well that's a load of shit. Catholism did what it did based on its interpretation of the bible. If God didn't come down and correct them, then God is at fault for leading them astray. Besides Catholism isn't the only branch of Christianity that has done horrible shit, the banning and killing of homosexuals, jews, pagans, witches and heritics still happened in Protestant countries and empires. Scarring the shit out of your kids through a concept of hell still carries on.
Nothing you just said will change the fact that you will see the rapture with your own eyes and the fact you will be left behind in your unbelief.
You will see (1) The rapture (2) Isaiah 17:1 and Psalm 83 wars and out of them the anti christ will arise to world power. (3) 3rd Jewish temple (4) the mark of the beast ( micro chip implant or RFID ink) (5) 1/2-5/6 of the worlds population die as a direct result of Gods wrath.
I already have believed and i'm not going to fall for that again. Even if your particular Christian belief is right despite so many other competitors, if yours is right and i'm on the wrong side of the Christian God. Then yes, I will believe he exists, but i'll still hate him and I'll spit in his face as i'm tortured
@MrWaterlionmonkey 1 John 2:19, you have never been a believer and what you have just said exposes your ignorance of scriptures.
Do you know why God sent the flood?
There are no competitors only right and wrong black and white and each individual is given the opportunity to believe UPON Christ as their Lord and Savior.
There are whole denominations that do not RIGHTLY DIVIDE the Word. It is called Eisegesis as compared to Exegesis.
You worship a chicken. You have never read the bible. Your going to be tortured in my basement because of your ignorance of science.
You see how stupid it is to tell people what they believe and who they are when you havent meet them. I did believe, a believer can change his mind, just like Solomon. Anybody can change their mind. And there is no such thing as black and white in terms of morals, no one believes in something that they know to be wrong, seriously that is stupid
Also I know the bible like the back of my hand. I've read it a few times and I remember a hell of alot of it. Its a load of horrible crap. Hell, you don't understand the bible, if you did you wouldn't be a Christian
I have studied the bible in depth and not from a western frame of mind unlike a great many who claim to be Christian.
I ask you again, why did God send the flood? You said you studied so this should be relatively easy for you.
Once a person truly believes upon Christ their is no turning back. What you have been taught about this is part of the Lie of satan and is why I quoted 1 John 2:19.
You have a HYBRID race being created called the Nephilim. You see, satan tried to pollute the human blood line in an attempt to prevent the birth of Christ of which he tried to do more than once.
God wiped out a hybrid word that bred with angels for hundreds of years. This also explains David and Goliath and it was David and his might men finished of the giants.
This also explains why Joshua was told to spare one tribe and then wipe out the next
For the truth about religion try Robert M. Price, ' The reason driven life ' or John W. Loftus or Victor J. Stenger, ' God, the failed hypothesis' . Also interesting to have a look at the 1500BCE papyrus of Ani, with its god Osiris who weighs the heart to decide who can pass to the land of the living.[ The need to know the names of the gods & the negative confession & other magic texts to get there]. James Frazer's 'The Golden Bough' and C.S. Lewis, 'Mere Christianity'
People who do evil always rationalise it. We just invaded Iraq for the oil 'in the name of democracy', but no-one blames this on democracy. Ironically, when a person says, 'I did it because I'm evil. I lack normal standards of respect for life and dignity', it's a good sign they're ready to make real changes. But it should't surprise us that most villains think they working for good. Al Capone thought he was a businessman persecuted for meeting demand with supply.
whether the bible transforms a person is up to the heart condition of that person. the word of God is alive and exerts power, but you have to have the fine soil jesus spoke about. jwin I don't believe the buildings are going to mysteriously crumble but they will be closed or used for state business and religious leaders will have to suceed to statism. they may even be burned if the people are riled up by the state. look at states riling up people around the globe. they loot, burn etc.
Hiding Human depravity behind a condemnation of religion is to focus upon the symptom of the problem rather than the problem itself. If by religion we mean the effort of humans by works or any level of human effort attempting to please a deity and thereby gaining some form of eternal and temporal advantage, then human depravity is the foundation of such religion. I would also argue that the same human depravity is the foundation of Atheism. Therefore, depravity is the source of evil.
