Further, MD's veiwed the torsos and once again, like the critics of the single bullet theory, examined all the wounds and concluded more than one bullet hit the torsos. The head shot tests are even more conclusive. Also on youtube. Low trajectory shot w/ soft points would have completely obliterated JFK's head. Knoll shot, w/ Oswald's ammo. left an exit wound in the wrong place. Guess which shot actually jived w/ the zapruder film, med evidence, and known xrays released to the public?
They hit bone in JFKs' back, where Oswald did not, likely changing the bullet path through the body drastically Further, they hit two ribs in Connolly instead of only one.Despite that remarkably they still recreated enough of the same wounds to prove their point. To date it's the most accurate recreation of the 2nd shot. It doesn't surprise me one bit the author of this video is trying to discredit it. It's like those Sasquatch folks realizing they've been studying a redneck in an ape suit
@frankdrebin I could agree with a single bullet except that this discovery reenactment shows the angle is too steep to cause jfk's wounds. if the shot had occured one or two seconds later, yes all wounds align. but not when jfk is sitting erect
They do explain why the bullet exited lower. It hit bone, where Oswald did not. Yet still recreated 5 of the 6 wounds nitwits have been saying for 50 years couldn't have come from 1 bullet. The bullet was still amazingly pristine, like the magic bullet. Which wasn't magic at all, and simply tumbled or yawed upon leaving JFK's throat, hitting bones in Connolly flat, instead of nose on. They more than made their point w/ this experiment.
@frankdrebin The main issue, is that one bullet couldn't have burst JFK's skull open, and went through his back and exited his neck so neatly. If it was the same round, then his neck would have been ripped open from the tumbling of the bullet.
@timthecoleman Ok, feel your trapezius muscle next to your spine. Now feel your neck and throat. That's soft tissue. Now, reach up and feel your head. Bone, very hard. A high powered rifle bullet entering the skull doesn't just punch one small hole, it creates a massive pressure wave due to the energy of the bullet's velocity. This causes a massive exit wound, and your head to literally explodes upon it's exit, though fragmented. Why military snipers refer to it as popping one's grape.
I just got donw watching the same documentary and they left out a lot of facts. Instead of shooing the riffle in 2minutes, shoot it in 6seconds like LHO (I dnt believe he did it personally I think he was the fall guy) and what about the fatal shot to the head and explain why JFK fell forward? this movie did nothing here.
There's going to be a little inaccuracy in any recreated model. After all, they didn't make the mold from JFK's actual torso, right? But, while they may not have positioned the torso or located the back wound *perfectly*, Myers' computer model has already shown that *A* single bullet trajectory is possible. This re-creation shows a bullet on a similar trajectory will behave as the so-called "Magic Bullet" is claimed to have done. Oswald from the Book Depository with the rifle, folks.
This is completely ridiculous. The people who take this video and say, AH YES, THERE WAS A CONSPIRACY! are uneducated. The wounds on JFK and the governor cannot be disputed. So, if you people don't think this was all done by one bullet, then how did these wounds occur? How did the wound appear on the governor's wrist? How did the wound appear in the governor's back and chest? Were these all separate bullets?
@tarheeljeef7 I could agree with the warren commission IF the throat wound on JFK pointed to the sixth floor, but as you can see from the Discovery re-enactment, it doesn't. Therefore there must be another explanation.
@tarheeljeef7 There was a sniper in the glove compartment placed there by the CIA to take out Governer Connolly's wrist. No matter how much you disprove the conspiracy BS, they deny it. Despite all the different variables involved, because the bullet didn't exit in the exact same spot, yet still created almost exactly the same wounds on Connolly. The children still want to have their fun. It's sad.
@frankdrebin First of all,there's no evidence oswald even shot the rifle,no credible witness can place him there,no one can prove he brought the rifle to work,and a bogus investigation under a mandate.What are we left to think sir?''The children want to still have their fun''?Oh yes,nice job pigeon holing anyone who is skeptical as ''children''.Sad?Ha...you sure are buddy
@MrKUBRICKIAN How's this; Oswald owned the rifle, his wife took pctutes of him w/ it. People at the range confirmed he practiced w/ it, one even helped him zero his optical sight. He picked up the rifle from where his wife was staying the night before, where he normaly only visited on weekends. He told a co-worker who he drove to work w/ it was curtain rods. No curtain rods were ever found. But his prints were found, on the rifle, on the boxes he used to build the snipers nest. need i cont?
@frankdrebin Hey thanks for proving my point.Yeah,his co-worker,the same one who described a package that couldn't POSSIBLY be the rifle lol.Again,also,no evidence he fired the rifle that day,no credible witness could place him there at the time.You gonna continue to deflect,while i let the record reflect?
@MrKUBRICKIAN Yeah, so where are the curtain rods Oswald claimed were in the package? You do know rifles break down? Why were his prints on the weapon? Why was he pictured w/ it, and the 38 he killed Tippet with? Witnesses did place him there, one even heard the shells hitting the floor. Are you going to continue to ignore common sense to believe your boogey man fantasy, and wonder why people refer to you and those like you, as children? Let the record reflect? You're ignoring it.
@frankdrebin Of course i know rifles break down,problem is for you,if were going to believe frazier,then we have to also believe his eye witness testimony of how oswald carried it.And since it's IMPOSSIBLE,(going by frazier's own testimony),we have to strongly assume,this package did NOT...carry...the rifle.Witnesses hearing shells?Oh,and so from this,they could also magically see up through the floor it was oswald shooting?What the HELL does hearing shells have to do with eye witnesses??? lol
@MrKUBRICKIAN Again, where are the curtain rods? Why was his rifle missing from the garage where it was stored? Why did he leave the TSBD? Why did he shoot officer Tippet? How much more guilty could this guy have been? Why did Oswald tell a co-worker to leave the elevator door open on the 5th floor, thus making it inop for anyone else trying to get to the shooter's position? Now I feel like I am talking to a child. Yeah, a witness hearing shells and the bolt action is an important witness
@MrKUBRICKIAN You want to strongly assume that package didn't contain a rifle, b/c you absolutely have to for fantasy land to be true. Why couldn't he have carried it the way it was testified he did? Listen to yourself, jesus. Other witnesses saw oswald in the window before the shooting, oddly looking down elm street, instead of the direction the motorcade was coming. Imagine that. There's more evidence Oswald did the shooting, than there is of a 2nd shooter, or any conspiracy whatsoever.
@frankdrebin Strongly assume?The package found showed no trace,none,of a rifle ever being in there.Why couldn't he have carried it the way he testified?Frazier saw him holding it from under the armpit to the cup of his hand.The rifle is 3 feet long disassembled,frazier said the package was no more than 2 feet long.''Other witnesses saw oswald in the window before the shooting?No credible witness can put him there at the TIME!''LOL You keep spinning like a top pal(deep sigh)anything else?
@MrKUBRICKIAN Yeah, get some therapy. Stay away from sharp objects, Call the nurse if your straight jacket gets itchy. You haven't answered a single question I posed to you. Any witness who saw or identified Oswald at either murder scene isn't credible according to fruit bats like you. But, you'll gladly listen to someone who was feet from the JFK when his head blew up, but saw Jacky holding a fluffy dog, and badgeman on the grassy knoll. Again, why was Oswald's rifle there?
@frankdrebin ''Any witness who saw Oswald at either murder scene isn't credible to fruit bats like you''LOL Who is this witness you speak of,who saw him killing jfk,brennan?lmao!''Have you read this fruit bat's testimony...''fruit bat?''You'll gladly listen to someone who saw jackie holding a fluffy dog,and badgeman''?What?Who said i believed hill and the other lady?They were just as full as shit as brennan.Pretty pathetic pal,you put words in my mouth that i ever believed people like jean hill.
where this video continue??? Why only recreations form the bullet coming from the back. What about the shot in the head? That clearly shows it was from the front.
Recreation is being misrepresented by the editor/poster. The team performed a series of test shots, modifying the dummies each time. Once simulated tissue was added to the neck portion of the JFK dummy, the bullet exited from the throat, just as claimed by the WC. Plus the bullet from their final test bears an uncanny resemblance to the stretcher bullet. I guess they used a time machine to go back and plant one that would match in 1963....
All it proves is that their dummies weren't positioned correctly, or it wasn't an exact duplicate of JFK. The other mountain of evidence points to Oswald firing 3 shots, so the fact that their bullet exited in the wrong spot only proves that their model wasn't correct.
The fact is the bullet the government said hit Kennedy was in excellent condition, and those who know you can't expect a bullet not to have some kind of damage when it hits have every reason to doubt the final report. Like building 7 getting pulled on 9/11. Who benefits?
Check out the statement of ER Nurse Patricia Hutton.She assisted the Doctors that worked on JFK at Parkland.She held a pressure bandage on what she described as a HUGE EXIT wound in the REAR of his head.She said JFK had TWO ENTRANCE wounds from the FRONT.In order to supress the truth her statement was classified "Top Secret" for decades.
All Parkland Doctors also insist that JFK had TWO entrance wounds from the FRONT and a HUGE EXIT wound in the REAR.
The bottom line is that anyone with a pair of working eye-balls and a reasonably well working brain knows what happened that day. If you are waiting for the truth to come out publicly one day you are setting yourself up for a huge disappointment. They will continue trying to discount the "Conspiracy Theories" until the end of time but, the truth is self-evident....Oswald was a patsy.
I just finished watching "JFK: Beyond the Magic Bullet" on the Military Channel. Not only are they very selective in their analysis of "the first two shots", they don't even mention the kill shot (head) from the front and right of JFK, clearly showing a shot from the "grassy knoll".
It's amazing to me that all these years later they are still trying desperately to convince us of their official lies. Watch "Evidence of Revision", a 5 part series explaining the truth if really want to know.
At 0:58 seconds of your video shows an x ray were they used to metal markers to show entry and exit wounds.If you use a protractor to measure the angle of that wound it is only 21 degrees.The six story was an angle of at least 31 degrees as shown in frame 1:20 of this video again use a protractor .Simple math people figure it out !Iike how these experts prove the coonspiracy for us.You can tell a lie a million ways but the truth can be told only one way!
I agree, Which means instead of putting the 6th floor to rest, it opens up all sorts of possibilites, for instance, there must have been mulitple gun men (more than one) obviously in different areas. I also have seen a video recently which places the rear gun man inside the Dal Tex Building and not the 6th floor window. It also was very well done. I am convinced Oswald was innocent, and used as a bait and switch. Keeping the real assasin/assasins protected. Thanks Gianni
All this talk of the shot or shots that hit JFK in the back and out the neck, even it it had been one bullet, that one bullet did not make a U-turn and go back in to Kennedy's forehead. Am I the only one who knows that JFK also had an entry wound in his forehead and and exit wound in the crown of his head?
this is a bunch of B.S. What they are trying to do is, prove Spector's notion. They aren't interested in truth. As this video goes on, they make the bullet tumble to cause a 3cm entrance wound in Connally, which would prove the bullet tumbled, the problem is , the entrance hole as measured by Dr. Shaw is 1.6cm at its largest point. This fact is easily verifyable by reading Dr. Shaw's testimony for the W/C. This "exact recreation" proves the SBT, is NOT possible.
None of it makes sense. If Oswald wanted to make a name for himself, why do it with a rifle from a window? Why not just step off the curb and fire. I "lone nut" would be more likely to try something far less complicated. The chances of missing would be slim. And if he was trying to get away with it, why leave the rifle that could be traced to him?
