3 of 6)

[bheadh]

You are only fooling yourselves people...do I hear an amen? If the "Saturday Law" is soooo important, why isn't passover part of your "religion". It was paramount to the Jewish faith and was a ceremony that was to "be preserved forever"!!?? Instead of trying to tear Christianity down, we should be uniting against the great evils of our day. E. White and SDAs are a deluded cult. On the fringe of Christianity. No love here, just hate mongering. Do I hear an amen?

[07braves]

cont..last but not least..the beast (empire) =ROME, and also the man = romulus, ( its founder) in which in hebrew is romiith..=666

[07braves]

the mark of the beast could be if we remember is 1st the mark of the BEAST (empire) and is the mark of a man 2nd. the beast of Daniel is rome..what mark did it have that set it apart from all other empires..crucifixion. the Holy Roman empire uses this emblem also as do most of all christian denominations, and through the dark ages, it was turn (to the latin cross) or burn. constantine seen a cross that meant as he seen it..go forth and conquer. catholic, marked from birth, masses, and death.

[michalchik]

Cool, a fundamentalist that understands that the breakdown of Church and state is a threat to the Church as well as the secular State.

[Dusty341]

I am sorry that you were duped into this nonsense.

[Nirky]

Actually it all started coming together and making sense when I denied myself and asked God to lead me, not wanting anymore to go my own way, do whatever I pleased, even it ran contrary to God's ways.

After that, I began to understand. That understanding came by His Holy Spirit, which He gives only to those who purpose to obey Him. Acts 5:32

What specifically is your scriptural disagreement with what David is presenting?

[Dusty341]

Respectfully, I disagree with the scriptures all together. But to read Revelations and read a passage describing a beast with 7 heads 12 horns, feet of a bear, mouth of a lion and so on and come up with what that man said....just absolutely ludicrous. The man says that the Holy Spirit has lead him to these conclusions Well, ALOT of people have come up with ALOT of claims saying that the Holy Spirit lead them to it. It's actually a pretty dangerous claim, seeing how many people will believe it.

[Dusty341]

Cont.

It is also interesting that there are countless Christians through out history that have pulled the Holy Spirit card, when defending their logic, and none of those people came to the same conclusion about the EXACT same topics of scripture.

Just seems to me that if god wanted us to understand his "inerrant" word, he would have made it easier to understand. Not to mention, not so easily debatable.

[Nirky]

God gave us His revelation to REVEAL what will happen to His people, and to the world. God wants us to know, He does not want His children to be in the dark!

Regarding the sea beast of Rev 13 with 7 heads and 10 horns, do you have any specific objections regarding what David is saying, other than just general disagreement without providing a scriptural basis?

[Nirky]

"The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave Him to show His servants—things which must shortly take place." Revelation 1:1

God wants us to KNOW, not be in the dark.

[Dusty341]

This Revelation has been shown and it has never been understood by anyone. Many many people have tried, since it was written, to decipher what it means. No one agrees. If this is truly the "Word of God" then he did a bad job of making it understandable for his fallible and finite servants.

[Nirky]

The fact that you do not yet understand what God is saying here in Revelation does NOT mean that it cannot be understood!

Regarding the book of Revelation, it was coded in signs and symbols to obscure the meaning from those who do not care to put Him in their hearts and understand. Rev 1:2 But we CAN know!

[Nirky]

"Ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you.

For everyone who asks receives, and he who seeks finds, and to him who knocks it will be opened.

Or what man is there among you who, if his son asks for bread, will give him a stone?

If you then, being evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father who is in heaven give good things to those who ask Him!" Mat 7:7-9,11

[Dusty341]

Hasn't been my experience in Christianity.

Forgive me, but quoting the Bible is useless when debating an Atheist. If your god exists, then he gifted me with reason that I used to pick apart a book that no evidence supports, and reject it entirely. If he exists, he knows how to reveal himself to me, and he knows that a hopelessly flawed document aint doin' the trick. No offense, but if you are just reading and quoting the parts of the Bible you like, then you deceiving yourself.