Greeks, Romans, Japanese, Chinese, Mayans, Aztecs, Jews, Christians and Muslims have been killing, maiming and torturing for thousands of years. The body count for Christianity alone is immeasurable. If you want to play the dick measuring contest of deaths done. You lose
Also, most of those 20 million were not religious peoples and most were killed for political reasons unquie to communist dogma. So really those deaths are the responsibility of Communism or Stalinism, not Athiesm. He didnt kill them in the name of Athiesm he killed them in the name of communism. In which case he was a member of a political religion and has much more in common with your position.
@MrWaterlionmonkey Atheism played a role in those deaths and is solely responsible for the deaths of billions of babies world wide in the womb. There is no escaping the position you find yourself in. Atheism is a religion all of its own with it;s leaders and tenants of faith (evolution)
Athiesm goes not have a doctrine or dogma, its simply a rejection of dieties. To use the communists as ammo against all athiests is like saying a guy who hates golf kills a golfer and now all golf haters are potentiality immoral. You cant say that because there is no dogma between this group the only thing they have in common is a hatred of golf for many different reasons as well as having different opinions on everything else.
Athiesm is not a religion. There are plenty of athiest who dont suport abortion, there are thiests who do and vice versa. Also not all athiests belive in evoultion, that is not true at all. Beside there are plenty of thiests who do believe in evoultion. So, What! Let me ask you this, do babies believe in Jesus and the bible or even a God? Observattion would clearly give you the answer, NO. So, are babies immoral? Do they believe in evoultion and abortion?
@MrWaterlionmonkey theist is a man made word that means nothing. There are whole denominations that are not Christian that claim to be. The key is that these are the last days when deception will rule.
So lets say .05 percent of atheists don't believe in abortion that is hardly the mass of that religion.
@MrWaterlionmonkey HUH, what garbage. To hold a position of Deity is still holding a position and or DOGMA. As a result of your denial of God do you believe in evolution? Evolution is one of the worst THEORIES out there and is even more fantastic than a creator.
Truly you understand little of anything and your positions are absurd. Claiming atheism is not a position LOL, not that's rich
@MrWaterlionmonkey You know whats really scary? The fact that what happened in Noah's day is going to happen again Luke 17:26.
Just look at the mass media promoting life in the universe and the belief in aliens, Babylon 5, SG1, SGAtlantis, Star trek in all of it forms, Star Wars, and on and in and on.
Look at the UFO interest world wide with sightings.
You will see the fallen angels come as aliens and pretend to be our creators and helpers.
Total agreement with the arguments presented by John Lennox; Christendom should not be confused with true Chritianity, namelly first century Christianity, as taught by Jesus Christ and the Apostles.
Why are so many unable to separate the two, and why are the vast majority of so-called Christians so easily seduced by the teachings of Christendom, choosing, in the process, to reject the uncontaminated teachings of Christ and the Apostles?
While historians of Christianity have generally acknowledged some degree of Germanic influence in the development of early medieval Christianity, Russell goes further, arguing for a fundamental Germanic reinterpretation of Christianity.
Christendom is deficient just as ancient Babylon was deficient. Both HATE(d) the true God Jehovah, and both will have been destroyed by the climax of the Great Tribulation.
I look forward to the day when all the church buildings in my area come "mysteriously" crumbling to the ground by a mighty, invisible, all-powerful hand!!!!!
"Hence today I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator by defending myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of the Lord."
-Adolf Hitler (Mein Kampf)
Hitler was no atheist, nor was the Nazi:
Gott Mit Uns (God is With Us) written on their belts.
Goebbels notes in a diary entry in 1939: "The Führer is deeply religious, but deeply anti-Christian. He regards Christianity as a symptom of decay." Albert Speer reports a similar statement: You see, its been our misfortune to have the wrong religion. Why didnt we have the religion of the Japanese, who regard sacrifice for the Fatherland as the highest good? The Mohammedan religion too would have been much more compatible to us than Christianity. Why did it have to be Christianity..."
Not at all. I am stating they were not Christians by their very words. Of course Hitler did not come right out and tell the German people who had been Christians for more than a millenium that he was not a Christian and they couldn't be either.