THIS IS BULL SHIT IT PROVES THEY CANT REPLICATE THE SHOT CUZ MORE THAN ONE WEAPON WAS USED, jfk was going to expose the GLOBAL AGENDA PLAN and the false security of the federal reserve. he was killed over executive order 11110 which has to do with monetary policy in our gov. do yur research, learn your history, those who don,t are condemened to repeat it .........
THIS IS BULL SHIT IT PROVES THEY CANT REPLICATE THE SHOT CUZ MORE THAN ONE WEAPON WAS USED, jfk was going to expose the GLOBAL AGENDA PLAN and the false security of the federal reserve. he as killed over executive order 11110 which has to do with monetary policy in our gov. do yur research, learn your history, those who don,t are condemened to repeat it .........
i had recored this special a long time ago and could'nt really believe these so called reainactment test's first thing of all they say they are going to debunk what the conspiracy therioist have stated about th magic bullet when all the details about the bullet came from the warren commission themselves not the conspiracy believers they could'nt even redo it like the way it so called happen why not use a real moving target in a car and make all the wounds with one bullet? cuz it's impossible
I think they did not account for the President leaning forward at the time of the shot. This I think explains why the exit wound on the recreation is lower than it was on the President's body.
@LaynesAngryChair LOL I know! WTF? These test are only done to dispute conspiracy's, and to keep sheeple happy with exploding dummies. The tests look legit to the untrained eye because not everyone is a scientist. I bet most of the experiments done in this video are not that very accurate and if they are, they are only accurate towards what they want you to know.
This video goes far to highlight the amount of detail that went into this reconstruction. But one thing I've noticed is that the president's torso isn't hunched forward as much as he appears in either the Zapruder film or the computer animation. If the reconstructors got the position of his torso just a little bit off, it could account for why the bullet exits a few inches lower than it should have.
@F1NGER you can do your own "re-enactment" use a stand-in seated like JFK. place marks on the entry and exits. it is way too steep coming from the 6th floor
Are you telling me that he had a direct shot with JFK coming right at him and he let him turn down towards Dealy Plaza? That is insane. The worst gumman in the world can hit a target when facing it directly. You guys are placing Oswald in the annals of the greatest shooters ever. Shortly after he ended up in the Texas Theater and in a matter of minutes the building was surrounded by tons law enforcement people. How did they even know he was the guy, or for that matter in the Texas Theater?
First let me make a few points on this whole situation. 1. Is anyone familiar with Lee Harvey Oswald's military record in the Marine Corps? There are three classifications of rifleman in the Marine Corps. Marksman, Sharpshooter, and Expert.
Marksman is the lowest of the three. When you shoot Marksman, you have barely qualified as a rifleman. Oswald was a Marksman. I challenge any of you to go out and talk to a sniper and ask what the hardest target to hit when in the field. The answer without any doubt will be a moving target. 2. Has anyone been to The School Book Depository Building in Dealy Plaza? Well, I have been there. I studied that area where Oswald supposedly made his shot.
Marksman is the lowest of the three. When you shoot Marksman, you have barely qualified as a rifleman. Oswald was a Marksman. I challenge any of you to go out and talk to a sniper and ask what the hardest target to hit when in the field. The answer without any doubt will be a moving target. 2. Has anyone been to The School Book Depository Building in Dealy Plaza? Well, I have been there. I studied that area where Oswald supposedly made his shot.
I would go so far as to say that I would bet my life on it that the shot can't be made. I looked at it from every angle possible. The thing that annoys me most is that everyone has all of these theories about Oswald and this shot, but they haven't looked at the one place where it supposedly occurred. I'm watching the show right now, and the person shooting the targets seems like he is an incredible marksman.
coming directly at him on Houston St? Even the worst shot in the world would have had a chance in this instance. It just doesn't make any sense that he would allow him to turn down into Dealy Plaza. He could have gotten off a dozen or more shots with him coming directly at him. There is not enough room in the SBD for an angle to get those shots off. I looked at it from every different position. Impossible, no other way to put it.They wanted to cover this up as quickly as possible.
If you look at Myers SB recreation, he cheats. With a marker he pinpoints the back/entry wound pretty precisely, but when the camera does a 180 turn to show the throat position, the entry wound then raises somewhat to the neck area. Very sneaky and took me a while to pick it up.
I'm not denying how great a shot you were, I was very good one myself. After being in the SBDB for a visit and looking at it from all angles for over a hour, I know there is no way Oswald could have made the shot. I'm not sure if you ever visited before, but I can honestly say that, if you would did, you would know exactly what I am talking about. Here's another thing! Why would Oswald wait for the limo to go down through Dealy Plaza when he had a direct shot at him when he was
I'm not denying how great a shot you were, I was very good one myself. After being in the SBDB for a visit and looking at it from all angles for over a hour, I know there is no way Oswald could have made the shot. I'm not sure if you ever visited before, but I can honestly say that, if you would did, you would know exactly what I am talking about. Here's another thing! Why would Oswald wait for the limo to go down through Dealy Plaza when he had a direct shot at him when he was
I'm not denying how great a shot you were, I was very good one myself. After being in the SBDB for a visit and looking at it from all angles for over a hour, I know there is no way Oswald could have made the shot. I'm not sure if you ever visited before, but I can honestly say that, if you would did, you would know exactly what I am talking about. Here's another thing! Why would Oswald wait for the limo to go down through Dealy Plaza when he had a direct shot at him when he was
@vydeoynkhorne You call shooting 3 bullets in 5.6 seconds through some trees at a target that is moving away from you easy?! lol, I wouldn't want to get on your bad side. EVERYONE ASK YOURSELF THIS: IF OSWALD WAS THE SHOOTER, WHY DIDN'T HE START TO SHOOT ON HOUSTON ST. WHEN HE HAD THE BEST ANGLE? JFK WOULD BE MOVING TOWARDS HIM WITH NOTHING OBSTRUCTING THE HIS VIEW. IF YOU DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER ILL TELL YOU. THE SHOOTING STARTED ON ELM ST. BECAUSE THEY NEEDED THE CAR TO BE IN A CROSSFIRE.
Its funny how they are still trying to cover it up so badly. HELLO! Not everyone is stupid! Please people, dont trust anything on TV! Sure its fun to watch, but do some research on things if you are not totally sure or have a suspicion towards something. Take this as an example, they are covering it up right in front of you and you probably didn't even notice.
@GOODY61 Never did any time in the military huh? Marksman: A classification in the U.S. Army and Marine Corps for the lowest of three ratings of rifle proficiency. Oswald scored 212 in December 1956[11] (slightly above the minimum for qualification as a sharpshooter) but in May 1959 scoring only 191[11] (barely earning the lower designation of marksman). (As per wikipedia.) 190 is minimum for marksman. By military standards LHO was not a good shot.
The problem is that he is sitting on a bench, and he has a high powered scope on his rifle. Everyone is giving Oswald too much credit when in fact he was a lousy shot. I am not denying that Oswald was a Communist sympathizer, but he definitely wasn't a Marksman. My theory is that they told him to take a few shots at Kennedy to let him know that if we want him, we can get him. The famous Mafia Hitman known as "The Iceman" explained how everything went down.
He has absolutely nothing to gain by his admission. He is doing life without the possibility of parole. It was three different gunman that were flown in from Italy. They were contracted by the Mafia. Here is my last and final point. When Kennedy's car made the right turn and was heading directly towards the book depository on Houston St, I would go so far to say that Oswald may have gotten lucky and killed him from there.
But why wouldn't he take the shots then? A perfect shot with him coming straight at him. No, he let him turn to get a better angle. Guys, this is really simple. I am almost ashamed to watch programs like this. The people researching this are brilliant scholars. They just don't have the correct facts. Start with Oswald and his position in the school book depository and you will know immediately that this feat was impossible!
The JFK neck shot came from the Del Tex building as it's the only place one can create that angle to achieve the back-neck wounds. The snipers were coordinated by radio, and the shooters fired simultaneaously to obscure the number of shots and positions. The Del Tex shooter's weapon was silenced to the degree possible. The shot that hit Connelly could have come from the TSBD while JFK's back-neck shot came from Del-Tex. The head shot came from the Grassy Knoll. This was a pro CIA-Mob hit, gents.
I just want to say that despite how meticulous your recreations may be, and no matter how precise you are, there is nothing one can do to exactly recreate something such as the Kennedy assassination. I just want to point out that bullets can do some crazy things, such as during the assault on Grenada, a pilot was shot in the thigh by a 7.62x39mm round fired from an AK-47, and the bullet ended up exiting out of the gap between his neck and collarbone. No internal organ damage, and lived as well.
@DawnOfDaybreak just want to point out that the recreation was repeated twice using standard forensic techniques. the throat trajectory must be wrong as established by the warren report as the recreation demonstrated it as too steep. therefore it was "exactly recreated twice" in this experiment. QED
ok so when you show what you the real exit wound at about 2:26 how come you are clearly showing the body in the front seat because you can see another stand behind it and to the left. so way to try and change the footage to show what you want ass hole! if you dont believe me go look at 1:38. cuz clearly there is no stand behind jfk's body. check it out ass you didnt find a discovery channel cover up. you just didnt like the actual truth so you had to try and change it to your liking.
Tipperary makes a few blatant misstatements. If you review witness accounts a majority actually heard shots come from the Knoll/Underpass area. Arnold and Zapruder said they thought they heard and felt shots pass near them from behind. Holland and others saw smoke hovering in the air from the fence area. Hoffman saw a man being tossed a rifle by a man in a suit. Bowers later admitted to Holland he saw something like a rifle being thrown in a trunk. Did Bowers fear speaking of the men he saw?
Come on people, stop all the name calling. (Animefareast) You make good points but come off as a tenth grader trying to sound tough to his thug friends.
Another thing to point out about this ass hole's video is that he shows the black torso used for the test shot, not the brown final torso used for the dupication shot. That torso is shown at the end of the documentary with the neck wound close to where the expected out wound was labeled.
@animefareast ...excuse me, did I mention conspiracy in this video? I only said the shot that hit jfk does not exit his throat ( you can see the warren exit at frame 2:30) when in actuality it would have exited his sternum. therefore the throat shot could only have occured as jfk leans forward
@animefareast you obviously don't pay attention to what is being said in the video. it never mentions conspiracy. I find "lone nuters" to be so oblivious to facts that they automatically get so defensive they won't listen. I am the narrator and I am not a jack hole. the only point is that the first shot could not have been made when the warren commision said it happened. it must have occured later because not all the wounds line up. is that a conspiracy???
@animefareast you obviously don't pay attention to what is being said in the video. it never mentions conspiracy. I find "lone nuters" to be so oblivious to facts that they automatically get so defensive they won't listen. I am the narrator and I am not a jack hole. the only point is that the first shot could not have been made when the warren commision said it happened. it must have occured later because not all the wounds line up. is that a conspiracy???
This is total crap. Google the videos "JFK-Case For Conspiracy I" and "JFK 2" then get back to me. Also look at "JfKLancerforum The bullet hole in the windshield" scroll all the way down the see the original bullet hole, compared to the fake replacement glass.
What fact? Oswald bought the rifle, he owned the rifle, his prints and fibres of his shirt were on the rifle, the CE399 bullet found on the stretcher in Parkland and the other bullet fragments found in the limo were matched to his rifle, witnesses saw him fire the rifle, he fled after the shooting, went home, got his revolver, later shot Officer Tippet and tried to shoot other cops when he was arrested at a movie theatre. Oswald was guilty.
@MrTipperaryMan The riffle was bought and delivered to frame him, most likely. The prints could have been made in the morgue. This doesn't mean there were no shooter from there, but it was not Oswald, because of the timing. And some photographs show that there were other people looking through the windows after the shooting, and these people were never accounted as witnesses...