[Nirky]

One of the major proofs which God gives us He exists and can be trusted is prophesy. Knowing the future in advance.

Now that you have knowledge of this video, and know the role of the US & the Papacy in end time events, what will you do when these events come to pass?

[Dusty341]

Prophesy is not proof or evidence. People have been seeing the signs of the times since the cult of Christianity became a religion. And the end continues to not to happen. The prophesies of the Bible are EXTREMELY vague and about things that happen often(in the grand scheme of things).

As to your question, ill say this: I would rather burn in hell for eternity, then worship the Christian deity. Worship of a tyrant is wrong and immoral to me. No matter how powerful. that includes the Antichrist

[Nirky]

You have avoided my question. What will you do when you live to see the prophesies in this video concerning the US & the antichrist come to pass before your own eyes? With Bible prophesy unfolding all around you, will you persist in your denial and say "prophesy is not proof or evidence"?

[Nirky]

I reread your last post, and you did, in a way, answer my question.

You aren't making much sense. First you denied Biblical prophesy because you didn't understand it, you reasoned nobody could. You used as your proof various opinions and interpretations of others.

Then, when faced with the possibility of prophesy you are aware of through this video coming to pass before your eyes, instead of admitting you would be tragically wrong, you instead say you would rather die than look to the Lord.

[Dusty341]

I told you that Biblical Prophecy is bunk. It is vague and unclear. Anyone could draw their own conclusions(Like Mr. Asscherick) from your so called Prophecies. No one has described anything prophetic from scriptures that ANYONE can agree upon. How could I possibly know if prophesy has been fulfilled? Yes, I would deny that the Antichrist existed. How on Earth could I tell if he was? Or if the US is the second Beast? I don't see how there could be any evidence that could prove either is?

[Nirky]

If you had watched and understood this video, whether you agreed with it or not, you would know when these prophesies were fulfilled. You would see how the first and second beasts did what scripture said they would, and you would have time to reconsider your fatalistic outlook..

[Dusty341]

Listen, I understood the video. I know you think these prophesies have been fulfilled. But, you are failing to realize, you aren't the first person to be 100% confident that Biblical Prophecy is being fulfilled. And you won't be the first person to be wrong. Christians have been saying End TImes are here for 2000 years! The brilliance with these Prophesies is that they predict events that can EASILY happen, and vague enough to describe just about anything!

[Dusty341]

I mean, im sure growing up in the 1940's, as a Christian, it would be obvious to me that The Axis of Evil was the 2nd Beast and Hitler was the AntiChrist. And I would have scripture to back it up. During the Cold War, how could I not see that the Communist Empire was the 2nd beast? I could pick and choose among the Communist leaders who would be the AntiChrist.

You see? There will ALWAYS be a 2nd Beast and an AntiChrist that needs revealing. Long after you and I are gone.

[Nirky]

The Axis does not fit the Biblical identifiers of the 2nd beast.

Hitler does not fit the identifiers of the antichrist. If you understood those, you would not make that statement.

Seems you are still making the mistake of basing your understanding on what you observe others say instead of your own personal study.

If you have studied this, what conclusions have you come to?

And if you have not studied it for yourself, how can you make any claims like "Biblical prophesy is bunk"?

[Dusty341]

You are missing the point here. I keep saying that Prophesy is not evidence. THAT is the point. Someone could say "I predict that it will rain tomorrow." If that person is right, does it make them a prophet? No. They could have seen a weather forecast, and that would be a rational explanation.

I'll tell you what would impress me: Names, dates, times, and locations. As it happens the gospels can't even agree on the date and time of Christ's crucifixion, let alone a vague prophesy.