Hitler tried to use propoganda to bring Christianity into the fold of Nazism. When that failed he simply closed down churches and restated his position: "One is either a Christian or a German," he said. "You can't be both."
Goebbels was quoting Hitler. Surely you're not suggesting Hitler was an honest man? What Hitler said in public was propoganda designed to comfort the millions of Christians that he sought to charm into performing his evil deeds, and he succeeded.
Goebbels knew Hitler better than anyone, I trust his account of what Hitler said in private far more than I trust anything Hitler said to beguile his public.
i would say that hitler honestly believed the things he said and wrote. a desire for a change of attitude is all that hitler expressed not a desire for a change of faith, he simply wished that christians were more willing to take up arms; not that he wished them not to be christians.
it is all too simple to dismiss the deep love for his version of christianity, as many of your types do.
Hitler didn't say or believe half of the things he spoke of. Kinda like the pact he signed with Stalin not to invade the Soviet Union.
To claim that what Hitler said to beguile the public was closer to the truth than what he discussed with his inner circle and trusted lieutenants is an exercise in intellectual dishonesty.
lol whatever "kinda like the pact.." so what he broke a treaty, that happens all the time. of course he never intended to keep the treaty he openly says that he hates communism and liberalism in his book.
Exactly, you make my point for me. Hitler was not a paragon of honesty. What he told his Christian public to extract obediance was far less trustworthy than what he told his lieutenants.
hitler was like lots of christians he had challenges to his faith, but he remained a christian dispite any doubts etc...
and i think the point you are missing is that it was all done by the germans in the name of god. it doesn't matter really what a few individuals believe because nazism by in large was facilitated by the christians of germany. the hand fulls of diabolical men we read about could never have done what they did if the german people didn't feel it was in line with christianity.
You are a historical revisionist sir, nothing was done in Nazi Germany in the name of God. I am an honest person, there are terrible things in history done in the name of God. Some of the Crusades, the Spanish Inquisition, the Witch trials of the late Rennaisance. These are horrible events done "In the name of God." Nazi Germany was never in it's time, nor in any other considered a theocracy, or even governed under general Christian principle. Hitler shut down churches, he didn't open them.
hitler in nearly every speach envoked the christian god, the local churches supported the nazi's. hitler told the people that it was for jesus that we must get rid of the jews... etc.... you don't have to be a theocracy to do things on the behest of your majority religion.
in america we have no official religion, yet God is envoked for war,social programs,and for general speaking with the public;
Again you are a revisionist of the worst kind. You want to spin a few statements intended to beguile a majority Christian public into something that fits comfortably in your world view. It doesn't. Hitler closed churches, church schools, and had clergy that wouldn't cotton to his ideas imprisoned and deported. Bormann stated publicly in 1941 on the behalf of the Fuhrer "National Socialism and Christianity are irreconcilable." Hitler said whatever the public wanted to hear to enforce his will.
you like to ignore things like the support of Deutsche Christen(german christians) for the nazi's. even the early opposition from the Bekennende Kirche switched to praising loyalty to hitler.
Gerhard Engel, one of Hitler's generals, reported that Hitler had told him: "I am now as before a Catholic and will always remain so" (in an entry in Engel's diary during 1941)
the nazi's promoted what is called "positive christianity" which is what most KKK and other anti-semetic christians believe
I'm not ignoring anything, millions of Christians fought for and aided the Nazis. Millions more fought against them.
Gerhard Engel was a third rate division commander. He ranked not at all in Hitler's confidants. Goebbels was in Hitler's inner circle. Please, this is becoming ridiculous, you don't know history if you claim Hitler was honest to his citizenry, or that Engel, (who admitted that he rewrote an edited the diaries that you're quoting after the war), knew Hitler's mind.
Well Communism as part of its core is a separation of a belief from God. I agree Atheism is not a dogma in that it isn't a view that has universal concepts within it's members. Take the skeptical view of the Resurrection. All atheists believe that it didn't take place but their reasons for believing so, differ GREATLY. The problem occurs when skepticism is presented as the default position when the position itself is so varied.