The rifle and a .38 was purchased from a sporting good magazine by Oswald using a mail order filled out in his own handwriting.
The print were found on the rifle before Oswald was murdered - the Dallas police dusted the dissembled rifle barrel and found his palm print. The rifle and palm print were sent to the FBI crime lab and authenticated.
The photos of the TSBD show only employees of the company looking out the windows. All of them were accounted for as witnesses.
That you can't exactly recreate the actual trajectory doesn't mean it wasn't possible. Let's say I shuffle a deck of cards and deal out a poker hand. I point to the cards and say "what were the odds of my having dealt that exact hand?" They'd be vanishingly small -- and yet it happened!
While the odds of any exact trajectory were tiny, there were many qualitatively similar possibilities. And their test showed that they were all possible.
This is all beside the main issue. The fatal and final shot threw JFK back and to the left indicating a shot from the front right and not from behind.
There were two wounds in Kennedy's head - the entry wound in the back of the head and the massive exit on the right side which tore open his skull. The bullet could only have come from above and behind and nowhere else. The exiting bullet blew out a 'jet' of brain matter and blood which could have pushed the head back - this was proven in experiment by Dr. Luis Alvarez a Nobel physicist. Also when people are shot in the head, massive neural damage causes involuntary spasms.
@MrTipperaryMan The spasm point is only a hypothesis advanced to fit the conclusion. It's reverse reasoning. You can be killed instantly without spasms. This one will never be fully plausible because we can't ask Mr. Kennedy how he felt at the moment of his death...
The Warren Commission conducted a test in which a goat was shot in the head. The animal spasmed after it was shot. It is therefore obvious that this is what happened to the President.
The physical evidence - the actual wound to Kennedy's head - show a bullet struck the back of the skull and exited the top front right side of the head creating the massive fatal exit wound.
Vydeoynkorne's "rebuttal" of the Discovery Channel recreation leaves much more to be desired than the recreation itself. Rather than conduct a formal analysis of the recreation, which does provide reasons why the bullet behaved as it did in the recreation, Vydeoynkorne instead focuses in on the one "missed" element, i.e., the neck wound only. In essence, the rebuttal argues against the "magic bullet theory" because a complex recreation could not exactly duplicate one of the wounds.
@ErikTheBigKMan - JFK's front right portion of his head was blown out and he was thrown back and to the left therefore indicating a strong possibility of a second shooter from the front right. It's obvious and of course the US government don't care about how obvious it is, they just deny deny deny like usual. But anyone who can think for themselves can see that it wasn't a lone gunman from the rear that shot JFK. Case closed.
@MassacreBlast - I guess I should say at this point that I find Bugliosi's massive tome to definitely put to rest such conspiracy theories as you postulate. The fact that the front right portion of Kennnedy's head was blown "out" is ballistically consistent with an "exiting" projectile rather than an entering one. Sorry, but that is the basic ballistics and physics of that wound.
@ErikTheBigKMan - Yeah I'm looking into that, it would seem that the exit wound and how violent it was also threw him back. I can also see right when he gets hit he moves forward. So it entered, he jerked forward, then it exited and blew out his head throwing him in the opposite direction.
@MassacreBlast - Right. There is a lot of excitement among the consipiracy theory crowd to keep the heat on, but sometimes a bullet is just following a complex trajectory in a dynamic environment. Nothing magical about it, just complex.
@ErikTheBigKMan - So the shot came from behind. However I'm still puzzled about the hole in the windshield, the bullet that hit the curb and nicked Tague in the cheek. There has to be at least 4 shots fired which makes the lone gunman theory fall apart.
@MassacreBlast - see page 57 of Bugliosi's Reclaiming History: "Twenty-three feet from the east face of the underpass, along the south curb of Main Street, [deputy sheriff] Walthers spots a mark ont he top of the curb. it is quite obvious to both of them [Walthers and Tague] that the fresh gash was made by a bullet, and from the angle of the mark, it came from the direction of the Texas School Book Depository."
@ErikTheBigKMan - Yeah, that clears that up. I'm still wondering about the hole in the windshield and upon further research there was apparently a bullet that got stuck in the ground and some unknown blonde man confiscated it? Perhaps I'm getting into complete BS but there are a few people who were there that are saying that even today still.
@MassacreBlast - I guess I would suggest that your best starting point would be Bugliosi's book which is available on the bargain table. It is exhaustive and a massive read. However, he handles everything that is credible...just because someone claims something, that does not make it credible. One of the worst forms of evidence is eye-witness accounts. If you have ever been at a crime scene or accident, you will notice the lengthy procedure for processing "witnesses" by law enforcement.
@MassacreBlast - For example, some "witnesses" claimed to have heard multiple shots, but there were only three casings located in the sniper's nest. Virgie Rachley down on street level in front of the Book Depository, hears SHOT 1 and sees "sparks fly off the pavement in the far left lane, right behind the presidential limosine. She thinks it's a firecracker thrown by some boys who are fixing to get in a lot of trouble" (Bugliosi, p39). It was not a firecracker despite her witnessing it as so
@MassacreBlast - "Secret service agent Paul Landis, riding on the right running board of the Secret Service follow-up car, knows immediately what the sound is - the report of a high-powered rifle coming from over his right shoulder" (Bugliosi, p39). Landis will not see Oswald's rifle poking out of the 6th floor, nor anyone in the crowd with a gun, nor any tire damage if it is a blowout, but he pulls his gun because he knows something is wrong.
@MassacreBlast - Officer Marrion L. Baker in motorcycle escort seven cars back from the presidential limosine knows it is a high-powered rifle, too, having recently returned from a hunting trip. "He sees a great number of pigeons flying around the top of the Texas Schoolbook Depository Building and suspects a sniper is firing from the roof" (Bugliosi, p.39). He does not see the rifle sticking out of the window because he is not there, yet, but guns his bike ahead to the location.
@MassacreBlast - "Twenty-year-old high school dropout James R. Worrell Jr. is standing right in front of the Book Depository...When he hears the first shot, Worrell throws his head back, looks straight up and sees 6 inches of gun barrel with the forepart of the stock sticking out of a window high overhead on the southeasternmost side of the building" (Bugliosi pp.39-40). So, here are four witnesses to the first shot, and only one of them actually sees the gun that is responsible.
@MassacreBlast - at 3.5 seconds after the first shot, another shot rings out so loudly on the fifth floor of the Book Depository that "the windows rattle, and loose plaster and dirt fall from the ceiling onto Bonnie Ray Williams's hair" (Bugliosi, p.40). Charles Brehm and his son standing about 20 feet away from the presidential limo see Kennedy stiffen and his hands "swoop toward his throat" (Bugliosi p.40). Agent Kellerman sees that Connally is also in clear distress.
@MassacreBlast - Howard Brennan sees the third shot fired since he is looking directly at the gunman as he fires, but he cannot see if the shot hit its mark since the presidential limo is blocked from his view (Bugliosi, p.41). Some say it was impossible for Oswald to fire 3 shots in 8.4 seconds. Yes, it is impossible, but he only shot 2 in that time, we don't know how long he sat there lining up shot 1, which missed! Subsequent shots would be more accurate as he find his range.
Look up Mary Ferrell's website - she believes in a conspiracy - and her multi-media collection shows a color photo of the windshield. There was a spider web crack caused by a bullet fragment hitting the inside of the glass. The chrome frame of the windshield was also dented. Fragments of a bullet were found on the front seat of the limo. Fragments were found inside JFK's head. It is likely the 'hole' was caused by the headshot bullet.
@MrTipperaryMan - Like I give a fuck about arguing with you. JFK was killed because the ones truly in power are soulless war mongering lunatics. JFK had his head on his shoulders and didn't want war and corruption. So they killed him because he was actually trying to be a president instead of a puppet. War = Big Bucks and more land and power. It's no surprise that when that redneck Johnson came into office that he immediately went to war.
JFK was killed because he was riding in an open car. Anybody could have attacked and killed him with a rifle. Oswald was a crazed lonely man who craved fame and got it by shooting the President. He saw the route of the motorcade in a local paper, he saw his chance and he brought his rifle work the morning of the assassination.
@MrTipperaryMan - Shooting AT LEAST 3 shots from a bolt action rifle from several yards away in 7.5 seconds is near impossible. I think my explanation makes more sense since we all know that war is something that followed many of the major US disasters in history. After JFK was killed, we went to war. After 9-11 we went to war. After the sinking of the Maine, we went to war. War = Money, end of story. It's all business in the eyes of the ruling class. They're reptiles (not literally).
This guy fires the same make and model rifle in less than 6 secs.
watch?v=a9uIZJqzLc0&feature=related
This guy fires the same make and model rifle mounted with 4x scope exactly the same as Oswald rifle in 5.1 secs.
watch?v=h4c5Zr7hzzA
This video shows a simulation by CBS in 1967. A panel of riflemen took turns to fire Mannlicher-Carcano rifle mounted with 4x scopes at moving targets on a rail simulating the speed and position of JFK and his limo.
@MrTipperaryMan - Okay, granted that man fired the shots in under 7.5 seconds. Do you think he could have hit a man's head from almost 100 yards away while firing that quickly? It seems unlikely unless Oswald was one of the best riflemen in the world, which he wasn't known for by the way.
However, keep ignoring the fact that war is what America wants, and everytime a disaster strikes, war follows.
The best way to look at these cases is to see, who benefits. That's the primary motive.
Like all Marines, Oswald was trained and tested in riflery, scoring 212 in December 1956 (slightly above the minimum for qualification as a sharpshooter) but in May 1959 scoring only 191(barely earning the lower designation of marksman).
With his training he was more than capable of hitting a target at distance of 88 yds or less in Dealey Plaza.
Besides with the 4x scope the distance was just over twenty yards.
Firing at a target moving slowly at 11mph? Two out of 3 hits? Easy.
@MrTipperaryMan - Easy? You're forgetting the speed factor and the fact that he'd most likely be nervous since he'd be shooting at the President of the United States of America.
While it is possible for him to have done it, it's a slim chance. You're on the losing side when you look at the odds. Have you ever heard Lee Bowers testimony? He heard the first shot then the second and third were almost on top of each other. He was quite certain of what he heard. He ended up dead shortly after.
@MassacreBlast - You also need to understand that JFK wanted to pull out of Vietnam, and also eliminate the Federal Reserve. This is BIG business, perhaps the biggest. While he was 100% correct in wanting to do those things, there are certain scumbags that are far too greedy and power hungry to let that happen. They had JFK killed pure and simple. The motive was the oldest one in the book.
All the circumstantial, primary, secondary and physical evidence points to Oswald.
53 pieces of evidence link him to the shooting. In the real world it is impossible for an innocent person to have that much evidence against them and still be innocent.
Oswald's background has been gone over with a fine tooth comb. Practically everyone whoever met the man or knew him at one time or other was tracked down. His entire life is known almost day by day.
@MrTipperaryMan - Excuse me but Oswald never went to trial. But everyone says he's guilty. That's strange, I thought it was innocent until proven guilty?
The Warren Commission, the Clarke and Rockefeller and HSCA all concluded that Lee Harvey Oswald fired the fatal shots. The examined the evidence and interviewed witnesses to the murder of Kennedy and Oswald, interviewed investigating officers and came to the conclusion that Oswald's guilt was overwhelming.
in 1986 Vincent Bugliosi and Gerry Spence participated as prosecution and defence in a mock trial. Oswald was found guilty by the jury.
