.458 SOCOM AR-15 "HOGZILLA" -Interview + Shooting

[greymanthe]

"I think it's asian or something"... You sir, are an idiot.

[taofledermaus]

@greymanthe Name caller.

[frankgon4]

Teppo Jutsu : Art of the Rifle. I like the bullet, but they are around $3 each and I could not afford to practice much.

[taofledermaus]

@frankgon4 Definitely only practical if you have the reloading dies to do it yourself. The bullets themself aren't cheap though, about $1 each.

[dva9233]

FMJ required by military laws. Very funny, when you kill someone you want the whole to be neat and clean. This world is messed up.

[PotatoGunsRule]

I would like one to hunt with. AR can do it all!

[vpsaline]

What's the parent case?

[csxconductor100]

@vpsaline none

[GeneralAwesome1204]

Texas represent!!

[speedy02]

This show sucks now

[MultiSr16]

@speedy02 hahaha when did it not ??

[jdessell]

Cool meatball launcher ya got there.

[frankgon4]

I am happy with my Saiga 12 shooting slugs. I can afford 12 gauge slugs. .458 rounds are too much for my pocket.

[62hydrodyne]

my 45-70 winchester has been doing the same thing for 140 yrs.! and i dont have to worry about keeping every speck of dirt out to keep it shooting!



[taofledermaus]

@62hydrodyne There aint no shame in a 45-70! Thanks for stopping by.

[62hydrodyne]

@taofledermaus think its funny how things have come full circle since the 458 is similar ballistically to the 45-70, whats old is new again! haha!

[EvilxMerlin]

@62hydrodyne

I really don't understand this unusual notion an AR just dies with one spec of dust...

[MultiSr16]

@62hydrodyne yea but is it semi auto ?? detachable box mag ??

[justice2576]

Red jacket invented this gun!! This guy stoled it.

[ChrisreadIRL]

@justice2576 are you joking? they did no invent this gun, theres was built in the last couple months, this vid was uploaded beginning last year?

[ChrisreadIRL]

I just watched a shot clip of you shooting it on sons of guns!!!!!

[taofledermaus]

@ChrisreadIRL Cool! I'm on the west coast so it won't be on for 3 more hours. I'm glad they used my clip. Thanks for the heads up!

[ChrisreadIRL]

@taofledermaus it showed, the part around :45 with the clip and the round, and then a slow-mo shot shooting from the side. i remember you saying something about it and instantly remembering.

[weerd2normal]

My idea is to neck up the 5.56mm to a 9mm, thus having the ability to use the same magazines, use the same bolt, same upper, just a different barrel.

[TheDiabeticBirdman]

The .50 Beowulf doesn't fire specialized bullets. There are lots of .50 caliber bullets that you can use most .50 bullets that are used in the 500 S&W.

[TheMadMedek]

Thats rediculous. Won't catch on I promise you that. Too expensive. The 300 aac blackout has better potential of replacing 5.56 than that,

[taofledermaus]

@TheMadMedek Sons of Guns will be doing a show about this round this season, so it might catch on. Some people just like odd calibers.

[Dietzeeeee]

@taofledermaus they like odd calibers until they go to the store to buy a case of ammo and realize they will have to take out a personal loan. I think the 6.8 SPC has more potential and more magazine capacity. Unfortunately the US military has always caved to Nato standards. So until Nato changes the 5.56 and the 9mm as the standard that is probably what will be standard issue.

[gunguy40]

@TheMadMedek A lot of us don't care that a rifle we own is in a caliber that the military doesn't use.

[mudshovel007]

Why not just buy an AR-10 or AK-47?

[bf2lover42]

@mudshovel007 Because the military and police departments already have AR-15 and wasting money on new weapons because you bought weapons that do work in many situations is not a practical solution.

[johnnyfisalive]

OH YEAH i have a del-ton ar 15 lower will it combine or do i need a specific lower?

[johnnyfisalive]

they only sell the upper 458 socom why is that? i have an ar15 can i put the ar15 on it and still fire it will the bullets get stuck on an ar15 is the magazine the same size or larger?

[levelninetroll]

so they made a deadly AR? great, now all they have to do is make it reliable

[almostsk8er12345]

this'll stop haji in his tracks!