It's more the interpretation of evidence than a lack of evidence I think...GA Wells would say that Christ never existed, others deny Resurrection on gospel dating or that Paul meant spiritual not body, or they were lying or they saw visions. They all can't be right. The first disciples can't have claimed resurrection of Jesus if he didn't exist? If the New Testament isn't usable text for analysis I don't understand why critics universally use it when critiquing Paul or sayings of Jesus.
The consensus is that the character likely existed.
As for everything else...well, they all can't be right, sure, but they're all valid points against the natural order being randomly suspended.
As for using the bible to critique Paul or Jesus, those are just matters of consistency usually; atop the fact that there is no problem with accepting a claim in order to show it false.
people claimed that their deities died and resurrected in all of prechristian history, are we saposed to believe that baal was real, or that budda really transended? no they are all equally nonsense.
Also, saying 'god is watching you' is an empty statement to people who have a radically different concept of what a god is. As far as they were concerned, their god well and approved what they were doing.
Also, what is this Atheism = Communism ignorance?
Communism criticized concepts of god because it sought to replace devotion to a god with a devotion to the state. Replacing one blind ideology with another. This is why it is referred to as 'religion without a god'.
It is tiring to hear of Atheism spoken of as if it were dogma.
Please, highlight this dogma. Particularly the parts about 'no hope' and violent atrocity.
If this is about what Catholicism has done then the answer is very simple Catholicism is a CULT, A perversion of Christianity.
I don't thin this video or the speaker really understand what they are speaking about.
On Christs 2nd advent He is coming as Lord of Lords and King of Kings and He is coming to TAKE this world by FORCE.
THERAPTURECOMES 3 months ago
@THERAPTURECOMES
well that's a load of shit. Catholism did what it did based on its interpretation of the bible. If God didn't come down and correct them, then God is at fault for leading them astray. Besides Catholism isn't the only branch of Christianity that has done horrible shit, the banning and killing of homosexuals, jews, pagans, witches and heritics still happened in Protestant countries and empires. Scarring the shit out of your kids through a concept of hell still carries on.
MrWaterlionmonkey 2 months ago
@MrWaterlionmonkey
Nothing you just said will change the fact that you will see the rapture with your own eyes and the fact you will be left behind in your unbelief.
You will see (1) The rapture (2) Isaiah 17:1 and Psalm 83 wars and out of them the anti christ will arise to world power. (3) 3rd Jewish temple (4) the mark of the beast ( micro chip implant or RFID ink) (5) 1/2-5/6 of the worlds population die as a direct result of Gods wrath.
Will you believe then?
THERAPTURECOMES 2 months ago
@THERAPTURECOMES
I already have believed and i'm not going to fall for that again. Even if your particular Christian belief is right despite so many other competitors, if yours is right and i'm on the wrong side of the Christian God. Then yes, I will believe he exists, but i'll still hate him and I'll spit in his face as i'm tortured
MrWaterlionmonkey 2 months ago
@MrWaterlionmonkey 1 John 2:19, you have never been a believer and what you have just said exposes your ignorance of scriptures.
Do you know why God sent the flood?
There are no competitors only right and wrong black and white and each individual is given the opportunity to believe UPON Christ as their Lord and Savior.
There are whole denominations that do not RIGHTLY DIVIDE the Word. It is called Eisegesis as compared to Exegesis.
Time is running out
THERAPTURECOMES 2 months ago
@THERAPTURECOMES
You worship a chicken. You have never read the bible. Your going to be tortured in my basement because of your ignorance of science.
You see how stupid it is to tell people what they believe and who they are when you havent meet them. I did believe, a believer can change his mind, just like Solomon. Anybody can change their mind. And there is no such thing as black and white in terms of morals, no one believes in something that they know to be wrong, seriously that is stupid
MrWaterlionmonkey 2 months ago
@THERAPTURECOMES
Also I know the bible like the back of my hand. I've read it a few times and I remember a hell of alot of it. Its a load of horrible crap. Hell, you don't understand the bible, if you did you wouldn't be a Christian
MrWaterlionmonkey 2 months ago
@MrWaterlionmonkey
I have studied the bible in depth and not from a western frame of mind unlike a great many who claim to be Christian.
I ask you again, why did God send the flood? You said you studied so this should be relatively easy for you.