[Nirky]

So when the Papacy comes into power and causes first the US, then ALL nations of the world to legislate their religious observances, including the compulsory keeping of Sunday and outlawing corporate worship on any other day, especially Saturday, you will not recognize it being a fulfillment of what you have learned from this video?

[Dusty341]

Well, if you know your history, you know that pretty much all ready happened(and we are still here.) By emperors and popes, no less. But, yes(as I already told you) it wouldn't surprise me that human beings would do their best to control everyone in the world with religion. It has happened before. That is what religion is for, after all. Control. It would NOT prove your deity's existence.

[Nirky]

Now you are just being silly.

But alright, you claimed what I just described happened in the past. So please show when the US caused the world to live and worship by the dictates of the Roman Church, first under penalty of economic sanctions, then death. I must have missed that in my history class. Please tell me when this already happened.

[Dusty341]

I should have clarified, that was a poor job by me of explaining my point. I was talking about the Holy Roman Empire controlling most of the known world in the past. Never did it control the US, and it never will. Americans have always had a healthy mistrust of Catholics, which might be why there has been only one Catholic president in American history(JFK). According to you, shouldn't the Pope be gaining power in the US instead of losing it? Secularism is on the rise, friend.

[Nirky]

The Roman Church keeps gaining in power & influence, it will not diminish until the end. The things covered in this video WILL come to pass, and in your lifetime.

I know you disagree with it now, but please remember what you learned, and keep your mind and heart open. Your only way of escape will not be through man, but through a relationship with Him. I pray you seek and find Him before the worst begins. God bless!

[LiquidSmooth]

@Dusty341 The Roman Empire doesn't have control of the USA? Are you asleep?

Why don't you turn on your TV. Not for a long time. But you will see Roman Catholics (Hannity, O'riley, Ann Coulter, Laura Ingrahm) telling you to vote for people that seem to appoint more catholics to high government office. We have a SUpreme Court, made up of mostly ROman Catholics. Head of FBI, CIA, Department of Defense, all roman catholic (yes, episcapols are Roman Catholic).

[Dusty341]

@LiquidSmooth You're a pretty funny guy! You name a bunch of right wing PUNDITS that happen to be Catholic and a handful of politicians who happen to be Catholic...and that is supposed to convince me that the Vatican is controlling shit? Talk about paranoid.

I live in the DC area, and recently legislation passed allowing gay marriage. The Catholic Church threatened to withdraw financial support to certain charities if they passed it. The legislation passed and the Catholics withdrew. Control?

[LiquidSmooth]

@Dusty341 You act like the HEAD of CIA, FBI, Department of Defense, 6 Judges on the Supreme Court, are just some nobodies. Those are pretty high positions in government. Isn't it odd there is not ONE protestant?

The Catholic CHurch threatens alot OUTWARDLY. These is to appease the catholics that actually think the Catholic Church is good. If the Catholic Church was really against homosexuality, it would ban having gay priests.

[Dusty341]

@LiquidSmooth You know something, I am truly anti-Vatican. I hate their history and I hate what they stand for. But, I don't hate them. You really hate them don't you? You hate the fact that most of the Christian population of the world subscribes to the Catholic belief, and you cant stand that can you?

Evangelical Christians have a strong political base and strong lobbying group. Lot of influence from the Evangelical Christian base..plenty of bullshit rumors going around about you guys too..

[LiquidSmooth]

@Dusty341 I don't hate people, just their organizations and what they stand for.

ANd I think I should hate that anyone subscribes to a lie, why would I not hate that? I love seeing people subscribe to the truth.

Evangelicals do have a strong base, but trouble is, they are manipulated by media and government that is ran by catholics.

Saying the Head of CIA, FBI< Department of Defense, 6 Judges, are roman catholic, is not a rumor. It is FACT.

[Dusty341]

@LiquidSmooth "ANd I think I should hate that anyone subscribes to a lie, why would I not hate that? I love seeing people subscribe to the truth."