[Noobpatty]

so why this instead of the 7.62 nato?

[alchoholicsementhful]

@Noobpatty Same mags as the 5.56 and same lower rather than an AR10 with the 7.62 combination.......

just slap the new upper and done.

plus it does have a bigger bullet making it less reliant on speed and therefore good for shorter barreled carbines.

[PlanetAirsoftPlym]

i wish i had one, but i live in the U.K

[alexpain100]

I want to build to a ar...but I don't know which caliber to get it in, 50 beowulf or .458 socom

[dzsk8r]

@alexpain100 .308 or 7.62NATO

[annasajerk]

umm... .50 cal can be had for under $3 anyday.

[Nater245689]

@annasajerk Um...this doesn't shoot a .50 caliber bullet. Not to mention, you probably mean .50 BMG. .50 BMG would be beyond uncontrollable in such a small and light gun. I've seen guy's fire M107s from the shoulder, but that's a 34lb gun and it's recoil operated. The operation and massive brake of that rifle takes out a lot of the recoil.

[annasajerk]

@Nater245689 you are an idiot. I never said ANYTHING about this gun shooting the .50 cal. and yes I did mean .50 bmg. the man in the video said that the .458 costs $4 per round, and that .50 bmg costs $5 per round. all I said was that you can get .50 bmg for $3 a round easy.

[Nater245689]

@annasajerk People confuse this round and the .50 Beowulf constantly. The guy in the video is probably talking about newly manufactured .50 BMG, not 1040s surplus. If you've read any of my posts, you'll know I'm far from an idiot. You, on the other hand, are an absolute ass.

[freestylmx311]

@Nater245689

there is a 50 bmg upper for the ar15

there is a vid here of a guy shooting one mounted on a plum crazy ar15 lower

[knueven5150]

223 was designed to injure not kill

[MushroomPictures]

@knueven5150 No it wasn't:-)

it is very devastating

[Nater245689]

@knueven5150 That might be the dumbest thing that I routinely hear with regards to 5.56mm. Why, oh why, would you design a bullet not to kill? That is beyond stupid and wouldn't be done by any military. They do have weapons designed to wound and not kill (land mines), but doing that with a rifle round is not going to happen. The post-Vietnam issues with 5.56mm lethality I have explained in another post on this thread.

[knueven5150]

@Nater245689 get some background knowledge and then come talk to me. yes it does kill but wounding your enenmy is more effective. it gets more enemies off of the battlefield

[Nater245689]

@knueven5150 I'm fully aware of that fact, hence the land mine reference. However, we're talking about rifles. These weapons are used to close with an kill the enemy in close combat. They're not used to attrite him during movement or sap his moral. They're used to kill him. The whole point of Project SALVO, which eventually led to 5.56x45mm and the M16 rifle, was to increase lethality. The weapon was, in fact, quite lethal with 55gr M193 ammunition.

[knueven5150]

@Nater245689 *special ammunition*

[Nater245689]

@knueven5150 No. M193 was the bog stardard, 55gr ball ammunition that the M16 rifle used from it's inception up until the adoption of the A2. It is a pretty nasty round as far as general issue military rounds go. 5.56mm military bullets can be expected to fragment sufficiently above 2700fps, which M193 will attain for longer ranges. M193 also fragments better than M855. It's started coming apart after ~3" of penetration and is completely fragmented by 5-7". end Pt 1.

[Nater245689]

@knueven5150 I think people get confused when they hear 'dramatic wounding effects' or something similar. They think the 5.56 is designed to wound. Of course it is, but it's designed to produce wounds so devastating that they will lead to rapid incapacitation and death. In fact, the older rounds were so devastating that the International Committee of the Red Cross and several national Red Crosses wanted the ammunition banned outright.

[marksrig]

I have the FTX 325 grain...what bullet, powder and powder weight did you reload this with?

Thanks

[sasquatch4liffee]

expensive and underpowered. might as well have a .50 beowolf

[jedirifleman]

The .223 / 5.56mm cartridge isnt the problem its the FMJ bullets required by the Hague convention. The .223 with 55grain ballistic tips or 64 grain Winchester power points is a man stopper. If the .458 socom were to be used in theater it would be limited to FMJ ammo just like the 5.56mm is...welcome to the wonderful world of politics-bullshit and dog & pony shows.