Once a person truly believes upon Christ their is no turning back. What you have been taught about this is part of the Lie of satan and is why I quoted 1 John 2:19.
I understand exactly why I am a Christian
Why flood the world?
THERAPTURECOMES 2 months ago
@THERAPTURECOMES
the apparent wickedness of mankind. There! happy? but, let me ask you something, why didn't God save the children and babies?
MrWaterlionmonkey 2 months ago
@MrWaterlionmonkey PT1 Go to Genesis 6:1-2 Verse 1 the daughters of men. This group is clearly being listed as the FEMALES of the man (HUMAN)
Verse 2 we have the 'sons of God' This is another group of beings being clearly distinguished as being a separate group from the daughter of men
The question now becomes, 'who are the sons of God'? Your answer is in Job 1:6, 2:1 and 38:7
That's right, the sons of God are fallen ANGELS and the NIV and Septuagint call them angels.
THERAPTURECOMES 2 months ago
@MrWaterlionmonkey PT 2
You have a HYBRID race being created called the Nephilim. You see, satan tried to pollute the human blood line in an attempt to prevent the birth of Christ of which he tried to do more than once.
God wiped out a hybrid word that bred with angels for hundreds of years. This also explains David and Goliath and it was David and his might men finished of the giants.
This also explains why Joshua was told to spare one tribe and then wipe out the next
THERAPTURECOMES 2 months ago
For the truth about religion try Robert M. Price, ' The reason driven life ' or John W. Loftus or Victor J. Stenger, ' God, the failed hypothesis' . Also interesting to have a look at the 1500BCE papyrus of Ani, with its god Osiris who weighs the heart to decide who can pass to the land of the living.[ The need to know the names of the gods & the negative confession & other magic texts to get there]. James Frazer's 'The Golden Bough' and C.S. Lewis, 'Mere Christianity'
zytigon 5 months ago
People who do evil always rationalise it. We just invaded Iraq for the oil 'in the name of democracy', but no-one blames this on democracy. Ironically, when a person says, 'I did it because I'm evil. I lack normal standards of respect for life and dignity', it's a good sign they're ready to make real changes. But it should't surprise us that most villains think they working for good. Al Capone thought he was a businessman persecuted for meeting demand with supply.
leconfidant 6 months ago
I think labelling the evil on Christianity and religion is very short sighted.
Seracinfinity 7 months ago
whether the bible transforms a person is up to the heart condition of that person. the word of God is alive and exerts power, but you have to have the fine soil jesus spoke about. jwin I don't believe the buildings are going to mysteriously crumble but they will be closed or used for state business and religious leaders will have to suceed to statism. they may even be burned if the people are riled up by the state. look at states riling up people around the globe. they loot, burn etc.
TheRosa63 1 year ago
Hiding Human depravity behind a condemnation of religion is to focus upon the symptom of the problem rather than the problem itself. If by religion we mean the effort of humans by works or any level of human effort attempting to please a deity and thereby gaining some form of eternal and temporal advantage, then human depravity is the foundation of such religion. I would also argue that the same human depravity is the foundation of Atheism. Therefore, depravity is the source of evil.
VeryImagesozo 1 year ago
This sounds like an attempt to enforce a no true scottsman fallacy.
Mathenaut 1 year ago
My proposal:
Great good can be achieved without dogma.
Great harm cannot be achieved without dogma.
arifreeman 2 years ago 2
This has been flagged as spam show
@arifreeman That's not true at all. Stalin killed more than 20 million people in the name of atheism.
Seracinfinity 7 months ago
@Seracinfinity
Greeks, Romans, Japanese, Chinese, Mayans, Aztecs, Jews, Christians and Muslims have been killing, maiming and torturing for thousands of years. The body count for Christianity alone is immeasurable. If you want to play the dick measuring contest of deaths done. You lose
MrWaterlionmonkey 2 months ago
@Seracinfinity
Also, most of those 20 million were not religious peoples and most were killed for political reasons unquie to communist dogma. So really those deaths are the responsibility of Communism or Stalinism, not Athiesm. He didnt kill them in the name of Athiesm he killed them in the name of communism. In which case he was a member of a political religion and has much more in common with your position.