By far the most intelligent thing I have heard in this thread yet. And yet you subscribe to the most brutal, misogynistic, bigoted, lie that the world has ever known..A lie that is responsible for so much misery in the world.

And saying that because a number of government officials are Catholic, means that the Vatican is in control...paranoid.

[LiquidSmooth]

@Dusty341 How is that paranoid? It is obvious fact. Catholics get in control, and Bibles get removed from schools. Catholics get in control, laws against guns and free speech start to be made. Catholics get in control, torturing of prisoners happens. Catholics get in control, the IRS and Federal Reserve get created.

How am I the bigot, when they are the ones that won't give a protestant one single high office?

[Dusty341]

@LiquidSmooth Also, don't think I haven't noticed that you are dodging most of the points I am making...might want to address those. Especially because it makes you look disingenuous.

[LiquidSmooth]

@Dusty341 The catholic Church is very friendly with the Episcopailians. And they openly allow gay marriage.

The catholic church never excommunicates any of these judges or politicians that favor abortion.

[Dusty341]

@LiquidSmooth My friend, I don't care how friendly the Catholic Church is with the Episcopalians. The Vatican is friendly with plenty of groups and governments that they openly condemn and that openly condemn the Vatican. And while the Church does not excommunicate politicians who are OVERRIDDEN on issues of abortion, but they do excommunicate their own clergy for allowing life saving abortions in Catholic hospitals.

You're paranoid buddy. The Vatican has a long reach, but not that long.

[LiquidSmooth]

@Dusty341 The Vatican didn't excommunicate Pavelic or Hitler. You really think the Vatican cares about abortion? Or do they excommunicate some people sometimes just to look like they have some morals?

Heck, you are talking about an organization which protects pedophiles by moving preists from perish to perish. Even after they find the priest has a problem, they don't excomunnicate them.

[usenetposts]

@Dusty341 From the point at wehich the Catholics lost their earthly power, the main political tool on earth of Satan is the masonic network. The same people now have infiltrated almost every church and they are doing the bidding of Satan without even realising that they are doing it. That's really why the "reach" is so long. And it is very long, longer than the most paranoid of us would care to imagine.

[LiquidSmooth]

@Dusty341 Who do you think had the Bibles removed from the Schools in America? Do you think it was the ACLU? It was the Roman Catholic CHurch. In 1841, Bishop Hughes of New York told politicians they would be supported by the catholic church, if they removed the bible from public schools. Then in 1854, 36 schools had the bible removed. And the Pope even rewarded Bishop Hughes for this.

So most of this "secularism" is a sign that the Vatican is in control.

[Dusty341]

@LiquidSmooth Id have to know more about that Bishop Hughes situation to have a solid opinion on that matter; However, It seems to me the Catholic Church was looking for a way to have a non-Catholic Bible pulled out of schools, and our government(our SECULAR government) agreed. Sounds like a sound decision to me.

[evcrawfish]

@Dusty341

5 of the supreme court justices are roman catholic

131 catholics in the house

25 catholics in the senate

catholics have a heck of a presence 

[Dusty341]

@evcrawfish So do the Evangelical Christians! I'm more worried about them than I am Catholics.

[Dusty341]

I'll answer your question another way: I would deny until I saw Jesus pop out of the sky. How could I deny that?

A forced religion would horrify me, of course, but that is happening all over the world and would not surprise me much. I wouldn't accept any "Mark" on my forehead or right hand. I would fight all that until death. But, I would rationalize that it was the doing of a demented human. Prophecy is not evidence, and could not make me believe in a deity.

[Dusty341]

"Regarding the sea beast of Rev 13 with 7 heads and 10 horns, do you have any specific objections regarding what David is saying, other than just general disagreement without providing a scriptural basis?"

Other than taking scripture and trying to make it say whatever you want for recognition, no. I see absolutely no reason for anyone to believe that he is in anyway accurate. That is my beef with him. That he is trying to persuade people into believing non-truths.