[Nater245689]

@jedirifleman The problem with 5.56 isn't FMJ bullets. The problem is/was that M855 was designed for the SAW, not rifles or carbines. When fired out of rifles and carbines, especially carbines, it does not reliable fragment at range. It'll reliably fragment out of a 20" barrel at 140m, 14.5" at 45m, and 10.5" at 12m. The newer Mk 318 and M855A1 rounds are designed for short barreled weapons and don't have this problem.

[bf2lover42]

@jedirifleman There is no problem with the 5.56 NATO, in any of it's FMJ variants.

It will kill where it was designed to. Most of the "problems" with the 5.56 are because of "extremity" shots and engagements longer than 300m.

Also, short barrels will underpower the 5.56 a lot. I doubt a barrel under 13" will make the round tumble violently after 125m, unfortunately I never came across a test like that.

[taofledermaus]

@CabelasOutdoor4x4 It has a similar feel to shooting a 1oz slug out a 12 ga shotgun.

[NIGHT454]

This is BEAST mode for the AR-15 what mod's do you have make to fire this round? plz... info

[taofledermaus]

@NIGHT454 Just buy the .458 Socom upper half and slap it on your AR lower. It is around $725 from Rock River Arms.

[Fairnzelia]

fuck thats a savage... whats your guys' background in armed forces?

[ironfox08]

so its like the 9x39mm that the Russians have and actually issue

[kitezen]

can you guys try shooting it through stuff? like wood and bricks and cinder blocks? would like to see if what they showed in the video is true

[taofledermaus]

@kitezen I definitely want to film this rifle again. I've been wanting to do exactly that, see what it will penetrate. Cinderblocks, steel plates, padlocks, whatever we can find.

[bigdaddy1325]

Yea, I know. common courtesy is a thing of the past nowadays. I simply said that the 458 SOCOM had a more useful range of bullets available to it. And I was every name in the book.

[taofledermaus]

@bigdaddy1325 You probably bruised his ego by saying there was a better gun out there. It's easy for people to misinterpret a comment and take it as an insult too.

[bigdaddy1325]

Theres a knob head on youtube that thinks his 450 bushmaster is the cats but, I told him the 458 SOCOM is a better round but he called me every name in the book like a kid or something.

[taofledermaus]

@bigdaddy1325 Lol, well, to some that is like insulting their mom! 

[landronics]

holy crap that hits hard

[nominalvelocity]

Dang, that water flew like 50 feet either direction, before it evaporated in mid air. I want one!

[Vexzm]

but one round of that is equivelent to 5 rounds of .223 in recoil thats whats good about the .223 is the recoil isnt to bad for the stoppingpower not much there but still good

[pontiacmaniac2]

Free action button- 2:27

[leapmau85]

You said it would fit an ar15 lower, would it fit ar15 upper, .223??

[sharpshooterrn]

@leapmau85

What he means is, this caliber (upper= Bolt, chamber + barrel) can be switched out to any standard AR because it will fit into any standard AR lower receiver.

[delemon6]

any gun will kill you dosnt need to be big

[MrIhaveanopinion]

1 persons AR15 couldn't hit the targets.

[MrIhaveanopinion]

1 persons AR15 was cheaply built.

[Tackdriver4000]

The brass rounds pop through most vests

[SuperEvilLemon]

I would not like to get hit in the leg by one of these, no sir.

[gunnerzz100]

how much is a box of these??

[taofledermaus]

@gunnerzz100 Just a quick look I found a box of 20 for $55.

[geewilmas]

WOW, big effin round. Will the 600 grain rounds penetrate my level 4 sapi plates within 200 yards? cause that would suck ;)

[taofledermaus]

@geewilmas It's a big round but quite slow. It might knock the wind out of you. haha

[JasonRedfield]

@geewilmas

Nah, it wouldn't. Unlikely, anyways. The things are low-velocity and wide, so like a shotgun slug, they're unlikely to pierce high-quality armor but the momentum they deliver is likely to inflict some hurt on whatever's under the vest. Severe bruising for sure, possibly some broken bones and whatnot as well.