MrWaterlionmonkey 2 months ago
@MrWaterlionmonkey Atheism played a role in those deaths and is solely responsible for the deaths of billions of babies world wide in the womb. There is no escaping the position you find yourself in. Atheism is a religion all of its own with it;s leaders and tenants of faith (evolution)
Communism is in full denial of GOD!
THERAPTURECOMES 2 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@THERAPTURECOMES
Athiesm goes not have a doctrine or dogma, its simply a rejection of dieties. To use the communists as ammo against all athiests is like saying a guy who hates golf kills a golfer and now all golf haters are potentiality immoral. You cant say that because there is no dogma between this group the only thing they have in common is a hatred of golf for many different reasons as well as having different opinions on everything else.
MrWaterlionmonkey 2 months ago
@THERAPTURECOMES
Thats a ton of crap.
Athiesm is not a religion. There are plenty of athiest who dont suport abortion, there are thiests who do and vice versa. Also not all athiests belive in evoultion, that is not true at all. Beside there are plenty of thiests who do believe in evoultion. So, What! Let me ask you this, do babies believe in Jesus and the bible or even a God? Observattion would clearly give you the answer, NO. So, are babies immoral? Do they believe in evoultion and abortion?
MrWaterlionmonkey 2 months ago
@MrWaterlionmonkey theist is a man made word that means nothing. There are whole denominations that are not Christian that claim to be. The key is that these are the last days when deception will rule.
So lets say .05 percent of atheists don't believe in abortion that is hardly the mass of that religion.
THERAPTURECOMES 2 months ago
@MrWaterlionmonkey It requires faith to believe that evolution is a fact and not a theory.
THERAPTURECOMES 2 months ago
Comment removed
MrWaterlionmonkey 2 months ago
@MrWaterlionmonkey HUH, what garbage. To hold a position of Deity is still holding a position and or DOGMA. As a result of your denial of God do you believe in evolution? Evolution is one of the worst THEORIES out there and is even more fantastic than a creator.
Truly you understand little of anything and your positions are absurd. Claiming atheism is not a position LOL, not that's rich
THERAPTURECOMES 2 months ago
@THERAPTURECOMES
Your an idiot. Charles darwin believed in God till the day he died.
MrWaterlionmonkey 2 months ago
@MrWaterlionmonkey Charels Darwin did not believe in the God of the bible and his theories (beliefs) clearly show that.
You can't claim to be Chrsitian and then turn around and teach the exact opposite of what the bible teaches. It just does not work that way.
THERAPTURECOMES 2 months ago
@MrWaterlionmonkey You know whats really scary? The fact that what happened in Noah's day is going to happen again Luke 17:26.
Just look at the mass media promoting life in the universe and the belief in aliens, Babylon 5, SG1, SGAtlantis, Star trek in all of it forms, Star Wars, and on and in and on.
Look at the UFO interest world wide with sightings.
You will see the fallen angels come as aliens and pretend to be our creators and helpers.
You will see
THERAPTURECOMES 2 months ago
Total agreement with the arguments presented by John Lennox; Christendom should not be confused with true Chritianity, namelly first century Christianity, as taught by Jesus Christ and the Apostles.
Why are so many unable to separate the two, and why are the vast majority of so-called Christians so easily seduced by the teachings of Christendom, choosing, in the process, to reject the uncontaminated teachings of Christ and the Apostles?
STEVENDOES 2 years ago
Comment removed
StevendoesTasha 2 years ago
"Christiandom" OR "Germandom"?
The Germanization of Early Medieval Christianity
James C. Russell
While historians of Christianity have generally acknowledged some degree of Germanic influence in the development of early medieval Christianity, Russell goes further, arguing for a fundamental Germanic reinterpretation of Christianity.
Schnacht 2 years ago
"Christendom" is unbiblical. Violence is only in self-defense.
numberonesurvivor75 2 years ago
Christendom is doomed.
It has been found deficient.
It will soon be destroyed with all the REST of false religion!!
JWinCT 2 years ago
Deficient of what?
You'll become a Christian yet.
numberonesurvivor75 2 years ago
Already am!
Thanks.