@MrTipperaryMan - Excuse me but he was never brought to trial. So shut your fucking mouth after that demonstrable fact. Seriously, you have no leg to stand on. Innocent until proven guilty motherfucker. That is the law, for a fucking reason. You know, I would argue other OBVIOUS points with you but this was kind of a thought experiment for me. To see if you could accept facts which you clearly cannot. I am therefore done with you and it's as simple as that. I'm done WASTING my time.
@MrTipperaryMan - No trial, no guilt. There are eye witness testimony to the contrary of a single shooter you know. I guess they were just confused though eh? Anything to make it seem like it was a one man show. Because it's too scary to think the American government isn't so nice after all? I don't know what your hang up is.
The irrefutable physical evidence proves beyond all doubt that three shots were fired from Oswald's gun and the two bullets that struck and killed Kennedy came from his rifle. No other rifles, bullets or spent shells were ever found. No witnesses saw any other gunmen nor were any other suspects taken into custody. Oswald acted alone. He was murdered by Ruby who murdered him on pure impulse during his transfer. No evidence whatsoever connected either man to a plot.
@MrTipperaryMan This is only what the Warren Commission deducted. Some evidence was tampered with, and most of the evidence could easily be replaced or destroyed by any authority.
@Simboiss Are you trying to suggest that hundreds of law enforcement officers who participated in the investigation were all in on the plot? Because that would have to be the case when you imply evidence was tampered with, replaced and destroyed.That's a hell of a lot of people who would have to told to shut up isn't it?
@MrTipperaryMan Military personnel work on orders and payrolls. If the evidence must go up to the con men, then it will. You can have a conspiracy with a few men, but many others who only follow orders...
People instinctively think that it demands hundreds of people to keep the secret. Because of hierarchy and compartmentalization, things can be done with the help of many people who are "only doing their job"...
Why would conspirators risk involving other people in their plot, giving them them to opportunity to put two and two together? Hundreds of people who as you say were following orders would quickly find out they were conned and would go directly to the press with the story. America in 1963 was not the Soviet Union. It had a free press. There is simply no way any conspirators would risk execution for treason by involving oyal Americans who swore an oath to serve and protect.
@MrTipperaryMan Not ALL the "greatest legal and scientific minds" agree that there was a single shooter. There is a lot of smoke, and men in power controlling pretty much everything to their favor. Think of it as the fox investigating the hen house...
Dr. Luis Alvarez, Nobel prize physicist and friend of the late President investigated the physics of the assassination - the famous 'back and to the left' head movement in the Zapruder film and concluded that the exiting matter from the head created a 'jet effect' which pushed the head in the opposite direction. He prove the shot could only have come from above and behind from the 6th floor window.
@MrTipperaryMan Since the wound is more like on the SIDE of the head, it could have been shot from the 2nd or 3rd floor of the Dal-Tex building, or from somewhere in front of the limo, but not DIRECTLY from the front. Either the picket fence, or from the top of the triple underpass...
The autopsy discovered an entry wound in the back of the head and that the huge hole in the top front right of the skull was a wound of exit. The only rifle and spent hulls found were in the TSBD. Film and photos of the grass knoll show no shooter and no witnesses saw a shooter there.
The overwhelming majority of witnesses heard three shots from the direction of the TSBD. Witnesses on the knoll who would have been standing only feet away from a supposed assassin behind the fence, saw and heard no assassin firing a rifle. Zapruder and his secretary who was holding him steady on the concrete pier near the pergola would have been in the supposed grassy knoll gunman's field of fire. No shells, rifle or suspect were ever found. The knoll shooter story is bullshit.
@MrTipperaryMan No. Just no. Many people walked or ran in the direction of the fence after the limo disappared under the triple underpass. We see that clearly in a film shot from the other side of Elm street (opposite to Zapruder). And no, Zapruder was not in the field of the shooter, not even close...
Zapruder was standing on a concrete pier directly in the field of fire for a grass knoll assassin. During the shooting numerous witnesses were standing on the knoll. They saw no assassin. The police officer who jumped off his bike and ran up the knoll was not even in the plaza at the time of the shooting.
We have already discussed the speed factor. I have already shown you that it is possible to fire three accurate shots with the Mannlicher-Carcano in less than 6 secs. He was nervous. Sure. Oswald missed with his first shot and followed it up with two hits.
It is not a 'slim' chance - the bullet and bullet fragments recovered were matched to his rifle excluding all other weapons. His palm print and shirt fibres were found on the rifle barrel. He was seen firing it at a JFK.
No witnesses saw anybody firing from behind the fence.
The films and photographs of the assassination do not show any person behind the picket fence. Lee Bowers, working in a railroad control tower, had an unobstructed view of the back of the picket fence. He did not see any assassin.
Kennedy was hit by two bullets in the back of the neck and the back of the head from the Depository sixth floor, proven by autopsy photos and x-rays and pathologist testimony.
@MrTipperaryMan Many experts tried to equal Oswald's alleged feat, but none succeeded. The Carcano itself is considered a mediocre rifle. The scope on the Carcano was deficient. And there was a tree in the line of sight from the 6th floor of the Book Depository...
This video shows a panel of riflemen recreating Oswald's feat on a range for a 1967 CBS news inquiry: watch?v=HsOEJF6qoy4. They fired three shots using the same model rifle at a moving head and shoulder size target in less than 5.6 secs moving on a rail replicating the movement of the car through Dealey Plaza.
This video shows that Oswald had a clear line of sight beyond the tree.
The ballistic evidence proves that a 6.5mm bullet wounded Kennedy in the back of the neck to the right of the spine exited the base of his throat, struck Connally in the upper back, exited his right chest below the nipple, passed through his right wrist as he held his Stetson across his lap and lodge in the flesh of his thigh. This trajectory is recreated in this documentary using anatomical surrogates
@MrTipperaryMan The best evidence was scraped at the hospital, and probably tampered with at the morgue, since the body was ILLEGALLY moved by authorities. You read correctly. ILLEGALLY. Read again. ILLEGALLY.
There is a continuous chain of custody for all of the evidence - none of tampered with. Kennedy was never put in the morgue. After his death his body was taken by plane to Bethesda Naval Hospital where the autopsy was performed.
The body was removed from Texas accompanied by President Johnson, Mrs. Kennedy and the rest of the Presidential entourage because of fears of a coup d'etat.
Oliver Stone and other theorists would have us believe, the CIA hired 3 or more shooters to kill Kennedy and it required them to fire 6 or more bullets to kill Kennedy.
Connally had five wounds to his body - back, chest, two holes in his wrist and a final wound in his thigh.
Stone claims one bullet could not have created seven wounds to both JFK and the Governor but is happy to believe 1 bullet created all of five wounds to Connolly?
Was Connolly shot 5 times? Just who was the target?
@MrTipperaryMan It doesn't work that way. First, Stone's movie is a movie, which means some artistic liberty was taken. And he doesn't have abolute proof of everything, just like the government or any other commission can have the absolute proof of everything.
The point is, as SOON as you have more than 1 shooter, you have a conspiracy. It could be 3, 4, 1000 shooters, whatever the number, it would be defined as a conspiracy.
Further, MD's veiwed the torsos and once again, like the critics of the single bullet theory, examined all the wounds and concluded more than one bullet hit the torsos. The head shot tests are even more conclusive. Also on youtube. Low trajectory shot w/ soft points would have completely obliterated JFK's head. Knoll shot, w/ Oswald's ammo. left an exit wound in the wrong place. Guess which shot actually jived w/ the zapruder film, med evidence, and known xrays released to the public?
frankdrebin 4 weeks ago
They hit bone in JFKs' back, where Oswald did not, likely changing the bullet path through the body drastically Further, they hit two ribs in Connolly instead of only one.Despite that remarkably they still recreated enough of the same wounds to prove their point. To date it's the most accurate recreation of the 2nd shot. It doesn't surprise me one bit the author of this video is trying to discredit it. It's like those Sasquatch folks realizing they've been studying a redneck in an ape suit
frankdrebin 4 weeks ago
@frankdrebin I could agree with a single bullet except that this discovery reenactment shows the angle is too steep to cause jfk's wounds. if the shot had occured one or two seconds later, yes all wounds align. but not when jfk is sitting erect
vydeoynkhorne 4 weeks ago
the shot did not come out the throte cuz they did not hit the jfk dumby in the right spot
movieman175 4 weeks ago
I like how you substituted in the test models that were used for aiming practice instead of the actual models that were used for the final test.
Boredman567 1 month ago
They do explain why the bullet exited lower. It hit bone, where Oswald did not. Yet still recreated 5 of the 6 wounds nitwits have been saying for 50 years couldn't have come from 1 bullet. The bullet was still amazingly pristine, like the magic bullet. Which wasn't magic at all, and simply tumbled or yawed upon leaving JFK's throat, hitting bones in Connolly flat, instead of nose on. They more than made their point w/ this experiment.
frankdrebin 2 months ago
@frankdrebin The main issue, is that one bullet couldn't have burst JFK's skull open, and went through his back and exited his neck so neatly. If it was the same round, then his neck would have been ripped open from the tumbling of the bullet.
timthecoleman 4 weeks ago
@timthecoleman Ok, feel your trapezius muscle next to your spine. Now feel your neck and throat. That's soft tissue. Now, reach up and feel your head. Bone, very hard. A high powered rifle bullet entering the skull doesn't just punch one small hole, it creates a massive pressure wave due to the energy of the bullet's velocity. This causes a massive exit wound, and your head to literally explodes upon it's exit, though fragmented. Why military snipers refer to it as popping one's grape.
frankdrebin 4 weeks ago
I just got donw watching the same documentary and they left out a lot of facts. Instead of shooing the riffle in 2minutes, shoot it in 6seconds like LHO (I dnt believe he did it personally I think he was the fall guy) and what about the fatal shot to the head and explain why JFK fell forward? this movie did nothing here.
matt2fresh84 3 months ago
There's going to be a little inaccuracy in any recreated model. After all, they didn't make the mold from JFK's actual torso, right? But, while they may not have positioned the torso or located the back wound *perfectly*, Myers' computer model has already shown that *A* single bullet trajectory is possible. This re-creation shows a bullet on a similar trajectory will behave as the so-called "Magic Bullet" is claimed to have done. Oswald from the Book Depository with the rifle, folks.
PaladinWF 6 months ago
This is completely ridiculous. The people who take this video and say, AH YES, THERE WAS A CONSPIRACY! are uneducated. The wounds on JFK and the governor cannot be disputed. So, if you people don't think this was all done by one bullet, then how did these wounds occur? How did the wound appear on the governor's wrist? How did the wound appear in the governor's back and chest? Were these all separate bullets?
tarheeljeef7 6 months ago
@tarheeljeef7 I could agree with the warren commission IF the throat wound on JFK pointed to the sixth floor, but as you can see from the Discovery re-enactment, it doesn't. Therefore there must be another explanation.
vydeoynkhorne 6 months ago
@tarheeljeef7 There was a sniper in the glove compartment placed there by the CIA to take out Governer Connolly's wrist. No matter how much you disprove the conspiracy BS, they deny it. Despite all the different variables involved, because the bullet didn't exit in the exact same spot, yet still created almost exactly the same wounds on Connolly. The children still want to have their fun. It's sad.
frankdrebin 5 months ago
@frankdrebin First of all,there's no evidence oswald even shot the rifle,no credible witness can place him there,no one can prove he brought the rifle to work,and a bogus investigation under a mandate.What are we left to think sir?''The children want to still have their fun''?Oh yes,nice job pigeon holing anyone who is skeptical as ''children''.Sad?Ha...you sure are buddy
MrKUBRICKIAN 2 months ago
@MrKUBRICKIAN what ever you say there, crazy train,
frankdrebin 2 months ago
@frankdrebin Wow what a rebuttal,you got me superstar.