[TheHiddenPart]

Basically, it's like having a 12ga. sabot slug through a rifled barrel. Only it's in AR form, hence it's more user-friendly and tahcticahl.

[Moldovawineimporter]

@TheHiddenPart Very good way to describe this round .

[sekiryu]

"Teppo Jutsu" is Japanese for "art of the gun", just fyi ;)

[taofledermaus]

@sekiryu Right on! Thank you for that!

[climbingtothetop]

curious, will they fit in pmags?

[sidnous]

It's not $4 a round closer to $2 a round. I can get a box of 20 for around $35.

[mrbadx19]

i still like the fact that the target explodes before you see the case eject, just a demo on how fast that round is moving. @ $4 a pop, those cases are golden!

just figger barrel twist, muzzle velocity, them little buggers would cauterize a wound as soon as it made it, from video #1 with it melting a liquid filled bottle on entry and exit, of course after it scrambled the target's innards. a body center hit ain't walking away from one of them.

that is one wicked little toy.

[taofledermaus]

@mrbadx19 Each brass case is 75 cents, so we were picking them up like they were gold after we shot it. The melted plastic was just too weird. It had to have super-heated the water to get it hot enough to melt like that. I've shot a lot of water filled plastic things and have never see that effect before. I hope to film more of this gun!

[ichewtoast111]

have fun paying $4 a shot....

:/

[LocutusIsBorg]

You could practically drop an elephant with that.

[weaponeer]

wow that 458 is more expensive than my 6.5 Grendel, 50 AE, and more than I have ever paid for 50 BMG. The 50 Beawulf and 458 are very close.. the 458 costs more to buy or build than the 50 Beowulf, but the 458 has more reloading options than the 50 Beowulf. but they both have about the same power when using the case bullet weight.  If I remember correctly the 458 can be loaded with up to a 600 gr bullet (which is higher than the Beowulf), but my 50 BMG is still 833 gr :) lol

[taofledermaus]

@weaponeer I completely forgot to put the 50 BMG round I brought out there to compare with this. It makes the 458 look like a 9mm round. The 600gr. bullet in the 458 is supposed to keep it subsonic, and I have heard of people putting suppressors on them. A silent sledgehammer? He said he paid 75 cents per brass, and the bullets are a buck each. Hand loading saves a bundle.

[semiautoriflelover]

I bet that would work on a bear.

[taofledermaus]

@semiautoriflelover I have heard of people using it to hunt Elk with.

[ww2footage]

@semiautoriflelover that would blow bear apart

[Moldovawineimporter]

@semiautoriflelover Small Black bears hunted over bait stations yes it will work .

For large Alaskan bears its not even an option to be used for these bears .

[Moldovawineimporter]

@semiautoriflelover If used for close range such as over bait stations hunting black bears it will work fine.

Black bears are quiet easy to kill, especially when the shooter has time to choose a close range shot with good shot placement on bears feeding at bait stations.

The last five Black Bears I killed over bait I used a Marlin 357 mag loaded with 158 grain Speer Gold dot bullets loaded with 13grains blue dot.

All five bears died with double lung shots, so surely the 458 Socom will work .

[strikeme5]

is its like the .50 beowolf

the stopping power is better but huge range lost??

[taofledermaus]

@strikeme5 What I have been told this ammo has a range of about 200 yards. The specs (velocity and energy) are very similar to the .50 beowulf.

[strikeme5]

@taofledermaus .50 also goes 200 yards so in reallity there the same



[taofledermaus]

@strikeme5 I think the biggest difference is price per round. The Beowulf is about $1.50/rd at Cabelas. The 458 is about $4/rd and Cabelas doesn't carry it. It's not real main-stream yet. Hopefully it will become more popular and prices will come down.

[VMFA115Starloric]

@taofledermaus

But what costs more, the .50 or the .458?

[taofledermaus]

@VMFA115Starloric The 458 rounds are much more. I found a box of 20 of the Beowulf rounds at Cabelas for $30. He reloads his 458's so he is able to keep the cost really low. The factory rounds are still very expensive.

[MrIFUCKWAHABIS]

I bet it could pierce a tank.

[aderonn]

more stopping power? well i think they got what they needed with this round.