Christendom is deficient just as ancient Babylon was deficient. Both HATE(d) the true God Jehovah, and both will have been destroyed by the climax of the Great Tribulation.
I look forward to the day when all the church buildings in my area come "mysteriously" crumbling to the ground by a mighty, invisible, all-powerful hand!!!!!
PRAISE JAH, YOU PEOPLE!!
And serve His king and Christ, Jesus!!
JWinCT 2 years ago
Matthew 13:24-30,36-43
MasterBathingBater 2 years ago
80% of Americans are christians and many Americans even christians support the War in Iraq.
MasterBathingBater 2 years ago
Hitler was a Catholic. Not a Christian.
JohnMuise 3 years ago
congratulations on your cursory understanding of history.
mgundy 2 years ago
catholic's are christians
TheEvolver311 2 years ago
I think many are but many are not. Catholics preach so many things that are not Biblical that it makes me sick.
JohnMuise 2 years ago
so do noncatholic's
TheEvolver311 2 years ago
"Hence today I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator by defending myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of the Lord."
-Adolf Hitler (Mein Kampf)
Hitler was no atheist, nor was the Nazi:
Gott Mit Uns (God is With Us) written on their belts.
ChemEBeaver 3 years ago
Goebbels notes in a diary entry in 1939: "The Führer is deeply religious, but deeply anti-Christian. He regards Christianity as a symptom of decay." Albert Speer reports a similar statement: You see, its been our misfortune to have the wrong religion. Why didnt we have the religion of the Japanese, who regard sacrifice for the Fatherland as the highest good? The Mohammedan religion too would have been much more compatible to us than Christianity. Why did it have to be Christianity..."
thehistorysage 3 years ago
So what are you trying to imply? Hittler and the Nazi did not like being Christians, and instead wish they were Shinto or Islam?
ChemEBeaver 3 years ago
Comment removed
thehistorysage 3 years ago
Not at all. I am stating they were not Christians by their very words. Of course Hitler did not come right out and tell the German people who had been Christians for more than a millenium that he was not a Christian and they couldn't be either.
Hitler tried to use propoganda to bring Christianity into the fold of Nazism. When that failed he simply closed down churches and restated his position: "One is either a Christian or a German," he said. "You can't be both."
thehistorysage 3 years ago
goebbel sure, but what he have written and spoken from hitler directly is that he is a christian.
TheEvolver311 2 years ago
Goebbels was quoting Hitler. Surely you're not suggesting Hitler was an honest man? What Hitler said in public was propoganda designed to comfort the millions of Christians that he sought to charm into performing his evil deeds, and he succeeded.
Goebbels knew Hitler better than anyone, I trust his account of what Hitler said in private far more than I trust anything Hitler said to beguile his public.
thehistorysage 2 years ago
i would say that hitler honestly believed the things he said and wrote. a desire for a change of attitude is all that hitler expressed not a desire for a change of faith, he simply wished that christians were more willing to take up arms; not that he wished them not to be christians.
it is all too simple to dismiss the deep love for his version of christianity, as many of your types do.
TheEvolver311 2 years ago
Hitler didn't say or believe half of the things he spoke of. Kinda like the pact he signed with Stalin not to invade the Soviet Union.
To claim that what Hitler said to beguile the public was closer to the truth than what he discussed with his inner circle and trusted lieutenants is an exercise in intellectual dishonesty.
thehistorysage 2 years ago
lol whatever "kinda like the pact.." so what he broke a treaty, that happens all the time. of course he never intended to keep the treaty he openly says that he hates communism and liberalism in his book.
TheEvolver311 2 years ago
Exactly, you make my point for me. Hitler was not a paragon of honesty. What he told his Christian public to extract obediance was far less trustworthy than what he told his lieutenants.
thehistorysage 2 years ago
hitler was like lots of christians he had challenges to his faith, but he remained a christian dispite any doubts etc...
and i think the point you are missing is that it was all done by the germans in the name of god. it doesn't matter really what a few individuals believe because nazism by in large was facilitated by the christians of germany. the hand fulls of diabolical men we read about could never have done what they did if the german people didn't feel it was in line with christianity.