MrKUBRICKIAN 2 months ago
@MrKUBRICKIAN How's this; Oswald owned the rifle, his wife took pctutes of him w/ it. People at the range confirmed he practiced w/ it, one even helped him zero his optical sight. He picked up the rifle from where his wife was staying the night before, where he normaly only visited on weekends. He told a co-worker who he drove to work w/ it was curtain rods. No curtain rods were ever found. But his prints were found, on the rifle, on the boxes he used to build the snipers nest. need i cont?
frankdrebin 2 months ago
@frankdrebin Hey thanks for proving my point.Yeah,his co-worker,the same one who described a package that couldn't POSSIBLY be the rifle lol.Again,also,no evidence he fired the rifle that day,no credible witness could place him there at the time.You gonna continue to deflect,while i let the record reflect?
MrKUBRICKIAN 2 months ago
@MrKUBRICKIAN Yeah, so where are the curtain rods Oswald claimed were in the package? You do know rifles break down? Why were his prints on the weapon? Why was he pictured w/ it, and the 38 he killed Tippet with? Witnesses did place him there, one even heard the shells hitting the floor. Are you going to continue to ignore common sense to believe your boogey man fantasy, and wonder why people refer to you and those like you, as children? Let the record reflect? You're ignoring it.
frankdrebin 2 months ago
@frankdrebin Of course i know rifles break down,problem is for you,if were going to believe frazier,then we have to also believe his eye witness testimony of how oswald carried it.And since it's IMPOSSIBLE,(going by frazier's own testimony),we have to strongly assume,this package did NOT...carry...the rifle.Witnesses hearing shells?Oh,and so from this,they could also magically see up through the floor it was oswald shooting?What the HELL does hearing shells have to do with eye witnesses??? lol
MrKUBRICKIAN 2 months ago
@MrKUBRICKIAN Again, where are the curtain rods? Why was his rifle missing from the garage where it was stored? Why did he leave the TSBD? Why did he shoot officer Tippet? How much more guilty could this guy have been? Why did Oswald tell a co-worker to leave the elevator door open on the 5th floor, thus making it inop for anyone else trying to get to the shooter's position? Now I feel like I am talking to a child. Yeah, a witness hearing shells and the bolt action is an important witness
frankdrebin 2 months ago
@MrKUBRICKIAN You want to strongly assume that package didn't contain a rifle, b/c you absolutely have to for fantasy land to be true. Why couldn't he have carried it the way it was testified he did? Listen to yourself, jesus. Other witnesses saw oswald in the window before the shooting, oddly looking down elm street, instead of the direction the motorcade was coming. Imagine that. There's more evidence Oswald did the shooting, than there is of a 2nd shooter, or any conspiracy whatsoever.
frankdrebin 2 months ago
@frankdrebin Strongly assume?The package found showed no trace,none,of a rifle ever being in there.Why couldn't he have carried it the way he testified?Frazier saw him holding it from under the armpit to the cup of his hand.The rifle is 3 feet long disassembled,frazier said the package was no more than 2 feet long.''Other witnesses saw oswald in the window before the shooting?No credible witness can put him there at the TIME!''LOL You keep spinning like a top pal(deep sigh)anything else?
MrKUBRICKIAN 2 months ago
@MrKUBRICKIAN Yeah, get some therapy. Stay away from sharp objects, Call the nurse if your straight jacket gets itchy. You haven't answered a single question I posed to you. Any witness who saw or identified Oswald at either murder scene isn't credible according to fruit bats like you. But, you'll gladly listen to someone who was feet from the JFK when his head blew up, but saw Jacky holding a fluffy dog, and badgeman on the grassy knoll. Again, why was Oswald's rifle there?
frankdrebin 2 months ago
@frankdrebin ''Any witness who saw Oswald at either murder scene isn't credible to fruit bats like you''LOL Who is this witness you speak of,who saw him killing jfk,brennan?lmao!''Have you read this fruit bat's testimony...''fruit bat?''You'll gladly listen to someone who saw jackie holding a fluffy dog,and badgeman''?What?Who said i believed hill and the other lady?They were just as full as shit as brennan.Pretty pathetic pal,you put words in my mouth that i ever believed people like jean hill.
MrKUBRICKIAN 2 months ago
@MrKUBRICKIAN You've been talking to me this whole time? I didn't get any notification there were responses.
frankdrebin 4 weeks ago
@frankdrebin What are you talking about?I haven't posted you.
MrKUBRICKIAN 4 weeks ago
@MrKUBRICKIAN Sorry.
frankdrebin 4 weeks ago
where this video continue??? Why only recreations form the bullet coming from the back. What about the shot in the head? That clearly shows it was from the front.
camelot28 7 months ago
Recreation is being misrepresented by the editor/poster. The team performed a series of test shots, modifying the dummies each time. Once simulated tissue was added to the neck portion of the JFK dummy, the bullet exited from the throat, just as claimed by the WC. Plus the bullet from their final test bears an uncanny resemblance to the stretcher bullet. I guess they used a time machine to go back and plant one that would match in 1963....
tjhoenecke 9 months ago
All it proves is that their dummies weren't positioned correctly, or it wasn't an exact duplicate of JFK. The other mountain of evidence points to Oswald firing 3 shots, so the fact that their bullet exited in the wrong spot only proves that their model wasn't correct.
handsomepete 9 months ago
The fact is the bullet the government said hit Kennedy was in excellent condition, and those who know you can't expect a bullet not to have some kind of damage when it hits have every reason to doubt the final report. Like building 7 getting pulled on 9/11. Who benefits?
Ellipser 10 months ago
Check out the statement of ER Nurse Patricia Hutton.She assisted the Doctors that worked on JFK at Parkland.She held a pressure bandage on what she described as a HUGE EXIT wound in the REAR of his head.She said JFK had TWO ENTRANCE wounds from the FRONT.In order to supress the truth her statement was classified "Top Secret" for decades.
All Parkland Doctors also insist that JFK had TWO entrance wounds from the FRONT and a HUGE EXIT wound in the REAR.
themeaningoflife38 10 months ago
The bottom line is that anyone with a pair of working eye-balls and a reasonably well working brain knows what happened that day. If you are waiting for the truth to come out publicly one day you are setting yourself up for a huge disappointment. They will continue trying to discount the "Conspiracy Theories" until the end of time but, the truth is self-evident....Oswald was a patsy.
Dr1Canuckchuck 10 months ago 2
I just finished watching "JFK: Beyond the Magic Bullet" on the Military Channel. Not only are they very selective in their analysis of "the first two shots", they don't even mention the kill shot (head) from the front and right of JFK, clearly showing a shot from the "grassy knoll".
It's amazing to me that all these years later they are still trying desperately to convince us of their official lies. Watch "Evidence of Revision", a 5 part series explaining the truth if really want to know.
Dr1Canuckchuck 10 months ago
At 0:58 seconds of your video shows an x ray were they used to metal markers to show entry and exit wounds.If you use a protractor to measure the angle of that wound it is only 21 degrees.The six story was an angle of at least 31 degrees as shown in frame 1:20 of this video again use a protractor .Simple math people figure it out !Iike how these experts prove the coonspiracy for us.You can tell a lie a million ways but the truth can be told only one way!
SuperWeier 11 months ago
I agree, Which means instead of putting the 6th floor to rest, it opens up all sorts of possibilites, for instance, there must have been mulitple gun men (more than one) obviously in different areas. I also have seen a video recently which places the rear gun man inside the Dal Tex Building and not the 6th floor window. It also was very well done. I am convinced Oswald was innocent, and used as a bait and switch. Keeping the real assasin/assasins protected. Thanks Gianni
giannivee1 11 months ago
great job
Bpeirce2 11 months ago
All this talk of the shot or shots that hit JFK in the back and out the neck, even it it had been one bullet, that one bullet did not make a U-turn and go back in to Kennedy's forehead. Am I the only one who knows that JFK also had an entry wound in his forehead and and exit wound in the crown of his head?
AdamRainStopper 11 months ago
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It should be called the deceivery channel.
TrueNovice 11 months ago
It should be be called thedeceivery channel
TrueNovice 11 months ago
this is a bunch of B.S. What they are trying to do is, prove Spector's notion. They aren't interested in truth. As this video goes on, they make the bullet tumble to cause a 3cm entrance wound in Connally, which would prove the bullet tumbled, the problem is , the entrance hole as measured by Dr. Shaw is 1.6cm at its largest point. This fact is easily verifyable by reading Dr. Shaw's testimony for the W/C. This "exact recreation" proves the SBT, is NOT possible.
whatdidulearn 1 year ago
None of it makes sense. If Oswald wanted to make a name for himself, why do it with a rifle from a window? Why not just step off the curb and fire. I "lone nut" would be more likely to try something far less complicated. The chances of missing would be slim. And if he was trying to get away with it, why leave the rifle that could be traced to him?
Autshot20 1 year ago
By the way, in this accurate recreation, was the target moving?
Autshot20 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
THIS IS BULL SHIT IT PROVES THEY CANT REPLICATE THE SHOT CUZ MORE THAN ONE WEAPON WAS USED, jfk was going to expose the GLOBAL AGENDA PLAN and the false security of the federal reserve. he was killed over executive order 11110 which has to do with monetary policy in our gov. do yur research, learn your history, those who don,t are condemened to repeat it .........
clone1eighty7 1 year ago
THIS IS BULL SHIT IT PROVES THEY CANT REPLICATE THE SHOT CUZ MORE THAN ONE WEAPON WAS USED, jfk was going to expose the GLOBAL AGENDA PLAN and the false security of the federal reserve. he as killed over executive order 11110 which has to do with monetary policy in our gov. do yur research, learn your history, those who don,t are condemened to repeat it .........
clone1eighty7 1 year ago
i had recored this special a long time ago and could'nt really believe these so called reainactment test's first thing of all they say they are going to debunk what the conspiracy therioist have stated about th magic bullet when all the details about the bullet came from the warren commission themselves not the conspiracy believers they could'nt even redo it like the way it so called happen why not use a real moving target in a car and make all the wounds with one bullet? cuz it's impossible
DB0175 1 year ago
It is unusual to see so many well reasoned and well thought out comments on a YouTube video especially on one of the conspiracy controversies.
IamtheBurceDickenson 1 year ago
I think they did not account for the President leaning forward at the time of the shot. This I think explains why the exit wound on the recreation is lower than it was on the President's body.
IamtheBurceDickenson 1 year ago
other goo?
LaynesAngryChair 1 year ago 5
@LaynesAngryChair LOL I know! WTF? These test are only done to dispute conspiracy's, and to keep sheeple happy with exploding dummies. The tests look legit to the untrained eye because not everyone is a scientist. I bet most of the experiments done in this video are not that very accurate and if they are, they are only accurate towards what they want you to know.
TPBXDRicky420 1 year ago
This video goes far to highlight the amount of detail that went into this reconstruction. But one thing I've noticed is that the president's torso isn't hunched forward as much as he appears in either the Zapruder film or the computer animation. If the reconstructors got the position of his torso just a little bit off, it could account for why the bullet exits a few inches lower than it should have.
F1NGER 1 year ago 10
@F1NGER you can do your own "re-enactment" use a stand-in seated like JFK. place marks on the entry and exits. it is way too steep coming from the 6th floor
vydeoynkhorne 1 year ago
Are you telling me that he had a direct shot with JFK coming right at him and he let him turn down towards Dealy Plaza? That is insane. The worst gumman in the world can hit a target when facing it directly. You guys are placing Oswald in the annals of the greatest shooters ever. Shortly after he ended up in the Texas Theater and in a matter of minutes the building was surrounded by tons law enforcement people. How did they even know he was the guy, or for that matter in the Texas Theater?
nscacpt 1 year ago
First let me make a few points on this whole situation. 1. Is anyone familiar with Lee Harvey Oswald's military record in the Marine Corps? There are three classifications of rifleman in the Marine Corps. Marksman, Sharpshooter, and Expert.
nscacpt 1 year ago
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Marksman is the lowest of the three. When you shoot Marksman, you have barely qualified as a rifleman. Oswald was a Marksman. I challenge any of you to go out and talk to a sniper and ask what the hardest target to hit when in the field. The answer without any doubt will be a moving target. 2. Has anyone been to The School Book Depository Building in Dealy Plaza? Well, I have been there. I studied that area where Oswald supposedly made his shot.
nscacpt 1 year ago
Marksman is the lowest of the three. When you shoot Marksman, you have barely qualified as a rifleman. Oswald was a Marksman. I challenge any of you to go out and talk to a sniper and ask what the hardest target to hit when in the field. The answer without any doubt will be a moving target. 2. Has anyone been to The School Book Depository Building in Dealy Plaza? Well, I have been there. I studied that area where Oswald supposedly made his shot.
nscacpt 1 year ago
I would go so far as to say that I would bet my life on it that the shot can't be made. I looked at it from every angle possible. The thing that annoys me most is that everyone has all of these theories about Oswald and this shot, but they haven't looked at the one place where it supposedly occurred. I'm watching the show right now, and the person shooting the targets seems like he is an incredible marksman.
nscacpt 1 year ago
@nscacpt I was an "expert" shot in my army days. the dealey plaza shot was what I would call "easy"
in spite of that I believe there was a conspiracy
vydeoynkhorne 1 year ago
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nscacpt 1 year ago
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nscacpt 1 year ago
coming directly at him on Houston St? Even the worst shot in the world would have had a chance in this instance. It just doesn't make any sense that he would allow him to turn down into Dealy Plaza. He could have gotten off a dozen or more shots with him coming directly at him. There is not enough room in the SBD for an angle to get those shots off. I looked at it from every different position. Impossible, no other way to put it.They wanted to cover this up as quickly as possible.
nscacpt 1 year ago
@nscacpt coming down Elm is the best shot. perhaps the chrome was too shiny and obscured the view, or reflections from the windshield hurt his eyes
vydeoynkhorne 1 year ago
@nscacpt Shooting while on Houston he would have secret service agents looking right at him.
genericgeorge 11 months ago
If you look at Myers SB recreation, he cheats. With a marker he pinpoints the back/entry wound pretty precisely, but when the camera does a 180 turn to show the throat position, the entry wound then raises somewhat to the neck area. Very sneaky and took me a while to pick it up.
genericgeorge 11 months ago
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I'm not denying how great a shot you were, I was very good one myself. After being in the SBDB for a visit and looking at it from all angles for over a hour, I know there is no way Oswald could have made the shot. I'm not sure if you ever visited before, but I can honestly say that, if you would did, you would know exactly what I am talking about. Here's another thing! Why would Oswald wait for the limo to go down through Dealy Plaza when he had a direct shot at him when he was
nscacpt 1 year ago
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I'm not denying how great a shot you were, I was very good one myself. After being in the SBDB for a visit and looking at it from all angles for over a hour, I know there is no way Oswald could have made the shot. I'm not sure if you ever visited before, but I can honestly say that, if you would did, you would know exactly what I am talking about. Here's another thing! Why would Oswald wait for the limo to go down through Dealy Plaza when he had a direct shot at him when he was
nscacpt 1 year ago
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I'm not denying how great a shot you were, I was very good one myself. After being in the SBDB for a visit and looking at it from all angles for over a hour, I know there is no way Oswald could have made the shot. I'm not sure if you ever visited before, but I can honestly say that, if you would did, you would know exactly what I am talking about. Here's another thing! Why would Oswald wait for the limo to go down through Dealy Plaza when he had a direct shot at him when he was
nscacpt 1 year ago
@vydeoynkhorne You call shooting 3 bullets in 5.6 seconds through some trees at a target that is moving away from you easy?! lol, I wouldn't want to get on your bad side. EVERYONE ASK YOURSELF THIS: IF OSWALD WAS THE SHOOTER, WHY DIDN'T HE START TO SHOOT ON HOUSTON ST. WHEN HE HAD THE BEST ANGLE? JFK WOULD BE MOVING TOWARDS HIM WITH NOTHING OBSTRUCTING THE HIS VIEW. IF YOU DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER ILL TELL YOU. THE SHOOTING STARTED ON ELM ST. BECAUSE THEY NEEDED THE CAR TO BE IN A CROSSFIRE.
TPBXDRicky420 1 year ago
Its funny how they are still trying to cover it up so badly. HELLO! Not everyone is stupid! Please people, dont trust anything on TV! Sure its fun to watch, but do some research on things if you are not totally sure or have a suspicion towards something. Take this as an example, they are covering it up right in front of you and you probably didn't even notice.
TPBXDRicky420 1 year ago
@nscacpt "Marksman" was the certification Oswald attained. This shot iis easily a makeable shot for someone with that certification.
GOODY61 1 year ago
@GOODY61 Never did any time in the military huh? Marksman: A classification in the U.S. Army and Marine Corps for the lowest of three ratings of rifle proficiency. Oswald scored 212 in December 1956[11] (slightly above the minimum for qualification as a sharpshooter) but in May 1959 scoring only 191[11] (barely earning the lower designation of marksman). (As per wikipedia.) 190 is minimum for marksman. By military standards LHO was not a good shot.
Ahlywog 1 year ago
@Ahlywog but certainly good enough to make the JFK shot which is not a tough shot by military standards.
GOODY61 1 year ago
The problem is that he is sitting on a bench, and he has a high powered scope on his rifle. Everyone is giving Oswald too much credit when in fact he was a lousy shot. I am not denying that Oswald was a Communist sympathizer, but he definitely wasn't a Marksman. My theory is that they told him to take a few shots at Kennedy to let him know that if we want him, we can get him. The famous Mafia Hitman known as "The Iceman" explained how everything went down.
nscacpt 1 year ago
He has absolutely nothing to gain by his admission. He is doing life without the possibility of parole. It was three different gunman that were flown in from Italy. They were contracted by the Mafia. Here is my last and final point. When Kennedy's car made the right turn and was heading directly towards the book depository on Houston St, I would go so far to say that Oswald may have gotten lucky and killed him from there.
nscacpt 1 year ago
But why wouldn't he take the shots then? A perfect shot with him coming straight at him. No, he let him turn to get a better angle. Guys, this is really simple. I am almost ashamed to watch programs like this. The people researching this are brilliant scholars. They just don't have the correct facts. Start with Oswald and his position in the school book depository and you will know immediately that this feat was impossible!
nscacpt 1 year ago
nanana ur president got shot la la la la :D
oskaras77 1 year ago
The JFK neck shot came from the Del Tex building as it's the only place one can create that angle to achieve the back-neck wounds. The snipers were coordinated by radio, and the shooters fired simultaneaously to obscure the number of shots and positions. The Del Tex shooter's weapon was silenced to the degree possible. The shot that hit Connelly could have come from the TSBD while JFK's back-neck shot came from Del-Tex. The head shot came from the Grassy Knoll. This was a pro CIA-Mob hit, gents.
videocanone 1 year ago
I just want to say that despite how meticulous your recreations may be, and no matter how precise you are, there is nothing one can do to exactly recreate something such as the Kennedy assassination. I just want to point out that bullets can do some crazy things, such as during the assault on Grenada, a pilot was shot in the thigh by a 7.62x39mm round fired from an AK-47, and the bullet ended up exiting out of the gap between his neck and collarbone. No internal organ damage, and lived as well.
DawnOfDaybreak 1 year ago
@DawnOfDaybreak just want to point out that the recreation was repeated twice using standard forensic techniques. the throat trajectory must be wrong as established by the warren report as the recreation demonstrated it as too steep. therefore it was "exactly recreated twice" in this experiment. QED
vydeoynkhorne 1 year ago
ok so when you show what you the real exit wound at about 2:26 how come you are clearly showing the body in the front seat because you can see another stand behind it and to the left. so way to try and change the footage to show what you want ass hole! if you dont believe me go look at 1:38. cuz clearly there is no stand behind jfk's body. check it out ass you didnt find a discovery channel cover up. you just didnt like the actual truth so you had to try and change it to your liking.
mtconquest 1 year ago
they didnt think to clothe them?
uhtom 1 year ago
Tipperary makes a few blatant misstatements. If you review witness accounts a majority actually heard shots come from the Knoll/Underpass area. Arnold and Zapruder said they thought they heard and felt shots pass near them from behind. Holland and others saw smoke hovering in the air from the fence area. Hoffman saw a man being tossed a rifle by a man in a suit. Bowers later admitted to Holland he saw something like a rifle being thrown in a trunk. Did Bowers fear speaking of the men he saw?
Exiles800 1 year ago
Come on people, stop all the name calling. (Animefareast) You make good points but come off as a tenth grader trying to sound tough to his thug friends.
catfish561000 1 year ago
Another thing to point out about this ass hole's video is that he shows the black torso used for the test shot, not the brown final torso used for the dupication shot. That torso is shown at the end of the documentary with the neck wound close to where the expected out wound was labeled.
Nice try cocksucker....warren report 1, idiot dumbfucker 0
animefareast 1 year ago
@animefareast ...excuse me, did I mention conspiracy in this video? I only said the shot that hit jfk does not exit his throat ( you can see the warren exit at frame 2:30) when in actuality it would have exited his sternum. therefore the throat shot could only have occured as jfk leans forward
vydeoynkhorne 1 year ago
The narrator is a stupid jack hole and all conspiracy believers are fucken idiots.
animefareast 1 year ago
@animefareast you obviously don't pay attention to what is being said in the video. it never mentions conspiracy. I find "lone nuters" to be so oblivious to facts that they automatically get so defensive they won't listen. I am the narrator and I am not a jack hole. the only point is that the first shot could not have been made when the warren commision said it happened. it must have occured later because not all the wounds line up. is that a conspiracy???
vydeoynkhorne 1 year ago
@animefareast you obviously don't pay attention to what is being said in the video. it never mentions conspiracy. I find "lone nuters" to be so oblivious to facts that they automatically get so defensive they won't listen. I am the narrator and I am not a jack hole. the only point is that the first shot could not have been made when the warren commision said it happened. it must have occured later because not all the wounds line up. is that a conspiracy???
vydeoynkhorne 1 year ago
@vydeoynkhorne they should have done a shot from the daltex building
imasoulman01 1 year ago
did they calculate the wind?
demonman520 1 year ago
This is total crap. Google the videos "JFK-Case For Conspiracy I" and "JFK 2" then get back to me. Also look at "JfKLancerforum The bullet hole in the windshield" scroll all the way down the see the original bullet hole, compared to the fake replacement glass.
sargoth37 1 year ago
I know for a fact that LHO did not act alone.
AXELOPS 1 year ago
@AXELOPS
What fact? Oswald bought the rifle, he owned the rifle, his prints and fibres of his shirt were on the rifle, the CE399 bullet found on the stretcher in Parkland and the other bullet fragments found in the limo were matched to his rifle, witnesses saw him fire the rifle, he fled after the shooting, went home, got his revolver, later shot Officer Tippet and tried to shoot other cops when he was arrested at a movie theatre. Oswald was guilty.