TheEvolver311 2 years ago
You are a historical revisionist sir, nothing was done in Nazi Germany in the name of God. I am an honest person, there are terrible things in history done in the name of God. Some of the Crusades, the Spanish Inquisition, the Witch trials of the late Rennaisance. These are horrible events done "In the name of God." Nazi Germany was never in it's time, nor in any other considered a theocracy, or even governed under general Christian principle. Hitler shut down churches, he didn't open them.
thehistorysage 2 years ago
hitler in nearly every speach envoked the christian god, the local churches supported the nazi's. hitler told the people that it was for jesus that we must get rid of the jews... etc.... you don't have to be a theocracy to do things on the behest of your majority religion.
in america we have no official religion, yet God is envoked for war,social programs,and for general speaking with the public;
TheEvolver311 2 years ago
Again you are a revisionist of the worst kind. You want to spin a few statements intended to beguile a majority Christian public into something that fits comfortably in your world view. It doesn't. Hitler closed churches, church schools, and had clergy that wouldn't cotton to his ideas imprisoned and deported. Bormann stated publicly in 1941 on the behalf of the Fuhrer "National Socialism and Christianity are irreconcilable." Hitler said whatever the public wanted to hear to enforce his will.
thehistorysage 2 years ago
you like to ignore things like the support of Deutsche Christen(german christians) for the nazi's. even the early opposition from the Bekennende Kirche switched to praising loyalty to hitler.
Gerhard Engel, one of Hitler's generals, reported that Hitler had told him: "I am now as before a Catholic and will always remain so" (in an entry in Engel's diary during 1941)
the nazi's promoted what is called "positive christianity" which is what most KKK and other anti-semetic christians believe
TheEvolver311 2 years ago
I'm not ignoring anything, millions of Christians fought for and aided the Nazis. Millions more fought against them.
Gerhard Engel was a third rate division commander. He ranked not at all in Hitler's confidants. Goebbels was in Hitler's inner circle. Please, this is becoming ridiculous, you don't know history if you claim Hitler was honest to his citizenry, or that Engel, (who admitted that he rewrote an edited the diaries that you're quoting after the war), knew Hitler's mind.
thehistorysage 2 years ago
Well Communism as part of its core is a separation of a belief from God. I agree Atheism is not a dogma in that it isn't a view that has universal concepts within it's members. Take the skeptical view of the Resurrection. All atheists believe that it didn't take place but their reasons for believing so, differ GREATLY. The problem occurs when skepticism is presented as the default position when the position itself is so varied.
thetruthnothingless 3 years ago
Reasons for not buying into the resurrection vary greatly?
It's more than absurdity and lacking evidence?
Mathenaut 3 years ago
It's more the interpretation of evidence than a lack of evidence I think...GA Wells would say that Christ never existed, others deny Resurrection on gospel dating or that Paul meant spiritual not body, or they were lying or they saw visions. They all can't be right. The first disciples can't have claimed resurrection of Jesus if he didn't exist? If the New Testament isn't usable text for analysis I don't understand why critics universally use it when critiquing Paul or sayings of Jesus.
thetruthnothingless 3 years ago
The consensus is that the character likely existed.
As for everything else...well, they all can't be right, sure, but they're all valid points against the natural order being randomly suspended.
As for using the bible to critique Paul or Jesus, those are just matters of consistency usually; atop the fact that there is no problem with accepting a claim in order to show it false.
Mathenaut 3 years ago
people claimed that their deities died and resurrected in all of prechristian history, are we saposed to believe that baal was real, or that budda really transended? no they are all equally nonsense.
TheEvolver311 2 years ago
Also, saying 'god is watching you' is an empty statement to people who have a radically different concept of what a god is. As far as they were concerned, their god well and approved what they were doing.
Mathenaut 3 years ago
Also, what is this Atheism = Communism ignorance?
Communism criticized concepts of god because it sought to replace devotion to a god with a devotion to the state. Replacing one blind ideology with another. This is why it is referred to as 'religion without a god'.
It is tiring to hear of Atheism spoken of as if it were dogma.
Please, highlight this dogma. Particularly the parts about 'no hope' and violent atrocity.
I can only hope that the point is taken.
Mathenaut 3 years ago