MrTipperaryMan 1 year ago
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@MrTipperaryMan
Yeah, you keep telling yourself that.
AXELOPS 1 year ago
@MrTipperaryMan The riffle was bought and delivered to frame him, most likely. The prints could have been made in the morgue. This doesn't mean there were no shooter from there, but it was not Oswald, because of the timing. And some photographs show that there were other people looking through the windows after the shooting, and these people were never accounted as witnesses...
Simboiss 1 year ago
@Simboiss
The rifle and a .38 was purchased from a sporting good magazine by Oswald using a mail order filled out in his own handwriting.
The print were found on the rifle before Oswald was murdered - the Dallas police dusted the dissembled rifle barrel and found his palm print. The rifle and palm print were sent to the FBI crime lab and authenticated.
The photos of the TSBD show only employees of the company looking out the windows. All of them were accounted for as witnesses.
MrTipperaryMan 1 year ago
That you can't exactly recreate the actual trajectory doesn't mean it wasn't possible. Let's say I shuffle a deck of cards and deal out a poker hand. I point to the cards and say "what were the odds of my having dealt that exact hand?" They'd be vanishingly small -- and yet it happened!
While the odds of any exact trajectory were tiny, there were many qualitatively similar possibilities. And their test showed that they were all possible.
ApolloWasReal 1 year ago
@ApolloWasReal Yes, just like it's possible that one or more shots came from the picket fence or the triple underpass or the Dal-Tex building...
Simboiss 1 year ago
This is all beside the main issue. The fatal and final shot threw JFK back and to the left indicating a shot from the front right and not from behind.
MassacreBlast 1 year ago 3
@MassacreBlast watch my other video 'jfk concealed weapon' for more insight
vydeoynkhorne 1 year ago
@MassacreBlast
There were two wounds in Kennedy's head - the entry wound in the back of the head and the massive exit on the right side which tore open his skull. The bullet could only have come from above and behind and nowhere else. The exiting bullet blew out a 'jet' of brain matter and blood which could have pushed the head back - this was proven in experiment by Dr. Luis Alvarez a Nobel physicist. Also when people are shot in the head, massive neural damage causes involuntary spasms.
MrTipperaryMan 1 year ago
@MrTipperaryMan The spasm point is only a hypothesis advanced to fit the conclusion. It's reverse reasoning. You can be killed instantly without spasms. This one will never be fully plausible because we can't ask Mr. Kennedy how he felt at the moment of his death...
Simboiss 1 year ago
@Simboiss
The Warren Commission conducted a test in which a goat was shot in the head. The animal spasmed after it was shot. It is therefore obvious that this is what happened to the President.
The physical evidence - the actual wound to Kennedy's head - show a bullet struck the back of the skull and exited the top front right side of the head creating the massive fatal exit wound.
MrTipperaryMan 1 year ago
Vydeoynkorne's "rebuttal" of the Discovery Channel recreation leaves much more to be desired than the recreation itself. Rather than conduct a formal analysis of the recreation, which does provide reasons why the bullet behaved as it did in the recreation, Vydeoynkorne instead focuses in on the one "missed" element, i.e., the neck wound only. In essence, the rebuttal argues against the "magic bullet theory" because a complex recreation could not exactly duplicate one of the wounds.
ErikTheBigKMan 1 year ago
@ErikTheBigKMan - JFK's front right portion of his head was blown out and he was thrown back and to the left therefore indicating a strong possibility of a second shooter from the front right. It's obvious and of course the US government don't care about how obvious it is, they just deny deny deny like usual. But anyone who can think for themselves can see that it wasn't a lone gunman from the rear that shot JFK. Case closed.
MassacreBlast 1 year ago
@MassacreBlast - I guess I should say at this point that I find Bugliosi's massive tome to definitely put to rest such conspiracy theories as you postulate. The fact that the front right portion of Kennnedy's head was blown "out" is ballistically consistent with an "exiting" projectile rather than an entering one. Sorry, but that is the basic ballistics and physics of that wound.
ErikTheBigKMan 1 year ago
@ErikTheBigKMan - Yeah I'm looking into that, it would seem that the exit wound and how violent it was also threw him back. I can also see right when he gets hit he moves forward. So it entered, he jerked forward, then it exited and blew out his head throwing him in the opposite direction.
MassacreBlast 1 year ago
@MassacreBlast - Right. There is a lot of excitement among the consipiracy theory crowd to keep the heat on, but sometimes a bullet is just following a complex trajectory in a dynamic environment. Nothing magical about it, just complex.
ErikTheBigKMan 1 year ago
@ErikTheBigKMan - So the shot came from behind. However I'm still puzzled about the hole in the windshield, the bullet that hit the curb and nicked Tague in the cheek. There has to be at least 4 shots fired which makes the lone gunman theory fall apart.
MassacreBlast 1 year ago
@MassacreBlast - see page 57 of Bugliosi's Reclaiming History: "Twenty-three feet from the east face of the underpass, along the south curb of Main Street, [deputy sheriff] Walthers spots a mark ont he top of the curb. it is quite obvious to both of them [Walthers and Tague] that the fresh gash was made by a bullet, and from the angle of the mark, it came from the direction of the Texas School Book Depository."
ErikTheBigKMan 1 year ago
@ErikTheBigKMan - Yeah, that clears that up. I'm still wondering about the hole in the windshield and upon further research there was apparently a bullet that got stuck in the ground and some unknown blonde man confiscated it? Perhaps I'm getting into complete BS but there are a few people who were there that are saying that even today still.
MassacreBlast 1 year ago
@MassacreBlast - I guess I would suggest that your best starting point would be Bugliosi's book which is available on the bargain table. It is exhaustive and a massive read. However, he handles everything that is credible...just because someone claims something, that does not make it credible. One of the worst forms of evidence is eye-witness accounts. If you have ever been at a crime scene or accident, you will notice the lengthy procedure for processing "witnesses" by law enforcement.
ErikTheBigKMan 1 year ago
@MassacreBlast - For example, some "witnesses" claimed to have heard multiple shots, but there were only three casings located in the sniper's nest. Virgie Rachley down on street level in front of the Book Depository, hears SHOT 1 and sees "sparks fly off the pavement in the far left lane, right behind the presidential limosine. She thinks it's a firecracker thrown by some boys who are fixing to get in a lot of trouble" (Bugliosi, p39). It was not a firecracker despite her witnessing it as so
ErikTheBigKMan 1 year ago
@MassacreBlast - "Secret service agent Paul Landis, riding on the right running board of the Secret Service follow-up car, knows immediately what the sound is - the report of a high-powered rifle coming from over his right shoulder" (Bugliosi, p39). Landis will not see Oswald's rifle poking out of the 6th floor, nor anyone in the crowd with a gun, nor any tire damage if it is a blowout, but he pulls his gun because he knows something is wrong.
ErikTheBigKMan 1 year ago
@MassacreBlast - Officer Marrion L. Baker in motorcycle escort seven cars back from the presidential limosine knows it is a high-powered rifle, too, having recently returned from a hunting trip. "He sees a great number of pigeons flying around the top of the Texas Schoolbook Depository Building and suspects a sniper is firing from the roof" (Bugliosi, p.39). He does not see the rifle sticking out of the window because he is not there, yet, but guns his bike ahead to the location.
ErikTheBigKMan 1 year ago
@MassacreBlast - "Twenty-year-old high school dropout James R. Worrell Jr. is standing right in front of the Book Depository...When he hears the first shot, Worrell throws his head back, looks straight up and sees 6 inches of gun barrel with the forepart of the stock sticking out of a window high overhead on the southeasternmost side of the building" (Bugliosi pp.39-40). So, here are four witnesses to the first shot, and only one of them actually sees the gun that is responsible.
ErikTheBigKMan 1 year ago
@MassacreBlast - at 3.5 seconds after the first shot, another shot rings out so loudly on the fifth floor of the Book Depository that "the windows rattle, and loose plaster and dirt fall from the ceiling onto Bonnie Ray Williams's hair" (Bugliosi, p.40). Charles Brehm and his son standing about 20 feet away from the presidential limo see Kennedy stiffen and his hands "swoop toward his throat" (Bugliosi p.40). Agent Kellerman sees that Connally is also in clear distress.
ErikTheBigKMan 1 year ago
@MassacreBlast - Howard Brennan sees the third shot fired since he is looking directly at the gunman as he fires, but he cannot see if the shot hit its mark since the presidential limo is blocked from his view (Bugliosi, p.41). Some say it was impossible for Oswald to fire 3 shots in 8.4 seconds. Yes, it is impossible, but he only shot 2 in that time, we don't know how long he sat there lining up shot 1, which missed! Subsequent shots would be more accurate as he find his range.
ErikTheBigKMan 1 year ago
@MassacreBlast
There was no 'hole' in the windshield.
Look up Mary Ferrell's website - she believes in a conspiracy - and her multi-media collection shows a color photo of the windshield. There was a spider web crack caused by a bullet fragment hitting the inside of the glass. The chrome frame of the windshield was also dented. Fragments of a bullet were found on the front seat of the limo. Fragments were found inside JFK's head. It is likely the 'hole' was caused by the headshot bullet.
MrTipperaryMan 1 year ago
@MrTipperaryMan - Like I give a fuck about arguing with you. JFK was killed because the ones truly in power are soulless war mongering lunatics. JFK had his head on his shoulders and didn't want war and corruption. So they killed him because he was actually trying to be a president instead of a puppet. War = Big Bucks and more land and power. It's no surprise that when that redneck Johnson came into office that he immediately went to war.
MassacreBlast 1 year ago
@MassacreBlast
Wasting your breath at Mr. Ireland
AXELOPS 1 year ago
@MassacreBlast
JFK was killed because he was riding in an open car. Anybody could have attacked and killed him with a rifle. Oswald was a crazed lonely man who craved fame and got it by shooting the President. He saw the route of the motorcade in a local paper, he saw his chance and he brought his rifle work the morning of the assassination.
MrTipperaryMan 1 year ago
@MrTipperaryMan - Shooting AT LEAST 3 shots from a bolt action rifle from several yards away in 7.5 seconds is near impossible. I think my explanation makes more sense since we all know that war is something that followed many of the major US disasters in history. After JFK was killed, we went to war. After 9-11 we went to war. After the sinking of the Maine, we went to war. War = Money, end of story. It's all business in the eyes of the ruling class. They're reptiles (not literally).
MassacreBlast 1 year ago
@MassacreBlast
This guy fires the same make and model rifle in less than 6 secs.
watch?v=a9uIZJqzLc0&feature=related
This guy fires the same make and model rifle mounted with 4x scope exactly the same as Oswald rifle in 5.1 secs.
watch?v=h4c5Zr7hzzA
This video shows a simulation by CBS in 1967. A panel of riflemen took turns to fire Mannlicher-Carcano rifle mounted with 4x scopes at moving targets on a rail simulating the speed and position of JFK and his limo.
watch?v=HsOEJF6qoy4
MrTipperaryMan 1 year ago
@MrTipperaryMan - Okay, granted that man fired the shots in under 7.5 seconds. Do you think he could have hit a man's head from almost 100 yards away while firing that quickly? It seems unlikely unless Oswald was one of the best riflemen in the world, which he wasn't known for by the way.
However, keep ignoring the fact that war is what America wants, and everytime a disaster strikes, war follows.
The best way to look at these cases is to see, who benefits. That's the primary motive.
MassacreBlast 1 year ago
@MassacreBlast
Like all Marines, Oswald was trained and tested in riflery, scoring 212 in December 1956 (slightly above the minimum for qualification as a sharpshooter) but in May 1959 scoring only 191(barely earning the lower designation of marksman).
With his training he was more than capable of hitting a target at distance of 88 yds or less in Dealey Plaza.
Besides with the 4x scope the distance was just over twenty yards.
Firing at a target moving slowly at 11mph? Two out of 3 hits? Easy.
MrTipperaryMan 1 year ago
@MrTipperaryMan - Easy? You're forgetting the speed factor and the fact that he'd most likely be nervous since he'd be shooting at the President of the United States of America.
While it is possible for him to have done it, it's a slim chance. You're on the losing side when you look at the odds. Have you ever heard Lee Bowers testimony? He heard the first shot then the second and third were almost on top of each other. He was quite certain of what he heard. He ended up dead shortly after.
MassacreBlast 1 year ago
@MassacreBlast - You also need to understand that JFK wanted to pull out of Vietnam, and also eliminate the Federal Reserve. This is BIG business, perhaps the biggest. While he was 100% correct in wanting to do those things, there are certain scumbags that are far too greedy and power hungry to let that happen. They had JFK killed pure and simple. The motive was the oldest one in the book.
MassacreBlast 1 year ago
@MassacreBlast
All the circumstantial, primary, secondary and physical evidence points to Oswald.
53 pieces of evidence link him to the shooting. In the real world it is impossible for an innocent person to have that much evidence against them and still be innocent.
Oswald's background has been gone over with a fine tooth comb. Practically everyone whoever met the man or knew him at one time or other was tracked down. His entire life is known almost day by day.
There was no conspiracy.
MrTipperaryMan 1 year ago
@MrTipperaryMan - Excuse me but Oswald never went to trial. But everyone says he's guilty. That's strange, I thought it was innocent until proven guilty?
MassacreBlast 1 year ago
@MassacreBlast
The Warren Commission, the Clarke and Rockefeller and HSCA all concluded that Lee Harvey Oswald fired the fatal shots. The examined the evidence and interviewed witnesses to the murder of Kennedy and Oswald, interviewed investigating officers and came to the conclusion that Oswald's guilt was overwhelming.
in 1986 Vincent Bugliosi and Gerry Spence participated as prosecution and defence in a mock trial. Oswald was found guilty by the jury.
MrTipperaryMan 1 year ago
@MrTipperaryMan - Excuse me but he was never brought to trial. So shut your fucking mouth after that demonstrable fact. Seriously, you have no leg to stand on. Innocent until proven guilty motherfucker. That is the law, for a fucking reason. You know, I would argue other OBVIOUS points with you but this was kind of a thought experiment for me. To see if you could accept facts which you clearly cannot. I am therefore done with you and it's as simple as that. I'm done WASTING my time.
MassacreBlast 1 year ago
@MassacreBlast
The Fairy Godmother killed Kennedy? Is that it? LOL
The greatest legal and scientific minds investigated the Kennedy assassination and they all agree that Oswald was the sole assassin.
The evidence is absolutely overwhelming.
I bet you believe the moon landings were faked or that 9/11 was inside job too?
MrTipperaryMan 1 year ago
@MrTipperaryMan - No trial, no guilt. There are eye witness testimony to the contrary of a single shooter you know. I guess they were just confused though eh? Anything to make it seem like it was a one man show. Because it's too scary to think the American government isn't so nice after all? I don't know what your hang up is.
MassacreBlast 1 year ago
@MassacreBlast
The irrefutable physical evidence proves beyond all doubt that three shots were fired from Oswald's gun and the two bullets that struck and killed Kennedy came from his rifle. No other rifles, bullets or spent shells were ever found. No witnesses saw any other gunmen nor were any other suspects taken into custody. Oswald acted alone. He was murdered by Ruby who murdered him on pure impulse during his transfer. No evidence whatsoever connected either man to a plot.
MrTipperaryMan 1 year ago
@MrTipperaryMan This is only what the Warren Commission deducted. Some evidence was tampered with, and most of the evidence could easily be replaced or destroyed by any authority.
Simboiss 1 year ago
@Simboiss Are you trying to suggest that hundreds of law enforcement officers who participated in the investigation were all in on the plot? Because that would have to be the case when you imply evidence was tampered with, replaced and destroyed.That's a hell of a lot of people who would have to told to shut up isn't it?
MrTipperaryMan 1 year ago
@MrTipperaryMan Military personnel work on orders and payrolls. If the evidence must go up to the con men, then it will. You can have a conspiracy with a few men, but many others who only follow orders...
People instinctively think that it demands hundreds of people to keep the secret. Because of hierarchy and compartmentalization, things can be done with the help of many people who are "only doing their job"...
Simboiss 1 year ago
@Simboiss
Why would conspirators risk involving other people in their plot, giving them them to opportunity to put two and two together? Hundreds of people who as you say were following orders would quickly find out they were conned and would go directly to the press with the story. America in 1963 was not the Soviet Union. It had a free press. There is simply no way any conspirators would risk execution for treason by involving oyal Americans who swore an oath to serve and protect.
Bullshit.
MrTipperaryMan 1 year ago
@MrTipperaryMan "America in 1963 was not the Soviet Union."
Indeed ? so what was(is) it ??
hearNyou 1 year ago
@MrTipperaryMan Not ALL the "greatest legal and scientific minds" agree that there was a single shooter. There is a lot of smoke, and men in power controlling pretty much everything to their favor. Think of it as the fox investigating the hen house...
Simboiss 1 year ago
@Simboiss
Dr. Luis Alvarez, Nobel prize physicist and friend of the late President investigated the physics of the assassination - the famous 'back and to the left' head movement in the Zapruder film and concluded that the exiting matter from the head created a 'jet effect' which pushed the head in the opposite direction. He prove the shot could only have come from above and behind from the 6th floor window.
MrTipperaryMan 1 year ago
@MrTipperaryMan Since the wound is more like on the SIDE of the head, it could have been shot from the 2nd or 3rd floor of the Dal-Tex building, or from somewhere in front of the limo, but not DIRECTLY from the front. Either the picket fence, or from the top of the triple underpass...
Simboiss 1 year ago
@Simboiss
The autopsy discovered an entry wound in the back of the head and that the huge hole in the top front right of the skull was a wound of exit. The only rifle and spent hulls found were in the TSBD. Film and photos of the grass knoll show no shooter and no witnesses saw a shooter there.
Police and workmen were standing on the overpass.
They saw no shooter on the bridge.
MrTipperaryMan 1 year ago
@MrTipperaryMan At least 20 witnesses recall a shot from the Grassy Knoll's fence.
Simboiss 1 year ago
@Simboiss
The overwhelming majority of witnesses heard three shots from the direction of the TSBD. Witnesses on the knoll who would have been standing only feet away from a supposed assassin behind the fence, saw and heard no assassin firing a rifle. Zapruder and his secretary who was holding him steady on the concrete pier near the pergola would have been in the supposed grassy knoll gunman's field of fire. No shells, rifle or suspect were ever found. The knoll shooter story is bullshit.
MrTipperaryMan 1 year ago
@MrTipperaryMan No. Just no. Many people walked or ran in the direction of the fence after the limo disappared under the triple underpass. We see that clearly in a film shot from the other side of Elm street (opposite to Zapruder). And no, Zapruder was not in the field of the shooter, not even close...
Simboiss 1 year ago
@Simboiss
Zapruder was standing on a concrete pier directly in the field of fire for a grass knoll assassin. During the shooting numerous witnesses were standing on the knoll. They saw no assassin. The police officer who jumped off his bike and ran up the knoll was not even in the plaza at the time of the shooting.
MrTipperaryMan 1 year ago
@MassacreBlast
We have already discussed the speed factor. I have already shown you that it is possible to fire three accurate shots with the Mannlicher-Carcano in less than 6 secs. He was nervous. Sure. Oswald missed with his first shot and followed it up with two hits.
It is not a 'slim' chance - the bullet and bullet fragments recovered were matched to his rifle excluding all other weapons. His palm print and shirt fibres were found on the rifle barrel. He was seen firing it at a JFK.
MrTipperaryMan 1 year ago
@MrTipperaryMan Many witnesses saw shots from behind the fence...
Simboiss 1 year ago
@Simboiss
No witnesses saw anybody firing from behind the fence.
The films and photographs of the assassination do not show any person behind the picket fence. Lee Bowers, working in a railroad control tower, had an unobstructed view of the back of the picket fence. He did not see any assassin.
Kennedy was hit by two bullets in the back of the neck and the back of the head from the Depository sixth floor, proven by autopsy photos and x-rays and pathologist testimony.
MrTipperaryMan 1 year ago
@MrTipperaryMan Many experts tried to equal Oswald's alleged feat, but none succeeded. The Carcano itself is considered a mediocre rifle. The scope on the Carcano was deficient. And there was a tree in the line of sight from the 6th floor of the Book Depository...
Simboiss 1 year ago
@Simboiss
This video shows a panel of riflemen recreating Oswald's feat on a range for a 1967 CBS news inquiry: watch?v=HsOEJF6qoy4. They fired three shots using the same model rifle at a moving head and shoulder size target in less than 5.6 secs moving on a rail replicating the movement of the car through Dealey Plaza.
This video shows that Oswald had a clear line of sight beyond the tree.
watch?v=tU69lMs2FMg
At less than 88 yards with a 4X scope. Easy.
MrTipperaryMan 1 year ago
@MrTipperaryMan It's even easier if there are 2 or 3 shooters...
Simboiss 1 year ago
@Simboiss
The ballistic evidence proves that a 6.5mm bullet wounded Kennedy in the back of the neck to the right of the spine exited the base of his throat, struck Connally in the upper back, exited his right chest below the nipple, passed through his right wrist as he held his Stetson across his lap and lodge in the flesh of his thigh. This trajectory is recreated in this documentary using anatomical surrogates
watch?v=PZRUNYZY71g
This video replicates the headshot.
watch?v=A4CtVCjhvhA
MrTipperaryMan 1 year ago
@MrTipperaryMan The best evidence was scraped at the hospital, and probably tampered with at the morgue, since the body was ILLEGALLY moved by authorities. You read correctly. ILLEGALLY. Read again. ILLEGALLY.
Simboiss 1 year ago
@Simboiss
There is a continuous chain of custody for all of the evidence - none of tampered with. Kennedy was never put in the morgue. After his death his body was taken by plane to Bethesda Naval Hospital where the autopsy was performed.
The body was removed from Texas accompanied by President Johnson, Mrs. Kennedy and the rest of the Presidential entourage because of fears of a coup d'etat.
MrTipperaryMan 1 year ago
@Simboiss
Oliver Stone and other theorists would have us believe, the CIA hired 3 or more shooters to kill Kennedy and it required them to fire 6 or more bullets to kill Kennedy.
Connally had five wounds to his body - back, chest, two holes in his wrist and a final wound in his thigh.
Stone claims one bullet could not have created seven wounds to both JFK and the Governor but is happy to believe 1 bullet created all of five wounds to Connolly?
Was Connolly shot 5 times? Just who was the target?
MrTipperaryMan 1 year ago
@MrTipperaryMan It doesn't work that way. First, Stone's movie is a movie, which means some artistic liberty was taken. And he doesn't have abolute proof of everything, just like the government or any other commission can have the absolute proof of everything.
The point is, as SOON as you have more than 1 shooter, you have a conspiracy. It could be 3, 4, 1000 shooters, whatever the number, it would be defined as a conspiracy.
Simboiss 1 year ago